Witches' Halloween Ball [Game Over]

[Dunnstral]

Moment
Lady Lambdadelta
DVa
Firebringer
Karmeleon

I think this group is all town at this point

Also leaning town on shortaru at this point

Here is where I'm leaning scum:
Sakura Hana
Brian Skies

[Dunnstral]

Moment
Lady Lambdadelta
DVa
Firebringer
Karmeleon

Moment engaging with the discussion and having a lot to say is very typical of town him, I'm going to treat him as easy to read because from my experience when he's scum you can pretty much tell and he doesn't get as involved, where town looks like this
Lady Lambdadelta has been engaged in a towny way, maybe I'm underestimating her scum game here? She looks like town to me right now
DVa had a really towny tone when I read her, I might need to see more here actually to draw a solid conclusion, still leaning town here anyway
Firebringer plays like this as town all the time, whereas I think he plays differently when he's scum, less brazen and annoying
Karmeleon said some things that other people started talking about, I think the way he reacted to that felt genuine in a way where it was coming from town, just a little awkward

[Dunnstral]

@maria I obv town really quickly once I start posting actual solid serious content so

What type of content are you posting right now?

[Dunnstral]

I love how people keep helping me prove my point that i was making to RC.

You weren't trying to make a point, you were trying to justify your early proposal to kokichi to him

[Dunnstral]

Why did you pick Kokichi?

[Dunnstral]

I don't explain town reads, it's anti town.

Wait is this true or theory?

theory

[Dunnstral]

^I think this pairing is a good idea

[Dunnstral]

Moment
Lady Lambdadelta
DVa
Firebringer
Karmeleon

I think this group is all town at this point

Also leaning town on shortaru at this point

Here is where I'm leaning scum:
Sakura Hana
Brian Skies

I disagree with Sakura being scum here but beyond that it's kinda freaking me out that Dunn opened with a reads list this game. idk maybe I need to look at some other games, he just seems to be trying to be protown more here. Not that that's a bad thing, just means he feels different

OK, I'm thinking Sakura because she was being real weird about the way people read her and going out of her way to be generally uncooperative and try to get people to pair up early, and she hasn't given me a reason to think she's town, did you ever look at other games? Me giving a read list isn't anything weird

[Dunnstral]

Karmeleon said some things that other people started talking about

, I think the way he reacted to that felt genuine in a way where it was coming from town, just a little awkward

?

What's confusing you Brian Skies? Do you disagree that Karmeleon said some things that other people started talking about?

[Dunnstral]

Hey honeydunn what's your MariaR read

I've got no clue, I don't really get good reads on her early in the game

As always, I wouldn't kill her day 1/pre-dance but will keep forming opinions on her

What's confusing you Brian Skies?

What are you specifically referring to?

You question marking something I said

[Dunnstral]

I wanna dance with Dunnstral.

Steal him from Maria~.

I refuse to dance with dunn this game so he's all yours.

This might be worth mentioning since it implies there's some out of game reason she doesn't want to dance with me when that's not the case (to my knowledge...)

So she has some other reason to not dance with me

[Dunnstral]

oh wait fuck, another join date concern.

Wait, is Karmeleon a hydra or alt or somehting?

Pretty sure hydras are not allowed

That... completely dodges the point in a weird way that doesn't feel town but I am uncertain is alignment indicative?

oh wait fuck, another join date concern.

Wait, is Karmeleon a hydra or alt or somehting?

Alt

Then Karmeleon is probably scum.

Not all alts rand scum

This one on the other hand is scummy as a reaction, so we're starting to get preponderance of evidence.

I actually agree with LLD that Karmeleon is scum but she is prolly bussing

oh wait fuck, another join date concern.

Wait, is Karmeleon a hydra or alt or somehting?

Alt

Then Karmeleon is probably scum.

Not all alts rand scum

This doesn’t feel right to me. He seems to be trying to subvert the argument.

oh wait fuck, another join date concern.

Wait, is Karmeleon a hydra or alt or somehting?

Pretty sure hydras are not allowed

That... completely dodges the point in a weird way that doesn't feel town but I am uncertain is alignment indicative?

oh wait fuck, another join date concern.

Wait, is Karmeleon a hydra or alt or somehting?

Alt

Then Karmeleon is probably scum.

Not all alts rand scum

This one on the other hand is scummy as a reaction, so we're starting to get preponderance of evidence.

I agree with this post.

Karma was looking kinda dodgy, there.

[Dunnstral]

I think Maria<->Cakez is a good pairing.

I also think Dunnstral<->LLD is a good pairing.

Because frankly 1) I think all four of those names are town now seeing their posting

and 2) I think all four of those names are entirely unafraid of killing themselves to kill the other if they get the slightest hint of them being scum.

I do want to run it by other people's reads, specifically interested in our confirmed town's perspective on things, but yeah I think those are a few good pairings.

I'm on board with pairing with you, by the way

[Dunnstral]

Ladies
MariaR
DVa
Sakura Hana
Moment
Malakittens
Firebringer
Princess Celestia
Lady Lambdadelta
ChibiBear

I'd like to see MariaR, DVa, Moment, Firebringer, and Lady Lambdadelta get a pairing

I'm pretty sure Sakura will get a pair regardless

Looks like that leaves Malakittens, Princess Celestia, and ChibiBear as potential candidates. I don't really have a reason to read Princess Celestia either way, If they're scum we'll probably find out anyway later so I'd prefer if they got a pairing, probably.

Malakittens, now would be a good time to start posting 'seriously'?

ChibiBear, I'm not saying you're scum but the way you only ask questions but never really give your own thoughts or engage is kind of suspicious looking

[Dunnstral]

Me giving a read list isn't anything weird

I mean you didn't do anything near a reads list in Boundaries of Reality, but I guess that game was really short

Of the three of these you have been in, you didn't give a reads list in Midsummer Night's Revelry (where you were town) or New Year's Eve (where you were scum), but you did in Valentine's Dance (where you were also scum) and I haven't seen any of your games where you throw down a reads list as your very first post

I'm not gonna say it's antitown or scummy it just throws me off since my impression of you in Boundaries of Reality was a lot more laid back. Since you're a guy here and you literally cannot die in this phase of the game it's confusing to me why you would be trying really hard to be seen as protown. Since it feels like the other guys are bundles of apathy or freewheeling it (<3 Karmy) you coming in as unusually organized struck me

maybe you just hit the thread where there was already content so you felt like you could do a reads list. I dunno

1st of all there is more to this game than pre-dance
2nd of all I don't think there's any significant correlation between my alignment and whether or not I post a reads list, even if you feel that way. Remember that me being laid back/not giving reads in Boundaries of Reality was in part due to my role as 2 shot vig that died to desperados

[Dunnstral]

I literally just gave some of my own thoughts my dude.

I've been rereading through the entire topic because I was massively hungover yesterday, I'll be engaging more very soon, don't worry!

You gave a 1 line explanation about something that happened on the first page, and even then you only said that what she was saying seems reasonable (which is very vague)

I'm just saying, I have reasons to want other people to get partners, do you think there are girls that shouldn't get a partner aside from you? Let's leave out Princess Celestia for now

[Dunnstral]

I want Sakura Kokichi and Dunn to tell me how they feel about moment because I feel moments play here is night and day from BBtag

I said I thought he was town and you agreed with it

Look, I'm going to be straightforward here. You guys seem to have this whole thing all already set up and I don't exactly have any objections or a better plan.

I'm probably the most useless player here so there's really no point in me doing anything other than following your leads at this point.

now you're looking like town

Now that you guys are talking about Fire, i have a concern, what if he doesnt come back on time to accept a dance? or will he at least be reading enough to accept?

At the risk of sounding like a jerk this kind of pings me but whatever

ok, then I'm just gonna do

Dunn, would you care to dance with the Witch of Certainty?

Right now I'm thinking of accepting this in the near future

I'm wondering why you seem so intent on pairing with me in particular, though, when RC was talking about other pairings

[Dunnstral]

I really don't wanna pair outside of Cakez and Dunn, RC. Those are my top male Town reads, and Maria's my top female town read.

Oh right, this

[Dunnstral]

I love how I seem to have dissapeared from people's reads lists

Because you're paired with the ic and there's no point in speculating on your alignment anymore until after the intermission

[Dunnstral]

Sakura still short?

She's not getting any taller

[Dunnstral]

dva are you an alt?

I noticed that she played in newbie games

[Dunnstral]

Disregard that, she

replaced

into a newbie game

[Dunnstral]

Dunnstral/Cakez/Karmeleon/shotaru are all people I either lean mafia on or have had a very hard time to read and so I find it interesting those four are in Moment’s town group. I am not sure the reasons for these reads as it doesn’t seem that Moment actually explains them at all.

I believe the most likely scum are Dunnstral, MariaR, and Malakittens.

I believe the most clearly town are Sakura, Firebringer, and Brian Skies.

Why did your read on Shortaru change?

[Dunnstral]

chibi short maybe? @_@

Yes

[Dunnstral]

Dunn what have you thought about the accusations against Moment? She was in your townreads in your first post, has that changed? Could we see an updated list from you?

I think Moment looks like their town play here - from my experience they tend to get scumread on day 1 because of their posting style

[Dunnstral]

I mean if the categories are about equal then could Karmy just accept?

If you want a better chance at winning I think you should come with me, you might be able to get a better read on me

I've been having second thoughts on LLD, I will feel bad for rejecting her though

[Dunnstral]

Dunn can I see your full reads list?

Guys:

Karmeleon
Shortaru
Brian Skies
SirCakez
Gamma Emerald

---

Kokichi Oma

Ladies:

ChibiBear
DVa
Firebringer
Moment
Sakura Hana
MariaR

---

Malakittens
Lady Lambdadelta
Princess Celestia



A lot of the ladies became a lot more readable to me, and that's why I'm kind of questioning my LLD read. Also a couple of things she said has been nagging at me

[Dunnstral]

Page 23
Dunnstral, I am not sure what you mean by “Princess Celestia, if they’re scum we’ll probably find out later anyway”. What does this mean? How would you find out later if I was mafia? Do you mean because I am new and not good at hiding?

Basically yes, I think this playerlist would tear you apart, so to speak

Why is Sakura below Firebringer?

Because, having played with firebringer before, this looks like his town self. I'm not 100% confident on it, but I'm more sure on it than Sakura

Again, at the risk of sounding like a jerk, I'm not going to townread everybody that throws a temper tantrum in the game thread - it's not like only town can get frustrated, after all, I'm also not going to townread MariaR reacting to the temper tantrum (NAI). I don't think Sakura/Mala are faking anger or annoyance - they seem pretty sincere. Scum can get angry too, if they feel they're being read 'unfairly'. Notably, Sakura got angry at something nobody was doing - nobody was pointing to games where she was scum before - I certainly wasn't

[Dunnstral]

I mean if the categories are about equal then could Karmy just accept?

If you want a better chance at winning I think you should come with me, you might be able to get a better read on me

I've been having second thoughts on LLD, I will feel bad for rejecting her though

This post feels a mite shifty

Why?

[Dunnstral]

Aight aight

If you want me to dictate a final order and not have interaction with it that's fine, I'll take my pairings outside of thread and come back in a few hours with final pairings

I feel like I’m not gonna have an impact anyway
I mean I’ve tried to increase engagement/activity and yet no one is picking up on it. I don’t think anyone cares to adjust how they see me.

I don't really think you're scum, I just can't say for certain you're town so I'm not going to advocate gambling on it when there are people I feel I can read better

[Dunnstral]

I mean if the categories are about equal then could Karmy just accept?

If you want a better chance at winning I think you should come with me, you might be able to get a better read on me

I've been having second thoughts on LLD, I will feel bad for rejecting her though

This post feels a mite shifty

Why?

I feel like you’ve made the same argument as scum in the past.

Nope, I've never said that as scum.

[Dunnstral]

Because, having played with firebringer before, this looks like his town self. I'm not 100% confident on it, but I'm more sure on it than Sakura

but why do you think this?
I don't understand ur read on me..

Tone mainly

also you are being defiant (maybe needlessly so) and I think that points towards a town you as well

[Dunnstral]

Aight aight

If you want me to dictate a final order and not have interaction with it that's fine, I'll take my pairings outside of thread and come back in a few hours with final pairings

I feel like I’m not gonna have an impact anyway
I mean I’ve tried to increase engagement/activity and yet no one is picking up on it. I don’t think anyone cares to adjust how they see me.

I don't really think you're scum, I just can't say for certain you're town so I'm not going to advocate gambling on it when there are people I feel I can read better

Okay
I felt your putting me and Maria so low was rather shifty too but I guess this rationalizes where I am

Are you townreading Maria?

[Dunnstral]

Dunn, maria read?

Ladies:

ChibiBear
DVa
Firebringer
Moment
Sakura Hana
MariaR

---

Malakittens
Lady Lambdadelta
Princess Celestia

She's above the line of who I want to lynch ATM

I think she's town, but just barely, I'm certain that when she was interacting with Sakura it was as a friend and she would have done that as either alignment

[Dunnstral]

Maria what is your read on me?

[Dunnstral]

That's not the impression I got from Chibi

[Dunnstral]

Should I dance with dunn?

Yes

[Dunnstral]

Also why does every game have to be so angry

[Dunnstral]

give me aminute

[Dunnstral]

Dunn if I asked you to dance rn would you say yes.

I mean, probably, I don't think it's towns best shot at winning though

[Dunnstral]

It's always funny to me how my top scumread on D1 is always a universal townread (i feel like mentioning it's not LLD.)

@sakura

[Dunnstral]

I mean, I hate suicides but at the same time LLD is just sowing chaos.

And why should I die?

[Dunnstral]

I mean, I hate suicides but at the same time LLD is just sowing chaos.

And why should I die?

[Dunnstral]

I still think DVa should be paired with me

[Dunnstral]

Why not?

[Dunnstral]

I'm not comfortable with brian skies up there

[Dunnstral]

Me or Karmeleon

I don't have that strong of a townread on them, the stuff about suiciding can be faked

[Dunnstral]

We’re not going to chain leave
I’d rather we aim for lunches if we can

Really awkward timing to be saying this

[Dunnstral]

Honestly, that doesn't excuse talking about me like that but idc.

was I that hostile? that I wasn't going to shitpost with you in the PT and wasn't confident on my townread?

or are you mad I called you a downer? cause you pretty clearly are atm

I'm pretty sure Shortaru is town, by the way

[Dunnstral]

Dva you should've just paired with who you wanted. This game's about having fun. If it was more fun for you to pair with someone else and handle the game like that you should've. Just because 1 person tells you to do something doesn't mean you have to do it.

So do you want to pair with me, or should we mix things up?

[Dunnstral]

Dude he said I was going to get move to tier 4 if I was with Karmy

and Karmy didn't accept the risky proposal so he kinda lost his chance

I was warming on Dunn but my acceptance there was totally on the confidence of RC's read

Brian I was confident on but I feel like he's unreliable

so it's like all my options have been fucked

at some point the game needs to move forward

What are your reads on the rest of the ladies?

[Dunnstral]

yeah now I not only regret the pairing but now I regret not fighting it more

I think I need to focus my attentions elsewhere for the night now

Do you think I should pair with LLD, or should we leave her out of the dance?

[Dunnstral]

Like I feel anyone who knows how to read me should know scum me would just pair with Dunn and get him to townread me period. I'm easily able to do it.

[Dunnstral]

DVa is very town

[Dunnstral]

Like I feel anyone who knows how to read me should know scum me would just pair with Dunn and get him to townread me period. I'm easily able to do it.

Ping btw

[Dunnstral]

i'm kind of tempted to not even go for individual reads on people, to just go through isos until i come up with a pairing that i can confidently say is not svs and put that in

me and lld?

[Dunnstral]

Who should I pair with Maria?

[Dunnstral]

Gamma is a gentlemen

[Dunnstral]

Isn't that great, you can dance with Gamma

[Dunnstral]

I townread moment but I don't think I could bet the game on them

[Dunnstral]

I townread moment but I don't think I could bet the game on them

I guess this is fine

I wouldn't mind dancing with moment

[Dunnstral]

give me a bit to think on that then
pedit: HELL NO

Who would you pair with out of the gentlemen?

[Dunnstral]

Where is everyone?

The burden is on the ladies to ask people.

[Dunnstral]

I'm waiting for cakez to say yes already

When are you going to ask me to the dance?

[Dunnstral]

May I have your hand in this dance? Assuming all your choices are already taken

[Dunnstral]

May I have your hand in this dance? Assuming all your choices are already taken

Why do you wanna dance with me so badly?

My options are you, fire, mala, and lld, and I'm assuming fire is going with gama, DON'T flatter yourself

Really though times have changed and now I think the best pairing we could form is with each other

[Dunnstral]

Right now I'd choose Kokichi and Princess as the endgaming pair

I wouldn't.........

[Dunnstral]

Can you please invite me to the dance?

[Dunnstral]

Hey Dunn-kun

Wanna go dancing with me? I'll make sure to step on your toes.

I accept

Sorry fire, I would have danced with you if you asked earlier, but I was talking to Maria

[Dunnstral]

Mala isn't scum but they forgot ladies had to invite gentlemen, unlucky

[Dunnstral]

I wasn't trying to play dictator either but no one would engage me on my reads or style of playing the game and everyone just wanted to be dictated to? Like my vision was us collectively deciding pairings but no one wanted to play that game so I just matchmakered it

Didn't realize I wanted to be dictated to, thanks for letting me know

[Dunnstral]

When is Mala gonna be less busy?

When she no longer has to worry about a mafia game

[Dunnstral]

I didn't accuse anybody of anything

[Dunnstral]

^Same but somebody has to go home, and the remaining ladies are LLD, Mala, and Moment - and moment is supposed to be pairing with sircakez

[Dunnstral]

Don't think I agree with that, DVa, I feel like they're both town

[Dunnstral]

Because I think malakittenz is easy to read and then sircakes looks town by tone - though if I were wrong on one of them it would be him

[Dunnstral]

._.

Why didn’t I just not pair up so I didn’t have to deal with this stupid ass bullshit

I get it. People you’re scum reading me. I get it I been inactive, but holy ducking sakes it’s site wide. It has zero to do with whatever tin foil rhetorics everyone is coming up with that it has to be alignment related. Can’t I actually just be a workaholic, that I actually found my career job, but I haven’t found a balance yet. I’m working on it.

Would you guys like me to just replace out? Would that make you all happy?

Malakittens your work schedule must be really taxing on you, and it might take some getting used to, maybe general discussion is a better place for you to vent, though? You are accusing other people of scumreading you for 'being busy' - nobody is doing this, actually, and you're kind of generalizing everything to be like that. Seriously, you've got a bit of a victim complex this game too - everything is a targeted attack at you (even otherwise factual statements.)

Otherwise, for lack of a better term, I'd call your content NAI whining, sorry

[Dunnstral]

I was reading Moment scum b/c all of their posts seemed really fake and trying to look like a proto-typical townie. I guess it's just how they post in general.

I said this, I'm sure of it

[Dunnstral]

Dunn what have you thought about the accusations against Moment? She was in your townreads in your first post, has that changed? Could we see an updated list from you?

I think Moment looks like their town play here - from my experience they tend to get scumread on day 1 because of their posting style

[Dunnstral]

Wtf

Dunn is definitely the problem in your pairing Maria

Do I really need to bring out the meta this game or can we just get someone else

[Dunnstral]

I slightly dislike the Maria/Dunn pair b/c of Dunn, not Maria fyi

Hey Sircakez, can you answer why you didn't accept your pairing with MariaR?

I know you were set top be paired with Moment, but you disregarded that and did your own thing anyway, so it kind of looksl ike you were avoiding being paired with Maria for som ereason

[Dunnstral]

Also, I'm going to need you to elaborate on that, can you prove you're not just sheeping other people wen you say that?

[Dunnstral]

I'm sitting here wondering why Sircakez moment never happened.

[Dunnstral]

So Shortaru was lying about being a newbie in all his posts

[Dunnstral]

Maria is town by the way

If fire/gamma are town we need to think of where else we are looking, and right now I'm looking at sircakez and shortaru

[Dunnstral]

LLD's freak out about the game happened immediately after I changed the top pairings from

DVA/?
Chibi/Short

to

Chibi/Brian
Short/DVA

Just went back and checked it out.

This is true. It bugs me now.

This post and the way LLD was reacting to short is making me further believe that the slot is scum

[Dunnstral]

Where was this dislike pre-dance? Seems very sudden which really irks me.

I pretty much had this game tuned out pre-dance because I was wrapping up my newbie game (perfect town win, fun times) and you experienced players were talking a bunch of stuff I couldn't begin to relate to anyway.

[Dunnstral]

Don't worry Brian, I'll contribute enough for the both of us today

[Dunnstral]

When I read Sircakez iso I don't really want to lynch him though

[Dunnstral]

Reminder that rc threatened to put shortaru into final 2 if he didn't get his way

Maybe non-sakura players will be capable of thinking for themselves

[Dunnstral]

I think LLD would know better than to want to pair with town and be at threat of being walked out on so I think dunnstral is scum

I'm going to link to all other places where you've "thought I'm scum" and been wrong and then maybe you can stop scumreading me every single game?

[Dunnstral]

good read dunn

i also think that gamma might be scum

'but you just said gamma was town'

no I just wanted to see if he'd vote jiffy if I buddied him

because i'm not voting jiffy anymore and am going back to being honest about my reads?

dunnchan u know how i feel about u

Seems pretty bad. Your case on him seems pretty junk though? I really think its just maru and you not seeing that is bothering me.

mmm

I still think you're scum ftr and the oh chickadee is bad but hey look at this juicy maru wagon doesn't make me feel any better about you.

Alchemist is still scum but I'm starting to waver on my read on the gamestate outside of that.

If Dunn's scum then Jiffy probably isn't, though Dunn could absolutely be town.
Maru is plausibly scum given her absolute refusal to engage with me despite me reaching out to her a billion times in which case Chamber would be town which isn't really implausible. I don't really dislike his iso

I'm a lot more certain on townreads and like specific relationship pairings than my reads on everyone

Oh yeah Jiffy is still scum upon reread, nevermind. So that puts Dunn in the townbin.
RC/Vonflare/Gamma/Irrelephant/Invisibility
only Vonflare/Invis could even really be considered as scum at this point fmpov and I don't think that either of them are so pretty solidly town even outside of being on a D1 scum wagon

MariaR/Dunnstral/Chickadee is a hammer and I don't think any of them are scum anymore but I'll at least put chickadee in the scumpool a bit later
That leaves Alchemist/Jiffy + 1/2 Maru/Chamber + 2/4 Horrordude/Sadnadog/Penguin/Chickadee

this is a meme tier read but I think penguin would already have voted with me by now so he can be one
and 1/2 of horror/sadnadog, can give Maria this one and say it's sadnadog

ok, here's our last game together. I was scum.

[Dunnstral]

Hmm let's read our last game together

Did you ever do this, by the way? I provided helpful quotes, why did you suddenly stop posting?

Shrodinger's Dunnstral -- scum if you're looking at him, not scum if you're not?

Dunnstral does your alignment in mafia prove string theory is real?

In might, in regards to Rc's read on me, let's take a look at that in a bit

and as RC friend i will call him out on behavior i disagree with heavily. if he has a problem with my call outs we can discuss it.

Sure, I'll call him out as well, for coming in here and acting like he's in any position to try to sort me instead of just defaulting to Maria's read on me, and for essentially voting out people he doesn't like/agree with instead of who he actually thinks mafia is

[Dunnstral]

I think dunnstral is scum

[Dunnstral]

I mean, we both know you were just going to lynch lld regardless of your read on her, if I actually thought she was town I would have just paired with her anyway

[Dunnstral]

@Nancy, since you wanted explanations, here's where I am rn:

Townie
Kokichi Oma -- I've read Kokichi's town games, and this looks like his town game

Dunnstral -- I didn't correctly sort him in BoR and don't have confidence in my read. RC insists he's town; I thought opening with a reads list was unusual. At this point there's other people that are scummier. (Very much wish I'd pushed back on RC flipping his read on Dunn and danced here instead at this point)

Brian Skies -- Most of my read here was based on

Is it too early to volunteer as tribute?

which struck me as a ballsy gambit if scum

he could be townier tho

ChibiBear -- Fine with this being newgreen until I see a Gamma flip, at which point I go back to:

Gamma - Feels like he's posted a fair but but hasn't said much, definitely keeping an eye on him.

which did not, at the time, strike me as a genuine reaction to Gamma's slot based on what had been posted until that point

Malakittens -- There's been so little new content here for a while that I'm worried game will stall with her alive forever, and she's with Cakez who seems scummy. 'acceptable losses for a cakez flip'? that's kinda cold but kinda how I see it

Princess Celestia --

MariaR getting involved here is not good and she is attacking our confirmed town RadiantCowbells

While I don't townread Maria, I thought this particular attack on Maria was kinda weird at the time--I can see the POV a bit more now

Firebringer -- I don't know how to sort this slot even after having glanced through two of his other games. A little concerned since my last "poe null-->town" ended up flipping scum tho

MariaR --

So I believe fire when he says he forgot how many scum were in this game.

Maria hates me for coming back to this again but this post pinged me really hard. We've talked about this post so I wouldn't bring it up except it's still on my mind

I don't think your reads will have more influence in your death as you think they will. Will some people respect them and maybe use them for reasoning to some extent? Sure scum will if scum is in that pairing and town might too.

Frankly I just don't know *what* Maria was trying to accomplish with this post and so it bothers me

SirCakez --

LLD's sort of taking command looked town to me. I don't think she takes that tone as scum from my (admitedly vague) meta recollections.

didn't like this then, don't like it now

also never liked his suspicions of Karmeleon

Gamma Emerald --
didn't like him going after Karmeleon here

This doesn’t feel right to me. He seems to be trying to subvert the argument.

shortaru --

RadiantCowbells - duh
Gamma Emerald - I think town?
Dunnstral - scummy
Karmeleon - scummy

MariaR - towny, would dance
DVa - scummy, doesn't feel like genuine posting
Moment - towny, would dance
Sakura Hana - towny would dance (but alas, she has her sights elsewhere)
Firebringer - I can't get a read on this... everything in me screams scum, but wtf would scum be so blatant for?
Lady Lambdadelta - scummy

Putting aside the read on me which I didn't like, what really bothered me was why Gamma would be a leantown based on his posts, why karmy would be scummy, and *how he decided* LLD was scummy. In retrospect this read list almost looks too accurate based on the evidence that was available at the time.

He also was trying to play up being new green in points such as this:

Still learning the ropes in forum Mafia. Been churning through the wiki to get a handle on strategy, action resolution, and power roles (oh dear God the power roles!)

scummy

with all that, Gamma/Fire and Cakez/Mala both seem like, as pairings, the best places to look for a flip today to me

at this point it's quite obvious shortaru was a manipulative little fucker. I don't know that makes him 100% lockscum but he roleplayed the newbie card way too hard and had some wild fucking reads, so unfortunately Nancy, I think there's a solid chance you replaced into a scum slot at this point

Here are my reads:

I believe the way MariaR was acting when pairing up was towny, and she got mad in me in the pt because she thought I was tricking her in a way that seemed genuine, Right now I think it's really likely she is town

Firebringer is leaning town - he could be scum, sure, but I'm not optimistic about lynching him and finding scum
Gamma I can't really read, again not optimistic on finding scum here, with that being said I don't see a reality where this pair makes it to end of the game without being lynched anyway - sorry guys

Shortaru/Nancy - I'm thinking probably scum, a lot of the stuff he's said is really dodgy looking back at it with the perspective that he wasn't a new player, I remember at one point I asked him to expand on something and he ignored it twice - this is my scumread right now - I'm pretty sure this slot won't survive until the end of the game (DVa will probably leave before that point)
DVa - I still think she's been obvious town, and it seems most people agree with that (unless I'm mistaken..?)

Sircakez - I don't have a good track record of reading this guy, poe makes me want to scumread him but reading his iso makes me want to townread him
Malakittens - I think she's town

Brian - More town than not - still, I'm not completely convinced that this isn't scum
Chibi - I'm pretty convinced this is town, though

Kokichi - Leaning town, wouldn't exactly be surprised if he was scum though, he doesn't really give us a lot to read him off of
Princess - Could definitely be scum, hasn't done much but what she has done has had me raising my eyebrows

[Dunnstral]

Hey dunnstral I have had exactly one scumread this game and they flipped scum

So if you're actually town and not just scum posturing to discredit me, shut the fuck up.

So I do and my reads this far this game have been pretty good!

Did you know that, historically, you have a very bad track record of reading me correctly? Does this factor in? Don't you think you should leave reading me to someone else, like Maria who you seem to tr?

[Dunnstral]

Hey dunnstral I have had exactly one scumread this game and they flipped scum

So if you're actually town and not just scum posturing to discredit me, shut the fuck up.

So I do and my reads this far this game have been pretty good!

Did you know that, historically, you have a very bad track record of reading me correctly? Does this factor in? Don't you think you should leave reading me to someone else, like Maria who you seem to tr?

[Dunnstral]

Oh yeah Jiffy is still scum upon reread, nevermind. So that puts Dunn in the townbin.

MariaR/Dunnstral/Chickadee is a hammer and I don't think any of them are scum anymore but I'll at least put chickadee in the scumpool a bit later

I mean, you called me town. It doesn't matter if you were thinking "but if majiffy is town, my reads change" because that's not what you wrote

I'm trying to win this game as well, and I don't think lynching us is the way

[Dunnstral]

That's actually a joke

I hard townread you in 827 despite you being absolutely worthless
You claim that I townread you in the xyzzy game but I was scumreading you and literally only said you weren't scum with Majiffy who I wasn't even scumreading when I left.
Hard townread you in fallout to the point of getting pissed you got mislynched.

So no your fantasy universe is a joke and can be kept out of this game.

I am sure on my strategy to win. Every single town game I've played this year with only 1 exception where my reads weren't super good I've been dead on and when I've lost I've lost because I've gotten fucked by dumbasses ignoring my reads and doing their own thing after I was clearly nightkilled for a reason. So no you're not going to guilt trip me into feeling bad for lynching a slot that is encouraging people to ignore my reads and I think both your heads have non-zero scum equity with LLD, yours especially.

I mean, it's not a fantasy universe though, you're just sort of delusional and only see your own play in the most positive light

[Dunnstral]

Can you jog my memory, where did I say I was going to sabotage the plan?

[Dunnstral]

Dunn whats ur read on Gamma?

Go back like 10 posts?

[Dunnstral]

u can't read him either? well thats unhelpful.

I believe I have a history of reading him as lean scum, nothing he's doing really sticks out to me as scummy in this game

[Dunnstral]

It's really easy for scum to convince you to follow them because they tell you what you want to hear instead of the truth.

Who are you talking about? Or are you trying to say this wagon is my fault?

[Dunnstral]

why do people think that is town?

The copious amount of AtE, though I agree with it

[Dunnstral]

*inb4 I'm accused of being scum trying to avoid a mala lynch*

Who do you think we should lynch?

[Dunnstral]

Confirmed cocky and loud

[Dunnstral]

You try to win this game by not sabotaging the overall plan that makes sense and both you and Maria have advocated sabotaging the plan so from where I'm standing you're not trying to win the game, you're at best trying to assert your individuality over trying to win and at worst are just scum.

Once again, I'd like to see where I advocated sabotaging the plan?

Otherwise, are you just lying?

[Dunnstral]

Just because you're confirmed town, doesn't mean everyone is willing to jump through hoops to vote with you, it seems - looks like you're going to have to show your work and prove what you're saying, just like anyone else

[Dunnstral]

Like I said, I'm pretty sure Maria is town from the stuff I've seen inside the pt, I'm hoping she checks in again

[Dunnstral]

I'd prefer fire

What do you think about your partner?

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: Maria

starting to care less about which of my bottom 3 pairings we do rn

I think you should trust my read of her

I also doubt that our pair makes it to the very end anyways

[Dunnstral]

Sakura just be quiet, you're really going to keep pointing to one game I read Maria wrong and act like that means I should never be trusted when rc has read me wrong a handful of times and you're not going to say anything

[Dunnstral]

you're really going to keep pointing to one game I read Maria wrong

TWO games

That's cute

[Dunnstral]

u will never know my secretz weapon now dva.

NOOOOOO!!!!!!

I know you don't have a big reason to scumread Maria :/ can you not compromise on my pair?

[Dunnstral]

I have seen no evidence that she expected me to derptunnel her so.

You killed/tried to get her killed day 1 in the last 2 dance games you were a part of, for the record

[Dunnstral]

Unless I'm misremembering and it was lld who suicided on you, which I might be, to be fair

[Dunnstral]

oh god me being conftown in this game would be complete cancer

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 8#p9456218

[Dunnstral]

How about you start expecting LLD to be a human being then tell me to get over myself.

Like you're delusional if what you're thinking is "lld probably wouldn't expect me to push her" when you post stuff like this

Hey rc? get over yourself

[Dunnstral]

..I think lld expected rc to push on her early

[Dunnstral]

I'm not going to let RC bully this game uncontested anymore

[Dunnstral]

but the only way it would be a red flag to me is if he used his "I'm new" status to avoid doing stuff.

Which he did, by the way, and I can point out where

[Dunnstral]

Where was this dislike pre-dance? Seems very sudden which really irks me.

I pretty much had this game tuned out pre-dance because I was wrapping up my newbie game (perfect town win, fun times) and you experienced players were talking a bunch of stuff I couldn't begin to relate to anyway.

[Dunnstral]

He got super aggro and his explanation turned into the blame game.

This didn't happen

[Dunnstral]

Here's what happened: Maria got mad because I "forced" her to pair with me, I pointed out that sircakez was reserved for moment, and kokichi had picked a dance partner already: her choices for pairs at the time where me or karmeleon

[Dunnstral]

He got super aggro and his explanation turned into the blame game.

This didn't happen

Here's what happened: Maria got mad because I "forced" her to pair with me, I pointed out that sircakez was reserved for moment, and kokichi had picked a dance partner already: her choices for pairs at the time where me or karmeleon

You did though you got so mad like "oh don't blame me for this!" It was so funny. I was praying you'd do an overly towny reaction but I didn't get that from the rxn test. Shame

Literally lying in the main thread right now, it's not amusing

[Dunnstral]

Where was this dislike pre-dance? Seems very sudden which really irks me.

I pretty much had this game tuned out pre-dance because I was wrapping up my newbie game (perfect town win, fun times) and you experienced players were talking a bunch of stuff I couldn't begin to relate to anyway.

[Dunnstral]

i paired with her because i told her flat out i could easily read her if she played with me
in the dance thread she said fuck off you can't read me i refuse to engage with you at all so I suicided, and even then i didn't suicide to take her out

i suicided to make a point of firebringer being scum.

that last part isn't true
you told me post game that you thought i was scum but suicided because lld wasn't cooperating and had to be cleared because she was playing to scum win.

Yeah I was gonna comment on this. I just assume that RC forgot and his mind/ego made it seem that x happened when y happened but x makes him look better so he believes it

He just lies a lot to try to make other people see him as a better person than he is

[Dunnstral]

you told me post game that you thought i was scum but suicided because lld wasn't cooperating and had to be cleared because she was playing to scum win.

I mean, I assumed that firebringer was talking about a personal conversation you two had after the fact, in which case really it becomes a case where one of the two of you are lying, though admittedly it was a little aggressive to assume that the person who would have to be lying would be you right away. Unless I'm misunderstanding the whole situation

And really? You have a serious problem with changing what happened in your own mind. Like, you hard townread me all game in fallout? Really?

What I really have an issue with, with you this game, is you coming in here going "Dunn and Maria need to die because they're advocating going against the plan"

I ask you to point out where I'm advocating against the plan, twice (I never did) - your story changes to "I'm scumreading Dunn" - OK, I point out that your history at reading me is abysmal and your reply was the most self delusioned thing I've ever seen, I'm still not sure whether you actually believe that or if it's all bravado - somewhere along the line you say I'm tricking people by starting a wagon on sircakez and Mala (Which I never did) - you then say you're scumreading Maria too and at this point it's clear that you're just throwing everything at us to get us lynched for whatever reason

[Dunnstral]

How about we all cool off for a minute and focus on this game?

I'm not mad, just upset and sort of pissed off at your push on us because it's getting old

I'm probably going to vote whatever maria wants to lynch before deadline so he have something going - I kind of think princess is just awkward and not scum so I'm not sure I want to go there

[Dunnstral]

I'm not comfortable with brian skies up there

All of that from this?

[Dunnstral]

You had me as town eventually, yes, for the vast majority of the game I was always leaning around scum/null/lean town but if this person flipped this way then maybe scum

[Dunnstral]

Oh hey Gamma <3

How are you tonight?

Good, just watched the Georgia-Auburn game (go Dawgs!) and now I’m gearing up to watch the second episode of RWBY Volume 6.

Hey guys, it's good that we're making idle pleasant conversation, but I feel the need to remind everybody that town loses the game if the deadline reaches 0 - a little over a day from now

I really don't think Maria is scum and would REALLY prefer not to go out in 1st dance

[Dunnstral]

uh, oops maria

[Dunnstral]

No, I also don't understand your push on RC prior to the dance flipping.

Like I kinda think if you were town you would have just chilled, waited for RC to be dead, and then pushed people on sheeping him post death

Instead it feels like you wanted the moral highground of him having flipped his read on you pre-death

Wait, I don't understand the context to this post

[Dunnstral]

During the dances, normal nightless lynch mechanics will take over. A lynch will NOT reset the deadline. If the Mafia makes up 50% or more of the remaining players at any point, Mafia immediately wins. If all of the Mafia are lynched, then Town wins. If the game runs out of time and at least one Mafia is still alive, then Mafia wins.

@Sakura doesn't differentiate between first dance or second dance in the rules

With that said, town has the ability to leave the dance before deadline so it's not a huge concern (that is, as long as we're not being super boneheaded)

[Dunnstral]

Here are my reads:

I believe the way MariaR was acting when pairing up was towny, and she got mad in me in the pt because she thought I was tricking her in a way that seemed genuine, Right now I think it's really likely she is town

Firebringer is leaning town - he could be scum, sure, but I'm not optimistic about lynching him and finding scum
Gamma I can't really read, again not optimistic on finding scum here, with that being said I don't see a reality where this pair makes it to end of the game without being lynched anyway - sorry guys

Shortaru/Nancy - I'm thinking probably scum, a lot of the stuff he's said is really dodgy looking back at it with the perspective that he wasn't a new player, I remember at one point I asked him to expand on something and he ignored it twice - this is my scumread right now - I'm pretty sure this slot won't survive until the end of the game (DVa will probably leave before that point)
DVa - I still think she's been obvious town, and it seems most people agree with that (unless I'm mistaken..?)

Sircakez - I don't have a good track record of reading this guy, poe makes me want to scumread him but reading his iso makes me want to townread him
Malakittens - I think she's town

Brian - More town than not - still, I'm not completely convinced that this isn't scum
Chibi - I'm pretty convinced this is town, though

Kokichi - Leaning town, wouldn't exactly be surprised if he was scum though, he doesn't really give us a lot to read him off of
Princess - Could definitely be scum, hasn't done much but what she has done has had me raising my eyebrows

[Dunnstral]

or 1/2 of

1) LLD wanted to be paired with scum!Dunn and was worried that Maria would suss something was up potentially and really pushed for that pairing and also set someone up for Maria to make her happy
2) LLD wanted to keep Scum!Maria and Town!Dunn apart so she hard tried to steal Dunn as a partner so that she could prevent a Maria/Dunn pairing that scum evidently felt would end up backfiring on Maria.

I know 1 is untrue and think 2 is an unlikely scenario

Didn't you just say I couldn't read Maria? That that was an objective fact?

Why do you think 2 is a likely scenario?

[Dunnstral]

You might be right Sakura

[Dunnstral]

Thing is fire isn't going to be able to read gamma and simultaneously other people who can't read gamma are going to vote him out before the end of the game

[Dunnstral]

Short absolutely took advantage of newb status and I keep pointing to the same post :|

[Dunnstral]

DVa is obvious town but needs to die anyway at some point during the game because of nancy slot

[Dunnstral]

Princess might be town I'm rethinking it.

Yeah same - like I think her reads are bad but I think she reads more as awkward/inexperienced town than inexperienced scum. Not 100% on Kokichi town, though, just fyi

[Dunnstral]

uh, oops maria

?

I changed my opinion about my read on her a few times and we got confused and contradicted each other in thread

[Dunnstral]

Having short as likely scum is fine. I don't know his slot is 100% lock scum, but I do know that my slot is town

so we flip one scum, then I leave. I don't give a fuck who the final four are, I only care who the final 2 are

if you're fine with brian and chibi then I *don't know what we're talking about*

RC's plan *is fine*

even with short as scum

the point is not for the final 4 to be lock town

it is to make sure that we do not reach a point where there are 2 scum in the final 4

that is the entire logical conceit of this strategy

First of all, it's pretty obvious that me and mariar aren't both scum so why couldn't that pairing be us, just theoretically?

The plan is fine except if shortaru is scum he would have lost us the game and then later his argument was that you had a choice about who to pair up with

I am not 110% convinced that brian is town, maybe 85-90% and so while I'm not pushing him right now I'm not - I am 95% convinced that chibi is town and would feel comfortable with her at the end, what I'm against is him pushing me every single game and being dishonest about it and then making more stuff up

[Dunnstral]

what is RC supposed to do in response to that? what am I?

I don't care about rc but you could have voted with me instead of against me when I told you that my read on Maria was town and we're only getting targeted (not even lynched - just targeted) because of rc being rc

[Dunnstral]

If RC really wants a fight over this and is going to be intellectually dishonest then I'm going to bring some facts in and I will fight him about this

--------------------------------------------------------------
Newbie 1697: Hungarian Children's songs - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=66000

Dunnstral, I hereby award you the title of Slimiest Scumlord of all RC Games.

Appreciate your title.

vote me then.

I'm done playing 20 questions with someone who is as obvscum as this.

like if you're townreading Dunnstral right now, you've got something else coming.

Note: RC was force replaced from this game

First game on site for me - we were both town - RC is wrong and loud about it

--------------------------------------------------------------
Open 695: C9++ - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=66955

Page 5:

K we back to regular names because I'm bored.

Zach: {Zach}
Towny: {Dunnstral}
LeanTown: {Davesaz}
Null: {APF, Bins}
Leanscum: {Transcend, Loopdan}
Mid+Scum: {LQ}
Scummy: {Smithereens}

VOTE: Smithereens

We are both town - ok, he is right here, but he's only read up to page five in a game he replaced and then I was killed night 1, so whatever

--------------------------------------------------------------
Micro 684: Pixie Seven - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=70391

I don't specifically have a read on Maria.

I scumread Stormcloud, rest of the game is shades of null. I kinda townread Schadd and Dunn though.

He is town, I am scum. We both die night 1 for different reasons - here he is wrong but quiet about it

--------------------------------------------------------------
Micro 614: Micellupan's temptation - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=66718

Yeah Dunnstral huge scumread for me.

Realeo, no. If you're tempted you're town and you play for town wincon. period.

VOTE: Dunnstral

I don't.

Dunnstral is my only scumread in the pure pile.

Let's just lynch Dunnstral.

I'm not playing with him this entire game.

Would honestly not mind lynching Dunnstral at all.

I'd rather we lynch in the tempted claims and then psych scan Dunnstral tomorrow.

We should have psych scanned Dunn today but since everyone was being dumb that's not an option *shrug*

note: at this point, we lynch the only mafia in the game and they choose another player to "possess" on game mechanics, so essentially it is proven that I was town and we are starting over

Possession Scan: Dunnstral

I still don't believe him and if he's actually tempted he's the obvious possession target.

I sincerely doubt we lose because we failed to scumhunt well in the VTs. I think the odds are fairly decent that we lose because we wrote someone off as conftown who wasn't.

I am voting Dunnstral.

We're not finishing today without scanning Dunnstral.

VOTE: Dunnstral

k

We were both town all game

Wrong and LOUD about it to the point of tunneling

--------------------------------------------------------------
Mini 1901 - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=71365

Town!Dunn never makes this claim.

VOTE: Dunnstral

VOTE: Dunnstral

note: game was ended due to mod error near the start of day 2, with both of us still alive

Another game where he scumreads me - doesn't really mention me after these posts but the game doesn't last for a long time
We are both town in this game

--------------------------------------------------------------
Mini Normal 1893 - I Keep Modding Minis Ending in 3 - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?p=8976269

No quotes - rc replaces in, doesn't comment on me, and replaces out after an argument with another user all before I check back into the thread
We are both town
--------------------------------------------------------------
Midsummer Night's Revelry - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=72677

But basically my deadlist before the nightkill is [Dunn/Maria] + [P_A/x] unless either PA or Dunn does something super towny and I'll make my decision on whether to step out on LLD when day 2 starts.

Off to a good start

You paired up with obvscum. Shouldn't have paired up with Dunn so quickly and I would have gladly paired up with you if we could have forced LLD/Dunn or something and forced them to both die.

Now look back to his play this game - at this point this is starting to feel strangely similar but let's keep going

P_A is given away by the fact that she isn't responding to any of my attempts to push on her because she can't push on me without pushing on you at the same time.
You were given away by your terrible reaction to my attempt to partner with you and your partnership with P_A was given away by the way you approached Cabd/P_A.
Dunn was well obvscum and it's really obvious that you two are at blows in scumchat by the way that you're talking in game.

I must say that I'm rather disappointed.

If I walk out on you and you're town, absolutely!

I'm totally willing to reconsider and that's why you are last on the list and I want to powerlynch Dunn/Penguin first and also why I was trying to get in your good graces.

Hey no policy lynching LLD until I get my chance at P_A and Dunnstral.

I think that Keyen is the most likely to be pocketed and I am fine with seeing them gone.

What I think you're town you're just getting thoroughly hoodwinked by Dunnstral.

wtf how would we bus if we were paired

we'd be bussing now since I'm lynching Dunnstral

I've been right on things like this before.

I'm fine with dunn -> penguin -> lld. If any of them want me to do something differently they should talk to me.

yes i do.

also I know what your town game looks like and this isn't it.

literally delusional, I don't know what else to say, we'll just let the stats at the end speak for themselves

dunn please you're so scummy it hurts.

No P_A is actually really scummy her reads are super shallow she's evasive about her cabd read and takes a very convenient position for scum and her rationale for why I should townread her is dogshit.

like

Dunn/LLD/P_A is a thing for a reason. they're all so far below the rest of the game right now

Mine wasn't formed cuz friends.
Cabd's wasn't formed cuz friends.

Only Maria/Dunn and Fire/Shiro and fire/shiro was okay but maria/dunn was maria giving herself up for no reason.

oh god me being conftown in this game would be complete cancer

Shiro walks out, lynch Dunnstral tomorrow. game will be over.

And sorry is this like a special holiday where everyone does their best to make my life miserable? how many times have you read me successfully dunnstral?

you're crying that I can't read you because of a game where I didn't care to try because I figured if you were scum you were making an action that essentially guilties you.

How about you start expecting LLD to be a human being then tell me to get over myself.

We were both town this game (as was the person I paired with)
Another game where RC is WRONG and LOUD

--------------------------------------------------------------
Mini Normal 1925 - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=72508

dunn might be scums tho

dunn/elena are obviously scumbuddies and it's shocking how people are on the wrong side of history here

like this isn't a challenging game by any stretch

Classic scumread Dunn opening into a ~1000 post game we both just replaced into

THINKBIG IS ON FUCKING EMERGENCY V/LA UNTIL WEDNESDAY. HIM SHOWING UP TO MAKE A LITTLE BIT OF A CONTRIBUTION TO THE GAME IS NOT A SCUMTELL.

DUNN IS OBVSCUM ELENA IS OBVSCUM LET'S LYNCH THESE TWO FUCKING CLOWNS AND BE DONE WITH IT.

VOTE: Dunnstral

No confidence that I will be able to get this lynched after yesterday, but this is scum.

Dunn's scum and that's just facts. TB may be scum as well so let's hold him accountable for what he didn't do yesterday and see what he says.

Hey Zach let's fuck up waifu girl dunnstral

VOTE: Dunnstral

zach/dunn are both scum but I would rather just lose than try to convince this lobby

why is dunn a bad lynch :?:

No one is lynching Zach today.

Dunn if you defend Creature and he flips scum you go tomorrow no questions.

In post 2880, Dunnstral wrote:
I dedicate this game to Elena Fisher

Right I fucked up. You've seen me mislynch once as town then go on to sweep games.

I ask you again: do you think that I'm scum here?

In post 2887, Dunnstral wrote:
From what I've seen though while you're a good scum player I do not think that carries over to your town games. I think you're overtly cocky for someone who in my opinion almost always tunnels onto town as town

The slice of my pie that you've seen iirc paints me in a rather unflattering light. also lol @ good scum player.

Oh the read is that Dunn is town.

Alright I'm not living to tomorrow

so you all motherfuckers, listen up

Drumbeats is town
MM4 is town
Firecroc is town
Dunnstral is town

Zach is scum
Last scum is PROBABLY Robb
but if it's not it's Gratiae

we good?

Meh I wasn't sure about it until Dunnstral started obvtowning.

OK, so at the very end of the game after playing with me for a while he does a 180 and says I'm obvious town
Well, I was scum in this game while he was town

--------------------------------------------------------------
Kidney Mafia - forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=72889

Note: I was in a hydra this game - Arcade Pals, RC replaced in ~4500 posts in

Nah let's Lynch arcade pals

More likely to be scum

Again, classic opener for some reason

If pere's voting here I'll vote but

VOTE: Arcade Pals

And he was right in this game, we were scum while he was town - again, there's not a lot of content between us in this one though - it was also a hydra game so it wasn't a read that was 100% based on me, but again, whatever

--------------------------------------------------------------
The House in the Wood - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=75168

Note: this is an all hydra game, but players could (and did) talk outside of hydra

I don't wanna fight maki game is hers if she's scum

No real scumread or townread given this game, our hydra was third party

--------------------------------------------------------------
Steam VN Upick - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=74973

Note: RC was part of a 3 person hydra while I was not in a hydra, I believed RC posted less than his hydra members in this game

Lady Lambdadelta

RC and the Sunshine Band (RadiantCowbells + schadd + Creature)

33pITATurbo (Beeboy + Mulch)

Ramcius

Alisae

Smocaine

Espeonage

Kokichi Oma

Taroumaru

Chucky says Cheese
Kiana Kaslana
Nyan Sequitur (Purrcocet + Keychain)

hebichan

Dunnstral
Maki Harukawa

Take your pick.

Only gives this vague poe list that I'm a part of, so not townreading me, doesn't go further than that
Regardless, I'll leave this one as if there was no real read given either way

We are both town here
--------------------------------------------------------------
Mini 1990: Terror in the City - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=75044

note: RC was in a hydra of 4 (?) people, he was later force removed from that hydra, the following are posts from when he was a part of the hydra

VOTE: Dunnstral

Sticking with this Dunn vote for now

I'd be voting Dunn right now if it weren't for the fact that a guilty was just claimed, feels like he sees us as an easy target.

{mom, dunn, gamma} maybe

that leaves {mom, dunn, gamma, kop}

Who's down for a Dunn wagon? Dude rode the assemble wagon before town got desperate EOD.

VOTE: Dunnstral

Im more confident in my dunn read, but of course I'll vote mom if that's where everyone wants to lynch today, just don't forget about Dunn. Plenty of time left in the day.

We're consulting with the other heads to see if we can get unity on Dunn because it seems to be the only overlapping scumread that we have right now.

ALRIGHT YOU SILLY CLOWNS WE'VE SOLVED THE GAME.

VOTE: DUNNSTRAL/HOPKIRK/GAMMA

THAT'S YOUR SCUMTEAM BOYS WE'RE GOING TO LYNCH ANY ONE OF THEM THEN KOP IS GOING TO JAIL US SO WE DON'T GET FUCKING SHOT

WE ARE GOING TO INITIATE ON DUNNSTRAL BECAUSE A NON-ZERO NUMBER OF MY DAUGHTERS QUESTION A NON-ZERO NUMBER OF THE OTHER READS

BUT THAT'S THE LYNCH ORDER. LISTEN TO ME I'M SMART ENOUGH TO DEVELOP SUPERPOWERED LIFE IN A LABORATORY I CAN CERTAINLY SOLVE A GAME OF MAFIA

You should vote Dunn or Gamma because those are the two I'm super sure about. I'm actually gonna look at Dunn gamma momrangal for a sec.

I think scum thought Kokichi softed cop and shot him.

Scum indicative for Dunn, meaningless otherwise.

HOPKIRK AND GAMMA ARE SCUM. LAST IS PROBABLY IN {DEEDLES/NC/DUNN}. PLS STOP SHEEPING SCUM HOPKIRK THANKS IN ADVANCE.

A game where I was indeed scum, and RC was town - though I haven't sorted through who is who (they signed their names with code words), you can assume that the all caps is probably RC

--------------------------------------------------------------
Micro 827: The Team Odds - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=77333

VOTE: Dunnstral

VOTE: Dunnstral

Dunnschadd or dunngazer maybe

This is just the first page

Am I the only one who thinks dunnformer r buddies

i mean

performer I'm wavering on

but I think dunn has been objectively scummy

i'm seeing dunnformer and lillyformer > dunnlilly

i mean it could be dunn for third

but i think carca and performer are both town and wh4t is statistically town so

{RC, NSG}
{Performer}
{Schadd_}
{Carcalilly}
{Dunn, Skygazer+}
{Eragon}

with wh4t as unplaced.

And by you I actually mean performer then probably you or Dunn tomorrow

I think dunnformer is fine

the existence of dunnformer is the reason that I want to lynch performer primarily

i dunno

i think that scum is in sky/dunn/eragon/performer

i newly excluded dunn/former
so like
if its eragon its sky/eragon or dunn/eragon

going back to thinking Dunn/Eragon has actual equity

i would agree that's townier than anything he's said this game

VOTE: Dunnstral

yeah you can do better if you're town.

I think Dunn is the healthiest place for my vote right now.
Readslist:

{RC}
{NSG}
{Wh4t}
{Schadd}
{Skygazer, Carcalilly}
-null-
{Eragon}
{Performer}
{Dunnstral}

I think that Dunnformer > Dunneragon

don't get me wrong

dunn can just be last scum and it's dunnformer but

former is where i put my chips

its basically just era/dunn/performer with offchance sky anyway

dunngazer is also in contention, forgot about that one

vaguely think this looks more like one of dunn's town games than the reverse

OK, interestingly enough his opinion seems to be changing after a hard tunnel

sure i'll lynch myself or dunnstral tomorrow.

or not...?

note that I know that I'm town and suspect dunnstral is town
I would strongly advocate for lynching Skygazer even if she's 'half' as likely to be scum as Dunn

Oh, I guess he is, maybe?

i am fine with skygazer/dunn lynches
i suspect that I don't have the option of not being a lynch before endgame in which case I would want Sky over Dunn.

Not really, since he's still calling for my lynch

t the risk of being called scum for hedging I could totally buy era as scum as well and think there's enough pointing there that I'd put the actual scumteam odds as something like

1% perf 9% dunnstral 35% eragon 55% skygazer

I can clear dunnstral but I can't guarantee that town doesn't mislynch me. sorry :(

this clears dunn and makes era significantly more likely to be town, ftr. at this point i'd call it clearing because it's pretty obvious that the main goal of the scum team wasn't winning this game, it was mislynching me.

OK, at the end of the game he isn't scumreading me
We were both town in this game

--------------------------------------------------------------
how good is vonflare at laser tag - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77288

note: RC chose to replace out from this game, but was in it for a sizeable portion of it

good read dunn

i also think that gamma might be scum

'but you just said gamma was town'

no I just wanted to see if he'd vote jiffy if I buddied him

, RadiantCowbells"]because i'm not voting jiffy anymore and am going back to being honest about my reads?

dunnchan u know how i feel about u

Seems pretty bad. Your case on him seems pretty junk though? I really think its just maru and you not seeing that is bothering me.

mmm

I still think you're scum ftr and the oh chickadee is bad but hey look at this juicy maru wagon doesn't make me feel any better about you.

, RadiantCowbells"]Alchemist is still scum but I'm starting to waver on my read on the gamestate outside of that.

If Dunn's scum then Jiffy probably isn't, though Dunn could absolutely be town.
Maru is plausibly scum given her absolute refusal to engage with me despite me reaching out to her a billion times in which case Chamber would be town which isn't really implausible. I don't really dislike his iso

I'm a lot more certain on townreads and like specific relationship pairings than my reads on everyone

Oh yeah Jiffy is still scum upon reread, nevermind. So that puts Dunn in the townbin.
RC/Vonflare/Gamma/Irrelephant/Invisibility
only Vonflare/Invis could even really be considered as scum at this point fmpov and I don't think that either of them are so pretty solidly town even outside of being on a D1 scum wagon

MariaR/Dunnstral/Chickadee is a hammer and I don't think any of them are scum anymore but I'll at least put chickadee in the scumpool a bit later
That leaves Alchemist/Jiffy + 1/2 Maru/Chamber + 2/4 Horrordude/Sadnadog/Penguin/Chickadee

this is a meme tier read but I think penguin would already have voted with me by now so he can be one
and 1/2 of horror/sadnadog, can give Maria this one and say it's sadnadog

Never really scumreads me in this game
I was scum, he was town
--------------------------------------------------------------
Fallout Mafia - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=76181

note: RC is in a hydra in this game

Townreads

Tchill
Davesaz
Alchemist21
Hebichan
Our slot obvobv

Lazy townreads

Dunnstral

This felt towny enough from Hebi and I also started liking some of her earlier posts more.
Dunnstral is a lazy townread, I don't think he's substanstively more likely to be town.

I was also considering putting Nero in lazy townreads pile ftr.

Dunn: very good scum equity if Ventriloquist flips scum, idk otherwise

Actually I think hebi is town if Vent is scum
So if/when vent flips scum you're probably town too

So like {Vent/MWNN/{RMOJ/ETLDRA/VERYLAZY/DUNN}

Dunn: trusting my initial good gut feelings

{RC, Kaede}
{Alchemist, Ankamius, MWNN, Davesaz}
{Wilky, NC (mariatown)}
{Ramcius}
{Tchill, Dunnstral}
-null line- Impossibear/jungle outside of typical reads
{Verylazy, NC (mariascum)}
{MariaR, Hebichan}
{}
{Wraith}
Hydra of AnonymousGhost & RadiantCowbells

alch town
dunnstral
wilky
nero?
ram
hebi
realman bottom

VOTE: Dunnstral

this instead

Starts off townreading me but slides into voting me again

RMOJ/Bear are off the table today for ~reasons~.

Locktown:
Ankamius
Ouroboros (AnonymousGhost + RadiantCowbells)
Kaede Akamatsu
Wraith
Alchemist21

Townreads:
Ramcius
davesaz

Mariareads:
MariaR

Slight town:
Tchill13

Nullish:
Dunnstral
Nero Cain

Pretty damn awful:
hebichan
verylazy

Absolutely awful:
Wilky
Hydra of Anony

sliding way down the reads

I did but more because I was temporarily irritated at Dunnstral than anything else.

OK...

Locktown or setup unavailable:
Ouroboros
Wilky
RMOJ
Impossibear
Kaede
Ramcius
Ankamius
Davesaz
Alchemist21

Maria:
Maria

meh:
Dunnstral
ProjectMatt/Nero

leaving:
Tchill
Verylazy
Wraith
Hebi
Hydra of Anonym

Wraith and Dunn are 2/3 remaining scum

Undecided on third, leaning towards it being you

Wait, let's take a moment to see what RC has to say about this game in Witches' Halloween Ball:

Hard townread you in fallout to the point of getting pissed you got mislynched.

Yeah

I said I wouldn't strong arm shit today so I'll leave you to your mislynch of Tchill. Wraith and Dunn die the next two days though.

k honestly I just wanna lynch dunnbun but I know maria will get mad at me if I vote him

Ouroboros
Kaede
Ankamius
Davesaz
Alchemist21

Probably town:
Wraith
OTM
Impossibear

Bottom of town, but still towny:
Ramcius

I honestly don't know, going to trust setup spec and hope they do end up dead at some point:
RMOJ

Maria:
Maria

Somewhere around meh:
Tchill
Kokichi
ProjectMatt/Nero

Actively vscummy:
Wilky
Dunnstral

Ramcius
Maria
Tchill
Kokichi
ProjectMatt/Nero
Wilky
Dunnstral

Because Maria can read dunnstral well and says he's locktown and I'm also not -really- scumreading him?

It's also not a bad vote tbh

Meh

I am officially averse to a dunnstral lynch starting now.

interesting

first 4 are all townreads I thiiink? im all ver the place on ramcius rn so not committing to a read there but yea
dunn maybe
rest some stage of ick

wraith/kokichi/projmatt would all be lynchable

I'm gonna try a readslist again, putting you and rmoj in t1 for reasons: RMOJ could easily still be scum ftr.

Ouroboros
Impossibear
Kaede
Ramcius
Ankamius
Alchemist21
OnTheMark

1/2 of
Wilky
Davesaz
is town, the other is probably scum I

decide later:
RMOJ
Maria

Better than the rest maybe?:
Dunnstral

leaving:
Tchill (who doesn't actually make sense with some of the scumflips I thiiink but maybe that's wrong)
Verylazy
Wraith
ProjectMatt/Nero

wait what if both millers are scum

@Impossibear - Please take a look at 3239 for my stance on Kokichi.

Dunn - I have no real opinion about him; he's not a high priority lynch.
Wraith - Same as above. You'd have to talk to RC about possible scum!Wraith since RC was leading the charge on that.

Within your group, here's my preference Kokichi -> Dunn -> Wraith.

Can you take a look at my preference and tell me your thoughts? (Kokichi, Punreader, Wilky)

My big 3 right now would be {Kokichi, Wraith, PJM}, I'm fine narrowing it down to your 3 but I'd probably actively resist a dunnstral lynch for today at least. other two very happy to see dead.

Btw I townread the first four votes, aka scum weren't bussing wraith early presuming he's scum or voting him at all until perhaps dunnstral

like ramcius is town I'm more and more sure
I'm town
Kaede is town
OTM is town - all 3 obvious
Dunnstral maybe scum but townlean

scum are not voting here. wraith is playing to survive the day phase. scum are not going to bus so if town has bad reads town is going to lose.

At the very end he is townreading me, so sure I'll give this one to him, but he scumread me for over half of the game and even at the end was only kind of sure about me

--------------------------------------------------------------
Witches' Halloween Ball - https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77636

I hard townread you in 827 despite you being absolutely worthless
You claim that I townread you in the xyzzy game but I was scumreading you and literally only said you weren't scum with Majiffy who I wasn't even scumreading when I left.
Hard townread you in fallout to the point of getting pissed you got mislynched.

Bringing up RC's opinion as a contrast to what I've quoted so far

I think Dunn is a good towny boi

Sry Dunn you're my top male townread so I'm gonna heavily micromanage your partner

dunn is in my shortlist of DVa partners rn and you don't like my other contenders

maria/cakes is fine as a pairing to me but moreso because i'm not especially sure either are town

think sircakez got a lot of really easy townreads

notably i do think maria is town but i think it will be impossible to convince town to put her in a top 4 pairing

kokichi hasn't done anything to deserve that townread either
aorn i think there's almost no chance I go for a pairing for DVA outside of {gamma/short/kameleon/dunn}

gamma/short/dunn i have damn good reasons to tr

but short/dunn good stuffs.

Clearly being townread all game

No, I'm just not comfortable with Dunn in the townblock

OK

i think maria/dunn probably flips a scum

Talking about my pairing here so trying to get me lynched, although not clear who exactly he is scumreading

Wtf

Dunn is definitely the problem in your pairing Maria

But now it's clear, he's scumreading me again

VOTE: mariadunn

I think LLD would know better than to want to pair with town and be at threat of being walked out on so I think dunnstral is scum

Hey dunnstral I have had exactly one scumread this game and they flipped scum

So if you're actually town and not just scum posturing to discredit me, shut the fuck up.

also dunn you can't read maria. that's an objective fact. she would agree with me on that. so don't say that you can. at least maria's ability to read you has some ability to sway me in a different situation

i came out and said why I'm voting dunn/maria it's fundamentally based onn associative

you are in some sense correct that my push on you has been intellectually dishonest but my pushes are always intellectually dishonest because the real reasons I push people aren't sexy and enticing and it does NOT mean that my play is incorrect. this is something that you should be used to and using it as an attack on me is ??? given that I claimed Ventriloquist was scum because they posted 3 times consecutively even though notepad obviously exists. sometimes the real reasons people are scum aren't enticing to people and it's easier to just lie and not have to explain why something that to the untrained eye is NAI is super telling. the fact that LLD was super set on those Dunn/LLD and Cakez/Maria pairings is super telling, and to me it was super obvious that 1 of the 3 was the case. I do not believe her just randomly setting up TvT pairings makes much sense because if everyone is town, dunn/maria softconfirming each other helps LLD stay alive but Cakez/Maria reaches endgame first and LLD hasn't set a paper trail for defending her buddies, so the Maria/cakez pairing is far more likely to reach endgame because Maria at the end could easily convince Dunn to leave and LLD would know that.

So, in terms of scum pairings either

1) LLD wanted Maria paired with Cakez to keep scum him alive and wanted Dunn with him so maria/dunn could each get pocketed by one scum and townbin each other and they'd win together

least likely

or 1/2 of

1) LLD wanted to be paired with scum!Dunn and was worried that Maria would suss something was up potentially and really pushed for that pairing and also set someone up for Maria to make her happy
2) LLD wanted to keep Scum!Maria and Town!Dunn apart so she hard tried to steal Dunn as a partner so that she could prevent a Maria/Dunn pairing that scum evidently felt would end up backfiring on Maria.

That's why I think you need to die as a pairing, you cover 2/3 of the explanations for why LLD was obsessed with dunnstral and why her pairings were what they were.

The implicitly suggested pairing is dunn/maria goes to endgame given that no other has been suggested and lolno.

Wrong and loud about it.

--------------------------------------------------------------

That's most of our games together, I've left out the following:
-Games where RC was scum
-Games I replaced into after RC was dead or replaced
With a chance of the following:
-Hydra games I don't remember

So now for the fun part, let's take a look at the final stats:

Total games together fitting the above criteria: 16

Games where we were both town and he incorrectly scumread me: 5/10
-However, if we leave out games where he has no opinion on me at all (and I believe we should), that number becomes: 5/8

Games where I was scum and he was town and he correctly scumread me: 2/5
-However, if we disregard hydra games (just theoretically), that number becomes: 0/3


So now let's add all that up, I'd like to leave out the third party game and 2 town games where RC has no opinion towards me at all


Games where RC has an opinion on me, and is correct: 5/13
-However, if we disregard hydra games (just theoretically), that number becomes: 2/10


Bonus statistic:

Games where RC scumreads me at some point during the game: 10/16
-However, if we leave out games where he has no opinion on me at all (and I believe we should), that number becomes: 10/13

[Dunnstral]

Anyways, I'd like to leave the dance