Newbie 1742 Earth - Game Over


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Post Post #26 (isolation #0) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 4:26 am

Post by Accountant »


Hi, I’m Accountant, your friendly neighbourhood Inexperience-Challenged player, or IC. This means that I have a few games under my belt, so I know the ins and outs of mafia and can show you the ropes. For those of you who hate reading long rants, or have read a similar post already, check out the link:
A Beginner’s Guide to Being Awesome At Mafia
Anyway, as the IC, it’s my job to teach you theory concepts, which means I will never lie about theory questions. Ever.
Before we start the game proper, I’d like to cover a few key concepts.


Hammering, Lynching and L-1

When the number of votes on a player exceeds half the number of players for that game, that player is lynched
instantly
and the Day ends. For example, we have 9 players. If that means the hammer is 5, so if there were to be 5 votes on someone, that player would be lynched. Do not recklessly hammer, especially early in the game, or you’ll risk accidentally lynching town members and cutting short discussion time.
The concept of L-X is used to indicate how many votes a player is to hammer. L-1 means 1 vote to hammer, L-2 means 2 votes to hammer and so forth. So for this game, if someone were to get 4 votes, they would be at L-1. When you place the vote that puts someone at L-1(for example, if someone has 3 votes and you’re putting the 4th vote down, with a hammer of 5), you should usually announce it with a statement like “He’s at L-1”, so people don’t accidentally hammer. Even more importantly, it means that mafia can’t hammer a town member and then claim ignorance the next day.
If someone is at L-1 and you want to hammer him, you should usually state “intent to hammer”, which means “I want to lynch you”. When you do this, you can also ask for a role claim. That way, if the player is a power role being mislynched, he can claim before you place the hammering vote, and thus save himself.


LyLo

LyLo is the shortened form of a phrase which means “lynch or lose”. The simplest form of LyLo is 3 players, 2 of whom are vanilla townies and the last being a mafia goon. Then, it’s easy to see that if they do not lynch, the mafia goon will kill one of them at night, stalemating the lynch the next day, and killing the last town member on Night 2 – although the mod will usually recognize this and end the game early instead of dragging it out.
When town is in LyLo, it’s important not to carelessly vote like you would on any other day, because of the potential for a mafia coordinated hammer(a “quickhammer”, happening before anyone else can react). Let’s say we have LyLo with 3 Vanilla Townies and 2 Mafia Goons. One of the vanilla townie carelessly puts his vote on another VT. This allows the two mafia goons to instantly rush in and simultaneously vote that VT, bringing his vote count to 3 in a game of 5 players, which is a hammer and loss for the town.
It’s good practice to try to recognize LyLo situations when you see them, but in Newbie games a more experienced player will usually point out that it’s LyLo and caution people from recklessly voting. Learning how to deal with LyLo is a very important part of playing mafia, and it comes up more often than you might think.


RVS

We are currently in the RVS, or Random Voting Stage. As none of us has any idea who is mafia(well, except the mafia members themselves, but they’re hardly going to admit it), we’re mostly poking around and slinging votes like hot curry at a food fight, trying to provoke reactions, start a discussion and basically probe around to try and determine player’s alignments.
As it is the
Random
Voting Stage, it’s common for players to vote for very silly reasons, such as “your avatar is ugly” or “your username has too many numbers in it”. Don’t worry, they don’t have a grudge against you or anything. It’s just part of RVS. Without RVS, it would be a lot harder to get the game moving.


Conclusion

Thank you for joining this newbie game, and I hope that all of us will have fun playing, win or lose. If you have any questions at all, feel free to ask me. I’m an IC, so it’s my job to be active and respond to questions from newer players. I live in Singapore, which makes my timezone GMT+8, so don’t be surprised if I answer in the middle of the night or appear to be inactive at high noon(I’m probably sleeping).

Have fun and good luck!


- Accountant
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #27 (isolation #1) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 4:29 am

Post by Accountant »

VOTE: Huntress

For having an avatar similar to zoraster's. Impersonation of site administration!
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #28 (isolation #2) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 4:31 am

Post by Accountant »

ShadowlancerX and Blix900, would be good if you can get an avatar! they help players identify your posts quickly.

Also, shadowlancer is newbtown to a T. Scum are paranoid about dying, especially early on in the game, and so they do not vote themselves to L-1.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #32 (isolation #3) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 6:38 am

Post by Accountant »

VOTE: Blix9090

Glad to see you've come around to the light side, Vampirate.
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Post Post #33 (isolation #4) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 6:38 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 31, Blix900 wrote:
In post 30, Vampirate wrote:VOTE: Blix900

No content post cheering for more content instead of providing his own.
I don't believe I could provide any content beyond sending out a vote at this point...

Why immediately vote on me after I vote on you?
How do you feel about Shadowlancer?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #55 (isolation #5) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 7:58 am

Post by Accountant »

PP what the fuck
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #56 (isolation #6) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 7:59 am

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Vampirate is probably town
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #57 (isolation #7) » Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:01 am

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Don't fall into the trap of lynching only from Blix's wagon - it's too early and too erratic to conclude that scum HAS to be pushing it. I would definitely take a good hard look at everyone on it though.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #66 (isolation #8) » Sat Sep 24, 2016 6:19 pm

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VOTE: Huntress

Scum!Huntress jumping to mislynch PP is more likely than scum!PP randonly deciding it would be fun to hammer a townie and get the spotlight on him for the whole of Day 2.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #68 (isolation #9) » Sun Sep 25, 2016 1:53 am

Post by Accountant »

If you like her vote, shouldn't you be voting PP?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #73 (isolation #10) » Sun Sep 25, 2016 11:17 pm

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I'm gonna let PP respond to that before I say anything.
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Post Post #76 (isolation #11) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:24 am

Post by Accountant »

Then why aren't you voting Penguin? Even if you think me and Penguin are both equally likely to be scum, it would make sense to vote PP because he has a vote on him and is more likely to be lynched.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #79 (isolation #12) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:47 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 77, Icy wrote:How about you convince me your town and make it easy for me to move my vote.
I'm not trying to convince you to move your vote, I'm asking you a
question
. Why did you vote me as opposed to PP
in the first place
when town!Icy would be voting PP?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #80 (isolation #13) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:48 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 78, Icy wrote:Anyone have any strong feelings on Vampirate getting killed?
She was obvtown, so it's only natural.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #82 (isolation #14) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 2:07 am

Post by Accountant »

The reason would be that scum!PP wants to lynch a townie and cut short the day, being confident enough that he can talk his way out of a noose D2. But I don't think that's the kind of player PP is.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #85 (isolation #15) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 2:38 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 83, Icy wrote:
In post 79, Accountant wrote:
In post 77, Icy wrote:How about you convince me your town and make it easy for me to move my vote.
I'm not trying to convince you to move your vote, I'm asking you a
question
. Why did you vote me as opposed to PP
in the first place
when town!Icy would be voting PP?
If there wasn't a vote on him already I would have voted there.

At this point in the game I see you as 1 and 1a.
What is this disingenuous shit? A vote on PP would only encourage you to vote him over me, since scum being closer to lynch is better for town.

VOTE: Icy
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Post Post #88 (isolation #16) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 4:29 am

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PP derphammering is weird, but again I don't see him as the sort of player who'd do that as scum and I don't think it outweighs Icy's disingenuity.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #94 (isolation #17) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 3:11 pm

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waiting for Icy to answer the question that 4 people so far have asked him
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #98 (isolation #18) » Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:11 pm

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So Icy responds fairly promptly earlier on, then goes quiet when the hard questions are asked? Inactivity isn't a scumtell, but convenient inactivity in response to pressure is.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #103 (isolation #19) » Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:51 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 99, Icy wrote:
In post 89, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 83, Icy wrote:If there wasn't a vote on him already I would have voted there.
Why wouldn't you put another vote on me if you think I'm scum?
Your day one play warranted some questions/ and or votes on day two. When I logged in Huntress had already voted you and Accountant voted her. Accountant's vote and reason for the vote seemed to me like it could have been used on anyone who voted you. That's why I voted him instead of you.
How does my reasoning being applicable to anyone who voted Penguin imply that your vote would be better placed on me instead of Penguin?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #104 (isolation #20) » Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:52 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 102, Icy wrote:
In post 97, hinanawiscarlet wrote:
In post 78, Icy wrote:Anyone have any strong feelings on Vampirate getting killed?
I agree that this question feels like a distraction, and not adding to town.
Not a distraction at all. I felt after reading day one that either Vampirate, or Shadowlancerx would be the night kill.
So, uh, what conclusions have you come to from thinking that Vampirate would die then Vampirate dying?
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #107 (isolation #21) » Tue Sep 27, 2016 2:30 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 105, Icy wrote:Accountant, have you decided everyone on Blix's wagon is town or was this post to everyone else?
In post 57, Accountant wrote:Don't fall into the trap of lynching only from Blix's wagon - it's too early and too erratic to conclude that scum HAS to be pushing it. I would definitely take a good hard look at everyone on it though.
Not sure what you're saying. I don't think people on Blix's wagon are scummier than anyone else.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #113 (isolation #22) » Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:05 pm

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What do you make of the fact that he hasn't received all that much pressure in the first place? Even if it was an accident, he could still be scum that made a mistake unless you subscribe to the "scum-are-more-careful" theory. Is there a reason you are dismissing him as town?
I think Penguin is a conservative player, and wouldn't do something as risky as quickhammering Day 1. Site rules prevent me from saying too much, but you can check his previous finished games and judge for yourself.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #114 (isolation #23) » Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:07 pm

Post by Accountant »

BlackVoid, you should totally vote Icy.
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Post Post #116 (isolation #24) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 2:13 am

Post by Accountant »

everything icy just said is a lie

prove me wrong
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Post Post #120 (isolation #25) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 3:52 am

Post by Accountant »

Icy is scum, so beating Icy is pushing town towards a win. Not sure what you don't understand. Brief posts because I'm drowsy and stressed and tired of lazy scum throwing shade.
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Post Post #125 (isolation #26) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 6:52 am

Post by Accountant »

I seem to be getting votes because of my support of you
That's not true at all. You're getting votes for inconsistency with stated reads vs voting patterns - like hesitating to vote a scumread because they already have a vote on them. This is a giant misrepresentation of the case against you.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #126 (isolation #27) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 6:54 am

Post by Accountant »

For the record I basically didn't realize and so didn't call. I do my best to call out L-1s as I see them, but they far from the top priority I have. I can show you a couple of other games where I was town and missed calling L-1s.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #127 (isolation #28) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 6:56 am

Post by Accountant »

Adding to that, I have a problem with Accountant calling out possible townee posts day one. If he isn't controlling the night kill he is at the very least influencing it.
Oh yeah, and Icy is also trying to tell me I should have communicated less and be less transparent about my reads. He needs to eat rope.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #131 (isolation #29) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:18 am

Post by Accountant »

Accountants reason could have been used on anyone voting Penguin. After day one both seemed scummy to me.
Why the Jimminy Cricket does that make me scum or the reasoning invalid??? This is not the first time you have dodged a question or failed to answer questions posed to you. You think they'll go away if you ignore them??

Face the music, Icy. You've been caught. Put your hands against the wall, do not move and do not resist arrest. You have the right ti remain silent as we lynch you.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #132 (isolation #30) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:21 am

Post by Accountant »

Okay, just realized that maybe you haven't read up. Tell me when you have.
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Post Post #138 (isolation #31) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:32 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 134, Icy wrote:
In post 131, Accountant wrote:
Accountants reason could have been used on anyone voting Penguin. After day one both seemed scummy to me.
Why the Jimminy Cricket does that make me scum or the reasoning invalid??? This is not the first time you have dodged a question or failed to answer questions posed to you. You think they'll go away if you ignore them??

Face the music, Icy. You've been caught. Put your hands against the wall, do not move and do not resist arrest. You have the right ti remain silent as we lynch you.
Did I say the reason was invalid, or weak, lame and sorry? The reason made the hair on the back of my neck stand up, and my gut hurt. That along with your day one play made you my vote.
Oh, so
now
the story is "my read was gut all along! :D"

No. This is scum who has realized they talked themselves into a corner and are trying to spin it as a gut read, which conveniently can't be explained(because it's GUT!!!!).

And it is indeed a pure gut read because I've already debunked his nonsense about me intentionally not L-1ing(I notice he didn't take me up on my offer to post games where I L-1ed accidentally as town, like actual town trying to discern my alignment would) and his other nonsense about me trying to control the night kill by townreading people.
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Post Post #139 (isolation #32) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:34 am

Post by Accountant »


This is a game of numbers. If any townee agreed with Accountant (which I did) and Scum nightkilled player C that would leave one less possible scum player. The longer the game goes the worse it gets for the scum team.

The smart night kill was one of those two players.
By the way, this is an argument for town!Accountant being bad and telling the scum players who to kill, because it presumes that scum are killing people based on how much they're being townread; of course for this line of logic to make sense, the person doing the townreading(ie. me) has to be town themselves.

I thought you were scumreading me, Icy. Do you subconsciously know I'm not a member of the scumteam?
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Post Post #140 (isolation #33) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:35 am

Post by Accountant »

I don't think he works as a partner with Icy though so I need to rethink one of those reads.
What makes you think this BlackVoid?
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Post Post #142 (isolation #34) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:44 am

Post by Accountant »

Makes sense.
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Post Post #146 (isolation #35) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:51 am

Post by Accountant »

I don't know why anyone would announce it.
So why the hell would you write this as your reason for scumreading me? To scumread someone, you find something they do, explain why scum would do this and link the two to conclude theg are scum. You're completely missing the second step, and someone who's been here since March would know better.

If you can't explain why scum would do something, there's no valid reason to scumread someone for doing that thing.

There was already some pressure on Penguin and Accountants reason for vote (valid or not) bothered me. Rather than put more pressure on Penguin and let Accountant slide. I decided to apply some pressure to Accountant by voting him.

Had Accountant not voted Huntress I would have voted Penguin.
You're so full of shit, Icy. Real town want to wagon and kill their scumreads. They want to pile votes on top of them and shove them into the noose, like I'm doing to you right now. Someone who had the mindset of wanting to kill Penguin but not wanting to let me slide would have voted Penguin and then verbally put pressure on me by calling me out and shit.

This is terrible logic. Die! Die! Die!
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Post Post #147 (isolation #36) » Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:53 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 145, Icy wrote:So you admit you know I'm Town!!!!!!!
???????

That line you quoted was me implying you're scum who knows that
I'm
town.
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Post Post #150 (isolation #37) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:25 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 149, Icy wrote:Subconsciously: acting or existing without one's awareness

If I were scum I would know you were town, my subconscious wouldn't be fighting me.

Stop dodging questions. This isn't the presidential debate.
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Post Post #152 (isolation #38) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:49 am

Post by Accountant »

If you're not dodging, then why did you not respond to #146? Have you realized that you can't defend yourself against the righteous accusations leveled against you?

Out of
all
the shit I said on page 6, you chose to fixate on "subconscious"? Tell me again how that's not lazy scum declining to defend themselves, please.
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Post Post #154 (isolation #39) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:35 am

Post by Accountant »

gonna repeat this for the billionth time

i believe in calling out l-1s

I believe in calling out L-1s

I BELIEVE IN CALLING OUT L-1S

IT'S JUST THAT I MISSED THAT PARTICULAR L-1 BECAUSE I'M NOT AN INHUMANLY PERFECT VOTE CALCULATOR

literally trying to jump on a human mistake and say it's due to me being scum

blow this nonsense away plz
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Post Post #156 (isolation #40) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:41 am

Post by Accountant »

Mafia would gain favor with the town by being right. Some might think because your read was proven right on Vampirate, it's also likely to be right on others.
So am I scum for controlling the night kill by townreading Vampirate or am I scum for trying to get towncred by townreading Vampirate?

What makes you think it's scum!Accountant trying to get towncred as opposed to town!Accountant stating his actual reads?
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Post Post #158 (isolation #41) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:01 am

Post by Accountant »

That's a straight up misrep of my vote case. It's not okay that you're intentionally lying to town about your voting reasons and being inconsistent about your voting. Like, it makes no sense that you as town would not vote Penguin, and the reason you gave when asked to explain that was weaselly and god awful.
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Post Post #159 (isolation #42) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:02 am

Post by Accountant »

Maybe you did, maybe you didn't I'm unsure.

So unsure that you voted me and said I was scum.
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Post Post #161 (isolation #43) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:29 am

Post by Accountant »

[quote="In [url=http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 7#p8372017]
I see no reason for town Accountant to share his reads.[/quote]
There's a ton of reason for me to share my reads. Letting people know what my stances are so they can hold me accountable and I won't be able to make up stuff without contradicting myself, catching scum by PoE, forming townblocs, protecting townreads from the noose by getting others to townread them too.
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Post Post #162 (isolation #44) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:31 am

Post by Accountant »

Noone existing on this site has ever went "whew! This person townread someone and the guy died and flipped town! I guess I will trust them!"

At this point you're literally stretching logic as far as you can to try to make up stuff and justify the things you say that people call you out on
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Post Post #164 (isolation #45) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:34 am

Post by Accountant »

Hey PP why'd you keep parroting the stuff I say right after I say it?
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Post Post #167 (isolation #46) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:45 am

Post by Accountant »

UNVOTE:

No. I have a bad feeling about this. We aren't lynching until I have more from scarlet and Huntress. The jump onto Icy feels fishy.
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Post Post #169 (isolation #47) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:52 am

Post by Accountant »


BlackVoid
hinanawiscarlet
Icy
Shadowlancerx
Huntress (SE)
PenguinPower (SE)
Accountant (IC)
I know I'm town.

Newbie 1739 just ended, so I want everyone to go look at it. That's a game where Penguin is scum. I don't think he's scum here.

Shadowlancer isn't scum. Newbscum doesnt L-1 themselves early on the game.

BlackVoid is probably town. Wouldn't bet my soul on it, but scum BlackVoid could easily have killed Icy.

Icy is pretty obvious newbtown if I take off my tunnel glasses. Scum has no reason to vote me when they could mindlessly sheep onto PP.

scarlet and Huntress are scum by PoE. One is an inactive and the other was trying to kill PP instantly Day 2. The jump from PP to Icy seals the deal.
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Post Post #170 (isolation #48) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:53 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 168, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 165, Icy wrote:No one in this game has made a case on anyone but me.
I actually still think there's a case on Huntress, though she's been quiet compared to you.

VOTE: Huntress
This vote confirms PP as town.

VOTE: Huntress

Icy, come and join us. The scumwagon on you is over. It's time to lynch actual scum now.
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Post Post #171 (isolation #49) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:54 am

Post by Accountant »

When someone derphammers town, scum's first instinct is to kick back and let town rip itself apart. Especially with the wagon on Icy. The only place I could be wrong is BlackVoid, but we have one mislynch so if we just lynch Huntress and Scarlet we're confirmed a win.
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Post Post #177 (isolation #50) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:44 am

Post by Accountant »

Maxx got quickhammered in that game, and PP yelled at everyome for it. Because as scum he likes to be able to take the "moral high ground" and get towncred for yelling at people who rush lynches. That's not the type of mindset that leads you to quickhammer gambit.
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Post Post #178 (isolation #51) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:54 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 174, Shadowlancerx wrote:
In post 171, Accountant wrote:When someone derphammers town, scum's first instinct is to kick back and let town rip itself apart. Especially with the wagon on Icy. The only place I could be wrong is BlackVoid, but we have one mislynch so if we just lynch Huntress and Scarlet we're confirmed a win.
The lurking has been really bothering me, but walk me through why huntress and scarlet wouldn't have added their votes to Icy when they could have? I'm guessing that a lynch on someone who turns town (if Icy is actually town, I don't have a clear read either way anymore) is better when the Mafia don't have to actually throw their votes on it, but would they risk that? I guess I'm just not completely clear here.
UNVOTE: until I've got a clearer picture of what's going on.
Huntress did add her vote to Icy. I don't know about Scarlet, but scum usually doesn't like to double hop onto a wagon at the same time because it looks shady.

Remember, the scum team wants me to drive the lynch onto Icy. They know Icy will flip town and doesn't want to be caught leading the wagon on her when she does. They would rather I drive the wagon while sitting back and hiding in the shadows themselves.
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Post Post #179 (isolation #52) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:57 am

Post by Accountant »

Also I just realized I've been ignoring the possibility of PP being scum who genuinely accidentally hammered... but Huntress-PP interactions(including the immediate jump Day 2 and PP moving from Icy to Huntress) make that unlikely. Outside chance of scarlet-PP, maybe.
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Post Post #182 (isolation #53) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:07 am

Post by Accountant »

Great to hear you're on board Shadow! Let's wagon Huntress. She'll almost certainly flip scum. She's not scum with PP and probably not scum with void, so no need to worry about stuff like a PP-Scarlet team today. Just lynch Huntress
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Post Post #184 (isolation #54) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:15 am

Post by Accountant »

Probably scum lies or trolling. I'm okay with a derphammer.
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Post Post #187 (isolation #55) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:23 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 186, PenguinPower wrote:I'm getting a really bad feeling that Accountant may be scum leading the town.
TRUST

YOU GOTTA HAVE TRUST

(also, why would I bother switching off Icy if I was scum)
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Post Post #195 (isolation #56) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:51 am

Post by Accountant »

I don't buy PP scum right now. Paranoia feels genuine as well. Void, I'm up for lynching Scarlet; I don't care what order scum is lynched in.
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Post Post #198 (isolation #57) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:12 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 190, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 189, BlackVoid wrote:On Penguin's end, I think he was very quick to vote Huntress right after Accountant unvotes Icy even though he was pushing Icy for most of D2. Accountant listed out two people (scarlet and huntress) in 167 and immediately Penguin puts down a vote on Huntress in the next post. It seems too much of a co-incidence and looks like he's encouraging Accountant to push the scumread that's not his partner.
Where was I pushing Icy for most of D2? I never put my vote down on Icy. Also, I can't help that I responded to Icy's post at the exact same time as Account made his post. I didn't see it until p-edit, but there was nothing for me to comment on at that point.
Wow. Be more clear about your reads next time.

Who do you think is scum?
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Post Post #222 (isolation #58) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:53 pm

Post by Accountant »

Huntress OMGUS is a scum claim. Lynch this.

Gladiate: Huntress
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Post Post #223 (isolation #59) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:54 pm

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Huntress is the only scum I'm 100% absolutely sure of. Vote her or me, pick your side.
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Post Post #224 (isolation #60) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:54 pm

Post by Accountant »

If Huntress flips town, I want everyone to lynch me tomorrow.
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Post Post #225 (isolation #61) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:56 pm

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Setting up lynches in advance? The only way you could be confirmed a win from that is if you are scum and know that Scarlet and I are both town. Or if Scarlet is your partner a mislynch on me would give you an excuse not to follow through with that plan in lylo and to lynch another townie for the win.
Or if you're scum and I'm lynching you and your partner. BlackVoid, come vote Huntress. No reason for you not to unless you're protecting your partner ;)
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Post Post #227 (isolation #62) » Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:03 pm

Post by Accountant »

No - we don't want the scum killing investigatives and preventing them from bringing their investigations and info to the table the next day. Plus, if we lynch Huntress, it won't be LyLo.
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Post Post #229 (isolation #63) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:20 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 228, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 227, Accountant wrote:No - we don't want the scum killing investigatives and preventing them from bringing their investigations and info to the table the next day. Plus, if we lynch Huntress, it won't be LyLo.
How do you know we're in a setup with investigatives?
I don't. But let's not take the chance.
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Post Post #230 (isolation #64) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:20 am

Post by Accountant »

It's just not optimal to massclaim when we can just lynch huntress and avert lylo in the first place
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Post Post #232 (isolation #65) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:58 am

Post by Accountant »

To be blunt, I don't think the setup is relevant right now.
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Post Post #242 (isolation #66) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:06 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 235, Shadowlancerx wrote:
In post 231, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 230, Accountant wrote:It's just not optimal to massclaim when we can just lynch huntress and avert lylo in the first place
No. I get that. It's just that now you and Shadow have both commented pretty specifically on our setup. It's off-putting.
Penguin, my comment about the setup was more along the lines of it being wide open from my standpoint. Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but is speculating on the setup a bad thing (I'm asking this as a general statement, not for this specific game)?
Not necessarily a bad thing, but it doesn't help us and it might lead to PRs slipping or scum getting a better idea who to target.

At least, y'know, wait until you have information about the setup before speccing on it.
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Post Post #244 (isolation #67) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:09 am

Post by Accountant »

Unless they have an IC coaching them pre-game not to worry about it.
I might coach 'em not to panic if they were at L-1, but it doesn't make sense for me to coach Shadow to vote himself to L-1. I'm not that insane.
I don't get why you're buddying me.
I'm not buddying you though. I just like that you voted Huntress. You should keep voting Huntress.
Can't trust an IC who is buddying me. You swapped off Icy because it makes you look more towny.
Nah mate. I coulda pretended to blindtunnel Icy for free and nobody would have found me suspicious for it. Heck, you would've equated it to my behavior against vytis in the mini we played together, where I was town. The extra towncred isn't worth giving up the free mislynch for scum Accountant.
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Post Post #245 (isolation #68) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:14 am

Post by Accountant »

I'm actually wanting to do this as the inverse.
I'm okay with this. Let me outline the rules of the Accountant Game.

The Accountant Game

TWO PLAYERS ENTER

ONE PLAYER LEAVE

IT'S TIME TO RUMBLE

Rules:

- You can only vote either
Accountant
or
Huntress
today. Anyone who doesn't vote one of these two options is either scum or a big weenie nya nya!
- Hint: you should vote
Huntress
.
- If you do end up voting
Accountant
, you
must
lynch
Huntress
after
Accountant
flips town. Everyone in this game has to look me in the metaphorical eyes and promise me this.
Huntress
cannot be town together with
Accountant
, because if that was the case mafia would sheep
Accountant
and then mislynch me the next day after
Huntress
flips town.
- No voters are a big weenie nya nya as well! If you're town, you shouldn't be afraid to stand firm and declare your side!
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Post Post #255 (isolation #69) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 5:42 am

Post by Accountant »

Play the Accountant Game, please.

@Huntress: I'm not interested in wasting words on answering a scum member's questions. If actual town wants to know the answer, they's ask me themselves.
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Post Post #256 (isolation #70) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 5:48 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 250, Huntress wrote:I see Accountant still hasn't answered my questions.
This isn't even town hounding after their scumread for dodging questions, btw. Compare how I was yelling at Icy over and over to answer my questions vs this post, which is directed at the rest of the town and intended to make me look bad(ie. throw shade at me) rather than get answers.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #259 (isolation #71) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:02 am

Post by Accountant »

Roll up, roll up!! Play the game, don't be a square! It's the duel of the century!

Right now, I'm looking at Scarlet as a scumbuddy! But that could change! Who knows!
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #261 (isolation #72) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:14 am

Post by Accountant »

How about proving me right and lynching yourself? ;)
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Post Post #263 (isolation #73) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:00 am

Post by Accountant »

If Huntress was town, scum would quickwagon her and frame me for it. Huntress can't be town.

Shadow can sheep whoever he likes as he is all but confirmed town.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #264 (isolation #74) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:04 am

Post by Accountant »

No way town Huntress coincidentally scumreads me for unrelated reasons right after I expose her as scum.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #266 (isolation #75) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:52 am

Post by Accountant »

Icy play the game, don't be silly
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Post Post #268 (isolation #76) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:57 am

Post by Accountant »

And remember, if Accountant is town, Huntress is scum. Say it with me, kids -- if Accountant is town, Huntress is scum.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #275 (isolation #77) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 9:45 am

Post by Accountant »

even without my game or town accountant -> scum huntress or any of that gimmick, huntress is objectively scummy

1) start of day push on pp
2) votes icy, then immediately OMGUSes me once I scumread her
3) only interested in throwing shade rather than actually wanting questions answered
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Post Post #278 (isolation #78) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:51 pm

Post by Accountant »

Just play the game, guys. Humor me on this. Also, anyone who's trying to say me and Huntress can be town together is scummy. Looks like they're trying to lynch me while keeping their buddy alive.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

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Post Post #279 (isolation #79) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:51 pm

Post by Accountant »

Wow, didn't expect that Scarlet vote. Not sure what to make of it. Good job Scarlet!
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #281 (isolation #80) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:59 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 280, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 276, Huntress wrote:then scumclaimed in 171.
That's a pretty weak example of a scum claim.
It's not a scum claim at all. Huntress is literally sitting there lying their ass off.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #284 (isolation #81) » Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:33 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 283, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 282, Huntress wrote:
In post 280, PenguinPower wrote:That's a pretty weak example of a scum claim.
If he is town there is no way he could claim a confirmed win from lynching two players whose alignment he could not know. He
knows
that but he said it anyway to try to convince you to lynch me. Setting up lynches like that is not town play. Hence the action was a scum claim.
Nah. I just got beat by town the same way.
when scum lies go wrong
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #286 (isolation #82) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:08 am

Post by Accountant »

I didn't name any names :^) I don't see how you jumped to that conclusion

But seriously, play the game. Do it. Take a side, don't be a wuss. You know one of us is scum. Don't try to claim we're both town, because that's impossible.
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Post Post #290 (isolation #83) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 2:38 am

Post by Accountant »

I dunno. I could see BlackVoid as an edge case, perhaps. Or maybe Scarlet is trying to bus.

The only reason you'd refuse to play is if you think both me and Huntress are town. Why do you thinrk that?
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Post Post #296 (isolation #84) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 4:41 am

Post by Accountant »

WTF leads you to believe my poe is wrong???
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Post Post #297 (isolation #85) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 4:42 am

Post by Accountant »

You're so full of ??? I can't even sort you. Please just stay hands off the Accountant Game if you're not going to participate. When Huntress flips scum, you can throw around your conspiracies about who is/isn't bussing and the scum team's precise mislynch order or whatever.
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You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #301 (isolation #86) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:02 am

Post by Accountant »

for what its worth I trust PP right now.
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Post Post #303 (isolation #87) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:07 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 302, Icy wrote:
In post 300, PenguinPower wrote:
In post 298, Icy wrote:
In post 296, Accountant wrote:WTF leads you to believe my poe is wrong???
You really believe that Scarlet is throwing his partner under the bus?
Why isn't your vote on Scarlet?
Until this silly game is over I will remain a no-vote.
WHAT

Ok listen up

a no-vote is a terrible idea

objectively a terrible idea

you're taking away info from town because they can't look at what wagons you're on

and you lose a chance to vote your scumreads, even if they're wrong

there's literally 0 reason for you to no-vote

plz get your head back in the game and stop with this temper tantrum "I don't like accountatn's game so I won't play!" thing
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Post Post #307 (isolation #88) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:39 am

Post by Accountant »

talk to me about how penguin is scum
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Post Post #309 (isolation #89) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 7:04 am

Post by Accountant »

I've addressed my thoughts on the derphammer. Reason 2 is a legitimate point.
Reason 3: Questions Shadow, but now knows it's likely Shadow will sheep him.
Why is this scum PP? Questioning Shadow isn't scummy - knowing it's likely Shadow will sheep him isn't scummy(because I don't see him manipulatively capitalizing on that knowledge). Why is this something that scum PP would do and not town PP?
Reason 5: Swaps to Huntress for no apparent reason
He did give a reason - he no longer trusts his gut read, and goes with his logic, which says Huntress. As it well should.
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Post Post #311 (isolation #90) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 7:20 am

Post by Accountant »

why is that scum?
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Post Post #314 (isolation #91) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 7:43 am

Post by Accountant »

265 and 305 seem to contradict each other

you imply that he's scum buds with me in 265 and scum buds with huntress 305

i understand you were flipping back on forth on who the scum was between me and huntress; does this imply you think icy is confirmed scum and you're trying to find his partner
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Post Post #318 (isolation #92) » Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:58 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 316, Icy wrote:
In post 311, Accountant wrote:why is that scum?
My point of view, what scum wouldn't love a game pitting two townee's against each other.

I guess I just don't see your case on Huntress. Maybe I just don't want to see it.

Your defense of Penguin also seems solely based on his other games.
I love this game too. I caught scum early. What townie wouldn't love a game where they caught scum early?

My defense of Penguin is based on his temperament. Evidence of his temperament comes from his play in this game and others.
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Post Post #330 (isolation #93) » Mon Oct 03, 2016 4:17 pm

Post by Accountant »

Okay uh

I know this looks bad but I can totally explain

I don't have the time to post right now but give me a few hours and I'll defend myself, I promise.
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Post Post #331 (isolation #94) » Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:37 pm

Post by Accountant »

Currently two scum remain alive - I think Icy and Shadow are town, which means Black and Scarlet must be scum, the dirty connivers.

No matter who you think is scum, please don't make a vote yet. This is LyLo, and there's really no benefit to voting someone.
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Post Post #334 (isolation #95) » Mon Oct 03, 2016 7:39 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 332, BlackVoid wrote:Saying I'm scum with Scarlet is odd given I've been pushing him most of the game. Scarlet probably is scum though and I'm not sure who the partner is so I'm going to have to look over interactions.

@Scarlet, why did you vote Huntress when you said that Accountant was more suspicious?
Okay, let's lynch Scarlet together. Maybe I'm wrong about you.
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Post Post #335 (isolation #96) » Mon Oct 03, 2016 7:45 pm

Post by Accountant »

So, the reason I offered myself as tribute and offered to get lynched today if Huntress doesn't flip scum is because I
really really really
thought Huntress was scum. Apparently I was wrong. Which is extremely weird, because I'd strongly expect scum to push Huntress the moment I leapt onto Huntress. However! People are wrong a lot of the time, including me! So I guess I was wrong. I'm going to go ahead and do something very selfish and say that I'm sneakily retracting my promise to let myself get lynched. Because, you know, I'm town, and if i get lynched, we lose this game right now. Only it's not selfish, because everyone loses if I die. So I'm not going to let myself die here.
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Post Post #337 (isolation #97) » Tue Oct 04, 2016 1:40 am

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Don't be a pooper, Icy, penguin died with HIS vote on Huntress. He outright said he didn't think I was scum and his gut was bad.
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Post Post #338 (isolation #98) » Tue Oct 04, 2016 1:41 am

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You were pushing that me and Huntress were both town earlier. What changed? In fact, you claimed Mafia would push me after Huntress flipped town.
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Post Post #340 (isolation #99) » Tue Oct 04, 2016 2:13 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 339, Icy wrote:
In post 338, Accountant wrote:You were pushing that me and Huntress were both town earlier. What changed? In fact, you claimed Mafia would push me after Huntress flipped town.
My reads were based on Penguin being Scum.
why does penguin being town mean I'm scum is the question I'm trying to ask you
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Post Post #347 (isolation #100) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:38 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 346, Icy wrote:
In post 338, Accountant wrote:You were pushing that me and Huntress were both town earlier. What changed? In fact, you claimed Mafia would push me after Huntress flipped town.
Read the thread, I only moved my vote off you when I was sure Penguin was Scum.
Earlier, you said "Huntress will flip town and the scum team will push Accountant, winning the game"(post 295). That means you thought I was town at the time.

Between then and now, two people flipped - Huntress and PP. Your quote already presumes Huntress town, so it must not have changed your stance at all. In other words, PP flipping town must have convinced you somehow that I am scum. My question is "how?"
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Post Post #348 (isolation #101) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:39 am

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Now that I know that Huntress is town, scumread Accountant again. He feels like directing the lynch.
Why is me directing the lynch proof that I am scum? Town directs lynches all the time.
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Post Post #350 (isolation #102) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:41 am

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This feels like reverse psychology, almost put here so that you could say later "why would scumAccountant say this?"
Except that's not what I said, Shadow. I told everyone that I retract the statement and that I was lying out my ass when I said I would let town lynch me - because I'm not going to let town outright lose just because I was wrong about Huntress.
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Post Post #351 (isolation #103) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:44 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 349, Icy wrote:The two things that bother me the most are your move off me, and this quote.
In post 139, Accountant wrote:

This is a game of numbers. If any townee agreed with Accountant (which I did) and Scum nightkilled player C that would leave one less possible scum player. The longer the game goes the worse it gets for the scum team.

The smart night kill was one of those two players.
By the way, this is an argument for town!Accountant being bad and telling the scum players who to kill, because it presumes that scum are killing people based on how much they're being townread; of course for this line of logic to make sense, the person doing the townreading(ie. me) has to be town themselves.

I thought you were scumreading me, Icy.
Do you subconsciously know I'm not a member of the scumteam?
Penguin mentioned town credit, but that only works if I'm night killed. (likely your plan when you moved off me) Given my late game support of you it's likely you went after someone who was unsure of you instead. I can't think of any other reason for you to walk away from me.

Your quote above is also troubling. If I were Scum I'd know your alliance. That was a Scum slip.
I understand why you think scum Accountant would do this, but there are also reasons for town Accountant to do this - specifically, that town Accountant believes you are town and no longer wants to vote you.

I don't understand why you assumed it was scum Accountant than town Accountant, since it could be from both.
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Post Post #352 (isolation #104) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:46 am

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Oh, and that's not a scumslip. I said "subconsciously" to imply that you were scum who subconsciously "knew"(without consciously doing it) that I was town and inadvertently let that fact color your words.

And that's not just a scum lie perpetrated by me; PP also said that was his interpretation of the line.
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Post Post #354 (isolation #105) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:01 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 345, Shadowlancerx wrote:
In post 342, hinanawiscarlet wrote:I was wrong, okay? It was just gut at first. I reread Accountant's posts and I decided to vote Huntress.

Now that I know that Huntress is town, scumread Accountant again. He feels like directing the lynch.

Also, since this is lylo, I think it's time to claim the power town role. Is it jailkeeper or tracker?
This post makes me uneasy. I don't know whether it's good to get a claim here or not, there are way too many variables in play, but you're suggesting it without any reasoning to back it up?
Claim is optimal.

Jailkeeper is useless since if he manages to stop a kill it becomes 3-1, optimal strategy then is to No Lynch and let scum kill, which comes down to the same thing anyway. Not only that, claiming as Jailkeeper confirms a townie(1/3 less chance of losing) OR narrows down the vote to 2 players if counterclaimed(normal 3/5 -> 6/10 minus 1/2 -> 5/10 = 1/10 less chance of losing).

Tracker should claim as well. It has the same benefit as Jailkeeper in terms of stopping losses, and it has no utility at night because Tracker results are of very little use on Day Four, where scum have no reason not to make up anything they think they can get away with(if they fakeclaim Tracker it narrows to 2 players, which is exactly the same as no fakeclaim).

tl;dr - claim.

IC can't lie about game theory
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Post Post #355 (isolation #106) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:02 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 353, Icy wrote:If town Accountant said that then she truly believed I was a town, yet her vote remained on me for another 24 hrs.

Look Accountant, you voted Bliss, you voted Huntress, and you spend 4 days hounding me. Your either Scum, or a townee having a VERY bad game.
I'm a townie having a very bad game.
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Post Post #357 (isolation #107) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:12 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 356, Icy wrote:
In post 352, Accountant wrote:Oh, and that's not a scumslip. I said "subconsciously" to imply that you were scum who subconsciously "knew"(without consciously doing it) that I was town and inadvertently let that fact color your words.

And that's not just a scum lie perpetrated by me; PP also said that was his interpretation of the line.
So does your subconscious still think that Huntress is Scum. Regardless of how you or Penguin read it, the statement bothers me.
No. My subconscious has nothing to do with this! I was accusing YOUR subconscious of knowing I was town.
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Post Post #358 (isolation #108) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:18 am

Post by Accountant »

I'm going to repeat something I said in another game(I was the mod and a tense LyLo had just ended in a scum win). "LyLo is the ultimate test of who you can trust and who you can not trust". My game theory explanation of the power of a single confirmed townie is proof of that.

So I'm going to ask everyone here if they trust Icy. I trust Icy because a mafia has no reason to try to stop the Huntress-Accountant wagon since both are town. Do you?

If we can all agree to trust and confirm Icy as town and town PR claims, that turns us from 3/5 chance of mislynching to 1/5 chance of mislynching.
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Post Post #360 (isolation #109) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:26 am

Post by Accountant »

In post 359, Icy wrote:Point is subconscious has no play in Scums mind, they know all players alignments.
They do, but they are not consciously thinking of this when they make posts. They are pretending to be clueless.
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Post Post #362 (isolation #110) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 3:34 am

Post by Accountant »

Actually, I think Mina banned IC colors. I use red for my first post to make it stand out, but that's it.

If a PR claims and is scum, the real PR would of course counter-claim. Then we lynch between those two, narrowing down our options to a smaller pool.
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Post Post #364 (isolation #111) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 5:25 am

Post by Accountant »

@BlackVoid: Mafia has incentive to sit back and raise their eyebrows and go "this doesn't look right" but not actually do anything to stop it vs Icy trying to counterwagon on PP
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Post Post #374 (isolation #112) » Wed Oct 05, 2016 3:14 pm

Post by Accountant »

I'm vanilla town as well. Icy is confirmed.

scarlet: Probably so you can say "if I was scum I wouldn't have killed PP, therefore I am not scum".

It's interesting that you think scum thought PP was investigative. Firstly, at the start of Night 2 town has NO WAY of knowing if the PR is a jailkeeper or tracker. But scum DOES have a way - if they know they have a roleblocker, they know for sure the last town is tracker. Are you scum who
subconsciously
knows that the PR is investigative before Icy revealed?

Because I thought PP was killed as he was the most experienced player bar me, and I was an obvious mislynch target. Why did YOU think that, scarlet?
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Post Post #377 (isolation #113) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:16 am

Post by Accountant »

Scarlet is definitely scum, but BlackVois's eagerness to lynch her surprised me, hence the "maybe I'm wrong about you comment". The other possibility is Shadow-Scarlet. Either way, Scarlet is scum.
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Post Post #378 (isolation #114) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:16 am

Post by Accountant »

Investigating the possibility of Shadow-Void but gut says nk
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Post Post #379 (isolation #115) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:16 am

Post by Accountant »

no*
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Post Post #382 (isolation #116) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 4:34 am

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What part, Shadow? And why the hell are you disheartened if you think I'n scum? You should be like "I knew it! Accountant is scum and THIS PROVES IT" not "woe is me, accountant didn't respond"

Let's wrap this up, please.

VOTE: Scarlet

If I am town and Scarlet is also town scum will quickhammer. I am going to sleep now. If there's no game over when I wake up then it's either me or scarlet.
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Post Post #384 (isolation #117) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 4:48 am

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Not really - at least two others have said they think I'm scum, which is enough for a lynch today.
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Post Post #386 (isolation #118) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:00 am

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I just ISOed you and found the post I "ignored". I did the opposite of sweeping it under the rug - I only focused on the bits that actually said I was scum. Nevertheless, you seem to want me to respond to it in full, so I'll do so.
Posts 114 and 116 were the first examples; in 114 he openly tried to lead blackvoid to an icy vote, and if he and void are scumbuddies, this reads as more menacing. In 116, you respond to a pretty well thought out post by Icy by saying that everything Icy said was a lie, thus carrying on his attack without needing to actually respond to the post.
Post 184 is terrifying, because he openly admits that he doesn't mind a derphammer on Huntress, which doesn't sit right with me, and it shouldn't for any town player. Derphammers make the day end, and that deprives a huge amount of potential information from the town, and generally just makes the game favor a Mafia win. Post 187 follows this with a call for trust, but the issue of a quick hammer isn't about trust, it's about what's good for town. Post 224 Accountant: "If Huntress flips town, I want everyone to lynch me tomorrow." This feels like reverse psychology, almost put here so that you could say later "why would scumAccountant say this?" With the answer being, because it works as a way to clear him. Doing the opposite of what we would expect so that we trip up and he gets away with it. Posts 256/261 are subtle, but show a sense of gloating, he didn't answer because he had Huntress at his mercy.
In 114 I thought Icy was scum. Hence, leading BV to vote Icy isn't scummy.

116, I meant what I said. I challenged Icy to prove me wrong, and if any of his arguments had any substantiation whatsoever he would have done so.

184, Huntress was confirmed scum in my eyes, so talking more about whether or not she was scum was useless to me. Talking about who her partner is is impossible when people are arguing about the first point and yelling about preflip associatives. Lynch her, let her flip red, sort everything out, then go into D3 and we can think about who her partner is. That was my thought process.

Post 187, see above.

Post 224, already addressed. You claim I was setting up "why would accountant say this?", but the first thing out of my mouth was "that was all a fucking lie".

251: Why wouldn't town gloat upon lynching their strongest scumread?
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Post Post #387 (isolation #119) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:00 am

Post by Accountant »

You aren't exactly a firebrand yourself shadow
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Post Post #469 (isolation #120) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:52 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 400, BlackVoid wrote:@Accountant, can you go over what exactly changed your mind on Icy during D2 where you realized he was town?
I usually take a step back and reevaluate my reads when I feel like I'm diving deep onto someone and I'm not getting anything done. Sometimes it's a clue I'm confirmation bias diving onto town.
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Post Post #470 (isolation #121) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:00 pm

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Oh wait the game ended hahaha
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Post Post #471 (isolation #122) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:00 pm

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Check the IC confessional for thoughts about pushing Huntress. I have no regrets.
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Post Post #473 (isolation #123) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:18 pm

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I don't feel the hammer on Huntress was sketchy. I would have done the same.
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Post Post #476 (isolation #124) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:25 pm

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In post 464, mhsmith0 wrote:Part of what should have suggested accountant/huntress was town-town was that no one seemed all that interested in taking that possibility seriously. Scum have no incentive to engage with that possibility; it's the responsibility of other townies to really dig into whether it's a fight north defusing.
That's why I thought Icy was town.
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Post Post #478 (isolation #125) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:27 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 468, Transcend wrote:
In post 455, Icy wrote:Good game folks. Seems really unfair to play against 3 scum when your only looking for 2. Maybe someday I'll play a game with Accountant and actually trust him!
:lol:

he has solid scum play tho ;)
Optimal scum Accountant play against Icy is to draw/bait him into a long back and forth(similar to Day 2 but with him on the aggressive side) that makes him look silly or stubborn, especially if I'm playing with people that have already seen me and Icy interact in other games.
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Post Post #481 (isolation #126) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:56 pm

Post by Accountant »

In post 479, mhsmith0 wrote:I'll probably say that the vote/leave bit on d3 wasn't optimal. Like, if that's a scam run just to see if people will react then MAYBE it's ok, but it's pretty early in the day to potentially make a game-ending vote I think.
Call it a quirk of my playstyle - I believe it's important for town to find something they can hammer on and throw down the gauntlet. I did it for Huntress and I did it for Scarlet.
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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Post Post #483 (isolation #127) » Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:00 pm

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That's what makes it exciting, mhsmith! It's like going all in in a game of poker!f
There's nothing that says that a fake can't beat the real thing.

You must not imagine that for beings like you and us there can be laughter. The low men laugh, and we envy them. But for us, the higher ones, there is no laughter, only an unending vigil, purely serious, stretching on into the night.
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