Micro 622: Queen Mafia GAME OVER

[Aristophanes]

DON'T FORGET

VOTE: Aristophanes

Sounds important!

VOTE: Aristophanes

Classic! XD

VOTE: Fire
Because playing with Fire is fun

[Aristophanes]

Aristophanes voted for Fire who hadn't posted by that point either. Then again your vote probably wasn't serious at all so who cares.

At least I have an actual username and not just some real name :/

I also thought it meant Queens as in the Royalty.

I've played with him lots before though. This is your first non-newb game right? Do you have much past experience in Mafia, offside or IRL? You have a confidence so ming into play I don't often see in newbies.

Also, Queen the Band is better than any Monarch!
(Though I plan to do a game in that theme soon. I can let you two know when I get the details figured out!)

[Aristophanes]

W/e please vote TellTaleHeart

Compelling case! That pizza did suck.

But you didn't even ask me

[Aristophanes]

I find it interesting that you are more worried about it than I am, IPS.

[Aristophanes]

Vote him

Because you Omgus'd him?
Or because he is displaying a newbie characteristic?

[Aristophanes]

Hm. I'd really like to hear from Aristo at this point.

I'm back. Sorry all!
Gonna read up before bed I guess.

[Aristophanes]

I find it interesting that you are more worried about it than I am, IPS.

Vote him

Vote him

Because you Omgus'd him?
Or because he is displaying a newbie characteristic?

I think it's off Ari threw a little shade at IPS in post 30 but then immediately balked at voting him when Elyse asked him too. I also think noting IPS as "displaying a newbie characteristic" in a way doesn't mesh with the "interesting" note. What's interesting?

The exchange just comes off as awkward to me.

I find it interesting because of the way he brought it up. The whole "I'm not saying there's scum on the wagon" thing is backtracky. However, even if a newbie characteristic, I still think his worry at an early L-2 is notable.

30 was not "throwing shade," it was a note for me to think on. I didn't vote for him because there wasn't a reason to.

[Aristophanes]

I find it interesting that you are more worried about it than I am, IPS.

This doesn't seem like a town post from Ari. This seems like he is trying to start putting pressure on someone because he has pressure. He acted very relaxed to pressure on him but that's not alignment indicative for him.

If this were the case, I'd have voted him. How am I starting pressure there if I am not putting it there myself?

[Aristophanes]

Spoiler: Long Post

I'm going to switch to
UNVOTE: GulityLion
VOTE: Elyse
as I feel that her posting has been fake.

Elyse ISO:

LET'S GO

VOTE: Elyse

Your Avatar irritates me.

??? I hadn't posted at that point.

VOTE: Iprobablysuck

OMGUS + stupid username

Also I can't be the only one who thought the theme was like, Queens, as in rulers and not the band

Her first post, RVS on Ips. Nothing wrong by itself, but:

Vote him

This was in the context of several people expressing suspicion of Ips, but none voting, asking them to vote. Considering that her vote on Ips wasn't serious, she wasn't really scumreading Ips, so encouraging the Ips wagon seems fake.

Because I think pressure will be useful in reading him

This reasoning for the wagon encouragement feels made up.

[/quote]I don't think the reasoning seems made up at all. I can see that she wanted pressure there as IPS would be most likely to react in a readable fashion. Thus her encouragement of a wagon there.

I really didn't like Elyse posts cause they seemed lazy excuses for the posts, but given this reaction by Bullet. I am now thinking its more town, which is by associations, which I hate.

Meh, not enough right now for reading Elyse probably.
Gun to head probably lazyish town.

Bullet thoughts on duppin?

So, your read went from "don't like them" to "lazyish town" because someone else made a case against them?
Please elaborate on this reasoning, because it makes zero sense to me.

Okay, first off, I wasn't ''worried'' about it. I'm not retarded and I know none of you would actually be dumb enough to hammer on page 2.

Secondly I HAVE seen three votes on somebody before in RVS. I just never seen the point, make up your own joke, don't piggyback off of someone else's :/

And that little comment was to try and kickstart discussion. The game wasn't really going anywhere by that point so I decided to give us a little push.

UNVOTE: Elyse

cause RVS is over I think.

I don't like how Aristophanes reacted to my comment, first he tried to throw shade on me and when Elyse came in saying to vote me he got all defensive.

First off, I could quote games where a hammer has been reached within the first 5 pages, possibly by page 2 but I can't remember specifically. The players who would typically do so aren't here though, so I wasn't worried. Was your concern just that people weren't being creative enough with their RVS votes?

Secondly, what is your take on my explanation of the posts I'd made there? Do you still dislike them?

[Aristophanes]

^^^
I screwed the coding there

Also, 59 is TownFire.

I have very mixed feelings on IPS based on 64 and [posr]67[/post]. I'm not sure if his wordings and demeanor are newbie or scummy.

The interactions between Fire and BNL at the top of this page are giving me weird SvS vibes.

I really didn't like Elyse posts cause they seemed lazy excuses for the posts, but given this reaction by Bullet. I am now thinking its more town, which is by associations, which I hate.

Meh, not enough right now for reading Elyse probably.
Gun to head probably lazyish town.

Bullet thoughts on duppin?

This post in particular is just... ehghrghdfaslsdfjklf...

VOTE: Fire Assassin

I didn't like the post either, thus my questioning of it. But the rest are towny and I don't think this one out does them. What about it is so damning other than feeling forced?

[Aristophanes]

Oh, and
UNVOTE:

[Aristophanes]

This game got a bit quiet..

Aristo thoughts on Postie and BNL?

Postie: I have a slight scum lean there. Her posting is very simplistic and I don't feel like she's putting the effort I expect into sorting people. All the one liners feel easily faked and have little actual backing stated.

BNL: Same read, very different reasin. He's trying too hard. The case on Elyse after 2 pages is a bit much, and isn't critically thinking about her motives. His Ranger-Reads out of nowhere make no sense. His townread on Fire for his Elyse case, then backtracking on the reasoning when questioned, are bad. Plus his flip flopping seems like he's trying to find a good spot on a wagon.

In fact,
VOTE: BNL

[Aristophanes]

So these were the posts that I said I was unsure about. The reasons I didn't like them is because of the emotion present in these posts, but I thought these could be town emotion or scum emotion, hence why I was unsure. But I'm currently leaning scum emotion.

I only see frustration in the posts you quoted, which is NAI as either alignment can easily get frustrated. What makes you think this is "Scum emotion"? Does it feel faked to you? Is it scum CftWR?
This just seems to be a very convenient decision on the posts with nothing in thread that appears to spur it on. So I'm curious how you came to this conclusion and why now was when you did it.

[Aristophanes]

2) what makes you think Bullet isn't thinking critically about motives and why
3) what flip flopping and why is flip flopping intrinsically scum? Your last sentence feels v disingenuous to me

2) He's aid her reasoning looked fake when I think it was actually very reasonable. IPS obviously would have been reactive to a wagon on him, and I don't like how he dismisses it as nothing.
3)

I'm going to switch to
UNVOTE: GulityLion
VOTE: Elyse
as I feel that her posting has been fake.

Unsure of Elyse's recent posting, but my other scumread has grown, enough to warrant a change of vote.
UNVOTE: Elyse
VOTE: Postie

Never mind, Postie is town. Back to Elyse~

UNVOTE: Postie
VOTE: Elyse

These are his flip flops. He wears them to the beach.
His vote on Postie and subsequent unvote occurred quite close together. I see no posts from Elyse that should have had him doubting his scumread if it were genuine, and his reasoning for the Postie vote in 156 is weak in itself.

@BNL

, what made you reconsider your Elyse vote in both occasions? She didn't post between the unvote, where you were unsure of her, and the revote, where she was a scumread again. What about Postie's posts in that timeframe convinced you she's town?

[Aristophanes]

Postie: I have a slight scum lean there. Her posting is very simplistic and I don't feel like she's putting the effort I expect into sorting people. All the one liners feel easily faked and have little actual backing stated.

Tell me more...

I don't want to quote wall it, but the majority of your posts are just "I like this." "I don't like this." "So and so is town." "This is scum."
The deepest read we have from you is your TTH townread, which is based on admittedly weak meta.

[Aristophanes]

I don't want to quote wall it, but the majority of your posts are just "I like this." "I don't like this." "So and so is town." "This is scum."
The deepest read we have from you is your TTH townread, which is based on admittedly weak meta.

Okay, but like, why is that scummy?

Because it let's you float through easily. Because it doesn't help anyone sort you, nor show how you are sorting anyone.
Like, I get witholding your reasoning on Fire, but what about your townread on Elyse? Your scumread on BNL? Your change from that to GL? None of these have reasoning and I know you are far more capable than this. Your lack of elaboration is weird, and I think possibly scumweird.

[Aristophanes]

I Don't know how I missed that re: Elyse. My bad.

171 does read as pretty faked reasoning, I agree. From his other posts though, I'm getting alright vibes and like the questioning and prodding he's doing to keep conversation going. Do these effect your read at all?

I read his ISO from that game, and though I agree those posts are bad, he was also overwhelmed there, making it hard to get a read of his overall play. From this game though, I'd say we have scum.

[Aristophanes]

171 does read as pretty faked reasoning, I agree. From his other posts though, I'm getting alright vibes and like the questioning and prodding he's doing to keep conversation going. Do these effect your read at all?

No. His other posts are null to me. I'm not sure how familiar you are with his scumgame but he's more than capable of faking this kind of thing.

I don't believe I have met ScumGL, so I don't have any basis here. I'll keep it in mind though!

[Aristophanes]

You met scumGL in college mafia, remember? I still can't believe I bullshitted out a win in LYLO in that game

Oh yeah! What a game! Haha That was quite the victory for you!
I should actually reread that. It was great fun...then I got hammered.

This isn't a "tonight project" though.

[Aristophanes]

VOTE: Aristophanes

This doesn't feel like your town play.

How do you figure?

[Aristophanes]

I explained my Postie townread in 193.
Tell me why you said 152 is doubting my Elyse read? I just said that wasn't sure of her posting.

I don't know how I missed that post. The subsequent ones explain away most of my I'll feelings too. And the tone of them is towny. I'm sorry I missed them!
UNVOTE:

One thing I disagree with though is Postie having a weak scumgame. The first game I played with her (Word Sneak 2) I was regained with a tale of her greatness and manipulative play as scum. I believe she was Nommed for a Scummy because of it. What makes you day her scum play is weak!?

I read his ISO from that game, and though I agree those posts are bad, he was also overwhelmed there, making it hard to get a read of his overall play. From this game though, I'd say we have scum.

What?

In reading the game Postie linked, it is clear that you were not making great posts that game because you were overwhelmed with the size and speed of the posts. You replaced out because of it. So I don't think it's a good meta example for your play.

[Aristophanes]

Good with an Aris or Bullet lynch

I'm off to work (got called in early) but I'll respond after. What have I done that is scummy?

[Aristophanes]

Wingback replaces Iprobablysuck! Please welcome them.

Hi. Been keeping an eye on the thread on my phone. I'll have more time after the fourth of july weekend so I should be able to catch up by tomorrow.

Hello and welcome!
Looking forward to it!

[Aristophanes]

239 pings me so hard. The overjustified, apologetic unvote of Bullet, the slight shade at Postie, the ridiculous defense of Bullet at the end when you were voting him like two posts earlier.

That was such an awkward and complete backoff of Bullet for "towny toned posts that you missed". Like are you even reading the game? You've "missed" a crazy amount of posts.

I wouldn't be surprised with a Bullet/Aris scumteam.

I missed some posts and they changed my read. I obviously need to reread some stuff because my reading comprehension sucks apparently.

I was not throwing shade at Postie, I'm refuting something I believe to be incorrect. Responding to "her scumgame is weak" with "no, she literally got Nommed for a Scummy for it" is not throwing shade.

For us to be a scumteam, I'd have to be scum. And I'm not scum. So...

[Aristophanes]

Honestly it's a mostly a character read. I'm not getting any townvibes from you, which I usually do when your town. I will admit it is possible some of it has to do with you going V/LA so yeah.

In any case, why isn't your vote on Postie?

I didn't vote Postie because I obviously need a better footing here, as I'm missing too many things (as Elyse noted). I need to reevaluate things before proceeding.

[Aristophanes]

Responding to "her scumgame is weak" with "no, she literally got Nommed for a Scummy for it" is not throwing shade.

To be fair, the game people tried to nom me for is literally the only scumgame I have won.

Oh.
Well, from my experience, your scum game is not weak at all. I may be tainted by that first encounter though. RC talked you up A Lot! And I respect his opinions on players quite a bit.

[Aristophanes]

Thank the stars! The site is back up!

I can't get to this until tomorrow. The Tiger attack set my whole schedule out of whack.

[Aristophanes]

Postie, why is your scumread on GL so strong? It appears most of your disagreements have been semantically rather than actually scummy things,and I think he's been very town this game.

What has he done that's actually scummy? Because I don't see it at all.

[Aristophanes]

Anyone have some TTH town games they can link me?

I just went to get one, but apparently I've only played with TTH when she Hydras. Well, until now at least!

[Aristophanes]

Postie, why is your scumread on GL so strong? It appears most of your disagreements have been semantically rather than actually scummy things,and I think he's been very town this game.

What has he done that's actually scummy? Because I don't see it at all.

Hard to explain but his scumread on me feels super opportunistic and fake. I just can't see town!GL scumreading me here at all.

I guess "Opportunistic" is the buzzword of the game, eh.

What about it is opportunistic? He has clearly had an escalating scumread on you. He voted you when he decided the case on me wasn't as good as he thought (which I see from town more often than not).

[Aristophanes]

@GL, re: Postie's Scum Partners

I don't recall Postie being a big busser, and I'd have to check, but I'm fairly certain she is rather against it when possible. Because of that, and her stance in this game, I'd say it is quite unlikely she would have done so. This makes it very unlikely that there is scum in GL, BNL, or Fire (Fire being the weakest of these reads).

She has suspected TTH and Duppin, but not acted on them. Having TTH with GL in the "Lynch these when I flip town" thing could be her throwing a scum mate in there to throw us off the scent.their disagreement looks unnatural and seems like a good way to distance should they lose Postie. The timing and placement on the wagon supports this.

Duppin interactions have been a lot of easy questions, as if he's throwing her a bone and helping her get a footing. Asking the same questions a few times also let's her be annoyed/angry (which people often townread) and let's her post "content"(even though it's just repeating the same content).

This is the pool I'd expect her scummates to be in. Distanced and shaded, but not pushed, and creating fake content.

[Aristophanes]

Wait what, are you really suggesting me and Postie could be scumbuddies?

Indeed I am!

[Aristophanes]

So you think I start a train on my scumbuddy for defending the player I was pushing? (You)

I don't think you gave yourself much choice really.

Had you not reacted as you did, questioning her town lean on me, it would have been weird. From there it escalated into a way where you couldn't have backed down without suspicion being on you should she flip. I would say that your walls were a saving grace, as it would be a bit much for a bus, but neither of your arguments against each other are very good, as if they weren't meant to actually create a wagon.

[Aristophanes]

I gotta read that Wingback post!

[Aristophanes]

I hate all this buddying and I can't shake it, and her whiteknighting of me is just too much!
VOTE: Postie

I'll finish reading up soon.

[Aristophanes]

That's L-1 btw.

[Aristophanes]

TTH! <3

You are da best! =D

[Aristophanes]

Oh yeah,release away on the PT!