Mini 2032: TAZ Mafia: Murder on the Rockport Limited [over]

[northsidegal]

VOTE: xreckoner

i'm leaning towards nos as town so far.

[northsidegal]

Literally nothing hes done has been AI

that's a pretty strong statement to make, i think. or rather, it seems kind of narrow in what's possible to be looked at as ai. he just seemed natural - obviously it's a pretty flimsy read, but it was still something that stood out enough such that i even had the thought in the first place, which in my mind makes it worth mentioning.

he has two posts so far:
-ignoring RVS
-voting RC

He's here, but hasn't done anything towny. Seems like more than half the playerlist is eager to spew their town alignment, and he is not, and so I'm voting him. Also another thing that may or may not be a thing later

to be clear, are you considering him suspicious for ignoring rvs or are you just including that as the only things he's done?

you're also voting him for what i think is kind of a strange reason, and one totally different than me. why do you think that not having any seeming interest in towntelling is scum-indicative? i actually consider that a towntell, and it's been

pretty

reliable for me, at least so far (it hasn't failed any time i've had the chance to apply it, at least). you don't agree? for some reason i get the feeling that you would, though i'm not sure why.

in this situation i would dispute if it would be applied, though.

[northsidegal]

I call dibs on answering this after north does, it might be a dumb reason but I've got a reason to townread nos.

why wait, by the way?

[northsidegal]

Also, I disagree with NSG that Nos feels town (what's "natural" about calling RC scummy and then doubling down with shitposting?)

you're looking at what he's saying rather than how he's saying it, which is what i was looking at.

do you think he's scummy?

[northsidegal]

i thought i was pretty clear that it wasn't a strong read at all. so yeah, i've got an open mind.

[northsidegal]

honestly? probably not. it's just based off tone, which i think is pretty hard to explain. i guess his joking around was what made it notable for me.

why are you voting skitter?

[northsidegal]

If anything, irritating town RC to the point of self-destruction is pro-scum.

i agree with this and it's why i voted reck

[northsidegal]

20 pages, this ought to be interesting

[northsidegal]

If anything, irritating town RC to the point of self-destruction is pro-scum.

i agree with this and it's why i voted reck

maybe you didn't get there yet but ... kinda surprised taht you aren't objecting to my vote on you

yeah, i hadn't got there, but i'm not all that surprised. why did you expect me to be? you've made it pretty clear in the past that you don't think you can read me.

This playerlist is good, I'm hesitant to TR most anyone here so easily.

are you familiar with the playerlist and peoples scumgames...? seems like a weird comment to make no matter if the answer is yes or no.

Cakes is like the poster child of people who say absolutely absurd and scummy things as town and get hilariously mislynched

huh. i think this post is actually pretty town-indicative. there's a saying that i read from RC about his town philosophy once in a game a long time ago that's stuck with me to this day, and this relates to that pretty well.

[northsidegal]

if anyone cares, i think the basics of what it was was something like "the first step to improving as town is to stop mislynching the townies who do outrageous things and start focusing on the silently scummy players".

[northsidegal]

my very limited memory of varsoon's scumgame is lots of mechanics / objectives talk

so i might imagine that, if scum, he would take more time to talk about the hated modifier here than he actually did

Hated's a trash modifier that indicates design-flaw and should probably be lynched regardless, as I'm reading hated as more likely scum than town in this setup.
But also I don't like Kokichi's main focus being on getting Gacha and mentions of himself as town/townread.
255, 232, 43, 30
Firstpost far too much tips at the role PM being red (thinking he was scum) that it strikes me as scum trying to manufacture a 'townslip' based on how peculiar they thought the sample role/their fakeclaim was in looks. Need to go back to the previous game, though, and see if the different color formatting/fakeclaims is in the mod meta, though, otherwise regardless it just bothers me.

perhaps slightly town indicative

[northsidegal]

Varsoon is scum because town don't scumread players for doing the same thing they themselves are doing.

mathdino disagrees

[northsidegal]

need to do things if they want to be townread and after that they can fuck off and lurk if that's what they want to do but obvsly happier if they stay around

lurking is never something that i

want

to do

i just don't have as much time as i used to. there's

nothing i'd love more

than to go back to when i was just starting out and i could play in +10 games at a time and on multiple accounts and still contribute well in each one of them, but as of now it's just not possible.

[northsidegal]

Mathdino is wrong.

do you still think varsoon is scum? still reading through

[northsidegal]

you think that the townread on reck is really just something he kind of made up? i couldn't imagine why. it seemed to me like something else was going on there.

[northsidegal]

how are you reading reck right now? maybe it's kind of a tinfoil theory but i feel like there's a decent chance that from the start his whole plan as scum might have been to try to set rc off (given his experience in team mafia)

policy double voting someone from the start of the game just because of their personality seems very odd to me, and it came at a time when there was already something of an rvs wagon there (hence my initial vote)

[northsidegal]

Why townread RecK? To pocket him. And manipulate him. Reck is "notorious" (his word) for letting this happen.

And yes, I think he made the townread up. Scum fake reads sometimes, you know? Like, they'll call a townie they want to pocket town, without actually thinking up why that player is town beforehand.

am i misremembering, or did varsoon / reck say that they haven't played together before? unless you're suggesting that someone else who's partnered with varsoon told him about reck's history and came up with a plan for varsoon to do it, how would varsoon know about that history / why would varsoon choose reck in the first place?

it seems oddly specific to me in a way that would suggest something going on that we don't know about that isn't just someone making something up.

Reck's plan? Or Varsoon's?

reck's.

Reck's town.

why?

[northsidegal]

Why are you assuming that something else is going on? I don't see why you'd assume they're both town, that's weird. There's a lot of evidence against Varsoon, not just the fake townread, so maybe you should be reading that behavior in context?

i'm not assuming they're both town. i was just telling you about my theory for why i think reck might be scum. "something else going on" doesn't imply that they're both town.

-shrug-

i don't think it's all that

unlikely

that varsoon is scum, i guess i'm just not all that convinced.

[northsidegal]

VOTE: porkens

i'm fine with this wagon. i know that porkens is normally kind of a zany guy but here it feels more like he's using that as an excuse for not actually doing anything rather than just having it be a part of the way that he scumhunts and plays the game. i suppose it's possible that i'm speaking from an outdated picture of how he plays, but for now i'm fine with it.

[northsidegal]

i've not played with him before but nothing he's doing really feels scummy?

like wtf-y, sure

like he's playing some sort of alternate-reality version of this game that in no way correlates to actual events, sure

but i don't see scum motivation in what he's doing. granted, i don't see town motivation either.

like this doesn't feel like an excuse to me? it just feels like wtf-y and troll-y and 'i have absolutely no idea what to do with this'-y. kinda like nm but in a different flavor if that makes sense

maybe i'll go look up some of his scumgames but atm nothing he's doing really feels purposeful or agenda-driven or like he's trying to accomplish something

it's not really about scum motivation vs town motivation for me, moreso a difference in this game vs how i remember his towngame being

although i would argue that acting weird to not actually have to read the game / put in effort to look towny / justify positions is a perfectly rational scum motivation for what he's doing

[northsidegal]

-shrug-

not sure.

who are your scumreads?

[northsidegal]

i think there are a few differences between the way rc was pushing people in that game vs this one (although i guess you might have more authority on the subject considering you were actually in that game)

i feel like in that game it was VOTE: MATH and then a lot of pushing and pointing out things that just make math "incredibly obvscum" or something

whereas in this game a comment like this seems to have an entirely different motivation

Varsoon there's two ways this can go from here

1) you fuck off and go vote someone else. I do the same. If we're both town this helps everyone

Or

2) I lynch you. You cannot prevent this. If you're town, reck double vote plus scum votes probably kill me tomorrow.

I said what I did regarding Reck because it was better than saying the truth because I don't want to make this game toxic.

that's not to say that a comment like that should individually be townread (although i do townlean the rc slot), just that i think there's a difference between the way he's pushed people as scum before and the way he was pushing varsoon here. i can speak personally as to what it's like to be lynched like that before, and there were even some similarities between the way he lynched math and the way he lynched me in a game a long time ago.

[northsidegal]

i really think it's better for me to try to not-read him and wait for a replacement tbh

not a bad approach

[northsidegal]

I know nsg is scum but i also feel really bad because she was getting away with 0 posting while i wasn't present so i'm gonna lynch her last

my not posting during the thread going from however many pages to 20 pages wasn't a deliberate act, it's just how things turned out.

she's scum but I don't feel like lynching her right now

i guess we can discuss this when you're ready to discuss this? i'm interested in hearing your explanation but if it's something you plan on waiting for then ideally you'll have changed your mind by whatever time that would've been

[northsidegal]

oh. well, i don't think i get killed night one anyways in my current era of being washed up. as a plan i would say it's probably more likely to just get me suspected for the rest of the game from people sheeping you, especially if you were killed early on.

[northsidegal]

huh, all three of those are kind of a surprise for me. mind elaborating?

[northsidegal]

What's your readslist?

don't really have anything all that specific

creature, sircakez, shoshin, maybe nosferatu town

reck and porkens scum

you've probably already read what i said but i kind of lean towards your slot being more likely town

looking at the playerlist irrelephant is someone whose posts i don't actually really remember reading, which might be indicative in itself

[northsidegal]

Ordinarily I would be telling myself that I need to trust you more but I also think that those people are people that you are systematically likely to be wrong on: do you agree with me that that's the case?

which people?

[northsidegal]

@Creature, Cakez, NSG, Nosferatu

Can we really not lynch Porkens?

sure, i'm willing to put Lorne's off for later. thinking my lack of memory of irrelephqnt is likely indicative, can elaborate more later

VOTE: irrel

[northsidegal]

hi sorry been kind of busy

from what little i've seen of the votecount i'm not sure why the irrel wagon died / is only me

[northsidegal]

huh gamma emerald is actually being scummier than i thought rc was

[northsidegal]

Irrelephant's a bad vote. Very bad.

i'm still unconvinced of his being town and feel like this is one of those situations where if i try to put this off then it just never ends up happening

those games are the absolute worst to look back on because even though you can say that you were at some point right you just never did anything about it

[northsidegal]

not sure why this lynch is happening specifically

[northsidegal]

not sure why this lynch is happening specifically

He's like my only scumread this game rn.

are you townreading reck

[northsidegal]

If I am, probably just because he's a doublevoter.

i don't think that's a very good reason to townread him

[northsidegal]

feels like things are just stalling as they are

[northsidegal]

-shrug-

could be either really - he could be getting bussed or he could be getting mislynched. either way there are other people i'd rather vote

[northsidegal]

I think you're town, nsg, but I don't get why you're townreading gamma g, if you are

maybe not a townread

there are people i'd rather lynch and even if he is scum getting bussed for my peace of mind i would rather lynch the scum bussing him first for the scenario in which he isn't scum

i still think reck is scum

[northsidegal]

VOTE: reck

[northsidegal]

can you do a quick case?
I'm usually v/la on Saturday/Sunday and I want some idea of what I'm sheeping before I sheep

i think i've talked about it before. consider for a moment that the double vote doesn't make him town. what has he done that's towny this game

[northsidegal]

yeah i havent moved my vote bc i dont wanna lose the doublevote just in case it winds up being the RCslot today and honestly nothing else is making me feel real good or passionate and nobody has presented anything resembling a good argument or case as to why i should move my vote

this lack of real opinions is why i think you're scum

[northsidegal]

I'd take either of those right now. I think Irrel's more likely to flip scum but the combined force of Gamma's worst posts and RC's worst posts make that slot a dumpster fire for me.

?

gamma emerald was the one who replaced rc, not gammagooey?

[northsidegal]

:thonking:

[northsidegal]

VOTE: irrel

[northsidegal]

It'd be nice if you guys don't lynch one of my townreads...

vote reck with me instead?

[northsidegal]

he's scum coasting

[northsidegal]

the lack of opinions or attempts at solving

[northsidegal]

Hmm, maybe. Why not Varsoon?

no reason in specific just scumread others more

[northsidegal]

lets lynch reck first then

[northsidegal]

the flip should help sort my scumreads out anyways because of things like these

Reading his ISO...

VOTE: Reckoner

The more I play forum mafia the more I enjoy last minute wagons

[northsidegal]

vote irrelephant or reck

[northsidegal]

scum probably got the self watcher and knew they had to kill varsoon. might be able to catch another scum from spending histories

[northsidegal]

Also how would self-watcher work if they were blocked?

does it also get blocked? guess it would huh

[northsidegal]

can respond more later on an early skim i think kokicji is suspect

[northsidegal]

I’ll just claim now since I think my role is important
I’m a food vendor. I won’t say who I targeted or what I vend specifically until someone speaks up about receiving any food. But I figured I could vend to Kokichi tonight, ask who got food, and see if a switcheroo happened. That’s why I said I wasn’t interested in voting him today.

are you saying you gave food to kokichi tonight?

[northsidegal]

i asked you because if you said yes it would mean kokichi did the swap thing with me. obviously.

[northsidegal]

it was the logical choice to confirm who you targeted before revealing that i received it.

[northsidegal]

dont like voting with kokichi and reck but gamma being a lot scummier than rc was

[northsidegal]

Im kinda troubled by the fact that nsg isnt really doing anything

seems disingenuous considering the overall pace of the game

[northsidegal]

saying i should be reevaluating implies there was something associative to my scumreads, which isn't the case. i've always liked cogito ergo sum's thoughts on this:

I know this is a concept floating for some reason but this is actually the completely opposite of how it works. Eddie (and Postie) flipping town simply makes it more likely that Marquis is scum - there's only 3 scum and quite a few people look townie to various degrees so it's only become more likely that Marquis is scum. If you're looking for someone and there's 2 man-sized bushes, it's 50-50 they're in the first one but if the first bush is empty, then it's very likely Marquis is hiding in the other one.

[northsidegal]

ok what do you think about reck (ie the other person you were trying to get lynched that day that you haven't really mentioned much since then)?

still think he's scum but considering as he's basically only voted gamma today and nothing else i don't have much new to talk about. i suppose it could be said that gamma and reck probably aren't s/s.

wondering whether to pursue reck or try to go more off the varsoon rb today.

[northsidegal]

VOTE: kokichi

[northsidegal]

I'm hated so dont forget. But yea I am VT

[northsidegal]

did kokichi actually buy a swap and is just trying to suicide on shoshin or something

if so, is there a way to actually kill him without also killing whoever he targeted or do we jsut have to do it

[northsidegal]

you don't seem enthusiastic about this lynch skitter

vote reck with me?

[northsidegal]

oh yeah, i forgot about that

[northsidegal]

i mean theres no real "testing" it, either hes telling the truth and he dies or hes lying and then we lynch him anyways

[northsidegal]

okay i believe koki's claim

all aboard the gamma wagon

why does it make him town

[northsidegal]

that's assuming that it doesn't get disabled in lylo. if it does then its just you scumclaiming and isnt broken at all

[northsidegal]

for someone who was apparently scumreading kokichi you seem awfully willing to take him at his word

[northsidegal]

if the mod gave me a role PM that doesn't mention my role doesn't work in lylo then im more than willing to lose this game and chalk it up to mod incompetence rather than believe xyzzy is a bad mod and didn't include these things from the start

talking about kokichis hated not your double vote

[northsidegal]

how am i scumreading kokichi

1448

[northsidegal]

gatchapon vote:

kokichi

excuse me

[northsidegal]

wow i saw that post and instantly i can't remember why i've been ignoring nos

[northsidegal]

@skitter what are you thinking rn

also i dont want this going to kokichi

gachapon vote: nsg

[northsidegal]

Maybe skitter actually
I feel like getting targeted by that vote fuckery make skitter likely town

what vote fuckery?

[northsidegal]

kokichi / nos is gaining so much scum value and while i still scumread both gamma and reck if kokichi flips scum then the game is just solved

[northsidegal]

NSG cannot be trusted, please don't gacha her.

Did NSG ever confirm receiving fruit? I don't understand why she's being so uncooperative on that front.

what is this ridiculous shade? that discussion was ended like an entire week ago. how at all am i being "uncooperative"?

[northsidegal]

i can't understand why you're not townreading me.

[northsidegal]

one sentence is a massive overreaction? also, you didn't say you trust yourself over me, you said that i (literal quote) "cannot be trusted".

i asked gamma for confirmation before answering because that was the entirely logical thing to do given the opportunity to catch someone in a lie.

[northsidegal]

being wrong isn't a scumtell.

[northsidegal]

not really, i'm just frustrated with you.

[northsidegal]

and you've done something scummy in that you lynched Irrelephant despite his obvious townness and despite the fact that I pointed out multiple reasons to townread him.

this is scumreading me for being wrong.

[northsidegal]

fine, guess i'll stop talking.

[northsidegal]

sometimes when people say things that i disagree with or want clarification on i just respond without necessarily having a predetermined goal in mind.

[northsidegal]

Well I feel like nsg kinda should have made that connection.

town lost that game because they didn't listen to me. i will never ever accept my own lynch.

[northsidegal]

Well I accepted my lynch in American presidents and town won. You wouldn’t know that because you flaked tho

I didn't "flake", I went

on vacation with no internet access.

What's even your point? The fact that you accepted your lynch in a game and town won anyways isn't a reason to believe that accepting your lynch is sometimes necessary.

[northsidegal]

and i don't think anyone was voting you for the block after i said that i received fruit.

[northsidegal]

I thought NSG was on Koki with me?

i think the vc is wrong.

[northsidegal]

sorry for the inactivity. i think this is where i want to end the day

VOTE: reck

[northsidegal]

i'm pretty sure i put you at l1, not hammering

[northsidegal]

skitter can you talk a bit about your wordless hammer on reck yesterday. it makes sense given your previous read but your not saying anything with it seems strange to me

[northsidegal]

nsg what are your reads like right about now?

thinking that nosferatu might be the most likely to be scum

having done a bit of self-reflecting he's occupied the "silently scummy" spot this entire game and i have always firmly believed that those people are the most likely to be scum. plus, a lot of his play yesterday just doesn't hold up under closer scrutiny, especially his reasons for being on the reck wagon at all and his reaction when reck called him out for it

Nosferatu is just openly trolling and admitting the wagon on me is dumb but staying on it anyway

imma be for real for real

i did not forsee the gamma nsg scumteam and if i was awake and saw that nsg vote i would have unvoted

~probably~ should have with the shit that rc did regarding nsg but

i was trolling pretty hard right there and your anger is ~mostly~ valid

[northsidegal]

gamma do you have any thoughts on skitters wordless hammer as it might relate to her alignment

[northsidegal]

It feels within how I feel skitter has been up to now.

elaborate?

[northsidegal]

it kinda feels like he's pre-emptively apologizing for reck flipping town and being on the wagon

and like setting up going after you + gamma today

.

bolded is exactly what i was thinking

[northsidegal]

yes i can understand the literal textual meaning of what your words say. what i would like elaboration on is what exactly you mean by a wordless hammer being similar to "how you feel she's been up to now"

[northsidegal]

gamma do you have any thoughts on skitters wordless hammer as it might relate to her alignment

what are your thoughts wrt my wordless hammer as it might relate to my alignment

[northsidegal]

okay. i still don't really understand what that means but i don't think i'm really going to get any sort of answer that i was looking for. the wordless hammer seemed weird to me at first but then i remembered that she did something similar as town in splatoon mafia when voting a guilty that also rubbed me the same way. thought you might have remembered that

[northsidegal]

no idea what that means, sorry

it's interpretive

(don't think it's scummy, just wanted gamma to answer first)

[northsidegal]

because i read a lot of games on this site.

[northsidegal]

meh

VOTE: nosferatu

[northsidegal]

it kinda feels like he's pre-emptively apologizing for reck flipping town and being on the wagon

and like setting up going after you + gamma today

.

bolded is exactly what i was thinking

except you felt like concealing it when you put your vote down for no reason?? lmfao what?

in what way was i "concealing it"? this doesn't make sense. are you referring to yesterday? if so, you made that post after i voted reck

[northsidegal]

comes in no context goes "i think i wanna end the day here" and puts reck to L-1
did next to nothing previously and basically lolhammered since skitter follows up a few hours later in an equally sus manner

it's not as if i hadn't talked about reck before. my preexisting scumread on reck was pretty clear.

and no, someone else hammering reck after i voted him is not "basically a lolhammer" at all. that's ridiculous.

[northsidegal]

Also think its lowkey scummy of him to not be concerned about that and to have not brought it up

this is a really good thought

tring skitter a bit more

[northsidegal]

@nsg

Its been like two dayphases and i still dont know why you did this

disagreeing with someone isn't "ignoring evidence". it just isn't. yes, i was wrong. doesn't mean i "ignored evidence"

[northsidegal]

i talked to mod about it did i not post it here?

that uh

seems like the kind of thing that would be in your role pm.

[northsidegal]

saying that i was "concealing" something just because someone else elucidated a thought we both shared before i did is pretty silly

[northsidegal]

like, do you really think that that's what happened every time someone says "I was thinking something similar"

[northsidegal]

meh.

i can agree that kokichi probably should be lynched today, but something still feels kind of wrong.

shoshin, why are you keeping your reads a secret until tomorrow?

[northsidegal]

(the thought also occurred to me that kokichi's hated might actually go away in lylo but he's saying otherwise in an effort to try to catch out scum in lylo, but i imagine that if that were the case he probably would've brought up some more WIFOM related to it or hinted at it in some way)

[northsidegal]

why are your posts so banal and passive and like ... not scum-hunt-y?

see the first line of my signature

is this the first game we've played together in a while? i don't think that i'm playing all that much differently than i've played in my recent games, although i would understand if you were comparing to my games from a while ago (say, before this summer)

i mean, i would argue that from an objective standpoint i think i have pretty strong reasons to be townread (the strongest being RC's read on me). where exactly are you trying to go with your vote on me? you've told me repeatedly before that you find me hard to read, and i'm not sure what you really expect as a response from me here. yes, i understand that i lack motivation. i wish just as much as you do that i didn't, but i do.

To be clear, Koki, I'm confirmed townf from your perspective because of switcheroo.

If I were scum, I would have used switcheroo on a townie. That means if I'm lynched today, town dies. Then I'd go into LYLO and quickly lynch you.

So, you need to rethink the whole "Shoshin is scum" bit you've been pushing and work with me if you're actually town here.

i don't think that makes you confirmed town...?

shoshin, can you be a bit more clear in exactly how much of your vote today is based on a scumread vs how much you just think it's the optimal play? yes, you've said you think he'll flip scum, but was that the primary reason for your vote or was it just the mechanics? if it's primarily a scumread you're not playing around it like i would expect you to.

[northsidegal]

@nosferatu, thoughts on kokichi needing to die before tomorrow?

[northsidegal]

like here it's not an activity-based read.

wasn't saying it was.

-shrug-

maybe you should take a quick glance through my iso in one of my recent games.

what would these reasons be?

i mean, rc's read is first and foremost (and probably takes precedence over everything else, honestly), but apart from that i guess i would call it more of a relative thing - that is, i feel like a lot of people are playing scummy this game, even people who i doubt are actually scum (like porkens and to a lesser extent shoshin)

by the way, you keep pointing out how passive i'm being as if it's something that you don't expect, which is strange to me, because that's basically been all my towngame has been recently (much to my chagrin as i've mentioned multiple times in dead threads of recent games). i think your view of me might be being falsely shaped by your experience with that other, more aggressive player.

[northsidegal]

-shrug-

despite my paranoia my current view of the game is that it's probably just kokichi and nosferatu

[northsidegal]

link me a recent towngame that you think is representative of this playstyle?

compare the first few posts of my iso here with the last few, and then realize that got cut short night one

and also look at my reads that game to see how amazing i am of course (you might need a reminder after my earlier play this game)

[northsidegal]

i am, but in some sense he's the "paranoia read" that i was talking about. i thought rc was towny and that's pretty much the only source of my townread on the slot. my current view is that kokichi and nos make the most sense, but if kokichi turns out to be town then gamma's scum equity goes up a lot (although in that case i think nos would still be a stronger scumread)

[northsidegal]

haven't spent any gold, pretty sure i haven't had enough to actually buy anything. don't have any night actions to claim

my current poe is two in {gamma, nosferatu, shoshin}, with porkens and skitter as town

porkens is a player who despite being lynchbait-y i'm actually pretty sure that i can read now, having had a bit of time and experimentation so to speak (only vaguely sure as to how much i can talk about this so you get a vague answer for now). for the most part i would say that nosferatu's assessment was pretty accurate - porkens is probably one of the only players i know who i would actually say "openwolfs" as scum (i think a lot of people use that term pretty loosely but in this case i think it applies).

even beyond my own read on him, porkens neighborized me and creature night 2, and then creature died night 3. it seems somewhat unlikely to be that scum would spend gold like that only to end up killing a member of the neighborhood, so that solidifies my townread there.

for skitter it's mostly a matter of a townread and a comparison to the people who are left. on an individual level i think skitter has asked a lot of pretty good questions / had some pretty good thoughts this game that i think are more likely to come from town, but even further, when i start to consider skitter not being town i have to ask myself "well then who the hell is town?" because i really don't think nosferatu is town, my townread of RC is pretty outdated at this point, and shoshin keeps playing really weirdly in this way that makes me question if my expectations are off or if i really am seeing something different.

although to be fair i think gamma/nos is more likely than any combination involving shoshin.

{porkens, skitter}
{shoshin}
{gamma, nos}

[northsidegal]

shoshin, could you be a bit more clear about your reads / is there some reason you aren't?

[northsidegal]

, and shoshin keeps playing really weirdly in this way that makes me question if my expectations are off or if i really am seeing something different.

Elaborate?

it's mostly a comparison with pokemon go and the way she pushed her scumreads pretty aggressively there vs the way she's dealt with them this game

---
so let me get this clear: these are the claims we have on the table:

I got gamma's food last night, so if someone got rb'd, it wasnt him (i was also specifically told it came from gamma so i guess hes a loud fruit vendor?)

I switcheroo'd myself & Skitter. Yes, I was hoping scum would try to kill me so that Skitter would die.

I lied. Gamma visited you. Which means he targeted me.

how exactly do tracker results work with switcheroo? i would think that a track would still show a person going to A if they targeted A even if A switcheroo'd with B, but perhaps not. under the interpretation where switcheroo doesn't change who a person who visits someone would be seen visiting when tracked, i'm pretty sure we have directly conflicting claims.

the fact that gamma also did not react or respond in any way at all to skitter's claiming that she received the fruit (literally the first post of the day) is pretty scum indicative. i think i'm leaning towards wanting to lynch gamma the most out of my three right now

[northsidegal]

Gamma's town because of his role. He confirmed it through you and NSG. And that means the scum killed Creature on the same night that Gamma gave Creature food, which just doesn't make any sense from a scum Gamma perspective because Gamma was under pressure to confirm his role. Why would scum add to the paranoia we already had about Gamma? On top of that, we now know that Gamma wasn't rb'd unless NSG lied about receiving food, which means even if Gamma is scum, we lynch NSG first, because it's very, very unlikely that Gamma's scum unless NSG is too.

i'm not sure why you think him being a fruit vendor makes him in some way more likely to be town - that doesn't really make sense to me.

i can

see

the argument of him giving it to creature the same night that he died, but isn't it completely equally as possible that he was the one who killed creature and was concerned about having been tracked? like, you seem to be already starting from the position of him being town

[northsidegal]

@mod

: if A were to target B who was switcheroo'd with person C, who would A be tracked to visiting?

[northsidegal]

i mean i was the recipient of it in pokemon go, it was just very aggressive

almost immediately after she started scumreading me she wrote posts and posts and paragraphs and paragraphs about why i should be lynched, all the while asking other people for their read on me / why they were townreading me, and asking them to vote with her:

Spoiler:

NSG's belief that I contradicted myself is weird, too.

Like, there's a very clear progression here. I thought she was town who had some paranoia of me based on inactivity. I wouldn't have cared about that and even said it was okay for her to suspect me a bit at that point in the game. But then I learn that she suspects me based on content, not inactivity. At which point I realize something is off about her. I skim some of her other posts and realize she's defending Profii for bullshit reasons that she can't even come up with. I realize her reads are fake. And so I start suspecting her. And then she says I'm contradicting myself because I happen to have a progression to my reads? That's scummy in itself. Like, she's not looking at the obvious town tells in front of her because she's pushing a lazy theory of me and Kokichi as scum without actually doing any real scumhunting or townhunting.

I'd lynch NSG today. Profii/NSG makes the most sense to me at this point.

Creature, look at the way NSG is misrepresenting me. Taking something completely out of context while ignoring what I'm actually saying to push this idea that I'm contradicting myself. Please explain to me how that isn't scummy.

NSG saying that I'm scummy because of content is bullshit. My content is fine. She suspects me because I'm not around, period. Saying otherwise is bullshit. And so is her read on Profii. I don't see how she's townreading that.

This is my original post.

And this is how NSG presents the original post:

NSG saying that I'm scummy because of content is bullshit. My content is fine. She suspects me because I'm not around, period.

She completley ignores the part where I describe what NSG's doing ("saying otherwise") as "bullshit." This is incredibly manipulative. It's how actual misrepresentation looks. You take something that a townie said out of context and then emphasize its importance while ignoring everything else the player said.

Hey Maria, remember this is exactly what I suspected Shepard for in Errant's game? He did the same shit to me and he flipped scum, as you know.

And of course so much hedging in all of NSG's posts. Doesn't want to overstate anything. Doesn't have confidence about anything. Yet has this core group of poe based on nothing? Like, no reason to townread Profii yet refuses to vote him? NSG's posting this game is bullshit. Her reads don't make any sense. Her focus on a couple scumreads based on poe suggests a strong degree of confidence about townreads, yet there's nothing to the townreads...

What the fuck? No. Were not policy lynching.

Creature, why is NSG town? Explain.

2. She suspects me because I'm not around, period. Saying otherwise is bullshit.

NSG is right - if you find NSG scummy, any reason NSG has posted is therefore fabricated as she is informed already. Therefore you saying she has a genuine reason to scum read you means NSG is uninformed, ergo, town.

Look at NSG's 1900.

To be clear, NSG ignores the part of my post that desribes what she's actually doing "saying otherwise" and thus ignores the part of my post that says her behavior is fake (i.e. "bullshit").

Yes, in the middle of my train of thought I consider what NSG would do as town as compared with what she'd do as scum. That isn't scummy, it's how townies think. You look at both sides - is this town? or is it scum? - and then you compare what NSG's doing with those metrics. NSG wasn't suspecting me because of inactivity (her words), she was suspecting me because of content. Thus, NSG's read is fake. This isn't complicated.

When I questioned NSG about this, what'd she do? Instead of representing me accurately, she says that I never called her read fake until AFTER she called out the contradiction in 1869. Then she quotes 1869 but removes the part of the post where I call her read fake. She literally hides that part of the post from view. It's visible to all, but she doesn't want to acknowledge it, because she's arguing that I never called her read fake until AFTER she called out a made-up contradiction.

Let's also be clear about someting. There's nothing contradictory about considering what a player would do as town AND scum in a situation - looking at both sides of things - that's just a good scumhunting habit.

NSG suspected me for reasons that appeared to be based on inactivity. My initial reaction to that was to interpret NSG's suspicion as some justified paraonia based on my inactivity. But when I said that, she clarified that she didn't suspect me for inactivity. And that's what pinged me initially. So I'm there reconciling two points of view - one view is that NSG's a townie who got paranoid of me because I was disengaged from the game - the other point of view is that NSG's scum who made up some reasons to suspect me. NSG tells me that she's not the first, so that's when I begin suspecting her for the second. And that's what my 1869 points out - it's reconciling two competing views of NSG based on how NSG describes her reasons for suspecting me.

there's really just nothing all that comparable in this game except maaybe with varsoon on day one

[northsidegal]

the fact that gamma also did not react or respond in any way at all to skitter's claiming that she received the fruit (literally the first post of the day) is pretty scum indicative. i think i'm leaning towards wanting to lynch gamma the most out of my three right now

Why is this scum-indicative?

What do you think he did last night? Ie how do you think scum!gamma resolves everything?

i guess i have two reasons / possibilities:

the first, in a non-partner context, is that he just isn't reading the thread very closely - essentially just popping in to say something random and not really all that game relevant and then popping out. not reading the thread closely is something i've considered a pretty reliable scumtell for a while, especially for players who have posting styles similar to gamma's

Spoiler:

about ready to park my vote on gamma again

my role gives extra gold to a targeted person on the list,

ive only used it 2 times, on kokichi, and porkens, n3, n4

I don’t trust those selections at all tbh

I only used gold last night to protect my target because I was salty after Creature died

the second would be considering the possibility that gamma and shoshin are scum together and gamma stayed silent to not contradict shoshin when it came to any of the details of what she's saying about tracking him / to wait for her to claim the track before saying anything about you getting the fruit

[northsidegal]

what are your reads?

[northsidegal]

i'm still not really following why it's scum-indicative for him to have not reacted really

-shrug-

experience has told me that people don't usually agree with me when it comes to "not reading closely" being a scumtell. it's worked for me before, so it's just something i usually look out for.

and i'm not really liking that nsg leapt to scum!gamma. like that narrative really only makes sense if gamma is scum with shoshin and shoshin performed the nk n1 since gamma wasn't rb'd then (if he had been he'd have to be scum with nsg but i'm assuming only 2 alive scum rn)

lept to? you know that i already had gamma as scum at the start of the day, right? like, my observation wasn't any sort of change in opinion - it was just that, an observation.

---
i am leon the artificer, it takes one less vote for me to win the fantasy gachapon (the flavor is that i'm the "gachapon operator")

[northsidegal]

Finally, let's talk about NSG. She led the mislynch on Irrelephant on D1, as a direct counterwagon to scum Gammagooey.

it seems pretty hypocritical to point to this as a reason for me being scum when you were on varsoon the whole day, who was also town. is there some difference just because irrelephant was the one whose wagon ended up going through over varsoons?

She also tried getting a counterwagon to Gammagooey on Reck, who was one of RC's strongest scumreads for personal reasons rather than actual game-related reasons (look at my arguments with NSG about both Irrelephant and Reck, both of whom were town and both who I correctly read as town).

just because RC (and i) were wrong about reck doesn't mean you can say that his scumread was only for personal reasons. there were

without a doubt

actual reasons to scumread reck (outside any sort of personal issue) - just because he flipped town doesn't mean those reasons didn't exist. that's being results oriented vs probability oriented.

On top of that, she's been a complete non-presence ini this game, and she's shown nothing close to the level of aggressive play that she showed in POkemon (where she was inactive town but still played with a lot more care about who was lynched - here, she never showed any care about who the lynch was because all the lynches were ending up on town, and the one time there was a potential lynch on scum (Gammagooey), she actually worked to get Irrelephant/Reck mislynched on D1).

not only are you unambiguously wrong here, you're completely backwards. i've put more into trying to get the people i want lynched lynched in this game than i ever did in pokemon go. i mean, that game i was

really

lazy.

And, of course, now she's suddenly townreading Skitter above everyone else, suddenly, for reasons that are so obviously faked because there's actually nothing to townread about Skitter. Like, look at NSG's reasoning ("oh, skitter is town because if she's not town who is??"). And of course she goes after you and me because, well, that's all she's got left now that I'm onto her and Skitter. And of course, it's process of elimination.

1) my townread on skitter isn't something new.
2) "there's actually nothing to townread about skitter" lol. for one, what you quoted isn't my sole reason for towneading skitter, and for two it isn't even a bad reason in the first place - it's basically just occam's razor and in fact that sentiment is one that i basically copied verbatim from watching RC solve in situations like this

and also you seem to imply that i've somehow lost my scumread on nos, which again is not true

[northsidegal]

given that i got it and shoshin swapped me/her and that seems to be where the nk was too given that nobody else is explaining where the nk went

i mean i think a no-kill is probably the most likely answer

[northsidegal]

did shoshin say what night she did the switcheroo on?

[northsidegal]

and also given how public shoshin was about having / buying switcheroo it seems like a fallacy to say that scum must have shot at her wanting her to die and thus she's town

[northsidegal]

if gamma is town that makes scum!nsg make a little less sense.

I wouldn't think RC would read that slot wrong as town and also go to such lengths to protect it by pretending to scumread it

so what are you thinking?

[northsidegal]

:thonking:

[northsidegal]

because your response to saying 'i'm pretty sure we have directly conflicting claims' (which apparently we don't, but that's irrelevant, the point is that you thougth we did at the time) is to lynch outside of it

it's not that i think that the gamma scumread came out of nowhere, but rather that i don't understand why your impulse is to lynch outside of a pair of conflicting claims in lylo

having already scumread nos/gamma the most, gaining information that to me either pointed to a) gamma scum or b) gamma/shoshin scum made me think that out of the three players in my poe, the one singularly most likely to flip scum would be him (not sure if i still believe that)

you thought about it in a totally different way than i did: for me it was a simple weighting of evidence and i don't think i made the same connection to the claims as you did. obviously if xyzzy had come back to say that essentially shoshin was directly counterclaiming your story then we would lynch within one of you

[northsidegal]

nsg i'm still having a bit of bop-scumread thing with you.

that's something you should really work out soon because i really don't think i should be scumread here, basically by anyone.

why?

i feel like a lot of the playerlist could be considered as a potential mislynch target and i feel like scum might have been trying to keep a wide pool of suspects

i'm not following this, elaborate?

as far as i understood it, you were saying "gamma doctored shoshin, and nobody died, thus scum must have also shot at shoshin, thus shoshin is probably town" (correct me if i'm wrong)

where i think the mistake in that line of reasoning is the "scum must have shot at shoshin thus shoshin is probably town" line: shoshin had already made it clear that she either had enough gold for switcheroo or had already purchased switcheroo. thus, nobody would target shoshin hoping that she died, right?

[northsidegal]

i mean, shoshin's track is also something to consider. yeah, it doesn't give hard innos or guilties, but it could turn what would otherwise be a confusing lylo into a 1v1

just seems more likely to me

[northsidegal]

for me it was a simple weighting of evidence

(to elaborate on this: if i already consider nos/gamma and i see something that either points to gamma or to shoshin/gamma, taking all of that together has the most that points towards gamma compared to anyone else)

[northsidegal]

ones that i completed or ones that i was replaced out of

[northsidegal]

helloo!

[northsidegal]

scum probably got the self watcher and knew they had to kill varsoon. might be able to catch another scum from spending histories

this is still a weird post; not sure why you went to self-watcher here and not 'varsoon basically claimed a rb guilty in his opening post that gammag suicided to prevent him to reveal'

or why you thought spending histories were a thing

i don't really consider roleblocker guilties "guilties" so that didn't really occur to me as a motivation. it seemed more likely to me that he tracked someone to a kill or something of that sort

i wasn't referring to "spending histories" as a specific thing, just moreso the idea tha tkeeping track of how people spent their money could potentially reveal scum if they had done the self watch

[northsidegal]

N

ormally, I'd be throwing down on Gammagoo for that hammer, but I'm actually pretty sure of scum that isn't him.

S

o right now, I'm gonna sit on that, though, 'cus I am interested in what everyone else has to think.

G

ooey, do you have anything you want to share?

uh maybe i'm overlooking things but look at the bolded, first letter of each sentence

porkens did you see this?

i'm laughing right now but i'm also really disappointed. this is the exatc same shit that happened to me in product placement mafia and i just don't have the same energy to get as mad as i got in that game, nor do i want to repeat any of that game. if you ever wanted to see perhaps the angriest i've ever been in a game of mafia, look no further. the summary is that i was roleblocked on the same night that a kill was stopped and thus people got it in their heads that i "had" to be lynched, while all the while i was screaming to actually lynch scum (and the rest of the game proceeded to ignore me, kill me anyways, and lose to the scum i was pointing out).

did varsoon rb me n2 or whatever? yeah, it probably looks that way. not really sure how common the "nsg" letters are but they seem pretty specific. that doesn't make me scum.

i really don't want to go through that whole same situation again.

you're making a lot of assumptions to get to me being scum from varsoon blocking me. none of those assumptions are reliable and they're not things you should be going off of over the actual evidence that points to me being town

[northsidegal]

Its been three days and she's posted elsewhere on site. If she doesnt post by like tomorrow, im prob just voting her

my point is she posted onsite about a day after i pointed out the rb thing, and then flaked

that was just something quick on my phone. do you think that i would ignore my modding responsibilities or something just to avoid posting here? i don't understand what kind of correlation you're meant to be pointing out here.

[northsidegal]

would like to see what shoshin has to say

[northsidegal]

if you guys are going to lynch me after rc called me locktown multiple times, shoshin has essentially prodged today after promising amazing reads yesterday and gamma has pretended to play the game then this town deserves to lose. that's not even talking about actually lynching today instead of no-lynching.

if i get lynched and someone gets a lucky doc protect or something it's gamma / shoshin.

[northsidegal]

"explain NSG"

you know full well that your choices are to call me scum or accept NSG as town.

I can't believe NSG is more town than me. That's absurd.

I can read NSG better than you

You said yourself I have never seen your scum game

[northsidegal]

skitter you said it doesn't make sense for me to think gamma is scum and also say that rc's townread clears me

even if you think we're both scum it still makes sense to lynch him first. also on a personal level rc would bus me if we were scum together rather than trying to clear me. i know this because that's what i would ask him to do and because something similar happened before when we rolled scum as a hydra. he could've ghostwritten posts for me but he didn't because it just made more sense for him to take control of the game himself.

[northsidegal]

pedit indeed

[northsidegal]

also gamma/shoshin logistically makes no sense

why not

[northsidegal]

i honestly have no idea. maybe scum really did no-kill for some reason. maybe they all lurked it out and forgot to submit a kill. both are things that i've actually seen happen before and subsequently send town into a wild goose chase later trying to explain the discrepancy. if i had to guess i would put at as one of those. all i know is that it doesn't make me scum

[northsidegal]

do you bus as scum?

there was a point a decent amount into my career where i had yet to cast a vote against a scumbuddy

pretty sure that's no longer true but i don't really remember any of my most recent scumgames

[northsidegal]

is there some reason not to? because your last line is explicitly a reason

to

[northsidegal]

it's not like anything was really sacrificed from that sequence of events. a fruit vend is pretty useless and unless they were concerned about some remaining investigative or something then using what they have in a series of events designed such that the complicated nature of things makes it look like they're not partnered is just the smart thing to do.

[northsidegal]

do you bus as scum?

t

here was a point a decent amount into my career where i had yet to cast a vote against a scumbuddy

pretty sure that's no longer true but i don't really remember any of my most recent scumgames

ok this is what i was getting at.

besides for nos you've only voted people who flipped; incidentally all of those people flipped town
and what i wanted to check is as scum if you really avoid pushing your partners like at all

if you're going to take this as an alignment indicative point, don't you think that's the kind of thing you should check rather than just taking my word for it? (and really only taking the first part of my word there)

this is part of my BOP thing with you - have you had towngames where you've never pushed scum in xylo?

only very early on in my "career"

[northsidegal]

you're assuming that shoshin did the switcheroo yesterday. is that true?

[northsidegal]

i mean i think this whole time we've also been assuming that shoshin has been telling the truth about having switcheroo but if shoshin and gamma are both scum that isn't even necessarily true, is it?

[northsidegal]

i think these are the three most recent ones.

2024
pres
817

[northsidegal]

but then what did she do with it?
i guess you can say she never had it but like ... what did she do with all that gold?

tracking people each night? ascetic / self watch each night? both of these? not sure.

mainly my point is that when i got reminded of shoshin saying something about how we'd have to lynch you if we wanted to lynch her or the inverse or something it just got me thinking how great of a plan to fake that it'd be as scum. even if you scumclaimed you would still get someone else lynched.

[northsidegal]

also honestly i think shoshin's most recent play (maybe even her play ever since around day 2 / 3) makes sense in the context of having some kind of strategy where even if you're scummy you still win - if i had that strategy then i would probably not really put in all that much effort because you just wouldn't even really need to. it might even be better to

not

put in effort to get people to scumread you and buy into the lie of switcheroo and then lynch your claimed "target"

[northsidegal]

yeah she wanted to lynch herself to lynch me - oh right that's why i believed it because that's a really really dumb thing to proposeif you don't have switcheroo

i don't think scum honestly thinks they can mislynch you here. has anyone except shoshin at the start of the day even brought up you being scum?

[northsidegal]

To be clear, this game would already be over if I were scum, because I have switcheroo.

interesting quote in the context of what i was talking about

[northsidegal]

(when i say "interesting", really i mean "this person is really probably scum", but just with less aggressive presentation)

[northsidegal]

she definitely proposed lynching herself to lynch me and not the other way around

lynching herself (without switcheroo) as scum in xylo is like ... not a smart thing to do and townspews me

are you saying that voting herself was something that she actually planned on doing? i don't think that's actually the case.

[northsidegal]

so your theory is that she had to 'prove' that she had switcheroo and that's what happened last night
she either used it or she's scum with gamma (or both) in order for all the claims to make sense

those aren't mutually exclusive

[northsidegal]

so your theory is that she had to 'prove' that she had switcheroo and that's what happened last night

the point i was trying to make was moreso the idea that "this game is already won if i'm scum" is a mindset consistent with the way shoshin has been playing

although yes, that's also a very real motivation

[northsidegal]

the pieces really just fit together for me. yeah i guess on an individual level nos is kind of scummy but i think a lot makes more sense if its shoshin/gamma

[northsidegal]

The fact that Gamma was able to prove his role means he's town 99% of the time. So I'm never never lynching Gamma's slot. Ever.

this was also kinda fallacious

like yeah i noticed that as not really making sense when i first saw it but now looking at it just makes sense whether or not the switcheroo thing happened or not

especially shoshin's last line there

Gamma's town because of his role. He confirmed it through you and NSG. And that means the scum killed Creature on the same night that Gamma gave Creature food, which just doesn't make any sense from a scum Gamma perspective because Gamma was under pressure to confirm his role. Why would scum add to the paranoia we already had about Gamma? On top of that, we now know that Gamma wasn't rb'd unless NSG lied about receiving food, which means even if Gamma is scum, we lynch NSG first, because it's very, very unlikely that Gamma's scum unless NSG is too.

i'm not sure why you think him being a fruit vendor makes him in some way more likely to be town - that doesn't really make sense to me.

i can

see

the argument of him giving it to creature the same night that he died, but isn't it completely equally as possible that he was the one who killed creature and was concerned about having been tracked? like, you seem to be already starting from the position of him being town

[northsidegal]

VOTE: nsg

I don't get why we're voting nsg instead of no lynching but if this is what we're doing, I want to be on this for the gold.

wait what did i miss this...?

she wants to vote me... for the gold????

[northsidegal]

shoshin's secret win condition is to get enough gold to buy a yacht :thonking:

[northsidegal]

that reads like he was trying for town not to get it
not sure why he'd bother if she was his partner

i'd be instantly suspicious if he didn't do that

[northsidegal]

that reads like he was trying for town not to get it
not sure why he'd bother if she was his partner

Yeah
It would be more advantageous to aim to get it rather than risk losing it

hmm :PONDERING:

[northsidegal]

-shrug-

thats a fair point, but i personally wouldn't place it above any of the other things that i've noticed about shoshin's play individually

[northsidegal]

also looking back there's the fact that shoshin's vote was the one that allowed him to self hammer rather than letting everyone agree on who would vote and get the gold

[northsidegal]

gamma had shoshin has his top townread
shoshin was *hard* townreading him for a post he made in rvs for like hundreds of posts. she finally admitted that some of his posts were kinda hollow 652; said gamma had a bad post that made him partners with varsoon 843 and then didn't mention him till she voted him in 1257 (ie after he scumclaiemd)

7 players voting for Gammagooey (

Creature, skitter30, xRECKONERx, xRECKONERx

, Porkens, Shoshin,

Gammagooey

)

and there's presumably scum on there other than gamma

classic "coloring yourself green on VCA even though you're actually scum" move there skitter. absolutely diabolical. but i'm onto you

[northsidegal]

nsg how likely is it do you think that varsoon blocked according ot the reads of that much-cited readslist?

i mean it still seems likely to be that he targeted me, unless the letters "nsg" really were by chance. if i'm saying that that really was chance then any theory i come up with as to who he blocked would probably just be conjecture.

if you were asking specifically about the people on his readslist or something then i'm not really sure. could you clarify?

[northsidegal]

i didn't really put a lot of weight into it over my reads. like i said, i don't really consider roleblocks guilties.

[northsidegal]

gamma emerald still pretending to play the game :considering:

[northsidegal]

i don't understand your point.

[northsidegal]

i don't understand your point.

u like say rc calling u town makes u town

but as a sidenote say gamma hasnt been playing which implies hes scum (otherwise why would u say that)

but theyre the same slot

yes. i talked about that to skitter.

[northsidegal]

nos, mind unvoting before skitter's finger slips and she accidentally types "vote:nsg"? i've seen it happen all the time (even in games i'm not in) and it's just a terrible way for things to end

[northsidegal]

(i'm joking)

[northsidegal]

i thought "finger slips and she accidentally types vote: nsg" gave it away

[northsidegal]

Skitter, the play wasn't just suboptimal, it's strongly, blatantly, and obviously anti-scum. The question is, why would scum Gamma ever intentionally act in such an obvoiusly anti-scum way? Like, use your brain. Scum don't do what Gamma did. They just don't.

gamma giving fruit to creature could easily be an excuse for if he were to be tracked to the kill

[northsidegal]

Gamma, who do you think is the scum between NSG, Skitter, Nos, and Pork? I'm still not 100%. I know for sure you're town, that's it.

nsg + skitter
The way skitter went from all in on nsg to a full backpedal is a solid buddy move, plus no explanation on the n1 lack of kill means it is still prolly nsg

i was about to say something about how you have no idea what real scumbuddy interactions look like but then i remembered that you're just scum

[northsidegal]

yes, as her partner, i think it's a good idea to point out a rb guilty on her, good job

:reflecting:

[northsidegal]

shoshin if you are actually a 1 shot cop there is literally no reason why you should not have said so long, long ago

[northsidegal]

...

[northsidegal]

Skitter acts like him presenting the crumb against nsg makes him town
No it doesn’t, in MY FIRST EVER SCUM GAME, I had the idea to present something against my buddy to distance. If that type of play occurs to me as a raw newb, it certainly could occur to skitter. That’s not a reason to clear skitter, especially in this scenario

Why would presenting the crumb against NSG make Skitter town if NSG is town in Skitter's mind? It's actually absurd.

she was saying it as a reason for us not being partnered, not for her being town

[northsidegal]

i'm just waiting for nos and porkens to arrive

[northsidegal]

i mean at the risk of sounding facetious i really think the answer to those questions are just that she's scum.

[northsidegal]

who was questioning whether or not gamma was actually a fruit vendor after i said that he gave me fruit?

[northsidegal]

i would never ever let a scumbuddy sacrifice themselves for me especially if it was something as not actually incriminating as a roleblock

[northsidegal]

nsg why am i town?

i mean the fact that you could've hammered me already ans didn't probably takes precedence over anything else

phoneposting rn so can't respond to other things i want to

[northsidegal]

i tracked shoshin to see if it'd resolve to skitter giving out her gift to see if shoshin was lying about having switcheroo or not.

[northsidegal]

it's shoshin/gamma.

[northsidegal]

vote gamma with me? shoshin? nos?

[northsidegal]

this is scum
VOTE: shoshin

[northsidegal]

gacha vote: nsg

[northsidegal]

I'm not gonna sheep you on nsg when my gut has a different answer in the future

-shrug-

i think that's kind of a knee-jerk reaction that feels like a logical fallacy to me. kind of like people hearing about a plane crash and deciding that cars are safer.

[northsidegal]

not likely that porkens gets lynched in 3p lylo

[northsidegal]

it's also not much of a statement to say that "town would have won if the person who cast the losing vote in lylo had just voted scum"

[northsidegal]

Like, are you really arguing that Nos didn't lose us this game? Outcome could have been very different.

it is a literal factual statement that nosferatu's action was what most directly lead to the loss of the game for town. what i'm saying is that "if only that person didn't lose us the game, we wouldn't have lost the game" doesn't actually say much. it's a tautology.