Micro 891 - Death List (Game Over)

[Hectic]

One	Two	The	For	Fiv	Six	Svn	Eht	Nin	Ten
A	X	O	L	O	T	L	V	@	I
W	I	N	D	Y	R	I	I	T	C
I	¥	A	O	£	U	A	G	O	O
T	R	A	C	K	E	R	P	F	N
U	¤	Y	T	I	V	A	C	L	S
M	A	Y	O	L	N	T	?	I	N
O	V	E	R	T	O	O	¶	N	A
U	D	R	A	W	O	W	R	G	G
R	U	I	N	E	D	N	O	E	E
W	R	O	N	G	ß	Y	E	S	V

[Hectic]

Salutations, all. Don't worry, for I have arrived.
Now I know I have quite the reputation to uphold here, so I won't wait around to kick things off.
To start off with, I will claim

X-Shot Day Vigilante.

Of the towny variety of course. I intend to use a shot today, so please keep this in mind.

You know, people always ask me, "Hectic, how

do

you manage to win every single game you frequent? Despite being in 10 simultaneous games? How

are

you so good?"
And I always tell them the same thing.
Hard work, commitment, undying motivation, and analysing every. single. little. detail.
I hope I can teach you all many things during the course of this game.
And one day, I hope each and every one of you will be as good of a player as I currently am.

During the day, instead of voting to lynch, each players can vote either:

• Reverse the list (1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 -> 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1)
  
  
• Cut the list in half and reorder (Odd number will be cut in bigger/smaller) (1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 -> 5 6 7 8 9 1 2 3 4)
  [HALF]
  
  
• Paired Shuffle (1<->2, 3<->4, etc)
  [PAIR]
  
  
• Layered Shuffle (1<->9, 2<->8, 3<->7, etc)
  [LAYER]
  
  
• Undo the previous action
  [UNDO]
  
  
• Skip Day
  [SKIP]

My understanding of the commands are currently a little rough around the edges. So I have some questions if that's alright, good moderator:

1) You say

[HALF]

splits the list bigger/smaller for odd numbers, but it seems to be split smaller/bigger in your example, am I misunderstanding?
2) In the case of an odd list, does

[PAIR]

ignore the middle number?
3) In the case of an odd list, does

[LAYER]

ignore the middle number?

[Hectic]

I perfectly happy for hectics to die. Hectic on the other hand I'm not so sure about.

Agreed.
Hectics has been impersonating me for far too long now. It's time we delivered him some justice.
Only fitting if I'm the one to do it.

VOTE: Undo

This will return me to the micro queue. Then I can join Baezu's game.

Don't do it. Hectics is likely to sub in and sabotage the game's integrity.

I have a really really tiny town read on Dunn and Hectics.

VOTE: HALF

You believe scum are less likely to put themselves at the top of the list?

[Hectic]

VOTE: SKIP

Some reasoning would be appreciated.

1) You say [HALF] splits the list bigger/smaller for odd numbers, but it seems to be split smaller/bigger in your example, am I misunderstanding?
2) In the case of an odd list, does [PAIR] ignore the middle number?
3) In the case of an odd list, does [LAYER] ignore the middle number?

1) I could've sworn I fixed it but it wasn't. Fixed.
2, 3) Yes.

Much appreciated.

[Hectic]

VOTE: SKIP

Some reasoning would be appreciated.

Pretty sure 12 is pretty sketchy because this site does not allow cryptography/secret messages in their site rules. And 13 feels LAMIST especially with the fake claim. You do realize how stacked this lobby is right?

Isn't all breadcrumbing a form of secret messages?
Why does me potentially breaking a site rule make me scummy?
It's not a fakeclaim.
I'm relieved to hear the lobby is stacked, I do like a good challenge.

[Hectic]

Hectics = 999^999^999
Dunnstral = 1231997
MariaR - 27
Elements - 12
Dongempire - 9
popsofctown - 6
Azuresky - 4
Nymph - 3
Locke113 - 1

It's possible to lynch anyone here with some combination of commands.
The same goes for D2, regardless of whether we have 7 or 8 people. And it gets even easier beyond that.
I'm currently struggling to understand what use the mafia has with their one shuffle.

[Hectic]

Hectics = 999^999^999
Dunnstral = 1231997
MariaR - 27
Elements - 12
Dongempire - 9
popsofctown - 6
Azuresky - 4
Nymph - 3
Locke113 - 1

It's possible to lynch anyone here with some combination of commands.
The same goes for D2, regardless of whether we have 7 or 8 people. And it gets even easier beyond that.
I'm currently struggling to understand what use the mafia has with their one shuffle.

Pretty sure I'm unlynchable today, if I understand the rules correctly.

I think the mafia get to shuffle repeatedly if they choose the same method over and over. It says "only one method", not only one shuffle. So they have an imperfectly aimed NK. If you manage to position the list so that both mafia players would be at the top of the list with "no action" and "reuse the action that got locked in night 1", you force mafia to NK themselves.

Ah, I missed the part about the list determining the nightkill too. That changes everything.
Think I fully understand the setup now, thanks.
You're lynchable today with a simple

[HALF].

[Hectic]

Isn't all breadcrumbing a form of secret messages?
Why does me potentially breaking a site rule make me scummy?
It's not a fakeclaim.
I'm relieved to hear the lobby is stacked, I do like a good challenge.

I think you appear scummy because of your LAMIST post. Basically if you encode anything in BBcode as a secret message, I'm pretty sure that's red flags. Did you actually read the setup?

I've checked with the mod and it's fine. I did infact read the setup.

To address your LAMIST point:
When people say to me: "Would you rather be thought of as ObvTown or a Scum God?" My answer's always the same, to me, they're not mutually exclusive.

[Hectic]

I did not go into this game expecting to sort Hectic by page 2, for sure

Recently, individuals have been sorting me as town

far

too early in games.
It'll be page 2, we're still the depths of RVS when Elizabeth pops up and says: "Hectic is obvtown btw. Gonna treat him as an Innocent Child from here."
Elizabeth, though I appreciate your support, it does take some of the fun out of the game for me, it causes things to be a lot more dull.
I want a challenge, I want to prove my towniness just like the rest of you.
Therefore, I will intentionally avoid all townspewing this game. Thank you for understanding.

Out of interest, what is your read on me so far?

[Hectic]

to lynch:

Hectic > SKIP
Dunnstral > PAIR
MariaR > LAYER, HALF, PAIR / PAIR, LAYER, HALF / HALF, PAIR, HALF
Elements > LAYER, HALF
Dongempire > HALF, LAYER
popsofctown > HALF
Azuresky > PAIR, HALF
Nymph > PAIR, LAYER
Locke113 > LAYER

after that Maria one
realised everyone can easily be lynched
more important about who the second person is
because only 3 different people possible for Maria for example
so just gave one example from Maria onwards

there you go
that's why they call me Hec "The GOAT" Tic
thank me later
actually thank me now

[Hectic]

huh
my Astrophysics PHD made me realise something
LAYER and REVERSE are equivalent
in any situation
suggest we use only one of them
less confusion that way
i vote for LAYER

[Hectic]

Why "kid"? I get the feeling it's an experienced alt. And no, I'm not hinting I know the main, I figure that sort of thing out.

Kid is just a slang term I use. You humans have slang terms don't ya? Alt or not that's not the issue here? Why don't you tell me what you think of Nymph eh pops? You really don't see what I'm talking about right now?

who you roleplaying?
would let me immerse myself better

[Hectic]

To be fair the only person that can die right now is hectic. But your point is noted.

#33 seems NAI imo. I also am not sure of what to do right now myself, but SKIP should be seen as Anti-town unless you believe Hectic is scum.

P-Edit: Oh boy, I need Elements in here, I need him to help me break this game

basically RVS there
why not vote something random?
how is this different?

[Hectic]

I'd rather not have my main outed.

VOTE: Layer

I'll entertain this. I feel like MariaR has some weird interaction with Hectic.

@MariaR: What do you think about Hectic?

I see your point. Hectic was kind of put up a topic at the top of the queue, in a way.

Asking for details instead of opinions seems like they're up to a scheme, and I'm afraid of schemes.

VOTE: Layer

Locke hasn't posted yet
why vote him?

[Hectic]

P-Edit: Oh boy, I need Elements in here, I need him to help me break this game

What's your history with Elements? Don't tell me you need them to get your own footing in the game. That'd be pretty bland.

I'll entertain this. I feel like MariaR has some weird interaction with Hectic.

@MariaR: What do you think about Hectic?

Uh, are you alright? I don't have a single interaction with Hectic. So I don't know what you're talking about. Humans, you're so strange I swear.

What do I think about the guy? He's posted a bunch of nonsense that I don't care to read. His questions aren't interesting. I'm waiting but he's on my bad side. Well, more than normal.

Pedit: Thanks for joining my vote. Keep it up

we got one of these ones eh?
you're lucky you're not in my prime years of 2008-2012
would rage and deathtunnel you
but i have something that my 2010 self didn't
patience
apathy
wisdom
so i will disregard this
for now

[Hectic]

Asking for details instead of opinions seems like they're up to a scheme, and I'm afraid of schemes.

Can you explain this?

Just a quote could be used to push him, or not push him. Asking me for a quote and opinion, like "is the nonsense readable, or do you just read the other stuff" gives you tougher options, you either have to fight my opinion, or drop the topic. The latter helps you read me better; I'm going to townread players that seem interested in reading me.

I'd rather not have my main outed.

VOTE: Layer

I'll entertain this. I feel like MariaR has some weird interaction with Hectic.

@MariaR: What do you think about Hectic?

I see your point. Hectic was kind of put up a topic at the top of the queue, in a way.

Asking for details instead of opinions seems like they're up to a scheme, and I'm afraid of schemes.

VOTE: Layer

wait
you talking about Maria here?

will catchup later btw

[Hectic]

sorry everyone
will get to this game tomorrow
will solve it for you because you're probably struggling
but maybe will give you some time first to let you have some fun

i see that attempt to buddy me Locke
and consider it done
you're locktown
anyone counterclaiming Elizabeth?

[Hectic]

Why would I respond to nonsense? Seems kinda useless and just clogs of the thread. So, if the interaction is so strange to you what kinda impression does it give you? 'Strange' can mean many things. Why don't you clear that up.

Have you played with Hectic before? I've never played with him which is why I asked for clarification. I thought the cryptography post and the fake claim is something I've never seen on this site before at the same time. I still remember someone from a Newbie game recently claimed VT from a game I was reading and ended up as scum that got lynched D2 which is what came into my mind.

have something to confess
didn't realise it was an open setup
so may have crumbed vanilla townie in my first post...
that game you're talking about is where i got the idea from

Can you post examples for me?

@Nymph
This would be what I was referring to.

I've never been asked for something like this before, actually, I'm not positive how I should be taking it. Only ever been asked for entire game links.

Wait really? I find questions like that to be NAI. I've seen questions about getting links to past games be very common.

from my 2 decades of experience - have found that people asking for specifics like that are generally more town
shows desire to solve and work things out

Ok, I'm going to leave a big post here for awhile as I plan on being busy tomorrow:

Give me Maria for town at this point, I'm usually a sucker for posts like #11, as most of the time this is a genuine statement.

Quickly looking at Hectics #12, I found the words,

Wind Tracker May Ruined Wrong Byes

take that as you will, its probably nothing, as there are no PRs in this game.

Hectic #15 ("You Believe Scum are Less Likely to put themselves at the top of the list") - Hectic could be scum for this. The WIFOM play is ballsy and something I can respect. Nymph v Hectic looks to be TvS if you ask me.

Pops is probably town, but I do have a tiny tiny tiny reason to believe she is scum, but I do not feel like outing my reason as it is reaching (and somewhat a gut feeling) and I tr pops enough for now to ignore it.


In Summary, I personally would like to think as of right now: Hectic/Nymph and someone who hasn't talked much yet (Dong/Elements/Dunn/Locke). I would vote SKIP right now, but I want to hear from those 4 before I make any more assumptions. I think this should provide yall some talking points to work with.

Other Notes:

I have a really really tiny town read on Dunn and Hectics.

VOTE: HALF

Dunn hasn't posted yet up to that post. Fake reads?

so youre not buying in to wifom?

I can see hectic doing it, never played with dunn, have you? Think dunn would wifom?

did it because it'd be funny
and that it'd generate discussion
didn't think it would impact lynching since 3 shuffles is enough for anything
like you could do 3 shuffles today and still have me at the top
or do a shuffle and then undo
you're reading too much into this
like a librarian on heroin

Hectic LAMIST is ironic, isnt it? Given that i dont see why you're scumreading him so much over it.
If its unironic, well, im out of words in that case. But doubt that

how dare you
you have a lot to learn student

[Hectic]

I had a theory that I've been thinking about how to possibly use VCA and associate players with other players based off the 3rd shuffle. If a player that is safe picks one option over another, then see who would die in that other option. That person has a "buddying" relationship with that player if the player or other person is scum.

Do I tryhard in this game and get a notebook and draw the permutations and statistical possibilities for each shuffle? Do I hate myself enough to do this?

don't think it's necessary yet
more important to see tomorrow

The first 3 pages are rolepaying and setup spec, damn.
I guess it befalls me to restart the rvs so we can actually get started.
VOTE: Guyinfreezer because i sure as hell wouldnt mind a more straightforward lynching system.

bit hypocritical?

I intend to use a shot today

Shoot me! I dare you!

Quickly looking at Hectics #12, I found the words,

Wind Tracker May Ruined Wrong Byes

take that as you will, its probably nothing, as there are no PRs in this game.

There are also the words; Axolotl, Wit, Low, Liar, Rat, Doctor, Draw, Ran, Town/y, Yes, Over, Ago, Goo, I/con/s, May, Tumour, One. There are probably a lot more but I got bored of looking and couldn't be bothered to find a words search solver.

Interesting that there's a word that actively relates to me there but I can't see one as obvious for anyone else. Unless "Low" and "Wit" is relating to Hectic himself.
Is there a reason for this Hectic?

there's one for pops too actually
there is a reason for that grid
was supposed to be my crumb
should i reveal it now?

Now that we know how to lynch anyone here, can we please start playing this normally instead of sprinkling crumbs like a pigeon and setup speccing?

you say this but i don't see much attempts at solving from you

[Hectic]

In regards to weather the mafia would put themselves at the top or bottom of the list - I think there's so much wifom there it's pointless speculating especially given we can get anyone to the top of the list.

So there is one thing I'd like to discuss about this.

Number theory.

So back when I was teaching this subject at MIT - this was back in 2007 - I conducted a small experiment.

I told one group of students to flip a coin 100 times, and note down the resulting sequence of Heads and Tails flips.
I told a second group of students to write down what they

thought

a 100 long sequence of random coin flips would look like.

I walked out of the room and allowed each group to write down their sequences. They wrote them down on individual pieces of paper.
When I returned, they handed me the two sequences, I did not know which sequence corresponded to which group.
Yet, it took me all of 3 seconds to determine which sequence was the fabricated one.

Why?

Because humans don't understand how true randomness

really

works.
The fabricated list's longest run of consecutive Head/Tail flips was 4. 4 Head flips in a row.
The

real list

had a run of

7

Tail flips in a row.
That's all it took for me to determine the true sequence.

The students fabricating the list thought it'd be ridiculous to have any more than 4 Heads in a row, I'd spot it's fake otherwise, right?
Wrong.
True randomness will result in much longer sequences of Heads/Tails.
In addition, the fabricated list just had smaller consecutive runs in general, the real one didn't.

So now that you're up to date with number theory, how do we apply it to this game?
Well.
The two mafia are very unlikely to pick two numbers very close together, and are extremely unlikely to pick the same number.
They avoid this since they believe their similar numbers could be used to link them together, that it wouldn't look natural if they were so close.
But in reality? Randomness doesn't give a damn about that.
So we can use this logic to not completely discount but make some scum teams far less likely.

Me and Dunn? Extremely unlikely. However, this doesn't apply here since I'm a master of Number Theory.
Azure and Nymph? Very unlikely.
Locke and Nymph? Relatively unlikely.
Same goes for pops with Azure.
And for Elements and Dongempire, and Dongempire and pops since the difference is proportionally smaller at those numbers.

Feel free to ask any questions. My students always had plenty after my regular lectures.

[Hectic]

Hectic has certainly played a lot of mafia and presumably he's probably good

probably good?
don't make me smite you

[Hectic]

I believe Hectic is scum.

The notion for hectic is that theres a pretty good chance hectic believes there will be atleast one shuffle, which allows him to gambit with a huge number for townpoints because “town wouldnt do that,” hectics number ENSURES hes the top, which is why I find this a gambit for townpoints.

He wants to be the top of the list, then I say we grant him his wish.

don't like Azure so far
basing WAY too much on my high number
it means very little
and more than one shuffle can still end with me at top

this the only reason you're scumreading me?

[Hectic]

liking Elements' stance on doing at least one shuffle just so we can gets reads from it later
even if it means we undo to still lynch me
have some townie brownies

[Hectic]

Should probably get 5 votes agree on all 3 shuffles before executing any of them to minmax this the best.

Straight skip is strictly better than something like Pair, Undo, Skip, because scum then get to choose between doing Undo and locking in undo for the rest of the game, or doing pair and locking in pair for the rest of the game, for the same effect, where with straight skip the scum must choose Pair.
I think we would possibly not even find out which one they did, that could make ending on an undo bad in general?

this also works though
though Elements idea is good
if we commit to a shuffle or two
then it may become impossible to lynch someone who does something scummy towards the end of the day
so actually - think we should do this instead

[Hectic]

Spoiler:

Spoiler: post

sorry everyone
will get to this game tomorrow
will solve it for you because you're probably struggling
but maybe will give you some time first to let you have some fun

i see that attempt to buddy me Locke
and consider it done
you're locktown
anyone counterclaiming Elizabeth?

I day-rolecopped Locke and got the result "Elizabeth", which means my initial read on you of being Elizabeth must be wrong (I didn't burn a shot confirming that hunch, I have to be careful as an X-shot). It's pretty clear now why Locke has you townlocked. I'll spoiler this, both to make dongempire happy, and to give us a better chance of someone showing up and scumclaiming by claiming Elizabeth.

Spoiler:

it's okay
since you spoilered it - i think only Dongempire and i will open the spoiler to look
probably too much hassle for everyone else

have someone else pinned down as Elizabeth actually
MariaR
yeah surprising i know
but think she's intentionally nullscumreading me to keep me alive in the night
well played MariaR well played

[Hectic]

I like "Skip" in that Nymph and Azuresky become unkillable and I think those slots are town, and the mafia lose the undo option. But I'm not really scumreading Hectic and I'm one of those players that is pickier than "nullread" for the day one lynch.

pedit: oooooh a new game now I gotta find a sequence that makes Elements unkillable too
I'm not actually townreading to where I care
but games

elaborate on your Azure townread please
agree with Nymph and Elements so far

[Hectic]

I'm still foggy on your reasoning for why at least one shuffle method should be used. A couple posts back you kind of hinted at it fostering discussion a la RVS votes, is that a rep or a misrep?

I think we're throwing 3-4 1-shot town bodyguard effects in the trash if we use the options one at a time instead of leashing, I'm not sure I can swallow that pill. UNVOTE: if I haven't yet, btw.

yeah
let's determine most scummiest/towniest players
than shuffle at the end to get scummiest at top and make towniest bulletproof

[Hectic]

Elements, baby. I need your advice.

What is your read on Hectic? What alignment do you see Hectic giving that number? Is Hectic a fan of WIFOM Gambits as either alignment?

And if you scumread him, are you interesting in skipping now or shuffling?

atm I'd say I'm slightly scum reading him. Mostly just gut here but his persona doesn't feel very obvious atm. I think we should do at least one rearranging of the list even if we then undo it.

what do you mean by this?
persona not obvious is a bad thing?
elaborate

[Hectic]

MariaR can also be given a townie brownie
agree with 168 and 169

will find her if she's scum later
these rp types always crumble later

[Hectic]

Might go look into Pops posts, maybe not.

@Maria

R

- I come from the Matsina school of being town, where you base reads off tiny gut feeling, then work to make it more concrete. Im a shitty townplayer so I work based on her style. To answer your question, I usually find those statements to be pretty truthful. The kind that are subtle and not obnoxious “IM TOWN BITCHES” (Hectic’s post where he claims dayvig is an example of bad posting).

I mean, if you are telling me that your #11 is a lie, we can lynch you if you like.

@All: Im motioning for a skip to end the day, lynch hectic, and get scum to move dunn or kill him since I dont have a read on him. Im not looking to see who is immune in the scenario because I dont want to have a stroke.

to address your dayvig point
didn't realise the game was all vanilla
hence why was surprised people immediately disregarded it
mod actually reminded me when i asked him if my grid was breaking the rules

[Hectic]

OH YOU CAN DO MORE THAN 1 SHUFFLE PER DAY

am townreading pops for this
scum would be talking about shuffles in their PT
think this revelation is genuine

[Hectic]

@Locke:
PAIR and LAYER leave out the middle number for odd-length lists.

For example, PAIR on a 5-length list:

Jimbo	Susie
Susie	Jimbo
Locke	Locke
Steve	Elizabeth
Elizabeth	Steve

[Hectic]

Hectic scumslipped boys.

He DID NOT GET a town PM.

Ill leave you in suspense until I get back from work. Maybe yall can find it.

what?
the if you're mafia real PM after this part?
how does it indicate no PRs?

[Hectic]

oh i see
just being called Town like that does suggest no PRs
you got me Azure
you're like the king
and i'm just a bishop
no not even that
just a pawn
but little do you know
that i'm getting to the other side soon
and will be a queen

[Hectic]

eh don't really know what to think of Dunn and Locke
will throw them into limbo pile for now

will invite pops Elements Nymph into my FoS (Frontier of Serenity)

meanwhile Azure and Dong are banished to my FoS (Field of Suspects)

[Hectic]

lul but the mafia get example town PMs sent to them
hence the if you're mafia real PM sent later part (paraphrasing)
so point is moot
unlucky

though her confusion about this does make her more townie
the fact she's forgotten about that section of the PM makes her far less likely to be mafia

hmmm
might have to kick her out of my FoS

[Hectic]

10

[Hectic]

5

(i believe this is to activate Elements' infinite bulletproof)

[Hectic]

lul but the mafia get example town PMs sent to them
hence the if you're mafia real PM sent later part (paraphrasing)
so point is moot
unlucky

though her confusion about this does make her more townie
the fact she's forgotten about that section of the PM makes her far less likely to be mafia

hmmm
might have to kick her out of my FoS

What makes you so quick to believe shes geuninely confused?

weird gambit for scum to fake confusion at something that can be so easily discredited
unless she's doing it to get town points for acting confused
leaning towards the former though
seems genuine
especially with the whole spotting it but not expanding until she gets home from work thing

[Hectic]

lul but the mafia get example town PMs sent to them
hence the if you're mafia real PM sent later part (paraphrasing)
so point is moot
unlucky

I think you forgot about that yourself. I think you forgot about the fake town pm since you got another one afterwards.

You didnt know this was vanilla. You fakeclaimed dayvig, which I assumed was a joke, but you said you were shocked to see people ignore it. You thought there was prs for town, which can exists in games with 2 mafia (goons).

You are scum, you are gambiting for the top spot, you forgot the setup, hence why you were setting up crumbs for later to pile on towncred with the fact you wanted the top spot, because you know that people wont immediately skip. You would be safe for a bit, its a smart plan.

Problem is, its a plan I would do myself as scum, so I can see the motivation for this as a scumplay.

huh
this tunnelling is weird
can barely see you in the dark in there
might have to confiscate your pickaxes
why is scum more likely to forget about the game being all vanilla?
both factions get the same town PM
and you think that kind of thing wouldn't come up in the scum PT?
about setup spec regarding the game being all vanilla?
really?

would go for the top spot regardless of alignment
that's NAI

[Hectic]

I cant edit this, so go along with me:

Bottom of #15: Feigning innocence.

Top of #18: I do see Hectic getting defensive from this, cause again, it should be common sense to everyone that town will shuffle once, right? How boring would it be to SKIP right away? Right Hectic? Do I have it right?

lul
was asking about a naked vote because i was defensive?
come on Azure
i'll confiscate your shovel as well if you're not careful
you have a lot to learn

disagreed with the notion that scum wouldn't pick a high number
hence why was interested to hear Nymph's thoughts on it

[Hectic]

lul but the mafia get example town PMs sent to them

Do they?

check your role PM again

[Hectic]

Why would I respond to nonsense? Seems kinda useless and just clogs of the thread. So, if the interaction is so strange to you what kinda impression does it give you? 'Strange' can mean many things. Why don't you clear that up.

Have you played with Hectic before? I've never played with him which is why I asked for clarification. I thought the cryptography post and the fake claim is something I've never seen on this site before at the same time. I still remember someone from a Newbie game recently claimed VT from a game I was reading and ended up as scum that got lynched D2 which is what came into my mind.

have something to confess
didn't realise it was an open setup
so may have crumbed vanilla townie in my first post...
that game you're talking about is where i got the idea from

Can you post examples for me?

@Nymph
This would be what I was referring to.

I've never been asked for something like this before, actually, I'm not positive how I should be taking it. Only ever been asked for entire game links.

Wait really? I find questions like that to be NAI. I've seen questions about getting links to past games be very common.

from my 2 decades of experience - have found that people asking for specifics like that are generally more town
shows desire to solve and work things out

Ok, I'm going to leave a big post here for awhile as I plan on being busy tomorrow:

Give me Maria for town at this point, I'm usually a sucker for posts like #11, as most of the time this is a genuine statement.

Quickly looking at Hectics #12, I found the words,

Wind Tracker May Ruined Wrong Byes

take that as you will, its probably nothing, as there are no PRs in this game.

Hectic #15 ("You Believe Scum are Less Likely to put themselves at the top of the list") - Hectic could be scum for this. The WIFOM play is ballsy and something I can respect. Nymph v Hectic looks to be TvS if you ask me.

Pops is probably town, but I do have a tiny tiny tiny reason to believe she is scum, but I do not feel like outing my reason as it is reaching (and somewhat a gut feeling) and I tr pops enough for now to ignore it.


In Summary, I personally would like to think as of right now: Hectic/Nymph and someone who hasn't talked much yet (Dong/Elements/Dunn/Locke). I would vote SKIP right now, but I want to hear from those 4 before I make any more assumptions. I think this should provide yall some talking points to work with.

Other Notes:

I have a really really tiny town read on Dunn and Hectics.

VOTE: HALF

Dunn hasn't posted yet up to that post. Fake reads?

so youre not buying in to wifom?

I can see hectic doing it, never played with dunn, have you? Think dunn would wifom?

did it because it'd be funny
and that it'd generate discussion
didn't think it would impact lynching since 3 shuffles is enough for anything
like you could do 3 shuffles today and still have me at the top
or do a shuffle and then undo
you're reading too much into this
like a librarian on heroin

Hectic LAMIST is ironic, isnt it? Given that i dont see why you're scumreading him so much over it.
If its unironic, well, im out of words in that case. But doubt that

how dare you
you have a lot to learn student

why i claimed top spot is in this post Azure
getting real hard to not OMGUS you
but decades of experience have taught me otherwise

[Hectic]

plus am in 6 games right now
perfectly reasonable that i'd forget this game was mountainous
though i didn't forget
just didn't realise from the role PM

stop digging that hole Azure
the deeper you dig it while remaining stubborn
the scummier you get
get out of it while you're still a townread

[Hectic]

also you didn't address my point about how that wouldn't come up in the scum PT
you think my scum buddy wouldn't inform me it was mountainous when discussing fakeclaiming and me settling on VT?
think that through for a bit Azure
thought you would've realised deathtunneling does not end well from last game

[Hectic]

4

[Hectic]

not talking about the vig claim specifically
how about crumbing VT?
would i not discuss with my scummate before doing that?
would my scummate not remind me the game isn't mountainous?

and of course
everything i do is 100% calculated
you need not worry
there's a reason why in 2011 they were calling me Hec "The Human Calculator" Tic

[Hectic]

Hectic why are you hedging on Azure? How are you going to brag about how long you've been playing mafia and try to scare someone off your lynch by saying "tunneling is scum indicative"?

tunneling isn't scum-indicative
but stubborn tunneling with bad reason is
still townread her though

interesting that you're concerned about how much i'm justifying myself
am trying to get someone i townread to stop deathtunneling me
since she seems really confident on her read

my VT crumb is REALLY good btw
like not even Hansel and Gretel would spot this
will explain it tomorrow

[Hectic]

I think Hectic picked a high number because he's Hectic

Another reason why I think Hectic is scum.

People will buy into the Hectics style of play which gives him townpoints.

Its genius.

lul
should give NAI points
since people expect me to do it regardless of alignment

[Hectic]

interesting that you're concerned about how much i'm justifying myself
am trying to get someone i townread to stop deathtunneling me
since she seems really confident on her read

You were asking me to elaborate on why she's town half a post ago; I'm skeptical about this progression where you immediately townread her for pushing you.

right
started townreading her more as she explained her reasoning
from her initial post thought i could make her realise her error straight away
a hesitant townread then
but her stubbornness and excitement on finding scum is towny
so a stronger townread now
i know i was saying to stop tunneling me because it will get her scumread by me
in reality was lying and just wanted her to stop wasting time
but the tunneling actually did the reverse
like a tunnel that goes into the sky instead of the earth

[Hectic]

well that's disappointing
you've been blinded pops
it's a shame really
but we still have time
i will show you the light
just not today

[Hectic]

Alright, so I'm gonna be honest. I've never been lynched on this site as any alignment, period.
That subconsciously makes me care

far

too much about being lynched, since some part of me wants that streak to continue.
Obviously, that's not very healthy, and probably makes me play a little bit worse, and makes every game where I'm being scumread as town a little more stressful when it really shouldn't be.
In some ways, it makes me play like scum as town, since I can't help but value survival far more than I should as town.

Also, I'm aware I only have 2 votes on me lol, and this may seem premature, but just wanted to get this out there since it's on my mind right now.
But in the event I do get mislynched, it would honestly come as a relief at this point.
If this makes you townread me, that's fantastic.
If not (this is an AtE after all), I'll do some scumhunting and elaborate on the number theory thing first, and no hard feelings.

[Hectic]

Also, I'm aware I only have 2 votes on me lol, and this may seem premature, but just wanted to get this out there since it's on my mind right now.

Why are you so worried about 2 votes on you?

VOTE: skip
something about you seems very off this game
3

yeah
was playing like a survivor rather than VT
gonna try and care less about being lynched now

Elements
didn't answer my question about my persona not being obvious enough?
elaborate

[Hectic]

has anyone found my VT crumb?
will sheep you for the next 3 games if you do
but pretty hard
especially from someone with a PHD in fantasy tales

[Hectic]

pops' progression realising there's more than one shuffle is genuine
doesn't seem fabricated
that's town-indicative

[Hectic]

hi

oh no
since you are probably a novice
should tell you that half of newbie scum enter with "Hi" of some sort
might not be too late to ask mod to edit your post

[Hectic]

Dunnstral feels like crown game but with more scumhunting
this is good

[Hectic]

Elements is a townlean on tone and useful content
though most of it setup related so far

what do you think of Azure tunneling on me Elements?
what do you think of Dongempire replacing out?

[Hectic]

sorry
am busy till Friday
will catchup and give my thoughts then
know there's been quite a bit of cafuffling around

[Hectic]

Patience is a virtue. You know who said that? That's right: Me.

Right now, I can understand you may be impatient, and eager for me to return and hammer down my final verdict.

Only thing is, when you get to my level of skill in this field of work, it can take weeks, or even months to analyse and surmise my findings.

Due to the complexity of the game state, it will take a further ONE day until I return with my solve.

Great. That's sorted then. Now here's some content: Chemist is here. Pops is levitating. Azure is interesting. Maria is foreboding. Locke is pragmatic. Elements is bamboozled.

End of post.

[Hectic]

special question?
remind me
i'll try and answer with my out of date knowledge

[Hectic]

was scumreading Dogenempire/Chemist back then
Locke was pinging me slightly
was townreading Nymph and pops

was townreading Azure
not scumreading her

could we not lynch Elements again?

[Hectic]

VOTE: UNDO

[Hectic]

Elements has a knack for locking scummy and getting mislynched day 1

think he's good here

[Hectic]

okay i'm back
catchup begins now
am on the London underground so beware
will be in and out of connectivity like a weasel

[Hectic]

only up to page 23 but am about to lose connection
so:
interesting that mafia let Elements die
so we can guarantee the top 2 die now
like lining up scum with a sniper

like Azure's read on Locke
his townread on me didn't really make sense

Dunn pushing pops is interesting
which two would you put at the top Dunn?

[Hectic]

does SKIP count as a swap for mafia?
mafia can use one type of swap?
or can only swap once?

mod probably clarified this already
but clearly not well enough
am a very analytical player and didn't notice
so
someone didn't do their job
you know
could help with comodding while playing this game
that cool Freezer Guy?
send me a PM if so
promise to not let spoiler info affect my in-game play

yes i know this is all nonsense
but i lost connection so can't change pages
so just filling the time with some golden content ya know
am like King Midas right now
but am more apologetic than a Canadian bumping into you

wait it's back

[Hectic]

I don't think it's worth going into mafia choices, they could have framed elements yet didn't, they probably value the ability to get the lynch off themself, or frame somebody later. It just wasn't worth going for elements at that time with the other choices available, or something like that.

Speaking of which, the other choices available were:

Reverse: Pops
Pair: MariaR
Half: Not_Mafia

if it's 1 swap only
they were right to let elements die
was townreading him and would've pushed for his non-death
and makes much more sense to save it to protect themselves
like you said already
good job Dunn
doing some great work out there

[Hectic]

Having an agenda isn't the base on why I would find someone scummy. Because I think every player has one to some extent. It's the agenda that your pushing and the actions around it that would make me question it.

Azuresky is really blatant in what they're doing and not trying to hide anything. Along with how they started the game compared to now feels pretty normal to me. You were a lot more of an oddball then that.

agreed
and Azure's "agenda" is reasonable
kind of like Caeser reforming the Grain Toll

though Azure
you semi-flipped on me when you realised i mentioned Locke was buddying me earlier?
that the only reason?

[Hectic]

GiF posted that he's replacing Azuresky in the Replacements thread. He didn't post about it here.
Did GiF give you the daystart PM Nymph requested Hectic
Or can I be mad about that too

no sadly
careful though pops
last time someone excessively complained about mod stuff
like short deadlines and votecounts
they were scum

[Hectic]

Hahahaha imagine if it's 2 deep wolves and we're about to get rekt.

who would you consider a deep wolf if they were scum from your point of view?

[Hectic]

That NotMafia guy?
Yeah, I've played with him.
He's quite a character that one.
And you know what?
I'm not afraid to say it.
He always manages to make me smile.
Looking forward to your contributions, NotMafia.
Just remember one thing no matter how stressful or tough things may get.
I've got your back, and you're the best.

[Hectic]

I want to hear more from Hectic at the moment for my own theory.

love theories
have said stuff
let's hear it

[Hectic]

NotMafia replaced Locke
who replaced Azure?

[Hectic]

like DDL's reads so far
(other than on me)

Dunn is scummy
but his playstyle here is so different to what it was in Crown
more scumhunting and aggression than that game
but stuff like saying DDL came in with an agenda
and pointing other fingers without following up is scummy
could just be changing up his scum game
since he was lynched for it last time

he or NotMafia to lynch
NotMafia hasn't done anything
but still scumlean him based on Locke's actions

uhhhh
don't you just hate hydra slips?

-Hectic

[Hectic]

DDL
why are you taking my page 23 "solve" seriously?
not that sure about my reads
also
remind me where else i've played with you outside of the silver box game

[Hectic]

Don't worry, I'll help you out, pops.
"Lolcatting" is used to describe a person that perceive themselves as a funny feline. These people are often disturbed and will claim scum even if they've been hammered as town.
Usually, this is done for "the luls". I can break down what "the luls" mean if you are in need of further assistance.
In this case however, NotMafia is in fact mafia, despite the confusing nature of his name, and will flip scum imminently.

[Hectic]

That is correct. lolmooing is the behaviour that NotMafia is presenting here.

Though, I think you'll find the Neantherdals would regularly ride atop of Miltanks that they considered of the feline variety. There's more overlap than you think.

[Hectic]

Oh, thought that was the last shuffle.
Got any kind of defense or reads, NotMafia? I mean why sub in and play in the first place?

Unsure if scum would shuffle to kill someone else or let me die, but I wouldn't be a bad nightkill for town given the current average read on me.
Beware of the 3 Lighteners (pops, Nymph, MariaR), I'd say more but I need to get back to working on my 5th PhD this year. It's on the predictability and perils of woolly mammoth taming during the Black Death on Wrangel Island.

VOTE: SKIP

[Hectic]

Turns out pops' scum game is really strong.

I'll put on my game face and even bring out the A-Game for next time.