Open 767: Nomination Mafia [Day 7]

[mutantdevle]

VOTE: Norwegianboy

Now leave!

[mutantdevle]

There's a few players in this game that I recognise the name of. Aside for you norwegianboy the only person here I've spent a significant amount of time playing with is Kokichi Oma but that was so long ago that I doubt I'll have any useful meta conclusions to make.

It's been over a year since I've played on mafiascum and I remember the games being far more active than this to the point that sometimes I'd struggle to keep up and just be a background member of the town. I would say to not expect me to be nearly as much of a town leader as I am on the EE forums but if the activity of this remains as it is then I may just fall into that description.

[mutantdevle]

all i gor was a crappy alignment.

A large majority of people prefer playing as town. So it's statistically likely that you too prefer playing town. Hence, if you're saying you think your alignment is crappy, you're admitting that you are mafia?

VOTE: pisskop

[mutantdevle]

all i gor was a crappy alignment.

A large majority of people prefer playing as town. So it's statistically likely that you too prefer playing town. Hence, if you're saying you think your alignment is crappy, you're admitting that you are mafia?

VOTE: pisskop

This needs votes, it's false, it's a sheepvote in RVS, it's tryhard, and its trying to blend in.

I mean, it's not false. Most people do prefer playing town. There have been numerous polls about it. Unless you mean the part about saying it's statistically likely that you prefer playing town - in which yeah that was a blatant lie and I'm sure you have meta evidence it prove it wrong.

mutant you know better than that

Should I? Have we played with each other significantly in the past? All I know about you is that I recognise your name.


You claiming I'm sheeping in RVS is just as much of a stretch as my reason for voting you. If I'm somehow sheeping PMysterious then you sheeped Norwegianboy in voting for me. Also, I'd like you to justify your statements that I'm A) Tryharding and B) trying to blend in. Those things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive but they are pretty damn close.

[mutantdevle]

look at me im so quirky.

and town.

thats what mutant did.

No it's not. I did this:

I think Mutant is just trying to create content for us so we can make a proper judgement about who’s acting scummy.

Anyone who doesn't see my vote for what it is (an attempt to generate content in a game that started as stagnant) is intentionally reading too much into it. If you thought that I'd ever actively champion votes against you for a reason such as that then I don't know what to tell you other than that you are wrong.

I suppose I at least achieved my goal of generating new content.

[mutantdevle]

36 is a joke vote, still in rvs. People that seem to be wagoning him based on that dont should reconsider.

Didn't read it as a joke tbh, more like just tryharding and reaching, but I also think its a naive read that rarely come from mefias so early on, shrugs

You're right it wasn't really a joke vote but it definitely wasn't meant to be taken seriously. So I don't really accept that it was a 'naive' read since it's not something I genuinely believed in. I suppose if I have been naive about anything it's that I'm not familiar with what the current culture on mafiascum. So far, the only criticism that I accept about my actions is that they were a bit tryhardy - though I don't understand why Pisskop but more specifically Titus thinks that's exclusively a scum trait.

[mutantdevle]

I'd be pretty fucking surprised if mutant flipped town.

Why do you say that so early?



Seriously though: this is a pretty strong conclusion to come to. So I must ask how serious this conclusion is? It seems odd to me that anyone could be so closed-minded this early into the game.

[mutantdevle]

54 is a very bad post. The only reason i can find for it existing is to throw shade at joey and try to discredit his posts nonchalantly, otherwise there is no reason to post it.

My issue with it on first read was how it appealed to pisskop as though they are best buds.

[mutantdevle]

UNVOTE:

[mutantdevle]

You claiming I'm sheeping in RVS is just as much of a stretch as my reason for voting you. If I'm somehow sheeping PMysterious then you sheeped Norwegianboy in voting for me. Also, I'd like you to justify your statements that I'm A) Tryharding and B) trying to blend in. Those things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive but they are pretty damn close.

why is sheeping the focal point here. The real vote, the real reason titus joined me is because its an incredible display of effort for an rvs vote.

RVS votes are short and sweet, making pseudo sense. You made a logic chain, and are now caught scum.

Sheeping was not my focal point at all. I was simply rebutting your claim that sheeping was somehow a factor within my own vote.

Your issue is that you're treating my vote as RVS. I've already explained that it was not an RVS vote. It was a calculated and intentional vote albeit with reasons I didn't genuinely believe - this had the sole intention of generating content. Until that point nobody had said anything meaningful.

Why does making an early vote that uses effort and logic instead of just near randomness make me scum? It shows an element of tryharding, sure. But what about that is inherently scummy?

Why its scummy, aside from the above, is that it shows discomfort with your position in the game [it is scummy to be so self aware] and it shows a desire to be seen as 'logical' 'useful' and 'proactive'.

it was a bad opening, because it reveals your initial, unadulterated mindset.

You're saying a lot of things about me here that I agree with yet I still don't understand how you come to the conclusion I am scum. Yes I took issue with the position in the game (in that nothing of substance was being said). Yes I am incredibly self-aware. Yes I have primarily a logical approach to things. And yes I was trying to be useful and proactive. So what I don't understand is why all of those things are bad? Or at the very least, why you think they are bad? I consider all of those traits to be positive, or at the very least neutral, so the only reason I can see that you'd suspect me for displaying them is if you think I'm faking them. Until your most recent posts, it really did not seem like that was what you were accusing me of. So am I right in saying that the reason you are currently scum reading me is because you think my blatant display of those traits is me faking and overselling them?

[mutantdevle]

If you want to be townread, i would suggest playing the game instead of spending the time defending. Lets discuss the reactions to my vote and push.

Lets talk about my reaction to your vote on me. you did it for info, so why arent you infoing?

Just because I'm not verbalising any reads yet doesn't mean I haven't made any conclusions. I can defend myself and solve the game at the same time. It's ironic that this is what you post about after my post where the main focus is me asking questions that try to understand where your point of view is coming from in scum reading me. I'd love to discuss my thoughts on the way that different people have reacted to your push against me with you - rather than just keeping my thoughts in my head. But before I do that I want to reach a consensus on you. So it'd be mighty helpful if you addressed my questions/concerns I directed towards you in my post #84.

I'm offering him a way out. I'm indirectly showcasing how his vote was not made with the intention of generating information that he uses to analyze and progress the game.

My vote

was

made with the intention of generating information and I consider it to have been a success. Sure you can take some credit for that due to your push on me but this whole situation, starting with my vote against you, has received plenty of information from people's comments and reactions. Being at the centre of that is especially beneficial for me in particular as a learn more from being directly involved in situations than I do merely observing them.

Right now the questions that are floating around in my head are "why would you want to offer me a way out?" and "are you actually just offering yourself a way out by encouraging me to do something that could make you naturally town read me?"

[mutantdevle]

pisskop do you intend to respond to my #103 and #84?

[mutantdevle]

something something no I do not

Why? You say you want me to talk to you about my reads yet you actively deny my attempts to gauge a read on you. Aside from trying to read my reaction to that, I don't see what town motivation there is to purposely stunt my ability to read you.

[mutantdevle]

This wagon is honestly ridiculous. I'm genuinely surprised that it's got this far.

[mutantdevle]

Pisskop comes across better than mutant in this

How?

Was initially reading pk v mutant as SvS and I still think it maybe could be

I don't see how you could have the perspective that this is SvS. Unless you have a really good explanation for why you think that then if pisskop is town you are certainly scum. This just seems like the kind of thing you'd say to set up an eventual lynch of both of us.

[mutantdevle]

This wagon is honestly ridiculous. I'm genuinely surprised that it's got this far.

If you want people to move their votes then you should make content.

Whats your reads?

I'll get to that; I'm going through the posts chronologically right now.

[mutantdevle]

He's somewhat confident in himself, and knows he can be a somewhat respectable member of the town, and he's trying to emulate it as mafia with that opening rvs post.

What makes you so confident that my post was faked and not just me being me?

I don't give a heck if he made a "good response", it's not that hard to wallpost as scum.

It's interesting that you have this view considering no one else has described my response as good. In fact, other's have claimed quite the opposite.

[mutantdevle]

Id like mutant to claim plz.

I'll claim when you answer my questions

[mutantdevle]

Feeling that good old pressure yet mutant?

Whilst I admit I was not taking the wagon on me seriously when it was just you and Titus, it is wrong to suggest that I was not feeling pressure before now.

You have been incredibly manipulative this entire time. You push me for my vote against you and then criticise the very fact that I defend myself. Your main criticism being that I've made no evaluations of any other aspect of the game despite the fact that you yourself are guilty of the same thing. And then refusing to answer my questions towards you whilst still demanding things from me (my reads). The very fact that you've not been willing to exchange information with me is directly why I've withheld it. You've actively made me not want to give reads. Maybe that was your intention. I don't understand how everyone's just let you get away with this shit. I consider it possible that perhaps I'm missing something and that from an outside perspective it may be that your manipulation really is just the process of applying pressure, and I've just taken this long to crack. But from my position it feels like your intentions are more malicious than that especially given your emphasis that this has all been in the name of pressure.


If I'm lynched today then I'm not going to take much responsibility for it. The only aspect that I will take responsibility for is that perhaps I should have played into your game of giving you information without receiving any from you - considering depriving you of my reads is, in reality, a net loss to the town. But likewise, I do not see what town motivation you have in withholding similarly important information other than to push me further into a corner where my alignment is not truly considered. Everything about your actions towards me just screams manipulation; I'm not going to town read that and, until now, I've not been willing to bend to it.



I'll post my reads once I've finished catching up.

[mutantdevle]

Yeah, and by meta, you mean that one game where mutant was busy IRL and also happened to roll scum? I remember that one too. I wouldn't consider that a great representation of his scumgame as a whole,

You seem to be the only person on the EE forums that seems to understand that I was genuinely just busy that game lol.

[mutantdevle]

VOTE: Menalque

So you think that both pisskop and I are town?

[mutantdevle]

1. Personal experience making the exact same type of posts.

So the conclusion wasn't made out of any ability to read me. I'm not saying that judging others by your own standards isn't valid, but it is flawed. And I don't believe you know my scum game well enough to make the distinction between what I do that's genuine and what I do that's faked.

[mutantdevle]

Was initially reading pk v mutant as SvS and I still think it maybe could be

I don't see how you could have the perspective that this is SvS. Unless you have a really good explanation for why you think that then if pisskop is town you are certainly scum.

This just seems like the kind of thing you'd say to set up an eventual lynch of both of us.

Lynching both people in an SvS would require one of them to flip S... ...is this a slip or nah?

Lynching both of us through his logic does not require either of us to be scum. His current intention is for me to flip. Scum!him would know I'd flip town and hence sets up this viewpoint in anticipation of that. After my lynch, if pisskop comes under pressure for my town flip he has already put himself in a position to join that wagon. Alternatively, he could start it himself under the narrative that he wouldn't have made such a conclusion that we are both scum if there wasn't at least some scumminess going on in the situation.

It was not something I had thought about when I wrote that, but Joey does have a point that if pisskop were to flip scum later on then that would also enable Menalque to direct a lynch back towards me if I were still alive. pisskop flipping scum isn't something that would make me consider Menalque to be scum nearly as much as pisskop flipping town would, but it does go to show how flexible calling the situation SvS is from a scum point of view.

[mutantdevle]

VOTE: Menalque

So you think that both pisskop and I are town?

What does my vote has to do with my read on both of you?

Also I said I didn't find anyone particularly mefia-y but I am being cautious. I think the case on you is terrible and people are already getting biased towards your answers (Awoo)

The subtext of my post about Menalque was that if both pisskop and I are town then his stance on the situation being SvS makes it incredibly likely that he himself is scum. You voted for him after that so I assumed that meant that you agreed with that assessment and placing a vote from the perspective of reading myself and pisskop as town.

[mutantdevle]

Mutant, why did you unvote Pisskop?

Because I was never suspicious of him. The only motivation behind my vote was to generate content. I obviously expected reactions to be negative towards me but I didn't expect those reactions to be so strong-felt and static. I thought a simple "it was clearly an attempt to generate content" would have resolved the situation in terms of conflict towards me and then that from there we could analyse different people's opinions about it and get into proper game conversation.

[mutantdevle]

@mod can you update the players post to show the names of the players who replaced in please?


Okay reads time:

Joey - I think he's town. Undoubtedly there's some bias there due to him defending me but I don't think that's strong enough to invalidate this read. He's honestly one of the few people that's making sense since he sees this wagon against me as ludicrously as I do and I don't think it comes from a place of trying to buddy up with me. (Is it called buddying? I can't remember).

Norwegianboy - I would have thought that he'd defend me more than he has and I actually think he's town because of it. Especially given his recent defence was made towards someone claiming to know me and at a time where it looks like I'm pretty fucked. I think that if he was mafia then he wouldn't have said anything to Awoo as it would benefit him to just let another player strongly believe that I'm scum. He also seems different here than in recent previous games I've played with him. It might just be the extended day length (days are 48-72 hours on the EE forums) but he was scum in those recent games that I'm comparing his behaviour here to so I think that difference I'm noticing is that he is town.

Awoo - I think he is scum. If he hadn't had said he was from the EE forums then I wouldn't think this. But if he is Kira from the EE forums then I do think his actions are scum motivated. This quote by Norwegianboy is what first started making me think that:

This is a nightless game. We get a say in every single player who dies. Mutant needs to go.
VOTE: mutantdevle

Because you see him as a threat to scum or because you believe he might be scum?

As some context, on the EE forums there's a strong consensus that I'm seen as a strong threat to the town when I'm mafia and a strong threat to the mafia when I'm town. The main reason being that on the EE forums I usually fall into the role of a town leader. So if he is scum then he'd strongly desire to get rid of me and he'd especially want this lynch to go through given, as he points out, the game is nightless. Being from the EE forums he should also know that everything I've said in my defence about my qualities and how I play the game is true and that the kind of thing he's accusing me of faking is exactly the kind of thing I'd do as town.

Creature - Null. He's not posted enough for any read to be significant.

Pisskop - Scum lean. The way they've orchestrated the wagon against me just feels too manipulative to be solely motivated by pressuring me as I feel like they came to the conclusion that I needed to die very early on. That said, my gut is telling me they are town. But right now I'm not listening to it, possibly because my logical conclusion is that the are scum, possibly out of spite.

Titus - Scum. If pisskop is town then I think there is still a strong chance that Titus is scum and, although she's done less pushing, I think she's scummier. The fact that her strong scum read comes from a position of watching from the side rather than directly pressuring me like pisskop has is part of why I think she's scummier. Based on pisskop's and Titus' interactions I feel like either they are scum partners who have delivered a strong push against me or Titus is using the opportunity to buddy up with pisskop to make him trust her. Either way it points to Titus being scum. Nothing she's said has convinced me that she thinks I'm scum for merely placing that vote.

Menalque - Null. Aside from what I've previously mentioned, he's not done anything significant for me to read him either way. My gut is telling me he's scum in the same way it tells me pisskop is town.

Dongempire - Town lean. There's nothing scummy about it's posts and I've generally liked what it has posted. Again, might be slight bias there, but it has shown more efforts to solve the game than just what's been going on with me and pisskop. Also, I think it's worth mentioning that Dongempire and Norwegianboy probably aren't on a scum team based on its post #17. That might be relevant later if I'm wrong about either of them.

PMysterious - Same as Creature.

Correspondence - When they placed their vote on me I checked their meta to see if they're always this weird and turns out they are. I hate players like these because they're impossible to read. But hey, that's probably not going to be my problem.

[mutantdevle]

Mutant tell me why you are town in short easy to read sentences. Keep in mind that I have trouble understanding words with more then 3 syllables.

No one has explained how my vote on pisskop was scummy. When I ask, they refuse to say. There is nothing else against me.

[mutantdevle]

Be critical of anyone who tries to blame me for this lynch.



I confidently think awoo is scum based on my experience with him. Titus is probably scum.

To be honest I think I'm actually going to say pisskop is town. So Menalque is probably scum.

I revoke my town read of Norwegianboy. His hammer was shitty.

I confidently think Joey is town.

[mutantdevle]

He declared intent 6-7 hours ago, mutant not having posted inside that window, I wouldn't mind roping them for that

This is why his hammer is shitty. He didn't wait for me to respond before hammering.

[mutantdevle]

If this flips town we’re doing you tomorrow norway

This is also shitty - trying to pin all of the blame for my lynch on someone else despite comfortably being on the wagon as well.

[mutantdevle]

position of watching from the side rather than directly pressuring me like pisskop has is part of why I think she's scummier

Fiction

You did not have an active role in encouraging people to join this wagon.

[mutantdevle]

That said, my gut is telling me they are town. But right now I'm not listening to it, possibly because my logical conclusion is that the are scum, possibly out of spite.

Hey pisskop! If you quit voting scum, they'll townread you!

As some context, on the EE forums there's a strong consensus that I'm seen as a strong threat to the town when I'm mafia and a strong threat to the mafia when I'm town. The main reason being that on the EE forums I usually fall into the role of a town leader. So if he is scum then he'd strongly desire to get rid of me and he'd especially want this lynch to go through given, as he points out, the game is nightless. Being from the EE forums he should also know that everything I've said in my defence about my qualities and how I play the game is true and that the kind of thing he's accusing me of faking is exactly the kind of thing I'd do as town.

BoP defense, I'm too good to be wagoned by homesite players if they're town

Joey - I think he's town. Undoubtedly there's some bias there due to him defending me but I don't think that's strong enough to invalidate this read. He's honestly one of the few people that's making sense since he sees this wagon against me as ludicrously as I do and I don't think it comes from a place of trying to buddy up with me. (Is it called buddying? I can't remember).

Look at me, I'm a wounded puppy dog and Joey buys it so town

This is all just a biased analysis of my posts. You were never going to let yourself town read anything I had to say. It's concerning how quickly you decided I was scum with seemingly unfaltering confidence.

[mutantdevle]

Menalque - Null. Aside from what I've previously mentioned, he's not done anything significant for me to read him either way. My gut is telling me he's scum in the same way it tells me pisskop is town.

Lol. A read here that completely no sense. Pisskop was a lean scum that his gut said was town but pride had him as scum. So if it was inverted, that makes Mel a lean town but scum due to pride? But he can't even dare use the word scum on Mel due to not wanting him to stay on.

It does make sense. It's called considering 2 possibilities and having an open mind. Logically, based on the information I had, I read pisskop's actions as scummy but my gut is telling me he's town. I also read Mel's actions as scummy but because what I found scummy about him was dependant on pisskop being town my scum read of pisskop overruled my scum read of mel - hence mel became a null read. I previously believed that pisskop was the scummy one and that my gut is wrong but I now realise that I probably only believed that because I am/was salty at pisskop for getting me lynched for literally the stupidest reason I've ever seen someone lynched for in the 3 years that I've been playing mafia.

[mutantdevle]

I've held back my feelings towards him at this point, but Mutant does seem overly defensive in this game, i'd think he would start pointing fingers by now but he hasn't actually voted anyone. I'm starting to consider this quote:

Mutant is clearly trying to piss no one off.

I'm declaring intent. Will hammer Mutant if nothing new comes up.

You were defending me earlier. And now you claim you've just been holding back your feelings. I don't buy it. What made you change your mind?

[mutantdevle]

I'm actually going to say pisskop is town.

Don't just take this as a given. Pisskop hasn't actually had anything to contribute to this game besides lynching me. Pressure him and make sure he actually shows analysis of the game. If he doesn't post his reads and opinions then lynch him.

[mutantdevle]

VOTE: Mutantdevle

What made you decide to hammer me after not even 7 hours of declaring intent? What were you even trying to achieve by declaring intent?? You should have just hammered me there and then if you didn't intend to give me time to respond.

I think it's that from joining this site you've learnt that hammering without intent looks scummy. So in order to avoid looking scummy you go through standard procedure of placing intent and naively thinking you'd be alright to then hammer later without giving me chance to respond.




If anyone tries invalidating my criticisms of Norwegianboy here by pointing out that I town read him earlier then I'd find them suspicious because there's very clearly new context after his hammer vote. Specifically that I now believe I was wrong about this:

I would have thought that he'd defend me more than he has and I actually think he's town because of it.

being a sign that he is town rather than scum.

[mutantdevle]

Looking at the ISO, even worse, Mena didn't even give a reason for being on the wagon in the first place. In fact, he only mentioned it one time.

Pisskop comes across better than mutant in this

Was initially reading pk v mutant as SvS and I still think it maybe could be

He also failed to explain his read when I asked him to.


It's interesting that he voted for me yet not once did he ever interact with me. Neither to ask me questions nor to respond to any of what I said about him.

[mutantdevle]

At the very least there's 2 scum on my wagon but I wouldn't be surprised if all 3 were. I refuse to believe that 6 people genuinely thought that I was scum soley on the basis of that vote against pisskop. Honestly, I struggle to believe that even 4 did.

[mutantdevle]

Judging by the wall of mutant posts I doubt he will be flipping scum.

How do you feel about me directly accusing you of being scum?

[mutantdevle]

Chances are, two of the 6 on the wagon for Mutant are scum at least. I wouldn't be surprised if all 3 of them were on this wagon.

Oh lol, I coincidentally paraphrased you. I honestly hadn't read this post by you when I posted that. I guess you can get some townie points for thinking like me.

[mutantdevle]

Judging by the wall of mutant posts I doubt he will be flipping scum.

How do you feel about me directly accusing you of being scum?

Not much. You say you have experience with me therefore I'm scum. I think we played in cul de sac a long time ago...? Want to elaborate before you die?

Lol, don't try to pretend like that's my only experience with you. You mentioned earlier in the game that you are also from the EE forums and proved it by showing knowledge of events there. I strongly believe you are Kira (from the EE forums) due to your tone being exactly like his. If you are Kira then there is no way you that you aren't scum here. Sure, I can't prove you're Kira, but it must be questioned why you're not prepared to say who you are and why you just tried to discredit my experience with you.

[mutantdevle]

Awoo - Menalque is more scum than town.
Correspondence is a firm null. Good luck trying to sort them.
Everyone else is more town than scum.
This is my list of scummiest to least scummy.

A

w

o

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T

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a

l

q

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C

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r

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p

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d

e

n

c

e

P

i

s

s

k

o

p

D

o

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m

p

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P

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_

[mutantdevle]

Something I can't help but feel about my wagon is that, if I had replaced out at any point for whatever reason, this is the kind of wagon where everyone would probably have unvoted when the replacement makes their first few posts saying they don't know what who they replaced was doing.

[mutantdevle]

I'm not Kira.

No one should believe this unless you say who you actually are.

[mutantdevle]

If you want me to reevaluate your actions in this game then you should say who you are so that I can judge your actions from that perspective.

[mutantdevle]

Sigh, but messing with people is so /fun/!

I'm NoNK.

That actually makes sense.

Okay, I revoke the scum read. I still struggle to understand why you scum read me in this game.

[mutantdevle]

Did the rest of my posting/explanation not convince you otherwise? I feel like you were so biased in your original conclusion that you never took a moment to truly evaluate anything else I said in the game.

Also, what do you think of Norwegianboy's hammer?


Pedit: okay you pretty much answered my first question in the way I laid out in this post. I think you're town.

[mutantdevle]

We've all seen you on the EE forums as a town leader, but never that much under pressure (at least I don't recall it much),

I was under quite a bit of pressure in PurgatorEE. I'm still in shock that processor randomly decided to trust me after scum reading me almost all game.

[mutantdevle]

Dont really get your townread on me though mutant, i ascertain that i havent done much to earn that so far, and my activity has been lacking

It's mostly PoE to be honest. There are so many people that are scummier than you that I think it's a simple matter of probability that you're town especially considering I see no scumminess or hidden agenda in your posts. Besides, based on my belief that you're not scum with Norwegianboy, his scummy hammer makes me think you are town all the more.

[mutantdevle]

Mutant, the fact that you didn't vote for any of your scumreads or doing about anything to create a proper counterwagon didn't make a lick of sense to me.

I wasn't exactly in a position to push my scum reads, was I?

You made a reads posts and then seemingly left it at that. Titus's explanation of yourself being at L-1 but still not budging gave me some bad vibes about you, it seems like you're trying to set up shades and stuff for your inevitable lynch. So i had to make a choice here.

Yeah you're right. Unfortunately someone hammered me before I had a chance to make any more posts after my reads list.

[mutantdevle]

Do you think his hammer and flip makes him scum?

Objectively it's pretty bad, but let's be honest, so were a lot of things you were doing, like pretty much everything titus grilled you on. And as we know from you, objectively scummy doesn't always translate right into actual scum.

I disagree that I was objectively scummy.


And yes, I do think he is scum because of his hammer. Don't get me wrong, the hammer itself is not the thing I have the problem with. It's the fact that he didn't wait for me to respond before delivering on his intent. I really think that Norwegianboy as town would have had the sense to, at the very least, wait a decent amount of time before doing something like that.

But honestly, it all depends on his responses/explanations. That's why I don't want you to just conclude that he is town. You're the living player that has the most experience with him. So grill him, pressure him, make him give you information. And then make your conclusion.

[mutantdevle]

YES YOU WERE MUTANT I WANTED YOU TO PUSH FOR A SCUMREAD

I was actually planning to vote for Menalque. I read Titus' posts last night on my phone at 3 in the morning before going to sleep. I literally went to sleep last night thinking about this game which is when I concluded that pisskop was town hence validating my scum read on Menalque. Sadly, when I woke up (Or rather, when I finally got out of bed) I had been lynched.

[mutantdevle]

So i had to make a choice here.

And your choice was to not wait for me to respond to you, or anything else in this thread since I had last posted, despite it only having been 7 hours since you declared intent? Let's be absolutely clear about this, if you had your way, I'd not have been able to make any of the posts that I have done in the last few hours.

[mutantdevle]

U never answered me Norway

Just like you never answered me.

[mutantdevle]

to analyzing Mutant's reaction to the push and concluding that his focus on defending himself and shading rather than pushing his scumreads lines up with scummy behaviour.

Was I shading? I've criticised the wagon as being ridiculous but that's as far as I've gone in terms of shading. Also, you've witnessed first hand on the EE forums that when I was being scum read for not doing much all I had to do was start pushing my opinions for most people to town read me again. So why would you think I'm scum for not doing that? Especially when I mentioned in this game the reason I wasn't giving reads was because pisskop wasn't answering my questions.

[mutantdevle]

U never answered me Norway

Just like you never answered me.

What was it I didn’t answer btw?

Pisskop comes across better than mutant in this

How?

Was initially reading pk v mutant as SvS and I still think it maybe could be

I don't see how you could have the perspective that this is SvS. Unless you have a really good explanation for why you think that then if pisskop is town you are certainly scum. This just seems like the kind of thing you'd say to set up an eventual lynch of both of us.

It would also be nice if you addressed the numerous times I've mentioned you aka accused you during this thread.

[mutantdevle]

Also Norwegianboy you haven't explained why you decided to only wait 7 hours between stating intent and then hammering.

[mutantdevle]

Pk comes across better because I hated hated hated your initial reason for voting him

So your opinion had nothing to do with our interactions thereafter? Because that's not what the context or phrasing of your post would suggest. I'm also sure that I don't need to explain why ignoring proceeding events is a terrible way of forming opinions.

[mutantdevle]

1: Titus's analysis of Mutant's reads from post 194 to post 203.

Really? That's what made you change your mind??? Titus's comments about me there were pedantic and blatantly biased and that's what made you change your mind?? C'mon Norwegianboy you're better than that.

[mutantdevle]

This

as time went on I thought your content was worse and pk’s was better

doesn't really match this

Pk comes across better because I hated hated hated your initial reason for voting him

But that's just semantics and I can see what you're saying so I'm satisfied with your response.

Previously I was thinking that Norwegianboy's and Manalque's interactions could be scum theatre but I think it's increasingly obvious that they are not scum together. Right now I'm favouring Menalque as the town one but regardless of that, considering Dongempire is another example of someone who is unlikely to be partnered with Norwegianboy if Norwegianboy is scum, Norwegianboy should 100% be lynched first anyway (unless of course Menalque does something incredibly scummy).

[mutantdevle]

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Does anyone have any questions for me? Because I wanna go to bed soon.

[mutantdevle]

GG. Watching Norwegianboy desperately clawing at a victory was very entertaining. I can't wait to see the mafia PT.

[mutantdevle]

+6

[mutantdevle]

You’re getting vigged irl for that