Mini 2059: Secrets of the Anuket Topaz [Over]

[Succinct]

Hi.
Game's long. Summarize? (Claims, events, etc.)

[Succinct]

ISO Ankamius, she gave a decentish summary a few pages back to a few of the recent joiners.

I'm apparently blind; I can't find it?

[Succinct]

I assume tris is referring to this post? It's the only one I've posted that includes a rough idea of where the game is at even though we've had developments since then

Spoiler:

I have more to say on that and how my fundamental thought process as town works and WHY I've gone this specific route for this specific situation, but I'm pretty certain it'll just get written off as self meta so I'll just stop here and leave the thread for a while

i'd be interested in hearing this, when you get back

Okay.

My town thought process generally follows these guidelines:

1. Get initial reads that I'm reasonably confident in.
2. Build a picture for what the gamestate is looking like, where the overall trajectory is heading, and where the scum influence in that gamestate/trajectory are
3. Test that theory by shaking up the gamestate enough that everyone has to adjust to what I'm doing.
4. Narrow down where the scumteam are likely to be in the game, and narrow down the slots that are most likely the scum causing the scum influence in the game.
5. Rebuild the gamestate so that town is naturally going to find my townreads as town and my PoE as scum.

So essentially, my job in most games is to find where scum are weakest and force town to scumhunt within that area. The tactics change, but that's fundamentally what I'm doing from game to game.

Relating to this game specifically, my read on the gamestate began with this:

1. There was overwhelming support among the active players to lynch the NotMySpamAccount slot
2. Most of those slots were townreading each other.
3. The rest of the slots were pretty much absent entirely.

Initial deductions are: If scum are within the active slots, they are already well on their way to pocketing the active town within them. It's unlikely that all the scum are in the lurker slots because it's ultimately dangerous to allow that many town slots to townread each other so easily within the game and agree on one slot. Therefore, it's very likely that there is

some

scum intent in killing NMSA, which means that either NMSA is a mislynch or that scum are okay bussing him.

I can abuse those deductions and test them by building the increasing suspicion on my slot to force people to pay attention to me instead of NMSA. It's important to note here that I can toneread people much more easily when they are targeting me because I can direct their thoughts in a way that can reveal to me whether they are legitimately falling for my trick and scumreading me... or faking it. I assumed that either people would be very split among scumreading me and how much they were scumreading me, or there would be a good deal of melding... which would strongly indicate there's scum within that bracket since that would be evidence to my theory that scum are within the active players/NMSA voters, and therefore looking to pocket themselves into the active towns.

I eliminated Reck from that bracket since he was aggressively pushing his own wagon; I don't suspect this is to save NMSA because of the above deductions, I'm not getting the sense he's trying to

derail

town by throwing them down a different path since he's aggressive, but not RC-levels of aggressive. And lastly, the way he was treating my slot was indicative of him critically thinking about whether my slot is scum or not, which is not 100% unfakeable if my read of him is correct, but it's more than enough to leave him out of my PoE list for a good while until I have reason to revisit it.

I used the fake hammer to get the reads too, and purposely amplified people's emotional reactions to get people to further react to me and reveal their mindset, since legitimate emotional reactions that make sense with the situation and their internal logic is NOT easy to fake. Brigitte failed this spectacularly. urap2 became a decently strong townread because of when and how he reframed his reads (I still don't believe he wanted to pocket me, this was well before I started getting any townreads other than like... Reck).

The rest of my provoking people was mainly to see how they would react and how their read of me would shift as I continued posting. You perfectly nailed what I was looking to come off as, cocky at being obvtown and never able to be lynched this game; this is why I kept up the snark for so long and kept posting about how hard I am to lynch as town (which IS true, none of that was a lie). I strongly suspected that scum would either back off, or strain themselves in a tunnel against me under the opinion that they

couldn't

back off. Enter somewhat fits this, but I don't have enough to really place it anywhere concrete, and Brigitte pretty well failed this.

I think this is roughly everything?

Oh, that one. Skimmed it, but it didn't seem like a summary.
Is the game really "some slots townread each other, almost lynched NMSA together", nothing more?
If so, who were all the NMSA voters?

I should have a confident sr by now but I only have confident townreads.

Enough of those're superior to having scumreads.

Name them.

Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.

Not convinced on Nimueh, but skitter-town/Brigitte-scum, can see.

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

I like my company on the Brigitte wagon way more than the tris wagon, it looks suspicious as hell to me

Agreed.

Creature

>

skitter30 > tris = Ankamius

>

Nimueh >

Xtoxm = xRECKONERx = NotMySpamAccount = Elbirn = Chara

(need more on all of these)

>

Flubbernugget = Brigitte

Barring further info.

VOTE: Brigitte

[Succinct]

oh hello, Succint!
...*forgets if the main is outed or not*

Not to my knowledge.

[Succinct]

p-edit and succinct was enter right?

Correct.

That is L-1. I will self hammer tomorrow.

like this isn't a scummy reaction imo

Agreed, but is it a town reaction?

[Succinct]

boy am i interested in hearing more about these (specifically: me, creature, chara, nimueh, and tris)

Creature's scumgame's not this good.
You said it yourself:

given that i'm quite good at obvtowning when i'm, like, town

tris's content's fine and the wagon's suspect.
Nimueh's stances vaguely look town.
Chara I lack sufficient data right now.

Will update these as appropriate.

[Succinct]

or, that's not quite wha tyou pushed, sorry, but pushing someone on the basis of their actions not being townie (when it's agreed tehy also aren't scummy) is awful imo

Not my intention. My meaning was Brigitte's suspicious; one post not being scummy's not enough to change that, unless it's sufficiently strongly town-indicative, thus my question; was it a town reaction? If it's nai, then it doesn't change prior scumminess.

Succinct what are your overall thoughts atm?

Is the game really "some slots townread each other, almost lynched NMSA together", nothing more?
If so, who were all the NMSA voters?

Creature

>

skitter30 > tris = Ankamius

>

Nimueh >

Xtoxm = xRECKONERx = NotMySpamAccount = Elbirn = Chara

(need more on all of these)

>

Flubbernugget = Brigitte

Barring further info.

Reasons for non-grayed reads already given; grayed reads = need more info.

[Succinct]

tris's content's fine and the wagon's suspect.

Expand.

Votecount 1.14

tris(5)

~ skitter30(221), Brigitte(240), Elbirn(217), Creature(36), Flubbernugget(78)

The only names town here're skitter/Creature; Elbirn's null; wagon formed quickly; wagon has both Flubbernugget/Brigitte on it (my scumreads).

tris's content hasn't been suspect; burden of proof lies on accusers and I've not seen any convincing arguments. (Or any, but I admit I may have missed them.)

[Succinct]

then it doesn't change prior scumminess.

Expand.

Opportunistic hop-on to your counterwagon, response about Chara's stance was suspect, posts don't seem to be advancing gamestate, description of your play from others.

[Succinct]

that quote about me is literally from a sentence where i said that i'm good at looking townie as scum so that's also a bad reason to townread me
i also have no idea how well you know my playstyle but like if you don't know me trusting my word on that also seems like a bad idea

I have experience with you.

You're good at obvtowning as town.
You're good at "obvtowning" as scum, but this isn't that; it's the former, not latter.

[Succinct]

I'm a bit concerned with the amount of people that have managed to sync with me this game so far, this doesn't feel like the kind of game where that should be happening this early

If it helps, me synching with you's why I'm townreading you.
This doesn't surprise me.

[Succinct]

I'm a bit concerned with the amount of people that have managed to sync with me this game so far, this doesn't feel like the kind of game where that should be happening this early

If it helps, me synching with you's why I'm townreading you.
This doesn't surprise me.

At the risk of outing my identity, synchronizing with you's not uncommon when we share alignments.

[Succinct]

What are you referring to when you say "this" doesn't surprise you?

This doesn't surprise me.

At the risk of outing my identity, synchronizing with you's not uncommon when we share alignments.[/quote]

[Succinct]

Er.

What are you referring to when you say "this" doesn't surprise you?

At the risk of outing my identity, synchronizing with you's not uncommon when we share alignments.

[Succinct]

I wasn't aware day had started.

Reading now.

[Succinct]

and scum should be there:
Xtoxm u r a person 2
Chara
xRECKONERx
NotMySpamAccount
Flubbernugget
tris

Switch tris<->Elbirn and we're on same page.

Btw why are we doing a tris wagon

Because people wrongly think the Brigitte wagon was countering a wagon on 'scum'-tris.

This games been really quiet, which is weird after getting a flip and a new day start..

I personally didn't know day started; was expecting mod to message me.

Succinct, why did you scum read Brigitte?

then it doesn't change prior scumminess.

Expand.

Opportunistic hop-on to your counterwagon, response about Chara's stance was suspect, posts don't seem to be advancing gamestate, description of your play from others.

like i was townreading enter but i don't really classify succint as being an active poster

Apologies. I do what I can, but succinctness does not foster activity.

VOTE: Flubbernugget
Still a scumread.
Vaguely lean Xtoxm/Chara town, but those're gut; I have no evidence backing reads up.
Think remaining two're in xRECKONERx/NotMySpamAccount/Elbirn.

[Succinct]

Because people

wrongly

think the Brigitte wagon was countering a wagon on 'scum'-tris.

huh? it felt like the counterwagon was tris

Perhaps emphasis'll help meaning.
tris

was

the counterwagon; people wrongly think Brigitte was.

[Succinct]

Switch trisElbirn and we're on same page.

i'm pretty sure elbirn is town and why do you want tris taken out of the poe?

Elbirn read's complicated.
He looks different from last time where he was town, but I'm also cautious; I misread him as being scum last time.

tris:

tris's content's fine and the wagon's suspect.

Expand.

Votecount 1.14

tris(5)

~ skitter30(221), Brigitte(240), Elbirn(217), Creature(36), Flubbernugget(78)

The only names town here're skitter/Creature; Elbirn's null; wagon formed quickly; wagon has both Flubbernugget/Brigitte on it (my scumreads).

tris's content hasn't been suspect; burden of proof lies on accusers and I've not seen any convincing arguments. (Or any, but I admit I may have missed them.)

Remains true. I haven't noticed any case; if there was one, certainly wasn't compelling.

[Succinct]

Forgot to mention:
I'd

vote

NMSA, but I'd

prefer

Flubbernugget.
NMSA's possible scum, but Flubber's an actual scumread.

[Succinct]

Succinct: gamestate read? Idr if I asked you yet or not

Ill-suited to answer sufficiently.
I lack grounding.

Loosely feel active slots're town, but my definition of active may not match yours. Nimueh, skitter30, Chara, tris, Creature, yourself.
Xtoxm's only townlean outside of there.

[Succinct]

What do you think about me believing you are trying to pocket me this game

I developed my reads independently of you. Matching up was coincidental. When this is evident, your paranoia'll fade.

Why is Flubber scummier to you than NMSA?

Mostly, experience. I lack it with NMSA; I have it with Flubbernugget. I know Flubbernugget's contribution's scummy. I don't have meta on NMSA that'd let me know if his play's alignment-indicative.

[Succinct]

what grounding do you need

Proper understanding of the game.

I've heard there was an L-1 on NMSA, but I know nothing about it, when that seems to be a key discussion point.
I've heard there was a townbloc formed on NMSA, but I don't know who it was comprised of.
I asked for these things, but was not given them.

[Succinct]

what grounding do you need

Proper understanding of the game.

Specifically, how it went prior to my entrance, if that wasn't clear.

[Succinct]

What specifically is scummy to you about Flubber’s “contribution”?

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

+

Votecount 1.14

tris(5)

~ skitter30(221), Brigitte(240), Elbirn(217), Creature(36), Flubbernugget(78)

The only names town here're skitter/Creature; Elbirn's null; wagon formed quickly; wagon has both Flubbernugget/Brigitte on it (my scumreads).

+ Knowing Flubbernugget's meta.
His contribution's lackluster; as town I'd expect it not to be.

[Succinct]

Ank is being a WOAT in this game and I’m really this close to losing it on her rn.

For the record Nimueh if you wish to avoid outing your identity, don't use phrases exclusively used by your main. There's only one scummer I know who uses that term, and knowing this I can confidently deduce you're town.

ngl i'm paranoid about succinct doing that to me here too

I'd aim to pocket Ank before you, respectfully.

Idk whether to be upset or disappointed that you don't understand how I approach the game yet

You do whatever you feel you need to.
I'm somewhat baffled you felt the need to act like my main.

Equally as baffling:

Low priority sorts:
Succinct

Knowing who I am and having me as a low-priority sort. I'd think I'd be your highest. However, speaking of 2570:

Townbin:
xRECKONERx

Since I've seen xRECKONERx content, this I can now agree on.

actually fuck flubber is town so i need to bump him way up and then figure out who else goes in the scumpile

Why.

(specifically, the indignation at not being spoonfed a game summary + the entirety of the case on flubb being 'meta')

To clarify, I needn't have a game summary to generate reads/content. However, I was specifically asked for thoughts on the gamestate; to give said feedback, I needed that info, and had desired that angle since replacing in.

Scum reading me bc "meta" and that's it.

My read's more complex than that. It's actually closer to this:

It's a gamestate read, his alignment holds a pretty big key to solving it I think. His actions indicate a scum agenda that I suspect is in play this game and him flipping scum would go a long way towards proving that.
It's a high information high scum equity lynch

2. NMSA got the overall town's eye and was pushed up to L-2 or L-1 with very little counterpushing other than Reck wanting to push lurkers
3. I replaced back in on this account (Branson is an alt of mine) and started scumming up on purpose to try to move the pressure around and to get more info to work with
4. At some point tris fakehammered (I think NMSA?). I started pushing Brigitte very shortly after this point (I'm still purposely scumming up at this point)
5. Tictac-slot gets somewhat wagoned as a lurker slot. It doesn't get too far iirc
6. Eventually Brigitte and I 1v1 and the wagon on her starts to take off from there. Note that a wagon on me was pretty much constant up to this point since I was on Branson.
7. tictac remains a wagon until Brigitte provokes Reck and he starts hard-pushing her
8. Replacement spam throughout this; lady angel flakes out and urap2 gets replaced at the same time not too long after the fakehammer I believe, tictac flakes a bit after that, then Enter leaves a bit after that
9. a tris counterwagon sprouts up when the Brigitte pressure starts to let up (primarily me backing off the push despite revoting her very shortly after unvoting)
10. When both are at L-3, we push the Brigitte wagon through
11. THE GAME DIES

This perfectly fits with scum letting town self-destruct.
Which I believe we have, given unfolding events.

If scum were influential in the events described, I'd expect there to be clear evidence, but those events all look like they originate from town.

I still don’t understand why you are even sr me at this point. I am not dping anything similar to what you have sr me before. All I do know if that your read on me is dead wrong here. If you flip me, you have to promise that you will never claimed to be able to accurately read me ever again. Deal?

Entirely regardless of Ank's case, this is just ridiculous. Even on the off chance that Nim is town, which I highly doubt, one misread doesn't mean you can never claim to read someone accurately again.

To wit, this is scum sitting on the sidelines, letting the fight play out without a meaningful contribution.

Skitter's new vote is even more bizarre than their previous one

As is this.

It was hard to notice given that the sun was still directly overhead, but many of the lights weren't working as well.

Votecount 1.4

NotMySpamAccount (5):

u r a person 2 5, tris 62, tictac 67, Brigitte 144, Enter 207

skitter30 (2):

Chara 69, Bronson 259

Brigitte (1):

NotMySpamAccount 198

Enter (1):

xRECKONERx 82

Not voting (4):

Nimueh, Ankamius, skitter30 190, Flubbernugget 258

With 13 alive, it’s 7 to lynch. The Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2019-03-08 00:58:59).

@Mod: This VC is incorrect; Lady Angel is still voting Brigitte at this point and you have my slot as voting skitter30 and not voting at the same time.

I'd also say the NMSA wagon was likely entirely town. There's a

small

outside chance Xtoxm's scum, but the other names're solidly town. In other words:

Interesting note A: The NMSA wagon gained steam and the amount of other 'wagons' drastically increased (and additionally the strength of wagons decreased) over time while NMSA was in the spotlight. This makes me think NMSA is town and scum are either helping push that wagon or looking to reduce the information gained from that flip.

I got the exact opposite impression; the other wagons're scum scrambling for a counterwagon to their scumbuddy.

Creature = Nimueh

>

skitter30 = Ankamius = xRECKONERx = Chara = tris

> Xtoxm > Elbirn > NotMySpamAccount

>

Flubbernugget

Where I'm at.

[Succinct]

I don't understand the skitter townread

I don't understand the skitter scumread. To me, skitter's play here's hitting every note I'd expect of her as town, with no warning signs of being scum. Regrettably, I currently can't figure out how to vocalize this; I'll let you know when I have.

Idk whether to be upset or disappointed that you don't understand how I approach the game yet

You do whatever you feel you need to.
I'm somewhat baffled you felt the need to act like my main.

Equally as baffling:

Low priority sorts:
Succinct

Knowing who I am and having me as a low-priority sort. I'd think I'd be your highest.

I'm legitimately confused by both of these comments
Like there's a hint here that I have your identity pegged correctly, but both of these comments to me don't reflect how we generally interact with each other

Your push against Nimueh's akin to a push I'd normally make: pushing someone you know won't be lynched, but will give more information to poe the scum. Your analysis of Nimueh being the eddie cane of the game was spot-on.

I should clarify it's not so much that I'm always a high-priority sort. It's more referring to:

I'm only worrying about that slot because if I'm wrong, I think I have to spend too much time proving it to be able to take the proper precautions if they're scum

This is a genuine threat; given your paranoia and the amount of time/effort to counteract scum!Succinct, I'd think I'd be a higher priority, so you'd be able to (depending on your conclusion) either have peace of mind at not needing this, or enough time to shift gears and do this.

[Succinct]

So I'm assuming you would be content with a Flubber + NMSA + Xtoxm solve currently?

I disagree on Xtoxm, but wouldn't fight that read.

Elbirn idk, not enough to sort yet. null
Succinct, not sure, but a mild tr here bc of Enter
Xtoxm, same as above, slightly stronger tr bc of urap2 who I can maybe read slightly better from experience
skitter, was a tr, sheeped someone on a sr cause I was demotivated, null.
Chara, I have no clue, don't ask, I can't read the slot to save my life, null
reck, slight tr for tone, not much here
flubbernugget, not sure, I could see either, more involved interaction will help the read
tris, maaaayyybe a tiny sr for weird gut reasons, can't explain it
Creature, same as Elbirn

In other words: almost everyone's null.

is Flubber very calculating as scum?

No.

i predict a scum stomp

Only if the Flubber wagon falls apart.

I need to respond to succinct but the way he quoted stuff makes that hard to do on mobile

How so?

I've completely lost my will to win this game, it died after the D1 lynch, and now it feels like diving into a pool of molasses just reading the thread. I'm perfectly willing to sheep Ank or skitter or someone if it will just get this game to the end or at least to a point where the game is moving fast than 2 posts a day. If Ank is scum taking advantage to lead town astray, then screw it the scumteam deserves the win because I just don't care enough anymore. VOTE: Flubber, I hope it's not L-1 or a hammer cause I'm sure not checking.

Obvious bus vote's obvious.

@Succint, @Tris, thoughts?

Xtoxm's a scum candidate, but my fear's that if he's town, lynching him causes a town self-destruct.
Flubber, I've no such worries.

[Succinct]

succinct, why are you townreading creature?

Creature's scumgame's not this good.

Hasn't changed.

[Succinct]

speaking of elbirn
he's done literally nothing in the past week now

Still hasn't.

I think this is scum #3

So you agree with my solve?

i kinda think elbirn is town tbh

Explain?

I’m townlocking Creature, Ank and Chara. Thanks Elbirn. <3

Not me?

I’m actually thinking now that everyone save Xtoxm, Elbirn and Flubber are town. Flubber at least in part due to associatives.

Your solve's compatible with mine, if you'd add NMSA in.

i really don't think Flubber/Elbirn/Xtoxm is ever a team here.

What about Flubber/Elbirn/NMSA?

[Succinct]

What posts are your scumread on me based on?

Most since replacing in; prominent offenders: 2273, 2668, 2801.
Since then, 3065 as well.

I am going to IC tomorrow

Can we please agree to speedlynch Flubber tomorrow when this is inevitably shown false?

Pretty sure we all know it's bs, but we're all going to let him prove it regardless.

VOTE: NotMySpamAccount

[Succinct]

then again everyone fell for the stupid IC claim

Pardon:
I did not.

I still prefer this as a scumbuddy:
VOTE: NotMySpamAccount
And still think Elbirn's the third.

[Succinct]

I'd much rather not hit a situation where they're scum and end the day before I really look at them and just kill me, then charisma through to victory

It's more conductive worrying I'm town, scum kill you, then my lack of charisma leads to loss.

I wouldn't even call pushing on Flubber after the IC thing town indicative

Nor I.

I'm actually not entirely sure about whether there's a mastermind in this game or not. I think only Succinct would fit the qualifications necessary for it to be possible.

Noteworthy: I replaced into this game, wasn't here from start. You should check if Enter's mastermind-worthy.
I'm also no mastermind on this account. I've the qualifications if on my main, but lack them here.

I too am of the opinion this game lacks a mastermind.

I feel then that looking at Flubber's interactions with others/others' interactions with Flubber is a mistake.
Scum knew they'd be sending someone away, and at least on D2 knew it'd be Flubber.
What we should focus on is individual play.

E.g.:

i have been very clearly off the mark and got got by flubber's random play
i need to reevaluate this game. i still think tris is a good lynch but after the flub flip i dont feel so great about my ability to read anyone.

like i can't even argue with people wanting to lynch me. my defense of flubber looks really really bad and i cannot defend it because it was shit based on gut. and couple that with me leading the brigitte charge d1 and yeah, i get the desire to lynch me. im not even sure i particularly have it in me to fight the lynch because it's deserved.

I know scum

can

post this.
I don't think scum-Reck

does

.

NMSA/tris are my top two scumreads but that feels too fucking easy. with this setup there's no way this is a slam dunk

That's too easy, but what about NMSA/Elbirn?

Well then. This changes a lot. Given the aforementioned case on why tris is town, and the fact that I know I'm town, reck almost certainly scumreads two town players. Even if I'm not obvtown, tris is because Flubber and scum in general wouldn't be that suicidal. This means reck is more likely than average to be scum. VOTE: reck

Given Reck's a likely mislynch, this is scum opportunism.

[Succinct]

i really need to get a better feel for what succinct is doing.

Succinctly trying to lynch scum.
Easiest way: iso me. My post count's deliberately low enough to be a manageable read, so it's not hard.

[Succinct]

I feel then that looking at Flubber's interactions with others/others' interactions with Flubber is a mistake.
Scum knew they'd be sending someone away, and at least on D2 knew it'd be Flubber.
What we should focus on is individual play.

why does this necessarily follow and/or correlate?

They aren't entirely linked.
I've read people's analysis of Flubber's iso + analysis of others' interactions with Flubber.

The entire time I've felt those analyses are off-base; given that, I'd feel it were a mistake even if not for what I said.

Yet, isn't it logical? Scum sent Flubber away. They knew Flubber would be sent away at least on D2. Wouldn't they tailor their actions so Flubber's flip wouldn't point directly to them? That doesn't require a mastermind; it's something they'd do individually: put distance between themselves and Flubber, to not be caught when he's shown scum. (Most scum show strong self-preservation instincts without leadership.)

However, no matter how well-hidden their interactions with Flubber, they can't change the quality of their play.

So hunting off of individual play feels like the route to take.

[Succinct]

THIS is saying that my strongest tool for scumhunting is not going to be useful here.

I know it's your strongest tool.
It's usually one of mine.
But given the setup, unfortunately, it's what I think; lacking a mastermind, scum were going to show high self-preservation, masking interactions with scumbuddies.

1. NMSA thinks that sheeping me throughout d2 is his best odds at surviving, even far enough to be willing to bus Flubber and conftown all but FOUR towns in the process.

This applies to

all

Flubber voters; voting him risked conftowning all but four town. Do you think every Flubber voter was town? I don't.

2. Elbirn thinks that tearing down my case at the core is his best odds at surviving, and most likely decided that the time he posted his rebuttal to me was the time to do it.

Which are you more weary of: someone opposing you, or someone sheeping you? Experience says the latter; Elbirn could know that. I wouldn't expect that knowledge from NMSA, or for it to be shared.

[Succinct]

Who besides Nimueh was/is townreading creature?

I am.
It'd be lying to say townread's same strength, but experience tells me

not

to let paranoia dictate my read there, to trust my townread.

[Succinct]

add reck and take me out and I'm with you 100%. Also I think Elbirn is right here, and it goes with my current gut read so VOTE: Nimueh

The opportunism's unreal, here.
When people suspected Reck, he voted Reck.
When people chased after a "scumslip", he votes Nimueh. In spite of what he said earlier

that page

:

I see only two general possibilities. Scumteam is flubber/reck/(Elbirn or an inactive), or it's flubber/Ank/irrelevant cause the IC claim was planned and Ank really is the mastermind we haven't been looking for and this post was distancing to help conftown Ank and town has no chance. Obviously the second is a long shot, but it's possible. Discuss.

I admit I could be wrong on Elbirn, but I'm

not

wrong on NMSA.

[Succinct]

i thought NMSA was clear because he almost hammered flub
is that not the case anymore

It was never the case.

Elbirn

Succint
Chara

NotMySpamAccount

tris
It's 5p LyLo, two of you are scum, the rest of us are treestumps. If you lynch someone wrong, you lose (not in practice, but let's do like this).

You already know my answer.

How is NMSA still alive over Brigitte and Xtoxm who were miles townier?

Good question.

NMSA
Succint
Elbirn

You seem to think I'm a double-busser.
I generally avoid bussing altogether.

I hate alts.

I take offense to that.
I do question the point in playing on an alt if you're playing identically to your main. (My gimmick's in my name. Speaking of...)

Sure. Apart from his abysmally low postcount, post quality, and thereby remarkably poor contribution to the game, I also have not been able to find a single reason to townread him in a 150-pager. Looking at his ISO, it's scummily-barren, he isn't trying to gamesolve or have the conviction that town would.

You're scumreading playstyle. Look at my name. It's my approach; deliberately minimalistic. I'm also a late-D1 replacement. I average 1 post/day. My game solving's in all my posts; I mostly only quote pertinent content. (Almost)

Everything

holds relevance.

But, I observed his lack of emotion and/or conviction in those posts [compare to NMSA], hinting that it may be indicative of a distancing attempt on a scumpartner who was already under fire (and therefore also the prime candidate to escape the game).

You apparently missed a few posts pushing Flubber significantly.
Of 29 posts, I pushed him in 9+ of them.
The ones not pushing him, most're establishing/defending/explaining townreads, or pushing NMSA, or pushing Elbirn.
I never let up on Flubber; my push on NMSA's been the same since D2.

[Succinct]

1. Flying under the radar, and 2. Lack of gamesolving.

You'll never find me active, least of all not now. (Knowing my main'd help know why I'm particularly inactive now.) My gamesolving's in establishing townreads more than establishing scumreads, but I've done both.

I'm aided by people engaging me, but them not doing so's out of my control. If people don't interact with what I post, then I don't have anything to follow through on.

You're making me miss Ank, because she's one of the few who

would

engage me.
Question my reasons for NMSA, question my reasons for Elbirn, question my townreads.

^This post is also a pretty bad look.

What about it's wrong?
The only possible scum mastermind's me, and I

know

that's not right.
Knowing this, scum didn't have one.
Knowing they didn't have one, scum're going to play more as individuals.
The average individual scum player shows high levels of self-preservation, more interested in personal survival than survival of scumteam.
I think given this setup, that trait's amplified.

Voting Flubber risked five players becoming conftown. Flubber had ~7 different voters at different time. They aren't all town. As a result, scum at some point did cast a bus vote, and I think they did it for precisely the reason I outlined above: an increased sense of self-preservation, leading to a decreased interest of survival of the scumteam.

Never NMSA who I think is town.

NMSA also has good reasons to be town (that i've actually looked at)

Remind me why.

[Succinct]

considering this is Succinct's only scumread, i wonder why they didn't go harder on it,

I can't go harder than I do.
You expect me to bs reasons?
I made my points.
They held.
Nobody engaged those points.
No new points were raised; nothing changed existing points.
What more

could

I have done?

Honest question, because I genuinely could use the feedback from the answer.
What you saw

was

me trying.
If my trying wasn't good enough, tell me what needed to be better.

or consider

why

scum Flubber decides to try and live another day for seemingly no reason.

I was tired, I was exhausted, I was dejected. It wasn't worth the effort. I knew he wasn't getting lynched. I wasn't happy he wasn't getting lynched, but nothing I said or did would change it. I couldn't argue we should lynch him in spite of the claim, because from a theory standpoint we

should've

let him live, and I

knew

that theory.

How would you feel knowing the correct theoretical play's to let your scumread live, in spite of a bs claim?

Enter has only been in the game for a fraction of its duration

Actually, this time you're mistaken.
Enter was in the game for 75 pages.
I've been in the game for 78 pages.
Page-wise, we've been around an equal amount.

Succinct is extraordinarily scummy and therefore we can infer that he is arguably a lot worse at hiding his alignment than Enter.

For those who know my identity:

I would really appreciate it if you helped me with the Succinct push.

I would really appreciate it if you dropped your one incorrect read to push the correct NMSA/Elbirn combo.

[Succinct]

in a replacement situation you should always aim to read the easier and more transparent slot, not the one which is better at scum.

By that metric, you'd be reading Enter, because

I

am the slot that's better at scum.

As for Elbirn I acknowledged that I am biased against his way of playing.

And yet the thought didn't occur to you you're biased against mine?

NMSA has demonstrated strong town flashes during the course of the game.

Show them.

[Succinct]

How is it townie? Enter is shadethrowing and discrediting Reck who is one of my top townreads currently.

can you convince me on Reck being town?

I can.

Read 2551. The analysis there was solid.
While he reversed his read on Flubber, the way he did so indicates they're not scumbuddies. 2552 wouldn't be town without 2551 prior, but with it, it shows a strong indication he's not scum. Why would scum start to set up for a distance with their scumbuddy, only to immediately hard-reverse it into defense?

Stances in 2560 were original, and not sheeping the thread consensus.

Plus this:

i have been very clearly off the mark and got got by flubber's random play
i need to reevaluate this game. i still think tris is a good lynch but after the flub flip i dont feel so great about my ability to read anyone.

like i can't even argue with people wanting to lynch me. my defense of flubber looks really really bad and i cannot defend it because it was shit based on gut. and couple that with me leading the brigitte charge d1 and yeah, i get the desire to lynch me. im not even sure i particularly have it in me to fight the lynch because it's deserved.

I know scum

can

post this.
I don't think scum-Reck

does

.

Still holds.

[Succinct]

Succinct is only ever replying to people

Naturally, because

that's my playstyle

.
Especially as a replacement who didn't read content prior to replacing in.
All I

had

was replying to people to generate content.

Does nobody actually see the problem with being only reactive rather than proactive?

Naturally, because

there is none

.

and never putting forth his own pushes and arguments.

Just because arguments pushed are in walls doesn't mean they aren't there.

Has Succinct ever explained his Flubber scumread?

It's in

the very post you quoted

:

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

Ank was talking about Flubber.
Someone who's in the scum pool yet you don't remember why is usually scum; doubly so when said someone's a player like Flubber.
If anyone had

asked

me about this at the time, I'd happily have said as much.
Nobody did, but I can't control that, can I?

No explanation was ever given for Flubbernugget and Brigitte scumread.

The Brigitte read was also explained:

Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.

Not convinced on Nimueh, but skitter-town/Brigitte-scum, can see.

Context: skitter made this post after I replaced in:

the elbirn wagon was: brigitte, chara, xtoxm, nimueh
my gut says that there's prob scum in the elbirn voters, probably in this order of likeliness: nimueh >

brigitte

= chara > xtoxm

My post was saying, "I think Nimueh's town, and the scum on Elbirn was Brigitte".

Succinct explanations != no explanations.

[Succinct]

How would you feel knowing the correct theoretical play's to let your scumread live, in spite of a bs claim?

I should also emphasize: how would you feel, as a person who prides themselves on theory, that the correct theoretical play's to let your largest scumread live, in spite of a bs claim?

I knew the correct theoretical play was letting him live.
And I was feeling defeated because of it.

[Succinct]

I hate alts.

I do question the point in playing on an alt if you're playing identically to your main.

On this note, Tohru, I'm hoping you're not on the blacklist of any player in the game (as you might be if you're who you obviously are), because no offense, I'd rather any of them than you.

[Succinct]

Succinct is only ever replying to people

Naturally, because

that's my playstyle

.
Especially as a replacement who didn't read content prior to replacing in.
All I

had

was replying to people to generate content.

For reference, I've three completed games; all as a replacement; in all, I'm bottom post-wise.

Replying's how I scumhunt.

[Succinct]

that wasn't very succinct

When responding to lots of content, can only trim so much down.
Especially when responses involve extrapolating out existing thoughts. Statements're easily succinct, detailing how thoughts got from A to B aren't.

I disagree with the bolded. In this setup, I think that’s reversed. In your typical game, scum can bus and still win. In this setup,

the ENTIRE scumteam must survive or they ALL lose

. Iow,

in THIS setup, self-preservation=ultimately protecting your team

. No, this is faulty reasoning here, because

self-preservation=survival of the scumteam in THIS setup

.

Then do you think every Flubber voter was town?

I don’t understand this. Why is it the “correct theoretical play”? the correct theoretical play, is always pushing your strongest sr, no matter what.

Sorry, but no.
Correct theoretical play for a D3 IC claim's to let the IC claim live to D3. Chance of conftown > anything else. Correct theoretical play's

always

letting the IC claim live to prove it; that's why the obviously-BS claim was so defeating. I knew I couldn't do anything, because

I myself

knew the correct theory wasn't doing anything.

Both you and NMSA have Elbirn in your POE but neither of you, are willing to vote him.

Where did you get the impression I wasn't willing to vote Elbirn?
My NMSA scumread's stronger.
That doesn't make me unwilling to vote Elbirn, just more confident in NMSA.

yeah iirc at the end of day1 they had a fairly strong fairly mysterious scumread on flubber (like, way before it was popular) and like i asked about it but it never got explained

Pardon? Where'd you ask? I saw nothing of this sort until D2.

tbf that was *fairly* close to eod so there might not have been time to actually push flubber there

Correct. Half my reason for voting Brigitte was Brigitte > tris as a wagon, and both were the lead wagons.

but i don't remember the two of them interacting like *at all*

You'll also not remember me interacting with most players this game, because few have engaged me. Flubber's nothing special in that regard.

and there's like no mention of flubber in their iso before this besides for the like the afore-mentioned scumread which is meh

Has Succinct ever explained his Flubber scumread?

It's in

the very post you quoted

:

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

Ank was talking about Flubber.
Someone who's in the scum pool yet you don't remember why is usually scum; doubly so when said someone's a player like Flubber.
If anyone had

asked

me about this at the time, I'd happily have said as much.

VOTE: succinct

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Succinct

Tohru:

It should send

massive

red flags to you that the

people you've partnered with me

are the ones voting me.

Your solve's wrong.

Fix it.
VOTE: Elbirn

[Succinct]

VOTE: succinct

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Succinct

Tohru:

It should send

massive

red flags to you that the

people you've partnered with me

are the ones voting me.

Your solve's wrong.

Fix it.
VOTE: Elbirn

Repeat: The players you called my scumbuddies are the ones

backing you up

.
If I was scum, I'd have a scumbuddy; who'd it be?

[Succinct]

For that matter, no, you don't get to ignore these, either:

Spoiler: Quotewall

NMSA
Succint
Elbirn

You seem to think I'm a double-busser.
I generally avoid bussing altogether.

Sure. Apart from his abysmally low postcount, post quality, and thereby remarkably poor contribution to the game, I also have not been able to find a single reason to townread him in a 150-pager. Looking at his ISO, it's scummily-barren, he isn't trying to gamesolve or have the conviction that town would.

You're scumreading playstyle. Look at my name. It's my approach; deliberately minimalistic. I'm also a late-D1 replacement. I average 1 post/day. My game solving's in all my posts; I mostly only quote pertinent content. (Almost)

Everything

holds relevance.

But, I observed his lack of emotion and/or conviction in those posts [compare to NMSA], hinting that it may be indicative of a distancing attempt on a scumpartner who was already under fire (and therefore also the prime candidate to escape the game).

You apparently missed a few posts pushing Flubber significantly.
Of 29 posts, I pushed him in 9+ of them.
The ones not pushing him, most're establishing/defending/explaining townreads, or pushing NMSA, or pushing Elbirn.
I never let up on Flubber; my push on NMSA's been the same since D2.

1. Flying under the radar, and 2. Lack of gamesolving.

You'll never find me active, least of all not now. (Knowing my main'd help know why I'm particularly inactive now.) My gamesolving's in establishing townreads more than establishing scumreads, but I've done both.

I'm aided by people engaging me, but them not doing so's out of my control. If people don't interact with what I post, then I don't have anything to follow through on.

You're making me miss Ank, because she's one of the few who

would

engage me.
Question my reasons for NMSA, question my reasons for Elbirn, question my townreads.

Enter has only been in the game for a fraction of its duration

Actually, this time you're mistaken.
Enter was in the game for 75 pages.
I've been in the game for 78 pages.
Page-wise, we've been around an equal amount.

Succinct is extraordinarily scummy and therefore we can infer that he is arguably a lot worse at hiding his alignment than Enter.

For those who know my identity:

in a replacement situation you should always aim to read the easier and more transparent slot, not the one which is better at scum.

By that metric, you'd be reading Enter, because

I

am the slot that's better at scum.

As for Elbirn I acknowledged that I am biased against his way of playing.

And yet the thought didn't occur to you you're biased against mine?

Succinct is only ever replying to people

Naturally, because

that's my playstyle

.
Especially as a replacement who didn't read content prior to replacing in.
All I

had

was replying to people to generate content.

Does nobody actually see the problem with being only reactive rather than proactive?

Naturally, because

there is none

.

and never putting forth his own pushes and arguments.

Just because arguments pushed are in walls doesn't mean they aren't there.

Has Succinct ever explained his Flubber scumread?

It's in

the very post you quoted

:

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

Ank was talking about Flubber.
Someone who's in the scum pool yet you don't remember why is usually scum; doubly so when said someone's a player like Flubber.
If anyone had

asked

me about this at the time, I'd happily have said as much.
Nobody did, but I can't control that, can I?

No explanation was ever given for Flubbernugget and Brigitte scumread.

The Brigitte read was also explained:

Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.

Not convinced on Nimueh, but skitter-town/Brigitte-scum, can see.

Context: skitter made this post after I replaced in:

the elbirn wagon was: brigitte, chara, xtoxm, nimueh
my gut says that there's prob scum in the elbirn voters, probably in this order of likeliness: nimueh >

brigitte

= chara > xtoxm

My post was saying, "I think Nimueh's town, and the scum on Elbirn was Brigitte".

Succinct explanations != no explanations.

[Succinct]

I actually don't know. Your scumteam actually played a pretty strong game to obscure that last scumbuddy, I'll say. Credit to your partner.

Alternatively, it's because I'm not scum and

actual

scum're taking advantage.

[Succinct]

For that matter, no, you don't get to ignore these, either:

Spoiler: Quotewall

NMSA
Succint
Elbirn

You seem to think I'm a double-busser.
I generally avoid bussing altogether.

Sure. Apart from his abysmally low postcount, post quality, and thereby remarkably poor contribution to the game, I also have not been able to find a single reason to townread him in a 150-pager. Looking at his ISO, it's scummily-barren, he isn't trying to gamesolve or have the conviction that town would.

You're scumreading playstyle. Look at my name. It's my approach; deliberately minimalistic. I'm also a late-D1 replacement. I average 1 post/day. My game solving's in all my posts; I mostly only quote pertinent content. (Almost)

Everything

holds relevance.

But, I observed his lack of emotion and/or conviction in those posts [compare to NMSA], hinting that it may be indicative of a distancing attempt on a scumpartner who was already under fire (and therefore also the prime candidate to escape the game).

You apparently missed a few posts pushing Flubber significantly.
Of 29 posts, I pushed him in 9+ of them.
The ones not pushing him, most're establishing/defending/explaining townreads, or pushing NMSA, or pushing Elbirn.
I never let up on Flubber; my push on NMSA's been the same since D2.

1. Flying under the radar, and 2. Lack of gamesolving.

You'll never find me active, least of all not now. (Knowing my main'd help know why I'm particularly inactive now.) My gamesolving's in establishing townreads more than establishing scumreads, but I've done both.

I'm aided by people engaging me, but them not doing so's out of my control. If people don't interact with what I post, then I don't have anything to follow through on.

You're making me miss Ank, because she's one of the few who

would

engage me.
Question my reasons for NMSA, question my reasons for Elbirn, question my townreads.

Enter has only been in the game for a fraction of its duration

Actually, this time you're mistaken.
Enter was in the game for 75 pages.
I've been in the game for 78 pages.
Page-wise, we've been around an equal amount.

Succinct is extraordinarily scummy and therefore we can infer that he is arguably a lot worse at hiding his alignment than Enter.

For those who know my identity:

in a replacement situation you should always aim to read the easier and more transparent slot, not the one which is better at scum.

By that metric, you'd be reading Enter, because

I

am the slot that's better at scum.

As for Elbirn I acknowledged that I am biased against his way of playing.

And yet the thought didn't occur to you you're biased against mine?

Succinct is only ever replying to people

Naturally, because

that's my playstyle

.
Especially as a replacement who didn't read content prior to replacing in.
All I

had

was replying to people to generate content.

Does nobody actually see the problem with being only reactive rather than proactive?

Naturally, because

there is none

.

and never putting forth his own pushes and arguments.

Just because arguments pushed are in walls doesn't mean they aren't there.

Has Succinct ever explained his Flubber scumread?

It's in

the very post you quoted

:

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

Ank was talking about Flubber.
Someone who's in the scum pool yet you don't remember why is usually scum; doubly so when said someone's a player like Flubber.
If anyone had

asked

me about this at the time, I'd happily have said as much.
Nobody did, but I can't control that, can I?

No explanation was ever given for Flubbernugget and Brigitte scumread.

The Brigitte read was also explained:

Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.

Not convinced on Nimueh, but skitter-town/Brigitte-scum, can see.

Context: skitter made this post after I replaced in:

the elbirn wagon was: brigitte, chara, xtoxm, nimueh
my gut says that there's prob scum in the elbirn voters, probably in this order of likeliness: nimueh >

brigitte

= chara > xtoxm

My post was saying, "I think Nimueh's town, and the scum on Elbirn was Brigitte".

Succinct explanations != no explanations.

And I'll requote this until you answer them.

[Succinct]

Why do you keep referring to your main when you're on an alt? Is your main public? If not, why use it as a crutch when you're caught scum?

I'm referring to my main when it's pertinent, and to myself otherwise.

There's things which change on alts, things which don't change on alts, and things which people might think don't change even if they do.

I address each appropriately.

My main's not public, but many in the game know it by deduction. (Not hard to figure out.)
I talk accordingly.

[Succinct]

For that matter, no, you don't get to ignore these, either:

Spoiler: Quotewall

NMSA
Succint
Elbirn

You seem to think I'm a double-busser.
I generally avoid bussing altogether.

Sure. Apart from his abysmally low postcount, post quality, and thereby remarkably poor contribution to the game, I also have not been able to find a single reason to townread him in a 150-pager. Looking at his ISO, it's scummily-barren, he isn't trying to gamesolve or have the conviction that town would.

You're scumreading playstyle. Look at my name. It's my approach; deliberately minimalistic. I'm also a late-D1 replacement. I average 1 post/day. My game solving's in all my posts; I mostly only quote pertinent content. (Almost)

Everything

holds relevance.

But, I observed his lack of emotion and/or conviction in those posts [compare to NMSA], hinting that it may be indicative of a distancing attempt on a scumpartner who was already under fire (and therefore also the prime candidate to escape the game).

You apparently missed a few posts pushing Flubber significantly.
Of 29 posts, I pushed him in 9+ of them.
The ones not pushing him, most're establishing/defending/explaining townreads, or pushing NMSA, or pushing Elbirn.
I never let up on Flubber; my push on NMSA's been the same since D2.

1. Flying under the radar, and 2. Lack of gamesolving.

You'll never find me active, least of all not now. (Knowing my main'd help know why I'm particularly inactive now.) My gamesolving's in establishing townreads more than establishing scumreads, but I've done both.

I'm aided by people engaging me, but them not doing so's out of my control. If people don't interact with what I post, then I don't have anything to follow through on.

You're making me miss Ank, because she's one of the few who

would

engage me.
Question my reasons for NMSA, question my reasons for Elbirn, question my townreads.

Enter has only been in the game for a fraction of its duration

Actually, this time you're mistaken.
Enter was in the game for 75 pages.
I've been in the game for 78 pages.
Page-wise, we've been around an equal amount.

Succinct is extraordinarily scummy and therefore we can infer that he is arguably a lot worse at hiding his alignment than Enter.

For those who know my identity:

in a replacement situation you should always aim to read the easier and more transparent slot, not the one which is better at scum.

By that metric, you'd be reading Enter, because

I

am the slot that's better at scum.

As for Elbirn I acknowledged that I am biased against his way of playing.

And yet the thought didn't occur to you you're biased against mine?

Succinct is only ever replying to people

Naturally, because

that's my playstyle

.
Especially as a replacement who didn't read content prior to replacing in.
All I

had

was replying to people to generate content.

Does nobody actually see the problem with being only reactive rather than proactive?

Naturally, because

there is none

.

and never putting forth his own pushes and arguments.

Just because arguments pushed are in walls doesn't mean they aren't there.

Has Succinct ever explained his Flubber scumread?

It's in

the very post you quoted

:

Like I remember he was in my scum pool but fucked if I know why anymore

Experience says odds're slot's scum.

Ank was talking about Flubber.
Someone who's in the scum pool yet you don't remember why is usually scum; doubly so when said someone's a player like Flubber.
If anyone had

asked

me about this at the time, I'd happily have said as much.
Nobody did, but I can't control that, can I?

No explanation was ever given for Flubbernugget and Brigitte scumread.

The Brigitte read was also explained:

Not much time to post, but skitter is a strong townread, and it should be easier for everyone else to see now why Nim and Brig are scum.

Not convinced on Nimueh, but skitter-town/Brigitte-scum, can see.

Context: skitter made this post after I replaced in:

the elbirn wagon was: brigitte, chara, xtoxm, nimueh
my gut says that there's prob scum in the elbirn voters, probably in this order of likeliness: nimueh >

brigitte

= chara > xtoxm

My post was saying, "I think Nimueh's town, and the scum on Elbirn was Brigitte".

Succinct explanations != no explanations.

And I'll requote this until you answer them.

Forgot to add something:

Succinct is only ever replying to people

Naturally, because

that's my playstyle

.
Especially as a replacement who didn't read content prior to replacing in.
All I

had

was replying to people to generate content.

For reference, I've three completed games; all as a replacement; in all, I'm bottom post-wise.

Replying's how I scumhunt.

This I also want addressed.

[Succinct]

VOTE: Succinct

Need I remind you: until Elbirn cast this vote, he was the lead wagon.
Prior to this point, he's shown zero scumread of me.

It's survivalism/opportunism at its finest.

[Succinct]

It's also noteworthy: Elbirn's the only player in this game to have played with me on this account in a past game.
He makes no reference to it at all, no mention of me, no engagement, not even a "succinct was wrong last time and is wrong yet again". Nothing, in spite of being the one player best positioned to have commentary on my play.

[Succinct]

[*]Your Flubber trajectory is fake.
[*]Your reads are fabricated.

Saying they're fake doesn't make them so.
I can explain everything I've posted.

[*]You are going after low-hanging fruit.

Something I'm adverse to as scum, but care little for as town, because low-hanging fruit can and do draw scum.

[*]You've been flying under the radar, deliberately avoiding drawing attention.

Alternatively: this is my playstyle. I've done nothing to fly under the radar. People calling me town because of Enter's their choice, not mine. It's actually annoyed me the whole game; I've wanted to be townread because of

my

contribution, not his. I can't force people to pay attention to me.

[*]Your predecessor has been guilty of all of the above.
[*]Your predecessor is guilty of shadethrowing town.

I can't answer for these and you know it.

[*]Your position on Flubber is the perfect position that scum would have loved being in.

I voted at first available opportunity. I don't often move votes, to a fault. Moving my vote's a big deal.

I think you've made a sizable number of mistakes in this game. That's not to say you've been playing poorly, in fact, I think you've played well, because town didn't manage to catch you. So it is just your poor luck that Tohru replaced in and managed to identify your sneaky plans almost immediately, and ruining your narratives and your strong control over the game.

Nice to see the line of people bragging they "caught" me only to be wrong grows by one more game. Why am I not surprised.

1. It's clear that even if the statement is true, it is clear you are unable to play as optimally as you would be able to on your main, because of the gimmick being a handicap/additional complexity. Maybe it makes you more transparent (This is not necessarily bad!). Or maybe it does impede both your town and scum games, I don't know!

My gimmick makes it harder to play town, but more rewarding; it has zero effect on my scumplay.

I myself understand the frustration when a perfectly smooth scumgame is ruined by an over-the-top late-game replacement which threatens to destroy the narratives that you have been working over the course of a whole month to build up. It really does suck that I am taking the win away from you.
I... think I need to think about this.

You've no intention to think; were you to, you'd realize the frustration's from the obvtown player I most trust to read me and work with me was replaced by the antithesis of that. Even if you didn't scumread me, I doubt you'd work with me.

@Succinct, do you not have a scumgame anywhere?

Of course not. I avoid replacing into scum slots deliberately. I'd get no challenge from them.

Anyway, No, I don’t consider every Flubber voter to be town. My point was that you’re reasoning wrt to self-preservation in this game vs. protecting the scumteam don’t apply in this game, because if even one scum fails to escape, it’s essentially game over.

My point's that the view "not everyone voting Flubber was town" and the view "scum protected their scumbuddy knowing they needed to escape" are mutually exclusive. If someone voted Flubber was scum, they were inherently not protecting their scumbuddy.

@succinct
did you like go back to check this post?

Actually, yes; after 4017, I went back to my first post, isoed you from that point, searched Flubber, and checked; I found 2171 immediately. For the reason you mentioned (you didn't mention Flubber), I deemed it not worth mentioning. (Anything you don't see me address falls in this category. Since I only quote about 1/20 posts, you can assume I find 19/20 not worth mentioning.)

like i shouldn't look askance at the fact that you haven't engaged with flubber (your biggest scumread!) because you haven't engaged with *anyone* because they haven't engaged with you? that's like shifting your responsibility for sorting people off of your shoulders and onto everyone else's

...So?
I don't see the problem with letting others do the work, as long as the work's getting done. It's more succinct to let others handle it than to hash it out myself, yes?

elbirn's still town

I still want a reminder why.

[Succinct]

okay i'll agree with that.
Enter's replace out and the leadup to it was really towny and i should just concentrate on that regardless of how i feel about Succinct.

Chara:

Did you read this?

considering this is Succinct's only scumread, i wonder why they didn't go harder on it,

I can't go harder than I do.
You expect me to bs reasons?
I made my points.
They held.
Nobody engaged those points.
No new points were raised; nothing changed existing points.
What more

could

I have done?

Honest question, because I genuinely could use the feedback from the answer.
What you saw

was

me trying.
If my trying wasn't good enough, tell me what needed to be better.

or consider

why

scum Flubber decides to try and live another day for seemingly no reason.

I was tired, I was exhausted, I was dejected. It wasn't worth the effort. I knew he wasn't getting lynched. I wasn't happy he wasn't getting lynched, but nothing I said or did would change it. I couldn't argue we should lynch him in spite of the claim, because from a theory standpoint we

should've

let him live, and I

knew

that theory.

How would you feel knowing the correct theoretical play's to let your scumread live, in spite of a bs claim?

Elbirn/Succinct/NMSA left
there

The fact Elbirn and NMSA are my scumreads should tell you which person's town.

[Succinct]

i think i know who both nim & tohru are and tbh im exhausted by it

You absolutely do, and I'm not surprised.

you, specifically, tohru ive had an issue with in the past, i think

Can vouch for. You're who I had in mind for 3994. (Don't remember if Tohru's actually on it, but I know you had issues with him previously at least.)

i posted a fucking mammoth readcase on elbirn earlier and 0 people have commented on it or had a reaction to it

It was a good case, but I had nothing to say for it beyond believing it was a good case. My bad. <3

[Succinct]

@succinct: very quickly, can you just link to a game that you think gives you reason to think i have negativity with tohru's main acct?

I know it happened, but I don't recall which game. Best guess without research.

[Succinct]

Succinct: who do you think Tohru is?

I thought RC.

Oh cool I'm the counterwagon

Nice try to rewrite history, but

I

am the counterwagon to

you

, not vice-versa:

Votecount 3.1

NotMySpamAccount (2):

Succinct 3373, Chara 3489

Nimueh (2):

Elbirn 3669, NotMySpamAccount 3834

Elbirn (2):

Nimueh 3755, tris 3789

Succinct (1):

Tohru 3872

screw it, this game is toxic, I don't even care anymore, VOTE: succinct to get out of this game

This is literally a scumclaim.

Who gets out of the game on a town lynch?

[Succinct]

Elbirn/tris/Succinct/NMSA are the only players i would consider lynching.

And as a reminder, all of them have voted me. (tris to her credit unvoted.)

his reaction to how ank was pushing him to vote one of {xtoxm/flubber} doesn't come from scum

Why not?

the frustration felt real

Because frustration can come from scum and be no less real.

Mafia is a team game.

Sure is! Why're you making it a dictatorship, then?

Nimueh, you are either

with us or against us.

"With us or against us" isn't a team mindset; it's the polar opposite.

We have ALREADY "figured out the game". Now the whole team is waiting for you to take your time to WALK to the finish line!

That you can't name a scumbuddy of mine proves otherwise.

also if succinct is town i kinda feel like there wouldn't be resistant to it given how hard tohru is pushing it

What

resistance.
I went from 0 votes to L-2 literally overnight.
L-1 at some points!

The only true resistance has been Nimueh. Even Reck, second-most-resistant, expressed willingness to hammer me.

You say there's resistance, but evidence suggests the opposite; there's an utter lack of it, which should be a red flag.

[Succinct]

Theres tons of resistance to succinct wagon (see: the elbirn counterwagon)

The Elbirn wagon predates the Succinct wagon.
Try again.

[Succinct]

Subject: Mini 2059: Scum Private Communication

Interesting setup. Noted.

Subject: Mini 2059: Scum Private Communication

How good are you at looking town?

I'd rate myself best of us three, but still atrocious overall.

I am a little concerned about your unexplained scum read on me.

If you're worried about associatives, don't be; until I saw you posting here, I thought our third buddy was tris.

Subject: Mini 2059: Scum Private Communication

Let me know if I'm pushing you too hard, Flubber.

Subject: Mini 2059: Scum Private Communication

I wouldn't be worried about voting me.
I'm not getting lynched any time soon. You can park your vote on me for as long as you want, given that.

I'm far more worried about

you

being lynched.

Subject: Mini 2059: Scum Private Communication

At this stage we have two strategies;
I escape, we kill skitter; you escape, we kill Tohru.

Skitter's more likely to vote you tomorrow than Tohru; Tohru won't stop pursuing me.

Contributions of a scum mastermind.

[Succinct]

(Yes, I thought Flubber was town/tris was scum.)