Newbie 1744 - Game Over

[JasonWazza]

VOTE: SpyreX

I was looking forward to playing with Thor you imposter.

[JasonWazza]

I stated my reason, why do you feel the need to defend him?

[JasonWazza]

That's hardly a reason.

It is very much my reason, do you have any better reason i could have made a vote before post 10?

If so, what would be the reasoning, and who would it be on?

If you want to argue that my reasoning on page 1 is bad, then by all means, come to me with a better reason to vote someone, and i will join you on that.

[JasonWazza]

@Gideon / HS
I'd like to get every new player's first post and then we can get to your questions.

Why do you feel the need to delay this game until people are posting?

UNVOTE: Spyrex
VOTE: Copper223

This is a real vote, not an RVS vote btw.

There is no reason to delay any sorts of reasons you may have this early.

[JasonWazza]

There is no reason to delay any sorts of reasons you may have this early.

There sure is as some of the players don't appear to know what RVS is, making this phase more interesting.

How do you come to the conclusion that there was no possible reason for me wanting to wait?

Please explain to me how new players not understanding what RVS is, actually catches scum.

Let alone why you think new players are going to be affected by this information that you are delaying.

[JasonWazza]

And now your just using a shitty question to avoid my question.

[JasonWazza]

How the fuck does that make me a VI?

Your question is irrelevant to any discussion, and is a fucking strawman at best.

The fact that you think hiding RVS from the new players is actually a good thing is just terrible, it may not be alignment indicative, but it's terrible from a newbie game standard, we are in a newbie game, deciding your just going to hide what RVS is, isn't a good thing.

[JasonWazza]

Your question is irrelevant to any discussion, and is a fucking strawman at best.

My question was very relevant, because I wanted to know if this is scum jumping at the first thing they see or if you're a VI (as per the above description).

Trying to find scum is either me being scum, or me being a VI.

Logic/10

[JasonWazza]

The fact that you think hiding RVS from the new players is actually a good thing is just terrible

Can you show me where Copper did this?

Newbies posting without knowing about RVS may be revealing because it's a situation where the town and scum win-cons lead to different incentives on how to react, namely newbie townies are more likely to want to understand what is going on.

[JasonWazza]

The best strategy to win as town I know is to have a frank discussion with everyone and try to collaborate to reach an agreement on the player we want to flip while being rationally critical of each other's statements, Wazza there seemed just interested in scoring points and demonstrated from the start he had 0 interest in a back and forth, that's why I said in that context he could be behaving like a VI, or he is scum starting a bad tunnel.

Having tested him I think he is town.

Why is it that i am a VI simply because i don't believe in "collaborating to reach an agreement"

I play as a headstrong player, that doesn't make me an idiot.

[JasonWazza]

I need to read up because i have been active in another game and neglecting this one.

[JasonWazza]

Jason was very aggressive on the wall page between him and Copper. I don't believe he had to be that aggressive at that stage and so early on in the game.

@Jason, since Copper has voiced his opinion on your alignment after the discussion, what are your thoughts on Copper's alignment?

For the first part, what do you think my aggression means in terms of my alignment?

Second part i will likely get to before i finish this post, if it's still in bold i fucked up and forgot.

Nevermind it didn't end up happening below, i feel Copper is a scum lean and probably my personal top scum read, his not doing anything to actually put his neck out and is staying extremely safe with his reads.

Yes there's no need for a hammer at this point.

Remember when i was talking about reaction tests? This is a baby version of that.

P-edit: I'm engaged, but deep meaningful content will come much later. If copper is the 'leader' I'll be the 'observer' for the time being

I don't like this post, SpyreX is just trying to keep himself from commiting to anything.

Can 2 IC's or and IC and SE both be scum, while every newbie is townie?

While possible it's fairly unlikely

Jason, I understand you haven't been at your computer (to my knowledge) since I last asked, but what is your perspective on Toto?

I don't know about Toto for now, he is new, which makes reading him a little harder (as it does with all of you.) but i would honestly say he is a very slight town lean if anything.

[JasonWazza]

@Copper if you were to be flipped scum, who do you think would be your partner?

And yes this is a serious question.

[JasonWazza]

Copper feels town
Spy feels scum
SmoothBlue also feels scum.

UNVOTE: Copper223

VOTE: Smoothblue

(Also i do appologize for my inactivity in this game, it's a mixture of work, and not managing my time on here well.)

[JasonWazza]

@All
The fact SB is going through the thread sequentially and answering questions before reading up till the end makes me think he is town

Yes lets use player tells for alignment.

It's a player by player thing, not something that is dependant on alignment.

[JasonWazza]

@Spyre
You did make some really good points about Jason that I missed, so I am re-reading that today.

Also what points does he have?

I rolled my eyes and didn't bother responding, because again, it's using player tells to try and determine alignment.

[JasonWazza]

If you are scum, you want your reads to help you out, the more you know about the thread the likelier it is you can formulate a good strategy, that means you are incentivized to read everything before you post, which is not the case when someone asks you a question as town, there you just need to tell them what you think, not reading before replying is therefore not just a play-stile quirk often enough for it to be a tell (I've also had quite a lot of success with it).

The good points Spyre mentions were about you pushing something that was pretty far from what actually happened, why did you decide I was town after all coming back from your break?

First part, while that is true, not reading the thread first before posting

doesn't

mean town.

What your trying to use is something that would be a player tell (IE. Something a player always does) as an alignment tell.

Reading and posting based on what you have read (post by post), is by no means an alignment tell, just the same as reading everything all at once isn't an alignment tell.

As for why i think you are town, i re-read all the interactions and realized it's just a clashing of player styles that was giving me the gut feeling of you being scum, there has been more since then and reading it all, it feels like you are town.

[JasonWazza]

And you can't call it an alignment tell without knowing his meta.

And thus we are at an impasse, where we don't use the tell cause it's shit.

[JasonWazza]

Wait what did i say?

[JasonWazza]

I'm also interested in his next post, cause his reaction when I brought up the quote makes me think he doesn't believe it's relevant in this context.

Oh no i 100% believe it and think it applies, the way you worded it just sounded really odd. (mostly because you left off the part of me saying to see the reactions.)

[JasonWazza]

To be fair he did say activity is lower on the weekends. And we lose nothing by waiting.
That also doesnt mean we need to stagnate.

I'll admit while I'm happy with this lynch, seeing 6 bodies willing including all three experienced bodies makes me worried some. This isn't a slam dunk wagon by any means and an early bus in any of these setups is a high risk maneuver.

So I'd start thinking about what should happen if this is a town flip.

Why does all 3 experienced players being on this matter?

[JasonWazza]

UNVOTE: SmoothBlue