Role Call I (Game Over)

[Dunnstral]

Hi - I've read enough of the setup to understand what's going on with roles here, but not enough of the game to have reads on anybody

[Dunnstral]

I should get the night 2 bulletproof, yes?

[Dunnstral]

Bulletproof should go to a scum read. Give Bingle tree stump if we all end up town reading him.

Why does Bulletproof go to a scumread though? I was thinking it would make sense on the day 5 innocent child

Tree stump counts as a second lynch, right..? We're effectively lynching the person

[Dunnstral]

"bad" roles:

Neighbor
Day 3 Post restricted
Treestump
Compulsive Quitter



Neighbor is only bad because everything else is better

Everything else seems good. night 2 bulletproof is a good role

[Dunnstral]

By the way, the night 3 compulsive role caller is immune to lynches on day 4

[Dunnstral]

Also why are you talking to me about the day 5 ic not dying because 'nero is volatile' or whatever, when you seem to realize that I replaced him?

[Dunnstral]

If I'm not getting bp I should probably get that night 3 compulsive role caller

[Dunnstral]

Yah, I remember RC and the Sunshine Band (RC + schadd + me)

Ended up just being The Sunshine Band (schadd + me) pretty quickly

We were town

Wasn't that due to a ban?

[Dunnstral]

Aren't you in the slot Rc was in?

[Dunnstral]

Dunn I initially didn’t realize you replaced Nero until doing my proposal.

OK

In that case, what is the reasoning for not having me as night 2 bp in that lost?

[Dunnstral]

So why does momo have the bulletproof in your proposal...?

[Dunnstral]

Weren't you saying bp should go to scummy people just a bit ago? Now you're arguing that I'm not town enough to receive it or something

And momo has no night action

[Dunnstral]

Why are you trying to appease people

And what happened to you saying that the bp should go to scummy people

And again, he has no night action which is the supposed reason to not give it to me

[Dunnstral]

So you thought it was a full bp but opened the day saying a scumread should have it?

[Dunnstral]

Again, I think I should have the role call role if I'm not getting bp

[Dunnstral]

I think there are good reasons for me having it.

We are deciding, on day 2, who to make lynchproof on day 4. That's kind of a concern, with my role I wouldn't be lynched day 4 anyway.

I think the role is important to keep from scum, and will be useful, but I don't think it will make me a big NK target

[Dunnstral]

Actually, I could live with NeroDunn getting an investigative. Since IC/Guaranteed flip eventually

But I'd just die immediately? Maybe live 1 night with the doctor role

[Dunnstral]

I'm saying if I get an investigative I die and there goes all of towns power

[Dunnstral]

I see it is day 2 and I may now care about this game again
~Maria

'cause I'm here

[Dunnstral]

why can't we bp cheecks check again?

Look at the mafia factional abilities again

Did somebody ask why we're trusting Gamma?? THIS is why! He is actually reading the bloody game and trying to solve it.

Do you think that the people who don't know about the rolestop are town or pretending?

[Dunnstral]

If chronomage is on an investigative or something, don't they get their result and can out it? It's a pro-town role

[Dunnstral]

I don't understand why we would want the king to purposely break a post restriction and not be able to propose, by the way, am I missing something?

[Dunnstral]

I’m still not quite sure why I’m being scum read outside of policy. Momo I can understand a wee bit but there are worst slots out there.

Iconeum felt like policy yesterday and still does today.

Who are the worse slots?

[Dunnstral]

Pops can you walk me through why giving me the pseudo doctor makes sense

[Dunnstral]

Why does the inventor get the bp and not the day 3 king by the way?

[Dunnstral]

The reality is that there are three slots in favor of my lynch that don’t have any legit reasons to be in favor it.

Cheeky, Creature, and HH.

What do you mean they don't have any legit reasons to be in favor of it? Why can't they just think you're scummy?

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: against
When asked why you scumread me you give me psychologist instead? You just don't have any plausible reads progression this game

It's not even the list >I< came up with. It's HH's. They're Timid though.

Why not propose something you agree with?

[Dunnstral]

Is there a reason creature isn't voting against this?

[Dunnstral]

My thoughts:

AP, pops, HH all seem towny to me
Lil uzi vert I feel like he backpedaled somewhere in there talking about BPs and I generally don't feel good about him -> would lynch or stump

Momo I don't like anything I've seen, and he hasn't really argued against being scum, just against "lurking as scum" -> would lynch, probably not stump

I think we should stump Luv and lynch Momo

I don't think it matters if we stump scum, we should be thinking about "what if they're town"

[Dunnstral]

I don't have a read on creature

Why would town be fine being treestumped?

[Dunnstral]

Did you see the argument for leaving LUV on the basis that CT might resolve him?

No

[Dunnstral]

wig

[Dunnstral]

Yeah that's still my stance on LUV. I've seen a couple posts that seem like townLUV and a couple posts that seem like scumLUV this game but I really want to break this game with mechanics even if the scum are outplaying us and one of the ways to do that is to get 2 reads out of the Friendly Neighbor instead of 1.

OK but does town Cheeky = Scum Lil uzi vert ?

[Dunnstral]

Macho (Passive): Protective roles will fail when used on you.

Wiki entry for rolestopper:

Role type:
Protective
Manipulative

[Dunnstral]

That's not the mafiascum normal definition of macho by the way

"Macho is a role modifier that prevents players from being protected from kills in any way. "

That's the normal definition, with the way his macho is worded it implies:
Jailkeeper's can't roleblock him
Rolestopped does nothing on him, even to stop abilities that aren't harmful, like a friendly neighbor

[Dunnstral]

Normal version of Macho interacts with only Doctor and Bodyguard.

Spoiler: Off topic rant

As a rules lawyer I disagree and say it technically interacts with jailkeeper and the like as well because it does not explicitly say that it does not. That is, nowhere in the normal guidelines does it say that it

only

negates the effect from doctor and bodyguard, which is the key word that is missing where that would be true.

By default, the role works for a jailkeeper that is protecting a target, and nothing about the normal guidelines changes that - the role as a whole is considered normal, so... just saying that it negates doctor and bodyguard does not mean that it suddenly stops working for jailkeeper, it reads to me as more of a clarification for newbie mods, and a dangerous one.

There's no doubt that what it says is misleading. There is, also, no doubt in what it says. In my mind, the only argument for jailkeeper not affecting a macho role in a normal game is intent - that is, that it wasn't meant to affect jailkeeper.

For the record, this extends to other roles like babysitter, hider if you're a macho hider for some reason.

Actually, the role is even more confusing than that. "Macho is a role modifier that prevents players from being protected from kills in any way." - what if you roleblock the person performing the kill, does that not count? What if you're a macho commuter?

I don't know, maybe I'm wrong. I'm sure people running normal games run it the "right" way - As for me, I'd prefer to run it exactly as the guidelines say it should it be run... which is "Macho is a role modifier that prevents players from being protected from kills in any way. " combined with "It negates the effects of a Doctor or Bodyguard protecting it" - nothing more, nothing less.

[Dunnstral]

Do you realize that Cheeky was given the friendly neighbor invention?

Also, for all 3, why?

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: Against

That proposal is close to what I'd want

[Dunnstral]

Isn't it 7 votes to fail the proposal?

[Dunnstral]

nevermind, I get it, with 6 people there cna't be a majority on for, I read that

[Dunnstral]

Pops how does your town play differ from your scum play btw

[Dunnstral]

Sure, bring up Bingle's one loss. :P

when you replaced in the game was pretty much over going into the night phase

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: For

Only thing that gives me pause is that Gamma is the chronomage and I don't know why but that's not a huge deal and there's a lot of self voting going on here for some reason and yes I think we can do this

[Dunnstral]

CFJ I think this setup is really cool

[Dunnstral]

We should have lynched LUV yesterday

Instead we got caught up in some false dichotamy between him and CheekyTeeky that never really got explained

[Dunnstral]

I think one of pops/luv is scum

Pops isn't scum

[Dunnstral]

What did oversoul do?

[Dunnstral]

If people listened to me like ever this game would have gone better.

...?

You made us not lynch LUV

[Dunnstral]

HH is scum

Oh Dunnstral claimed LUV as scum during d3.

I guess he was screwing with me?

Actually I was still trying to pretend to be town just in case

[Dunnstral]

I liked the concept of this setup