Newbie 1816 (Game Over)

JaeReed · Post Post #5 (isolation #0) » Tue Aug 08, 2017 3:07 am

VOTE: clockworkgirl

Name reminds me of Orianna.

JaeReed · Post Post #35 (isolation #1) » Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:34 am

Yo I'll be around tomorrowish. Been busy with work.

Llama feels town to me on a skim.

JaeReed · Post Post #48 (isolation #2) » Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:01 am

In post 45, clockworkgirl wrote:@Jareed: You said you'd be free to post yesterday but you didn't. When exactly are you going to be able to participate? What do you think about SIV's posts so far?

I...
I did read up when I said I would.
But I don't have any real thoughts beyond Llama as town.

And I know that's not acceptable.
But basically, my strongest thought is "why did Bhoy confirm and not post?" and it feels weak and it's not real content... :/
Idunno. I don't get anything from SIV.
If you point me to a post I can try to explain why I don't get anything or maybe I'll pick something up from it? That might help.

JaeReed · Post Post #60 (isolation #3) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:22 pm

In post 56, SIV36 wrote:Out of the 9 players, why did you pick Llama? What made you decide on mentioning that Llama feels town?

That was the only person I had pings either way on my first impression. Honestly I really only mentioned it because blatant prod dodging with some mods doesn't reset the timer, so adding game related content to what was essentially a prod dodge makes it a post with content of some sort, as crappy as the content was.

This is a unique style of questioning though. What alignment relevant information did you hope to glean from those questions?

JaeReed · Post Post #61 (isolation #4) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:25 pm

In post 10, daRealDodo wrote:Howdy, new guy here, good luck and have fun. (ponders a bit why people are casting their votes early on)

This is hard for me to tell on whether it comes from a genuine complete newb place or a "I'm scum and feel uncomfortable in the early game" place.
I'd somewhat expect newbtown to react to RVS a bit differently somehow but I can't really words my feelings/the concept right now beyond that.

JaeReed · Post Post #62 (isolation #5) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:34 pm

Spoiler:

This might be scum? "Why my partner instead of this other dude?" basically is the hypothesis I'm playing with here. I could be reading too much into it and it could just be town trying to get information flowing but it just seems like a really random pick to go me over like, dodo or siv at this stage? Especially given clockwork explained the vote in the post Tuber quotes.

JaeReed · Post Post #63 (isolation #6) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:35 pm

I just read Llama's sig lol. FIW <3

JaeReed · Post Post #64 (isolation #7) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:42 pm

In post 18, Tuberkulos wrote:Well, you also said this:
In post 14, clockworkgirl wrote:If I had to pick someone for a serious vote I'd say Bhoysterous just because they've confirmed but haven't posted yet and that's the easiest way to deny town information.
And went on doing this:
In post 14, clockworkgirl wrote:VOTE: Bhoysterous
So why isn't your vote on Bhoysterous serious?

Ehhhhnnn I'm reminded of Thor and House here in the nitpicky nature. Might be playstyle rather than AI.

JaeReed · Post Post #66 (isolation #8) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:48 pm

In post 22, SIV36 wrote:Even though this is my fourth game, I still feel really new.

I got a tip from a mafia member in another game, and that person said that the mafia can be very stressed/uncomfortable during RVS, and the transition out of it. Considering that, I just want to point out that Tuberkulos seems the most unnatural with his posts, and is sorely sticking out to me at the moment.

Why did you not vote him at this time?

JaeReed · Post Post #67 (isolation #9) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:51 pm

In post 24, LlamaFluff wrote:If you do think Tube is scum, why not vote him though?

Oh hey I remember where I first started thinking Llama felt town.

JaeReed · Post Post #68 (isolation #10) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:54 pm

In post 25, SIV36 wrote:
In post 24, LlamaFluff wrote: If you do think Tube is scum, why not vote him though?

I don't have a strong conviction.

You mentioned wanting to vote Bhoy though in the post where you said Tuber looked the most suspicious.
:/ It's a really weird dissonance to have. Can you explain that?

JaeReed · Post Post #69 (isolation #11) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:59 pm

In post 31, daRealDodo wrote:Quick question: what do you refer to as L-1 and L-2?

Also, with everyone being rather humble and modest in their posts, Lllama seems to stand out like a knight in shiny armour. At this point I only hope this knight sits under the right coat of arms.

This is kinda devoid of actual content, not loving it tbh.

JaeReed · Post Post #70 (isolation #12) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:03 pm

In post 68, JaeReed wrote:
In post 25, SIV36 wrote:
In post 24, LlamaFluff wrote: If you do think Tube is scum, why not vote him though?

I don't have a strong conviction.
You mentioned wanting to vote Bhoy though in the post where you said Tuber looked the most suspicious.
:/ It's a really weird dissonance to have. Can you explain that?

Ah nvm, that was I4F. I don't know how my brain took a smiley face to be a dog, tbh.

JaeReed · Post Post #71 (isolation #13) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:05 pm

In post 34, In4Fun wrote:
In post 33, LlamaFluff wrote:Why are you showing intent to vote Byoh? You say that you aren't willing to put him at L-2, but he hasn't even posted at this point. What makes him your preferred vote over people who have not posted over UP who failed to even pick up their role?
Caution. I thought if I vote on him just because he hasn't posted, someone else can do exactly the same and now we're already at L-1. I probably overestimate what happens at L-1 (everyone directly accusing said player, being ready to finish him at any time), I thought it's better if we stay away from it for a couple of days. And remember, it's not like he said something that makes him scummy, he hasn't said anything. Just about everything could be the reason for that and being mafia is only 1 of them.

If I were to vote somebody, it would be Bhoysterous. But I'd rather search for scummy lines than to vote out someone who is going to get replaced anyway.

I kind of think this type of caution is a little townie.

JaeReed · Post Post #72 (isolation #14) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:11 pm

In post 36, Yooh wrote:
In post 31, daRealDodo wrote:Also, with everyone being rather humble and modest in their posts, Lllama seems to stand out like a knight in shiny armour. At this point I only hope this knight sits under the right coat of arms.
I think it is because his role as IC, regardless of his alignment. But, I'm not sure if this is should be role indicative or not, because his approach is very ...townie? I don't know how scum IC would approach to town or to their partner, but I'm pretty sure LlamaFluff will say that is depends on personality.

In post 33, LlamaFluff wrote:Vote I4F
Why did you vote In4Fun?

Vote : clockworkgirl

Let's be friend, JaeReed.

What did you feel was very townie about Llama's approach?
Why did you scumread clockworkgirl at this point?

JaeReed · Post Post #73 (isolation #15) » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:16 pm

In post 38, LlamaFluff wrote:@Yooh - My vote is because I4F is showing intention to vote a player that has apparently flaked after picking up their PM, and has no intention to vote a different player who flaked but did not pick up their role first. Its a distinction that makes no sense, especially as there are players that had posted but had said literally nothing of substance. It feels like a deliberate choice instead of a natural one.

@SIV - My point is we only have two week deadlines. 20% of the day is over, and very little has been said. This little content is very bad.

clockworkgirl actually did vote Bhoy there though rather than merely stating intent. Is it the intent that you find scummy moreso than the reasoning? If it's the reasoning, why were you not pushing clockworkgirl for it?

Are you normally a passive player?

JaeReed · Post Post #95 (isolation #16) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:07 am

My god it is so hard to not just omgus SIV rn tbh.

Like, especially finding the whole thing about my interactions regarding clockwork to be disingenuous when I was clearly trying to do a reread and get my head into the game.
But I'm also painfully aware of how prone i am to omgus and wanting to break away from that style of play because more often than not I'm going to be voting town with legitimate suspicions and that doesn't help work towards a cohesive town.
.....but my god do I want to Q_Q

Llama my concern with the passivity is that I feel like you were doing this "sit back and complain" approach and not actually using your vote to get a wagon rolling or sticking your neck out for anything, y'know?

JaeReed · Post Post #97 (isolation #17) » Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:05 pm

In post 96, LlamaFluff wrote:Can you walk me through your thoughts on why you would even want to OMGUS vote SIV here? From what I am reading, you are upset because he is saying that he thinks you are a good choice of a partner to clock. The worst part of it to me is that they are voting clock and not you instead, as they are using an "If A then B" thought process but just assuming A is true in their vote.

I tend to be an emotional player that expects to be townread as town, even from just a short burst of posting. It's awful play and it's pretty obvious why I'd want to get away from that because entitled townies are kinda obnoxious yet....for some reason I...keep doing it. :/
You pretty much explained it, though in your follow up there. It's the way he's approaching the read there as a whole, it doesn't feel genuine to me. That said, I tend to find any scumread on me to be disingenuous and I find I'm equally as likely to deathtunnel town over it as I am to do so to scum.

The issue with that line of thought where "SIV has to be scum for pushing this" is the driving force, is that if I think about it a little more it's a circle around to motivation as scum being one of:
1) To setup a mislynch on me after bussing his partner.
2) To setup a false clear on me if I were his partner. < this one I find to be especially common where scum will declare their partner to be scum with a townie and then try to lynch the townie instead
3) To attempt to chain mislynches by going after the associate tell then being able to say "oh but Jae is still scummy independently of that"

As for 1, not thinking that's happening here as it feels super unnecessary for D1 and especially so being a newbie and a game where town is lacking in their play and pushes.
2, I know that's not happening here since I'm town.
3, eh maybe? But I don't have any level of confidence in that at all. Like I think as scum he would find it much easier to go after me there than to push clockwork?

It's a weird stance overall but probably not actually scummy, honestly. Moreso objectively bad/anti-town play?

JaeReed · Post Post #105 (isolation #18) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:30 am

In post 98, SIV36 wrote:If you OMGUS-respond to me scum-reading you when you're town, how do you respond scum-reads on you if you're mafia?

JaeReed · Post Post #106 (isolation #19) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:33 am

In post 99, SIV36 wrote:Notice how I'm voting clockwork, and yet Reed responds as though I put
him
at L-2. I definitely got him acting a little unnerved. In my mind, it's either he really really has a confirmed town-read on clockwork, or if he's town, he shouldn't really care as much that clockwork is the one getting the pressure.

Er, you expressed a scumread on me yet didn't vote me over the assumed partner for me.
If I had an issue with clock being at L2 I'd just unvote. It's as simple as that.
If I were mafia with clock I wouldn't be voting her rn tbh. I don't bus.
I don't have a strong read on clockwork either way, but I'm trying to get reads on other people and that's by asking about motivations for things.

JaeReed · Post Post #119 (isolation #20) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:12 pm

In post 117, SIV36 wrote:I mean, it slipped my mind that JaeReed did the RVS vote.

Also, I did a paraphrase jot-note list of what JaeReed has done this game (in notepad but it didn't save). What I noticed is his reads are mostly apathetic, prod-dodging, being apologetic, and just all over picking people and making up reads...... not being focused. (I'm all over the place too, but I'm
too
focused; it's different) I don't know if it's NAI and him being not too much 'into' the game, or if it's because he's mafia.

Not being in the game, regardless of my alignment.
I do think that there was a legitimate point you could have picked on there in that I should have unvoted clockwork if you felt as though I was hard townreading her, because from your pov if I was hard townreading clockwork via my actions then why would I be vote parking on her and encouraging apathy in the game? I honestly haven't been townreading her which is why I haven't bothered to move my vote, but I do think there was a legitimate thing you could have hunted me on there. Not so much now since I just answered, so it's a matter of whether you believe that I don't have a good read on her or not.

I'll try again to get into this game.
Do think SIV is most likely town.

JaeReed · Post Post #120 (isolation #21) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:13 pm

I kind of want to townread guyy for having the balls to go after me after a self-admitted to being an omguser but I know that would be one of the laziest reads I could make.

JaeReed · Post Post #121 (isolation #22) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:19 pm

In post 101, SIV36 wrote:If I were to get clockwork lynched, why is he so weirdly trying to convince us that it's going to be a mislynch? If he doesn't really know the alignment of clockwork, then why is there no indication present that clockwork could be scum from his perspective?

It's just bugging me that I have a JaeReed!Town in my head saying very very different things. Like, "If clockwork does end up being scum then...", or something like tuber who was like "I have no idea what you're going on about". But this JaeReed!unknown seems off to me responding to my accusation as "I just want to explain to all the players that I feel this OMGUS thing whenever people try to say I'm mafia."

Those scenarios were a "if SIV is scum pushing clockwork based off associative tells with me" thing. I think I did float the idea of you and clockwork being partners in that as well? The main thing is trying to think through what you would get out of that as mafia and whether it's more likely to just be a town push to see if you can get something out of it in a slow game.

As to the second paragraph, meh, I can see how it could come across that way, but I did elaborate on it in that post you quoted when I was trying to explain to Llama what about it I found disingenuous.

JaeReed · Post Post #123 (isolation #23) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:34 pm

In post 108, guyy wrote:i won't quote the whole thing, but i like clockwork's post 81. it reads as genuine. i currently do not think she is scum, so her views are really useful at this point

In post 81, clockworkgirl wrote:It seems a lot of people are suspecting me of being mafia. I'm not and if you got that impression all I can say in my defence is that it's my first time playing and I don't seem to be particularly good at the game. If you have any questions to ask I'd be happy to answer
i wouldn't take people thinking you're scum as indication that you're not very good. i think you've been doing fine. people are going to think you're scum from time to time. if you're not and a lot of people seem to think so, there's a decent chance at least one person that is reading you as scum is scum themselves. i'd also suggest you don't remain deadset in any of your views. if you absolutely think someone must be scum, try to see why others don't think so. maybe they're on to something. alternatively, try to see if there are any hints as to who their scum partner might be

If guyy is scum then don't think it's with clockwork at the very least. In a guyy scum world this is the start of pocketing, I think. While an in-thread reach out to a partner IS possible I think it generally happens with more leading questions to give a direction.
Uhh something like this:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 6#p8978476
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 0#p8978560

JaeReed · Post Post #124 (isolation #24) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:43 pm

In post 122, SIV36 wrote:Ya know what else peeked me out,

Mafia chat had to stay open for a couple more days. Then, sometime after those couple days were over, clockwork came at you with this:
In post 45, clockworkgirl wrote:
@Jareed: You said you'd be free to post yesterday but you didn't. When exactly are you going to be able to participate?
Now, probably you mentioned in game that you were going to participate, and clockwork was meaning that she noticed you being inconsistent and lying in game. However, that's a really weird way of scum reading you, and was wondering if it was a very blatant, yet still cryptic way of prodding you to say something in your guy's mafia chat.

I'm probably wrong about that too though, because that would be very risky to just say that in game. Depending on how serious she was in getting input in that chat if applicable.

So I just went back because I completely forgot about the whole maf pt being open for 48 hours. That would have been closed like a day before I posted saying I'd catch up "tomorrow" or something, then two days after that was when clockwork prodded me because I didn't post any thoughts despite saying I would.
maf topic would have been well and truly locked by the time I even posted that I'd catchup soon.

JaeReed · Post Post #125 (isolation #25) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:51 pm

In post 108, guyy wrote:to me, it read as if he's really trying to find information in interactions, which is part of what everyone should be doing. i think it's a lot more likely to be offbase than disingenuous, especially considering how often he's changed his mind. do you think he was being equally disingenuous about everyone else he had suspicions for previously? how would you have read the reactions of those players if they had reacted as you are now?

tbh from my current understanding of your meta from what you've explaining, i think if you're town you'd better serve town if you tried to scumhunt outside of siv for now, even if siv ends up being scum. you could be right, but i think it's pretty likely you're still in an OMGUS mindset without expressly voting that way, which is equally unhelpful and likely to lead to people thinking you're scum, especially if siv flips town

It wasn't about his mind change but moreso the fact that he voted clockwork rather than me based off associative tells with me. And no, prior to that I was playing with "this might be town?" wrt SIV and his pushes, which is one reason I acknowledged my initial reaction and tried to reel it in along with hoping for a bit of help in that area, which Llama did provide some.

Can you explain what you mean by "how would you have read the reactions of those players if they had reacted as you are now?" please? Not sure I quite follow. I think the urge to omgus is entirely unhelpful and I think it's NAI overall whether someone does or does not state that urge. Some people find omgus scummy for whatever reason but I think everything should be looked at with context. Don't think the manner that SIV made that push was good so I think it's understandable that I would have an issue with it.

The last paragraph here is ?????? because I was clearly trying not to listen to my kneejerk reaction and actually reason out what I think is more likely. And I actually do believe that to be helpful, especially since I concluded SIV's thing on me didn't make as much sense from a mafia perspective.

JaeReed · Post Post #126 (isolation #26) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:54 pm

In post 108, guyy wrote:in theory i like this hesitation. jaereed is displaying a good amount of self awareness. at this point i could see it being either town trying to improve their play or nervous scum thinking someone might know his meta and expect an OMGUS retaliation from town!jaereed. this is something i've personally done before as scum- been afraid people would notice a difference in my behavior so i have to call it out myself before anyone else can

This might hold some water if I'd ever played with anyone here before. I haven't.
Doubt anyone meta diving me would pick up on that particular trait over anything else, either, but I also doubt that Llama would have the time to meta dive me so I think I'd be pretty safe there as maf to just not bother to bring it up.

JaeReed · Post Post #127 (isolation #27) » Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:04 pm

In post 108, guyy wrote:
In post 106, JaeReed wrote: If I were mafia with clock I wouldn't be voting her rn tbh. I don't bus.
i don't really have a lot of faith in WIFOM statements like these

Sure.
Except it's something I've provably stated many times in the past as town. As scum I don't *think* I draw attention to that so much but I'd have to check?
My first scum game my scum partner claimed scum and I pushed for us to not lynch him and search for any other scum first.
My second scum game my scum partner got a guilty on him and we pushed for the lynch of the watcher instead and had him cc the watcher.
My third scum game ended in a perfect win with none of us getting lynched because we didn't bus.

Bussing in a large number of games is exactly what causes scum to lose. There are very very very niche times where bussing would be a good idea and D1 of a newbie is never one of those times, so...
Like, I do imagine I will bus one day when I think I can get a boatload of cred for it with people who are familiar with me.
This isn't that game.

JaeReed · Post Post #129 (isolation #28) » Sat Aug 19, 2017 1:26 am

In post 128, guyy wrote:the other reason i was voting you was essentially the opposite of what i said about siv- as town i'd rather have someone that isn't going to omgus vote in lylo and that will reconsider and listen and think [so either you flip scum- good - or we mislynch a possibly detrimental vt- not terrible]

I've been raged at from the dead thread before for wanting to go through the whole game in lylo when it was considered a lock win.

That said, omgus voting in lylo is exactly what you need to do. You have to assume the player voting you is scum because you've lost anyway if they're not.
If you're arguing you think I'm the type to omgus vote... That was already proven false by the fact that I didn't do so.

JaeReed · Post Post #130 (isolation #29) » Sat Aug 19, 2017 1:27 am

In post 128, guyy wrote:i'm gonna reread

What did you get from your reread?

JaeReed · Post Post #137 (isolation #30) » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:49 am

In post 136, WhemeStar wrote:Hi

Hi, any thoughts so far?

JaeReed · Post Post #140 (isolation #31) » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:02 am

In post 139, clockworkgirl wrote:I would assume that us not lynching anyone on day one is a bad thing right? Does anyone have a suggestion for what we should do if we're at this stage with no clear consensus?

No lynching on D1 is an extremely bad thing, yeah. There were statistics on it somewhere but I'm writing this on my way out the door for work so I can't really hunt them down right now.
But basically, you don't wanna give mafia a free kill of a townish person without us also lynching someone we think is scummy.
I'm fine with lynching Wheme if he doesn't contribute.
Would prefer Eclipsed over either yourself or SIV but I'm not super in love with a lurker lynch because my confidence in my townreads this game isn't as high as I'd need it to be to do so.
Llama might be my preferred at this stage but I'm aware I'm never going to get the support for an IC lynch D1; just feel like he's doing the absolute minimum but then so am I so /shrug.

Hopefully we get a deadline extension to get content from the Eclipsed replace in. The slot has kind of given nothing all game.

JaeReed · Post Post #141 (isolation #32) » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:05 am

In post 138, SIV36 wrote:To him, he provides scum-reads based on how easy it is to push them,...argh... he makes all-purpose, generally agreeable arguements but little originality.

I'd say my arguments are original. Don't think I'm parroting others so I'm really not sure where you're getting that from.

I don't think I get scumreads based on how easy it is to push them either because it certainly would have been easy to push you as scum if I wanted to due to you voting clockwork over me off of associative tells. It wouldn't even have needed to look like omgus in me doing so.

JaeReed · Post Post #142 (isolation #33) » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:07 am

Also really hate how I'm the only one you bring up experience on when Llama is around with way more experience than me and there's another SE, actually. It's good to be aware of confirmation bias and that's one of the signs imo.

JaeReed · Post Post #159 (isolation #34) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:23 am

In post 156, Mulch wrote:Llama seems radically different than a recent town game I just played with them in tone.

VOTE: llama

What game and how would you say the tone is different? Can you try to explain that for me?

JaeReed · Post Post #160 (isolation #35) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:26 am

In post 158, Mulch wrote:I think some of Llama questions early game are useless and aren't really an attempt to game solve. Thoughts?

Think they were an attempt to kick start discussion.

What are your thoughts on players other than llama?

JaeReed · Post Post #163 (isolation #36) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:37 am

VOTE: llama

I don't townread him. I want more from your slot though. We can push this if it'll help. I'll check that game once I'm back from the hospital.

JaeReed · Post Post #164 (isolation #37) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:38 am

In post 162, Mulch wrote:
In post 160, JaeReed wrote:
In post 158, Mulch wrote:I think some of Llama questions early game are useless and aren't really an attempt to game solve. Thoughts?
Think they were an attempt to kick start discussion.

What are your thoughts on players other than llama?

Perhaps. But the problem has persisted throughout the day.

Why do you townread him?

Uh, not sure. I've barely read and wanted to pick a scummy person to push considering the deadline

The bolded is a valid concern.

JaeReed · Post Post #177 (isolation #38) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:03 pm

In post 166, LlamaFluff wrote:There is an extreme difference between replacing into a game that is about thirty pages in progress at the end of the first day with a strong scum read in a closed setup and acting as an IC in a semi-open game where most players haven't even hit ten posts. No matter what my role the approach is going to be different. What does he want me to do, just start calling people scum and pushing them when I don't think they are scum? The only player I have been pushing replied to a post of mine and then flaked. There is nothing I *can* do when the game refuses to participate and flakes away. What do you think I am supposed to do when a scum read doesn't respond and then flakes?

Put pressure on someone else.
Push the replacement and try to get content out of them.
In my dive there I saw you're not opposed to policy lynching. Yet if you're lacking scumreads in the active players one would think that would be a valid reason to push a lurker lynch if you're not shy of policy lynches. Even

that

would give more content for us to talk about.
You're lacking a distinct drive for content which I felt you should have as town here - the main question was whether you're someone who can actually drive things as town. I don't entirely believe that you're incapable of pushing slots for pressure.

I think there is a non-zero chance Mulch is scum for this, because apparently he cant find any other scum read, except me, who he is calling scum because I cant find any strong scum read so am not pushing anyone strongly. If he cant find anyone else he is willing to call scum, he is basically scum by his own logic for the exact same reason I am scum to him. Im not going to just fake a read to try and push something.

There was a possibility Mulch was scum for pushing it but this feels like "why me fry me", basically. My argument here would have been that you had suspicions on Mulch in that other game so he would be pushing you to get rid of a player that might be able to read him.

But this is far worse and more likely to be scum trying to take advantage of a situation compared to town acting on confirmation bias and incorrectly applying meta:

JaeReed wrote:I don't townread him. I want more from your slot though. We can push this if it'll help. I'll check that game once I'm back from the hospital.
This really bothers me from JR too. It seems to be preemptively pawning off a town flip on Mulch and looking to line up lynches. If I die, he can now turn around and look directly at Mulch.

How so? I did the meta dive when I said I would, so it's not like I'm just going to point at Mulch and say "he said it was a meta tell so he's scum pushing a mislynch with incorrect meta" - which would be such a rubbish push that I wouldn't honestly expect anyone to buy it anyway. I can see his point regarding why you could be scum here since you did a lot more in the last game he played with you. I can also see your point that you were a replacement and there was a lot more content to start from.
I was scumreading you for not attempting to drive the game forward (making no real push in content or votes/wagons) but didn't think it was a viable wagon for the day since multiple people stated they weren't lynching you today. What does a scum!me have to gain from pushing that wagon?

I know some people have called him scum in the past, and we have under 12 hours to have a lynch happen. With his last vote but comment to set up all of the blame at the foot of another player,
this is not at all what I really want
, but a lynch has to still occur or we are in a very bad spot right out of the gate.

I will probably be around for just a little bit before deadline hits, its just about an hour after I get up for work in the morning. Claims absolutely should happen before deadline, but that is why we need to do stuff NOW. Mislynching a power role is even worse than messing up and letting this day go to no lynch.

1) Think this is nothing more than dressed up omgus so far.
2) Your vote on me is actually what looks most opportunistic, since your scumread of me came as a "feels unnatural" after SIV and guyy express interest, which felt opportunistic in itself.
3) Please explain the bolded; because that reads like you're already excusing yourself for my townflip as a deadline push.

JaeReed · Post Post #178 (isolation #39) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:07 pm

In post 172, LlamaFluff wrote:
In post 167, Mulch wrote:Hi Llama.

Do you see where I'm coming from?
Possibly, I am trying to figure out what are the chances that you are town who is just trying to force meta to work in a spot where it doesn't work or not. I think JR is probably scum though given his response which would make you probably town trying to make something apply that doesn't.

In post 168, guyy wrote:llama are you suggesting mulch and jaereed are scum partners?

why jaereed instead of mulch? if you're concerned about no lynch why not vote mulch, who already has a vote
As noted, the complete opposite. I think there is a next to zero chance they are both scum. I could get behind ASP... after an awkward starting post he ghosted on us. Like JR a bit more though. Just feel like he was waiting for an excuse to jump my wagon and Mulch gave it to him. I will try to set my alarm an extra hour or so early. Prepare for lots of 5am spelling errors.

Given you're pulling pre-flip associatives here.
Let's say I flip town.
Who would you say is scum so far?

JaeReed · Post Post #179 (isolation #40) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:09 pm

In post 175, SIV36 wrote:I can be happy voting JaeReed. I'm sure looking back, his flip could provide more information than Eclipsed/Mulch. But I'm not liking the posts so far from either slot.

VOTE: JaeReed (L-3)

What information does my townflip provide?
What information does my scumflip provide?

Same questions for Eclipsed/Mulch.

Why are you chainsawing for Llama?

JaeReed · Post Post #180 (isolation #41) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:12 pm

In post 179, JaeReed wrote:
In post 175, SIV36 wrote:I can be happy voting JaeReed. I'm sure looking back, his flip could provide more information than Eclipsed/Mulch. But I'm not liking the posts so far from either slot.

VOTE: JaeReed (L-3)
What information does my townflip provide?
What information does my scumflip provide?

Same questions for Eclipsed/Mulch.

Why are you chainsawing for Llama?

Actually, Llama/ASP.
You could be voting me for either. Slightly more likely to be trying to get a CW for ASP I think, since voting alongside Llama might be less likely for newbscum to do.
You don't seem to be townreading either of the other two slots and go back and forth on me a lot so I would like to know in your own words why exactly you think a lynch on me will net you anything valuable.

(Also you don't need to announce L3, just L2/L1)

JaeReed · Post Post #183 (isolation #42) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:24 pm

In post 181, WhemeStar wrote:
In post 175, SIV36 wrote:I can be happy voting JaeReed. I'm sure looking back, his flip could provide more information than Eclipsed/Mulch. But I'm not liking the posts so far from either slot.

VOTE: JaeReed (L-3)
I'm townreading you because I scumread you once and you were town

Don't make bad votes like That please

Why is that a bad vote?

JaeReed · Post Post #185 (isolation #43) » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:48 pm

In post 184, WhemeStar wrote:Also didn't like the L-3, this can be Siv just not knowing he doesn't need to say L-3, only L-2 or L-1, or scum trying to be careful in their play

I actually removed the latter half of this from my post earlier telling him he didn't need to announce L3 lol.

Talk to me about your 182? Why do you dislike the vote for A Simple Plan there?

JaeReed · Post Post #187 (isolation #44) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 12:02 am

Who would you rather lynch then?
My current understanding of your stance is that you'd like to lynch me, but you don't want people making "information lynch" votes on me, and you don't want a lurker lynch because it comes equally from either alignment.
I think your pushback here actually might be more likely from town at this point because I can't see a reason for scum to not just join in with something here when we have more than one option but actually push back against both (especially given if ASP is your partner you already set the groundwork to vote me by stating I might be scum), however, we're at 3 days til deadline, and if we don't reach a consensus by then we'll no lynch, which we really don't want. Before a lynch we have to allow time for a claim, so we

are

under a bit of pressure here. If you have an alternative you'd prefer I'm all ears.

JaeReed · Post Post #191 (isolation #45) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:09 am

In post 188, Mulch wrote:That's a pretty scummy line

What is?

JaeReed · Post Post #192 (isolation #46) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:12 am

In post 190, SIV36 wrote: Llama is now very town to me. I can't lynch Llama.

What do you find very town about Llama?
Can you answer my earlier questions?

JaeReed · Post Post #193 (isolation #47) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:57 am

In post 190, SIV36 wrote:What is up with the deadline? Do we have another 3 days? And if we have less time than that, I'd suggest arguing/question-time be over. If we have little time left we all should settle on a lynch.

We got an extension for the replacement, it seems.
We still want to settle on a lynch, but you can do that while continuing to question and answer.

JaeReed · Post Post #194 (isolation #48) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 11:08 am

clockworkgirl, I see you're online. What are your thoughts?

JaeReed · Post Post #196 (isolation #49) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 12:11 pm

Can you answer my question? If you think I'm scum some reasoning would be good. I don't want this day to be a complete waste.
I don't get why you're apologizing if you think I'm scum either.

JaeReed · Post Post #201 (isolation #50) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:17 pm

In post 197, Mulch wrote:Your scum because of gut.

Not good enough.
I know you can give something more than this. Do it.

JaeReed · Post Post #202 (isolation #51) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:18 pm

In post 179, JaeReed wrote:
In post 175, SIV36 wrote:I can be happy voting JaeReed. I'm sure looking back, his flip could provide more information than Eclipsed/Mulch. But I'm not liking the posts so far from either slot.

VOTE: JaeReed (L-3)
What information does my townflip provide?
What information does my scumflip provide?

Same questions for Eclipsed/Mulch.

Why are you chainsawing for Llama/ASP?

@SIV

JaeReed · Post Post #204 (isolation #52) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 11:00 pm

In post 200, SIV36 wrote:The wheels of the bus go round and round.
All through the town.
Yay.

If you're town this is entirely unhelpful. Please answer my questions.

JaeReed · Post Post #205 (isolation #53) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 11:01 pm

In post 203, A Simple Plan wrote:My sincere apologies. Work has been killing me lately- I got called in Monday night, making this past evening five days straight that I've had to work; and if it wasn't for the "rollover" Saturday night, I'd already be into overtime hours for the week. Stocking jobs are exhausting...

Currently my vote goes on Mulch just at a glance. He is just jumping around on any potential wagon trying to see what sticks- when Llama was under pressure, his vote went there. He voted me to try to create a pressure wagon, and now he's on Jaereed who is, with that vote, the largest wagon- and all his reasoning has been absolutely terrible (Meta is garbage; wagoning an inactive is garbage; "gut" sometimes nails people (Micro 732), but is heavily unreliable.).

VOTE: Mulch

Do you have reads on anyone but Mulch?
Do you have the time to catch up tonight?

JaeReed · Post Post #207 (isolation #54) » Tue Aug 22, 2017 11:53 pm

In post 187, JaeReed wrote:Who would you rather lynch then?
My current understanding of your stance is that you'd like to lynch me, but you don't want people making "information lynch" votes on me, and you don't want a lurker lynch because it comes equally from either alignment.
I think your pushback here actually might be more likely from town at this point because I can't see a reason for scum to not just join in with something here when we have more than one option but actually push back against both (especially given if ASP is your partner you already set the groundwork to vote me by stating I might be scum), however, we're at 3 days til deadline, and if we don't reach a consensus by then we'll no lynch, which we really don't want. Before a lynch we have to allow time for a claim, so we
are
under a bit of pressure here. If you have an alternative you'd prefer I'm all ears.

@Wheme

JaeReed · Post Post #210 (isolation #55) » Wed Aug 23, 2017 2:04 am

Mulch why do you feel so different from mastina's and alchemists mini normals?

JaeReed · Post Post #214 (isolation #56) » Wed Aug 23, 2017 8:47 am

And what information do you get if I flip town?

JaeReed · Post Post #215 (isolation #57) » Wed Aug 23, 2017 9:58 am

In post 212, SIV36 wrote:From my perspective:
You have admitted that you are prone to OMGUS reactions. I feel insincerity when you say "If you're town", I think that was deliberately placed in there. It's clear that my alignment is not the main concern for you, otherwise you'd put more focus on it. This is all a defence of your position. Had you been a town, you'd mentally assume my alignment and work from it. It's clear you are seeming desperate to want your questions answered, yet you couldn't let me assume that you may know my alignment. You couldn't just say "Your post is unhelpful...etc" You had to throw in that extra piece of info to try to sway me from thinking otherwise.

And this is one of many flags that make me suspicious that you are one of the mafia.

This isn't a scumtell by any stretch and I'm struggling to see how you could genuinely come to this conclusion, honestly. I'm trying to sort out if you're bad town or mafia. You're picking on my wording which is something that is ultimately down to how I type and my personality.
One really handy feature of the site is that you can go to my profile > View user's posts. There's a search bar there and if you type "if you're town" into it (with the quotation marks) the phrase will be searched through my posts on this site. Some will return posts like this where someone else is saying the phrase and I quoted them, others will be mine (be mindful of ongoing games if you're doing this - treat those as if they don't exist). There's 5 pages of results when I search myself for that phrase. All of the completed games that return that result I was town in, ftr.

These are my two scum games on this account:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 2#p8426299 < 12 posts in 10 pages.
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 2#p8996392 < 22 posts in 19 pages.
Combined that's 34 posts total of me being scum on this account. There's no excuse to not read my ISO in those games and get a feel for my scum game. None of which do I use the phrase "if you're town".

JaeReed · Post Post #216 (isolation #58) » Wed Aug 23, 2017 10:03 am

In post 212, SIV36 wrote:This answer raises huge alarm bells. I say you are mafia because you are x, y, z. The easiest response for a mafia is to just say that they did not x,y, z. Especially when saying that you did x, y, and z is a huge assumption on my part.

When I accuse someone that they waited until midnight, and then I say they probably thought they were cool when they strutted into my room to commit the act of stealing my cash, the most likely way a person would lie is: No, I didn't do that. I was asleep at midnight, and I never feel cool." It's a lot easier to just tell these half-truths instead of just saying "I did not steal your cash at all. " People take the path of least resistance, and saying "I am not mafia" when you are is more difficult than saying truths.

You accused me of being mafia for things that I think are blatantly untrue. So yes, I'm going to say I don't see it that way.
I am not mafia. Happy? Of course not. I can explain that I think your reasons are bogus and that might actually have a chance of getting people to see what I'm seeing. If I don't do that then this just becomes an ego match of who can scream "No I'm not" "yes you are" the most and the loudest and that's not playing mafia.
I really don't even know what you're trying to push here. You told me I have little originality and have scumreads based on how easy it is to push them, and I explained why you were wrong. Yet you're now just using that as an excuse to stick in this weird tunnel on me. If you're town, you're confbiased.

JaeReed · Post Post #217 (isolation #59) » Wed Aug 23, 2017 10:09 am

In post 212, SIV36 wrote:I town-read Llama because I can feel his genuine frustration with the game being full of lurkers and not getting enough content. Mafia wouldn't be frustrated about this, but they could pretend they were, although that strategy would seem more energy-costly for the reward it would bring.

Uhhh
I don't even. This is so off.

If Llama were actually frustrated I would expect that to come across more in his posting. He's saying he's frustrated but he's not pushing for more content and pretty much disappeared the moment I pushed back on him.

Wanna know who IS frustrated with the lack of content? Me. Because I'm looking at this, going "I'm going to flip town and we've got 9 pages and no one is actually voting me for half decent reasons" and trying to get content and I have people like you making gloating posts instead of answering my questions which are an attempt to sort the lot of you before I go down. Because if I'm going down I'm going to make damn sure I'm confident in some reads that I can rub in town's face at the end of the game if they go on to mislynch me.

JaeReed · Post Post #218 (isolation #60) » Wed Aug 23, 2017 10:13 am

In post 215, JaeReed wrote:These are my two scum games on this account:
viewtopic.php?p=8426299&user_select%5B%5D=27722#p8426299 < 12 posts in 10 pages.
viewtopic.php?p=8996392&user_select%5B%5D=27722#p8996392 < 22 posts in 19 pages.
Combined that's 34 posts total of me being scum on this account. There's no excuse to not read my ISO in those games and get a feel for my scum game. None of which do I use the phrase "if you're town".

Also lol. I've already eclipsed both of those post counts combined in like 9 pages. I need to step up my scum game posting rates. I stress too much on the quality of the posts and whether I'm consistent and blah blha blah and then it takes me ages to make what should be a quick post.

JaeReed · Post Post #240 (isolation #61) » Thu Aug 24, 2017 10:49 am

In post 227, Ginngie wrote:JAE

HEY BOO

why does everything think you're a cheeky scumfuck?

Gut, omgus, and bad scumhunting, basically.

You should have a read on me by now. Why don't you?

JaeReed · Post Post #245 (isolation #62) » Thu Aug 24, 2017 10:52 am

Did you read my posts or not, Ginngie?

JaeReed · Post Post #251 (isolation #63) » Thu Aug 24, 2017 11:05 am

UNVOTE:

You both feel different to what I'm used to.

JaeReed · Post Post #257 (isolation #64) » Thu Aug 24, 2017 11:13 am

In post 221, SIV36 wrote:If you flipped town JaeReed, I probably wouldn't get as much information, except who was pushing you (besides me). Between you and Eclipsed, you would have been the better lynch. (assuming I was right about you both being mafia)

You're talking in the past tense here. Does this mean you no longer believe that?

In post 222, guyy wrote:i don't like that clockwork went missing

is it because people are now focused elsewhere or a coincidence

In post 223, guyy wrote:she was posting like clockwork but now she's not lol

Yeah I noted this. Also saw her online at one point when I called her out which isn't a good look. That said, people can be busy and still half check in so I kinda hate going down that rabbit hole.

In post 224, LlamaFluff wrote:I got caught up with real life issues today. Tomorrow I will get back on track but for now

@JR - Are you calling Mulch scum or no? You seem to suggest something off meta but are just floating it out there.

I don't know re:Mulch. I'm just saying he's different. It could be the lack of spamming and that could have no real relevance to his alignment. I know people were reaming him for it in the last game I saw him in so it's not unreasonable to think maybe he's toning it down for that reason. I'd need to check what he was like in your game to have any real idea whether it could possibly be as simple as spamming = town for him. Even then, it's not a large enough sample size for me to be comfortable making a read off of. What I'd really like is a lot more reasoning from him.

JaeReed · Post Post #258 (isolation #65) » Thu Aug 24, 2017 11:15 am

In post 252, Ginngie wrote:
In post 251, JaeReed wrote:UNVOTE:

You both feel different to what I'm used to.
pray tell

I'm used to Mulch being more spammy and pushy and gamesolvey.
I'm used to you being more cheeky and spammy and pushy and not as fencesittey on so many players.

I feel like you're both playing way more subdued and it's skeeving me out.

JaeReed · Post Post #371 (isolation #66) » Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:41 pm

Mulch why did you self vote after the last game where you got teamed for it post game?

JaeReed · Post Post #374 (isolation #67) » Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:54 pm

In post 372, Mulch wrote:
In post 370, guyy wrote:i still can't follow

so if ginngie is town does that mean the scum team is llama and mulch
If Ginnigie is town the scumteam is Llama/probably Jaereed

LOL.
Not a fucking chance, mate.

JaeReed · Post Post #376 (isolation #68) » Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:56 pm

In post 373, Mulch wrote:
In post 371, JaeReed wrote:Mulch why did you self vote after the last game where you got teamed for it post game?
Good question. Why do YOU think?

You're really not helping me sort you here. Please just answer the question.

JaeReed · Post Post #377 (isolation #69) » Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:59 pm

In post 375, Ginngie wrote:
In post 371, JaeReed wrote:Mulch why did you self vote after the last game where you got teamed for it post game?
whats the context here?

I'll explain it after I get my answer.
Question for you. You know when you come in as a replacement to look at the largest wagon as town. Yet you had no read on me when you decided to derail it. I really do need to know exactly why you have no read on me having actually seen firsthand how garbage my scum play is. I find it really hard to believe you as town don't have a read on me. If you could quote posts where you waffle on me and explain why that'd be helpful.

JaeReed · Post Post #379 (isolation #70) » Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:11 pm

You've seen my play when I've been both town and scum.

JaeReed · Post Post #381 (isolation #71) » Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:26 pm

Civ maf we were scum together.
For Us you were scum and I was town. < particularly this one I'm worried about because there's clear scum motivation in you refusing to read me after your defense of our slot there made me point out your posts to mastina and had us agree you were scum for it.

JaeReed · Post Post #383 (isolation #72) » Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:42 pm

I'm saying I could see you as scum having the wk go badly in another game then deciding to not have a read on me in a later game because the opposite got you caught.

But yeah they weren't great points, I just wanted to poke at you a bit.

sorry boo. <3

I have some thing to check up on wrt mulch but you might be barking up the wrong tree and if I can confirm that I'll have some links for you.

JaeReed · Post Post #418 (isolation #73) » Sun Aug 27, 2017 10:09 am

Need a vc but consider my vote/intent on llama.

JaeReed · Post Post #421 (isolation #74) » Sun Aug 27, 2017 10:45 am

In post 419, Ginngie wrote:Jaeeeeeeeeee

Mulch ~answered~ your question

Yeah, it's not really an answer though. :/
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 1#p9509371
So thing is Mulch self voted here and pushed a lynch through on himself because he was sure project was scum.
I'm struggling to reconcile Mulch who is not spam posting anymore due to ppl complaining that game he should be banned for it with Mulch who self votes despite the same thing in the same game.
It's not really a case so much as a weird thing tho. As in, I can see either alignment doing it. tbh the answer I was expecting was pretty much "because it worked" and that would have been fine but eh. I can't get inside Mulch's mindset at all :/

Llama's vote is again opportunistic tho.
I'll check again when I finish work to be sure I want Llama over Mulch since I just made myself late (but it's worth it for you, Ginngie <3). Also want to see Raya's full catchup before we lynch.

JaeReed · Post Post #442 (isolation #75) » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:20 pm

In post 389, Raya36 wrote:I'm having mixed feelings about Reed here. His posts seem genuine when he responds to Siv although Siv has a point in saying that he was responding to pressure on Clock as if it were on himself. I'll probably come back to this later.

Can you expand on what you were thinking here?

JaeReed · Post Post #456 (isolation #76) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 4:20 pm

^ then why is your vote parked on me?

@guyy siv is probably my main suspect rn for this weird disconnect that seems to hold throughout the game. I can't really explain that one but it's how he keeps making posts like the above but sticks to this dumb tunnel on me ultimately? I can't figure if it's just coming from badtown over newbscum though.
I'd also suspect llama but I kinda liked his pushback on me - it felt like true omgus and had this kind of... Complainey tone over being voted by me despite me not really making it a secret that I felt he had dropped off and wasn't doing much. It felt like he felt he was in the right, basically. Don't think siv is mafia if llama is because the above post I can't really see being a post about a partner, but could be last second distancing I suppose? Just wouldn't match with his play so far I think for it to be partners.

Pedit this all pertains to 453

JaeReed · Post Post #460 (isolation #77) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:25 pm

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 5#p9432591

Glad that game is over.
So I was worried siv might be lynchbait when I glanced at his other game and saw he was the d1 mislynch but like, going through this iso I kinda think there's a diff between siv there and here? Thoughts, ginngie?

JaeReed · Post Post #464 (isolation #78) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:49 pm

VOTE: siv

Ginngie this is my favored vote right now. Please give me a stance on what I asked about.

JaeReed · Post Post #466 (isolation #79) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:52 pm

Zzz well I'm not sure llama is scum with siv so I don't want to vote there and I don't have any conviction in mulch flipping scum either. Would rather flashwagon someone I actually think is scum than settle for either of those.

JaeReed · Post Post #468 (isolation #80) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:56 pm

Join me and it will happen. Why do you think I asked you to check the meta?

JaeReed · Post Post #471 (isolation #81) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:02 pm

Do you think llama could be scum with siv and is my reasoning for why I don't think they're scum together bad? If so, why?

JaeReed · Post Post #473 (isolation #82) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:04 pm

JaeReed · Post Post #476 (isolation #83) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:17 pm

Don't think that makes him caught scum but ok.
The townread is pre bad tho now that I've gone back to check what you were talking about here. Like iirc llama likes policy lynches on anti town shit which your self vote should fall under yet it had the opposite effect this game?
Eh I guess I can see it. I was just kinda worried the lurkiness and self preservation shit was for another reason.
Still would prefer siv tho tbh.

VOTE: llama

JaeReed · Post Post #482 (isolation #84) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:31 pm

Zzz I don't sr ginngie tho llama.
This is kinda why I was hoping for siv flashwagon
Can we do that instead? Like compare his iso that game and reaction to being suspected there to here. I can't words things perfectly but it's a fair difference and one I think is more likely scum.

VOTE: siv

JaeReed · Post Post #487 (isolation #85) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:42 pm

Reads change when your highest scumread turns out to be a pr, man.

JaeReed · Post Post #497 (isolation #86) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:50 pm

In post 489, LlamaFluff wrote:
In post 482, JaeReed wrote:Can we do that instead? Like compare his iso that game and reaction to being suspected there to here. I can't words things perfectly but it's a fair difference and one I think is more likely scum.
We already proved one game meta is wrong due to what Mulch was pulling on me. There are a ton of reasons a player can be different. Alignment. Game state. Game speed. How much fun they are having. Role. Meta from a single game establishes baseline activity and skill. Meta from a large number of games can start establishing some weaker alignment tells.

Also I still have zero reason why Ginngie was voted me. The actually still refuse to answer that question and now are just sheeping the biggest wagon in a hope to stay alive.

Except the way I'm doing this meta is different from "tone". It's the reaction to him being pushed. There's a huge difference that I can't explain which is why I posted the iso link and asked for ginngie to look at it.

Ginngie will obvtown or obvscum given time so I'd really rather not go there. Especially given I'm seeing glimpses of her town game here.
Mulch's frustration with me earlier and the back and forth with ginngie I think points to him being town.
Siv has been trying to keep open as many options at opportune times as he can this game. I don't believe his tunnel on me is genuine at all. I think if he's town tho then the scum team are lurkers. I'd be looking at someone like raya due to how she did the catch up then dropped off.

JaeReed · Post Post #498 (isolation #87) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:51 pm

In post 495, Ginngie wrote:wheme hammer, llama isn't happening because of bs.

Siv needs a chance to claim.

JaeReed · Post Post #517 (isolation #88) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:18 pm

I don't want Llama to claim either. It's incredibly antitown for them to do so rn and they already committed to claiming D2 first post so drop it, please.

JaeReed · Post Post #520 (isolation #89) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:19 pm

I know you are. This isn't helpful though. Remember your training.

JaeReed · Post Post #521 (isolation #90) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:19 pm

We're lynching SIV.

JaeReed · Post Post #523 (isolation #91) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:20 pm

In post 519, Ginngie wrote:It's incredibly anti-town to no lynch

btw Llama this is a good reason for Ginngie to change her vote to someone who could actually be wagoned today that has been sketch as fuck lately.

JaeReed · Post Post #525 (isolation #92) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:23 pm

@llama read from here to 478. There's your answer. Ginngie started to suspect SIV from his behaviour about your wagon.

JaeReed · Post Post #529 (isolation #93) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 9:07 pm

In post 526, LlamaFluff wrote:2) I really dislike the SIV wagon because realistically the way it formed I think the only way he is scum is if JR, Mulch and Ginngie are all town because I don't buy a snap wagon half a day to deadline driven by scum on scum. Its not impossible, but if he is scum its with someone who is more lurky (Raya, guyy, ASP or WS). Other side of the coin, any of Mulch, JR, Ginngie being scum means SIV is probably town.

I'm pretty sure we're all town.
I'm pretty sure this is just scum!SIV.

I'd really rather not lynch a lurker that I don't even really scumread over a strong scumread.

JaeReed · Post Post #530 (isolation #94) » Tue Aug 29, 2017 9:08 pm

In post 528, WhemeStar wrote:Like llama is doing the same thing guyy did in his last scum game and guyy won

I've thought Llama's play adds up for a PR for a while now.
Llama is already going to claim D2. Just leave it til then. I'm pretty sure that Llama is actually just a town PR here.

JaeReed · Post Post #546 (isolation #95) » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:42 am

VOTE: llama

JaeReed · Post Post #549 (isolation #96) » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:44 am

I've always wanted to lolhammer.

But yeah that hammer there comes from town doc never

JaeReed · Post Post #580 (isolation #97) » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:55 am

I wanna do a reread, will do tonight.

JaeReed · Post Post #583 (isolation #98) » Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:02 am

LOL so you think llama's push on me that nearly ended in my lynch was scum-scum? You wanna go there?

JaeReed · Post Post #603 (isolation #99) » Sat Sep 09, 2017 12:59 am

So I'm not sure whether i'm sticking in this game or not.
I really have no drive for this.

That said. I have zero drive for watching a replacement push obvtown mulch sooooooooo.
Yeah.
There's that.
So this is a prod dodge in the form of "never voting mulch ever so change your tactics if ur scum"

JaeReed · Sun Sep 17, 2017 10:08 am

Yeah I had a heavy cop read on Wheme too.

I was surprised you still went for that kill after SIV flipped cop.