Newbie 1717: Newbies Through the Looking Glass (Game Over)


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Post Post #9 (isolation #0) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 1:46 am

Post by Accountant »

VOTE: innocentvillager

His scumbuddy is Meepo - casting shade on Mizzy's wagon by using the word "random" to imply it's without justification. He follows it up with a classic chainsaw defense of innocentvillager. I think that's enough to wrap up the game. Sorry, scum members. I know you tried, but you lost the moment you drew the opposite alignment as me.
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Post Post #10 (isolation #1) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 1:47 am

Post by Accountant »

Everyone please sheep the IC. They know best.


Hi, I’m Accountant, your friendly neighbourhood Inexperience-Challenged player, or IC. This means that I have a few games under my belt, so I know the ins and outs of mafia and can show you the ropes. For those of you who hate reading long rants, or have read a similar post already, check out the link:
A Beginner’s Guide to Being Awesome At Mafia
Anyway, as the IC, it’s my job to teach you theory concepts, which means I will never lie about theory questions. When I answer those questions, I will be typing in this color (red), so you know I’m wearing my IC hat and not my <insert alignment here> hat.
Before we start the game proper, I’d like to cover a few key concepts.


Hammering, Lynching and L-1

When the number of votes on a player exceeds half the number of players for that game, that player is lynched
instantly
and the Day ends. For example, we have 9 players. If that means the hammer is 5, so if there were to be 5 votes on someone, that player would be lynched. Do not recklessly hammer, especially early in the game, or you’ll risk accidentally lynching town members and cutting short discussion time.
The concept of L-X is used to indicate how many votes a player is to hammer. L-1 means 1 vote to hammer, L-2 means 2 votes to hammer and so forth. So for this game, if someone were to get 4 votes, they would be at L-1. When you place the vote that puts someone at L-1(for example, if someone has 3 votes and you’re putting the 4th vote down, with a hammer of 5), you should usually announce it with a statement like “He’s at L-1”, so people don’t accidentally hammer. Even more importantly, it means that mafia can’t hammer a town member and then claim ignorance the next day.
If someone is at L-1 and you want to hammer him, you should usually state “intent to hammer”, which means “I want to lynch you”. When you do this, you can also ask for a role claim. That way, if the player is a power role being mislynched, he can claim before you place the hammering vote, and thus save himself.


LyLo

LyLo is the shortened form of a phrase which means “lynch or lose”. The simplest form of LyLo is 3 players, 2 of whom are vanilla townies and the last being a mafia goon. Then, it’s easy to see that if they do not lynch, the mafia goon will kill one of them at night, stalemating the lynch the next day, and killing the last town member on Night 2 – although the mod will usually recognize this and end the game early instead of dragging it out.
When town is in LyLo, it’s important not to carelessly vote like you would on any other day, because of the potential for a mafia coordinated hammer(a “quickhammer”, happening before anyone else can react). Let’s say we have LyLo with 3 Vanilla Townies and 2 Mafia Goons. One of the vanilla townie carelessly puts his vote on another VT. This allows the two mafia goons to instantly rush in and simultaneously vote that VT, bringing his vote count to 3 in a game of 5 players, which is a hammer and loss for the town.
It’s good practice to try to recognize LyLo situations when you see them, but in Newbie games a more experienced player will usually point out that it’s LyLo and caution people from recklessly voting. Learning how to deal with LyLo is a very important part of playing mafia, and it comes up more often than you might think.


RVS

We are currently in the RVS, or Random Voting Stage. As none of us has any idea who is mafia(well, except the mafia members themselves, but they’re hardly going to admit it), we’re mostly poking around and slinging votes like hot curry at a food fight, trying to provoke reactions, start a discussion and basically probe around to try and determine player’s alignments.
As it is the
Random
Voting Stage, it’s common for players to vote for very silly reasons, such as “your avatar is ugly” or “your username has too many numbers in it”. Don’t worry, they don’t have a grudge against you or anything. It’s just part of RVS. Without RVS, it would be a lot harder to get the game moving.


Conclusion

Thank you for joining this newbie game, and I hope that all of us will have fun playing, win or lose. If you have any questions at all, feel free to ask me. I’m an IC, so it’s my job to be active and respond to questions from newer players. I live in Singapore, which makes my timezone GMT+8, so don’t be surprised if I answer in the middle of the night or appear to be inactive at high noon(I’m probably sleeping).

Have fun and good luck!


- Accountant
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #12 (isolation #2) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:01 am

Post by Accountant »

That makes no sense Grace. I said Meepo was scum with innocentvillager, so how exactly am I drawing attention away from Mizzy accusing Meepo? In fact, I'm drawing attention to that fact by putting a spotlight on Meepo and giving meat to Mizzy's accusations. I think your suspicions are unfounded, sorry.
Makes me think that maybe you're just extrapolating your asociation with Mizzy
To extrapolate means, broadly, to infer an unknown from something that is known. If I had an association with Mizzy, it would hardly be unknown to me, so I couldn't possibly extrapolate that. You need to be clearer on what exactly you think I'm doing with Mizzy.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #14 (isolation #3) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:16 am

Post by Accountant »

What do you have to hide, Grace? I have a far easier time reading people when they're natural and let their thoughts flow freely rather than constructing their sentences artificially to try to
seem
a certain way. That's a very mafia thing to do.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #15 (isolation #4) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:17 am

Post by Accountant »

Since you said the reason your vote was still on me was because I "exposed" you, does that mean you acknowledge that your accusation of me drawing attention away from Mizzy accusing Meepo had no merit?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #17 (isolation #5) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:38 am

Post by Accountant »

Now that it's known that I'm no brainy, I don't have to pretend
I was just trying to sound clever
I'm not sure what you mean by this. Were you attempting to sound clever or not? This isn't a jibe at your intelligence; it's a legitimate issue if you're going around trying to sell us a certain image of yourself artificially.
I see you as a dangerous player capable of manipulating us all
I agree. I
could
manipulate you all, but I won't, because I'm town. My capability to manipulate people has absolutely nothing to do with the role card the moderator sent me. It isn't as if he mind-scans the players to see who's the most manipulative and then sends mafia PMs to the most manipulative players.
now I do think you're a member of the mafia
Can you explain clearly why you think so?
I don't want this town to start killing each other because of forced accusations made by scum
I don't either. What made you think my vote on Meepo was a "forced accusation" and stemming from a scum motive?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #19 (isolation #6) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:03 am

Post by Accountant »

I just do, I don't trust you.
Unfortunately, that kind of reasoning won't quite cut it. Isn't it a little hypocritical of you to accuse me of making forced accusations when your own accusations(against me) are backed by no reasoning at all?
And then, if I'm right about thinking so, you'd be really dangerous and we should lynch you before you get to make us vote for an innocent villager.
What makes you so confident I am a mafia member this early in the game? After all, if I am town and you lynch me, then you have lynched a dangerous player who was on your side. Why didn't you consider this?
You took every single thing Meepo said and turned it against him and innocentvillager, and for me that seems a bit forced.
I don't think it was forced. I think Meepo's words were inherently suspicious, all I did was point out how weird it was that he was chainsaw defending a random player in RVS - something that you yourself are guilty of. If Meepo had good intentions, then excellent. Let him come into here and explain himself before the eyes of 14 of his peers. He certainly doesn't need you to defend him.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #22 (isolation #7) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:26 am

Post by Accountant »

VOTE: Grace

Joking around early D1 is normal, but it's only natural to become serious when scum makes a slip up like Grace did. She became more and more desperate under pressure and eventually cracked with #21, ignoring all my questions in favor for an appeal to... I'm not sure what she's appealing to, but it's not logic.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #24 (isolation #8) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:32 am

Post by Accountant »

Grace, why did you lie about the seriousness of your accusation?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #26 (isolation #9) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:54 am

Post by Accountant »

So you kept your vote on me because you thought I was mafia for being too aggressive? Why do you think I was aggressive-mafia and not aggressive-town? For all you know, I could have been aggressively trying to hunt down mafia members. It's interesting to me that the way your post is worded implies that you do not like questions and refutations.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #76 (isolation #10) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 1:20 pm

Post by Accountant »

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

Will post fully when I get on a computer.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #78 (isolation #11) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:24 pm

Post by Accountant »

Let's look at some things I found interesting.

Grace

I don't think Grace is scum. Her reactions seem to me like newbtown frustrating/panicking/lashing out because they've just been put under pressure by the IC than anything else.
And yes, I'm nervous, that's why most of the things I've said so far make no sense, I'm just not used to be confronted that hardly. And sorry for the typos.
This doesn't look like scum to me.

Meepo

Some of the bits coming from him are standard. Others I find questionable.
My first post was a joke reply to your joke posts. But the fact that you just don`t want to let that go is suspicious.
Why do you think it is suspicious?
Your post is about something actually in game - the fact I was trying to get a wagon going.
I did not know you were trying to do so
Here he answers Mizzy's question in bold. Why, though? It seems to me that it should be obvious Mizzy was trying to create a wagon on IV to get out of RVS, especially since he has
explicitly stated so
.

I don't like Meepo's posts because he seems excessively focused on the RVS stage(which I think we are well out of by now) and the general tone of his posts is in defending himself from Mizzy rather than actively trying to go out and find scum. I don't like that. I don't get the sense Meepo is trying to figure out the game at all. He has 12 posts in his ISO - a total of 11 are fluff or focused on subjects like RVS and "seriousness" of posts. The only post that I'd call actual looking for scum is #23, where he points out Grace contradicting herself. If we add in posts that even hint at the fact that he's searching for/attacking scum, we could add #37, where he attacks Mizzy kinda noncommitally, and more importantly doesn't follow up on it at all. His further interactions with Mizzy doesn't feel like a town interacting with his only stated scumread - they are light hearted and full of offtopic content.

InnocentVillager

Let's get this clear about this meta. I don't know his meta. I don't trust people in this game to tell or show me what his meta is/was. Even if I had incontrovertible proof that his meta was to be "eccentric and aggressive", I wouldn't vote him or scumread him based on that. In other words, I'm completely disregarding anything Mizzy has said so far about his meta when deciding how I feel about him.

So, how
do
I feel about him? Honestly, I'm absolutely null, and currently I'm convinced that anyone who reads him anything but null is:
1) Scum making up a read
2) Misguided town who feels they have to have a strong read on everyone
3) Confused

He's literally fluffing his way through the game, and not in the way Meepo is doing, in a way that acknowledges the fluff and attributes it to exhaustion from previous games + mobile posting + vacation. That to me is completely NAI. Any talk of InnocentVillager at this point is a distraction and if you're town you should focus on the people that matter. If IV is still shitting around 50 pages in, then we can examine him.

Mizzytastic

Post #30 is bad. It has a lot of questions, but there's no meat in it. It's just jabbing and poking people with porcupine quills. There aren't any questions that strike to the heart of someone, they all feel very shallow. That plus the needlessly exhaustive post by post analysis makes me feel like it's just there to make Mizzy look active and making an effort. I'm not too impressed with the meta attack on IV either. After this, he engages in a long and drawn out conversation about irrelevant details with Meepo. Despite bringing up several reasons for Meepo being scum, he ends up voting IV.

I have a bad feeling about this slot and I don't like the way he's setting about "scumhunting". VOTE: Mizzytastic
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #80 (isolation #12) » Wed Jun 08, 2016 4:20 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 79, RadiantCowbells wrote:so why did you vote me?
OMGUS
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Post Post #89 (isolation #13) » Thu Jun 09, 2016 2:50 am

Post by Accountant »

Okay, Meepo is town. RC, stop playing games and sheep me thanks.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #90 (isolation #14) » Thu Jun 09, 2016 2:51 am

Post by Accountant »

Hey Lycan I feel like you're just sitting around and whaling on someone who can't fight back. Any thoughts on active players?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #98 (isolation #15) » Thu Jun 09, 2016 5:33 am

Post by Accountant »

RC is not a Titus alt.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #103 (isolation #16) » Thu Jun 09, 2016 2:22 pm

Post by Accountant »

I like Simoyd now.

Why isn't Mizzie doing more stuff with Meepo? It makes sense to talk to and pressure your scumreads.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #105 (isolation #17) » Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:17 pm

Post by Accountant »

Why. I don't see it.
Posts feel very real and typical of a newbie townie.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #107 (isolation #18) » Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:47 pm

Post by Accountant »

I thought #104 was pretty meaningful, Lyc. Is there any other reason why you think IV is suspicious?
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #111 (isolation #19) » Fri Jun 10, 2016 3:07 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 109, RadiantCowbells wrote:Really, really like my Accountant vote.
I guess your record of being able to perfectly read my alignment has finally come to an end
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Post Post #113 (isolation #20) » Fri Jun 10, 2016 3:25 am

Post by Accountant »

What don't you like about my reads, etc.?
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Post Post #114 (isolation #21) » Fri Jun 10, 2016 3:26 am

Post by Accountant »

I've never done a single reaction test this entire game, and I don't know why people thought I did. :|
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Post Post #116 (isolation #22) » Fri Jun 10, 2016 3:38 am

Post by Accountant »

And yes I meet my promises, unlike everyone else I've seen who says shit like this.....
I call these people "Donald Trumps" because they promise walls but can't deliver :P
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Post Post #124 (isolation #23) » Fri Jun 10, 2016 9:44 pm

Post by Accountant »

You certainly don't think this is enough to wrap up the game. If not bussing, then is this a reaction test?
It certainly was enough to wrap up the game if Meepo had been serious. But he later said he was joking.
I just get the impression that your motivation to tunnel was to keep up the bussing facade and not to find scum like town would.
I tunneled on Grace because I wasn't sure of her alignment yet. 13 and 16 may have been enough for you to determine her true colors, but it wasn't enough for me. People respond under pressure - that response shows me their alignment. Afterwards I townread Grace since her respond was townie.
Why would town OMGUS (post 80)?
Because I knew that RC's initial vote on me was just him playing games as usual, so I voted him back to show my displeasure. In addition, this was something of a placeholder vote, and after I completed my analysis I ended up voting Mizzy.
Why defend?
Because people were attacking him unreasonably and I wanted to put a stop to that.
And making people feel stupid like that isn't a reaction test how?
Please explain how my post made people feel stupid.
In the same post you also attack Mizzy, saying her post 30 is bad when 80% of it basically just looks like parroting of your own opinion earlier in the game
Indeed - just because someone is sheeping me doesn't mean that their posts are magically good.
How is anyone expected to strike the heart of someone at this point?
I don't expect Mizzy to strike at the heart of anyone. If she doesn't have something real to scumhunt, she be honest and say that she can't find any openings to question rather than trying to look good by jabbing aimlessly.
Why is jabbing and poking any different than what RC has done?
RC's meta isn't to jab and poke, it's to make naked votes and one liners or 20 pages and then jump on someone and deathtunnel them. In addition, I'm wary of trying to sort RC early because I find him difficult to read.
How do you differentiate between Mizzy appearing to look active and actually looking active at this point in the game?
I assume you meant actually "being" active here. My response is that the difference is the intent and direction of her questions. I don't see the pointedness and the "driving" that would lead me to believe she has a concrete idea of how each question helps to sort player alignments.
Since when does town ever ask someone to sheep them?
What is wrong with town asking someone to sheep them? To "sheep" someone means to follow their lead and vote who they vote - if a town member is confident they've found a good player to vote, they should want the rest of the town to vote with them.
again defending innocentvillager. This seems to be a reoccuring theme...
Of course I'm defending him. He's literally awol and people are rushing to jump down his throat.
Liking me is the obvious scum choice because I'm terrible at this game and obvious newb town.
Liking you is the obvious
town
choice, too. If you're obvious newb town, that means that I, as a town member, should want to read you as town.
This is besides the fact that I was voting meepo and not pushing either, but you like me?
I think you were doing this in a sort of clueless town way, rather than Mizzy's deceptive manner.
I would like to see a detailed explaination on why you think that post seems nowbie townie and meaningful...
You misunderstand. IV, in his post, questioned why I townread Meepo. I said that Meepo as a whole seemed genuine.
I think IV is your buddy. You immidiatly respond positivly and defend him again in 107 the moment he's under fire... What is that!
Why do you think that me defending IV means that we both have to be scum together? That's a ridiculous line of thinking. All town would defend another player who they feel to be unfairly attacked, which IV was. My actual read on IV is nullish, so anyone who reads him otherwise is either seeing something I don't(unlikely, since there's nothing much to see from 1 post and some V/LA declarations) or outright wrong.

In Conclusion

I feel that your erroneous scum read on me is due to a number of misunderstandings about my play and horrible misconceptions about how town should react. Your logic and hasty pre-flip associatives are bad and do not hold in the face of closer examination. You also seem to fundamentally misunderstand the point of many of my posts, like declaring them to be reaction tests when they're anything but. In the light of this, there can be no further reason to suspect I am scum.
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Post Post #126 (isolation #24) » Fri Jun 10, 2016 10:15 pm

Post by Accountant »

How am I being defensive, IV? Simoyd wrote a post about how I was scum; I responded by writing a post about how I was not. This seems natural.
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Post Post #128 (isolation #25) » Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:31 pm

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You should! I suggest changing it to Mizzy.
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Post Post #133 (isolation #26) » Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:58 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 130, Lycanfire wrote:Accountant, why defend IV so hard when he had an opportunity to do it himself, gave it up and showed up 36 hours later to try? Popular opinion wasn't against IV. Why should you care more than he did, and what was the rush?
I care when people say/do wrong things. Like suspecting IV for for being V/LA.
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Post Post #134 (isolation #27) » Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:58 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 132, Pants98 wrote:
In post 126, Accountant wrote:How am I being defensive, IV? Simoyd wrote a post about how I was scum; I responded by writing a post about how I was not. This seems natural.
Yeah........ no.

VOTE: Accountant
1) You're actually going to have to give a stronger case than that if you want to lynch me.
2) This vote makes it L-1, which means the next person to vote me will lynch me instantly(as outlined in my IC post). You should have declared this so people don't vote recklessly.
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Post Post #137 (isolation #28) » Sat Jun 11, 2016 4:05 pm

Post by Accountant »

hey pants it's been way more than a few hours
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Post Post #149 (isolation #29) » Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:37 pm

Post by Accountant »

That last paragraph conclusion was done in order to completely shut down any attempt Simoyd may gave at scum reading me.
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Post Post #152 (isolation #30) » Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:13 pm

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Who do you think is scum and why, Grace?
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Post Post #154 (isolation #31) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 2:14 am

Post by Accountant »

Okay, that sounds good. Please focus on Mizzytastic especially, I want to know what you think of her.
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Post Post #159 (isolation #32) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 6:51 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 155, RadiantCowbells wrote:Accountant is scum. stop voting people who aren't accountant and start voting people who are.

Note that Accountant hasn't said anything to me.
Hey RC, just a reminder that I on principle don't really interact with you much on Day 1. The rule I established back in that other newbie whose name slips my mind is that I'll townread you at the start of the game and scumread you more as time passes by without you getting NKed, and I am sticking to that.

In addition, you don't talk to your scumreads, so I don't see anything to be gained out of talking to you. If you have something to say and want me to respond just directly address me. Thanks.
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Post Post #160 (isolation #33) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 6:53 am

Post by Accountant »

I don't like his newest post#154 because it sounds like a "validate my scumread" post.
If Grace goes "hey Mizzy is obvtown" and lists a bunch of reasons wouldn't that completely defeat the purpose of it?
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Post Post #164 (isolation #34) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:42 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 161, Lycanfire wrote:
In post 160, Accountant wrote:
I don't like his newest post#154 because it sounds like a "validate my scumread" post.
If Grace goes "hey Mizzy is obvtown" and lists a bunch of reasons wouldn't that completely defeat the purpose of it?
Does scumAccountant have anything to lose at this point?
scum!Accountant has quite a lot to lose. The wagon on me was dead in the water after Grace backed off; like you said, nobody was applying a lot of pressure. It makes no sense to characterize this as a desperate move.
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Post Post #167 (isolation #35) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:44 am

Post by Accountant »


What I mostly meant was #2 and #3 which are straight up personal attacks on anyone who was considering IV. The rest I've quoted here is of the same tone.
These are not personal attacks. They simply reflect the state of the game. If I had said "you are an idiot for not nullreading IV" that would be personal but when I said misguided I was simply referring to the fact that the person would be focusing their energies on the wrong player and would be well advised to participate in actual scumhunting.

Scumreading IV is NAI by itself, but it can be part of a pattern of weak attacks where the player just picks on easy targets.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #168 (isolation #36) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:45 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 166, Simoyd wrote:
In post 164, Accountant wrote:It makes no sense to characterize this as a desperate move.
Do you feel like you're under pressure right now?
No, not at all. Two of the people voting me - Pants and RC - have literally no stated reason and the others are quite apathetic about me I feel.
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Post Post #170 (isolation #37) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:48 am

Post by Accountant »


Would you prefer for her to just say "I can't find any opening to question" every 48 hours instead of at least trying to question and analyse? Wouldn't activity from her be good for town, regardless if she's scum or not, instead of making her feel bad about her direction and post less?
Scumhunting is not just about questioning. She could analyze the posts that are already there, state her reads, make cases and so on if she can't find an opening.

I think it would be accurate to quantify almost everything that happened before post 30 as "jabbing aimlessly", including your posts. I think everything I did before post 112 was "jabbing aimlessly" trying to hit something. Can you explain to me why you think this is a scum tell?
I disagree. My early posts and interactions helped me to sort Grace quickly. Jabbing is a scum tell because it makes scum look like they're scumhunting when they are just sitting at their computers asking aimless questions as they already know who is what alignment.
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Post Post #171 (isolation #38) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:49 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 169, Simoyd wrote:
In post 124, Accountant wrote:if a town member is confident they've found a good player to vote, they should want the rest of the town to vote with them.
I think the "how" is questionable. You chose the "ask someone directly to sheep me" route. I'm concerned with what motivated you to choose that.
How else would I get RC to vote with me? He doesn't respond to cases, which is my usual go to for pushibg a wagon.
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Post Post #174 (isolation #39) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:07 am

Post by Accountant »


I wouldn't... I would attack the person who attacked my town read. Does that mean you think I'm scum?
Not really
I'm not sure one exists, but did you really expect to yield any fruit for this effort?
Yes.
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Post Post #175 (isolation #40) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:08 am

Post by Accountant »

Attacking X for unfairly attacking Y is just another way of defending Y. That is why it is known as the chainsaw defense.
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Post Post #179 (isolation #41) » Mon Jun 13, 2016 6:02 pm

Post by Accountant »

Wait, so first you say there's a lot to lose, then you say the wagon is dead, so what is there to lose then?
Figure of speech. To have nothing to lose means simply "I'm screwed because of the wagon, might as well do something reckless". If the wagon is dead, then I'm still "in the game" and can't make desperate or suicidal moves.
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Post Post #182 (isolation #42) » Tue Jun 14, 2016 2:53 am

Post by Accountant »

The action in question: me asking for Grace's thoughts on Mizzy.
Claimed upside: I get validation on my scumread.
Possible downside: Grace strongly townreads Mizzy and the opposite happens

It's almost like the upsides and downsides are the same and I really just wants to know how Grace reads Mizzy!
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Post Post #184 (isolation #43) » Tue Jun 14, 2016 2:58 am

Post by Accountant »

Well, RC and Pants seem to be vampires who hate the sun and refuse to go out doing the day.

Grace has vanished as well, albeit less severely, but her content has dropped severely ever since early game. Mizzy is V/LA, I think.
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Post Post #192 (isolation #44) » Tue Jun 14, 2016 5:48 pm

Post by Accountant »

Pants or RC, maybe. I'm not sure, I don't have a solid scumread and even my read on Meepo is like kinda wobbly
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Post Post #195 (isolation #45) » Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:09 pm

Post by Accountant »

since when do you give wallcases RC
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Post Post #197 (isolation #46) » Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:26 pm

Post by Accountant »

Apparently, keeping a meta is so important that you can't break character in a newbie game and use a throwaway one.
What?
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Post Post #199 (isolation #47) » Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:30 pm

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RC isn't doing that to keep a meta IMO, he's doing it because he genuinely feels I am a scumlord and he thinks town has the best chance of win by lynching me so focusing on other candidates is irrelevant.
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Post Post #204 (isolation #48) » Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:28 am

Post by Accountant »

Why?
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Post Post #210 (isolation #49) » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:18 am

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On Grace? I'm not pushing her lynch any more. I changed my mind.
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Post Post #212 (isolation #50) » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:19 am

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I don't think any of what I said was contrived sounding. I don't get what you mean by that.
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Post Post #224 (isolation #51) » Wed Jun 15, 2016 5:19 am

Post by Accountant »

Hey have I taken LSD

Since when does RC voluntarily release pressure on a hard tunnel of his

Sorry postie on mobile, will link you to a couple of my games when I get on my laptop. I usually make weird pushes during early day 1 to start discussion, the trouble is I sometimes end up believing my own nonsense and getting sucked into a deathtunnel.
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Post Post #226 (isolation #52) » Wed Jun 15, 2016 5:24 am

Post by Accountant »

I've already stated why I don't like RC, he's not giving reasons and making bad pushes. I know it's his meta but I don't see the spark that usually leads me to townread him early.
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Post Post #228 (isolation #53) » Wed Jun 15, 2016 6:31 am

Post by Accountant »

No, it was a statement of confusion because RC doesn't usually do this
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Post Post #232 (isolation #54) » Wed Jun 15, 2016 7:04 pm

Post by Accountant »

Postie replaced in and her being in the game makes me unwilling to push a lynch until I've fully read.
What do you mean?
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Post Post #237 (isolation #55) » Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:03 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 236, RadiantCowbells wrote:It means, shocker, I like playing with Postie and I want to put everything into the game when we're in it together.
>implying I'm not worth putting everything into

:cry:
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Post Post #238 (isolation #56) » Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:04 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 234, Simoyd wrote:Getting prodded once then replaced is a town tell right?
nope
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Post Post #245 (isolation #57) » Thu Jun 16, 2016 1:31 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 239, innocentvillager wrote:
In post 230, Postie wrote:Um, that's actually a pretty towny post.
If you're referring to RC's post, why?

I initially thought RC's unvote was bad but seeing after his explanation on wanting to really try when you replaced in is NAI at best.
Because if he was scum he has no reason to unvote.
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Post Post #247 (isolation #58) » Thu Jun 16, 2016 7:47 pm

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i have enough jelly to fill a doughnut :'(
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Post Post #252 (isolation #59) » Fri Jun 17, 2016 5:15 am

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I don't agree that a lynch on myself is the most likely option for Day 1. The case simply falls down upon a close examination. Someone like pants is far more likely to get lynched.
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Post Post #257 (isolation #60) » Fri Jun 17, 2016 2:08 pm

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@Lycanfire: RC is the only alternative lynch I'd accept
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Post Post #268 (isolation #61) » Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:54 pm

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Lycanfire is null. My read on RC is based on their lack of scumhunting, not OMGUS. Someone still needs to explain the case on me because there's absolutely no reasoning.
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Post Post #274 (isolation #62) » Sat Jun 18, 2016 5:49 am

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Why Lycan?
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Post Post #277 (isolation #63) » Sat Jun 18, 2016 5:52 am

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VOTE: Pants98
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Post Post #303 (isolation #64) » Sun Jun 19, 2016 6:46 pm

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Welcome, snoe!
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Post Post #362 (isolation #65) » Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:29 pm

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Don't have much time on the computer - RC and snoe are scummy, Lycan and IV are TvT. Simoyd is scumlean, rest are null or townlean. Postie isn't doing as much as I thought she would with her strong entrance
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Post Post #364 (isolation #66) » Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:33 pm

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In post 363, RadiantCowbells wrote:You should, because if you don't I will vote you instead today.
Bussing scum
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Post Post #378 (isolation #67) » Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:35 pm

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In post 366, Pants98 wrote:Ugh...... I messed up. I'll try to be more active. Reads soon.
<IC hat on>Hey Pants, I really shouldn't have to tell you this, but this is very very illegal. The mod can blacklist or ban you for this, especially since this is a newbie. You're an SE, don't set a bad example for our newbs!</IC hat on>

Hey Simoyd, I think you're sheeping RC and hiding behind your newbness to justify it. Your readslist is very similar to his and you're voting the same person as him without strong reasoning. I'd like to hear your defense against this.
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Post Post #380 (isolation #68) » Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:44 pm

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Because it's more official, of course.
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Post Post #396 (isolation #69) » Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:16 pm

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Isn't the only real answer is that you've used this as a scumtactic before? Are you trying to be called on this?
Explain?
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Post Post #405 (isolation #70) » Tue Jun 21, 2016 6:41 pm

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@Simoyd: Just to avoid confusion, can you restate your case on me?
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Post Post #480 (isolation #71) » Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:32 pm

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@Simoyd: That's ridiculous. of course I would defend IV, and I'm shocked the other SEs didn't. You didn't give any specific examples of which of my defenses are garbage. As for scumhunting, I don't think I can accomplish anything productive before deadline, and I intend to lynch snoe.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #485 (isolation #72) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 12:41 am

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In newbie setups, cops are
always
sane.
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Post Post #488 (isolation #73) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 3:17 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 486, Harkonnen97 wrote:Thanks.

Accountant, you were very aggresive at the start, what made you shift gears and become more passive lately?
Mmm, I think the heat of the game is winding down and everyone is settling on their own reads and moving towards a lynch(hopefully snoe's). Like I said, I've already slapped down my vote, I don't think I can do anything constructive until after a flip.
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Post Post #495 (isolation #74) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 4:15 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 489, Postie wrote:
In post 487, Titus wrote:I am thinking this is Postie/Blank. :(
How about this: we lynch Accountant, then Lycan and snoe/Blank, and if the game hasn't ended by then you can autolynch me.
I don't really see myself being wrong on any of my townreads.
If all three of those people are town there'd be no point autolynching you since mafia would have won already

What makes no sense to me is why you seem to be equally willing to lynch me and Titus(snoe), but vote me instead of L-1ing Titus.
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Post Post #674 (isolation #75) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 4:40 pm

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Why is Blank not six feet under yet? Also, are you guys seriously wanting to lynch me because RC has a perfect record of reading my alignment?
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Post Post #679 (isolation #76) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 5:21 pm

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In post 675, RadiantCowbells wrote:That seems like a fairly strong reason to want to lynch you.

Claim.
Uh? Unless the vote count is screwed up I'm at L-2.
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Post Post #684 (isolation #77) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 6:20 pm

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Is there intent to hammer?
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Post Post #704 (isolation #78) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 6:50 pm

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I'm VT.
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Post Post #707 (isolation #79) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 6:51 pm

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Final words:

- the case on me is ridiculous. If you're town and on my wagon, I don't know what you're thinking.
- that said, I suppose I didn't play as well as I could have. My apologies.
- lynch Blank and RC. This isn't town RC. Postie is hard to sort, I suppose you could lynch her if you don't have any other good options.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #715 (isolation #80) » Thu Jun 23, 2016 7:21 pm

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For the record, I'd rather be lynched than have a No Lynch. But obviously lynching Blank is best.
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Post Post #723 (isolation #81) » Fri Jun 24, 2016 12:59 am

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In post 722, Harkonnen97 wrote:Accountant looks like scum who gave up. I don't mind hammering her right now.
^ terrible post, not blank/RC levels of scummy though
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Post Post #727 (isolation #82) » Fri Jun 24, 2016 1:06 am

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In post 707, Accountant wrote:Final words:

- the case on me is ridiculous. If you're town and on my wagon, I don't know what you're thinking.
- that said, I suppose I didn't play as well as I could have. My apologies.
- lynch Blank and RC. This isn't town RC. Postie is hard to sort, I suppose you could lynch her if you don't have any other good options.
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Post Post #728 (isolation #83) » Fri Jun 24, 2016 1:06 am

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Last chance to turn back and lynch actual scum, Hark.
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Post Post #730 (isolation #84) » Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:01 am

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Because he feels different from the other times he's been pushing me. It feels like he's constructing motive to fit the conclusion he already generated. As for frustation, that's a spurious accusation. Anyone would be frustrated at being lynched D1 regardless of alignment.
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Post Post #1182 (isolation #85) » Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:30 pm

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I've already erased this game from my mind.
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Post Post #1188 (isolation #86) » Sun Jul 03, 2016 4:58 pm

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Honestly IV you felt town because you didn't do anything scummy unlike some other players
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Post Post #1190 (isolation #87) » Sun Jul 03, 2016 5:08 pm

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I think that you could have tried obvtowning it up, being really tryhard with re-reads and questioning and ISOs and everything. One of the main complaints against Pants was that he was useless, so if you did that it would be easier to pass it off as part of Pants' playstyle.
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Post Post #1195 (isolation #88) » Sun Jul 03, 2016 6:52 pm

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Yep. Thank you all for playing and I hope everyone had fun, whether you won or lost :)
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Post Post #1199 (isolation #89) » Sun Jul 03, 2016 8:47 pm

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No idea why people suspected Lyc
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