Mini 2006: Scummer in this game UPick GAME OVER

[OnTheMark]

Hey guys I have a neg utility action.

I also received something.

Reading now.

[OnTheMark]

Hi Alisae. I picked you as my role, yeah.

Incidentally, I couldn't choose between Alisae and Pine so I chose both! (By submitting the hydra.)

I can see the dilemma.

However I think Wisdom chose well.

[OnTheMark]

I should probably claim that ability in fact.
I am a compulsive D1 permanent-track/watch-immune-inventor.

As in.

I am required to make one person (and sadly, it does specify "ANOTHER player" so no self-targeting to make sure it lands on town) in the game, by the end of D1, be track/watch immune. If I don't submit anyone, it's randomized. I'll let you know who I am selecting; it'll be among my largest townreads for obvious reasons.

You 100% sure about your claim?

Because I find it VERY ODD

[OnTheMark]

Mastina's role is very similar to mine

I agree with this statement.

[OnTheMark]

Why are you claiming now Mastina?

Uh. Because

thats an even more anti town role than mine!

?

Legit there's zero benefit from hiding this. None. Absolutely zero. It needs to be outed promptly and immediately.

mastina, sudowoodo vote please

Tempting, but I prefer my Wisdom vote. Might join later tho.

Hmmmm I have a theory. What if

everyone

is compulsive neg utility? I find it odd there are two already.

[OnTheMark]

I think Mastina always scum reads me as scum, but that's a sample of one game so *shrug*

I do indeed always scumread you when you're scum!

And yes it is a sample size of one pretty sure, but this game will make two!

Hey wait

I am an idiot.

If Mastina is town and hits momo as she claims
And I hit momo with my neg utility then momo won’t be a ninja.

Mastina talk with me about your momo townread?

[OnTheMark]

mine isn't compulsive

But it’s neg utility yeah?

[OnTheMark]

Help me catch up who all is neg utility?

[OnTheMark]

So mason by definition is two people of the same alignment.

A mason cop if it exists would indicate one of the pairs is a mason but a scum mason. Would also probably mean a rolecop exists somewhere and thus make anyone claiming neg utility probably town except maybe one.

So what are those pairs? Then we can break down and analyze that further.

[OnTheMark]

This post is a town claim.
Please town read it.

Also I am a town godfather.

So Beeboy is probably town because godfather is neg utility to rolecop should it exist as I theorize it does.

[OnTheMark]

I have a lot of trouble believing this game has 6 confirmed towns btw.

So?
Ignore the conftown, focus on the town.

CheekyTeeky rings townbells even without a claim that I buy is more likely to be a townclaim.
Sudowoodo rings enough townbells even without a claim that I buy they're more likely to be a townclaim.
I don't care about a mason claim from you and Lovebird you two are town anyway.
And Nico would be solidly town even if she wasn't my mason partner.

I mean, to be honest, haven't given much thought to my own play and whether I'd be obvtown or not, but that's still at minimum five town names without claims.

Crossreference with Momrangal who is fairly town and Momomen who bleeds town and LLD who is more likely town for many of the reasons presented, and you've got 9/13.

Again.
Leaving RedFlavor, MariaR, Kokichi Oma, and Wisdom.

One of these names is not like the others.

So it should be no wonder why my lynchlist is what it is.
MariaR, Kokichi Oma, and Wisdom are in the POE pool.
They furthermore have a shitload of scum content, with clear scum motivations, a traceable scum mindset, with actions that are visible scum-oriented in that they further the scum wincon to do.

That's why they should be lynched.

Mastina you’re claiming neg utility action and

town mason

with Nico, correct?

[OnTheMark]

This post is a town claim.
Please town read it.

Also I am a town godfather.

So Beeboy is probably town because godfather is neg utility to rolecop should it exist as I theorize it does.

I think this post was a joke. beeboy is claiming mason with lovebird iirc.

I am not so sure. If it is beeboy can correct it. Mainly since there seem to be a lot of claims I am looking for consistency and rhythm and reason behind them. By finding that I can get some footing.

Do you have a list of claims?

[OnTheMark]

VOTE: Kokichi

I am good here.

You have enough of an idea to believe there is a shit ton of mason claims yet you can’t write them out, despite someone claiming mason necessarily needs to have an impact on reads. Similarly should a mason cop claim exist you should be able to tell me who it is.

The fact you can’t or won’t shows that you don’t give a shit and aren’t hunting.

Furthermore why would the mod confirm something?

[OnTheMark]

MATHY YOU'RE TOWN
I'M TOWN
LET'S CIV THIS GAME UP AND CARRY <3

Ewwww no
Civ I was fucking atrocious in

Uhm *shivers*

Just no.

Wait? How did you know I am math?

[OnTheMark]

Like nothing I can say is going to make people re-evaluate
MathBlade aka Lovebird is just going to continue being bad due to her inability to read me.
KTS is shitting up the thread with his shitty read.
no one wants to wagon wolves.

...lolz great

Now anyone who is perceived to suck is now me.

Just fucking great. And I get misgendered fuck. :/

[OnTheMark]

You alt slipped before love

Don’t think I have? Weird. Will check later.

Kokichi town or scum and why?

And the mason pairings would be awesome sauce.

[OnTheMark]

this game is painful, hope you're ready for the pain train

I kinda feel that already. Got a TLDR and who is masons with who?

We may just be able to break this shit.

[OnTheMark]

a lot of meta and stuff I don't think he'd do as scum

Like what?

[OnTheMark]

I have a lot of trouble believing this game has 6 confirmed towns btw.

So?
Ignore the conftown, focus on the town.

CheekyTeeky rings townbells even without a claim that I buy is more likely to be a townclaim.
Sudowoodo rings enough townbells even without a claim that I buy they're more likely to be a townclaim.
I don't care about a mason claim from you and Lovebird you two are town anyway.
And Nico would be solidly town even if she wasn't my mason partner.

I mean, to be honest, haven't given much thought to my own play and whether I'd be obvtown or not, but that's still at minimum five town names without claims.

Crossreference with Momrangal who is fairly town and Momomen who bleeds town and LLD who is more likely town for many of the reasons presented, and you've got 9/13.

Again.
Leaving RedFlavor, MariaR, Kokichi Oma, and Wisdom.

One of these names is not like the others.

So it should be no wonder why my lynchlist is what it is.
MariaR, Kokichi Oma, and Wisdom are in the POE pool.
They furthermore have a shitload of scum content, with clear scum motivations, a traceable scum mindset, with actions that are visible scum-oriented in that they further the scum wincon to do.

That's why they should be lynched.

Mastina you’re claiming neg utility action and

town mason

with Nico, correct?

So the mason claims I see are mastina and Nico and beeboy and Lovebird.

So if both groups are town mason cop is scum
If it’s split mason cop is town.

I think we learn a LOT about the mason claims from the mason cop claim (assuming it’s genuine along with the mason claims for the moment)

@mastina what if I said nothing should impact momo tonight so they are required to get a check tonight? And I would want them to check you?

[OnTheMark]

Here is my reasoning (assuming the claim is true)

Assuming momo gets a check on Mastina and says they are scum one of three possibilities exists
1) Mastina is scum Momo town << most likely
2) Mastina is scum and Momo scum << second most likely and we get a scum in Mastina and then scum momo confirms the other pair as town sooooi....like still get two conf town yay
3) Mastina is town and Momo scum << Mislynch mastina then know 100% momo scum because of my night action because you always Lynch a cop guilty

Assuming mono gets a check on Mastina and says they are town
1) Mastina town Momo town hooray. Nico consequently town. Repeat on other mason block if momo lives
2) Mastina scum momo town. Trust me when I say literally impossible unless Mastina is a Miller that didn’t claim when she always would so lynch her anyway.
3) Mastina scum momo scum. In this case they have to push the other set of masons as 4 confirmed town plus someone who can find them is never a setup that gets approved. When the duo flips town, mastina nico and momo get wrecked.

Can rinse wash repeat for any mason claim just suggested Mastina as I have trouble reading her.

[OnTheMark]

Noted thank you.

Ugh similar names though

Besides that hiicup what do you make of the argument?

Oh and if scum are dumb enough to kill the cop then that means that the cop has influence so we just trounce anyway.

[OnTheMark]

It's okay, but I feel like that's what most people would think based on the results anyway. I do think that we should set in stone who Mom will check though.

Mastina 100% if she is town she can win this game for us.

If she is scum she is a threat to be removed ASAP.

[OnTheMark]

I feel like there is one scum between sudowoodo and cheeky based off mechanics. Where do you stand on that

Kinda interested in why this wasn’t explored more

[OnTheMark]

Why are you pushing me when you've seen me claim. Like actually just use your brain cells.

This is the same logic you guys are yelling at Nico for, I hope you realize that.

Except my role is provable?

Ugh I can’t find cheeky’s claim.

[OnTheMark]

hes gamethrowing town so me voting who he wants after incessant whining is a scum claim

If he is town he is inherently not gamethrowing if he believes you are scum.

I strongly oppose the word being used unless there is willful malice. I have been a part of mafia games where someone threw and it ruined the entire game.

Call the reads idiotic or demonstrate you are town if you are. But words like that carry A LOT of weight.

[OnTheMark]

UNVOTE:

I'm really happy you're here Math.

Thanks.

What do you make of momrangel’s theory that there is scum in you and Mastina?

[OnTheMark]

VOTECOUNT 1.23

Lady LambdaDelta [1]

- Kokichi Oma

RedFlavor [3]

- Lady LambdaDelta, beeboy, Wisdom

Sudowoodo [3]

- Lovebird, MOMOMEN, RedFlavor

Wisdom [3]

- NicoRobin, mastina, Momrangal

Momrangal [1]

- MariaR

MariaR [1]

- CheekyTeeky

Not Voting [1]:

Sudowoodo

With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
You have (expired on 2018-05-16 18:00:00) to do so.

@LLD help a brother out. You said at the start your vote doesn’t move.

How did it move?

[OnTheMark]

Who do you think is town and who do you think is confirmed town?

[OnTheMark]

What if I said I thought Maria R is scum?

VOTE: Unvote

What if I said I thought Maria R is town?

[OnTheMark]

What post is that?

[OnTheMark]

I have no words for the last couple pages.

I get mason/not mason. I dont get masons alignment at all.

Also in what world does scum masons ever exist.

Both pairs of masons are town and im town

In a theme game there’s such a thing.

It’s like a town ninja or a town strongman.

In what world does that exist?

When you assume a role has a given alignment. It’s like a free god father because people assigned an alignment to a role instead of a player to an alignment.

Another way to ask this is name a game where a mod allows confirmed town by claim to be equal to or more than the scum team. Mathematically that cannot be the case or scum lose before they say a word.

Ergo one of the following must be true
1) One or more of the 2-3 mason claims must be scum or lying
2) You’re lying
3) This setup requires 0 participation for a town win.

Will break it down more when I get home with numbers and shit but I do not believe there are four town masons in a mini.

[OnTheMark]

UNVOTE:

I'm really happy you're here Math.

Thanks.

What do you make of momrangel’s theory that there is scum in you and Mastina?

Not her and Mastina. Her and Sudo/pine.

I also think mechanically probable scum between the two of us and so did wisdom

Also i couldn't find it but i thought i saw you propose town leash and direct me and for the love of god why would you suggest that. I already have my pool reduced to four players so why would you reduce it to two and give scum a greater chance of possibly messing eith my results

Because with my neg utility they can’t.

[OnTheMark]

Either I use my neg utility on you to ensure an accurate result or I use it on Mastina to make sure she just isn’t buffing a scum buddy if she is scum. If she’s town she wouldn’t mind it anyway because she from her post claim implied she doesn’t want to make someone immune to tracks anyway. So it’s one or the other. And I would much rather know whatever check you give is accurate and on a player we are divided on.

[OnTheMark]

Mmm...Ok.

I intend to check between bee/love pair.

Mastina/nico seem far more beleiveable. They claimed first and i didnt see any kind of pushback from the bee or lovebird.

Also, youre essentially saying that im either scum or my role has no utility

I am saying if you’re scum it has utility period to find masons.
If you’re town it has utility it has the same utility.

What I am saying is if you’re town then one of the mason pairs is scum.

Otherwise mass claim wrecks the setup because there is 13 players.

5 confirmed town breaks the setup. Still not home but 5/13 confirmed town leaves 8 outside that.

3 or 4 scum means
Lynch in unconfirmed then 7/13 unconfirmed. Night kill confirmed 4/13
Rinse wash repeat 6,3
5,2
4,1
3,0

By the time scum killed all of the confirmed town assuming one KPN alive

There would be three alive.

Ergo it’s why random sampling is so powerful.

[OnTheMark]

Is anyone around to talk?

Hi I am here but shopping

[OnTheMark]

This is why I am completely confused.

If there are scum masons they claim and coast.

There 100% cannot be 4 masons and a mason cop all town the setup does not work.

[OnTheMark]

Ergo the one I am suspicious of is the Mastina claim not Beeboy/lovebird.

Pedit

The definition of mason is share same alignment. The must be town in normal games not theme.

[OnTheMark]

Lovebird who do you townread and scumread outside of the mason claims? Doesn’t have to be a whole list just a couple.

[OnTheMark]

Gotta drive home but if someone could double check my math that would be awesome sauce.

[OnTheMark]

Mmm...Ok.

I intend to check between bee/love pair.

Mastina/nico seem far more beleiveable. They claimed first and i didnt see any kind of pushback from the bee or lovebird.

Also, youre essentially saying that im either scum or my role has no utility

Also no one ever pushes back on a mason claim. I have done that as both alignments and it was suicide.

Driving now back in an hour or so.

[OnTheMark]

Anyone faking masons has a prod dodge
(48 hours)

(expired on 2018-05-12 21:50:21)


To rescind without it factoring heavily into my reads.

Anyone rescinding after that point is a scum claim.

[OnTheMark]

I never do.

Still wanting those reads lovebird.

[OnTheMark]

P.s. not driving traffic was amazing

[OnTheMark]

I just said them.

Fuck my phone lolz sorry

[OnTheMark]

Anyone faking masons has a prod dodge
(48 hours)

(expired on 2018-05-12 21:50:21)


To rescind without it factoring heavily into my reads.

Anyone rescinding after that point is a scum claim.

This post is kind of a scumclaim.

I gave a pass to the scumplaining earlier today because I’m frustrated with the situation, but this looks a LOT like signaling to scumbuddies to abort their gambit and an effort to help them de-escalate.

Good luck with that.

I work off of truths. I also understand faking masons is a thing.

If we genuinely have four masons then hoo fucking Ray we win.

However I sincerely doubt this as I explained.

If I was scum with buddies I would just let them do their fucking gambit dude.

If I get mislynched and there are four masons then we win
If I get mislynched and there are not four masons I was right

There is literally no downside to me asking and then if you scumread the people rescinding you do.

I just want a firm basis in reality to start from. Without starting with truth I go askew.

[OnTheMark]

So significant events are
Mason claims
Mastina claim early
morangel claim

What other events would you consider significant?

Yes it’s a subjective question. Answer as you feel is right.

[OnTheMark]

And your reads similar to Lovebird in style would be amazing.

[OnTheMark]

I am still trying to decide is Mason cop was a red herring role or scum genuinely claiming there role.
I am leaning towards the latter.

pedit: I low key haven't read most of this game.

Even better!

Then if what you have read

right now

name some town and scumreads.

Yes I understand it’s incomplete and blah blah blah qualifiers here.

[OnTheMark]

From a balance point why four masons and other roles especially positive utility claims

Masons and enemies and other mason friendly setups had nothing else because of this.

[OnTheMark]

Makes me think if all masons are real everyone else is neg utility.

Mainly gonna heat map this shit later. So events are super helpful.

[OnTheMark]

Keep in mind Jingle is a fucking reviewer.

He gave scum no night chat before to make us seem town.

Scum masons is not outside Jingle’s repertoire.

[OnTheMark]

From a balance point why four masons and other roles especially positive utility claims

Masons and enemies and other mason friendly setups had nothing else because of this.

Scum could have powerful roles. Or, nico and mastina still just gambiting.

It doesn’t matter.

They have to kill a mason and if Momrangal is town them every fucking night or they have conf town in lylo.

It doesn’t matter if they are all godfather infinite BP infinite global roleblock

They would need more than one kill a night otherwise they cant win.

[OnTheMark]

I don't really get how. 3 masons vs 3 scum isn't instant town win, for example.

3 masons v 3 scum and X VT depends on the X.

If there are 3 masons and 1 VT in lylo all scum are forced to counter claim the masons in the open setup or more than likely double bus. If they counter claim then VT is conf town.

It isn’t an instant win but scum can’t control their destiny.

Only if scum make every kill right in a four mason scenario plus mason cop do they have an equal shot in lylo

I legit don’t see that passing review ever

[OnTheMark]

1) Scum masons are not bastard similar to scum without nightchat, Unexpected yes. A lie, no.
2) It’s logically incorrect. I like taking “scummy slots” and then obvTowning or causing people to examine the game
3) I am not trying to “get the masons lynched” I am trying to understand the setup and how Jingle would ever approve this. If I was “trying to get the masons lynched” I would be voting them and encouraging the same:
What I AM encouraging is a setup analysis.
Furthermore since I said I could ensure momrangal’s results being accurate I am getting pushed.

Coincidence?

It’s 1 am sleep time for Mark

[OnTheMark]

Furthermore since I said I could ensure momrangal’s results being accurate I am getting pushed.

Coincidence?

You're not getting pushed by people claiming masons though so I don't understand your logic here?

I am getting pushed. Look at the wagon formed on me for merely pointing out 5 confirmed town is broken and saying I can guarantee the results.

4 is not much better.

9/13 4/4
8,3
7,2
6,1
5,0

So then scum would have only one kill they could do that is not a mason before lylo.

This also assumes the “masons” claim. There is no way there are 4 masons.

[OnTheMark]

Scum Masons are not a thing

Mom's masoncop is semiprovable, which makes the Masons semiprovable

VOTE: OntheMark

This is the best choice for today

No shit. Hence why I am letting momrangal prove it and I will ensure true results.

Pedit wtf? masons is just people of same alignment.

[OnTheMark]

1) it isn’t
2) where is your argument again?

[OnTheMark]

I am gonna go randomly *scritch* a post now

Okay done and have to head to work and therapy and dnd today.

[OnTheMark]

Oh and then I will switch and scritch another post tomorrow as the scritch marks fade away.

[OnTheMark]

Furthermore a “mason” is defined in two ways
1) You share an alignment with someone.
2) You have a PT you can day or night chat or both in (otherwise best friends not masons)

Ergo it is quite possible a “scum” mason exists.

Especially depending upon the legalese of the given cop/mason role PMs.

[OnTheMark]

This is 100% within Jingle’s setup spec.

I was a godfather without name.

As scum I was able to use people pre suppositions to assume things that 100% were not true.

Ghostlin’s figured it out but by then we convinced the others to vote.

And a clean sweep without a true chat is hard AF.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=73980

There is scum in the mason claims as this is a Jingle setup and momorangel is town.

[OnTheMark]

Mason is inherently Town.

By definition.

"Scum masons" who share a PT are just called Mafia

And if they share an additional PT outside of the mafia PT scum masons.

[OnTheMark]

This is why Momrangal NOT receiving the alignment is important

Setup is probably 2 town masons
2 scum masons (sharing a PT outside of mafia chat)
A light/medium weight scum fuckery

And then a spread of “neg utility” stuff for scum to hide in.

Mastina claiming both mason and neg utility doesn’t make sense from balance,

especially

with my role.
So I am very much thinking she is the liar along with NicoRobin

However if I am wrong and it’s beeboy and lovebird that are the liars then the heat map changes rather drastically.

I sent my last will to someone I don’t think scum will kill tonight and so I trust them if I get mislynched to run this shit home.

[OnTheMark]

There could be one “listener” of sorts for something but in general I think that is pretty much it.

[OnTheMark]

Math scum can't have the word "mason" in their role or it'd be bastard

In their role NAME yes.
However if they have an additional PT outside the scum PT they are masons.

Because then momrangel does NOT get the alignment
If his check says “Do these people share an alignment and a PT that is not factional?” That CAN return a yes and not be bastard.

It’s like Parity cop + PT check.

The underlying assumption is mason. However scum can indeed be masons.

[OnTheMark]

If mom is a mason cop
the name needs to have the word mason in it for the result to be correct.
Scum can't have that even if they have the other stuff for it
IE a pt and outside coms

No it doesn’t.

Scum CAN be masons as I have just described and would flag “Yes” on a mason cop check.

It has to depend on the legalese of momrangel’s check. If it checks for the word “mason” then scum mason according to the site would be rather unexpected but imho still could be a thing depending upon how far reasonable is stretched.

It’s long since been a dream of Jingle’s to add more “fuckery” across MS. I cannot emphasize this enough.

[OnTheMark]

Can't tell if Town!OTM is conflating Neighbor and Mason

Or if Scum!OTM is being intentionally obtuse to muddy the waters.

Leaning the latter.

Neighbors who know from mod confirmed information that they share an alignment are for all intents and purposes masons.

If that is what momrangel gets it’s a false positive.

[OnTheMark]

Scum masons used to be allowed in normal games (paired with town masons) which was incredibly stupid although that would be considered bastard by basically everyone on today's site meta.
Mason text currently is something along the lines of "you know you share the alignment of your partner" so technically speaking without the game being bastard you can have a scum mason as long as they are paired with another scum.

Although glgl finding a scum mason in the past 3 years on this site.

This. Exactly what I am trying to say

But it wouldn’t be bastard simply because people aren’t used to it.

Otherwise the game where I never had a chat with my buddy would have been bastard because people assume scum have a factional PT.

You have to pitch the underlying assumptions and look at the EXACT wording.

[OnTheMark]

No it would actually be bastard to have a scum mason paired with town.

Right.

But scum with scum wouldn’t be.

They would be scum masons.

[OnTheMark]

If I was a scum mason with lovebird I would never have claimed Mason.
It's shitty play, I would have played as if I was a goon and hope for some role cop rng if I was lucky.


Also playing around something that hasn't been used in like 3-5 years isn't exactly something I think we should be doing until like lylo.

I agree you wouldn’t do it. But Mastina WOULD

Or Titus maybe would for shits and giggles. Because she has always wanted to be a scum mason.

[OnTheMark]

But scum masons has to be considered now

Because four masons out of 13 is like not a thing

[OnTheMark]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... _and_Mafia

This is an approved open.

There is a 0.01% chance Jingle approves four town masons and a cop to check them here without giving scums counter.

[OnTheMark]

I approve re: checking us

That doesn’t assuage my fears at all. If you’re scum masons you’d return a positive.

The bigger question is why none of the mason claims scum read each other after both have doubled down.

[OnTheMark]

The question is how would you balance four masons if you don’t scumread any
OR
If you can’t find a way who do you scumread?

[OnTheMark]

Mod could scum be masons?

The answer to this is no. Nico actually asked this right off the bat in our mason PT. Was one of the first things she did. Thought it was pretty dumb to do because of course masons are town in a non-bastard game it is literally written into the wiki for masons to be conftown to one another, but she asked it anyway as one of her quirks and Cheet did answer, so.

Absolutely, masons are conftown. They cannot be scum.

To be a little more explicit.

Nico's exact question to Cheetory was if we are explicitly confirmed town to one another; Cheet answered that yes, we are. (Actually it was just 'yes'.)

If beeboy and Lovebird are genuinely masons, they can ask that same question to Cheetory and get that same answer.

Mastina you’re claiming neg utility action and

town mason

with Nico, correct?

Correct. There is more to both Nico's role and my role than just being a mason. We each have at least one additional power. It would be anti-town to claim further details than that information; we've revealed the important parts, that we are masons, that we're more than just masons, and that I have a compulsive negative utility action I must use today.

I think this post was a joke. beeboy is claiming mason with lovebird iirc.

No, I'm quite certain beeboy's town godfather claim was serious. It either exists in tandem with his mason role because you're not going to be JUST a mason and nothing else (proof: Nico and I), or it exists without the mason and is his actual real role.

Either way, it exists. Mason-godfather, or Godfather-fakeclaiming-mason. But it's real.

Pine I expect better from you tbh so I think you're scum.

Au contrair! Better from Pine would be scum from Pine.

Which if I believe you which I

don’t

because my role is literally the antithesis to what you claimed you have to explain 4 mason town or be tunneling the shit out of Beeboy/lovebird.

Because if you were a town mason and not a scum one then you’d be all down for lynching the other pair because a mod such as yourself knows 4 masons never passes review.

But you can’t and if Beeboy is scum Beeboy can’t. So instead you push me. Because you don’t want to answer the question.

[OnTheMark]

Scum masons is not outside Jingle’s repertoire.

This is scum speculation 100% of the time (because scum can almost never win if both sets of masons are treated as conftown) especially since I know Jingle enough to say yes they fucking are. Jingle is one of the best players at knowing setups and their interplay. Especially setups featuring mechanics such as masons; he singlehandedly broke open jjh's Iambic Tetrameter game decisively and accurately.

He would know better than to stoop to scum masons. That is, if the idea was even considered in the first place. It is such an outrageous idea that frankly it would never cross his mind in the first place. Masons are conftown to one another. Period.

Nice word twist.

They are confirmed to share the same fucking alignment.

Not town.

Only normal rules require that town

And just because something is not a part of normal setup and / or not done regularly doesn’t make it not here

Otherwise the game I cited would be bastard.

There legit cannot be 4 masons in this setup or scum lose

Address that or push Beeboy/Lovebird who are confirmed scum to tou

[OnTheMark]

Scum masons is not outside Jingle’s repertoire.

This is scum speculation 100% of the time (because scum can almost never win if both sets of masons are treated as conftown) especially since I know Jingle enough to say yes they fucking are. Jingle is one of the best players at knowing setups and their interplay. Especially setups featuring mechanics such as masons; he singlehandedly broke open jjh's Iambic Tetrameter game decisively and accurately.

He would know better than to stoop to scum masons. That is, if the idea was even considered in the first place. It is such an outrageous idea that frankly it would never cross his mind in the first place. Masons are conftown to one another. Period.

Nice word twist.

They are confirmed to share the same fucking alignment.

Not town.

Only normal rules require that town

And just because something is not a part of normal setup and / or not done regularly doesn’t make it not here

Otherwise the game I cited would be bastard.

There legit cannot be 4 masons in this setup or scum lose

Address that or push Beeboy/Lovebird who are confirmed scum to tou

[OnTheMark]

If I make a joat 1 shot encryptor one shot vanillizer one shot tomato vendor one shot message giver that hasn’t been done before I don’t think but that doesn’t change the odds of happening here

Setup balance dictates one of the pairs is lying as 5 confirmed town D1 cannot exist in a mini ever.

[OnTheMark]

I 100% guarantee in the 10+ years of playing mafia I have never seen the role PM I received. You can try to tell me it doesn’t exist but I can go back and stare at it.

[OnTheMark]

Again if you’re town it’s legalese and splitting hairs

A town mason asks that question
A scum mason asks that question and replaces town with scum

You’re trying to argue legalese and manipulating the situation to your advantage

My fucking point stands one of the pairs is scum.

[OnTheMark]

I have to go but one of the pairs is scum

4 masons never passes a review EVER

[OnTheMark]

The fact Mastina pushes me over two people who are confirmed scum to her says a lot.

[OnTheMark]

mathy
she's scum

She’s influential scum. If I don’t get people to see it then I die and people assume Math is stupid.

[OnTheMark]

The bold of that is why 4 masons cannot exist.

Mastina can claim whatever she wants. If I ever die she is confirmed scum as I am her antithesis.

I have to go the rest of the day but mastina is scum

There is no way she believes 4 town masons exist and is selling that belief.

[OnTheMark]

I am l-1 well I am out all day.

I still reiterate I can make momragel ‘s checks not messed with.

I still maintain that I am the counter to Mastina spreading ninja to buddies.

Just remember if I am hammered there is a lying pair or scum masons.

I gotta go. See you this weekend if I am not hammered.

[OnTheMark]

My last will is out and so I trust the person with it to push tomorrow.

There be scum in the mason claims.

5 confirmed town / IC by claim is insurmountable for scum

The more Mastina and beeboy dodge the more right I am.

[OnTheMark]

Honestly if I just read a few scum games and tried to review meta I'd be able to make up my mind.
But ehh idk I think we have enough good options that I don't particularly mind.

{Mom, Not Mafia, LLD} are all pretty solid choices and going option OTM just feels meh to me.
I don't think Mastina can kill me if she is scum so I am fine leaving her alive and not lynching her either, it's a trade off I am willing to make.
+ I just see my flip getting her killed anyway?

LLD is town 100%

[OnTheMark]

These 2 wagons suck. Who wants to help me start a new one?

Driving home now laters

LLD is town let her drive tomorrow if I am mislynched

Same with monrangel

Fucking figure out the mason problem tomorrow is my last wish since we are lynching me and I am the one person who can ensure no fuckery on momrangel

[OnTheMark]

I am l-1 well I am out all day.
I still reiterate I can make momragel ‘s checks not messed with.
I still maintain that I am the counter to Mastina spreading ninja to buddies.
Just remember if I am hammered there is a lying pair or scum masons.
I gotta go. See you this weekend if I am not hammered.

And yet in spite of being at L-1 and knowing you are going away...

...You don't claim.

This is scum Mathblade.

I already did lolz.

I claimed neg utility and what I can do. I just got to the store yet again

I know I cannot win a war of words with you

I would rather just die and have people call me dumb when I die than try

I have much more important things irl to focus on.

I legit caught you and you mislynching me proves it

Why the hell would I claim what neg mod just to have the wagon on me survived when I already proved my town flip confirms you as scum?

Think my neg mod can stop you from ninja’ing someone or ensure momrangel’s results

There is only one

[OnTheMark]

I just said I can confirm both of us as town come tomorrow, so your words hold no water. Either you have to nightkill one of us to stop it from happening, in which case we'd still be confirmed, or I reveal it come tomorrow. Either way, by this time tomorrow, we'd be confirmed, so it's a lose-lose situation for your team. Nice try.

You can’t lol

You seriously can’t

Because you’re scum banking on people not assuming scum masons are a thing.

Otherwise you’d push the other pair

It is a 100% fact there cannot be 4 town masons this game

Yet you push me instead of the other pair

I don’t have time to read your plan I just know it’s flawed

[OnTheMark]

I just said I can confirm both of us as town come tomorrow, so your words hold no water. Either you have to nightkill one of us to stop it from happening, in which case we'd still be confirmed, or I reveal it come tomorrow. Either way, by this time tomorrow, we'd be confirmed, so it's a lose-lose situation for your team. Nice try.

You can’t lol

You seriously can’t

Because you’re scum banking on people not assuming scum masons are a thing.

Otherwise you’d push the other pair

It is a 100% fact there cannot be 4 town masons this game

Yet you push me instead of the other pair

I don’t have time to read your plan I just know it’s flawed

Meet Mini 1936, a game with four active confirmables + one semi-confirmable. Again, nice try.

And that mini town won with little to no effort

So again my point is made

jingle would not make a setup that is a free town win.

[OnTheMark]

TBF it makes sense a Yume themed game would have a fuck ton of town power to balance it out

And this game with the picks people submitted is basically mastina themed.

So it makes sense that a mastina themed game would have a fuck ton of town power to balance it out.

And I am you madam

[OnTheMark]

I'd rather this than wisdom slot I guess VOTE: Momrangel

And this would be the scum counterwagon to the Wisdomslot.

No that’s the town counter to the town slot

[OnTheMark]

The fake mason claim can not afford me saving the cop results

So I have to die if you’re scum

So they can’t get me they go to momrangel

[OnTheMark]

I don't think Yume's retarded enough to fake claim masons here.

Please no r word use in thread

[OnTheMark]

{Not_Mafia, LLD, Mom, Mastina}

Scum are in here.

+1

I would do Not Mafia or Mastina

Would prefer not mafia in case Beeboy/lovebird is the wrong pair and Momrangal can verify it.

I feel Mastina in my bones and in my core and based on my role PM but play > role and do masons claims should be scrutinized but ultimately want Not Mafia or Pine

[OnTheMark]

I don't think Yume's retarded enough to fake claim masons here.

Please no r word use in thread

ok

-

but yea yall keep shooting down every wagon and its just like no scum is somewhere lol

unless yume is worse than i've ever thought (and i've policy vigged her lol) then she's not faking with mastina rn

so my townbloc is correct

we just need a lynch im gonna NM the wagon that htis L-1 I just want to move on

Wouldn’t that make her good scum if she is faking with Mastina?

Your word choice is odd

Plus Mastina wanting to give ninja to you reads horribly.

Mastina Momo Nico NotMafia/Pine?

[OnTheMark]

EVeryone agrees nico is town, so for this scumastina narrative being pushed nico would need to be gambitting.

Also, no it doesn't considering it results in no net less because I'm loud as she can and did confirm, so again, I can only be scum with mastina who can only be scum with nico and this is an awful push from you so fuck it

VOTE: OntheMark

you're a logical player so you don't get away with awful logic

Lol not everyone agrees nico is town
You vote someone else
I suspect you
You vote me

Lolz

And if I had a nickel how many times I have been mislynched with “awful” logic I’d have enough to run a hundred mafia servers

[OnTheMark]

EVeryone agrees nico is town, so for this scumastina narrative being pushed nico would need to be gambitting.

Also, no it doesn't considering it results in no net less because I'm loud as she can and did confirm, so again, I can only be scum with mastina who can only be scum with nico and this is an awful push from you so fuck it

VOTE: OntheMark

you're a logical player so you don't get away with awful logic

Finally a fucking hammer.

The resistance to this makes me confident we're getting a redflip here.

The resistance to it is scum trying to figure out how to Unvote me and get Momrangal if they can’t get me.

Which they can have me or none
If they have me they admit the masons are a lie
<cake is a lie gif here>

[OnTheMark]

Ummmm cake please

[OnTheMark]

math doesnt xcum claim in twilight, it's not a player it would work on. it's irrelevant cause hes probscum here and someone should hammer cause we need day end.

Lol wtf

I would really appreciate it if you quit lying to mislynch me
In the most recent scum game of mine I did claim scum in twilight to try to help my last buddy.

People are being twisting and trying to get people to perceive what they want instead of reality.

There is no resistance to this Lynch

The reason I am not mislynched yet is scum aren’t convincing a big enough chunk of town

They are only convincing the ones who refuse to believe a 5 town is balanced

And yes there is the mini normal that town won handily because it wasn’t balanced

You cannot ever ever ever have more confirmed town via claim than the amount of scum in the game or scum lose. Period. Varsoon school of modding.

[OnTheMark]

math doesnt xcum claim in twilight, it's not a player it would work on. it's irrelevant cause hes probscum here and someone should hammer cause we need day end.

Lol wtf

I would really appreciate it if you quit lying to mislynch me
In the most recent scum game of mine I did claim scum in twilight to try to help my last buddy.

People are being twisting and trying to get people to perceive what they want instead of reality.

There is no resistance to this Lynch

The reason I am not mislynched yet is scum aren’t convincing a big enough chunk of town

They are only convincing the ones who refuse to believe a 5 town is not balanced

And yes there is the mini normal that town won handily because it wasn’t balanced

You cannot ever ever ever have more confirmed town via claim than the amount of scum in the game or scum lose. Period. Varsoon school of modding.

Ebwop

[OnTheMark]

....................../´¯/)
....................,/¯../
.................../..../
............./´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
........../'/.../..../......./¨¯\
........('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
.........\.................'...../
..........''...\.......... _.·´
............\..............(
..............\.............\...

[OnTheMark]

Nico you’re gonna smell reality one way or the other.

It’s gonna suck for you and Mastina.

You if town need to look at a town!me world because my town flip is gonna make Mastina look bad
Scum will confirm Beeboy/lovebird as masons
And if you are town you will then be forced to buy into scum masons

Because momrangel is town.

[OnTheMark]

The only thing my mislynch does is hasten that reality

And the reason my mislynch is wanted is pretty black and white

I just wish my townreads would like do something :/

[OnTheMark]

Nico you’re gonna smell reality one way or the other.

It’s gonna suck for you and Mastina.

You if town need to look at a town!me world because my town flip is gonna make Mastina look bad
Scum will confirm Beeboy/lovebird as masons
And if you are town you will then be forced to buy into scum masons

Because momrangel is town.

Plus, this is exactly the kind of thing scum would say to prevent their own lynch.

So no, I am not buying that you are town, cos you do the exact sort of thing scum did on multiple occassions.

Do I need to get the day cop to prove it, like how I did in 1936?

The amount of people who can correctly read me I can count on one hand. You and Mastina are not them.

And you can’t have a daycop prove that gorgeous. You will need in though I assure you

And keep citing a game with 5 ICs that existed that doesn’t make it balanced

Jingle is a better mod than that and he LOVES fucking with people.

[OnTheMark]

VOTE: Not Mafia

#protestVote

[OnTheMark]

Nico you’re gonna smell reality one way or the other.

It’s gonna suck for you and Mastina.

You if town need to look at a town!me world because my town flip is gonna make Mastina look bad
Scum will confirm Beeboy/lovebird as masons
And if you are town you will then be forced to buy into scum masons

Because momrangel is town.

Plus, this is exactly the kind of thing scum would say to prevent their own lynch.

So no, I am not buying that you are town, cos you do the exact sort of thing scum did on multiple occassions.

Do I need to get the day cop to prove it, like how I did in 1936?

The amount of people who can correctly read me I can count on one hand. You and Mastina are not them.

And you can’t have a daycop prove that gorgeous. You will need in though I assure you

And keep citing a game with 5 ICs that existed that doesn’t make it balanced

Jingle is a better mod than that and he LOVES fucking with people.

Yeah, comments of this nature are exactly what RR did in 1936, which helped me catch him. So go on, give me more material to catch you, and once I get a daycop, I will use it to check you and prove you are scum once and for all, just like back then.

You can either mislynch me or daycop me

Daycopping me after I am dead is idiotic.

Which is it?

You’re just pushing me for a mislynch now or gonna cop me later?

[OnTheMark]

1. She is shading us because she has to
2. She is using the exact same arguments and exact same wording RR used in 1936
3. She somehow scumreads mastina while still treating me as town. If she genuinely believed we are scum masons, she wouldn't be talking to me in a manner someone uses to talk to a misguided town.

1 I don’t have to I am town
2 I use reality as town as well as scum and I am not Drixx or Cerb. I am a logical person by nature very similar to Mastina in a lot of ways.
3 I am not treating you as town I am making arguments with others pointing out your follies

Lastly again I am a dude. I have NEVER been SHE on this board ever. He or They never she.

The fact you don’t get this right makes me think you don’t even realize who I am yet use meta arguments

Or you do and you’re intentionally trying to make me dysphoric and piss me off

[OnTheMark]

To clarify on 3, if she genuinely believed we are scum masons, she would be pushing me as well, cos from her point of view, I would be scum trying to mislynch her as well. Ask yourself: has she genuinely pushed me since she came in?

I have more on Mastina than you. I don’t know you.

So yes I push Mastina because she can’t be allowed to control the game as scum

[OnTheMark]

To clarify on 3, if she genuinely believed we are scum masons, she would be pushing me as well, cos from her point of view, I would be scum trying to mislynch her as well. Ask yourself: has she genuinely pushed me since she came in?

I have more on Mastina than you. I don’t know you.

So yes I push Mastina because she can’t be allowed to control the game as scum

You saw it. She admitted it.

@OTM And yes, I call you a she, because your main is apparently Mathblade, someone Titus says is her 'sister', and 'sisters' aren't male by default....

Go fuck off

I am a trans male. My pronouns are mine.

And if you continue to call me she I will fucking blacklist you from any games I play in ever. Mastina fucking knows this and if you were actually a mason and talking with her she would have told you.

And I already addressed your post. I have been attacking Mastina because I know her style more

This is damn close to becoming personal and I am doing my damndest not to sink to the level you are

I said my pronouns are he or they. You don’t control my narrative I do.

[OnTheMark]

Furthermore no one in this thread has used the word sister except you.

And I fucking refuse to believe that Mastina would intentionally tell you to make me dysphoric.

So I absolutely refuse to believe you are masons with Mastina.

Therefore this means you are scum with someone who knows me.

Greatly limits the pool.

Thanks.

[OnTheMark]

I thought it was mathdino

No.

I fucking said I was Mathblade in my intro were people misgendered me again

Holy fuck.

It’s like people saw what a cluster fuck I was when I was scum and forced to be dysphoric and now that is their damn default to try to throw me off my game.

Well I am town and scum if that is your strategy have some fucking honor and dignity and don’t.

[OnTheMark]

Um. So. How's the weather everyone?

Sunny...sorry.


*backs out of thread*

[OnTheMark]

1) I wasn’t 100% out yet. I only had they on my profile not he.
2) https://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php? ... sf=msgonly
Titus was called my sister NOT the other way around.
3) Even if that WAS the case someone can come out as trans and then you just call them what they want to be called. It’s not hard. Sure mistakes happen then apologize and move on. You don’t continue to fucking argue that you can use the old pronouns.

And I have addressed it 3 times now

There is a fucking cop in play that solves this and I have more on Mastina than I do you.

As much as I want your flip rolling around in the goddamn pavement you will be proven scum.

I am trying to be better as town and not demanding your lynch.

Pine pronouns legit don’t help. Thanks though. People ignore them in game intentionally.

[OnTheMark]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 7#p8357037

Mastina would never let you call me female. Ever.

She would never endorse what you are doing and she would fucking tell you to apologize.

So the odds of you being masons is damn near 0.

[OnTheMark]

Also, Mastina hasn't been answering direct questions in other (nongame) threads, so it's possible she's just not current on this.

I am regrettably unconvinced that this isn't scum theater. Bad scum theater. Possibly one-sided "please don't do this" scum theater.

And I am not trying to convince you I am not scum.

My mislynch will do that and convince you Mastina is scum.

However you can also go look at a game where Transcend and another user were being transphobic and my scum buddies. To this day I have not released the scum thread because of how much of shit heads they were being.

[OnTheMark]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=73635

There is the game Pine

Pronouns are literally for my mental health MOMOMEN so call me a child if you want I am going through second puberty after all.

And Mastina would tell Yume “Hey you’re being a meanie” in Mastina words.

[OnTheMark]

VOTE: NicoRobin

100% policy at this point.

I already said a cop fucking resolves this.

However if you are brutally determined to be an asshole then I can and will tunnel you to kingdom come if you won’t show basic decency.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.teenvo ... uicide/amp

Each time someone misgenders me willfully my entire body feels like it is on fire and I want to punch things or rip things to shreds and occasionally think about some things that are very very bad which I will not bring up for any other trans people in thread.

And yes I am flipping my lid. I have demonstratable proof you aren’t a mason because you aren’t talking with Mastina or listening to people telling you you are being an asshole

[OnTheMark]

Why is letting the scum mason cop figure out that me and lovebird ade the real masons is somehow a good solution to our issues in thread.

I already laid out the possibilities

If I live and target momrangel they HAVE to tell the truth.

If Momrangel dies overnight it confirms scum masons exist because Momrangal is a threat
If I die overnight Momrangal has accurate results

If Momrangal is scum then they can tell the truth about the check or be conf! Scum because at THAT point I will claim my neg utility. But claiming it before hand gives scum an out.

However I sincerely doubt momrangel is scum.

[OnTheMark]

And if you mean Momrangal, both Maria and Kokichi voted her and OTM hasn't attempted to dissuade them. Therefore, he agrees with burying the very person he allegedly wants to resolve me/mastina issue. Coincidence? I think not.

I have several times wtf.

[OnTheMark]

Nico you’re gonna smell reality one way or the other.

It’s gonna suck for you and Mastina.

You if town need to look at a town!me world because my town flip is gonna make Mastina look bad
Scum will confirm Beeboy/lovebird as masons
And if you are town you will then be forced to buy into scum masons

Because momrangel is town.

Pedit

Oh so now I am scum because I can’t convince anyone?

Lol that’s town me.

Scum me gets people to do exactly what I want

Town me has as much influence as pillow punching its way out a paper bag

[OnTheMark]

I just wanna lynch the scum mason cop it isnt a lot to ask for.

Not happening because momrangel is town.

They will get their check and tomorrow will demonstrate one of the mason pair claims is full of shit.

[OnTheMark]

Just because a cop resolves this isn't the answer to the question of why you outright refuse to vote your scumread.

jesus christ, shut up

Could you please explain why he is not voting mastina despite scumreading her then? Cos he clearly has no intention of answering in a way I can understand.....

You don’t lynch what will be copped unless given no other options or it is MORE antitown to let them live.

[OnTheMark]

I just wanna lynch the scum mason cop it isnt a lot to ask for.

Not happening because momrangel is town.

They will get their check and tomorrow will demonstrate one of the mason pair claims is full of shit.

and why praytell in your lalaland are you assuming he will target the fake pair of masons since one of them is most certainly fake? its a 50/50 in the BEST case.

Simple
If momrangel says Beeboy/lovebird is scum then fake pair found. Lynch one of Beeboy/lovebird.
If Momrangal says Beeboy/lovebird is town we finally lynch one of Mastina/Nico.

If the lynched person flips town we have scum in momrangel and scum in the other pair. We would lynch Momrangal the next day and then one of the other pair the next as they would be conf scum.

Momrangal lying even as scum ensures their fake masons deaths.

[OnTheMark]

Nico you’re gonna smell reality one way or the other.

It’s gonna suck for you and Mastina.

You if town need to look at a town!me world because my town flip is gonna make Mastina look bad

Scum will confirm Beeboy/lovebird as masons
And if you are town you will then be forced to buy into scum masons

Because momrangel is town.

Why should I care if it makes her look bad? I am town and she is town. Looking good isn't our priority. Lynching scum is. You are scum. Therefore, lynching you is a priority.

p-edit: Nice answer. Still, you seem 100% sure that we are scum masons, and you yourself said that us returning a positive results does nothing to lay your fears of us being scum masons to rest, so why even wait for results if you are gonna think we're scum masons regardless of what the results are?

Because as momomen said mason claims lynching d1 barring evidence or blatant antitown/disrespect doesn’t happen. My flip is the evidence.

It’s simple as that.

So you can either have the mason cop does give accurate results and then follow what is given
OR you can have scum masons exist.

Pretty damn simple.

[OnTheMark]

So momrangel scum team HAS to eliminate me so they can lie.

The true scum team wants me dead.

[OnTheMark]

And if you choose scum masons then you have to admit I am not ridiculous in pushing you especially with my role, Ergo town.
And if you choose to trust the results as accurate regardless of momrangel’s alignment you have to let them live for the check. Ergo I will Be town.

QED I am town.

[OnTheMark]

If you say your flip is the evidence, then why don't you hammer yourself? That would enable your evidence to kick in.

Because it’s much more valuable to ensure momrangel gets a check.

If I was JUST a confirmation Mastina scum then I would. But if I can confirm my theories to everyone
That
1) one of the pairs is lying
2) Save townreads in the process
3) Form an impenetrable town block
4) conf!town myself

If I didn’t have the role I have that can DO these things I would just hammer myself to show mastina scum.

[OnTheMark]

Even if my reads are 10000% garbage and you think I am ridiculous
Momrangal if I am alive and so are they will get a check off.

[OnTheMark]

Even if my reads are 10000% garbage and you think I am ridiculous
Momrangal if I am alive and so are they will get a check off.

And she lies about the check, then you will waste the edge that we as real masons give town for no reason.....

Again I already laid out the if Momrangal lies check and it’s valid.

We STILL get momrangel and the fake/fakeclaiming mason pair.

[OnTheMark]

That is 3 dead scum.

When I can deliver 2-3 dead scum I will never self hammer

[OnTheMark]

And if momrangel lies and says no result I WILL know.

[OnTheMark]

I feel like we are just talking in circles

No we aren’t.

There is progress being made here.

Nico either has to accept the check as valid OR has to admit that scum masons can be a thing.

Which is it?

[OnTheMark]

We would have one mislynch today and one mislynched mason AT MOST. Which I find highly unlikely.

At that point we would have 3 scum in a row.

A mini has 3-4 scum.

Worst case scenario leaves one scum against the world.

[OnTheMark]

Which if that gets to lylo I will be extremely disappointed.

[OnTheMark]

VOTE: NotMafia

[OnTheMark]

VOTE: Pine

Momomen Mastina Nico Pine

My alternative if Beeboy/Lovebird is fake is with them

[OnTheMark]

@Cheeky
1) 5 confirmed towns is unwinnable for scum.
2) 4 masons and a mason cop would be 5 unwinnable towns
3) mastina claimed mason and neg utility power role (granting ninja if memory serves) and is giving it to momomen and not her mason partner. Nico should be mastina’s top townread as masons.
4) My role while neg utilty seems to directly counter what Mastina is doing.

5) Not Mafia and Pine has weird reactions from what I am used to. I voted Not Mafia as a reaction and Pine called it self preservation despite the fact I counted everyone of his meta points. Not mafia’s reaction seemed genuine so is probably town. Was more concerned that Not Mafia was buddying at first.

6) momomen is complaining about apathy when it’s Mother’s Day it’s bound to be slow and other factors which do not need rehashing were contributing. Momomen is trying to control the narrative that the apathy is scum driven but the game was shit before I hopped in

7) With mastina and momomen linked by mastina’s claim she is going to make momomen ninja despite the mason partner this implies they are the same alignment. Thus mastina Nico monomen.

Pine is more a “He knows me better” bit. Could be town derp.

8) Mastina / Nico however could be acting suboptimally. Hence why I want the opportunity to have momrangal prove it.

If momrangal scum and lies we get three scum.
If Momrangal scum and truthtells we get two scum.
If Momrangal is town and truthtells we get two scum.
If Momrangal is town and lies just fucking don’t.

Nico’s objection to this saying we lose our lylo advantage is irrelevant if we get a majority if not all the scum.
It feels like scum on their last gasp.

[OnTheMark]

Also, math. While I have some free time im gonna say my piece. Up until you blew up at nico you didn't make it clear that your gender was changed and even I was a little confused. I know you as Titus's sister and I probably would have misgendered you to and I apologize if I already did but I honestly think she was genuinely confused.

Nico is clearly town and if there is a scum mason, it's in the latter pair. I think you are letting the emotions get the better of yourself regarding your reads and while I know you and your sister (well I know your sister does, I'm assuming the same for you) prize yourselves on logic, I say see what mastina has to say tomorrow and leave that alone.

If I had a nickel for every time someone said Mastina was obvTown as scum I would be a billionaire. Mastina together with anyone can make them look like town

Not to mention she outright said she can't give it to me. :/

I believe Nico is referring to mastina, that Mastina can’t give the ninja to Nico.

In this case (keep in mind I haven’t read the entire thread yet and this would have been an important event I am asking about.

There are only two reasons WHY she can’t that I can think of:

Ascetic on Nico or disloyal on her modifier.
I kinda doubt Nico is ascetic and mastina said she townread MOMOMEN. That would make her scum or she is lying about townreadinc momomen. Which makes her scum. Or she can explain why she can’t.

You need to straight up stop calling him she. Its disrespectful and further more, he is trying to game solve. If he can ensure me an accurate result, I don't care about what he can exactly do. He can contribute to a gamesolve then let him and go after another scum read because I know she has one.

Everyone else do the same. I'll settle on something else but I think NM would be the best lynch.

Underlined is my response.
Not Mafia is town. Not feeling it.

[OnTheMark]

6) momomen is complaining about apathy when it’s Mother’s Day it’s bound to be slow and other factors which do not need rehashing were contributing. Momomen is trying to control the narrative that the apathy is scum driven but the game was shit before I hopped in

The game was shit before you joined. Its been shit since about page 80... which is what I said. Its been apathetic for far longer than mother's day too, good try. I do laugh at you peddling a 9:4 game while ALSO saying that 4 masons is impossible though.

9 v4 happens a lot and I am not peddling that it is a mere possibility. If it’s 10v3 with 4 masons scum don’t even get to lylo soooooo you’re torpedoing your own theory

7) With mastina and momomen linked by mastina’s claim she is going to make momomen ninja despite the mason partner this implies they are the same alignment. Thus mastina Nico monomen.

I mean, Mastina can confirm I'm Loud, so sure. Did you have a better suggestion for her to target? Because she can still change it, and I posted in the thread about it and not a single person objected. Also, good luck shipping me as a team with a pair of masons, there was much better options for you to take here but sure your scum game is brilliant. Instead, you're peddling a scum team involving a person every single other player townreads and their mason partner, and a global townread bar Cheeky. n1.

I already suggested momrangel. I objected as I have said she is scum many times over. I don’t care about “better” I care about reality. Mastina can and will target momrangel or her mason partner or it is a scum claim. I would bet 10000000% Nico isn’t ascetic and therefore she could target Nico and is lying

1) 5 confirmed towns is unwinnable for scum.
2) 4 masons and a mason cop would be 5 unwinnable towns

And since when is a mason cop confirmed town? That claim is more likely to come from scum...

Because law of numbers. 4 masons is unwinnable for scum. Even if mass claim D1. If you take out the mass claim then scum are never in control of their destiny.

3) mastina claimed mason and neg utility power role (granting ninja if memory serves) and is giving it to momomen and not her mason partner. Nico should be mastina’s top townread as masons.

Because it gels with my role. And this has been in the thread. And nobody has or is objecting.

Except Wisdom and myself who object repeatedly. What did you claim? Can’t find it[/i]

4) My role while neg utilty seems to directly counter what Mastina is doing.

Your neg utility role counters her neg utility role... you would have had a MUCH better time trying to ship those roles as town synergy. Lol.

Good thing I am not a salesman or a shipper and I work in reality then

5) Not Mafia and Pine has weird reactions from what I am used to. I voted Not Mafia as a reaction and Pine called it self preservation despite the fact I counted everyone of his meta points. Not mafia’s reaction seemed genuine so is probably town. Was more concerned that Not Mafia was buddying at first.

So you voted Not Mafia because he is probably town?..

Not what I said at all. I was reaction testing to determine which

If momrangal scum and lies we get three scum.

...no?

Yes. If we mislynch a mason tomorrow momrangel confirms as scum and the other pair as scum. FYI if you’re insistent on checking the pair Momrangal check lovebird. Beeboy claimed mason godfather. I would much rather you check Mastina

If Momrangal scum and truthtells we get two scum.

I mean, sure.

If Momrangal is town and truthtells we get two scum.[/quote
I mean, sure.

It feels like scum on their last gasp.

Nico and I are probably the most widely townread players in the game, but sure, we are on our last gasps as a genius scum team who couldn't outplay the blade.

[OnTheMark]

Also, why do you care so much whether the game is unwinnable for scum or not? If you are truly town, you should be happy about the automatic town win.....

I care because Jingle doesn’t do automatic town wins.
I care because I never allow myself to get complacent.

If the game is unwinnable for scum with the current set of assumptions/setup spec it has to be wrong.
There is never such a thing as an automatic town win.

Answer me this: why can’t mastina target you?

Surely if you’re both masons you must have discussed this.

[OnTheMark]

Also, why do you care so much whether the game is unwinnable for scum or not? If you are truly town, you should be happy about the automatic town win.....

I care because Jingle doesn’t do automatic town wins.
I care because I never allow myself to get complacent.

If the game is unwinnable for scum with the current set of assumptions/setup spec it has to be wrong.
There is never such a thing as an automatic town win.

Answer me this: why can’t mastina target you?

Surely if you’re both masons you must have discussed this.

It's in her role PM that she can't....

That would make her disloyal.

Which means she is lying about being town.
Or she is lying about townreading monomen and is intentionally giving a ninja to a scumread
Which would make her a mason ninja granting cop.

So you can explain or people will go with what is most likely which is she is lying.

Because you’re clearly not ascetic.

[OnTheMark]

my vote is remaining where it is for purposes of things I have discussed earlier, and because I think that slot is scum, but I will vote the counter wagon to mark if it is required. I believe mark to be 100% town.

Then you don’t vote me.

Ever.

I am giving you two scum and forcing a leash on Momrangal.

Like LLD and Kokichi explain?

[OnTheMark]

Also, why do you care so much whether the game is unwinnable for scum or not? If you are truly town, you should be happy about the automatic town win.....

I care because Jingle doesn’t do automatic town wins.
I care because I never allow myself to get complacent.

If the game is unwinnable for scum with the current set of assumptions/setup spec it has to be wrong.
There is never such a thing as an automatic town win.

Answer me this: why can’t mastina target you?

Surely if you’re both masons you must have discussed this.

It's in her role PM that she can't....

That would make her disloyal.

Which means she is lying about being town.
Or she is lying about townreading monomen and is intentionally giving a ninja to a scumread
Which would make her a mason ninja granting cop.

So you can explain or people will go with what is most likely which is she is lying.

Because you’re clearly not ascetic.

No, that would make her unable to give it to me specifically, which doesn't mean she is unable to give it to the rest of the town.....

And since you and she talked then you should be able to claim the modifier or part that forces her to not be able to.

But wait you can’t do you keep up the lie.

[OnTheMark]

my vote is remaining where it is for purposes of things I have discussed earlier, and because I think that slot is scum, but I will vote the counter wagon to mark if it is required. I believe mark to be 100% town.

Then you don’t vote me.

Ever.

I am giving you two scum and forcing a leash on Momrangal.

Like LLD and Kokichi explain?

I'm.

Not.

Voting.

You.

Reading.

Is.

Tech.

Sorry

*hides in shame*

[OnTheMark]

Also, why do you care so much whether the game is unwinnable for scum or not? If you are truly town, you should be happy about the automatic town win.....

I care because Jingle doesn’t do automatic town wins.
I care because I never allow myself to get complacent.

If the game is unwinnable for scum with the current set of assumptions/setup spec it has to be wrong.
There is never such a thing as an automatic town win.

Answer me this: why can’t mastina target you?

Surely if you’re both masons you must have discussed this.

It's in her role PM that she can't....

That would make her disloyal.

Which means she is lying about being town.
Or she is lying about townreading monomen and is intentionally giving a ninja to a scumread
Which would make her a mason ninja granting cop.

So you can explain or people will go with what is most likely which is she is lying.

Because you’re clearly not ascetic.

No, that would make her unable to give it to me specifically, which doesn't mean she is unable to give it to the rest of the town.....

And since you and she talked then you should be able to claim the modifier or part that forces her to not be able to.

But wait you can’t do you keep up the lie.

What if there is no modifier, but rather a clause that prevents her from giving it to me?

Then that “clause” would be a part of the role name and thus a “modifier”

It’s like saying you’re a one shot roleblocker but don’t claim the modifier

Surely you should be able to claim the clause.

Is it “people not named Nico only” “people without a PT only?” “People with out birds in their names or avatars?”

This isn’t about “grilling” if you’re confirmed town to each other surely you have claimed to each other.

[OnTheMark]

LLD

You should vote Mark

Just to spite him.

Mark is confirmed town to me, as far as I can tell.

Should I vote you?

A reminder that with how little time left we have, if I vote you it never moves again.

Explain the confirmation to me and I'll vote RF with you. He's been on my list for a while.

FWIW, we had you as scum too, but your recent attitude strikes me as very Town!you.

As for voting me, *shrug*. It'd be a shame to waste a vote you can't easily move.

LLD and Maria R be townie AF yo.

Like never lynch them ever.

They got my ear.

And MariaR yeah apparently because people don’t want to confront reality.

[OnTheMark]

Cheeky Much as I would LOVE to see the eventual red flip from Nico lynching a mason claim isn’t happening today.

Nico clearly can’t and won’t explain the modifier as it won’t stand up to scrutiny. It’s clear the duo is scum.

1/2 - 3/4ths of the game more or less knows why I scumread Mastina and as long as we aren’t stupid this game should be broken. One person has an amazing ear for this and the other reads better than I do and you see it too. Such a beautiful piece of art.

People will come around and see it.

All I have to do is wait and then scum are forced to fall.

[OnTheMark]

Fine

@Mod replace me.

What a shit game. Looks like I overestimated peoples competency.

Pedit you're an assclown. Gfy.

Please don’t Cheeky.

Please stay

[OnTheMark]

Okay, you want me to explain? Then I will.

My modifier is enabler, and I enable her role.

Happy now?

....not really.

That doesn’t explain why she can’t make you ninja.

It would be empty and useless. Perfect thing to do for neg utility.

A ninja enabler is still an enabler.

[OnTheMark]

I have work but only a few people answered the same question from me earlier.

The 2-second jist as I get ready for work is
Beeboy/lovebird claimed masons. Beeboy claimed town godfather.
Mastina/NicoRobin claimed masons. Mastina claimed she can make someone ninja but can’t do it to Nico (for reasons unexplained and dodgy as fuck). Nico claimed to enable Mastina.
Momrangal claimed mason cop that checks for masons and doesn’t receive alignment.
I am neg utility that in this game is oddly enough pro utility as I can force Momrangal to have accurate results tomorrow.
Momomen claimed some kind of message thing with Mastina (hint Momomen is scum with Mastina/Nico imho)

I sent a message to LLD (I really wish she didn’t claim that) in case scum try to kill me overnight.

And Pine is just scumclaiming as scum want me deader than a doornail right now. Nico calls for my hammer despite me being nowhere close to a lynch anymore.

I am 75% sure the only way we get a red flip is momomen or Pine. And if they flip green they are scum beards.
The duo continues to push a 4 mason town world and refuses to take a stance on which pair is fake claiming because there is a 0.0000001% chance that Cheetory6/Jingle put in 4 town masons and a mason cop as that is mathematically impossible for scum to win as they would have to kill a mason every day just to get to lylo and have a shot in hell.

[OnTheMark]

Sigh

Fine

LLD, can you help me with your clear on OTM?

She sent me an anonymous message. I am 100% convinced.

And LLD please it’s he.
Pine is right. This has been covered.

[OnTheMark]

so mastina and nicorobin are obviously lying regardless of card right?

I don’t know what you mean by “card”
However I find the odds infintesimal that Beeboy and lovebird and Mastina and Nico are all town masons.

Since I have an ability that directly counters Mastina and Mastina and Nico have both been bad refusing to consider scum Beeboy/lovebird worlds, pushing on the cop that could solve this problem, push me who can verify results, then back to the cop when that doesn’t work, I would say that they are obviously lying.

Furthermore it’s morning and no explanation from Nico or Mastina why they can’t continually target Nico. If you have a neg utility ninja you’d give it to someone 100% town from your POV and who can’t kill. It neutralizes the neg utility. Instead there is insistence on giving it to mono men.

[OnTheMark]

can you try that entire summary again but without putting a disgusting spin on it

you spent so much time complaining about momomen that i don't actually understand what you or momomen claimed

I claimed neg utility that I am using for a proutility purpose of ensuring Momrangal gets accurate results.

[OnTheMark]

sup erryoatgay
that looks so much worse than i thought it would

i don't know what you're asking in 3267 because there doesn't appear to be a cheekyteeky claim

@nicorobin: yeah except mastina is lying because she's mastina

it would be nice if i had a list of flavour claims as well

I crumbed my flavor in the argument before rather directly. Not a fan of calling out directly unless necessary. Pretty sure I die soon anyway so I find it moot.

Mostly been ignoring flavor claims of others sorry :/

[OnTheMark]

someone better have an awesome explanation for why this day has, on page 131, been reduced to setup speccing and attempting to mechanically solve a upick role madness game.

Edit: are you asking to be lynched to confirm mastina...?

For me it’s setup spec because
A) I know 100% scum is pushing me
B) The math says no way in hell four town masons.
C) Mastina has been full of shit all day and because she and Nico claimed mason they are off the table. So I have been trying to demonstrate their lies and make sure I keep alive and the cop alive so we get a check and get confirmed town and/or confirmed scum out of this.

It’s not reduced to setup spec. I also scumread their terribad pushes and their scumreads that don’t align with reality.

[OnTheMark]

Scum kill innocents, regardless of competency. The only time they don't is under special circumstances.

Hahahahahaha funny cute.

The mishmash on MU where I named 8 scum in a row I died as an IC and scum lost due to power role barrage. The biggest PR threat gets killed. Sometimes it’s mason sometimes it’s not. I have also lived a long time as IC and there is the scum game of Mastina’s where they didn’t kill the IC for a while.

Keep flailing.

[OnTheMark]

this is like fucking pulling teeth wtf

How I felt when I started

No one gives a list.
I give a list.
Nico ignores her promise to “clarify” why she can’t be targeted by Mastina.

I am going to work. Obvious scum is obvious.

Pedit I am in a hurry. I was summarizing a lot. Link Mathdino to the post as I get dressed. And yes because I don’t agree with scum I am “gamethrowing” *rolls eyes*

[OnTheMark]

I have work but only a few people answered the same question from me earlier.

The 2-second jist as I get ready for work is
Beeboy/lovebird claimed masons. Beeboy claimed town godfather.
Mastina/NicoRobin claimed masons. Mastina claimed she can make someone ninja but can’t do it to Nico (for reasons unexplained and dodgy as fuck). Nico claimed to enable Mastina.
Momrangal claimed mason cop that checks for masons and doesn’t receive alignment.
I am neg utility that in this game is oddly enough pro utility as I can force Momrangal to have accurate results tomorrow.
Momomen claimed some kind of message thing with Mastina (hint Momomen is scum with Mastina/Nico imho)

I sent a message to LLD (I really wish she didn’t claim that) in case scum try to kill me overnight.

And Pine is just scumclaiming as scum want me deader than a doornail right now. Nico calls for my hammer despite me being nowhere close to a lynch anymore.

I am 75% sure the only way we get a red flip is momomen or Pine. And if they flip green they are scum beards.
The duo continues to push a 4 mason town world and refuses to take a stance on which pair is fake claiming because there is a 0.0000001% chance that Cheetory6/Jingle put in 4 town masons and a mason cop as that is mathematically impossible for scum to win as they would have to kill a mason every day just to get to lylo and have a shot in hell.

@MathDino

The list

[OnTheMark]

This post is a town claim.
Please town read it.

Also I am a town godfather.

Me and Lovebird are still masons.
Mastina and Nicorobin are still gambiting yw.

[OnTheMark]

Except Wisdom and myself who object repeatedly. What did you claim? Can’t find it[/i]

Read the first 5 pages lol. And Wisdom never objected, and he hard tr'd me too if you wanna cite wisdom. Also, a role you can't target your mason partner with makes sense if its a compulsive neg util. lol.

Yes. If we mislynch a mason tomorrow momrangel confirms as scum and the other pair as scum. FYI if you’re insistent on checking the pair Momrangal check lovebird. Beeboy claimed mason godfather. I would much rather you check Mastina

Look, no point hiding this anymore. We used our messages to communicate. Mastina messaged me a claim earlyish in the day (after the mason stuff was in thread a bit, before it was popular). I messaged back for her to confirm I was loud (after I had the mod confirm that her action would not be affected by loud, to prove I'm not a ninja), which she's done in thread. I gave her a phrase to give to Yume and Yume did it, proving they had day chat. I gave some very harsh words about Yume if its a gambit, and if yume's gambitting she's hard blacklisted (

if you haven't redacted it by the end of day 1

). like, I have no words for play that bad and I've played with some pretty damn bad players. I don't think Yume is that dumb though and I do believe her claim, so they're masons or scum partners. IF they're scum partners, sure, but that'll come out eventually like I told you and like you shoudl really know as a mathematical player, and otherwise they're just both town.

I think Bee and Love are gambitting, so yes, if we leave Mara and you alive I would rather he target Love. However, I hard townread both of them so I don't really care. At this point we're gonna mass claim day 2 or day 3. At that point, if 4 mason claims are still alive and town has other power, yes, we look twice at them. I think you and Pine still contains a scum, but looking back fresher I kind of see Ali slot town and I still thought Wisdom was solid although PoE sketch so idfk. Mara is known as someone who can fake her town meta well so idk why people are confidently TRing there, so honestly that's my second pick for a lynch after you/pine. Then there's your NM read which is just daft, and its a scummy slot. If we are lynching outside of everything, fucking fine, this day needs to end.

Momomen’s claim about “proving” Mastina and NicoRobin(sometimes called Yume) have a chat. Which since I am scumreading them both is entirely unnecessary. It’s just noise to say don’t push my buddy.

[OnTheMark]

And in regards to wtf that means it’s vague on purpose.

Broad enough to fool scum and narrow enough to be clear of the purpose. I have no intent of fullclaiming at this venture but with my ISO it should be obvious.

And no. No one has said what the message said but I demonstrated I am the one who sent it.

[OnTheMark]

Yeah, mastina can lie blah blah blah

The real question is do I lie?

And if you believe I would blindly do everything she says after being deceived by a scum player twice inside a PT, then I have a few choice words for you. >.>

Lol I believe you’d do anything Mastina says if you’re town masons as you know she wouldn’t deceive you.

So lol at Mastina potentially deceiving you.

#whenYouFuckUpYourFakeClaim

[OnTheMark]

the situation in question if anyone actually gives a shit for meta purposes, etc etc

at the time i thought maria was town and was speaking to her as if she was

game basically ended with policy lynching scum-her in mylo

anyway pine or eddie cane should compile all the roles because it's pretty terrible that OTM claims he gave the full list and left out a pretty crucial part lol

?? I thought I did?? Did I miss something?? Will catch up after work

[OnTheMark]

I'm gonna take a break for 24 hours from this thread and see if I want to keep going or not I've asked Math not to play any games I'm in and the fact he's joining is just a dick move I'm gonna debate if I wanna keep going or deal with him given his playstyle around me is just super toxic.
Pedit: Fuck right off

Do you mean me? I don’t think I am toxic. If I am I am sorry?

[OnTheMark]

ITT: people scumhunt based on setup spec and people's reactions to said setup spec

when no one actually knows all the available setup information

gg

Edit: she means me but is ignoring the request to not call you or me "Math"

yes, because stupid people don't get setup spec and try to break games with it when they don't understand it themselves. such as mathblade saying this is a 9:4 while simultaneously arguing 4 masons is impossible. or such as cheeky insisting ali is conf town earlier because they are odd/even night clones!

Stop misreppong me.

I said 9:4 is possible. I am not saying it is the setup.
I have pointed out multiple times after you said I said that when I didn’t.

9:4 is possible. 4 masons is not as scum lose every time. They never control their own destiny.

[OnTheMark]

The cheeky insisting Ali is town because odd even clones if it exists would be bad.

No one mentioned that to me so will find that later if it exists

[OnTheMark]

i agree that's bad considering cheeky literally played a scum amnesiac cop recently

i assume that cheeky recognised that pine is better to keep around in the long run though and was buddying pine strategically

FWIW i intend to do the same

lynching him would be anti-town regardless of his alignment.

VOTE: Lovebird
help me pressure this slot into a claim

As I said earlier that slot is claimed mason with Beeboy

Are you reading what I write?

[OnTheMark]

I said 9:4 is possible. I am not saying it is the setup.
I have pointed out multiple times after you said I said that when I didn’t.

9:4 is possible. 4 masons is not as scum lose every time. They never control their own destiny.

they'll win just fine in the situation that town decides to lollynch a bunch of masons

mastina/nicorobin is self-resolving

what i don't understand is why you're obsessed with getting mastina/nicorobin out of the picture when lovebird/beeboy is clearly the scummier "slot"

i can only assume it's because you have a bone to pick and this game has devolved into a dozen grudge matches

Because beeboy is town!lurk see civ mafia where I townread him right.

I don’t know lovebird at all but Mastina’s claim legit doesn’t make sense to me as a town one and I am built to counter her and the duo continually pushes my townreads and tries to mislynch the cop that straightens it out much more vehemently than Beeboy does. Nico cannot and has not given be a straight answer as to why Mastina cannot target Nico. When I questioned Mastina she flailed around in what little she did post and Nico sends me into a shit show. And furthermore Nico claimed to enable the neg utility Mastina.

So at this point we’re gonna end up with them just adding something else when caught lying times over times and Nico already said Nico doesn’t 100% trust Mastina.

[OnTheMark]

Mastina and Nico is clearly the scummier slot of the duo.

They can’t even get their claim straight when asked.

[OnTheMark]

I am actually Masons with Lovebird I will double down on this as it becomes relevant.

[OnTheMark]

I am not arguing for a “policy Lynch” on Mastina/Nico.

As I already said we aren’t lynching in the mason claims today.

What I AM arguing is they are scum.

And I have known Mastina to do just that yes.

[OnTheMark]

Me and Lovebird are still masons.
Mastina and Nicorobin are still gambiting yw.

Already done Mathdino

[OnTheMark]

okay, and we've reasonably shown that they're not gambiting as nicorobin's argument checks out

so i'm gonna need a triple down from beeboy and a double down from lovebird, who claimed it was anti-town to continue to discuss herself/beeboy

i need flavour claims and for beeboy to talk about the godfather shit

Beeboy asked to replace out and lovebird posts once in a blue moon.

Hence why I am answering the questions to help you.

[OnTheMark]

Both pairs have doubled down even after being given 48 hours to rescind free of charge. There are 4 claimed masons.

Mastina and Nico just happen to be the scum ones.

Pedit

Can’t pressure what isn’t here. And why would I pressure a townread when I have flailing scum? Like they can’t explain why they don’t ninja themselves.

[OnTheMark]

lovebird has been active onsite, i can pressure lovebird all i want

the last 3 people you've voted are

- Pine, who we've established is better off kept around and not lynched today

- Not_Mafia, the only person i'm townreading

- one of the masons

do you plan on actually doing anything other than bitching at mastina/nicorobin then?

Pine has not been established as that and should be lynched.

Not Mafia I agree. I reaction voted him.

My Lynch pool is momomen and Pine.

Everyone else I pretty much townread at this point. Except Mastina/Nico who we already established not lynching.

And go for it. You’re just gonna spam the thread asking if they are masons for the billionth time. Then we already determined not lynching mason claims. Soooo hypocrite much?

[OnTheMark]

like the correct move if you want to #ProtestVote is lynch maria

not_mafia is extremely readable and is pro-town as town

Maria is practically IC levels of town.
I would protest vote you rather than her.

[OnTheMark]

Oh, I get it. You will continue insisting we're scum after one of us flips mason because ##Logic, am I right?

Depends on if you flip town mason or scum mason.

If you flip town mason obviously not. At that point Beeboy and Love it’s become conf!scum

However the only way I scumread Beeboy/lovebird is after one of you is dead and flips mason. Mastina is not town and neither are you. You’re just lying about asking the mod that stuff.

I can do it to:

I can lie and say “I asked the mod what the integral of x^2 is over the interval 0,1

[OnTheMark]

Oh yay.

Mastina. Why can’t you target Nico with your ninja? Nico couldn’t explain why.

Pedit

Mathdino they are not vague.
Beeboy saying still masons is in no way “vague”

She said something that makes her town. Deal. She ain’t being lynched like ever.

[OnTheMark]

Oh, I get it. You will continue insisting we're scum after one of us flips mason because ##Logic, am I right?

Depends on if you flip town mason or scum mason.

If you flip town mason obviously not. At that point Beeboy and Love it’s become conf!scum

However the only way I scumread Beeboy/lovebird is after one of you is dead and flips mason. Mastina is not town and neither are you. You’re just lying about asking the mod that stuff.

I can do it to:

I can lie and say “I asked the mod what the integral of x^2 is over the interval 0,1

If you mislynch one of us, that person flips town and your teammates will freely kill the other, thus robbing town of the advantage of having conftowns in LYLO. I am not gonna let you do that.

Like, town you should know that your strategy would cost town the edge of having a conftown in LYLO, and I doubt you'd be that dumb as town....

We get three scum tomorrow if we mislynch a mason pair.

I am aokay lynching a mason if we get three scum out of it.

[OnTheMark]

Nahdia

Quick before you read

Your slot had claimed masons with Lovebird

Do you confirm?

[OnTheMark]

And godfather do you confirm that?

[OnTheMark]

I already destroyed that plan and we’re having momorangel check Beeboy and lovebird.

I already asked Nahdia to claim. I have faith Nahdia will do so.

I also have faith momorangel will cop beeboy and lovebird town which necessitates Mastina and Nico scum ad no way Cheet puts in four confirmed town.

What’s much more likely is almost everyone is neg util which gives scum a place to hide.

And that Mastina and Nico are scum masons.

[OnTheMark]

I'm the new beeboy. What can I do for ya?

Confirm that you are masons with lovebird and you are godfather

[OnTheMark]

VOTE: Nahdia

This and lovebird can now die.

I was countering Mastina because I am compulsive town wall.

In other words I do what Mastina was claiming to do to a person. It’s how I could ensure momorangel’s check wouldn’t be interferes with.

My claim is still counter to Mastina’s but I think my role was intentionally designed to get me to counter claim Mastina.

With Beeboy and Lovebird claiming mason as well there was 0% chance I was believing Mastina/Nico.

Nico screaming that I didn’t deserve my pronouns because of what my sister called me before I was out kinda cemented them scum in my head. I sent a counter claim message to LLD with my full claim in it.

[OnTheMark]

I literally make someone ascetic.

Hence why I knew no one could fuck with momorangel’s check. They would have to kill momorangel

And because Mastina is literally claiming what I can do I was CCing Mastina subtlety thinking there can’t be four masons and Mastina and my role differ

[OnTheMark]

VOTE: lovebird

That was with the mason claim.

With Beeboy gambiting he doesn’t do that as town and especially not this long.

[OnTheMark]

Hence why Mastina claiming they make someone track immune is hella suspicious

Compared with there not being 4 masons as I originally suspected.

Now with Nahdia rescinding we can have momorangel check Mastina.

[OnTheMark]

Mastina's role is very similar to mine

FYI if anyone cares wisdom soft CC’d here

And I was soft CC’ing the entire time

The masons was just a cherry on top without that hurdle Mastina can still be scum but I am chill about letting that go until momorangel can confirm they are town and just mean that Mastina/Nico are just really fucking antitown.

[OnTheMark]

Hence why Mastina claiming they make someone track immune is hella suspicious

Compared with there not being 4 masons as I originally suspected.

Now with Nahdia rescinding we can have momorangel check Mastina.

i mean that's idiotic because mastina/nicorobin are basically conftown now but i guess momrangal basically has nothing better to do

so yeah sure we can do that

anyone who is townreading lovebird, please tell me why

lovebird reads as someone who is recovering from her figuring out her own scumtells (you're welcome, i literally told her a 100% scumtell i had on her, WHOOPS)

there is no nuance that i would expect from town lovebird

Lol they aren’t but momorangel will remove my doubt and Nico was just a meanie earlier who I expect an apology post game from.

[OnTheMark]

The only reason I don’t 100% townread them is they can still be fake claiming masons because of how fucking similar my role is to hers.

But when momorangel should remove that doubt that means I was right there weren’t four masons just Beeboy/Lovebird were fucking with us.

[OnTheMark]

we lynch lovebird right now

nahdia, please describe your ENTIRE relation to lovebird setup-wise

did your predecessor plan this out via PT or messages or some shit?

Edit: I THOUGHT YOU FUCKING SAID BEEBOY WAS TOWN LURKING

I have no connection to Lovebird whatsoever, far as I can tell. Nor have I received any message from them.

I will not answer the second question unless I'm given a very good reason why I'm role claiming. I understand my predecessor did some confusing stuff but that doesn't make my slot scum.

My entire basis for scumreadinf Mastina and Nico was that there was another set of masons and that my role was a CC to Mastina.

You not being masons means that your slots (both loverbird and Beeboy) intentionally conspired to pit me against Mastina and Nico after seeing my softs.

So you bet your ass that if you townread loverbird you will role claim here and now. Because it looks like loverbird and you are both scum who tried to manipulate me into pushing Mastina and Nico because of role similarity

[OnTheMark]

With the lack of clarity it just felt like Mastina and Nico were just adding stuff to try to get me to buy it.

Far as I am concerned lovebird if they flip red then Beeboy.

[OnTheMark]

HOW HARD IS IT TO CLAIM YOUR FLAVOUR HOLY SHIT

HOW HARD IS IT TO READ THE FUCKING THREAD TO REALIZE WE HAVE CLAIMED OUR FLAVOR TEN TIMES (THAT NUMBER IS NOT AN EXAGGERATION) ALREADY HOLY SHIT

...

*looks at pagecount*

...Oh.



Butyeah.

We have claimed our flavor. No fucking joke. Ten times already. Ten fucking times. Not kidding. I didn't bother pulling the exact number up. But between Yume claiming it. Me claiming it. And others exasperated at this question pointing out we did so already. It's at least ten times.

The full list of claims and flavor thusfar is:
beeboy,

Godfather

. May have claimed flavor but if so I don't remember.

Masons with Lovebird

.

Maintains both halves of claim as true: Godfather-Mason.

Mathdino/CheekyTeeky,

beeboy, (Odd/Even)-Inventor

. Inventions unspecified other than that they are positive utility.
Momrangal,

mastina, Mason Cop

. Gets results of "Mason"/"Not Mason".
OnTheMark/Wisdom,

mastina, ?????

. (Role title unclaimed.)

Some vaguely specified negative utility inventor

.
Lovebird,

Mason with beeboy

. Flavor unclaimed; role details also unclaimed.
Lady Lambdadelta,

Sticky voter

. Flavor unclaimed; any additional abilities unclaimed.
NicoRobin, Alisae,

Mason Enabler

. Mason with mastina; enables mastina's abilities.
mastina, Sudowoodo (Alisae/Pine hydra),

Enabled (something unclaimed) Mason

. Mason with NicoRobin; abilities enabled by NicoRobin.

One of unclaimed abilities is a D1 1x Compulsive Track/Watch-Immune Inventor

, flavored as D1 of Twin Trap.
Pine/Sudowoodo [Hydra of Alisae & Pine],

beeboy, (Even/Odd)-Inventor

. Inventions unspecified other than that they match CheekyTeeky/Mathdino.
MOMOMEN [Hydra of Eddie Cane & Killthestory],

Eddie Cane, Self-Janitoring(Flipless) Loud (probably more unclaimed)

. mastina has explicitly confirmed that their Loud ability exists as advertised.

Not_Mafia/RedFlavor, ????, ????, sent something to LLD off of the suspicion they're similar roles and LLD says "that buys the slot a day", but that's all we know.

COMPLETE AND TOTAL UNKNOWNS: MariaR, Kokichi Oma

That's probably the most accurate.

Just claimed it recently when Nahdia rescinded

I make a person ascetic each night compulsive.

I didn’t want to full claim when whether or not 4 masons was vital as I didn’t want scum fucking with it

And LLD states my thoughts exactly.

[OnTheMark]

Hence why your ninja claim was so fishy to me. 4 masons and I am a built in CC to you.

Wisdom sifted his CC and I messaged mine to LLD.

[OnTheMark]

Mod, this goes without saying, but extension for the replacement spam please. Deadline reset to 96 hours from the last replace in would be my suggestion because there's been quite a few, but adding 48 hours works too IG.

I endorse this product and/or service

Just saw this. I also would like this

I also want this

Me too

[OnTheMark]

COMPLETE AND TOTAL UNKNOWNS: MariaR, Kokichi Oma

MIGHT I POINT OUT.
THESE TWO HAVE BEEN TWO OF THE MOST CONSISTENT SCUMSPECTS IN THE ENTIRE GAME RIGHT BEHIND WISDOM/MATHBLADE.

AND YET IN SPITE OF THAT.

THEY ARE THE TWO PLAYERS WHO WE KNOW THE LEAST ABOUT.

WHAT.
THE.
FUCK.

You realize all caps just pisses me off yes?

All caps doesn’t change the fact I am town.

It also doesn’t change the fact that my role is built to be a CC of you and a fuck things up role.

Without the opposing mason claim and Nico and you continually adding shit I probably would have townread you.

Screaming at me doesn’t make me want to listen especially when I feel like your hydra partner despises my very existence and can’t be bothered to show decency.

[OnTheMark]

Am I still scum sir blade?

I don’t fucking know anymore.

[OnTheMark]

And 3 of the 4 there became major wagons. So, lol. LLD is the only one who hasn't for whatever reason.

this is because LLD, like mulch, makes it incredibly anti-town to actually lynch her as either alignment unless she AtE's herself into force replacement (cough cough team mafia)

i'm uninterested in making today any more of a shitshow than it has to be

plus i currently believe LLD's towngame is better than her scumgame (HERESY) so she can probably get BoP'd down the line

I can't tell if this is an insult or a compliment.

you also make it incredibly anti-town to openly/explicitly insult you

AtEing yourself into force replacement was a potshot yeah
i didn't think you went too far but whoops guess ya did. your replacement choked

otherwise you kinda just do the thing where your meta benefits your scumgame
like i said tho i think your current towngame > your current scumgame so i guess i don't really mind

Can we lynch this person for being insufferable?

No.

If anything they forced Nahdia to rescind

So they don’t get lynched. They are a townread