Mini 1802: Paint Mafia Sequel - Game Over!

[TehBrawlGuy]

Imma just claim miller here. Annoying, but whatever. Miller's a dumb role.

Ok let me get clarification on something.

We want to flip who we're scumreading right?

yes? no?

That depends. Here, on D1, I think using it as we would a lynch is the correct play, but after that it's kind of a crapshoot. Every phase, colors will get less and less accurate as the mafia gets to change them more.

As a faction you have the ability to send one of your members every night to go out and paint a player a new colour, which will also cover them in wet paint. You have one charge of blue paint and infinite charges of red, green, orange, yellow, black, white and purple.

^Direct quote from last game's scum PM. Obviously. Scum probably have some similar system here to prevent the game from getting broken by the reveal phase. Checking beeboy's 81, he said that in the last game Scum couldn't tailor, and he doubts that Scum would even have a framer. Then in his 87, he says that he missed that Scum could tailor last game, but doesn't note anything about framing. Offhand, this feels like a Townslip to me. Really seems like scum!bee would know about that kind of ability and not make that mistake, but town!bee would not. (assuming, of course, that mafia have a similar factional ability, which I think they must for balance reasons)

[TehBrawlGuy]

@pie
@utl
@nina
@hiplop

Explain to me why you think this is TSQ!scum rather than just TSQ being TSQ?

I'll cast a VOTE: Nina for now. I dislike the TSQ wagon. It feels off to me. Of the people on it, I particularly take issue with Nina because of her 106. I generally find cute-story-posting like that to be a scumtell, because it allows you to mask your tone very well. This section gives me pause as well.

Nina - "I kinda think the Spiffeh wagon had to have a scumpartner vote him. And I think UTL/beeboy/hiplop are town. At least the first two.

Host - "A fine reason indeed. Thanks for watching everyone, we'll be back after the break! Nina Williams has just picked Aristophanes, thestatusquo and lalaladucks as the scumteam! Stay tuned for more!

She thinks Spiffeh had a scumpartner vote him, but Spiffeh isn't on her reads list as Scum? This is a fabricated reads list. To me, it seems to me the reason she's talking about Spiffeh's scumpartners is because she already knows Spiffeh is Scum. If we flip Nina now and she flips red, I think it's a 2-for-1 on her and Spiffeh.

[TehBrawlGuy]

tehbrawlguy: is your miller ability related to your color?

About TSQ: the action is scummy, that's all I care about right now. If I am wrong, please correct me.

About Spiffeh: You are correct. I think my brain made some crazy twist there. But hey, at least I can have you as a townread for pointing out my own mistake. But if you really think I would make a fabricated reads list, calling a partner scum and forgetting to list him as a scumread, I would be disappointed.

Correct. It's color-miller specifically - I just said miller because I assumed there are no alignment-cops given the whole color mechanic.

All scum have to fabricate a reads list. It's absolutely not out of the question that you scumslipped or that you originally had Spiffeh as Scum, changed your mind on calling him out, then accidentally left that part in.
Either way, you definitely made a mistake. The question is if that's town!nina making it for no reason, or scum!nina making it for a very good reason, and obviously I think it's the latter.

Also, why did you not address beeboy, who was the first person to vote?

Because of my aforementioned Town read on him. I think there's Scum on TSQWagon, I don't think it's beeboy.

Explain to me why you think this is TSQ!scum rather than just TSQ being TSQ?

regardless of who it is, I would expect a town player to... post reads... or ask questions... or do literally anything at all to sort people, rather than what TSQ did. what he did was pop in, make one vague snipe at me, and then do absolutely nothing else. it isn't productive and it isn't a town entrance; it is fairly standard for scum to just sit and vaguely snipe at things when they aren't sure what to comment on and want to look like they're doing things.

do you have meta that suggests this is usual for TSQ, or?

Yeah. I read through some games a while back + discussion threads, and I think this is TSQ's normal posting. Grain of salt, though, I've not actually played with him.

there are parts of it that are off (i.e. specific players on it), but for the most part it feels like a pretty normal wagon that happens early on day ones. Is it just nina that feels off to you about is there something about the wagon in particular?

Both. It's a speedwagon on someone I don't think did much scummy, which just feels bad, and I think Nina's scummy on her own merits anyway.

[TehBrawlGuy]

also, what the fuck is wrong with this site and how many people replace out?

wait like two days irl, if you still want to /out then /out

i'm sick of playing in games with slots that are revolving doors

[TehBrawlGuy]

@pie
@utl
@nina
@hiplop

Explain to me why you think this is TSQ!scum rather than just TSQ being TSQ?

I'll cast a VOTE: Nina for now. I dislike the TSQ wagon. It feels off to me. Of the people on it, I particularly take issue with Nina because of her 106. I generally find cute-story-posting like that to be a scumtell, because it allows you to mask your tone very well. This section gives me pause as well.

Nina - "I kinda think the Spiffeh wagon had to have a scumpartner vote him. And I think UTL/beeboy/hiplop are town. At least the first two.

Host - "A fine reason indeed. Thanks for watching everyone, we'll be back after the break! Nina Williams has just picked Aristophanes, thestatusquo and lalaladucks as the scumteam! Stay tuned for more!

She thinks Spiffeh had a scumpartner vote him, but Spiffeh isn't on her reads list as Scum? This is a fabricated reads list. To me, it seems to me the reason she's talking about Spiffeh's scumpartners is because she already knows Spiffeh is Scum. If we flip Nina now and she flips red, I think it's a 2-for-1 on her and Spiffeh.

@mod: you missed my nina vote in the post above

@everyone else: Can we get this wagon going please, or at least discussion. This is stagnant AF and that makes me sad.

[TehBrawlGuy]

@everyone else: Can we get this wagon going please, or at least discussion. This is stagnant AF and that makes me sad.

before I compromise, I want TSQ to fully respond to my post, and I want Spiffeh and TD37 to generate at least some amount of content.

speaking of TD37's slot, do you disagree with my thoughts in 131?

I agree that it's an awfully convenient way to justify a TSQ vote/speedwagon and general lack of content, which I dislike, especially since hiplop should know how likely it is that the color flip is accurate on D1, so it does earn minor scumpoints. My only issue is that if you assume town!hiplop, then his actions all make sense from the PoV of someone who thinks it's all useless. In short, I can see that coming from either town!hiplop or scum!hiplop, with Scum being a little more likely.

[TehBrawlGuy]

If we're going to assume that the flip's accurate, I'd much rather have confscum that we can lynch d1 than conftown who will probably just die in the night. If Pie's a strong town player, why do you want an early death for them?

[TehBrawlGuy]

I didn't have any scum reads on my first read through either, tbh. There's not been a lot that's super overtly scummy - I only caught the bit with Nina on reading her ISO after the TSQ-wagon

[TehBrawlGuy]

townreads atm are
Ranger, beeboy, pieguyn

i also have a weird gut townlean on UTL but don't quote me on that shit it kind of just happened reading one insignificant post and im probs just being a bad and it's NAI.

need people to post more substance. today i'm thinking we want to use the color flip on someone relatively active though, so they'll be useful as a clear. does anyone object to that?

VOTE: Nina

I object. If we misflip and hit Town, then I think want it to be a less active player. Any clear is a high-priority NK target, so putting all our eggs in one basket by having a super active ConfTown player is begging for them to get offed. I'd much rather put that target on someone less useful, so that Scum have to choose if they want to leave good players or the clear alive. Having an active clear to sheep is for shitty players who can't find Scum on their own.

All that said, I still want to hit Scum with the flip. Getting a clear on D1 is fairly useless since they'll probably die before long, but offing Scum is forever.

[TehBrawlGuy]

If we're going to assume that the flip's accurate, I'd much rather have confscum that we can lynch d1 than conftown who will probably just die in the night.

You're forgetting: I'm going to be confirmed town, so sooner or later, scum are going to want me dead.
I believe it was Nahdia who said she would

also

be confirmed town, so sooner or later, scum are going to want her dead.
Getting a

third

town player, especially of pie's caliber, as confirmed town on D1 would mean scum have basically their three next nightkills forced upon them, because confirmed town players are too much of a threat for them to deal with.
Also, I don't hold the same confidence in pie being town as everyone else seems to, which gives me a DARN good reason to want a pie reveal.

I don't believe for a second that there are two ICs or otherwise mod-confirmable roles in this game. I also believe that having a conftown of high caliber is not the way to go, as I said earlier. I'd much rather Scum have to choose between killing Pie and the conftown - having a strong conftown player does nothing for us but give us someone to sheep. I don't need another strong town player to tell me who's Scum - I can do that myself, and all of you should be able to as well. And again, having a conftown is not nearly as valuable as having a dead scum.

But I want to lynch TehBrawlGuy.
Not flip.
Lynch.

Why are you using aggression on me to ignore what I've posted on Nina, who was supposedly among your scumreads earlier? Feels chainsaw-y.

[TehBrawlGuy]

drawing request: a bunch of sad, terrible squirrels

[TehBrawlGuy]

Agree - that sums up my thoughts on the slot as well. The jokevote on me is cute, but it masks that her last vote was in Post #4. Her slot feels very much like trying to be active without making waves. She's a fine flip, but I still prefer a Nina flip because it's a 2 for 1 on Spiffeh too if Nina flips Scum, which almost ends the game on the spot, and I think Nina's pretty likely to be scum anyway.

[TehBrawlGuy]

yes i said that because his posts all look great and analytical and towny

thx

if Nina flips blue, I want attention focused on lala during the lynching phase, full stop. can we agree to this?

I don't agree with the argument that itle "scum slipped" by omitting Nina from his reads list. however, I do agree that in general leaving Nina off of the reads list when she was a major focus is somewhat weird. the other thing is that he called Spiffeh's 46 decent when it really really wasn't, and town read him due to "nothing about his play pings me at all" when it was only page 2, which kinda reads like he was stretching to find a reason to list him as town.

p-edit: that's kinda why I asked Spiffeh for the games he was using as a reference, so I could cross-check if what he was saying was actually well-reasoned or not. unfortunately, he disappointed me :<

agree/10

updated reads:

town: pie, dwlee(proxy from beeboy)
cute as frick: nahdia
null: everyone else
lean scum: spiffeh, lala
scum: Nina, ranger


spiffeh's got no content, ranger's completely focused on discussing if we should townhunt and hasn't really commented on /anyone/ as scum except for me, which I read as intentional avoidance, and spiffeh's content is super super low in his one-liner posts

[TehBrawlGuy]

messed up mah quotes, this was supposed to be in the last post

Why are you using aggression on me to ignore what I've posted on Nina, who was supposedly among your scumreads earlier?

I got disconnected from my reads.

I reset them.

Of them, you're one of my bottom three in the new tiers.
This is mostly being kept in my head, so I don't have an exact order worked out.

something something still avoiding saying anything about nina something something

got it

drawing request: moolan, the bovine warrior of china, with a bull in a chinese shop

[TehBrawlGuy]

do eet

[TehBrawlGuy]

cute as frick: nahdia

i can't see your 279 or 280 coming from an AntiCute player, and the moolan wall is definitely a cuteslip

also woo i led a wagon. if she's red its time to party

[TehBrawlGuy]

Welp. VOTE: Ranger.

[TehBrawlGuy]

That you are scum, so didn't need to sort all of the town, pip. I dunno why you are going for 'meta game' when the answer seems obvious.

Tehbrawl, why?

ranger's completely focused on discussing if we should townhunt and hasn't really commented on /anyone/ as scum except for me, which I read as intentional avoidance

To expand on that, in 44, Ranger posts a reads list w/ no reasoning, then in 45 she votse Aristo, who isn't even the most scum on her list (that was Nina) with no reasoning. After that, she devolved into only attempting to clear Pie. Her only post indicating suspicion of

anyone

is her 245 on me, which again has no actual reasoning. When I called her out on it, and her avoidance of commenting on the Nina wagon, she stated in her 343 that she's got new reads - but she doesn't post any of them, doesn't explain why she wants to lynch me, and STILL doesn't address Nina.

tl;dr look at her ISO

• she's made no attempt to scumhunt other than a passing comment that we should lynch me
  she's actively avoided ever mentioning Nina, despite Nina being one of her top scumreads
  she's never posted reasoning for anything she's done
  she's never posted reads since we got out of RVS
  she's active lurked super well by tunnelling on using the flip to conftown a strong player, despite nobody agreeing with it
  I also don't buy the part about her being modconfirmed at some point

[TehBrawlGuy]

Welp. VOTE: Ranger.

you break my heart. haven't you been saying this whole time you've agreed with my read on lala?

I think Ranger's approach this game is fairly standard for her. I think that her just doing her own thing, especially in this situation, definitely falls in line with how she would play as town, and there's another reason that I find her town based on her play which I don't really know if I should talk about at this point or not (since it's kind of speculative...) and either way I don't really see why we would lynch her when she's claimed a confirmable town role.

I do. Lala is a fine wagon and I support it as an alternate to Ranger. Part of the reason I'm on Ranger is that you're on Lala and I don't think it's helpful to have us both pushing the same big wagon - I'd rather have two so that we don't just easily lynch Lala and learn nothing. Any of lala/spiffeh/ranger are good lynches to me. I would love the speculation and meta on Ranger - is it normal for her to be this unhelpful and opaque as Town? This whole thing just reads to me as a Scum gambit to coast to late-game and then deal with the claim by being a Scum PR or just going "oh i was drawing the NK lol".

[TehBrawlGuy]

even if you "don't buy the part about her being modconfirmed at some point", why is that a reason for lynching her on day 1? it's more correct theory-wise to leave her alive until day 3 or so, and then lynch/question the claim if she still hasn't been confirmed by then

Let's run through the scenarios:

Ranger is Town PR

: We out her with a claim, swap lynch targets and she presumably gets blocked/killed - This is bad, but why would a role like Cop/Vig/etc claim as she did on D1 and put a target on themselves? That makes no sense, so I don't think she falls into this.

Ranger is IC:

We out her, swap lynch targets, and she dies in the night - her getting outed and dying is going to happen anyway, so it doesn't hurt much to have it now, especially since we have a conftown in Nina as is

Ranger is VT gambiting:

We probably mislynch, but we only lose an unhelpful VT - this is the realistic WCS to me

Ranger is Scum PR, gambiting to stay alive and use her power:

We either lynch her today and she dies before she can use her role, which is massive, or we force her into a hard claim and make it harder for her to wiggle later - both of these are huge wins for us, and this is the most likely scenario to me

Ranger is mafia goon

- She's caught and we lynch her today - this is another big win

Situations #1 and #2 make no sense to me - why would a PR or IC claim this? What advantage does it give them? I've thought she was gambiting VT since the claim, and didn't want to say it for fear of ruining the plan, but at this point I don't believe that.
If she was truly a VT attempting to draw the NK, why hasn't she scumhunted or done

anything

to make herself a tempting target to the Scumteam? You don't draw the NK by softclaiming confirmable and then sitting on your hands. Also, if she WAS a VT and wanted to draw the early kill, why would she push to confirm Pie as town, given how strong Pie's town game is, and that Pie would be the obvious N1 kill over herself?

pedit:

I think trying to play less open and more under-the-radar in order to dodge NKs until later in the game is something she would do.

Why would a town PR "trying to play UTR and dodge kills" claim confirmable under no pressure on D1? Her actions don't line up as Town PR, they don't make sense as Town VT, but they make a lot of sense as Scum imo.

[TehBrawlGuy]

Welp. VOTE: Ranger.

you break my heart. haven't you been saying this whole time you've agreed with my read on lala?

I think Ranger's approach this game is fairly standard for her. I think that her just doing her own thing, especially in this situation, definitely falls in line with how she would play as town, and there's another reason that I find her town based on her play which I don't really know if I should talk about at this point or not (since it's kind of speculative...) and either way I don't really see why we would lynch her when she's claimed a confirmable town role.

Why would a town PR "trying to play UTR and dodge kills" claim confirmable under no pressure on D1? Her actions don't line up as Town PR, they don't make sense as Town VT, but they make a lot of sense as Scum imo.

she claims a confirmable role so that people (in theory) can rule her as being scum and focus on scum hunting elsewhere, and then tries to play under-the-radar so she can survive as late into the game as possible.

i've definitely seen something like this done in other games, specifically the idea of a clear trying to keep themselves alive to reduce the amount of people the player list has to sort. this seems entirely plausible to me and i'm not really going to speculate on her role is when i have no way of knowing if i'm evaluating every possibility or not

Why would she do it under no pressure, though? If she's a PR, surely it would be wiser to just play UTR and only claim if you're becoming a distraction? I can maybe see this claim coming from an IC, but if she's an IC, she just claims that when we run her to L-2 and we lynch elsewhere.

I can see a clear doing this if they were already cleared, but I don't see the point of clearing yourself and then going UTR rather than just going UTR outright.

pedit @ bella:
scum!ranger I think fakes it because scum!ranger is some kind of Scum PR and wants a free ride to late-game to do her shit. If she were hypothetically a Scum Rolecop, or even something weird like a Scum double-painter that can paint twice in a night, she's a glorified goon once in the endgame, but staying alive until then is massive for the Scumteam, even if it costs her life eventually.

pedit2 @ pie:
Okay, but why would she claim it at that time? Why not once she took heat, which she probably wouldn't, considering she's playing UTR anyway? Hell, taking some heat and THEN claiming would give us a decent body to analyze.
Assume she's Scum for a moment. When in the phase would she claim? Immediately, because she needs the claim to have credence - she can't back it up as she would have to if she claimed it under pressure.
town!ranger doesn't make that claim off the bat, scum!ranger has to

[TehBrawlGuy]

Ranger if you are gambiting say it now because you are not living d2 if you say it then

This is not a gambit.
I will be confirmed town.

I'm still wary, but I can't push in the face of this and nobody's backing me, so VOTE: Spiffeh. Still support Lala wagon but I think the odds are better on Spiffeh. Lala's pretty clearly disconnected, see:

i also want nina ... to come back and actually do something before i attempt to sort them.

so i can buy town!lala not sorting anyone and making lazy arguments. It's still scummy so she doesn't get a pass for it, but if she were town, I can see it looking like this.

[TehBrawlGuy]

Lala's pretty clearly disconnected, see:

how the fuck is this any different than what Spiffeh is supposedly is doing?

someone who apparently is disconnected but actively makes up excuses to not read people is much worse than someone who has done nothing of the sort. if you want to push another wagon just to see what happens, that's fine, but this is a really poor excuse for giving her a pass for anything

I don't like how hard you are pushing this at all.

what specifically don't you like about it? is there a part of his reasoning or the way he's pushing it that comes off as disingenuous?

It's different because Spiffeh might be scum trying to fly UTR intentionally, as well as disconnected. Lala is just clearly disconnected. Could be disconnected scum, could be disconnected town, but is genuinely disconnected rather than just lowposting intentionally to go UTR. To put it one way:

reasons spiffeh could be doing what he's doing:

-scum intentionally going utr
-disconnected scum
-disconnected town

reasons lala could be doing what she's doing:

-disconnected scum
-disconnected town

Pretty misreppy to say I'm giving her a pass on anything when in the post you quoted, you removed the parts where I said I supported her wagon and thought what she did was scummy, disconnect or no. She's my second favorite lynch candidate - she's not getting a pass at all.

[TehBrawlGuy]

ranger continues to be entirely unhelpful

this is extremely obnoxious/poor town play if it is town play

spiffeh's posts since i voted him are better, so VOTE: lala.

[TehBrawlGuy]

You seemed to be playing plenty of attention when you got beetlejuiced into the thread after two votes.

I need to re-read your slot.

[TehBrawlGuy]

I like Aristo's comments on the flip phase, but her lack of scumhunting bothers me a lot. It's pretty standard scumplay to make good neutral points about the set-up/mechanics but not actually find scum. I'm happy with a VOTE: aristo.

[TehBrawlGuy]

Agreed. NLing is horrible.

[TehBrawlGuy]

I want to flip someone from the Aristowagon. I don't feel like Scum would let that go through as an all-town wagon. Looking at it, Nina is conftown, Pie is probably town, and you're not getting anything by flipping me, so we're down to {Dwlee, Spiffeh, Nadia, Bella}.

Of those, I feel like Dwlee is the best flip. Very low chance of getting altered in the Night, and his early Aristo vote is super weak with just "DEADLINE WAGON GO". Reads like a weak bus intended to make people see Aristo as only a deadline wagon and lynch elsewhere.

VOTE: Dwlee

[TehBrawlGuy]

I don't have any issue with flipping Nahdia, but her Aristo vote was a <1 hr deadline scramble and I'm not sure what she's done that we see as scummy.

[TehBrawlGuy]

I could go for an Itle flip. He's not gonna be super readable at any point and he doesn't seem like he'd be a likely candidate for flipping.

[TehBrawlGuy]

I don't have any issue with flipping Nahdia, but her Aristo vote was a <1 hr deadline scramble and I'm not sure what she's done that we see as scummy.

The slip I pointed out and her reaction, what do you think of that?

It wasn't a slip, and tbh I think most of what you posted on her is silly.

VOTE: itle. I'm still fine with Nahdia flip but it's not my preference.

[TehBrawlGuy]

VOTE: nahdia

[TehBrawlGuy]

that's l-1 btw, we need one more

[TehBrawlGuy]

prododge, will post after games done quick ends

[TehBrawlGuy]

I think the reason you find my arguments are so ridiculous is that I'm trying to argue one thing and you're subtly (and probably unintentionally) strawmanning and leading the argument further off the course of what it was originally intended to be. The original bussing charge (perhaps erroneously) disregarded your likelihood to bus in the case where you are scum, and instead focused solely on your push of Ari itself.

no, I find your arguments ridiculous because I find your thought process behind it to make no sense. I think there's about a 0% chance of me being lynched here, so it is not my goal to convince you; it is my goal to scum hunt your thought process.

976 in particular is a completely separate issue from whether what I did D1 looks like a bus: your angle there basically amounted to "there's scum off the wagon, and it's impossible for a town player to push through a scum wagon with scum off the wagon, so it must have been a bus", which... where the fuck did you even get this from? it makes no sense and I'm questioning you on it because it makes no sense. it reads more like you're trying to spin this narrative about "omg it must have been a bus" in order to make the reads you want to push more credible, rather than looking at how it went down and coming to any sort of natural conclusion.

Point taken. I heard somebody say that the Ari wagon probably had at least one scum on it, and I was like, "seems legit", but it's definitely not a foregone conclusion, so if I was treating it as such, I won't anymore.

I said this. I stand by it, but if you're thinking that there was at least one scum on it, why on Earth would it be Pie?

@whoever asked me about dwlee: no, the townread is gone - I still think beeboy's post looks like a towntell, but it could've been fabricated and I'm not okay with letting a useless slot coast on a D1 possible towntell

SPEAKING OF SLOTS WE SHOULDN'T LET COAST VOTE: lala

at no point will we be able to read this slot
at no point will this slot get replaced (probably)

it's a PL worthy slot that I remember thinking was scummy but forgetting why, so i'm fine with this lynch

[TehBrawlGuy]

[quote="In post 995

@TBG:

You didn't say beeboy towntold. You said he townslipped. Either something is a townslip or it isn't. If it is, then Dwlee is 100% town. Do you still think it was a townslip? If not, what changed your mind?[/quote]

I used the wrong turn of phrase there, late night posting.

I still think it looks like a townslip. That said, if beeboy is particularly cunning, or for some reason the mafia are different this game, he could certainly fake a townslip like that. Dwlee is posting damn near no content other than votes, which does not read town to me at all.
I was dead sure beeboy was town, and that does influence my read on Dwlee, (which is currently null because it all cancels out to me) but like I said, I'm not happy with letting Dwlee play scummy because his slot possibly townslipped earlier.


tl;dr dwlee gets a little bit of a pass for it to null instead of scum, because it did and still does look like a townslip, but he's been unhelpful enough to make me question if that was actually a townslip

VOTE: TheBrawlGuy

Congratulations on literally the worst post I've seen this game.

lolk

congrats on having no decent content and coasting on being conftown

[TehBrawlGuy]

@TBG: You didn't say beeboy towntold. You said he townslipped. Either something is a townslip or it isn't. If it is, then Dwlee is 100% town. Do you still think it was a townslip? If not, what changed your mind?

I used the wrong turn of phrase there, late night posting.

I still think it looks like a townslip. That said, if beeboy is particularly cunning, or for some reason the mafia are different this game, he could certainly fake a townslip like that. Dwlee is posting damn near no content other than votes, which does not read town to me at all.
I was dead sure beeboy was town, and that does influence my read on Dwlee, (which is currently null because it all cancels out to me) but like I said, I'm not happy with letting Dwlee play scummy because his slot possibly townslipped earlier.


tl;dr dwlee gets a little bit of a pass for it to null instead of scum, because it did and still does look like a townslip, but he's been unhelpful enough to make me question if that was actually a townslip

VOTE: TheBrawlGuy

Congratulations on literally the worst post I've seen this game.

lolk

congrats on having no decent content and coasting on being conftown
I don't have anything to put here because my normal signature is images. Weeeeee.

[TehBrawlGuy]

I agree with the logic wrt pie being unlikely to have been altered, although I'm still not sure we should bother with townflipping anyone.

[TehBrawlGuy]

{Pie, Katsuki, Bella}

We are flipping and lynching in these 3.

Not that I mind, but what happened to your read on me?

[TehBrawlGuy]

VOTE: pie

I feel like Pieflip is more likely to be accurate, and I also think Pie flipping blue prevents pie vs. RC shenanigans, which should help during the lynch phase.

[TehBrawlGuy]

I claim gladiator.

I will gladiate Pie immediately on colour phase ending.

Why in the fuck would you do this? You being confirmed town means that it would just force a lynch on Pie.

In what world is a

forced lynch on pie

useful? Even if he ends up Scum, we learn nothing because he's our only option.

[TehBrawlGuy]

Boy, I love playing with arrogant, pushy players who are willing to wreck the game if they're wrong. It's a blast.

/s

[TehBrawlGuy]

I didn't read the past game beyond a simple look into mechanics and roles, but if I were scum I would probably paint within my team. Town will be less and less trusting of blueflips as the game goes on, and redflips are going to come under heat no matter what. Alternatively, mass painting the Town red is not a bad strategy.

As far as Katsuki goes, I feel like it's prudent not to autoflip her. We don't really learn anything from an autoflip, and she's prime vigilante bait if we have such a role, or an investigative "wet checker", etc.

Pie lynch is incredibly dumb and not happening. Not sure where I want my vote. I re-read Bella and she seemed fine. Gonna have to do a bigger re-read soon(tm)

[TehBrawlGuy]

VOTE: S_S

tbh I think the Kat post makes him more likely to be town. I very nearly went off at RC the same way before remembering what slot he subbed into, and I agree with's Kat's thoughts - it if weren't for RC being conftown RC would be the optimal lynch.

Pie's assessment of the gamestate makes sense and I'm happy to go along with it.

[TehBrawlGuy]

@TBG: why do you townread pie?

not much, just that whole thing where they've been the biggest source of leadership/activity in the game and pushed through a lynch onto scum

/s

[TehBrawlGuy]

Being the driving force keeping this game from stagnation is absolutely alignment indicative - scum!pie could take a backseat and watch town flounder. It's an age-old strategy that would work very well here if Pie was Scum.

Taking the one mislynch that heavily against Pie is a massive jump in logic to me. It's would be extremely unlikely for

any

Town leader to hit Scum 100% of the time. Pie being town and getting one right and one wrong is by far the most likely scenario - especially given that lala gave us very little to work with.


Let's talk about

you

, though. Earlier, you posted this:

Null/Scum

Katsuki: I got gut pings from TSQ. Katsuki's reads are pretty weird and they're not doing much... this read could easily change, it's half a real read and half a placeholder.

pieguyn: Yeah ok so bussing Ari would have been a stupid move. I still have my eye on you, though this could just be one of my terrible reads... I just feel like she's saying a lot but none of it is really that profound, and I don't like the way she pushed Nina/TSQ as TvT. I also didn't like the way she suggested Ranger could be a TPR, it sounded a little like fishing.

indicating that you had pie and kat both in your top 3 scumreads. You then joined in the effort to colorflip Kat.

After this, Kat flipped red, and you:
Proceeded to vote pie with no reasoning
Completely dismissed your

red-flipped scumread

with "scum doesn't call conftown scum", when clearly the only reason ANYONE would call RC scum is that they forgot she was conftown, which is entirely NAI.
Spend your effort on questioning

[person who's voting you]

on why he thinks

[person who's spearheading your wagon]

is town

There's just no town motivation behind this. Town!S_S doesn't colorflip Katsuki, his scumread, have them flip red, and then randomly drop them completely. Scum!S_S does, because he needs to get behind RC's loud voice to get the heat off of himself. I think your weak play of calling Kat's slip on RC townie proves this. It's not a genuine opinion, it's one fabricated to give you a reason to pivot onto Pie.

[TehBrawlGuy]

Then refute

any

of it instead of lazily casting shade at me.

You're like the Donald Trump of this game. You come in with awful opinions are rely on being loud, obnoxious and repetitive to attempt to get them to stick.

[TehBrawlGuy]

lol, you can't refute what I posted on S_S because it's true

[TehBrawlGuy]

In what universe is flopping on your scumread...
after he flips red...
with extremely flimsy reasoning...
to back a more probable lynch...
on the player who's pushing your wagon...
NAI?

It's like S_S fucking ordered the Jumbo Combo at McScumtells.

[TehBrawlGuy]

I haven't fully explained the reasons I'm scumreading you.

The fact that you pushed Ari is the only thing that makes me think you might be town.

Gosh, it's almost like you're not genuinely interested in scumhunting!

I didn't dismiss my scumread on Katsuki, and I never called Katsuki town. I wanted an answer to 1255, and I got it.

Ah, right, completely not mentioning a player and pushing an entirely different wagon isn't dismissing anything.
Also, saying "why would XXX do this as Scum?" absolutely implies that the player is Town. It's a loaded question.

Okay, then. Tell me what my read is on Katsuki, since you clearly know so much about it.

Given that you yourself said he was null/scum and he hasn't done anything of note between them and now, I don't need to be psychic to say probably scum or null/scum.

[TehBrawlGuy]

He is openly sheeping pie and joins her whenever she's grilling someone, yes...but he's being just as vocal about all of this as she is. and the way he was constantly discrediting rc is idiotic play if he's scum

Not really. By himself, he wouldn't be able to carry this game and I think he's well aware of that.

I could if I felt like it - I've done it in enough games. Obviously I don't feel like it, though. I agree with Pie's content and don't really want to put in much more effort beyond quick looks at ISOs to verify that.

Regarding everything else, you (and pie both) have given me little to respond to. Either push me so we can actually do something with this wagon or don't and go push elsewhere. I'd give you a ton of shit for the lazy push if you two weren't conftown and my biggest town read.

[TehBrawlGuy]

Bella's my #2, Dwlee at #3

Bella didn't like Ari but didn't vote or really do anything with that other than encourage Ari to post more.

Dwlee I think reads exactly like scum coasting off of being seen as probably town for a townslip

[TehBrawlGuy]

Two half-baked snippets on the two lowest hanging fruit available and

I'm

the lazy one here?

Sure...

Considering I'm not actually trying to lynch either of them I think it's fine.

would like to point out S_S jumping again to the popular lynch that isn't him