Newbie 1924 - Game Over

[Datisi]

Hey, sorry I'm late! Didn't expect to get into a game this fast. I'm ready for the exciting ball of electricity.

Also, VOTE: Vedith, for trying to put me under pressure. I see you.

[Datisi]

Does the mafia then start choking on thin air and drop dead? Otherwise it's not very useful.

[Datisi]

Literally my first game on this site. Off-site, I've been playing Town of Salem for about 2-3 years, if that counts.

[Datisi]

Literally my first game on this site. Off-site, I've been playing Town of Salem for about 2-3 years, if that counts.

What is your elo there?

It used to hover just around 1200, I was never an excellent player. Recently, I haven't even finished the 10 placement games, the game's become too fast-paced and frustrating for me to tell you the truth.

[Datisi]

I find Clarity's lack of opinion a bit.. Weird? After not much posting coming to the discussion with nothing said.

But in any case, VOTE: Saladman27 for not posting one post that's game related. I'd like to hear more from him.

[Datisi]

As for Voted, not finding their actions as definitely scummy, but not necessarily town either. (Would that be a non-tell?)

[Datisi]

As for Voted, not finding their actions as definitely scummy, but not necessarily town either. (Would that be a non-tell?)

Interesting...

I'm just saying, I could see either a Scum or a Townie acting like that

[Datisi]

Fair assessment, I'd like other slots to speak their opinion on voted.

Because of this. I figured "slots" referred to other players. If that's not it and I misunderstood it, my bad.

[Datisi]

Everyone used to start at 1200 elo, and then you would fall or rise depending on wins and losses. 2200 used to be very high, not sure as of now since I'm not completely up to date with current meta there.

[Datisi]

That was more towards voted. I can't say I don't think you're scummy though. What do you think about the game salad? Do you think scum are voting you at the moment? Who do you think is town? Was the text in your role pm red?

UNVOTE: RCEnigma

You ask too many questions to be an informed scum, so I'm making unvote you for now.

Can't say this gives off Town vibes. Salad, would you care to change my opinion?

[Datisi]

What's wincon?*

Is there a way how to edit posts?

Correct me if I'm wrong, editing is not allowed, right?

[Datisi]

My guess is that she believed you were trying to frame him and push a lynch rather than make him talk. The former is scummy.

[Datisi]

Can't help but notice you didn't include me in the first part of your message.

[Datisi]

I think RC is Town since he seems he's looking for info that Town needs.
Voted is fishy since they keep on avoiding questions by delaying it with more questions.

I mean, it definitely looks like you're trying to avoid questions too. Hopefully you'll post more once you catch up?

[Datisi]

Btw, @Clarity, what is your opinion on Salad, if I may ask? I'm kinda curious.

[Datisi]

I've already said I'll ignore it. However, if you yourself aren't scum then 2 of the other 8 slots are. A random vote to start the day is more likely to land on town than scum and you haven't done anything to slim those numbers down so to think that your Rand vote landed on scum is poor reasoning.

It also doesn't reinforce wether I'm scum or not scum, just thank you aren't bothered to figure out if you are voting scum or town.

I think in your case I'm giving more leeway for a couple different reasons - new player, both games played you rolled scum I believe? So you may not have a strong base on how to scumhunt or what looks scummy when you aren't playing an informed slot.

I'll use my Voted read as an example. In addition to the things I've mentioned there are a couple things going on with him such as the contrast between his initial calm reaction when his wagon peaked and the survivalist push he made on salad afterwards. So 1, it could be seen as a playstyle difference (goes along with my theory of Voted +coaching, possible SE).

His disinterest in wether scum was voting him or not is +scum, scum!him would already know if this is true or not so may not be bothered with soring out motivations or intentions.

His unvote on salad when Vedith posted intent to hammer could go either way I guess. No one has really come to his defense so normally I would like to think he's town being left out by scum to cook but his pressure flipped onto me when I pushed further so I can't really ignore that and call it town.

From ToS:
bad scums tend to vote (town) either as 1st/ 2nd vote or as last votes
good scums tent to put vote in the middle.

I really don't know how to classificate people who played 2 or 3 games in this server. This is not ToS. So the votes on me aren't helping me find scum nor suspect anyone. That's why the disinterest.

But I have a feeling that, when looking at votes, who voted first, second or last is not all there is to it. Was anyone too pushy or tried to speed up the lynch? Maybe someone joined the wagon without any good reasoning? Things like that could help you suspect someone

[Datisi]

I feel like hardly anybody's interacted with me so far, and it's making me lonely

Hey, I feel the same way! Let's interact!

So... With all the Salad/Voted/RCE votes going on, you never changed your vote. Are you thinking about changing it? What made you stick?

[Datisi]

Leaves Voted and Salad. Gonna be fun when it turns out they were both somehow Town.

[Datisi]

Leaves Voted and Salad. Gonna be fun when it turns out they were both somehow Town.

I'm not saying I think it's likely, I'm voting for Salad myself. Just saying it would be funny.

[Datisi]

Salad and Voted are both at 2 votes rn, if that's what you mean. We're all still begging Salad to post more.

[Datisi]

@Salad, I still think you're town, but I'd like to hear more about what you think of the wagon on you. Do you think it's fair that you could be lynched for lurking?

Oh hai! I think right now, I’m gonna VOTE: Voted. Anyways, still nothing to report and I’ll probably have even worse post ethic.

Either ignoring the question or not even reading it. At this point, I'm starting to think lynching Salad will be beneficial regardless of their alignment. Even if they're Town, they don't seem to be helping us move along.

[Datisi]

and 13 pages of content

Noob question, that's too little, right? How much does day 1 usually have?

[Datisi]

20-35ish
but the number of pages are less important than the interactions
that we can go back and see later

if salad flips town where do we go from there?

If both, me and Salad are town (what I think is truth), than datisi and thenavneet have a huge problem for pushing against Salad (day 1 - lynch Salad, day 2 - lynch me, that would be a really nice start for scum). With pushing I don't mean making him post more, but making him sus, lynched.

Here's the thing, you cannot make someone post more. You can give a chance, ask questions, but ultimately it's their decision, and other players will react to those decisions.

If you don't think Salad is scum, who do you suspect?

[Datisi]

20-35ish
but the number of pages are less important than the interactions
that we can go back and see later

if salad flips town where do we go from there?

If both, me and Salad are town (what I think is truth),

than datisi and thenavneet have a huge problem for pushing against Salad

(day 1 - lynch Salad, day 2 - lynch me, that would be a really nice start for scum). With pushing I don't mean making him post more, but making him sus, lynched.

I wanted to take that as "you two could be suspected as scum" and not "i suspect you two as scum", but alrighty then.

[Datisi]

Because you can't know if Salad is scum or not. Unless you do?

[Datisi]

Sigh. I have a feeling that if Salad were scum, he would be more agressive than he is now. He would defend himself more. With Salad failing as a substitutional lynch for me, I will have to find out sameone else.

So, VOTE: MKM, do you have same reads on sameone else than me or Salad?

Again, you can't

know

. Wasn't saying you can't suspect his alignment.

[Datisi]

Besides, if you're suspecting me and/or thenavneet, why vote for MKM?

[Datisi]

Okay, going through the recent posts, only now I realize how unskilled I am, and I've got no idea about the vague SE's posts.

Anyway, just putting it out there, I'm starting to see Voted less and less as Town. Obv I won't vote him right now (plus not yet convinced Salad is just a noob Town), but putting it out there that I'm standing behind the (probable) lynch as well.

[Datisi]

That was more towards voted. I can't say I don't think you're scummy though. What do you think about the game salad? Do you think scum are voting you at the moment? Who do you think is town? Was the text in your role pm red?

Ok, let’s start with these.
1. I think I’m gonna get lynched before day 2.
2. Yeah, to jump on the bandwagon to appear less scummy.
3. Most of the people who aren’t lynching me.
4. No.
Right now I’m just facing the consequences of not committing to the game early, seeming as scummish as Voted and Navneet.

You think Town are most of the people who aren't voting for you, but you don't think scum is voting you?

[Datisi]

Who ever hammers Voted gets a town read

Should we end the day with 3 days left?

[Datisi]

@Nav, yeah, I do see Voted as non-Town at this point. Not necessarily thinking of Salad/Voted team, more as a sorta both of them are scummy, let's lynch one of them and go from there.

I think the 8-hour deadline expired? Are we waiting for Nav to do more ISO analyses? I can hammer as well if nobody's got anything else to say before day end.

[Datisi]

I'm here, but there's not much to say I guess

[Datisi]

Is the start of the day 2 usually this slow, or is this such a boring game.

[Datisi]

Is the start of day 2 usually this slow, or is this such a boring game?

Ebwop. Rereading the message I wrote while still half asleep before sending it? Nah

[Datisi]

I'll reread later on and try to spot what SE's see.
For now
VOTE: Salad

[Datisi]

Also the voted being the prime Lynch regardless of alignment thing. Unless the team is exactly TTTT+Salad then the voted wagon was probably 1 on/1 off which puts 1 scum between datisi/navneet.

Obviously that's fmpov but I did push that idea selfishly to narrow down who I have to hunt in to secure a scumlynch day 2.

Can you explain this? I don't get why day 1 events point to the wagon being 1 on 1 off.

[Datisi]

Maybe SE's should start explaining what they see, this is becoming more and more confusing for me

[Datisi]

UNVOTE: Salad
No problem. I still find him scummy though :p

[Datisi]

VOTE: Salad
Since SE's have decided to be all mysterious, fine by me

[Datisi]

TTTT, are you gonna change your vote back?

[Datisi]

I've half-given up on figuring out what game SE's are playing. It set aside, I'd wanted to lynch Salad since Day 1

But yeah, do that maybe

[Datisi]

UNVOTE: Salad
No problem. I still find him scummy though :p

Okay, actually I got there a lot faster than I expected. Everything is pretty well laid out in the material that's been posted already.

I'm good with a salad vote. He's already claimed, he's left his reads list. Are we ready to hammer then?

Is it just me, or did this seem to imply that you've read through everything?

[Datisi]

@TTTT, I haven't got much conviction. Maybe I'd be of more help if i understood what you and RCE keep hushing between yourselves, but for what it's worth, RCE is convinced Voted wagon was 1 on 1 off, therefore me and Nav can't both be scum

[Datisi]

My current thoughts are Salad/CC as one possible scum team, or Nav and, by some process of elimination, MJL. (SE's still seem pretty Townie to me so far) Nav attacking Salad doesn't seem like SvS to me. I know the first scenario is in contradiction with the me/Nav one on/off, but eh, the best I got so far.

[Datisi]

@Datisi
maybe start with just telling us what you think of Nav's gameplay in general

Honestly Nav seemed Townie to me as well, his ISO posts did at least. I understand how him pressuring SE's can be seen as Scum, but since I'm also one of the people frustrated because I have no idea what's going on, I'm not sure I can hold that against him

[Datisi]

Here. Is twilight always this omnious or is it just me?

[Datisi]

Here. Is twilight always this ominous* or is it just me?

Spelling is hard

[Datisi]

At least 50%. Everybody would be at less, but it might be my indecisiveness and general newbiness speaking

[Datisi]

At least 50%. Everybody else* would be at less, but it might be my indecisiveness and general newbiness speaking

I need sleep

[Datisi]

No matter what you flip now, don't give up on the game. We're here to learn, the next one will be better.

[Datisi]

I'm not gonna hammer a newbtown who plays like how you'd expect a new player to play like. Feels shitty to have it happen to you.

why do you think this is newbtown and not newbscum?

VOTE: thenavneet

like what do you think of RCE pushing a Nav lynch as the counterwagon to Salad
but then jumping on that chance to lynch Salad
I even moved my vote to Nav

I think Nav is more likely scum. Both have scum equity but salad is going to be an extremely easy push for scum if he's town in a Mylo situation where it actually matters.

I'm confident I can make my town case tomorrow and TTTT's as well. In the event I go down I think TTTT can piece together the game with help. And the converse is true. As a matter of fact if salad flips green then I have the game solved.

This makes nav lockscum as far as I'm concerned

It's rather late here and I'm pretty tired, but I'll post a couple of my thoughts before I crash. Both of these posts make me very suspicious of CC - she never answered the first one, but she did post later in Day 2. Not reading or ignoring the question? Same for the vote, after TTTT posted not to vote hastly.

As for TTTT, very close to locktown.

Potential scum along CC? Tbh I don't know. MJL would make sense, but I can sorta see Nav and CC engaging in SvS. Also I've lost a fair amount of games in my past by falling victim to buddying, so I'll try to be on the lookout this game. More posts when I catch some sleep and reread parts of the game.

[Datisi]

Normally I wouldn't mind being the lynch but this is D3 MyLo I'm not going to lose this game from scumreads on me as flimsy as the ones made on me

I'd like everyone to tell me

with specific examples

why my play is "lockscum"

@Clarity
everyone is SRing you to some extent
please provide a full reads list now

Well, for one...

[Datisi]

who are you leaning as the team?

Clearly Clarity. No team yet. My slot was suspicious of her and it came out that they know each other very well off the forum. He may have seen something in her posts that is a tell for him.

Just to clarify, this question meant "who do you think is the scum team?"

[Datisi]

How is him claiming VT a scum-sign? I understand new players might not realize it, but since it was highly likely we were going to lynch him anyway, wouldn't a scum-sign be claiming a PR to get them to cc? Besides, at the time you thought RCE was scum, if he were scum alongside Salad wouldn't he instruct him to claim PR?

[Datisi]

Alright, here we go then. I'm the Jailkeeper.

[Datisi]

RCE night 1 (was undecided for a long time between him and Vedith, rip), you TTTT night 2

[Datisi]

Yeah, pretend I'm voting him rn

[Datisi]

Well, either mod sent the wrong role PMs or someone is lying
And I think one of those is much more likely than the other

[Datisi]

yeah
one of Nav and Datisi is scum
and one of Nav and MJL is scum
I mean it's possible the team is MJL/Datisi
but odds are it's Nav who's lying

Just so you know, TTTT, I'm not voting for anyone other than Naveet. We can take our time, but he's definitively outed himself from my POV. My vote can only go to him.

Pretty much same with me, he's confirmed scum fmpov. Though I am worried about what after that.

[Datisi]

two things give me pause:
1. MJL's slot softing cop day1
2. MJL not reading the flips prior writing catch-up posts

When did the soft happen?

[Datisi]

Me neither tbh

[Datisi]

Can't say I'm genuinely surprised at it being you. I wanted to believe that just this once a Town player legitimately thought I'm town and that it wasn't a buddying attempt. Guess not.

[Datisi]

I don't see why it matters who is which role here today? It's MyLo and if you lynch a Townie, they win.

it matters bc
1. there's a risk it backfires (with a Neapolitan claim) and then both scum are caught
2. there is still a possibility of a doc if you are cop so mislynch may not end it

How? Even if Doc saves, it's 2v2,and Mafia won't get lynched?

[Datisi]

still I'm standing by #1

Yeah no objections there

[Datisi]

How is A confirmed if Nav is scum?

[Datisi]

maybe not confirmed but highly likely
given it's the safest column to claim cop
if it was column B scum!Nav claims Tracker
could still be column C I guess but he claimed he was RB'd

Yeah, he claimed he was RB'd. Doesn't that go in the trash if he's scum?

[Datisi]

@MJL, I'm fairly certain I get the roles chart. I understand my and Nav's claims are incompatible, but I'm not actually voting him rn because I don't want him to self-hammer early

[Datisi]

One thing strikes me as suspicious here.

Addendum to previous post: Column A isn't guaranteed, if I'm reading this right, but it's the highest possibility rn.

Here, Clarity says that Column A is probable, but it's not yet certain. Alright.

Actually, I feel like the game's solved now.

- Datisi's 95% town because of this.
- Based on the above, Nav is scum.
- Nav's falseclaim implies Column A, and Datisi's CC implies Row 2. That means there's a doc.
- One of me, TTTT, or MJL is doc. The other two would be VT and scum.

Yeah, I got it.

Here, she goes in with the assumption that Column A is definitely what we're playing. Town!Clarity wouldn't know that, but Scum!Clarity would.

Actually...

Hypothetically, would scum!Nav claim to be RB'd to sow confusion about the setup? Would B2 or C2 be potential options?

Then she goes on to "correct" herself.

Also, can you please give your reads? Who do you think is second scum?

[Datisi]

I've got nothing else to add. Ready when yall are

[Datisi]

I suspected you were Town, but I wasn't 100%, so this was my thought process:
If TTTT is Town, there's a chance he'll get attacked. Jailing him stops that.
If TTTT is scum, he's less on the radar than his partner, whoever that might be, so it's more likely he'll be the one doing the kill.
And if there is a NK after all, the chance of TTTT being scum goes down by a lot.

[Datisi]

Yes, I eas planning on jailing Clarity, but if a RBer is present, not much use of that.

[Datisi]

I'll still do it obv

[Datisi]

I'm voting Nav if he doesn't get in here and start pushing a Datisi lynch
countdown:

(expired on 2019-04-19 18:00:00)

Also I'll hammer this

[Datisi]

Dammit MJL why'd you have to do that thing
where you didn't read the dead flips before writing your replacement catch-up posts???

Goddammit now you're giving

me

anxiety

[Datisi]

Tbh I wanna be the one who hammers
Have a sense I did

something

right this game

[Datisi]

And yes I did just discover how to do italics and am overusing them

[Datisi]

VOTE: Nav
Cheers

[Datisi]

is that game?

I guess so
I'm off to bed, sleep well guys, hopefully see ya tomorrow

[Datisi]

I though Datisi's "cheers" was a scumclaim
don't go to bed we need answers!

Luckily I'm a phone addict who can't sleep without checking everything on it again
It was more of a "gg town we got one". Nav will flip red, you'll see

[Datisi]

Woo! now we just need to not mess up tomorrow!

... Unless Naveet was lying about his power role in the first place, in which case he lost town the game. Then it will lesson learned.

You mean "unless Nav is a VT lying about being Cop for the lulz"? Because we pretty much established he's lying.

[Datisi]

is that game?

Jesus I misunderstood this message BAD
I'm sorry for scaring you lol

[Datisi]

Good morning everyone. Clarity's been jailed last night.

[Datisi]

If it somehow turns out she's Town, I'll jail MJL. And if I end up dying because it was actually TTTT, then well played lol

[Datisi]

VOTE: Clarity

[Datisi]

Kinda surprised that the Mafia RB claimed PR, that doesn't usually happen?

[Datisi]

Also, I gotta ask
TTTT, did you protect RCE night 2 by amy chance

[Datisi]

Oh hey, the gang's all here

[Datisi]

I should learn how to post gifs

[Datisi]

GG everyone, hope to play with you again sometime! It was a ton of fun.