Newbie 1687 (Game Over)

[PantherPunt]

Town here. I'm the new hawkleader.

Don't have time to dive into this until tomorrow.

[PantherPunt]

lol Frog's here. quite a coincidence.

interesting playstyle...hard to read imo. ok glgl see ya'll tomorrow

[PantherPunt]

lol Frog's here. quite a coincidence.

interesting playstyle...hard to read imo. ok glgl see ya'll tomorrow

Lol. Hey Panther!

Does mafia share day and night chat in this game variant? Didn't see it in the OP.

It used to be just night chat. Then they were trial running daytalk for scum, but not sure if that trial period has ended yet.

I wish I could hard clear you for that question alone, but I know you're a crafty soab. So I can't.

[PantherPunt]

I think Kirroha and Drixx each have 3 votes on them, would they count as bandwagons?

I'm sticking with my vote, I'd expect the IC to be most experienced at finding mafia so they'd want rid of him, putting a third vote on them is the most suspicious thing I've seen (not really seen much suspicious yet)

Hi Rufus,

The first problem I had with this post is that you are assuming that the IC is town. That looks to have been addressed and you said "well there's a 7/9 chance." I don't love that as an answer because you should be trying to read EVERYONE. And making that response seems to imply that you aren't trying to read everyone. Scum are informed of all alignments, so that gives me some pause on you.

In reality, Drixx only had 2 votes at this point. What, at this point in time, made you suspicious of Swagrid but not the other Drixx voter, Kirroha?

[PantherPunt]

VOTE: Drixx

I'm not going on much more than holy shit that wall of text.

And also because it seems like everyone wants a Drixx lynch but everyone who hasn't voted is scared they'll look bad jumping on now.

I saw Drixx ask you to point out where you got this, and you could not. This is a scum tell. Scum have to manufacture reasons for things because they aren't actually trying to solve things. I don't want to re-harp on this a whole lot, but your responses to Drixx did not make me feel better.

There are other things that haven't been touched on that I think are a bad look as well, so I want to focus more on those now:

I throw out some votes and see how people react to them. That's the game as far as I know. It really isn't very important who gets lynched today anyway, because we're all just bullshiting right now.
[snip]

Rufus is my current townread at the moment, he seems to be most actively calling out what he sees are scumtells.

You say that you throw votes out to see how people react to them.
You later say that Rubeus (despite accidentally saying Rufus) is a townread because he seems to be most actively calling out what he sees are scumtells.

From my viewpoint, Rubeus called out the same scumtells on you that Drixx did.

So how do you give Rubeus a townread, but not give Drixx a townread for the same action?

It doesn't seem like you are applying the same logic to all players when "seeing how people react to votes."
[also, I couldn't disagree more strongly that it isn't important who gets lynched today. I struggle to see this viewpoint coming from a tonwie]

Yeah because being the 3rd or 4th person looks scummy, so I was just pre-empting the critcism, although apparently I did so badly. And if Drixx IS mafia, he'll probably outplay the village pretty well.

Nobody likes to be the 3rd vote on anyone. You know that

Here's a big problem for me. Saying that being the 3rd or 4th person on a wagon looks scummy comes from a mindset of looking at votes after a mislynch.

Which means you are saying this with the assumption that Drixx, if lynched, will reveal as town.

If you thought he was mafia, then you wouldn't be concerned about your place on the wagon and would be looking for town points for giving the wagon traction.

My secondary FOS is Rufus, because I think I do look extremely scummy right now, he seems to be playing the middle ground.

So you agree you look scummy? But you still think Drixx is scum for pushing you? This does not compute.

IMO Drixx spiking the football and say, "YOURE CAUGHT SCUM" just because I was careless when reading through the first day was pretty forced and pre-emptive. Rufus's fos on me seemed much more legitimate.

Again, apparently mixing up the names of Rufus and Rubeus. How did Rubeus's suspicion of you differ from Drixx's? This is what makes no sense if I'm trying to understand your perspective in evaluating those pushing you.

[PantherPunt]

Both Rufus and kagesong feel like a slight town lean at this point in time.

Hi kirroha.

Can you elaborate just a bit on these town leans? i.e. can you point to what specifically you like out of them?

Also, I find it a bit odd that you haven't weighed in with any thoughts on Drixx or literallypam. A significant amount of thread content has revolved around their back-and-forth. I have to imagine you have alignment opinions on each of them, and I'd like to know what those are and why.

[PantherPunt]

I agree with notachipmunk, even though Kagesong and Literallypam both seem scummy to me, I doubt they're a team.

What did you see that made you think they are likely not both mafia-aligned?

I went back over Kagesong's posts and I'm more convinced now:

43, 58, 61, 99, 127 for

assuming some kind of tricky lies are afoot

, seems like the mindset scum would be in
54 for enjoyment of Psychological warfare (seems scummy to me)

99 (again) working out nightkills, the others are more tone, this one seems more solid to me: from the previous posts, it's clear the Kagesong likes using this WIFOM reasoning...

If he's scum, he's putting out a name that he knows isn't going to get NKd, he's distracting attention and then he'll probably kill me and say "Why would I kill the guy who's pushing for my lynch? It's too obvious so it can't be me, besides, I already pointed out who the NK should logically be."

If he's town, why would he think scum want Guttsa dead? Guttsa didn't say anything of note other than a counter-accusation against Kirroha, the suggestion that scum should night kill Guttsa came out of nowhere.

In my experience, the emphasized part above tends to indicate a town-mindset. Town tend to be inherently paranoid rather than trusting. I just don't think it's good justification for scumminess with regard to kage.

Since I think Kagesong is scum, and a team with Literallypam is unlikely, I don't think Literallypam is scum, despite sounding scummy.

Why don't you think literallypam is scum? What have you read from them that makes you think they are more likely to be town than scum?

I doubt Hawkleader is scum...don't know how things go in general here but I'd guess that scum newbies would be less likely to drop out than townies.

While I can confirm you are correct, this is terrible reasoning to read someone as town. And I'm struggling with believing you actually believe it. Why do you think that?

[PantherPunt]

going to shelf it for a bit because there's quite a lot for people to respond to.

VOTE: literallypam

L-2

[PantherPunt]

I had to go back and recount the Drixx votes, can't believe I miscounted, but you're right.

As to assuming the IC is town...yeah, I did kind of assume that, newbie mistake I guess, has already been corrected.

Regarding Kagesong, I assume scum would be more paranoid, they have to lie constantly and worry about how their votes might give them away, I just have to tell truth & that shouldn't give scumreads.

About literallypam, I think scum would defend themselves more vigorously...especially if they can discuss strategy with their partner.

That links into my terrible reasoning about Hawkleader...it could be me projecting...I kinda wanted to be scum because it seems like it would be the more fun side so I'd expect newbies who draw scum to be more engaged.

I accept I might be completely misreading things, if we lynch Literallypam and they flip scum then I'll have to toss out all my reads...and maybe get lynched for going against it.

Thanks for your answers.

How would you have expected scum!pam (notation meaning if pam were scum) to more vigorously defend himself?

Also, one thing you didn't touch on... What makes you think pam and kage aren't likely teamed?

[PantherPunt]

Frog I'll get back into this a bit later. Feel good about you but I'll take a look back at that 15er you mentioned. I was not in that anon game.

Would like to see some people check back in. I hope Pam comes back

[PantherPunt]

VOTE: kirroha

For science

[PantherPunt]

Would love to see Pam come move his vote

[PantherPunt]

Sorry guys. Real life is too hectic so

I'm going to replace out of a few games which I haven't been able to catch up on

.

I need to do things that require less brain power.

I try to not be tilted by this type of shit but I can't help it. It's tilting.

[PantherPunt]

Read the rules at the start of the game. Messaging a player about an ongoing game is a really big violation of the site rules here.

And anyway, you are doing very good at injecting aggressiveness into the game. You got me to respond, and with you two and me I think we can get the others involved more. Let's do it, yeah?

what's your read on frog?

[PantherPunt]

Kage so town it hurts my eyes

[PantherPunt]

Goddammit Rufus

[PantherPunt]

He wasn't being serious. But i understand what you thought and it's something to learn from.

Also, the only way you survive the night is if we lynch scum and you jail the other scum tonight. And I'm about 92% sure you targeting kage will not accomplish that.

[PantherPunt]

Little do scum know this is just some tricky #levels

And when you flip VT you'll be the town mvp

[PantherPunt]

is this deadline not being extended?

[PantherPunt]

le sigh

VOTE: literallypam

L-1

no quickhammers

[PantherPunt]

Sorry guys. Real life is too hectic so

I'm going to replace out of a few games which I haven't been able to catch up on

.

I need to do things that require less brain power.

I'm still mad about this because she didn't answer any questions addressed to her and just bailed. And is playing like 7 other games and as far as I can tell didn't sub out of any of them.

If she's scum I'm blacklisting. Terrible form.

[PantherPunt]

Frog do whatever you want but I'd be amazed if this game day wasn't extended

[PantherPunt]

So I should burn for changing my mind in the course of nearly 100 posts but the two that said they were going to hammer then went missing, they're fine?

They both fall down a well or something?

which posts of Pam's in that timeframe made you change your mind?

Spoiler: hint

there were none

[PantherPunt]

Like..it's more likely that you're actually the JK than not. It seemed like a newb mistake.

But your resistance to lynching Pam is odd.

[PantherPunt]

Why did I come back to this site

[PantherPunt]

And before anyone says "well gtfo then"

dont

[PantherPunt]

wow I thought there was no way Drixx derped his role that hard and that it had to be a scum gambit

notachipmunk I thought you posted incredibly purely...great game to you.

Phantomcobalt's "lynch that other guy" was good comedy. not sure why he subs in games he doesn't actually play (this happened to me before where he subbed in as VT and became that day's lynch) - honorary 3rd scum!

gj Drixx and rubeus