Newbie 1806 - The Ffery Garden: GAME OVER!

[RadiantCowbells]

Town.
Hi everyone! This is like uhh.
Game.
I am playing the game though.

[RadiantCowbells]

Why was WhyMafia's train better than mine?

Are you really going to expect me to compare the merits of "I don't like spelling cankles" and "ciara stole first post"? The better question is, why are you sufficiently bothered by picking up a 2nd vote to ask a dumb question like that?

Don't like how Mhsmith is 'retaliating' against this

[RadiantCowbells]

There's not much else to say actually since it seems like it was a reaction test of some sort.

Hey Smith, I have 3 reasonably strong townreads and none of them are you. Who are they and why?

[RadiantCowbells]

Hello again!

Also, I have to ask: Why is WhyMafia Mafia?

[RadiantCowbells]

Well I townread the shit out of myself, because I'm town.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: King Cankles

0 relevant content.

[RadiantCowbells]

I only actually had one townread but you were correct in your 3 guesses about that one.

[RadiantCowbells]

Ciara was my townread. I have another townread.

I think Cankles could use more votes.

[RadiantCowbells]

Fykus might actually be scum, idk.

I'm not like scumreading him but.

[RadiantCowbells]

YEAH WE GOT OUR BLACK OPS ALL OVER THE WORLD FROM KAZAKHSTAN TO BOMBAY
PAYING OUR BRIBES LIKE YEAH PLUGGING HTE LEAKS LIKE YEAH

[RadiantCowbells]

I am back!

[RadiantCowbells]

This game is rather slow. I'll try to lead some activity soon.

[RadiantCowbells]

Okay, let's UNVOTE: King Cankles for now.

[RadiantCowbells]

Of course I voted for the biggest wagon. I'm about to get lynched. I'm not sure how that makes me scum? A lynch has to happen in order for us to gain some sort of info. Go ahead and lynch me if you want, but you'll be losing a townie.

This post makes me think he's town actually.

[RadiantCowbells]

Alright so I'm okay with a Fykus lynch.

Fykus, anything you want to say to prevent me from lynching you?

[RadiantCowbells]

There are 8 days left in today's phase. We've got plenty of time.

@Everyone voting one of Fykus/King Cankles: if you think that you're voting scum, who is their partner?

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean the one time I was town with you I played a fairly significant role in preventing House from powerlynching you, so I'm not sure why you'd feel that way.

I mean you've seen me as scum a whole bunch, and I've lynched you as scum, yes. Do you think that I'm scum this game?

[RadiantCowbells]

stfu noob

[RadiantCowbells]

oh you weren't joking.

you were the mod. -grey- is house.

[RadiantCowbells]

Yeah uh Fykus is the only person I'm scumreading right now with any real content but I'd like to see more!

Persephone, what are your thoughts on things

[RadiantCowbells]

Because I'd like to see more content from other people.

[RadiantCowbells]

Because when Fykus gets closer to being wagoned that becomes the main focus of the game rather than exploring other people.

[RadiantCowbells]

FERY GIVE GIF HIS AVATAR BACK

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Fferyllt

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean I could. I think there's plenty to talk about anyway though.

[RadiantCowbells]

why I have so many fucking townreads?

[RadiantCowbells]

My experiences with it recently have suggested that we shouldn't do so. It's good for winrates but it does bad things.

[RadiantCowbells]

Wait a second I just reread the game.

VOTE: Whymafia

PRETTY sure this is scum yo

[RadiantCowbells]

hi im rc

[RadiantCowbells]

Also: @RC wrt WhyMafia:

Interesting. What in particular makes you think he's scum?

hi im rc

[RadiantCowbells]

am town

[RadiantCowbells]

I IS TOWN U STOP THAT.

[RadiantCowbells]

>:[

[RadiantCowbells]

me twon just ask titus

[RadiantCowbells]

Titus: hi am Titus. awkward stuff and something about lawyer and disliking the godfather. RC twon.

ok confirmed

[RadiantCowbells]

don't you ever talk to me or my son ever again

[RadiantCowbells]

fykus why don't you call me God-Emperor RC and sheep my WhyMafia vote.

[RadiantCowbells]

my case on WM is that God-Emperor Radiantcowbells has decreed that the slot is a scumbutt slot

[RadiantCowbells]

don't omgus me

[RadiantCowbells]

I really think that whymafia is scum and I would appreciate more votes there.

[RadiantCowbells]

If you liked that post you're gonna love me.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't necessarily agree that they wouldn't be aligned.

Tbh right now I think that Fykus/Whymafia are scum together but I'm slightly more confident in Whymafia scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah but I just wanted to rc all over the place.

Fine. I'll do it. Give me half an hour first.

[RadiantCowbells]

I disagree with the premise!

[RadiantCowbells]

I would like to start by expressing my wist for the good old days where I could sit here calling someone scum and they would end up dead reasonably quickly.

[RadiantCowbells]

yay

idk I can't relaly put words to it. this is gut.

[RadiantCowbells]

no u

[RadiantCowbells]

I feel like I'm missing something here. Is RC famous for guessing right about scum without being about to explain why or something?

'guessing'

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean it's not exactly difficult to figure out. this is sort of how I deal with gutreads

[RadiantCowbells]

Idk I'm kind of a caricature of myself right now but I just have no idea what to say wrt why I scumread whymafia

[RadiantCowbells]

Why would I want my scumreads not to get lynched?

[RadiantCowbells]

Well at any rate I don't know how to push Whymafia this game. I think he's gonna flip scum. I can't do much more right now.

[RadiantCowbells]

Whymafia isn't getting lynched.
VOTE: Fykus
Second best imo. L-1.

[RadiantCowbells]

Worse wagon than you imo. sorry.

[RadiantCowbells]

No one took my read on whymafia seriously so I had to lynch elsewhere. that's not my fault.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean, if you want support on WM you could try explaining it? Do you think fykus is just blaming you for not staying on WM?

Can't put words to it that I haven't already.

[RadiantCowbells]

Whymafia is always mafia.

P.s sup RC long time no see

You've never completed a game with me

I'm bored so I'm going to OMGUS Fykus
VOTE: Fykus

You always come off as scummy lol. We'll see

Exactly. It sucks :/
I don't understand what's wrong with my tone but I always get scum read for it
Although I don't know what gave you that impression this game ..

These interactions were really weird and they're part of the reason I said they might be SvS

[RadiantCowbells]

Just weird in the way of interactions that are forced? 64 in partuclar looked a bit not scumbuddy to me, like there's some whining and then there's an actual question in it, which seems off the cuff likely to not be how buddies talk barring a good deal of pregame prep (and if THAT was the case, then I'd think they'd have actually done more during the game).

I don't agree.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: WHymafia

[RadiantCowbells]

mhsmith looked really townie, idk why RC scumread them

when did i scumread them

[RadiantCowbells]

I claim 1-shot bulletproof

Town.
Hi everyone! This is like uhh.
Game.
I am playing the game though.

1 word
6 words
1 word
6 words

in newbie 1616 modded by starkmoon I was 1-shot bp

now yall can fuck off.

[RadiantCowbells]

whymafia flips scum, period

wheme you can get lynched too

[RadiantCowbells]

wheme your vote on me was terrible you're not making endgame

[RadiantCowbells]

If there's CC please do so now
UNVOTE: All
You're not infallible RC

you don't get to call me scum for scumreading you then turn around and cry that I'm not infallible

you are getting lynched today. bye.

[RadiantCowbells]

??????????????????????????????

what kind of thought process was that

i had mhsmith0 pinned as pr from very early on. I didn't comment on his slot's alignment since like very early on for a reason

[RadiantCowbells]

why would I try to scumread someone that I thought was pr and draw attention to having a weird read on the slot before they die ??

[RadiantCowbells]

also how much do you want to bet that mhsmith tracked me last night

[RadiantCowbells]

Well first off, because he's scum.

Yall lynched an unendorsed wagon because when someone produces as little content as Whymafia over there it's hard to provide a conclusive case as to why they're scum.
Now that doesn't mean that I'm not conclusively thinking that they're scum- they're just scum.

RC I need something to work with. If you're going to tunnel me, can you at least wait until you formulate something that I can defend against? In addition, why don't you search for my "partner" until you can make a genuine case. You're just wasting time and giving an illusion that you're contributing.

This is hilariously no-town-would-ever-say-this. My vote doesn't change, I'm confirmed town. If you force them to produce a shitton more content maybe there'll be enough that I can provide a case that everyone can understand.
But sorry, Whymafia is currently scummy in a way that no one besides me would ever see and I don't have much to do besides say that they're scum and cite my track record of catching people like this until they get something I can jump on in a way that will make sense to everyone involved in this game rather than just myself.

[RadiantCowbells]

So what's your game plan then? Allow Whymafia to produce no content that's concrete enough to push on him for and ignore me when I call him scum because I can't give you concrete reasons? How's that gonna end?

[RadiantCowbells]

{RC}
{WhaleBarnicle} V town
{Persphone} somewhat town
{King Cankles} scummyish
{Whymafia} very scum

hey look one ofr each category

going to hold off on making any judgements about Wheme and Miles

[RadiantCowbells]

both of them are on the scummy side of the board though

[RadiantCowbells]

I liked Wheme's predecessor but his vote onto me was awful and transitioning from that into lets sheep RC was really, really terrible
Miles's predecessor was terrible. I townread his play on the whole but I'm concerned that there's some intellectual dishonesty going on wrt how he's approaching the Whymafia slot.
I'm not absolutely sure and that read is heavily contingent on a flip from Whymafia but it feels like somethin scum might do to avoid having to pressure their buddy.
Also just like in general him focusing on me as Whymafia's buddy in the way that he has makes a ton of sense because scum usually care more about people focusing on one of them.

[RadiantCowbells]

Also it bears noting that his description of what scum would be doing fits WhyMafia to a T but he ends up focusing on WhaleBarnicle who is super towny instead and it's just ???

[RadiantCowbells]

Like the analysis is decent-ish and I could totally see it coming from town but him not wanting to consider Whymafia scum when based off of his own reasoning the slot is vscum is just ??

[RadiantCowbells]

Cankles, Persephone, and Cowbell is town
I'll look at the remaining three

cankles why town

[RadiantCowbells]

Hi!

I'm sorry that I shut down conversation. It wasn't my intention and I got really frustrated that I was getting wagoned when I thought that I was obvtown.

Can I get a readslist with reasons from eveyrone?

[RadiantCowbells]

I kind of have no idea what's going on anymore but whatever here's my reads list.

RC: Confirmed town. Moving on.

Whale: Was towny yesterday; keeping up the same attitudes and activities now. Almost too towny really :p

Cankles: No data since yesterday, default to my previous townread. Reactions to wagon yesterday were town despair not scum despair.

Miles: I don't know if he has a scummy tone or a towny tone, but he sure has a Tone. I wish this wasn't his first game so I could know if he always talks like this. Analysis looks good but he kind of looks like he's showing off? Works out to slightly scummy I think. Really wish I had meta.

WM: RC's opinion counts for something. Tone looks increasingly bad to me but that's probably me being impressionable so I'll just fold it into RC. Other than that, no evidence really. Scummier than most other people I guess.

Wheme: Flippant votes, opportunism and no content. Not even doing that good a job trying to look busy. Trollish self vote. And like all of Ciara's very few semi-contentful posts were scummy too. Seriously, lynch this slot.

VOTE: WhemeStar That's L-1, at least until he takes off his stupid self-vote.

this vote makes me feel like Whymafia/Persephone might be a thing

[RadiantCowbells]

UR VOTECOUNT IS MESSED UP

also UNVOTE: for a bit

[RadiantCowbells]

I kind of have no idea what's going on anymore but whatever here's my reads list.

RC: Confirmed town. Moving on.

Whale: Was towny yesterday; keeping up the same attitudes and activities now. Almost too towny really :p

Cankles: No data since yesterday, default to my previous townread. Reactions to wagon yesterday were town despair not scum despair.

Miles: I don't know if he has a scummy tone or a towny tone, but he sure has a Tone. I wish this wasn't his first game so I could know if he always talks like this. Analysis looks good but he kind of looks like he's showing off? Works out to slightly scummy I think. Really wish I had meta.

WM: RC's opinion counts for something. Tone looks increasingly bad to me but that's probably me being impressionable so I'll just fold it into RC. Other than that, no evidence really. Scummier than most other people I guess.

Wheme: Flippant votes, opportunism and no content. Not even doing that good a job trying to look busy. Trollish self vote. And like all of Ciara's very few semi-contentful posts were scummy too. Seriously, lynch this slot.

VOTE: WhemeStar That's L-1, at least until he takes off his stupid self-vote.

How am I opportunistic

I'm talking mostly about the badly justified WM vote coming right in the middle of RC's wagon on him. Can you explain your reasoning for that? Also the out of nowhere RC vote at the beginning. Again, explain? Because it looks like you don't care much who you lynch.

I thought that you agreed that WhyMafia was likely scum: why are you pushing people for pushing him?

[RadiantCowbells]

I kind of have no idea what's going on anymore but whatever here's my reads list.

RC: Confirmed town. Moving on.

Whale: Was towny yesterday; keeping up the same attitudes and activities now. Almost too towny really :p

Cankles: No data since yesterday, default to my previous townread. Reactions to wagon yesterday were town despair not scum despair.

Miles: I don't know if he has a scummy tone or a towny tone, but he sure has a Tone. I wish this wasn't his first game so I could know if he always talks like this. Analysis looks good but he kind of looks like he's showing off? Works out to slightly scummy I think. Really wish I had meta.

WM: RC's opinion counts for something. Tone looks increasingly bad to me but that's probably me being impressionable so I'll just fold it into RC. Other than that, no evidence really. Scummier than most other people I guess.

Wheme: Flippant votes, opportunism and no content. Not even doing that good a job trying to look busy. Trollish self vote. And like all of Ciara's very few semi-contentful posts were scummy too. Seriously, lynch this slot.

VOTE: WhemeStar That's L-1, at least until he takes off his stupid self-vote.

How am I opportunistic

I'm talking mostly about the badly justified WM vote coming right in the middle of RC's wagon on him. Can you explain your reasoning for that? Also the out of nowhere RC vote at the beginning. Again, explain? Because it looks like you don't care much who you lynch.

I thought that you agreed that WhyMafia was likely scum: why are you pushing people for pushing him?

Sometimes scum accuses scum? Sometimes you can tell when that's happening by how the accusation is done? Am I missing something?

You're missing that it feels like you're chainsaw voting Whemestar in response to him voting WhyMafia.
It feels really bad that you agreed with me on WhyMafia scum but haven't addressed it and are pushing people voting him.

[RadiantCowbells]

this push on wheme is roflcakes

[RadiantCowbells]

The game is only stalled in the sense that I'm letting you get your thoughts out before I slit Whymafia's throat and tie him up with bricks and throw him into the river.

[RadiantCowbells]

So as to the last line: yes.

For the record, I have not personally been convinced by anything that you've said, which is why I'm still just waiting to give Persephone Whymafia's bulletproof vest with a fish in it, but I applaud that you're actually doing stuff.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's predicated on the assumption that you know what people could/would do in certain situations. Something I feel important to understand in terms of mafia play is that most of the time you don't know why people do things.
Most of what people do is not done for any obvious scum/town motivation or often any motivation at all, it's just what they happened to do at the time. Even players like me who rigorously plan out (moreso as scum but) games from top to bottom.

You have created one narrative by which Barnicle is scum who did certain things. There are also plenty of narratives by which he is town and did the same thing.

[RadiantCowbells]

Even your case for why Cankles is town is somewhat (and use this choice of words with a grain of salt) arrogant to me in the sense that you're claiming to understand what scum would do in certain situations. Maybe the other scum was just too weak a player and too scared to get anything else done. Maybe they didn't understand that they should do something about it. Maybe they were already on the wagon cuz Cankles doesn't matter, they matter. I am very, very, very slow to draw conclusions about the gamestate based on theorycrafting about what people 'should' do as either alignment.

[RadiantCowbells]

Tell me then, if you don't practice a method like mine, what method do you practice? Because with all due respect to Your Towniness, that method has been very opaque this game, at least from my seat.

This is a hard question to answer.

[RadiantCowbells]

So I'd say it's interplay between 3 things.

1) Experience. Despite my (relatively) short 5 year stint compared to many of the other 'scummers, I have played a shitload of games. On top of that I have a very long and reasonably precise memory and I can remember stuff from games years ago fairly well. There's a lot of times where I have certain 'objective' reads but I'm like 'yeah I have this read but I also have the feeling I've seen this player [not the player specifically but you understand] before and they've been town/scum instead' and I very often put those reads ahead of whatever the rest of my reads say and it's almost universally right. An example of this sort of read was on Fykus in 1770: Water where I said regarding him:

I'd hate to lose to Fykus because like fuck he's so obvscum at first glance but I remember mislynching a LOT of town who played like he is.

Purely a case where experience told me that he was going to be town despite every reason to scumread him, and he ended up being town.

2) Role Reversal / Empathy: The big thing that's mostly unique to me is that when I go along I try to put myself in the position of the people posting, especially when it comes to any AtE stuff, and try to empathize with them and see if it's genuine. I'm good at forcing myself to feel feelings and I can almost universally find the ability to find some common ground with people even when we have very different feelings regarding things when their emotions are genuine. It's been the source of a lot of unpopular correct townreads where I'm like yeah this guy is probably town even when a ton of other people refuse to see it.

An example of this sort of read was in the recently finished 722 modded by Aristophanes, where I instantly caught JasonWazza because of the way he turned back on us when we pushed him:

It is a paraphrase on account of the fact that I cannot directly quote from the hood. I did not change the meaning nor would anyone introduced to the hood disagree. For my part I am near 100% certain that the slot flips scum.
His pushback on us feels incredibly disingenuous, the way he responded in hood felt really disingenuous, it feels like he's just ramping up the aggression to towntell.

No, your opening isn't just forced it's forced in a bad way. Your pushback doesn't feel like someone who legitimately feels we're scum, it feels like someone who is trying to get townread. It feels like a show.

That slot flips scum.

3) Hunting for scumtells: Now, for the record, this means something totally different to me than it does to other people. If you go through the wiki's tells none of them mean shit to me. On the other hand, my tells mean very little to other people. I do sort of play on my own wavelength and there's often a level of disconnect between me and other players as a result. Idk.

[RadiantCowbells]

Scumtells are neither here nor there. I think you can agree that scum don't always proc your scumtells. After all, if they did, the game would be mighty easy, no?

My scumreads aren't always right but my townreads are almost never wrong.

And I wonder... this is WhaleBarnicle's first game on this website, no? Of course that would rule out prior experience between the two of you.

I don't need experience with him. I have experience in general with enough players that I've seen enough players that were like him and they were, largely, town.

I'm going to need some elaboration on your process of role reversal. If you believe WB is town and find my position thoroughly unconvincing, then you must be leaning on something in your role reversal process to get to that point, since the other two criteria don't apply. Is there something you can point to that WB said which led you to believe he wouldn't say as mafia?

More of just an entirety of his posting and along with that the fact that literally nothing that you have said regarding him gives me any desire to change my mind.

Also, and forgive the implication, but how frequently do you get false positives through your role reversal process? At a glance, it seems like if your primary method of evaluating people you haven't played with before is to, for lack of a better term, project your emotional reaction "in their shoes" so to speak onto their reaction in the thread, that you could easily end up giving them the benefit of the doubt, out of an unconscious desire to be fair to the person with whom you're empathizing.

Trying to fool me via emotional displays is pointless and stupid: I'm fairly sure I am the only person who ever got Frozen Angel lynched in her time on site. Even when I was a relatively young player I fakeclaimed a guilty on a Bro/AP hydra because their display of anger was so shitty and fake. I very rarely get reads from that worth following but when I do they are almost never wrong. This game has none of them, however.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Whymafia

[RadiantCowbells]

Probably not vchanging that vote at this point so let's see a

[RadiantCowbells]

UNVOTE:

you can have some time

[RadiantCowbells]

You guys are letting scum waste your time on pre-flip associations because I'm town. This discussion is absolutely useless if you all are speculating her alignment based on me

I'd ask for a reason but 506 was just so terrible that vote doesn't even need justification

Why is this so terrible it doesn't need justification exactly?

[RadiantCowbells]

There's no chance for us
it's all decided for us
This world is only one sweet moment set aside for us

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Unabombah

sorta think Cankles was scum now

[RadiantCowbells]

Me? I either have a way to confirm myself as town or I get lynched because there's nothing I can do as town that I couldn't do as scum.

Or it's a newbie and I do towny things that are within my scum range and get townread for them.

[RadiantCowbells]

???

I didn't act scummy. I was never scummy in this game. It's not scummy that I have trouble articulating my reads sometimes. It's just newer players conflating pro-town with towny.

[RadiantCowbells]

Whymafia, sing me a lullaby

Also:

We are not lynching Whemestar today. Foot down.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'll lynch u tomorrow after I get ur buddy

[RadiantCowbells]

I realize that nothing I say will dissuade y'all that I am scum. Well played scum. I just hope town lynches you tomorrow

Let's lynch elsewhere!

I don't have to lynch you.

[RadiantCowbells]

I flagrantly disagree with your conjecture that inexperienced scum would have the know-how or the ability to derail the wagon.

[RadiantCowbells]

See right now I think that scum is WhaleBarnicle / Unabombah and rather than attempt to derail, scum sat on the wagon

[RadiantCowbells]

During pre-game, but given the replacements probably not until night phase.

[RadiantCowbells]

yes.

plus most scumteams don't use their discussion much

[RadiantCowbells]

That is what I have been advocating, yes.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am much more confident in Unabombah scum Ithink

[RadiantCowbells]

Meh I'm going back and I think I'd rather lynch Whymafia

[RadiantCowbells]

Yeah I dug through some meta. Stuff that I thought was outside of his scum range wasn't, and his town game is way better than this.

VOTE: WhyMafia

DOVAHKIIN DRAGONBORN

[RadiantCowbells]

I guess this is you being scumpartners with WhyMafia

[RadiantCowbells]

Never reaching the end~
Letters I've written~
Never meaning to send~

[RadiantCowbells]

Never reaching the end~
Letters I've written~
Never meaning to send~

Also, I don't recognize the lyrics you sometimes use.. what kind of music do you listen to?

That was Nights in White Satin by the moody blues. Not my favourite song, it just happened to get there.

I am currently listening to The Police. I listen to a lot of rock, alternative, some metal, some pop, some rap, idk pretty much everything.

Some of my favourite bands are Queen, REM, and Imagine Dragons.

[RadiantCowbells]

Usually melodies? Metal wise I'm super partial to Luca Turili

[RadiantCowbells]

NO U PUT THAT VOTE DOWN U HECKIT

[RadiantCowbells]

Sorry RC VOTE: Una

wtf

[RadiantCowbells]

Y r u voting una and y r u not voting why

[RadiantCowbells]

if he's scum he's scum with whymafia so pls voterino cappucino

[RadiantCowbells]

I disliked yesterday's lynch and it didn't flip town. Do you really want to try to push through another lynch I don't support?

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't know :T

[RadiantCowbells]

Hey, I know exactly what the fuck I want and I don't trust you worth shit.

[RadiantCowbells]

Una > Miles > you >>>> others

[RadiantCowbells]

Hey, I know exactly what the fuck I want and I don't trust you worth shit.

Yeah? What happened to wanting Cankles's slot lynched then? If you know what you want, you should say it, since it changes so damn much.

It changes because I'm intellectually honest enough to reevaluate things.

[RadiantCowbells]

Should I never update my reads, never change my reads, deathtunnel whoever my first scumread is until they get lynched?

[RadiantCowbells]

Should I never update my reads, never change my reads, deathtunnel whoever my first scumread is until they get lynched?

Hell no you shouldn't.

You just went from apparently not caring anymore about WhyMafia and wanting to lynch Cankles's slot, to wanting to kill WhyMafia today.

And look, in fairness to you, it's not

just

you. Peri over there is waffling like moss in a breeze. The rest of the town isn't saying anything, whether they're posting or not. It's just frustrating that nobody seems to know what they want to do, but nobody is also willing to take me up on my vote.

I thought that WhyMafia's 2 posts a few pages ago were outside of his scum range. I reevaluated and found out they weren't so went back onto the scumread.

[RadiantCowbells]

My vote doesn't leave WhyMafia, even to prevent a deadline NL.

[RadiantCowbells]

RC can I get an apology post game if you manage to get me lynched <3

yes if you flip town which you won't and also I've seen this posture from enough scum so =]

[RadiantCowbells]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaa

[RadiantCowbells]

lynching whymafia is hard

[RadiantCowbells]

I will never fail to call you a she if you vote with me =]

[RadiantCowbells]

FAKE NEWS!

ALTERNATIVE FACTS!

[RadiantCowbells]

Yeah, this is gonna be a town loss.

[RadiantCowbells]

If I can't pull town together enough to get a lynch on scum two day phases in a row there's no way town is going to end up lynching scum and that's just facts.

[RadiantCowbells]

I compromised yesterday. I'm not changing again.

[RadiantCowbells]

What's going to happen if we mislynch today?
We have 7, takes 4 to lynch.
We go down to 6
Mafia kills town in night
We go down to 5, takes 3 to lynch. In that 5, there would be 2 mafia, so all three town would have to agree to even have the chance of a win. I don't like the sound of this.

I know we all have our thoughts on players here, but with how close to a knife's edge we are we all need to be really, REALLY careful about who we lynch today. Everyone (even you RadCow) needs to look at this with fresh eyes again and make sure we aren't barking up the wrong tree.

I'm going to bed for tonight, and tomorrow after I think a little bit more I'll probably place my vote. If the day ends before I can and I die at night, it's been fun guys.

I have done my resets. My vote is final.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I want to be more helpful but I can't put words to a lot of what I'm seeing besides gut.

[RadiantCowbells]

I've been rather confbiasy in the past so I want to try to make a case for Whymafia so other people can independently judge it's merits.

Give me a bit before we go anywhere.

[RadiantCowbells]

Whatever just do it I don't have the energy.

[RadiantCowbells]

Still, if it is you and Wheme I think we can still totally get you both if we're wrong about WhyMafia. If it's you and Miles...then we'll probably end up with RC choosing between Miles and Wheme and just have to hope she gets it right. But we're in the same boat if we lynch you today probably. And of course I could be wrong about you.

Hey! I don't remember calling you a he.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'd probably vote Wheme if you flipped town

[RadiantCowbells]

@n@

[RadiantCowbells]

And to be honest I'm a little surprised I'm still alive.

why would anyone have shot you last night

[RadiantCowbells]

so from one perspective this is sort of easy: I have 3 townreads and 2 null-scum reads.

[RadiantCowbells]

So let's say Wheme is in fact scum. What are your reads in UNa/Whale/Persephone?

[RadiantCowbells]

The only conclusion I can make about the nightkill is that scum felt the risk of keeping a fresh set of eyes in the game was worth leaving us with an additional suspect to consider. I don't think we can make realistic guesses about why that's the case without knowing who the scumteam is, so we shouldn't waste time on that line of questioning.

this was the only nightkill that was ever going to be made.

[RadiantCowbells]

Wheme, I want to lynch you right now.

[RadiantCowbells]

Persephone, if you're town, make me believe that you're town.

[RadiantCowbells]

in hindsight lynching fykus was a brutal mistake.

[RadiantCowbells]

So, Miles could be scum here.

[RadiantCowbells]

Wheme if you do nothing besides what you're doing you're getting lynched, period.
Persephone is my most comfortable townread and is the first person I would like to write out of lynching.

If anyone disagrees, speak now and make a case.
@Persephone, thoughts on that?

[RadiantCowbells]

nothing. that's the prblem.

[RadiantCowbells]

ok but that's literally just a reiteration of a thought that I just had

why don't you share some original content

[RadiantCowbells]

ok well what thoughts do you have that I didn't have after you had them but before you posted them?

[RadiantCowbells]

what thoughts

does WHEMESTAR have

that didn't follow chronologically in the following manner

WHEMESTAR HAD THOUGHT -> RADIANTCOWBELLS POSTED THOUGHT -> WHEMESTAR POSTED THOUGHT

[RadiantCowbells]

that's for me to know. if you disagree with my read I'd love to see a case.

[RadiantCowbells]

you still haven't done any thinkings.

[RadiantCowbells]

not in thread

[RadiantCowbells]

they are fighting

[RadiantCowbells]

eevers

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't think that town wins this one just on account of how much trouble I am having finding townreads.

[RadiantCowbells]

Unvote please.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't wanna help you bus because bussing is my job.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am slow sorry

[RadiantCowbells]

Idk I owe you guys better but I can't pull anything together right now

[RadiantCowbells]

We were never winning this game.

wp scum.

I think there was a path to victory if we lynched Miles (and for me it was between Wheme and Miles today) but not sure how likely that was. Don't vote this early in LyLo please.

[RadiantCowbells]

I've swung more difficult games and you never gave me a chance to actually reread and figure stuff out.

[RadiantCowbells]

I've been in a really shitty state irl for the last week or so and I haven't had the mental energy to invest in this game and you ended this game before I could find it back.

[RadiantCowbells]

Eh I didn't think Barnicle was scum and you had a townread on Pere and I didn't think we would get a Miles lynch

None of these are good reasons to be voting early and giving scum team a chance to quick hammer.

I felt like it was either me or Una getting lynched. And I thought eh if I get lynched we lose

RC probably would of voted me over Miles

Would I have though? You never gave me the chance. I haven't done any reading today. There's definitely Pers/Miles scumteam tells that I saw specifically looking for them and I was going to go through the entire game doing stuff. I'm pretty damn good at lylos and you didn't even get me the chance to play this one.

[RadiantCowbells]

I said unvote dude. Don't blame me for not selling you hard enough on not voting 2 days into ly/mylo.

[RadiantCowbells]

I wasn't because I can't right now. And yes I was making a joke.

[RadiantCowbells]

I honestly hadn't read it man. I just wanted everyone to lay off and give me a few days.

[RadiantCowbells]

Anyway, well played to both scum. I wish I got to play lylo.

[RadiantCowbells]

You were obv as fuck pr by the way

[RadiantCowbells]

can't point to anything just knew it the whole game

[RadiantCowbells]

Okay, topic of Wheme: Frustratingly unhelpful != scum. The last minute vote that everybody is upset about is relatively consistent with his stated opinions. He, like me, thought the scumteam was Una/Why so he didn't care that much which one was lynched first. I think he declares and votes on reads, without explaining them; this is anti-town but NAI. The actual reads themselves are plausible reads. I see him as very very null and since I actively scumread Una, he's a much safer lynch to me.

I townread Whale and Miles and mildly scumread Miles, so Wheme loses out by a bit. If Una is cleared, then by POE Wheme is guilty with Miles and I'd be willing to vote him. But for now, I'm very worried that lynching Wheme might lose the game.

I'll make a post about Una soon after I finish a short meeting.

I was actually expecting rc to lynch persp based on the slip here.

What'd I do?

You mentioned miles twice in two seperate types of read. It comes off as even if you didn't do it that way, like your been trying to figure out where to slot players and moved stuff around. Usually that kind of thought process doesn't come from a town mindset whose reads come from their honest thoughts. It comes from scum shaping their thoughts based on their perception of consensus.

I saw this in postgame for the record. I believe I would have been likely to see it once I systematically went through scumteam possibilities.
I can't say whether it would have made us win but there's definitely signs that I can see and I don't think this game was necessarily a wash once I got the right first scumread.

[RadiantCowbells]

Im sad. I get lynched when Im sleeping. Every time.

Also, I was gonna chase Perse hard on sunday, but it would've required good reads from RC to point out Miles to me.
I tried to give off the vibe that I was back to hunting Whale, but apparently that wasnt a good idea then. I wanted more content from Perse to analyze, and I thought it would be easier if I gave off the vibe Im looking at Whale as Whemes partner now.
I trusted that even Wheme wouldnt vote me in mylo so easily, but...ech.
I never shook the feeling that Perse was someones buddy, but she played it very good.

I tried to use the setup analyzing so mysteriously to achieve trust from RC, and Whale actually got my cred from diving into that too.
On this final day I went on a more direct mode with it, because I wanted more..anything from the scum, but didnt get it until it was too late. Perses later post wouldve been what I was waiting for, but I read it this just now.

Playstyles like Whemes will always rub me the wrong way, and will probably be a problem for my gamesolving.
I have now finished two games and got lynched in all of my games.

I think MafiaScum might not be for me. GG to all.

I'm sorry. If it helps I was not lynching you today but I didn't get the chance to have a say.
This was objectively a bad game for town.

[RadiantCowbells]

It wouldve been awesome to have you been Doc, and you'd have a confirmed townie to continue leading the next mylo, assuming I wouldve been able to wagon Perse (doubt it) and you NKd the following night.

YOu asking that question was the reason I wasn't lynching you today. it felt town.

ugh.

[RadiantCowbells]

this was a bleh game and that's not a reflection on the newbie queue.

[RadiantCowbells]

Err. HOld on.