Newbie 1687 (Game Over)

[Rufus Delorian]

VOTE: Hawkleader3

His claim of leading hawks sounds fishy to me.

Hi all, I've not played before but I've read through a couple of games and I think get the gist...or at least understand some of the acronyms.

[Rufus Delorian]

Oddly enough, I've never actually seen the film.

Though just like the DeLorean car; I am a triumph of style over function, and my footprints set on fire when I travel through time.

[Rufus Delorian]

VOTE: Reubus Swagrid

Voting for someone with the flu? Bally poor form, wot.

[Rufus Delorian]

I'm on GMT, clearly the best timezone because the Queen uses it.

What is your favorite joke?

I hate Jokers

What is the longest amount of time you have ever stayed awake?

Crime doesn't sleep, so neither do I!

What is your worst fear?

Bats

Icecream or Pizza?

Ice cream

If you could have only one meal for the rest of your life, what would it be?

Revenge...seved cold.

If you became a multi-millionaire overnight, what would you buy?

It'd be a bit of a pay cut, but I guess a cool car, boat, plane, maybe a space station...bunch of gadgets, sweet bulletproof costume...all in black

[Rufus Delorian]

I think Kirroha and Drixx each have 3 votes on them, would they count as bandwagons?

I'm sticking with my vote, I'd expect the IC to be most experienced at finding mafia so they'd want rid of him, putting a third vote on them is the most suspicious thing I've seen (not really seen much suspicious yet)

[Rufus Delorian]

I don't

know

that Drixx is a townie but there's a 7/9 chance that they are...I guess that goes for everyone though.

Like I said, not much to go on at that point.

[Rufus Delorian]

Surely those reasons only work if you start off with the assumption that we're both scum.

If you started from the assumption that we're town then those would be reasons to further assume we're town. i.e.

Your assumed carelessness as to who gets lynched gives you a more innocent air.

Therefore they seem innocent, so town

As for the other, his desire to protect another player in round one. It could suggest that he's doing so to appear as a good guy.

So I'm a good guy, also town.


I'm not sure about literallypam, I mostly got the impression that they just quickly skimmed the first page and posted after getting poked...it could have been a scummy attempt to push Drixx to L-1 without realising that people had changed votes, so I'm not claiming that literallypam is town, just that the reasoning you gave is flawed.

Literallypam seems scummier to me now than Reubus, basically same reasoning as before, admittedly weak reason.

UNVOTE: Reubus Swagrid

[Rufus Delorian]

@Kagesong - one might think that way, there's not really any way to respond to that though...act like a bad guy?

@Reubus - Same reasoning is that I reckon lynching the IC on the first day is likely to benefit scum...is that really such a scummy thing to suggest? Is it wrong? I'm legitimately asking since I've not played before, the reasoning sounds right to me but it apparently makes me look scummy.

You could have been random voting or maybe trying to sneak a real vote into the middle of a drixx lynch, I admitted it was a weak reason and since we're out of RVS, I'm not voting based on it anymore.

[Rufus Delorian]

Reubus, I get that, that's why I'm not voting atm.

Not sure who looks scummy right now, literallypam case seems weak for the same reason you gave, they're not pushing for anything.

I'd say kagesong might be suspect, surely scum would be the ones who enjoy engaging in psychological warfare and someone in a lying mindset would see the ways innocent comments could be sneaky lies.

But then maybe I'm biased because they're voting for me.

[Rufus Delorian]

Since I know I'm town, someone making a bad case against me seems scummy to me, you all don't know I'm town so I accept I might be biased.

I already pointed out that kagesong's case was flawed because it relies on crap reasoning: statement sounds towny, scum want to seem towny so he's scum

Seriously, is accepting possible mistakes in reasoning scummy now? I really don't get how this works.

[Rufus Delorian]

Hawkleader has been pretty quiet, 2 posts so far, I'm up for vote-poking.

VOTE: Hawkleader3

[Rufus Delorian]

Literallypam, is there anyone that seems scummy to you at this point?

[Rufus Delorian]

I was waiting to see if anyone else would give opinions on the Literallypam accusation...I'm not as convinced as you & Drixx seem to be.

This might get some discussion going:

My susipicions of Kagesong have increased, in 99:

Truth be told, the Scum's best strategy now would be to kill you tonight. That would, by your own statement make Kirroha seem guilty, regardless of her guilt. Actually I would be more suspicious of Kirroha if you remain alive.

Sounds to me like he's planning to kill someone other than guttsa tonight, maybe to make Kirroha look guilty. Then he link back to that post and say "Oh, the scum didn't do what was obviously the best strategy, I can't be scum because I would have, let's lynch Kirroha!" Or he'll kill Kirroha and try to get a lynch on Guttsa.

VOTE: Kagesong

[Rufus Delorian]

You seem awfully confident about reads you claimed to have made after, what? 2 pages?

I'm assuming you still suspect me and literallypam...or should that be literallypam and I?

[Rufus Delorian]

It does seem pretty slow, wasn't sure if that was standard here.

Is there a generally good method of getting things moving?

Not sure what else to say, I've already said my suspicions are Kagesong and to a lesser extent Literallypam and they both accept that they look scummy...not sure what to make of their reactions.

[Rufus Delorian]

I agree with notachipmunk, even though Kagesong and Literallypam both seem scummy to me, I doubt they're a team.

Guttsa's reaction to being accused did seem excessively defensive to me, I didn't get any sense of

intense rage

from Kirroha in the questioning so it was odd, Guttsa might have been having a bad day but I guess we won't find out if they're being replaced.

Drixx seems very focussed on Literallypam, same for Kirroha on Guttsa.


I went back over Kagesong's posts and I'm more convinced now:

43, 58, 61, 99, 127 for assuming some kind of tricky lies are afoot, seems like the mindset scum would be in
54 for enjoyment of Psychological warfare (seems scummy to me)

99 (again) working out nightkills, the others are more tone, this one seems more solid to me: from the previous posts, it's clear the Kagesong likes using this WIFOM reasoning...

If he's scum, he's putting out a name that he knows isn't going to get NKd, he's distracting attention and then he'll probably kill me and say "Why would I kill the guy who's pushing for my lynch? It's too obvious so it can't be me, besides, I already pointed out who the NK should logically be."

If he's town, why would he think scum want Guttsa dead? Guttsa didn't say anything of note other than a counter-accusation against Kirroha, the suggestion that scum should night kill Guttsa came out of nowhere.



Since I think Kagesong is scum, and a team with Literallypam is unlikely, I don't think Literallypam is scum, despite sounding scummy.

Guttsa case, other than the overreaction, seems weak to me, seriously go look at the ISO, 6 posts, 5 excluding the RQS reply: 1 questioning an IC lynch (apparently a common mistake among us newbies), 2 getting angry about getting accused (maybe scummy I agree), 1 giving a (are you thinking fraudulent?) explanation for the overreaction and 1 calling out a lurker.

I doubt Hawkleader is scum...don't know how things go in general here but I'd guess that scum newbies would be less likely to drop out than townies.

As a guess I'd say Kagesong is scummily teamed up with either Reubus or Drixx...can't say which.

[Rufus Delorian]

I wanna see literallypam flip tonight if I'm completely honest. It'll answer a few questions about who is sided with who ect. we all agree that pam out of all is most likely scum?? We have under 5 days to decide who we're gonna lynch, so lets weigh up our options and share what reads we have. Obviously we are gonna come up with a few null reads but that's better than nothing. Oh the drawbacks of a slow moving game such as this and 2 non noncontributing people being replaced this late in day 1.

It wouldn't be my preference, but if nothing changes then I can probably change my vote and settle for a literallypam lynch...can you lay out the case against them as you see it?

[Rufus Delorian]

Hi new people, good to have replacements in. I'll hold off on any vote changing until you've had a fresh look through, might come up with something interesting.

First game so don't know about pressure in mafia game. Not sure what mechanical vs analytical means. Posted reads just before you guys joined.

[Rufus Delorian]

You'll have seen I'm on GMT then. I'm going to get sleep pretty soon, will see what answers I can give tomorrow, probably on lunch break.

My thoughts have changed since that quote, you'll see that though.

[Rufus Delorian]

Ha! Was not expecting that.

I'm not going to be able to trawl through all that on my phone and respond to everything.

Couple of things I can answer:

Reubus vote wasn't based on much, any suspicion I had of kirroha would be based on the same RVS stuffso I didn't pursue it.

Like I said earlier, the initial Literallypam post just read as a rushed response after being poked. The evasiveness is a bit odd but I'd really expect scum to try to defend themselves so the lackluster defense & FOSing me for questioning case against them just doesn't feel scummy to me, bad play obviously.

Hadn't thought about it until you mentioned but if Literallypam is scum, they have daytalk and apparently their partner never said "just admit it was an unjustified vote ffs!"

[Rufus Delorian]

I had to go back and recount the Drixx votes, can't believe I miscounted, but you're right.

As to assuming the IC is town...yeah, I did kind of assume that, newbie mistake I guess, has already been corrected.

Regarding Kagesong, I assume scum would be more paranoid, they have to lie constantly and worry about how their votes might give them away, I just have to tell truth & that shouldn't give scumreads.

About literallypam, I think scum would defend themselves more vigorously...especially if they can discuss strategy with their partner.

That links into my terrible reasoning about Hawkleader...it could be me projecting...I kinda wanted to be scum because it seems like it would be the more fun side so I'd expect newbies who draw scum to be more engaged.

I accept I might be completely misreading things, if we lynch Literallypam and they flip scum then I'll have to toss out all my reads...and maybe get lynched for going against it.

[Rufus Delorian]

Literallypam should have been doing anything other than evading questions, maybe try to shift attention to Guttsa or me, claim it was a newbie mistake or speed reading gone wrong...there's probably a bunch more that I can't think of right now.

Kagesong accused Literallypam pretty early, them being a team doesn't feel right to me.

[Rufus Delorian]

Notachipmunk, I was going to say that myself before doing answers.

First 2 pages of Kagesong is asking how to vote, answering RQ and accusing me.

Maybe accusing me is the clearance?

Frog also just skipped over the NK post which, I will repeat

came out of nowhere

no prompting, no previous discussion of NK, hardly any talk from or about Guttsa and Kirroha prior.

Am I really reading too much into that?

[Rufus Delorian]

@Reubus: I was hoping for a summary but Frog and Panther have sorted that.

I'm going to be busy for the next couple of days, it's mother's day on Sunday in England, thought it was universally the same day but my wife's family is from the Caribbean and apparently they follow the American one and it's in May. Anyway, it's the first year that she's a mother & my Sister has plans...will be able to check things on phone but won't be able to say much.

Anywhoo, since we're nearing the end of D1 and no other scum targets have turned up, I will do as I said:

VOTE: Literallypam

Literallypam is at L-1

[Rufus Delorian]

UNVOTE: LiterallyPam

Town:
Me- because I'm the sheriff jailor obviously

I'm probably falling into a silly simple trap here.

This is a lie, I'm the Jailkeeper.

Town wouldn't lie about this, FrogSC2 is the Mafia Roleblocker, we need to lynch him today, I'll jail Kagesong tonight and if there's no kill, we lynch him the next day.

VOTE: FrogSC2

Alternately, if you don't believe my claim, lynch me today and expose Frog's lie then lynch him and Kagesong...kill Frog or Me, that gives the most info

[Rufus Delorian]

I can't see any other way to read it:

Lol. Drixx is orbiting the dark side of the moon possibly all game. Such obvious radio silence.

For the sake of disclosure what I really think, and to encourage Drixx and others to open up:

Town:
Me- because I'm the sheriff

jailor

obviously
Kaesong- I've discussed this, I could ISO in a scum light, but the first pages D1 told me enough.
Panther- mind meld
Reubus- Pam push + range of interactions (genuine)

Slight town:
Drixx - will be lock clear if Pam flips, good instinct on pressuring, but hypocritical in not opening the game up and withholding opinions on literally anyone other than Pam
Notachipmunk - almost 100 null, but more willing to post about anyone/anything

Slight scum:
Kirroha - logic is off on current vote, avoids center of discussion (being it or discussing Pam/Drixx+Reubus)

Scum:
Literallypam- *uses dodge!* + perspective in posts
Rufus- focused defensive, felt like he was trying to just survive early D1 instead of hunting. +Reads of less logic


Remember, the flips can set up a path of changes in reads. It's ok to change your opinions *as long as you have a good reason and explain it*

The reason I'm setting this list out is to increase openness and discourage selfish play styles that actually hurt town. If no opinions are given, no actual day can exist beyond fluff, troll, or lurk.

He's the Mafia Roleblocker, check the role grid, maybe he stuck the Sheriff thing in there so he could claim he meant Cop if the Doctor got lynched or killed tonight.

[Rufus Delorian]

If you're right then...crap, big fuck up from me.

It's hard to read a joking tone from plain text.

[Rufus Delorian]

Actually Kage, you're terrible at seeing through loops, you've been 100% sure I'm scum since the start and I'm not, I'm pretty sure Literallypam's going to flip town too.

I doubt skipping a NK in the hope of getting a mislynch would benefit scum, they'd be swapping a sure kill for a risky one...they could kill you (if you're town) and implicate me as scum, I doubt that'll happen though.

[Rufus Delorian]

I expect they're trying to waste D2 lynching Pam.

[Rufus Delorian]

I'm not killing town, let scum get hands dirty.

[Rufus Delorian]

So I should burn for changing my mind in the course of nearly 100 posts but the two that said they were going to hammer then went missing, they're fine?

They both fall down a well or something?

[Rufus Delorian]

I'm convinced Kagesong is scum, mentioned it a bunch previously.

Frog's absolute defense of Kagesong was suspicious, as was delaying the Pam lynch & trying to pin wagon on Drixx.

Maybe I misread his role claim but I thought he was trying to undermine a future legitimate claim.

Frog & Kage both promising hammer & not delivering convinced me, Frog's been posting constantly but happened to miss deadline? It wasn't random, they knew when it was.

Me hammering got them a Town kill with neither scum voting, not doing it.

[Rufus Delorian]

Perhaps, except they both said they'd hammer.

Frog even gave a time: in the last 2 hours I believe.

[Rufus Delorian]

UNVOTE: LiterallyPam

Town:
Me- because I'm the sheriff jailor obviously

I'm probably falling into a silly simple trap here.

This is a lie, I'm the Jailkeeper.

Town wouldn't lie about this, FrogSC2 is the Mafia Roleblocker, we need to lynch him today, I'll jail Kagesong tonight and if there's no kill, we lynch him the next day.

VOTE: FrogSC2

Alternately, if you don't believe my claim, lynch me today and expose Frog's lie then lynch him and Kagesong...kill Frog or Me, that gives the most info

ACTUALLY you just open the door to more WIFOM that is unnecessary. IF we lynch frog or pam, i say pam, then jail me, the scum will simply not NK then I, according to your theory, would be confirmed scum, whether or not i am. HOWEVER, my theory all along has been that you and pam are scum, and that you are playing double to ensure that pam does not get lynched OR if they do that suspicion falls on someone else. You're almost good at this. But, I'm very good at seeing through these loops, I believe most of the town is. We don't play this game because we're bad with psychology. I think you should become the D2 lynch.

end of day i will be voting pam for now

[/unvote] whoever i voted for UNVOTE:
[/vote] Rufus Delorian VOTE:

my vote might have been there, i just want to make sure.

Test.

I'm going to hammer in the last 2 hours

.

[Rufus Delorian]

Well I called Literallypam completely wrong...woops.

I'd say Frog definitively claimed Jailkeeper before the night, surely that means the scum is me or him, I'd rather we lynch him first but I can definitely see people wanting me lynched...its a town win even if you do me then Frog so I'm not too bothered about order.

VOTE: FrogSC2

[Rufus Delorian]

I did jail Frog last night.

If he's the Mafia Roleblocker, as I suspect, who I choose to jail doesn't matter, it also doesn't matter too much if I die, I'm effectively a VT now.

If he is scum, killing me would be wasted, I'm obviously a prime lynching target today and he can just roleblock me each night.

That's all I can think of atm...could be completely wrong, my track record isn't great.

[Rufus Delorian]

If the remaining scum is the Mafia Roleblocker, my jailings won't clear anyone because the Roleblocker acts before me, says so on page 1 of the game.

If they're a regular goon, I don't know why I'm still alive, even acting randomly at night has an ok chance of stopping a NK.

I'd say Drixx & Reubus are the best choice for cleared town, they jumped on a scum straight off. I'm thinking Kagesong's probably town too for the same reason...I think his WIFOMy style gave me scummy vibes but he was pretty clear about suspecting Pam.

If we're trying to get roles claimed, the existence or not of a bulletproof townie would clear up whether Frog is cleared or not.

[Rufus Delorian]

I doubt it if you didn't know you'd been jailed

[Rufus Delorian]

If Frog's telling the truth about decoying, it's very odd that we both survived the night.

Although scum might have not wanted to guess & assumed one of us would be jailed so went for sure kill.

[Rufus Delorian]

Roleblocker resolves first, it's under the role matrix, on phone so can't quote it easily.

[Rufus Delorian]

Ok, maybe I'm being dumb here.

What's the risk of claiming bulletproof? Unless two people do it...but then we've got 2 people to choose from as scum.

If no-one claims it, I can jail as directed and we've got a better chance of winning.

If only 1 person claims it, I can jail them. If they're lying, I'll have jailed a regular goon and there'll be no NK. If they're telling the truth, the scum would have to give up a night kill to convince us that the bulletproof guy is scum. It doesn't benefit them any more than just shooting someone else in the night.

[Rufus Delorian]

If we get a claim of bulletproof, we can ignore anyone I jail as being cleared because there's a roleblocker...bad for you obviously.

If no-one claims it, you're cleared and so is anyone I jail while a kill happens.

Seems to me like a decent trade-off for losing one possible bullet soaking.

[Rufus Delorian]

Just going to check living player list:

1) Drixx
2) FrogSC2
3) kagesong
4) notachipmunk
5) PhantomCobalt
6) Reubus Swagrid
7) Rufus Delorian

As far as I can tell from the litrallypam lynch, Drixx and Reubus are solidly town, Kagesong and notachipmunk seem likely to be town.

I'm town, I'm certain no-one's going to counterclaim at this point because they'd just be announcing themselves as scum...they might get me mislynched today but then it's game over next day after I flip Jailkeeper.

So it's PhantomCobalt (Replacing Kirroha) or FrogSC2 (Replacing Guttsa)

Kirroha didn't do much but she did think Guttsa was scummy, she pushed a bit, got a reaction then Guttsa dropped out.

FrogSC2 did get the killing vote in on LiterallyPam, my question for the more experienced players is: Would you normally expect the deadline to be extended at that point? Frog voted about 45minutes after the deadline if I remember correctly, would that normally get counted? i.e. was it a legitimate vote or intentionally late, hoping for a no-lynch while still voting for scumpartner?

[Rufus Delorian]

1) PhantomCobalt
2) notachipmunk
3) Kagesong
4) Reubus Swagrid
5) Drixx

Seems like a decent idea to me, if it's not, please say so before people start claiming things.

I'm going to get some sleep now

[Rufus Delorian]

No-one's counterclaimed Jailkeeper. Frog kinda did but has retracted. If someone else claims it, lynch me then them.

[Rufus Delorian]

I'll say Frog does seem a bit scummy to me.

However, if we don't have a bulletproof townie, he

is

cleared. I jailed him & there was still a NK.

I claimed Jailkeeper D1, if I was lying, there'd be another Jailkeeper, a Doctor, a Tracker, or a Cop, they'd have claimed, revealed me as scum and won the game.

Pretty sure everyone's posted since then & would have had the whole night to work out the easy way to win.

Other than Frog, only person I could be suspicious of is PhantomCobalt, just because everyone else seems towny to me and Phantom & Kirroha haven't said much

[Rufus Delorian]

I doubt you're going to get quickhammered, PhantomCobalt's the only other person I think could be scum and he's already voted for you.

You're right though, you're 50% hard cleared from my POV, would be a bit rushed if you get lynched now.

UNVOTE:

[Rufus Delorian]

VOTE: PhantomCobalt

What the hell, a bit of voting might inspire some more talk from the elusive Phantom. Not announcing L-1 was kinda poor form too.

[Rufus Delorian]

Sounds reasonable, Kagesong did accuse Literallypam pretty early on though...could be WIFOMy I suppose.

@Drixx, you put Reubus pretty high on your suspect list, can you elaborate? I had you and Reubus cleared for the same reason.

[Rufus Delorian]

That was my first thought, but if Frog's a Roleblocker, there has to be a Bulletproof Townie in the mix.

If there is a Bulletproof guy, not claiming is causing possible scum to be totally cleared, I think we went over this pretty well earlier so, since no-one's claimed Bulletproof, we're working on the assumption that there's no Roleblocker.

[Rufus Delorian]

I read the GG as a concession as well, then Frog started talking himself out of the lynch.

If PhantomCobalt is scum, claiming BP's just going to drag the game out for another turn. If he claims it, we lynch Kagesong, I jail Phantom and there's no NK, then we lynch Phantom. Maybe they didn't see any point in wasting everyone's time.

I'll jail Kagesong tonight if PhantomCobalt flips town.

[Rufus Delorian]

If he's the MRB, our Bulletproof guy is screwing us over.

But phantom claimed VT already so we're not losing a BP townie if we lynch him and if he is MRB, game's won.

[Rufus Delorian]

If scum doesn't NK, we get 2x the number of lynches that they can't control.

I know you like your WIFOM but that seems too farfetched to me.

[Rufus Delorian]

Are you just arguing for the sake of it at this point?

If there's no Roleblocker, I jailed him and there was a kill so he's cleared.

If there is a Roleblocker, we have a bulletproof townie who's stubbornly not claiming for no good reason.

We can't both be scum so if you think I'm lying about being JK, Frog is town, if you think Frog's a Roleblocker, you also have to assume a secret Bulletproof who thinks maybe surviving a NK is worth letting us think scum is cleared.

[Rufus Delorian]

I'd put Drixx as more town cleared than notachipmunk.

[Rufus Delorian]

Your assertion was that Frog & Pam are partners & there's no Roleblocker.

I've claimed Jailkeeper and say I jailed Frog last night.

For your theory to be correct, Frog would be scum and I'd be lying, therefore scum...it doesn't work, there's only one scum left.

[Rufus Delorian]

I hadn't even considered lynching that other guy...we may have to debate this proposal at great length.

I'll start us off:

If That Other Guy = scum, this is a great proposal.

If That Other Guy = town, this is not a very good proposal.


I'm sure Frog can elaborate in far greater detail.

[Rufus Delorian]

Take him to the gallows already

This.

[Rufus Delorian]

You know you can just ignore Frog, right? I've just been skimming his longer posts.

To be clear, do you actually think there's a Bulletproof Townie who hasn't claimed or are you just wanting to go against what Frog's doing because you think he's an ass?

[Rufus Delorian]

We kinda already pursued the Frog = Scum line of thinking. Without a Bulletproof Townie, it doesn't work out.

Reubus did the Rufus = Scum line of thinking but without any other power role claim, it doesn't work out.

We're currently on PhantomCobalt = Scum with a hint of Kagesong = scum in the mix.

Drixx, Reubus & Notachipmunk haven't had much suspicion pointed at them but they all voted on a scum lynch D1, if you can think of any reason to suspect one of them more than PhantomCobalt...we've got time I guess.

Personally I'd rather string up PhantomCobalt and be done with it.


Also, I read 'That other guy' as Kagesong.

[Rufus Delorian]

The lynch had already gone through at that point, D1 could have been extended for a week and that vote still wouldn't have been counted.

Regardless, if you're not scum, our current plan works for you. Either PhantomCobalt is scum and town win or I jail you tonight, you're safe from NK and cleared as town when I get killed.

[Rufus Delorian]

Well then we mislynch you tomorrow and discover their tactic, they'll have lost a NK though so it's still in town's favour.

It's an unsustainable tactic anyway because at some point, I'll Jail the actual scum. If they manage to be unsuspected the whole way through and give up all their NKs, it'll be me, Frog and the scum at the end, we'll lynch them, town win.

[Rufus Delorian]

If it is That Other Guy, I'll be so miffed. There is no greater pain than being betrayed by That Other Guy.

...maybe stubbing a toe.

[Rufus Delorian]

Think it's 4: Me, Reubus, Frog and Drixx

[Rufus Delorian]

Just try to pass it off as a teaching thing...this is what

not

to do newbies, take note.

Claiming 1-shot would be a sneaky thing for the regular goon to do, I imagine Drixx could be very sneaky. It's the only way to derail the plan and no-one can counterclaim, either he is the 1-shot or there isn't one and he knows it. Though if he was a regular goon, I expect he would have killed me and probably not have killed his own partner on D1...and his partner wouldn't have jumped on an imaginary Drixx wagon, so I'm going to believe the claim.

Reubus went straight for Literallypam too, he could have switched suspicion to me pretty easily D1 without seeming dodgy if he wanted to save his partner so I think he's probably town too.

So I reckon we lynch Kagesong and Notachipmunk in that order.

[Rufus Delorian]

He killed his partner on D1? What are the odds of it happening twice in two sequential games though?

I jail Drixx tonight, if there's a Roleblocker, it won't matter coz I can't jail anyone. If there's not, there'll be no NK. We can use the same logic as before, if the Roleblocker is choosing not to do a NK to frame Drixx, we're still one NK up and if we lynch Drixx tomorrow after no NK and he shows up bulletproof, we'll know there's a Roleblocker.

...crap, just did maths, I think the scum withholding a NK to frame Drixx would win them the game if we went for it so my jailing Drixx is a bad thing to rely on.

[Rufus Delorian]

His explanation does sound believable though. Also, I really think an IC would be doing a pretty bad job introducing newbies to the game if he got on a scum team with literallypam and immediately screwed them over.

I think Kagesong was acting kinda erratically at the end of D2: self voting when it was clear someone else was getting lynched, arguing how we were stupid for only seeing things one way (only Drixx & the scum should have known there was another way) and seeming to get pretty worked up at Frog.

Then Frog gets NKd...clearly it could be someone else trying to frame Kagesong by NKing the person Kagesong was arguing with but then Kagesong's been WIFOMy all game so it's exactly what he would do if he was scum.

VOTE: Kagesong

It's going to be Drixx now isn't it?

[Rufus Delorian]

Well I guess, before he turns up...does anyone think Reubus seems scummy so far?

I'm curious about the Notachipmunk vote too, looking back at her ISO, she's only voted 4 times and 2 of them were for Literallypam, one of them putting Pam at L-1 before being convinced to unvote by Frog then revoting again...same reasoning I've used to kinda clear Drixx and Reubus.

Balls, looking back at Kagesong's ISO, I'm less convinced than I was before, although...bit of an odd thing to notice, post 26, Kagesong asks about if anyone saw Literallypam's name as Literallyspam...Pam hadn't posted yet at that point...the name was obviously on the player list so that could be it, or it could be that he had the name in his head because he was part of the scum team.

Some opinions of likely scummyness would be good from Kagesong and Notachipmunk, especially if there's good reasons to think Drixx or Reubus are scum.

[Rufus Delorian]

The deadline is the deadline and FroGSC2 caused a no lynch, and I believe it's intentional. I believe he's scum and have strong reasons for that belief. He called out what I have reason to believe was a VT attempting to draw fire by claiming. If I'm dead in the morning you will see my role and it will make sense. If I'm know, I'll say more.

It's a bit of an old post but I'm quoting it here because I was sure Drixx was the bulletproof after it, which was why I was initially reluctant to accept Frog as cleared and kept asking the BP to step forwards.

Also, if there isn't a Roleblocker, I should have been NKd. If there is, it's useful to keep me around as long as BP doesn't claim because it could lead to scum getting cleared...such as if I "jailed" scum last night.

@Kagesong, on D2 you kept arguing that Frog was wrong & not cleared because there could be a Roleblocker, today Drixx has confirmed that there is one but you're not convinced, what changed?

[Rufus Delorian]

Okay, let's consider your opinion: Drixx is suspicious because he's claiming BP late.

Why would scumDrixx do this?

If he was under threat of being lynched, it could be a last ditch attempt to avoid it...But Drixx wasn't threatened by lynching, he's not even been mentioned as a possible lynchee since RVS because he went after scum D1.
It could be a way to discredit the people cleared by the Jailkeeper, but if that's the intent, why not just kill the Jailkeeper? It's a less risky course to take.

Why would vanillatownieDrixx do this?

To avoid being the target of a NK, selfishly putting his survival over the town win condition

Why would BulletproofDrixx do this?

It was a mistake, as he claims or:
He was hoping to get targeted for NK so his ability wasn't wasted (This would be if he hadn't forgotten)


Which one seems more likely? And don't just say "It could be WIFOM" WIFOM just means, "could be, could not, I don't know"...it contributes nothing, bringing it up only really benefits scum because you can throw doubt on towns legitimate attempts to clear town or find scum.

[Rufus Delorian]

It doesn't have to be complicated, you put the 6th vote on when 5 were needed, even if the deadline hadn't passed, it wouldn't have had any effect.

[Rufus Delorian]

Not sure what else to say, Kagesong seems scummiest to me and we've kinda run that out and said why other people seem less scummy.

If anyone's got alternate scum reads, it'd be good to discuss them but I've got nothing atm

[Rufus Delorian]

I do:

Kagesong is L-1

[Rufus Delorian]

I hear it makes you go blind.

[Rufus Delorian]

I'm fine with someone hammering, even if Kagesong isn't scum, it's clear that his apparent scummyness is hard to ignore, I doubt anyone else is going to be the top suspect, or even get decent consideration, while he's still around.

[Rufus Delorian]

Huzzah for town!

Good play chipmunk, I only thought you could be scum when you ended up with Drixx & Reubus since they were confirmed town for me

Kage, for me the main thing that made you seem scummy was the WIFOM stuff, it seemed like you were trying to confuse things or be deliberately contrary.

Not that my opinion should count for much, my game was entirely made up of dropping the ball, don't think I made a single good call, pretty fun though, reckon I'll get in on another newbie game in a month or so when I'm less busy.

Are there usually so many dropouts? That kinda confused things.