Micro 675: Heroes of the Storm uPick - Game Over!

[Syryana]

VOTE: Aj the Epic

Wagering millers must die.

[Syryana]

NOTTY!

*glomp*

BORK!

*glomp*

It was Tarot mafia. Where I got to pretend to be Nacho and you all sheeped me

[Syryana]

I'm not opposed to the idea but I think it should definitely be unanimous before we do it

[Syryana]

Nice catch, notty.

*hugs*

VOTE: Charloux

CHOO CHOO MOTHAFUCKAZ

[Syryana]

Bork.

Shoo.

[Syryana]

You people really suck at reaction tests.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Dunnstral

Bork, you can unshoo now.

[Syryana]

reaction tests.

So when you get called out, it's a reaction test?

[Syryana]

How was dunn's reaction so different from mine that you find him scummy and (presumably) not me

Notty's point was idiotic. (I love you notty but it's true). I immediately jumped on it for a couple of reasons. One, I wanted to see what would happen, e.g. who else jumped on, who called me out, etc. Two, I wanted to see what Charloux did with a little pressure. Results: Charloux = town, Dunn = explained below, Oxford is getting a squinty eyed glare from me.

Now, as to Dunn vs. you. I'm not finding Dunn scummy because he thought the Notty thing was silly. I'm voting him because of the following:

Feel free to start an early wagon that isn't based off a disgusting misrep. You should be wagoning one of sekio and Syryana.

Where's the vote? Pretty strong words with nothing to back it up. Are disgusting misreps not scummy anymore? He even goes so far as to say who someone else should be wagoning. That's the part that really got me.

Answer your question, bork?

[Syryana]

Iono I'll reread Oxford later

Raiding now

[Syryana]

What in the actual FUCK people?

STOP FUCKING CLAIMING.

[Syryana]

You don't seem fazed at all by my claim. Shouldn't it change the basis of your case on me?

It's less I'm unfazed by your claim and more I had to walk away to not flame the fuck out of all the claimers.
UNVOTE:

[Syryana]

at best it says he thinks town have reasons to lie in a mass flavorclaim, or any massclaim at all and that needs to be addressed now rather than later. Town have no reason to lie. At all.

You and your partner have played far far far too many games for me to believe you actually mean this.

VOTE: Seiko x Naomi

[Syryana]

I'd rather hash it personally.

[Syryana]

I feel like I have questions for pie but I can't think of them and I'm busy for an hour or so

[Syryana]

The reason I didn't wanna Bork to call Syr town without a good reasonsies is cos if Syr is scum he can fake town and bowl over Bork!!!! That's not good! We hafta be careful about who's town and who's just a null read!!

Seiko is not scum!! I don't understand why ya say she's scum bork

Why are you so convinced Seiko is town? You've spent the whole game trying to convince bork that I've done nothing that couldn't be faked whereas Seiko (which consists of two players that I consider better mafia players than I am) is solid town. What have they done that's not fakeable?

[Syryana]

AJ's 181 feels really forced and is very similar to the kinds of pushes I like to make when I'm scum: find some read that someone has that you can nitpick on and call them scum because "I don't see the logic behind their read" (I'm pretty sure notty remembers when I pulled this on him in a game where he was being dumb wrt a scum read on Tammy once). there are scenarios where someone does have a read that is legitimately off and is worth pushing over, but bork's read doesn't seem incongruous at all

I read AJ's post and it seems more like "bork I disagree that TOBs trajectory was logical because *reasons*" rather than "bork is scum because he's calling TOBs trajectory not shit".

Bork, thoughts?

[Syryana]

instead of analyzing the claims or writing them off as jokes he just goes into "generic well behaved townie mode" to denounce them.

I was pissy and started yelling before thinking.

I don't really get any scumvibes from AJ thus far

He's making me suspicious, but I'd rather not elaborate on the why right now

Also there's a post somewhere about you liking S_S I think, talk to me about S_S?

1. "so I find this post a bit odd on re-read" is a very, very, very, very weak way of stating that he feels TOB is scum/that he disagrees with your read. I think regardless of how he does it, town-him would come straight up and say something along the lines of "I disagree with bork's read" or "I don't like how they handled the Charl wagon", aka anything where he takes a firm stance either way on it. the way he did it doesn't feel like he's trying to make any wave in the game, it's really reminiscent of the kinds of posts I see scum making when they want to interject themselves into the conversation in a way that looks natural and doesn't draw too much attention onto themselves.

Piegirl <3

I'm not going to take a stance on the wagon unless I explicitly feel you're town or scum.

Is there anybody you DO feel is explicitly town or scum? Or are even leaning in that direction? (also fyi Seiko is Notty and Pie, not penguin)

UNVOTE:

[Syryana]

I unvoted Seiko.

[Syryana]

I just said I didn't find him scummy. It's on this page.

My bad, skimming @ work = dumb

Is there anybody you DO feel is explicitly town or scum? Or are even leaning in that direction? (also fyi Seiko is Notty and Pie, not penguin)

possible negative association between AJ/Seiko here

Maybe I'm being dumb but I'm sort of confused as to what you're saying here

[Syryana]

I can agree with that. Never would've gotten that from how you phrased it though lol

[Syryana]

VOTE: Aj The Epic

[Syryana]

It's spelled "bated breath."

I

like

this one, bork. Can we keep her a while?

[Syryana]

Gimme like 30 mins

[Syryana]

What are your reads now
What made you vote AJ?

Reads:

Town: Oxford, you
Leantown: Seiko, Dunnstral (this one is stagnating a little too but not as much as charleyhorse)
Was town or leantown but read is stagnating a lot: Charloux
No idea: S_S, Obvious Alt
!Town: Aj

Why vote AJ? A lot of it's gut. Some of it is that I feel he's said a fair number of words without actually saying anything. The whole PL thing was fluffy as fuck and basically led nowhere. The only thing of substance I see in his ISO is the Dunn thing but meh because he was in that game. I also still hate his 181 and he hasn't actually mentioned TOB since. (Actually I lied he said something about them in 231 but that means his whole schtick with them went nowhere so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯)

[Syryana]

What can I say, I'm a polarizing kind of guy

As for the same-y reads, I probably wouldn't get alarmed unless we end up mislynching today. Then shit gets real

[Syryana]

I'm open to a TOB-alogue with you notty

[Syryana]

some weird shit is going on.

QFT

[Syryana]

Because the timing on this counterwagon is weird AF.

[Syryana]

What scenarios are you theorizing here

There's a lot going on in my head right now. I'm going to try to put some order to it by putting out some facts before I posit theories.

Fact: AJ is at L-1.
Fact: You believe AJ is town (for undisclosed reasons) and that S_S is scum (also for undisclosed reasons).
Fact: OA immediately jumps on.

This is where we enter the thorny thickets of guesswork, paranoia and insanity. Given the above three facts I thought something along the lines of the following:

"Is this a scum-driven counterwagon to AJ? If so, which is the partner? Is Dunn the ballsiest partner ever? Is OA the laziest partner ever?"
"Am I wrong about Aj? Do we have two wagons on scum? *insert various other thoughts about AJ/Dunn/OA alignment and the connotations thereof*

So the takeaway from this is I'm really interested to hear what Dunn has to say on S_S and AJ. I also think this wagon is town driven/motivated. This basically leaves me entertaining the idea that AJ may be town. Jury's still out on OA; I think that jump reasoning is shitawful.

If there was going to be a scum counterpush to me here, wouldn't that happen BEFORE bork votes, not after?

This is one of the reasons why I said the timing was weird.

PEDIT X INFINITY GODDAMNIT

[Syryana]

Yes. Now I won't be posting thoughts for a bit because I'm at work and can't concentrate on two things at once bai2u

[Syryana]

the point isn't necessarily the alignments of the people being wagoned, but the impetus for pushing their scumreads now and not before -- that impetus being a change in the gamestate regarding someone they're not voting (me) -- meaning agendas, instead of something their scumread did to change the read -- which would mean scumhunting.

Yeah it's really weird all round, hence why my head started spinning earlier.

I doubt it's Dunn/OA, but neither looks really good from this. I did beetlejuice Dunn which does explain why he acted when he did, but still

IMO OA looks worse than Dunn. I know the timing of the wagon is utter shit with it happening when it did and ultimately the reasoning for AJ-town is pretty lame (I'll deal with that in a minute) but I have this really strong feeling that Dunn isn't scum for it. It just feels really genuine to me I guess.

For aj I don't have stuff to point out specifically, though I liked his use of meta on me and I liked his reads: his read on shadow seems to be that he hasn't played with him enough and he seems good on a surface level which is understandable, I wouldn't say his vote on obvious alt is misplaced because aside from the lurky lurk thing they were fluffing to start

The meta thing is NAI to me. The rest of this just says that you think AJ is town because gut, basically.

What did this mean? Which wagon is town driven/motivated and why does that make AJ town?

Wagon = AJ wagon. Also, it doesn't. However, that other people (well, you really) I think are town are disagreeing with me on AJ at the eleventh hour makes me entertain the possibility I might be wrong about AJ.

That said, I haven't seen anything in your explanations that convinces me that I've missed something or misinterpreted something, so vote stays.

[Syryana]

i guess overall maybe if we had more people willing to act like goddamn human beings and engage in natural dialog and i didn't have double the posts of the next person i might be able to poe the game more than i currently can

I mean to be fair I've engaged in plenty of natural dialogue with you and you still haven't figured out I'm town.

I mean it's really irrelevant because if OA is scum, Syr is partner, not S_S. OA outright townreads Syr, Syr's opinion is leanscum/null but has that post where he appeals to keep OA, even if it's more a joke than anything else. While he calls the OA jump bad, he's still using it as an incrimination to me. If I flip town, guess what? OA's not my partner, which was the basis of the post in 375 for either Dunn or OA (dunn == ballsiest partner ever, OA == laziest partner). And he's not sure of me, thinks OA looks worse than Dunn but won't move.

To me, this is the cut/dry partner to OA, not S_S

So, unvoting a scumread to follow that scumread onto another almost-as-scum read makes me...scum?

[Syryana]

VOTE: OA

Nottybork I'll be able to chat properly in an hour or so

But my thoughts are above

[Syryana]

So, what'd I miss

[Syryana]

I still would love for TOB to swing.

Maybe.

[Syryana]

eh, fine. overall i am seriously still paranoid of syryana, although this post didn't increase it.

I don't really understand your paranoia, I'm not this good at scum

Particularly in light of the fact this would be my first scum game in like 2 years

[Syryana]

I don't think Syryana has done enough to make them believe that you should townread them and be annoyed that you aren't. It's also partly the phrasing. I've seen scum say the same thing almost word for word before.

This would be true if you didn't know me as well as bork/pie/notty do, which is why I said it to bork and not to you

Pedit: this good meaning able to fake my towngame this well

[Syryana]

No way in hell scum-syry tries to go toe to toe with town-me and town-pie.

I love you too notty

FTR I'd be lurkfucking so hard atm if I were against youpieborktown

Pedit: It means I'm willing to talk to notty bout it if we don't get to some kind of compromise in the next two days and I don't know what the fuck innocent child means in this context

Pedit2: played, modded, followed games I've been in, my scumgame sucks and I overjustify literally everything or just lurk to death

[Syryana]

Spoiler: borkwords from 501

you're both right and wrong:

VOTE: Seiko x Naomi

You alive ns?

Also consider my vote serious now because why the fuck not

TOB's push on Syr is terrible, but I am not sure that it is terrible in a scummy way. I want an explanation for their town read on OA, though.

I don't have any town read on Dunn; I don't have any issues with the bulk of his push on us (save potentially the post bork pointed out), but it's nowhere near unfakeable.

AJ's 128 is really underwhelming and since notty seems to be gone/not have a vote down I'm going ahead and voting here.

Yeah ultimately I think this is all just kind of a bunch of "hey look I'm scumhunting" when actually it's not saying anything useful or attempting to get past the fact that it doesn't draw any salient conclusions.

VOTE: Seiko x Naomi

i got off later when my read change, but syr actually followed me around like a puppy on your slot pretty much the whole time

Ufuckingwotm8

I voted dunn off my reaction test for good freakin reason 50 then moved over to Seiko once it was established that Dunn had a reason for not voting 125 because notty came back and said he actually believed all that tripe about town never having reason to lie etc. You didn't even move to SxN until like 40 posts later. Granted I didn't move OFF from SxN until after you did but my bad for not posting while at work.

[Syryana]

my point is it's rare that i've really had to read you.

Alright, I'll grant you this

So place faith in notty's rockhardsyristown boner, because he's right

[Syryana]

I'll try really hard to stop fuck pissity shit ballsing you

I'm sorry, it's a work in progress

[Syryana]

I'll be frank I wasn't particularly impressed with his exchange with Shadow

I didn't really like either of them in that exchange

Pedit: Beeeeeetlejuice

[Syryana]

Bork, you want some more from me to be less paranoid

Ask me shit, fire away

[Syryana]

IT was intended to show I found the timing funny, not alignment indicative

[Syryana]

I'd rather lynch someone that has a reasonable chance of being scum, charlie boy.

[Syryana]

It is time.

VOTE: Shadow_step

[Syryana]

Fullclaim TIA

[Syryana]

????????
I don't have multiple abilities. I'm just a town bodyguard.
Flavor is Medivh.

I refuse to believe you have a role PM that says you're Medivh, town bodyguard. My PM has character, character flavor title, ability name, etc.

[Syryana]

Somewhat questionable matching with flavor imo, medivh's W is a temporary damage nullification barrier on a player. I don't see how that fits bodyguard.

He's got plenty of options for investigative with raven form or blocking with either poly bomb or ley line seal, commute or redirect w/ portal.
bodyguard of all things for medivh seems really weird

This is a reasonable statement, but I'm more in tune with your earlier line of thought that Foxy had roles and fit picks to roles.

[Syryana]

@Mod: you have 2 entries for Persivul in your vc

In other news I feel like I'm sitting in a corner blowing raspberries for all the good I'm doing here. I'm going to throw the contents of my brain at a wall and see what you lot make of it.

UNVOTE: for now.

Let's consolidate some shit here. People that aren't getting lynched today because of role reasons (not necessarily the only reason but etc):

Dunn - voted Seiko which will do good things tomorrow
S_S - claimed Medivh: bodyguard
Persivul - Will become obviously town tomorrow
Charloux - wants to be lynched because his ability is pro-town (not quite the same under the premise I started this list for but w/e)

So that leaves me, bork, Seiko, TOB, Aj. I'm not voting bork or Seiko. Aj I rather thought redeemed himself somewhat in the last few pages. That leaves TOB.

That said, I'm not supremely confident in a TOB lynch. I like the Raven head of it anyways. (I really should ISO just that head later, note to self)

That list leaves me with either an {Aj, TOB} scumteam (meeeeh), or at least one of the people in the role list is lying. If I had to pick a person in the list it'd probably be Persivul because the only reason I'm not voting him is the softclaim.

Seiko, bork, where are your heads at?

Fixed the VC.

[Syryana]

I still a little want to lynch shadow because bodyguard medivh is really hamfisted

does anyone else's role not match their ability in HOTS well? Mine is fine.

Mine is fine also.

I did think his reaction to you and I postclaim was pretty genuine though.

[Syryana]

Bork

I did think his reaction to you and I postclaim was pretty genuine though.

Your thoughts?

[Syryana]

i don't really know what else to do at this point is my thoughts

Come blow raspberries in the corner with meeeeeeeee

[Syryana]

Beeeetlejuice

[Syryana]

You rang, pie?

[Syryana]

There's just no pleasing you is there bork

[Syryana]

Well, yippee for piescience.

[Syryana]

You rang, pie?

I don't really need anything in particular, except you plan on voting Persi with us, right?

That's the idea. Kind of wanted the hammer for personal reasons, but meh.

VOTE: Persivul

[Syryana]

syr

Hi

I answered this before you ever asked

Bye

[Syryana]

I'll be around in an hour or so

[Syryana]

pie, notty especially: I still feel like syr's play is mostly feeling out what everyone thinks around him and strategically voting vs actually attempting to solve the game.

I'll be honest; recent games have taught me that I have no clue how to play forum mafia anymore.

1) if he thinks seiko is town he can't possibly think this is good things at this point (could possibly mean that it shows dunn's alignment, as even i once thought, but dunn himself waved this off forever ago in 415)

I thought it was going to give Seiko an extra vote or something, I don't remember seeing anything to suggest otherwise?

Leantown: Seiko, Dunnstral (this one is stagnating a little too but not as much as charleyhorse)

why was dunn ever on the same tier as seiko here esp after pie's big post that got me (and ostensibly syr) to see that they were town

Because though piegirl made me feel better about the slot I didn't have them as a fullblown townread until notty came in later and obvtowned like a motherfucker. Piescum can eat my lunch and make me foot the bill, notty can't

Pedit: bork you're doing that thing you accused someone (Dunn I think?) of doing yesterday where you're fitting evidence to a conclusion

Dunn went from obvscum to obvtown once he claimed. The read stagnated significantly between my unvote and readslist, hence the tier as was

also the implicit "let's make sure we lynch charloux first"

At the time I would've lynched Charl over Dunn, yes.

[Syryana]

And what the hell Pers

[Syryana]

I'm talking about your reasons for me-scum.

Pedit: Yes, obvtown.

[Syryana]

Because you're wrong.

[Syryana]

What was obvtown about dunn

I'll have to go look, sec

[Syryana]

Yes

[Syryana]

you're accusing me of fitting evidence to a conclusion, not following evidence to the wrong conclusion. why?

Six of one, half a dozen of the other imo. I don't think the evidence I've left in thread should lead to the conclusion you arrived at.

Re: dunn, I thought once the vote thing was claimed it put his actions during the reaction test into a good town perspective, i.e. calling out the bads for being bad (me, notty). I didn't like him not putting his money where his mouth was which seemed suspicious but that's a rehash of all that stuff so etc.

Pedit (900): I thought he changed his mind on Seiko hence why he gave his vote power thing to them

[Syryana]

they are definitely not six of one half dozen of the other.

the latter sentence: i mean you're going to say a variant of this as either alignment so i don't know what to say to this other than it isn't helping me see that i'm wrong

I guess it's too fine a point for me right now. It just seems to me like you have this gut feeling I'm scum and you're seeing things in a way I never imagined someone seeing them I guess. I don't know how to help you see you're wrong. If I did I'd be doing that instead of whatever the hell it is I'm doing right now.

Pedit (904): It's between pers and TOB, I came around on Aj yesterday during the final stages

[Syryana]

So bork, I'm leaning Pers at the moment as the final partner. TOB is a POE choice.

As far as Persivul goes I just haven't seen anything from him that says town and the only reason I didn't move to him after S_S yesterday was the softclaim. I don't think being a doublevoter makes you town particularly when it goes away in LyLo. It has to since it doesn't affect the total voting. Last time I saw a doublevoter in LyLo it affected the total number of votes needed for a lynch.

[Syryana]

The guy never met an L-1 wagon he didn't like.

This would be scummy if I didn't have a clear trajectory from A to B to C

[Syryana]

Even after that fake as fuck looking schtick between the two of them like 3 pages ago?

[Syryana]

Let me find something rq

[Syryana]

Through page 10, townie to scummy:

Dunnstral
borkjerfkin
The Oxford Bubbles (due to Raven)
Aj The Epic
Syryana
Charloux
Seiko x Naomi
Shadow_step

Has Dunn as top townread

No, he hasn't been. This is the first time I've played with Dunnstral that he's been doing some focused scum hunting and making me solidly town read him. You're the on who's just throwing shit here.

Okay, on track with why Dunn-town

Just vote Dunn with me. zzzz

I'm considering it. This is the first time he's appeared town to me - maybe that's his scum game? Plus, my D1 reads are usually wrong. But really I'd rather do SXN first, and I'm considering TOB. One head townie, one scummy, one absent.

Then there's this. No mention of Dunn between 614 and this post. Why the turnabout? Furthermore "I'd rather lynch these two people first, then Dunn." His trajectory sucks, man.

The whole rest of his D1 sucks too.

Pedit: I feel the

sarcasm

love, bork

[Syryana]

Also for future reference it's "Bated breath".

[Syryana]

Nope.

[Syryana]

Hi, busy with work so haven't checked in, will probably continue to be busy until this evening

Let me know what we're doing with claims TIA

[Syryana]

[Syryana]

Lol

[Syryana]

I'm distinctly reminded of a certain usage of the word "us"

[Syryana]

My ability doesn't target.

[Syryana]

Wow.

VOTE: The Oxford Bubbles

[Syryana]

I don't know that I even care about the rest of massclaim at this point tbh

[Syryana]

Because literally nothing in your 1009 comes from a town POV.

[Syryana]

Sure.

Chromie, Time Warp, 1-shot governor. Doesn't work in LyLo.

I believe it's your turn?

[Syryana]

Scum found. I know I have to die today, but lynch this tomorrow. I'm so mislynchable that I figured scum would be tempted to push someone other than me. Syry's hoping my self preservation instinct will kick in and I'll use my second vote to hammer TOB.

I was hoping you'd hammer TOB, actually. Then we'd have TOB confirmed town, you confirmed scum, I governate, you die with vengeance and we win the game.

Further, AJ's claim and TOB's claim support each other. Neither makes sense without the other.

Not true. What

does

make sense is that yours and Dunn's powers get balanced out by mine. Hated-maker+public doublevoter - governator = balance?

I honestly was expecting a more explicit interaction from TOB's role. While waiting, I was thinking it was largely Syr just cuz a close-tailored interaction with my role would suggest town because otherwise why the hell would I compulsively target him? I've prodded SxN and Bork respectively trying to see if my role would do anything.

If I understand your last sentence correctly you pick your target and otherwise your role does nothing. Okay.

This seems an appropriate time to explain why I'm voting TOB in a little more detail.

All right. It would be beneficial for everyone to claim whether they have an ability that can directly and intentionally target us before we claim. I don't have a lot of experience with set-up analysis, but I think this is the correct play.
Would everyone be OK with that?

~ Raven

Thank you, Aj. We need to hear from everyone else too. Scum need to be locked into claiming one or the other when the time comes for their full claim.

~ Raven

So we have TOB requesting knowledge of whether folks can target them or not. Reason: locking scum out of false claiming their way out of something. Okay. In my mind they have some kind of investigative result (or lack thereof) involving people targeting them so they can pounce if scum false claim. Reasonable enough.

This is where shit gets dicey.

We're Li Li. Our ability is Fast Feet. If we're targeted by any abilities, we become immune to all abilities the next night. That includes kills.
I wanted people to claim whether or not they could target so it was less likely the Mafia could lie about having activated our ability. I believe Aj's town, so if we're targeted we should be Bulletproof the night following Lylo.

~ Raven

Multitude of problems with this post. First, this ability has no effect on scum or their fakeclaims. If targeted, TOB becomes ability immune at night. How, exactly, does that lock scum out of claiming pretty much anything? Second, none of the claimed abilities or flipped abilities affect town adversely at night. Ergo it I'm going to list the abilities for ease of making my point.

List of flipped/claimed abilities:
Syryana - governor (does not target, merely prevents lynch death) *day ability*
Persivul - controls an ultralisk making him a doublevoter in effect *day ability*
Shadow_Step - Non-consecutive doctor *night ability*
Charloux - Postmortem public cop *night ability*
Dunnstral - delayed effect hated-maker *day ability*
borkjerfkin - Extended role-watcher (Action X happened to person Y, etc) *night ability*
AjTheEpic - Compulsive fruit vendor *night ability*
TOB - if targeted, becomes ability/kill immune the following night *night ability*
Seiko - ??? (not a killing role, whatever it is)

So in short we have a doc, role-watcher, a fruit vendor, a cop and potentially whatever the hell Seiko is. Balance wise TOB's role makes no sense for town to have in context of the game given we already have a flipped doctor. It makes even less sense in that it would be possible to make TOB-town completely immune to any mafia abilities and/or kills for the duration of the game. In a MICRO.

Problem three: The last two sentences of the claim. Quoted below.

I wanted people to claim whether or not they could target so it was less likely the Mafia could lie about having activated our ability. I believe Aj's town, so if we're targeted we should be Bulletproof the night following Lylo.

Literally none of this matters in the current gamestate. Any utility this role may have had went out the window post massclaim.

We've had a lot of posturing from TOB over the last few pages about how their role is town and they need information to stop the Mafia from lying and doing bad things etc. I find it absolutely inconceivable that they could believe that their role in any way could even have utility for town at this point, much less that their statements/claim over the last few pages prevent the town from losing the game. I believe they have some kind of ability that activates when they get targeted (that much I believe) and that they needed to know about it prior to claiming. I think the rest of their posting is an attempt at theater to appear town.

TLDR: TOB is scum because
1. They postured a lot about needing to know things "for the good of the town" when their role as claimed has no effect on the gamestate.
2. Their claimed role makes zero sense balance wise.

[Syryana]

So, you have all that reasoning to scum read TOB, and you voted them...but if I had hammered them, you would have governed them.

Yep. Two quickhammers and you die. Period. End.

In fact I'm not even a fruit vendor. SxN can confirm if they received a note saying they were targeted, but I'm pretty sure not even THAT part gets noted.

P-edit: No using the govern should NOT happen. It puts us in Mylo tomorrow with no flip. Verifying Syr's role exists isn't the point. More of having his claim to note any obvious balance issues.

I'm not planning on using the govern. Also the proof my role exists is already in the thread.

For targeting, I wonder if being governed wouldn't trigger it as well... Bork, myself, Charl, S_S have targeted abilities of some sort right now so there are decent ways to trigger it.

The way my PM is worded implies it doesn't target. I'd ask, but I think the question is largely academic at this point

Also my problem with their role isn't lack of things to trigger it but lack of reason for it to be in the game at all from a town perspective

[Syryana]

Notty, get your sorry ass in here

You too Pie

This game is fuckin dead

[Syryana]

Syryana, in LyLo scum would need to mislynch us to win. If they lied about activating our ability, they wouldn't.

1. Town can activate your ability
2. Whether or not you're bulletproof has no effect on mafia winning after LyLo
3. Mafia does NOT need to lynch you at LyLo to win, regardless of activation
4. Since you've broadcast the target thing it actually made it EASIER for scum to lie

I just don't even at this point

[Syryana]

If we're Bulletproof after LyLo, scum can't shoot us. That should end the game in a draw.

Let's say it's a you, bork, Dunnstral LYLO. Bork gets lynched. You're BP that night because Aj targeted you right? Here's what happens.

1. Scum no kills
2. Next day, no lynch happens because lynch is impossible
3. Scum NKs you, wins game

[Syryana]

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Endgame

[Syryana]

The grass grows under our feet as we await even one half of our lord and savior.

[Syryana]

Do you anticipate notty showing up anytime soon?

[Syryana]

On second thought as we're pretty much at an impasse here I'm going to give notty 24 hours to catch up/post his thoughts then I'll hammer Persi.

[Syryana]

I'll hold him to that.

[Syryana]

What?

[Syryana]

Extending my hammer deadline until tomorrow because fuckit

[Syryana]

Poke.

[Syryana]

Whaddaya want from me, Aj? Gamestate is either I hammer Persi or Seiko hammers TOB. From what I can see the only way TOB hammer happens is if notty gets a super hard on for it and talks pie into it. I'd rather see TOB swing than Persi but I don't see how it happens today.

[Syryana]

Probably onto the next day honestly.

[Syryana]

If you erased today's claim shenanigans I'd hammer Persi. The doublevoter thing, the instant hammer on dunn cutting yesterday short, etc.

Almost makes me want to hammer him anyways, now I think on it.

Almost.

[Syryana]

@Syr, I don't understand why you're so hung up on TOB's posts. I think you're 100% right that their thought process is wrong and stupid, but I don't really see them-scum faking it; I think it's a thought process they either legitimately would have had as town or them as scum doing what they'd do as town (i.e. it's null).

I don't think any of this is anywhere near as much of a tell as shit like Persi straight up trying to oversell his double-vote as a "confirmed town" role back on D1, which has a hell of a lot more scum motivation than this (TOB delayed their full claim so they could... what... have more information for a claim they largely locked themselves into all the way back on D1?).

I'd be continuing to call for Persi votes if not for the fact that notty and I haven't convened in forever and he still isn't caught up with the game.

if I'm missing something, let me know.

Quoting this for later because I want to respond and have a conversation with Pie about this but don't have time atm

[Syryana]

Not... the kill I expected.

[Syryana]

Dead game is dead.

I'ma reread the game tomorrow.

[Syryana]

Hey Pie.

You there?

[Syryana]

Cool.

VOTE: TOB

[Syryana]

Townclaim received.

Let's win this fuckin game man

[Syryana]

Hey pie, if you want something specific from me to aid in your decisionmaking process, ask for it

Otherwise I'ma sit here with my thumb up my ass until said decision is made

[Syryana]

Well shit.

Gg lads n lasses, I got schooled