Perfect Masquerade [Game Over]

[Gentleman 1]

Don’t mind if I drop in. If you need another name to call me by at all, call me O’Donnell.

[Gentleman 1]

I wanna feel the heat with somebody

Try hanging around Solar.
Also well said, Harry.

[Gentleman 1]

I was intimidated at first, but eventually I realized that you were all just as odd as I am

Very funny, haha.

[Gentleman 1]

Hi I'm Misty nice to meet you

Oh, is that how she looks in the Sun and Moon series? That art style really bothers me actually.

Hi I'm Misty nice to meet you

I am now Woman Laughing Alone With Salad.

May I just call you Salad?

Not sure if I lack reads because I'm distracted -- having a weird af day today friends -- or because of the nonmemorable names.

Gentleman 3 is now Crowman. I can do Dawn and Misty. Is Lady 9's avatar Celeste? Lady 2 can be... Eyes? 7 will just have to be 7, hope no one else is a number.

Me. It hit me wrong.

What about it? You think it was overly conciliatory?

Let's let the lady speak without supplying her with answers.

Is this a real thoight?

Do you think people routinely point out a post that bugged them and need an answer supplied to them?

I mean posts do bug me sometimes and I don’t know why, but still this reaction feels weird.

Valid point. I don't know why I posted that.

I have a bad habit of butting into conversations. I'll try to stop.

Unless Gentleman 7 does something similar I might just call Lady 7 Jackpot.

[Gentleman 1]

Sorry for the small comms malfunction, wasn’t aware that was capable of happening with this equipment.

[Gentleman 1]

L5, what made you think that the smiley faces might bother someone?

I’m getting the sense Link (Rick’s name for this works for me, also, hello Rick) is asking this in earnest, town read for him.

It seems initially scummy and lessens your chances of getting asked to the dance because it seems like you're afraid of engaging in a read of a player.

Why does a joke suggest that she's afraid of making a read?

The question isn't directed at me, but I want to point out that it seems to me like Lady 5 is specifically avoiding making non-joke posts. She's ignored my more serious posts twice now. Joking is fine but she doesn't have any non-jokey content yet.

I may be keeping a serious tone to maintain the roleplay I’m somewhat doing but I see no problem with joking around at this point.

I am already getting the impression Madeline is a more accomplished scumhunter than I.

I assume Madeline is Lady 8? Could you talk about that name?

It seems initially scummy and lessens your chances of getting asked to the dance because it seems like you're afraid of engaging in a read of a player.

Why does a joke suggest that she's afraid of making a read?

That assumes it is a joke.

Do you actually think I’m that stupid to believe a Neutral exists in this setup?

Hey! This feels like your real tone.

As opposed to what came before why?

I interpret that apathy as townie. I think that scum care a lot more about getting town read than town do right now.

I think the jokey/blending-in playstyle can be a strategy to get widely town read in itself though.

“69”

:3
I still can’t get over that funny theory.

It made me think of this clip.

Hey! This feels like your real tone.

That it does. Good call.

Now now. We don’t talk about our mains here!
We are here to dance and have fun!

That is not a main guess.

I had figured as much.

I agree that town carry playstyles will also want to show themselves to be town quickly.

But I don't think that avoiding serious talk in the early game when prompted to is a scumtell and I would lean it and Lady 5 the other way.

I agree with this impression. Dawn is technically my second town read. Not sure I should town read Harry just off of this.

[Gentleman 1]

But l8 is there a reason you opted for a mechanical discussion rather than what’s gone on yet?

Is there a reason you didn’t want that question asked?

I mean the key is to make T/T pairings. If flips make a difference in how likely a pairing is to be T/T, then sure, but I'm wary of that because scum have pretty much no incentive to avoid bussing, so associatives will probably not be helpful.

I'm wary of that because scum have pretty much no incentive to avoid bussing, so associatives will probably not be helpful.

The possibility you may be correct about this has me shook.

I don't think that's necessarily true? Especially if town manages to play well enough to force an S/S pairing, bussing isn't necessarily an optimal strategy for scum.

Let me cut to the chase, we only need ONE solid T-T pairing at late game to win after intermission.

Sure but I see two problems, the fact that we essentially need 2 T-T pairings going into Intermission, and the fact that lack of meta reads will likely make this a lot harder to do effectively.

Looking at the setup.
Isn’t it ideal for Gentleman 2 to choose a Lady that could be a Wolf.
That way they can’t kill him if they are a wolf or their lady partner dies.
On the other hand if they aren’t a wolf they just got rid of a miss Lynch target.

If I was Gentleman 2, my ideal play would be to do this. ^_^

No. This is extremely bad. Burn this post.

Why is it bad? If the Confirmed Town is paired with another townread slot that pairing likely dies during Intermission.

Salad

for me Lady 9 is Celeste because I know the character. I’ll keep that in mind, and I don’t recall any issue with your thoughts on that player.

[Gentleman 1]

Looking at it again could you tell me what makes Celeste/Madeline seem more accomplished to you?

[Gentleman 1]

We want Gentleman 2 ideally to be the NK bait.

Yeah I definitely don’t think this idea is that good.

We want Gentleman 2 ideally to be the NK bait.

Why would we want the confirmed Town to die?

It's so that the other T/T pair that we can hopefully confidently create survives until end game.

How are you so certain Orange (my place holder name for L8) was going to say this? If not why cut her off?

@FakeMod: Can I request for someone to shoot me an avatar sized image of something?

Also down for nicknaming people once everyone has settled on avatars.

Gentleman 6 is trying too hard with their avvie. Like Gentleman 3. Lady 6 is looking p good too.

AND How dare Lady 8!

Lady 5*

If the correction is of Lady 6 then I feel like our reads gel pretty well, which makes it a shame we are on the same side gender wise.
By the way what sort of avatar are you in the market for?

I'm feeling just a littttle regret here. For a moment just now I thought I should have joined this game as Gentleman, you know, I'm in touch with my masculine side. Because if I were I could yolo an invitation to dance with someone? I'll be honest. The usernames we were given are bland, which, fine. There are no votes, no traditional RVS-like stage with, you know, votes. And I'm stuck as a lovely Lady with no concrete game-related, like,

offers

I can make for people to respond to the way I could do with a vote in a game where everyone has a vote. Like sure I like L9 well enough Town. She seems to have her head in the game. Though to be honest even though their avatars aren't different she and L7 are kind of occupying the same spot in my brain, so. Great. Wonderful. The rest is a mush of people toying with yes admittedly a mostly NAI thing from L5. Oh okay G6 for your last two posts you seem chill as well.

And actually Lady 5, if you're asking, I

do

find the cutesy smileys, punctuating nearly your every sentance, irritating. Saccharine. I'm interested to see if you toning it down a bit can help me read you and other people. Offer accepted.

I like this for what I am pretty sure is the second post by Masque.

Can we ask people to dance yet. bc like I am keen to do it early and do most of my reading under an assumed masons idea.

Actually, it might be smart for you to do that, and then keep your read on your partner completely secret.

Very bold and interesting idea. Think it might be good.

[Gentleman 1]

@FakeMod: Can I request for someone to shoot me an avatar sized image of something?

Please come up with an avatar of your own.

That is a shame.

[Gentleman 1]

Hey can someone walk me through how to make an image avatar size?

Look up “image resizer” on Google, the first hit should be a rather easy one to use. What I would suggest is try your desired image, see what the pixel size is, then try to keep the same proportions (so a square one should remain square), that’s what I do.

[Gentleman 1]

Ok so, thoughts on holding a vote for which Lady to kill? An unofficial one.

It'll happen naturally enough through pairing. I think even if there's an unofficial vote there's probably gonna be some rogue gentleman who will extend a dance invitation to the voted lady.

You ruined my plan. Thanks.

Oh? What sort of plan did you have in mind?

I do not like Lady 2.

Why is this?

VOTE: Gent 4

Thank you for your support citizen

I might start calling you Dewey instead.

First order of business:

I am buying this town a pizza!!!!


What you want on your pizza?
If any of you say anchovies you might as well claim scum now

I’d like Italian sausage. Also anyone who asks for artichokes is dead to me, if these are to be shared.

[Gentleman 1]

I'm not a town leader type.

Could have fooled me. I think you might make a fine one. Maybe at an ordinary dance you wouldn't. But tonight you're wearing the mask. Why not go for it?

I do not like Lady 2.

Fair. I probably wouldn't like me either, and I know it, and it's really gnawing at me. Something isn't gelling. I want to be engaging here. Like genuinely I do. But it's not working, apparently. Like it's apparent even to me that I'm trying to say something but I get passed right by, like a ghost. Maybe it's posting while working, here and there, while other people are managing to have actual back-and-forth conversations.

Like L9, G3, L7, G6 are all sensible. L5 is ... fine. Can stay. L4 ... feels kind of like I do? I mean at the very least I'm sympathetic to her early frustration due to distraction and/or generic names. I'm not sure about her backing down immediately and completely after tbh a mild riposte from G3 early (I'm rereading, because yeah, I need to find some kind of foothold). Like, whatever it is, it's a firmer backing up than necessary but probably NAI. L8, kind of a low-key entrance as well? I'm not really getting much there. I do feel like trending Townread on L5 is a fake unpopular opinion? Like I don't think it was every truly going against the grain?

Mostly I want to know how L4 reads G6.

Oh, G4 also kind of lower bracket. Actually scratch that, I like him taking the offered mantle as Town leader. That's actually quite fine. Same with early offer. Actually even better. I saw the jokey pizza post and was wondering how long that shtick would take to play out. Moving fast on an offer was a strong Town move, like he stepped up to the plate and then actually delivered. Good choice of initial offer, too. L3 was in early but did and said little. G4's offer will offer some focus in a new direction.

I do actually like the broad strokes of the treanding-towards-consensus reads I'm seeing. I actually like all the active gentlemen fairly well, G3, G4, and G6 all Townleaning for me.

Is it just me, or has Masque put forth a large amount of the solving effort up to here despite a lack of posts? I definitely like that.

[Gentleman 1]

Looking for replacement.

What irks me about this is someone’s continuity of opinion has been cut off without any clear indication of whose it was. So you might ask someone a question about what they posted earlier, only to find out it was not them.

G2

I would accept if FakeGod were cool enough to allow same-sex pairings, but he is not unfortunately.

[Gentleman 1]

Yeah I need a better Kougami avi

I thought your avatar was supposed to be Spike from Cowboy Bebop. Do you mind if I call you Spike?

[Gentleman 1]

I actually vastly prefer having known that Chennis was replaced so I can play around it rather than having no idea what slot Dannflor was representing that then shifted.

Yes, it being announced is helpful to know someone’s continuity was interrupted, but I still am not aware of whose it was until I find out the hard way. A note on which slot the replaced person was in would be nice, since if you find out the hard way you get any information you would be getting from that anyway.

[Gentleman 1]

That was quick.

Indeed it was, I’m pretty sure he was one of the players who had not posted yet based on that.

[Gentleman 1]

Oh god two slips already :/

Am I the last one to arrive? My thoughts so far are that consensus townreads are probably the way to go, then ideally we can form pairs from within that group first. That way we have a better chance of crowding out scum into non optimal pairings with each other and with town who are harder to identify. Better than if we tried to just pick scum out individually, or all decide on pairings individually.

I've skimmed the game on mobile but the text is too small for me to actually read people's usernames easily which is a bit of a problem. So while I reread can everyone please give a list of your strongest townreads? It helps to have them in a list instead of scattered across pages.

I am forming a good impression of Malala (L1) already. I also like the idea of pairing off the townreads first.

[Gentleman 1]

Add lady 1 to the list of wood.

What does wood mean, in this scenario?

[Gentleman 1]

Oh. Lady 9 wasn't Dannflor.

This was what I was anticipating as well.

[Gentleman 1]

Why are people listening to you and not me?

I am town reading G3 and L9.

That's it.

However I am thinking I should match with scum.

Who is this directed towards?

[Gentleman 1]

It seems initially scummy and lessens your chances of getting asked to the dance because it seems like you're afraid of engaging in a read of a player.

Why does a joke suggest that she's afraid of making a read?

The question isn't directed at me, but I want to point out that it seems to me like Lady 5 is specifically avoiding making non-joke posts. She's ignored my more serious posts twice now. Joking is fine but she doesn't have any non-jokey content yet.

I may be keeping a serious tone to maintain the roleplay I’m somewhat doing but I see no problem with joking around at this point.

Sure, but they seemed to be going out of their way to avoid the more serious posts, which is the real issue here. And they didn't acknowledge 102 either.

Sure but I see two problems, the fact that we essentially need 2 T-T pairings going into Intermission, and the fact that lack of meta reads will likely make this a lot harder to do effectively.

It's certainly possible to play mafia effectively without using meta. It's probably the case that meta doesn't change winrate too drastically due to poor applications.

We want Gentleman 2 ideally to be the NK bait.

Why would we want the confirmed Town to die?

It's so that the other T/T pair that we can hopefully confidently create survives until end game.

How are you so certain Orange (my place holder name for L8) was going to say this? If not why cut her off?

I don't think I cut her off, I think the question was open ended discussion on what we should be doing.

I do not like Lady 2.

Why is this?

At the time I wrote that I'd have considered them to be active lurking - not really getting into the game, talking about use of smilies, not really offering anything. They've since turned that around, I actually liked their responses that came out after a bit of prodding in 244 and 343.

I will wait for Dawn to return before passing further judgment but as it stands I feel sympathetic to Harry’s position on her.
I agree playing the game that way is possible with no meta. I just believe it will be harder.
If a question directed at someone else seems open to discussion and you want to add your input, doing so is fine but wait until the intended responder answers first, so as to not taint their own response. That is the habit I practice.
Acknowledged on your Masque read, and good to see it seems you now agree with me there.

[Gentleman 1]

Why are people listening to you and not me?

I am town reading G3 and L9.

That's it.

However I am thinking I should match with scum.

Who is this directed towards?

L1

Why did you feel that way about Malala?

[Gentleman 1]

@L2: Because this strategy requires cooperation, it can't be left until later since people will probably start pairing badly which will lead to suicides. I appreciate you repeating them for me. I'm also getting distracted by interacting with people currently instead of rereading on a bigger screen.

@G2: yeah let's avoid suiciding. If you're a cassandra, show that off now with sorting out good pairings

Can you elaborate on this, how do you know that they had avatars early?

I scoped out all of the players because I was interested in what people were doing. You can still find profiles even if someone hasn't posted, using the member list. Lady 6 does not have an avatar.

This seems like a nothing question. I mean if you're interested in how to view their profiles sure, but sounded like you were trying to get a read off my method somehow.

I assume when you say Cassandra you are referring the the Greek mythology story?

[Gentleman 1]

Why are people listening to you and not me?

I am town reading G3 and L9.

That's it.

However I am thinking I should match with scum.

Who is this directed towards?

L1

Why did you feel that way about Malala?

I see this was already answered.

[Gentleman 1]

This seems like a nothing question. I mean if you're interested in how to view their profiles sure, but sounded like you were trying to get a read off my method somehow.

Am I wrong to be thinking like this?

I mean it probably yields nothing but I recall a game a couple years back where something came if this sort of event. I think Jackpot also pointed it out. I myself tried checking a couple profiles when I got the day start message, to see what others had chosen for their avatars, so Malala’s course of action makes sense.

[Gentleman 1]

This seems like a nothing question. I mean if you're interested in how to view their profiles sure, but sounded like you were trying to get a read off my method somehow.

Am I wrong to be thinking like this?

Many many moons ago in a galaxy far far away, scum outed themselves in the first few pages of the game by discussing the avatar of someone who hadn't posted yet in thread.

While anyone can make a mistake like that, there's something about Lady 1's measured tone that feels too systematic to make that mistake. Though the response to the question feels a bit eh.

As I suspected, it was Jackpot who noted it. Gives me an idea of who she is, but I will not try to act on that lead. It will probably impact how I interact with her, though.

[Gentleman 1]

I'm a watt?

This is just too good. Well played, both of you.

[Gentleman 1]

Spoiler: Full names and Nicknames

Gentleman 1
Gentleman 2 - Tom Riddle
Gentleman 3 - Link
Gentleman 4 - Rick
Gentleman 5 - Izaya
Gentleman 6 - Harry
Gentleman 7 - Winston
Gentleman 8

Lady 1 - Mala
Lady 2 - Zatanna
Lady 3 - Misty
Lady 4 - Carol
Lady 5 - Dawn
Lady 6
Lady 7 - Eureka
Lady 8 - Kitten
Lady 9 - Robin

This was important.

Spoiler: My own list

G1 - Wolf / O’Donnell
G2 - TBD
G3 - Link (would have chosen Arthur but Link works)
G4 - Rick
G5 - Spike (might change if corrected)
G6 - Harry (the funny part is David Tennant has a role in one of the Harry Potter movies)
G7 - Winston (my own choice would have been Gorilla or Harambe)
G8 - TBD

L1 - Malala
L2 - Masque
L3 - Misty
L4 - Salad
L5 - Dawn
L6 - TBD
L7 - Jackpot
L8 - Orange (placeholder)
L9 - Celeste

[Gentleman 1]

I will be having a cute puppy. You can call me Bestest Boi.

From now on you shall be dubbed Doggo by me.

[Gentleman 1]

The only Gentleman I'd accept at this point is the Doctor aka Gentleman 6. All the other gentlemen have been lack luster, even Gentleman 2, the IC.

Oh my, don’t tell me you still feel this way about me?

[Gentleman 1]

Outside of some small concerns about Celeste I have practically no solid suspicions at this moment.

[Gentleman 1]

I'm a watt?

This is just too good. Well played, both of you.

I'm afraid not. Older Harry is a Joule of my eye.

Very clever as well.

Gent 6 are you thinking of pairing with Lady 8?

May I ask why you're asking this question?

“69”

This joke is starting to get old. I noticed you barely posted anything of relevance and checked out rather quickly, cannot say I am a fan of that.

[Gentleman 1]

Outside of some small concerns about Celeste I have practically no solid suspicions at this moment.

Interesting. Want to talk about this?

I had a small feeling some of what Celeste was expressing didn’t feel genuine, I believe.

[Gentleman 1]

362 was me being annoyed about G6 getting on my case for asking for clarification. Had nothing to do with the actual thing I asked clarification on.

If any part of that exchange was an attack, it was 356. That's pretty pointedly implying that there's something bad about my question.

I’m inclined to agree with this perspective.

[Gentleman 1]

Also just saying.
If “69” doesn’t become a couple, I’ll be disappointed and I’ll question both of them with everything I got.
They better be ready to defend themselves.
You haven’t seen anything yet.

Why are you so eager to see that pairing, is it only because of the dirty number? I do like that you are trying to provide some content here, though.

[Gentleman 1]

Lady 3 was my other tentative townread, given that I'm also tentatively townreading G4 I think that I'm fine with that pairing in general.

Still townreading L9. Not going to bother saying more?

Would greatly appreciate it if new G5, L6, etc., came in and played since I am starting to feel like we'll win with just a few more townreads.

Anyone can make Town reads.

What are you getting at with this comment. Also, I see your point about possible lack of randomization, but I think FakeGod is not juvenile enough to deliberately make that reference. My impression of him is actually that he is rather uptight, if I may be blunt.
Also I believe I am experiencing the same issues with our communications hub as many others have noted, as delays in my ability to post have resulted in mild interruptions twice in a row now.

[Gentleman 1]

I am not quite in the mood to deal with this game just now but I will be giving input on some things soon.

[Gentleman 1]

I've been busy, but keeping track of activity, and this seems to have exploded recently.

[Gentleman 1]

I mean I think it's pretty clear-cut?
I ask for clarification in 350
G6 calls my questioning bad and heavily implies that it's scummy in 354 and 356
I defend my question by telling G6 that he shouldn't be ambiguous in 362
I later explain that I only wanted a clarification (372)

Personally I don’t trust Gentleman 6.
If he doesn’t make himself “69” then I’ll tell Piplup to use bubble beam on him!

What is your opinion now that Celeste has chosen to pair with G2?

Fashionably late of course, friends. I do say, this shall be a splendid affair. Absolutely spiffing!

Hi Michael

I seem to have catching up to do if I want to continue doing nicknames. I recall multiple changes to G2's profile picture, so that needs to be updated. I'll start calling G4 Leo and G8 Michael for now, I'll post my full up-to-date list when I'm certain I have everything properly set.

Outside of some small concerns about Celeste I have practically no solid suspicions at this moment.

Interesting. Want to talk about this?

I had a small feeling some of what Celeste was expressing didn’t feel genuine, I believe.

So which lady would you ask out?

I was leaning towards asking out Masque around this time.

Also @Gent 1

What made you want to respond to Gent 6’s Post?
Did you just want to point out you are getting sick of my joke? :l

I am confused by this post. Where does it looks like I was responding to one of Harry's posts?

It also makes it easy late game if “69” is both mafia, we take out 2 mafia without having to worry about losing a Town Member.

I really just do not get good vibes from this post.

[Gentleman 1]

Tonally G3 feels fine most of the time, but his discussion with G6 felt a bit too much based on semantics.

What can I say, semantics are important. Do you think my wanting people to say exactly what they mean reflects badly on me?

Not necessarily. Could just be a personality quirk, but the discussion over "sure" felt a bit pedantic, and I really don't want to get that discussion started again at all. If you had scum read him while having that discussion I'd be looking at you with a lot more squinty faces because that could be scum indicative. The fact that you town read him and said it was for clarification means that it could just be communication/personality clash. It stood out to me as a "not quite sure what to do with this" though.

I am really liking Jackpot's approach to solving at this point. I'd call her a solid town read.
My goal right now is to have a functional read list by the time I am caught up, and be ready to send a missive to my Lady of choice at that time as well.

Also if I am reading everything correctly, I get two 'lynches' worth of time / another 8 days before mafia get a 'kill' if I have matched a townie lady. So I think that is ample time to get some serious game solve happening.

I think an important question is to the ladies, given what I have said of my approach, who among you feels they are a strong hydra player / feels comfortable with me probably posting close to exclusively in the PT? I intend to lean heavily on my partner to help me parse the game and then form conclusions based on both an inevitable flip of either town or scum from my partner.

I am interested in how you plan to implement your suggested approach. You say you plan to base your conclusions of of the flip of the person you pair with. How do you intend to have that work out? I feel like logistically there is something amiss.

Actually, am I missing something?

When I think about it, isn't this just a case of finding one town lady to pair with the IC, and then...just no one else pairs up at all (Ideally we'd come up with backup pairs to organize at the last second in case scum tries to make a S/S pairing in the last minute). Although this sounds like it's starting to get really unfun.

How many of these games have you played before? This has been suggested often, but no solid method of executing this idea has ever been suggested.

To be honest I want to pair with L9 for reasons that aren't really related to mathematically optimizing the setup. I think it's probably a suboptimal pairing, but I don't really care.

Could it have been for what Dawn is proposing in some way?

[Gentleman 1]

If both Gent 1 and Lady 8 are town.
They will by far be the power house town needs to win.
The reason Gent 2 should go with Lady 7 is because Lady 7 is feel could be the most possible Deep Wolf so making the confirmed Town partners with them could help in the long run.
As for Gent 5 with Gent 2 I also feel another power house town can be made.
With both their play style’s together it can make with some good late game solving

I’ll now be gone for the day.
Cya.

This is your second time saying this, which I don't object to much but I am curious what gave you the impression Orange is a town powerhouse at this time. I would say Jackpot is a better pick for a town powerhouse

F - But tbh I am actually kinda ok with this one.

I would have asked about this but I read the mod's posts and it seems like it would not do much. Also, I don't know who the person in G2's current avatar is, but he looks like Adam from the show Adam Ruins Everything so that's what I am going to call him now.

There's a solution G7. Which is for people to not fuck up.

Like I am only playing this game in an incognito tab and not opening it or tracking it on any other account.

I have been maintaining my stability by writing my posts here in a way that I feel is contrary to my standard posting style, as well as avoiding mixing up which account I am using to check on the game. I am using my main account to just make cursory checks and using this one when I actually am trying to be involved.

Spike

, I do not see why I should drop the nicknames currently.

Also, going to leave in a bit, please don't make things harder to handle.

[Gentleman 1]

Lady 2 (Masque), would you care to dance with me?

I’m too busy to continue reading, but I did decide to quickly survey my options and while I did not see what L1 had posted, reading Masque’s posting at a glance was enough to tell me I would likely be choosing her.

[Gentleman 1]

I would really like it if no one left at this point, we have plenty of time currently, so we should maybe try using the vote first.
Also, going to be a bit before I do it, but I should be working at getting current again today. Problem is it seems like the volume of content I need to get through has only gotten worse.

[Gentleman 1]

I hate when people refer to others as VIs

Sorry. Should I use "unporposefully/unknowingly severely anti-town but likely town" instead?

No, and I know how frustrating playing with antitown people are, but it does hurt people’s feelings and I’m a big ole softie and feel bad for them.

In that case, how would you opt to refer to those types of players?

I am not quite in the mood to deal with this game just now but I will be giving input on some things soon.

My honest feeling is that I did not miss much at this point. Still have more to read though.

Also sadly I will be dropping nicknames at this point. The amount of catching up I have to do, along with the situation with having to track who has been changing appearances, just makes it seem like something I do not want to put up with, and I don’t want to put you through it either.

[Gentleman 1]

I'm actually townreading your posts now if it helps.

Not really no. I don’t want to be townread because I whined about not being interacted with. I’m a crazy person don’t mind me.

L7 continues to post things that I find towny.

Lady 3 was my other tentative townread, given that I'm also tentatively townreading G4 I think that I'm fine with that pairing in general.

Still townreading L9. Not going to bother saying more?

Would greatly appreciate it if new G5, L6, etc., came in and played since I am starting to feel like we'll win with just a few more townreads.

Anyone can make Town reads.

What are you getting at with this comment. Also, I see your point about possible lack of randomization, but I think FakeGod is not juvenile enough to deliberately make that reference. My impression of him is actually that he is rather uptight, if I may be blunt.
Also I believe I am experiencing the same issues with our communications hub as many others have noted, as delays in my ability to post have resulted in mild interruptions twice in a row now.

Who’s FakeGod?

Did you just seriously ask me who the FakeGod is? He is the person running this game. How clueless can you be? My instinct is that this is an act, no one can be as dense as you.

[Gentleman 1]

I am not quite in the mood to deal with this game just now but I will be giving input on some things soon.

Hopefully you weren’t the slot that replaced out.
Gent 1 Slot was strong town.

I have been preoccupied, but I have not been replaced at all.
I guess it might be interesting to see how sentiment towards me has shifted as I have been absent.

I mean that's very little of the reason that I townread you.

I'm still happy with 5 being removed, even if she's town her contributions are... limited.

6? 1? Me?

I assume these questions are asking about G6’s reads on those slots?

Gent 5 should always be with Lady 2 IMO.

What do you make of my pairing currently? It is the gentleman from one of your powerhouse pairing with the lady from the other. So I wonder what you’re thinking as of now.

I strongly think L2 and T6 is an incredibly useful pairing as I have already mentioned.

I am warming to G1/L5 as a pairing as I think L5, if town, is going to be somewhat similar to me come actual game days.

Why did you think L5 was a match for me? How do you feel they are similar to you, and how did that factor in to your preference?

[Gentleman 1]

G5 being turbotown is definitely a hot take.

Sort of. G5 was pretty dang towny.

I am pretty sure this should get discussed down the line but if it did not, please explain this read. I’ll most likely be reacting to posts without any expectation for my questions to already be answered, so don’t get frustrated because of that, I’m aware of it.

How likely is it that scum will want to pair with their partners? Ive been part of a mafia/mafia lover pair in a lovers game and it was even more stressful and miserable than playing scum usually is. So my thought is they wouldn’t want it, but then someone made a post about pairing off before scum had a chance to pair off together, and now I’m wondering icky original thought makes sense. Is there some reason scum would want to pair with each other here?

Remind me to answer this after pre-dance.

If you have not yet, here is your reminder to go over this.

Lady 9, may I have this dance?

I will not hold it against you if you decline.

Yeah we can dance if you want, let me know if you want me to accept this for real and i will. Only reservation here is knowing that I'm set to die if dancing with you, but if we can set up a few pairings that I feel good about then there isn't a problem, and maybe people will be more inclined to follow through with them that way

I like this post a little, seems like the desire to solve is genuine.

[Gentleman 1]

You don't want to try and live to endgame?

I do, but I see that paranoia is starting to blossom. I'm thinking my biggest contribution to this game now would be to set up T-T pairings and then die. I'm at a point in the game where I'm able to pick and choose with Ladies I'd like to see live to the end. I'm going to be focusing on Gents now.

I mean, yeah, that's absolutely something scum might do to try to avoid giving away inside knowledge. I don't think L5 or G5 are scum but I don't think this specifically rules them out.

Can you explain why you don't think L5/G5 are scum? I'm not sure that you've talked about this before

I am definitely feeling good about the effort L9 is showing here.

G5 I just explained.

L5, I guess it's just that she's spitting out a lot of information in a way that doesn't really seem planned or controlled. It's not that there aren't people who do this as scum but most of the time that carefree, say-what-you-feel attitude is town.

L5 is posting quite a few things, yes, but I don’t get the sense that there is a lot of rhyme or reason to it. Seems like posting for the sake of it. Which I do know people have brought against me, but I am trying to use my posting as footholds here.

Ok fuck it.

Without stating reasons at this time, I think either L8 or L5 shouldnt be dancing. I may sheep L9 until I get bored. Im thinking the setup is 2L/1G right now, but guessing the scumteam at this time would be detrimental until we get pairings. I Already stated my opinion on who should get left out.

With ICs permission I will be moving towards asking someone to dance.

I hope yall are ready, Im taking the reigns of the most active gentleman in the game; ladies I hope you can handle me.

Could you expand on this post? How have your opinions expressed here evolved?

[Gentleman 1]

OH MY GOD!

This avi just will not do. I do declare that my first action will not be to make the women (and men for that matter) swoon with the absolute machismo emanating from places others have only dreamed of, but to fix this horrible avi situation.

Someone catch me up while I look. Thanks dears.

Please tell me you do not keep this schtick up. It would be quite annoying.

I think G2 should aim for talkative scum. He's conftown. If he gets paired with a scum, he forces a 1 v 1 trade. If he hits a vocal player, the hood gives information.

I felt like you had a good awareness of the current situation earlier, so why are you making suggestions for G2 after he paired already?

I'm currently fine with any of 1, 3, 5, 7 sitting out.

If this were a Sadie Hawkins dance, I'd have asked G6 out a while ago. The rest just don't impress.

Odd, why are you saying I should dance?

Why can't you find a good man here? I think G5 is definitely worth linking to.

I do like this from L6. I feel like town tend to notice these sorts of errata more frequently. This is specifically about asking why L4 think she should dance.

As for why few men appeal to me,

1 focuses on strange things, I don't think I understand him.
3 is a suspect of mine.
4 was recently replaced and hasn't done much besides roleplay.
5 might not be awful, but I don't think he's interested in me and I don't get what he's doing recently.
7 is too mechanically focused. I cannot read him.
8 is not even here.

Why do you find the things I comment on strange L4?
Truth is, I felt mildly attacked when L4 initially expressed this sentiment, I was just starting to get into things then, and it felt like she was having a problem with that. At this point, though, it burns me less.

[Gentleman 1]

I probably be scum reading your bravado if you weren’t ic

I would please ask the lovely Lady 7 to not flirt with me when I have already given my heart to another.

Here is my room key, meet me up there in 15 minutes and make sure no one sees you leave. Did you bring your dental dams?

Spoiler:

how dare you sir! I will remain pure for the prince who was promised! If he fails to show, I will go to my death unsullied. I won’t tell your lady friend about this.

Oh my. Might this be a Game of Thrones reference? Your verbiage gives me that impression.

Why THE FUCK did I read 9 ladies and 8 gentlemen last night? Lol

That means we have to atleast scumhunt in gentlemen, and oh boy thats going to be interesting.

Lady 5, while looking back, I think youre posting has been suspect, but I admit im not entirely confident youre flipping mafia. Im willing to take a chance. Ive seen some associations that make me think youre townie.

As for why you over L2, I was never intending on dancing with L2, that was a joke post.

Why did you not intend to pair with L2?

Fixing:

What's wrong with lady 3 and lady 7?

What's right with 3? For real, please tell me why everyone likes her, I don't get it.

7 has had a few posts that made me think she might be town, but a lot more neutral unmemorable ones. I don't trust her.

Hmm, I remember liking Misty's early posts, and she had more content than a lot of people at the time

If the only posts from 7 are neutral or towny, shouldn't you want them to get a dance partner? It doesn't sound like you scumread her

I just don't get it. It's like everyone else is reading different, secret L3 posts. They don't do anything for me.

My experience tells me that players with a large volume of posts that read neutral to me often turn out to be scum. The same applies to G3. In the absence of many players who feel outright scummy, this is something I'm turning to.

I haven't formed a strong opinion of you yet, but as you probably already have more posts than L1, it seems like you will at least try.

Hold on, are you leaving people out based on whether they will try, or whether you think they will flip scum? You're changing your method between posts here

Someone who's trying is easier to read. I have no illusions that I'm, for example, going to be able to get my sick pocket L7 concerns lynched today. Not even sure I want to, as more time might help. If L1 is going to continue to be useless, that's a low risk predance kill.

I’ll ask you this because of the sentiment expressed here: what do you think of me pairing with L2, rather than L1?

If there's an S-S pair in the process of happening here it is G5-L5. Neither of them is making any sense on the subject.

I feel like each has their own problems. G5 feels artificially aggressive, like he’s forcing himself to provide. L5, however, seems to be taking the reverse approach, barely providing anything that really seems of worth, mostly providing drivel.

I retract my earlier wooden feel on g7.

He’s cool.

G7 - why don’t you want to partner with someone too towny?

I don't feel like I'm too town read and what we need to win is to create as many strong T/T pairs as possible. If I'm scumread, it will potentially get someone who's well townread to die from being lynched or them leaving. I still want to pair with someone I consider town, to potentially help in solving, bit nit someone whow iso a consensus TR unless I am as well.

Why do people honestly think scum would ever pair up with scum?

Other than being a stupidly ballsy gambit, its against scum wincon, no?

If they're both town read, I think it's reasonable. But at that point we're already in trouble.

I had already been feeling decent about G7, and this post I think makes that improve. Seems to be a major team player here.

[Gentleman 1]

I think it would be good for me to have a partner early, and I think of the ladies, three is best for me.

So, my dear, I'd like to re-extend my offer.

Lady 3, dance with me?

What made you feel this way about L3?

I probably be scum reading your bravado if you weren’t ic

I would please ask the lovely Lady 7 to not flirt with me when I have already given my heart to another.

Here is my room key, meet me up there in 15 minutes and make sure no one sees you leave. Did you bring your dental dams?

Spoiler:

how dare you sir! I will remain pure for the prince who was promised! If he fails to show, I will go to my death unsullied. I won’t tell your lady friend about this.

Wonder why you used multiple allusions to GoT...

Heh I am a very big fan of the books! The first one amused me when I thought of it. The second must have just flowed subconsciously.

I see. Thank you for the moment of levity. It kind of made my day.

Please do not make me hate this game.

Hun, dont be so thin skinned

You should probably be less antagonistic.

[Gentleman 1]

L5’s recent behavior seems panicked. Not sure what alignment that makes her currently.

[Gentleman 1]

@Moderator

Does day end when a couple dies?

If not, I'm very much fine with getting rid of Gentleman 8 and Lady 5 immediately and then working through the second pair immediately after, as I don't see the status of that pair changing.

It’s better to lynch a G1/L2.
Because if G8 is Town we could lose this game.
G1 and L2 I feel have a high chance of containing 1 scum in it.
This game would be allot better if I could actually fully trust my partner and my partner actually posted something, I’m kinda sad G3 didn’t pick me.
It’s also kinda sad that G8 said in our dance chat that I’m prob scum and he may leave the dance.
LMAO.

This is the post I feel looks the worst out of L5’s outburst. The attitude around G8 just feels wrong, specifically saying him being town loses the game, and the mention of the possibility of G8 leaving gives me the sense this outburst is a political move to make herself look helpful.

[Gentleman 1]

It intrigues me that G6 seems to have selected me and only me to have a nickname for.

[Gentleman 1]

The answer is you can't

But you can give summaries

This is the correct practice when it comes to talking about posts in private threads. Direct quoting is very often considered against the rules.

That’s nice to hear G6, but it’s jarring when I am the only one to have one.

[Gentleman 1]

@Moderator

Does day end when a couple dies?

If not, I'm very much fine with getting rid of Gentleman 8 and Lady 5 immediately and then working through the second pair immediately after, as I don't see the status of that pair changing.

It’s better to lynch a G1/L2.
Because if G8 is Town we could lose this game.
G1 and L2 I feel have a high chance of containing 1 scum in it.
This game would be allot better if I could actually fully trust my partner and my partner actually posted something, I’m kinda sad G3 didn’t pick me.
It’s also kinda sad that G8 said in our dance chat that I’m prob scum and he may leave the dance.
LMAO.

This is the post I feel looks the worst out of L5’s outburst. The attitude around G8 just feels wrong, specifically saying him being town loses the game, and the mention of the possibility of G8 leaving gives me the sense this outburst is a political move to make herself look helpful.

Look Helpful how?
And Yes him being Town loses the game as scum can manipulate Town after our lynch and pull off an easy win.

It seems that you are trying to push something to look like you are actively involved. I don’t recall you holding the stance you are currently expressing on my pair ever.
If you feel that way, what do you think scum’s game plan is when your pair gets lynched?

As I side note, I had hoped to take a break for about an hour, but that looks like something that will not be happening soon.

[Gentleman 1]

I think I understand why this game has been swelling, there seems to be some severe issues of people having problems with others. I feel like my vote will end up being on the pair I find most problematic if this proves true.

[Gentleman 1]

Think about it, I’ll actually take my break now and hope that by the time I get back this has blown over so I can just soar past this mess.

[Gentleman 1]

This is quite obnoxious. This game feels more polluted than Zoness currently. Good job people, you have managed to be worse than Andross.

I think I understand why this game has been swelling, there seems to be some severe issues of people having problems with others. I feel like my vote will end up being on the pair I find most problematic if this proves true.

This is why several players have decided to push Lady 5 and Gentleman 8 at the moment.

No we're not lynching L6.

This isn't the reason why I'm pushing this pair (although it's not a reason to not push it, in my opinion).

Ok actually G3 hasn't been doing shit lately so maybe...

That's at least part of the argument.

G3 L6 isn't scum m8s

Why not?

I do note this, however. I will keep that in mind when I get back to going through this bog of a game.

[Gentleman 1]

Now that this game seems a little less chaotic I will probably start catching up again soon.

[Gentleman 1]

VOTE: Lady 2/Gentleman 1

L5/G8 is a waste of a pre-intermission lynch and makes way more sense as a first lynch poster intermission.

How is that a waste of a lynch now and not later?

[Gentleman 1]

I haven't seen any particularly toxic, anti-town, or spammy play from any player, so that, too, is encouraging. I think this game looks to be very fun at the least.

Yes, that’s a definite positive. It’s definitely been nice not waking up to 10 pages over night for sure!

It hurts me to read this now.

I scoped out all of the players because I was interested in what people were doing. You can still find profiles even if someone hasn't posted, using the member list. Lady 6 does not have an avatar.

This seems like a nothing question. I mean if you're interested in how to view their profiles sure, but sounded like you were trying to get a read off my method somehow.

It's pretty intense to go from scoping the profile pictures before the game to lurking. I think that this might be scum for that reason.
Like, they were super keen on the game but then they got a scum role PM and weren't enthusiastic about it.

How early before the game were the anonymous accounts created? The validity of this read is rather low if the account were made right before the roles were sent out.

There's some sort of stanford prison guard experiment thing going on where alot of the gentlemen are in their roles as douchey guys at a club.

Isn't anonymity wonderful?

Anonymous games are a lot of fun in general! It gets hilarious when people have bad altguesses they’re convinced of and meta off those bad alt guesses and base their reads on them.

Why do people even try using meta in games where lack of meta is the point?

Without speaking in excess, I think the dance choices affect the game in such a way that Gentleman 6's actions merit at least some sort of response, so I'll say this: I think it would behoove you, sir, to remember your previous reads on certain players and consider the weight they held then to ensure that the pool of partners you select from is not one based on a short term memory. I would implore you to consider your selection carefully, keeping as much of the game in context that you can, prior to offering your hand.

None of this is to say I particularly disagree with Lady 4 or Lady 7 as your selection, but that consideration of past experience rarely proves wasteful or inefficient.

I’m liking G4’s desire to do good I see here.

[Gentleman 1]

Why is skitter factually town when she hasn't posted all game

Why is Lady 1 factually town*

I hope this is not serious. If it is, why are you doing this?

Anyways,

unless Lady 1 got replaced ~I think when that slot starts posting its going to rise in priority and I want to pinch the pools to force bad pairings for scum?

I am curious how this effrontery to force scum into bad pairings went. My sense is it failed. I have not seen one iota of planning in pairings.

I would just love it if we could not do alt guesses at all. Meta is a shifty beast in the first place, and vastly worse here. Also, for the spirit of the game.

I agree that trying to find mains breaks the spirit of of the game, and that is my biggest issue with it. Meta is also messy but it can be useful. The problem is it being useful is why it is being pulled from us this game.

7 why don't you think pairing with 6 is optimal for you?

There’s *something* I question his motives for. He didn’t seem inclined to talk to me much which makes me think interaction wouldn’t be that great. If he wants someone who can be obvtown, that’s fine I’ve never had a problem doing that, that’s fine, but I worry that we’ll end up being unproductive if I’m correct in my understanding of how he reads the game and gets reads. Too waffly people sometimes end up with nothing concrete.

I feel like the common thread with G6 is that he is quite mercurial. His opinions have seemed extremely flexible. I don’t believe it scummy but it is rather obnoxious.

[Gentleman 1]

Has G1 just realized what G4 has been doing?

This is interesting, what is the meaning of this? It makes it sound as if G4 has been up to no good.

Now sure why G1 posted the first post he did.
He complaining that it’s spammy and toxic?
Why would he bring this up now of all times?
If he is trying to shade me he is doing really bad at it.

If I was to pick someone who is responsible for creating the situation we had right now, it would not be you currently, but G6. It feels like he is driving this forever train currently.

I would also like to thank G3 for answer my question there.

[Gentleman 1]

There's some sort of stanford prison guard experiment thing going on where alot of the gentlemen are in their roles as douchey guys at a club.

Here comes ladies White Knight riding in to save them. I'm sure you're really just a nice guy and only if girls could see that they'd stop running around with all those Chads.

I’m just going to say this to you straight: get off reddit. In addition, it does not matter how trustworthy your motives are, that does not assure anyone that your bravado matches your actual capabilities. And if you’re going to make comments like, “you’re playing checkers while I’m playing chess”, I do not think you are going to get very far. Everyone here is playing mafia, and people respond better to proper arguments, rather than mindless ego stroking.

Can we please stop with the altguesses? It would really suck if he started force replacing due to it.

No RC, we cant.

Can you tell me what just shouting names at people does? Let’s say you are right about someone. Do you think anyone you have any idea about has meta that would help sort them?

Gentleman 5 would help with pushing my scum Reads but I’d have trouble trusting him at least in the beginning as he’s not my Lock Town where I can say with 100% confidence that Gentleman 3 is Town.
Me and Him can share are Reads and make stronger solving.

This reads to me as something I would say in a scum PT. Like something I would ask my scumbuddies before accepting the proposal. Given her hesitance, It makes me wonder.

I think L8 is mafia, I dont think L5 can be mafia with L8 given their interactions imo, so I may have to check into my reads of both.

L5 are you just going to ignore this as well?

I am starting to warm up to you. Can you possibly give a reason for your posting that felt excessively aggressive from before?

Oooooooooh I thought I explained this one!

Did you? I don't think it's normal for scum to post reads in the scum PT as though they really believe them.

I periodically will write false reads down in places besides the main thread as mafia, to psych myself into believing them more.

[Gentleman 1]

I’ll laugh if g4 and l8 are scum together and g4 manipulated g6 away from town and to his partner.

Why would that be funny? That would just be good play by G4.

You know, for 44 pages in, there seems to be alot of uncertainty for reads.

I mean, theres a reason/excuse I, G2, and maybe one or two other have, but the rest of yall idk what to think.

I assume this excuse would be not being in the game for as long?

Hello. I am glad to arrive at this ball. Will a smashing gentleman steal my heart?

I'm a watt?

This is just too good. Well played, both of you.

I'm afraid not. Older Harry is a Joule of my eye.

Time to get cracking. Will someone talk to me so I am not rambling alone in the late night hours?

L6 can you give me the purpose of the above please. I dont see it, they look “flowery, pointless posts, or spam”

I had felt something off with that statement, specifically with the shuddering posts on the same page, but this is also valid.

Maybe I'm reading too much into it but L9's thread presence disappearing after pairing up with IC is v townie.

I would very much love if you walked me through your perspective here. I don’t see why disappearing would make someone look better in this situation.

[Gentleman 1]

Can we get an F in chat for G1 who looks to be rereading the entire game.

I am not rereading the game. I am reading thing I was not present for for the first time.

I posted in the PT as well, just a heads up.

[Gentleman 1]

1024 is a joke.

Can you reclarify what your question to 1054 is?

I will try to pinpoint where it was again, but I feel like for a little bit your attitude was a bit overly antagonistic.

[Gentleman 1]

Everything you've done today seems to come out of emotional response to the fact that you've been called out multiple times by multiple people. You don't seem to be aware of yourself, in control of your posting, your thoughts aren't congruent, there is little or no discernable process, direction, or purpose behind your posts other than to lash out at the people who have called you out. Hence, reactionary.

Look dudes, this chick scumreads me. Rather than ask why or look at the posts she found offensive, I'll just call her crazy and emotional.

If you have trouble understanding why I form the reads I have, how can you be confident their reactionary or emotional? Your posting towards me today has been gaslighting and discrediting rather than intending to solve my alignment.

I think it's beyond evident that I have done more than my part in research. I also don't find myself to be lacking in understanding as far what your reads are.

I haven't gaslighted you and I doubt that simply using big words to attempt to discredit me will get you very far. You've made multiple posts that show a remarkable lack of awareness of game state and positions, and several of your posts have said that things have happened that have specifically not happened. I highly recommend you re-examine your perspective.

I recommend you go die. Neither of us is getting what we want.

The closest I came today to an error in perspective is when I misread a question from L7 as involving you and not G3.

Until you put your reads in the thread, we have nothing more to say to each other, you repugnant toad.

I’ll state G4’s argument here is pretty lame, but this was uncalled for.

G1?

Who do you like from the people below him?

Oh I ask because G1 was a bit of a conundrum for me. I liked some of his posts, but his quotestripe posts didn't felt kinda commenting to comment on things, which isn't in itself scummy because most everyone does it sometimes, but since it was mostly that one posting spree that I remember, I didn't get enough to get a feel for whether it was actually alignment indicative.

I appreciate the awareness displayed here. I have noticed “posting just to post” being commonly used, it feels like it might be a new buzzword. So deciding to write a cheap idea like that off seems towny.

G1, G7, and G8 are not active gentlemen. L1 isnt really here either.

G2 - L9
G3 ???
G4 - L3
G5 - L4/L5
G6 - L8/L7?

Assuming I get my salad on and G6 would change to L7, I would personally want to see G3 take L2

That leaves the inactive Gs with L1, L5, and L6 and L8

(If G6 takes L8, then G3 should take L7 and then it would be L1,2,5,6.)

Can we agree or work on this format for now?

This is the best attempt I have seen to create any sort of game plan up to here. I like it quite a lot.

[Gentleman 1]

I would rather leave out L2 than L5, I think L5 would be easier to read in the future.

I’d like it if you talked about this at some point.

I'm reading. I'm trying to commit to at least one catchup a day.

Whatever disregard correct play dance with the hottest girl.

Lady 8, will you dance with me?

I accept.

I am curious, as well as mildly concerned, about the fact L8 has to catch up yet is perfectly fine pairing and is conscious of the ability to pair at this point.

Can we please stop with the altguesses? It would really suck if he started force replacing due to it.

Not sure why G5 is being extremely aggro.

Also, I'm not really a big fan of L5 postings.

Honestly, theres alot I could say about L5 not accepting the proposal.

I thought she would have accepted that asap since people scumread her and probably have her pinned as a first target.

Im not sure how that makes me feel ie her alignment

Do people still scum read me for emojis? XD or something else?

Is this LAMIST? Also, I'm at like page 45 and wondering why G5 is ignoring all these questions.

L5* My bad.

I do like this examination into L5, though. Who, as I write this, is filling the game with meaningless drivel.

[Gentleman 1]

While it is on my mind, I would like to note something else questionable.

Gentleman 2 has posted in another game and is being replaced.

The moderator directly called out the fact it was G2 who was replaced here. So it baffles me that L5 is surprised by this fact. Again, I doubt L5 is this bad at remembering things, so I think it is an act.

[Gentleman 1]

I think G3 and L6 should pair.

What chemistry did you see in those two?

I am only responding to this because I am feeling rather worn out, I feel like I have made a modicum of progress, hopefully the thread doesn’t just swell in size again to kill my good feeling. In addition it seems like L2 is not on currently, and the biggest thing I wanted to do was talk with her in the PT a little. We did manage to talk to make that clear, but since she seems to have left me being around currently isn’t as important.

[Gentleman 1]

You doubt that Lady 5 of all people in this game has trouble remembering something?

I feel like I wouldn't be surprised if she forgot her phone number.

To me it seems like she has selective recall. She seems to pick and choose what to remember, and it seems like is consistently choosing to forget rather important things.

[Gentleman 1]

The purpose of this selective recall, in my opinion, is to generate a plausible deniability to ignore anything at will in the future.

[Gentleman 1]

I think G3 and L6 should pair.

What chemistry did you see in those two?

I am only responding to this because I am feeling rather worn out, I feel like I have made a modicum of progress, hopefully the thread doesn’t just swell in size again to kill my good feeling. In addition it seems like L2 is not on currently, and the biggest thing I wanted to do was talk with her in the PT a little. We did manage to talk to make that clear, but since she seems to have left me being around currently isn’t as important.

She was complaining about you before so what’s exactly going on between you two?

She had asked me some questions and I was being slow on answering them. I feel like that issue should be cleared up now, and we can start a proper back and forth soon.

[Gentleman 1]

OH NOW I KNOW WHO IT IS BASED ON YOUR APPROACH.

Fuck your lynch all anime avatars approach honestly.

Is this addressed towards L5? What makes you think that is her approach? It makes little sense to me based on her own avatar.

[Gentleman 1]

I honestly thought you meant make it to end game in the other sense of the word and I was very confused.

Why would you think G3 was claiming scum? That is the only other way I can see to interpret what he said.

[Gentleman 1]

And comments like those throw me for a loop because I really don't know where the town as a whole stands on me and that's vital information before I pair.

Pedit: did you not read what I just said

Looking at what G3 has been doing here, I get the sense they are scum. He seemed pretty driven early, but are at this point, it seems like he is way too concerned about his standing, and it feels like he is dressing it up in a way to not look too negative.

[Gentleman 1]

In addition, how comfortable are you in your scum game? If you could have paired with any of the gentlemen prior to them making the matches they have now, who would you have chosen? If your answer is Gentleman 2, please also include your second choice.

For a second I saw this post and had the concern that G4 has not been really following through on his questions but I remembered that was not the case on the last page.

I shouldn't have signed up as a gentleman honestly, if I play again I won't.

I don't see what the rush is?

What makes you regret signing up as a Gentleman in specific?

In addition, I keep seeing G6 throwing his full weight behind trying to get me out and it makes me very concerned about his motives. As far as I am aware this idea of getting rid of my pair is rather recent. I also do not recall seeing much before the large push in the way of sentiment against me, my partner, or my pairing. Now, however, it seems like everyone is going full volume with attempts to get rid of us. It makes me distrust those efforts very much. My biggest issue is G6 in particular aiming to remove the G8/L5 pairing from discussion. I do not trust that at all, and if my pair goes I want that pair gone the next chance that comes.

[Gentleman 1]

Gentleman 3, is there a reason you haven't proposed yet?

- because I don't like making decisions
- because I think pairs should be widely agreed on
- because I want to pair with someone who wants to pair with me, and only L5 has expressed interest, and I have thought about asking her but have not yet come to a conclusion

Who are you thinking of proposing to, if anyone?

Depends on how people read me, which I really don't have that clear of a picture on. If people feel good about me I'd want one of my townreads (probably L5 or L7); if I'm going to be mislynched anyway, I would not want to drag them down and would instead try to pair with scum/lynchbait.

You ain’t going to be miss lynched on my watch.
I’ll defend the you.
Although what we could do is form a 2 Way.
Like maybe pair with a Lady other then me you Town Read.
I’ll go with Gent 5 as he’s a strong town player.
My suggestion is to go with L2 or L8 as they are both scum players.
That way if we can end up with a Strong Town Tower, we should win easy.
Of course this all assuming Gent 5 is willing to agree with me on you being Town.

Oh welp then I’ll just go try hard solve mode with Gent 3.

This sequence raises some red flags for me. I don’t like L5 suddenly coming in acting like she is saving the day here. There is also the fact that the first post just feels out of place from L5. My final issue is that I do not believe there was any genuine attempt to make this pairing happen despite it seeming like it was the thing L5 wanted. I think G3 and L5 may both be scum together, and they did not want to pair because they were not at all confident they could make the double scum pairing work.

That pairing has deepwolf potential (ie, isn't an endgame pairing) but also isn't an immediate lynch contender.

If it actually had deepwolf potential, would you really think it was that evident, and something you could clearly announce should not make endgame?

[Gentleman 1]

L5 is the only person who's put an ounce of thought into what will happen after I pair.

Everyone else refuses to do it and is just saying "make a decision already" without telling me how they will respond to what decision I make, as though I don't deserve to know that in order to factor it into my decision.

What you talk about here and in your other posts on the same page tell me L5 seemed like a great match for you. So why would you not pick her? Actually, I can figure that out myself: you didn’t think that would reflect well on you. Well maybe it would not have, but grandstanding about the situation reflects worse than that would, that I can be sure of.

(if he pairs with L5, hes getting speedlynched tomorrow)

Orly?

L5 is the only person who's put an ounce of thought into what will happen after I pair.

Everyone else refuses to do it and is just saying "make a decision already" without telling me how they will respond to what decision I make, as though I don't deserve to know that in order to factor it into my decision.

Which, btw, is something I know L5 won't do.

I am concerned that G3 seems extra concerned about how he’s being read and wants to gauge how his potential partner is being read too

This is, or should be, the entire point of pairing. Townreads with townreads, nulls with nulls, scumreads with scumreads, then eliminate them generally from the bottom up.

But there's no consensus on me. And nobody is endeavoring to form one. They're trying to use my pair to determine their read on me, which is backwards.

Then ask L5??????????

This is stalling, you know it, I know it. Theres over 50 pages of information, you should have some semblence of who to pick at this point.

I think there is a reason why you havent picked L5.

Is it because you dont townread her, or because you both are scum?

G5 being so matched with me in how we view this makes me feel just that much better about my beliefs. I recall G6 throwing some hate his way as well, so I definitely get the sense the mafia at this point are just {G3, L5, G6}.

[Gentleman 1]

I would like to see my primary suspects of L5 and G3 go before I consider actually working on G6. My feelings about G6 are rather predicated on my perspective of the game being right, so if it is wrong I don’t want to do so much damage that the game probably goes down the drain. Which is what likely happens if I scratch and claw for G6 to go.

[Gentleman 1]

Or, you know, make stupid guesses and ad hoc modifications to support your preconception. Your choice.

Chill hes obviously rereading, despite what he says

I consider the term “rereading” factually incorrect. I am reading the game for the first time. Yes it may be a good term to describe it to you because you have read it, but I have not and from my perspective it is wrong.

That aside, I am really just rather frustrated because I feel like I’ve been painted into a corner where G6 has taken away any sort of attempt to get out of the hole he has put me in. That is probably the real thing that makes me think scum are all against me, this insurmountable wall of vitriol being shoved in my face.

[Gentleman 1]

[quote="In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p11380130]post 3644[/url], Gentleman 6"][quote="In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p11380119]post 3640[/url], Gentleman 5"]G5 being so matched with me in how we view this makes me feel just that much better about my beliefs. I recall G6 throwing some hate his way as well, so I definitely get the sense the mafia at this point are just {G3, L5, G6}.[/quote]

notice that

scum are both pushing the agenda that i'm scum all of a sudden

because they realize there is no path to endgame without killing me via lynch[/quote]
I think my best defense to this idea is that I took way too long to do anything here. If I were scum do you think I wait until the walls are closing in to start to make my move? No, I act when I see the signs, not just because it serves me better, but because I have more intel gathering potential with my two scumbuddies. Another thing is if I was scum why do I devote myself to catching up in the way I have? As scum I would have avenues out of that problem and I could likely do it without anyone blinking at me doing it.

[Gentleman 1]

Ignoring L8, who else is against you G1?

L5 and G6 are the ones I have most noticed, but G3 is there as well. I also remember one other person involved but maybe I just am taking G3 as two distinct people because I wasn’t tracking their movements then.

[Gentleman 1]

G6, if you are town, I don’t see scum killing you ever. I think you have demonstrated wild thought processes that make you an asset to them. Your best course of action if you are town is to take a step back and stop trying to control everything, because at this point I think you are bringing this game down.

[Gentleman 1]

G5 being so matched with me in how we view this makes me feel just that much better about my beliefs. I recall G6 throwing some hate his way as well, so I definitely get the sense the mafia at this point are just {G3, L5, G6}.

notice that

scum are both pushing the agenda that i'm scum all of a sudden

because they realize there is no path to endgame without killing me via lynch

I think my best defense to this idea is that I took way too long to do anything here. If I were scum do you think I wait until the walls are closing in to start to make my move? No, I act when I see the signs, not just because it serves me better, but because I have more intel gathering potential with my two scumbuddies. Another thing is if I was scum why do I devote myself to catching up in the way I have? As scum I would have avenues out of that problem and I could likely do it without anyone blinking at me doing it.

It's not inspiring much confidence to see your best defense be that you're playing too badly to be scum :/ people who play poorly as Town can play mediocrely as scum too

As scum I would have a support network. This entire situation is like a dogfight. If I were scum, my teammates would act as my wingmen and cover me when I am having issues. But that has not been the case. I seem to be largely on my own here.

Honestly, if you don’t trust me here, just leave. It spares me having to try to make up all the ground I have lost up to this point, and saves everyone else the distraction. I would do it myself but I trust you still so I don’t want to screw things up. I just ask that people actually get rid of the G8/L5 pairing when mine goes, regardless of which way it happens. I don’t think that pair has any reason to stay around, G8 has done nothing and L5 is a train wreck worse than the Macbeth supply depot.

[Gentleman 1]

The only reason someone should leave is if they absolutely do not trust their partner to be town. Otherwise I feel like the disservice to your partner makes it the wrong move.

[Gentleman 1]

G2 what’s your opinion on this whole deal? You’re the confirmed town so you should have an opinion. But as far as I can tell you have voted G5 with no reason and expressed very little recently in the way of stances. I think I would rather you have kept being arrogant if it meant you would actually help the game out here.

[Gentleman 1]

Well not only do I have really strong ideas about one person’s identity, I have them about two people.

[Gentleman 1]

I really do not want to predicate actual gameplay on who I think someone is but I think I might. G6’s probable identity makes me have a very strong feeling that he is town, despite his grip job the game being something that will likely kill it for town.

[Gentleman 1]

G5 please point out which post you believe should be my cutoff point directly because at this point I think I am well grounded in what has and is happening but I still want to attempt my due diligence. I started reading and I’m not going to stop until I’m certain the job has been done right.

[Gentleman 1]

G5 please point out which post you believe should be my cutoff point directly because at this point I think I am well grounded in what has and is happening but I still want to attempt my due diligence. I started reading and I’m not going to stop until I’m certain the job has been done right.

TBH when the new G8 comes in, I hope he makes an amazing case on you and convinces the entire playerlist to vote you including your own mafia members.

I really do not want to start crafting suicide pacts but if you want to go low I might just go low too.

[Gentleman 1]

G5 please point out which post you believe should be my cutoff point directly because at this point I think I am well grounded in what has and is happening but I still want to attempt my due diligence. I started reading and I’m not going to stop until I’m certain the job has been done right.

Theres a post where I ask G6 to explain why hes ignoring me.

Right around then is where he blows a gasket. Stop there.

Can you give the post number? I need to know if I have passed it already.

[Gentleman 1]

Before G6 leaves I would like to call out that I feel several players have been rather uninvolved in the proceedings recently. I want to try a more direct call out soon.

[Gentleman 1]

I will work on catching up more another day but I will be reading the current events. Current impressions are that L9 and L5 are probably worth suspicion.

[Gentleman 1]

The team is probably this:
G7, G1 and one of L6/L9.

Oopsie me.
Looks like mafia will vote me now because they scared.

This is a rather cheap tactic, pre-emptively discrediting any votes on them with the idea that the scum agenda is to vote them.

[Gentleman 1]

L5 is obsessed with enforcing her story of how the game is working. Narrative pushing will be promptly shot down if I have anything to say about it.
VOTE: Lady 5
Another point against her is how much she is talking about how G8 is not doing anything. That seems like a sort of guilty conscience-based mindset where she is most likely thinking, “why can’t my partner be around to make me not have to work so hard to preserve my pairing?”

[Gentleman 1]

Bleh not gonna lie. I’ve lost some interest in this game. On the one hand I’m super happy I’m so overly invested in the game that the anti-town shenanigans of first dance cost us 4 town in the worst way possible, but on the other hand it’s extremely demotivating especially when nobody is behaving obviously town. There’s no touchstone here, I have concerns I’m not in a t/t pair which gives me no real reason to fight, and the only other person I know is town is only by virtue of the mid telling me so, but he’s the most useless ICs I’ve ever seen. I thought maybe he, and l9, were holding back to escape the nightkill, but they both entered today with useless posts at best.

The l5/g8 team needs to go for on the one hand not doing shit and on the other for contribution. Some of the contribution is put terrible when you can understand it, but so much of it’s been so distracting. One thing I do not like right now is acting like l9 cannot be suspected and g7 is scum for being concerned that the ic pair didn’t die because l9 is scum. But a lot of l5’s thoughts are super surface, which might represent her level of play rather than scum? IDK.

Why isn’t l9 scum? Come on people, her approach to the game is so scum motivated it’s ridiculous. Starts off strong with some analytical posts early day one and then floats on the laurels of early town reads for the rest of the game. How is this town? How is this above suspicion? I also don’t like her post today, mostly in the part where she feels the need to include her being young oerslective. It’s like no shit, you don’t need to qualify that but sometimes scum do. Also if g1 is scum, she poo-pooed my earlier read on g1 for posting to post. Look at her beginning of first dance hop onto g5, which seemed to be sleeping g6 predance rather than any kind of assessment of her own.

So what is town about her? I don’t see it. Also if there are five pairs left and she confidently likes l6/g3, what that Piet should have said is she’s willing to tear through the last three pairs because they contain all the pairs. So why specifically say your taking a hard eye in 7-7. Kinda makes me think we’re actually a town town pair she needs to get rid of.

I don’t get the town reads in g3 either really. He just feels like scum. I hate him not trying to read his partner and just saying well g6 called her town so it’s his fault if we lose cuz of that.

Not sure about l6. I’m not overly suspicious there, but I don’t know how much this is g6 really vouching there, but I wouldn’t be surprised if she flips scum.

G1 just really overall looks like scum. A lot a lot of his posts are just posting. And hey you know what I do this too, it’s not scum indicative in a vacuum, but a lot of empty posting that says nothing and just comments is a concern, especially when you’re perpetually 2000 posts behind. Like, if you’re town figure out a different method cuz this one isn’t working. That on top of getting pissy because people are pointing out his empty posts and acting like it’s some buzzword instead of a manner of scumhunting that’s been around since the inception of mafia is terrible. I especially did not like this post:

Before G6 leaves I would like to call out that I feel several players have been rather uninvolved in the proceedings recently. I want to try a more direct call out soon.

Mostly because he wasn’t trying to stop the shit from happening, so why be planning to call people out? He made a post which said people should only leave if they suspect their partners, but that’s it. Hi pocrisy isn’t a scumtell, but this just reads wrong. I do like some things that g1 posts, but he feels like scum in a vacuum.

I don’t have a tangible reason to think g7 is scum, some of it is just a flat tone and sometimes the sense that sometimes he’s posting what he thinks town him would post, but that one is difficult to be confident about without knowing the main.

So that’s where I’m at, a big fat no place. I don’t know how g6 thought so many people were being obvtown here. I’m not sure if it’s because I’m super rusty, or if obvtown has become such a useless commodity these days p, but I just don’t see it. And normally, I’d step in and try to be a guide, but it’s difficult when you’re tethered to someone you’re not sure is town. Right now I’m trying to figure out if I should try to get a scum lynch or if I should leave. It’s weird.

Anyway it’d be really nice if the town in this town started acting like it.

I apologize for not really doing too much to call out those inactive people like I wanted to before, but there’s a reason I said what I did. I knew I was operating on limited to make the statement I wanted to. I was hoping maybe doing that would help G6 hit the brakes, even though I was pretty sure it wouldn’t. That supply train was already on a crash course for the depot.

As for my commentary, it’s actually my way of demonstrating to myself that my catch up is making progress. I noted that it was feeling ineffective at one point before, that was because tracking the page counts from time to time I noticed the gap was not shrinking. So it keeps me from feeling hopeless about my efforts. I do mean it when I say it is a rather cheap-feeling reason to scumread me. A lot of those have seemed to surface during my years of playing mafia and that is probably the most recent one I have noticed.

On to other points, L2 mentioned wanting to reread but hasn’t done anything about that yet. I also see L5 just straight up lost her mind. I might be having a confirmation bias situation but that meltdown really feels like it comes from scum with how indignant it seems. It feels like such a selfish reaction to not having G8 around. I feel like town would be upset there was an empty slot at all, but L5 made it all about her. Also, TSE definitely should not be posting now and I foresee some pretty severe punishment if he doesn’t. FakeGod doesn’t fool around, I believe.

[Gentleman 1]

I have already done a quick scan of what has happened since I was last here, and I feel like I should try to think things over more. I definitely feel like scum were primarily in the background during first dance. My prime suspects regarding this are L9 and G7 currently.
UNVOTE:
I think G7’s vote is rather concerning, why would he be interested in a double town flip when that puts the game in do-or-die mode? In fact the more I think on this the more I feel like lynching those two is a mistake.

[Gentleman 1]

VOTE: Gentleman 7
I looked over what he has done and it looks quite lackluster. Specifically I noticed he seemed to be fanning the flames with the G6 + G5 situation before quickly bowing out, and, as already noted, he also shifted from his more likely town scum pair to his more likely double town pair, for a reason that rather awful at this stage of the game.

I would also like if someone who has been paying more attention could tell me who else seemed to be avoiding messing with the game’s direction during first dance.

[Gentleman 1]

I really feel like we are past due for something to happen and at this point I feel like I am the one who has to make things happen.

I think a handful of people have expressed real suspicion of L2, can anyone who has speak up about why? I feel like leaving is the best way to set things off in the right direction and because of that I want to pursue this lead that feels rather untouched despite my pair being put on the chopping block for a long time. I have seen people pushing my pair and me but not L2, at least not to any real degree. Her name has been thrown out but not really discussed to much I believe.

I intend to remain awake for probably three or four hours but expect some motion or significant response to my ideas within one or two. We are over halfway to the end and nothing has been done. That needs to change.

[Gentleman 1]

Having surveyed the situation a little, it looks like the gears are in motion for things to happen but I want to speed things up a little. I want anyone present currently to bring up their biggest concern that they feel has not been adequately addressed regarding the gamestate.

Also to take things down to a lower level, I am rather baffled by what G7 is doing with G3. It looks like G7 is arguing G3’s play has not been geared towards survival? First, that is absolutely wrong, second, what is the point of arguing that idea? I assume G7 thinks G3 is scum, but in that case why is G7 arguing G3 has not been trying to survive when that would likely benefit the case?

[Gentleman 1]

Who should i sheep and why?

Someone vie for my patronage.

Please talk with me because I am feeling like something is very wrong currently. What do you think of L9 currently? My honest impression is she has been pushing some rather scum motivated agendas lately.

[Gentleman 1]

I feel like your vote would probably be good on G7 for reasons I have already brought up. I think the G3/L6 pair could be sketchy as well but have not taken as hard of a look at those two. I don’t know if I have an answer to why you should trust me or if that is even relevant. I feel like what is more important is clearing the stale air out.

I asked about gamestate concerns that have felt unanswered, do you have any G2?

[Gentleman 1]

I've been trying to work with you here

Alright, you say this now so why are you brushing him off in the PT? Seems like you aren’t using your communication channels to the best of your abilities.

[Gentleman 1]

Hm. Did she seem annoyed that people were scumreading your slot or just general "you aren't around" complaining?

Both. There was a fair share of "You gonna get me lynched!" and a fair share of "I can't win without a partner to help convince people!"

New lady 5 has come to pretty much the same headspace I'm at though, afaict. We haven't talked much there, but they seem to agree wrt G3/G7 interactions.

I decided to start digging through things I have not looked at in depth yet and this is one of the first things I found. Can you talk about those things you say L5 has been doing? Those match my initial impressions of her behaviors so the fact you say that is how she has been in the PT as well makes me feel like I was wrong to call off the charge against her.

[Gentleman 1]

Could no one leave for the next 12 hours while I get my feets underneath me? Please and thank you!

I am going to use this post as my timer for the time until I decide what to do. So anyone who is online, please come talk if you have ideas, concerns, questions, or anything else that might help.

[Gentleman 1]

You are wrong about G7's position on G3 by the way G1.

G7 is town reading G3 for spurious reasons, which G3 pointed out, and then G7 was like oh you're right but here's how it still makes you town...

Thank you for helping with this, now the situation makes more sense though I do think G7 is pretty suspect for this having not done any real background on this.

Also, L7 and L9, I would like it if you answered my general question to everyone.

[Gentleman 1]

Knowing that I will probably step out next phase because we wont die

bro...

Ok, i looked at the op for a minute to get my bearings.

How many people do we have alive?

We have 10 people alive. No one has died this phase. That is why I am pushing so hard for something to happen, no deaths equals no flips, no progress, and a greater time problem. I find it ironic that I am having to deal with this because I was actually on the opposite side of a similar situation when I engaged Star Fox on Fichina. Records say it happened at Fortuna but I think there was a mix-up.

[Gentleman 1]

I would like to note I feel like L9 raises a good point about how L7 has been positioning herself regarding leaving, but I also feel like L2 has done a bit of that herself, which is kind of why I feel like I should leave.

[Gentleman 1]

G8/L5 has even more strikes against it than it did before, and it already had too many
G2/L9 probably would have died had L9 been town and L9 has not been impressive anyway
G1/L2 definitely can't live.

G7/L7 is the only other pair I would consider letting live, and they should probably be the other final pair apart from us.

I agree with this quite a bit, and the only thing that would change my mind on this is if L5/G8 flips T/T.
VOTE: Lady 5

I'm kind of getting a bit paranoid of L7 myself, but I'm not sure if this is something that could come from scum to have her flip between scumreading me and then taking it back soon after. I firmly believe G3 is town, L5 is actually probably town but I think that pair shouldn't stick around until the end and out of the remaining people, they should probably go first.

G1/L2 should go as well, but I feel more confident that they will flip T/S in some way, while this might flip T/T, and is going to be more impactful on the game if that happens.

????????

G7, what you do if L5/G8 flips T-T, explain now

I am VERY not sure about the push for G8/L5 to be the first lynch in this phase. And I'm more than a little paranoid that just as there's some light at the end of the tunnel with regard to old!L5 being a rule-breaking mess and G8 being unresponsive - just as there's a chance they might become readable - there are a lot of players saying "well of course G1/L2 and G8/L5 both need to go, L5/G8 definitely goes first".

VOTE: Gentleman 1/Lady 2

I went back to around where I left off, and this makes me think L2 is a little less suspect, the position regarding the near certain lynching of our pair and G8/L5 seems more of a town one.

Also I’d like to mention I have little idea about what endgame should be but after another pair flips that likely changes.

[Gentleman 1]

I would like to note I feel like L9 raises a good point about how L7 has been positioning herself regarding leaving, but I also feel like L2 has done a bit of that herself, which is kind of why I feel like I should leave.

Look I said I would leave tonight before i went to bed if there was no movement. Lady 2 asked me not to yet, and more importantly G8 asked for 12 hours.

I said fine, we can figure it out in the morning.

How either of you is jumping to that being scum is wayyyyyyyyy beyond me.

Waiting is one thing, but it really seems you are trying to adjust your read on your partner so you don’t have to follow through.

[Gentleman 1]

Leaving the dance

HAVE FUN SUCKAS

I was about to quote a post of yours explaining how you are positioning the way I think you are, but you ended up proving me wrong. I will probably hold my thoughts until this resolves.

[Gentleman 1]

Should it be taking this long for the flip to happen? Normal it seems like FakeGod comes on around this time and does things.

[Gentleman 1]

I'm very disappointed that you all pushed Lady 7 to leave the dance.

Why should I feel ashamed when we have our first scum flip of the game? What is so bad about what happened? Either L7 left or we vote that pair out, those are the only ways to take care of G7.

Anyway, I need to think more on the situation but my doomsday clock is stopped now. Base impressions from the flip are that G3/L6 pair might be suspect, and that I should work on figuring out L9 quickly.

[Gentleman 1]

Why should I feel ashamed when we have our first scum flip of the game? What is so bad about what happened? Either L7 left or we vote that pair out, those are the only ways to take care of G7.

Because G3/L6 was a superior lynch first.

Lady 7 was obviously town and neither of those two are.

You probably do have a point, before I worked myself into a frenzy I did have L7 as town, and with regards to the situation I noted earlier about scum standing back, I feel like both G3 and L6 fit that mold to some extent. But I think it could be possible flipping G3/L6 might lead down a rabbit hole if it comes before flipping G7, but now that we have G7’s scum flip I think that points pretty solidly to there being scum in G3/L6.
VOTE: G3/L6
I am going to put my money where my mouth is here.

[Gentleman 1]

I'm reasonably confident that removing this pairing and the IC pairing wins the game.

Gentleman 8 is likely town due to how he interacted with me in our PT.
Lady 2 is obviously town.
Gentleman 1's trajectory on Gentleman 7 is quite town now that I look back on it.

Lady 6's contributions since I entered the game are incredibly lackluster and have the same bad feel as Gentleman 7's did.
Lady 9 looks terrible after this Lady 7 push.
Gentleman 3 is either playing very strangely or is trying to carry a deadweight town to endgame for his team.

The path looks quite clear in my eyes.

My one objection here currently is that I do not feel as confident as you do that L9’s push of L7 was suspect. Had L7’s pair flipped double town I would wholeheartedly agree, but there is the question in my mind of the fact L9 pushed town paired with scum to leave.

[Gentleman 1]

L9 certainly does not win by being the last scum alive, at this point that seems like a no-win situation for her. So considering that it seems like a bad move to get rid of one of the people who could carry that burden for her.

[Gentleman 1]

Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [3] - Lady 7, Lady 5, Gentleman 7

G7 voting here seems to soft clear it a bit, no?

I think if we are looking to soft clear anyone based on G7’s voting patterns the G8/L5 pair is a better option. G7 subtly brought that pair to L-1, which I noticed and decided to remove my vote because of. Had I not noticed that there was a definite chance that pair could have been lynched rather unceremoniously.

[Gentleman 1]

L9 certainly does not win by being the last scum alive, at this point that seems like a no-win situation for her. So considering that it seems like a bad move to get rid of one of the people who could carry that burden for her.

Gentleman 7 was unlikely to endgame even before that point, not with the amount of heat on him that he had.

The scumteam needs to try to bring another player to endgame.

Who really suspected G7 before I did, honestly? I think at least during this phase I was the first one to really point the finger that direction.

[Gentleman 1]

So it seems like unless the team is literally L9 and L2 one of G8/L5 has to be scum. That doesn’t mean I am going to vote yet, I want to see L5 and G8 chime in if they have not recently. Also I am curious why L2 seems to be completely out of consideration. I have been getting a large amount of radio silence in the PT recently compared to first dance. Maybe with the fact endgame is here L2 does not feel as much a need to work with me now.

I will participate more later but I have a spare minute so might as well use it.

[Gentleman 1]

I do not believe I have said anything revolutionary in there, but it felt like you were the main one driving the conversation in first dance, and in second dance that has felt reversed quite a bit. So just chatting in there would probably help alleviate my concerns.

[Gentleman 1]

uhh, I think Gent 8 is much more likely to be scum than Lady 5 though

Why does this matter? They are both paired together.

[Gentleman 1]

Since we know that both of G7's scumpartners are in his scum-pairing lists, suddenly G1 is close to confirmed scum just based on how the two of them keep talking to each other.

I think it's quite likely that they were specifically playing to have one of the two endgame after the other flips.

My main question is how G7 expects to win in the case that it's on him to carry the game, considering he has to pivot away from his specific plan or he's at a severe disadvantage when it's just his pairing and G3/L6.

It seems like your perspective here is that I wanted to be townread for pushing G7. I want you to take a look at my approach following G7’s flip and tell me if that is still what you believe. Because I feel that is strong evidence you have the wrong impression here.

[Gentleman 1]

It means I feel like I clearly was not trying to take credit for his flip. To make this clear, by the way, I will not take a response of “you did not want to look too blatant about it” or something similar kindly, at least from L5, because that does not seem to be the thinking she is going with here.

[Gentleman 1]

That is the most I really talked about that, and I never brought up anything about clearing me for that.

Now that you bring that post back up, I see something questionable in the post I responded to there. L5, you seem to have already formed your impression on how the G7 flip implicates me at that point. So I would like to ask why you only cared to bring it up at this point specifically? Something tells me you are scum who wanted to control the lynch order and as such did not bring up a point that town would likely mention in the interest of full disclosure.

[Gentleman 1]

Can someone actually summarize what all the players who flipped during first dance and intermission pushed as their solve? One thing I have considered is the possibility that their views might be key to solving this game, but I really do not want to try and figure that out myself. I think I have made my contempt for that part of the game clear.

[Gentleman 1]

If I try to read that again I am probably going to start to hate the game again. I guess I could try just isolating each person I want to look at, that might make it more bearable.

[Gentleman 1]

So my first step was checking L3, though I just checked her last page of posts in the isolated view to narrow the scope I was working with and avert issues I have had with using the isolation view in the past. I don’t think I need to pull any quotes to make my points but here is what I think.

First, I think it is feasible that the intermission kill was chosen because those two had a good chance of solving the game.

Second, I jumped to a point in the game to get some context for one of L3’s posts and by doing that I somehow feel even more confident about who G6 is, despite already feeling pretty sure. Given that I rate G6’s ability to solve the game rather highly up to a certain point, so I think when I look him over I will invert my tactic and only look at the beginning of his isolated view, since after my perceived drop in his capabilities, I do not think he really gets his full abilities back.

[Gentleman 1]

VOTE: G8/L5
I was considering this yesterday if I got to a point where I town read L2, and while I am not completely certain I do believe L2 is, if not town, definitely not scum with L2. So I believe there has to be scum in this pair.

[Gentleman 1]

I still feel like L5’s self-centered approach pre-replacement was rather scummy, and I was suspecting her early content as well. G8 has like nothing to work with but from what I remember they’ve honestly seemed somewhat genuine as a whole.

[Gentleman 1]

I honestly don’t think I would mind seeing L9 go but I feel like the holistic, if I am using that word right, approach currently for me is the G8/L5 pairing.

[Gentleman 1]

Is there a reason G8/L5 cannot be a double scum pair? You seem to be ignoring that possibility so I want to figure out if that is just an oversight or something, or if I am missing something there.

[Gentleman 1]

possible
kinda stupid decision if so
i actually rather like g8
so i think it's fairly remote and balance of probabilities we'd just win in that world anyway

sorry, are you familiar with lynch mechs in this setup? can we have two people leave or do we need to lynch two couples?

If the last pair is double scum we cannot rely on them leaving so we have to vote them out. If that’s not the case technically we can have the town half leave the and force the scum half to exit with them, but relying on that tends to create a lot of going rogue I feel.

[Gentleman 1]

Is there a reason G8/L5 cannot be a double scum pair? You seem to be ignoring that possibility so I want to figure out if that is just an oversight or something, or if I am missing something there.

Honestly if l9 is scum then her partner is g8 me thinks.

So I feel like we should lynch g8 and see how that flips. Only way it is bad is if it's a t/t pair.

Please officially place your vote, we need every town vote we can get at this stage.

[Gentleman 1]

Gentleman 2.

The scumteam is Gentleman 8 and Lady 2.

I will leave right now if you promise me you won't leave the dance or vote for your own pairing.

This leaves no room for redress if L9 is scum. This deal is bogus, and I would not take it in G2’s position.

And L2 was also pretty confident about L9 being scum, which I definitely feel L9 earned. While I did not particularly like the fact L2 made a demand like that I do not think it is as condemning as you seem to.

[Gentleman 1]

Now I guess I get to see if I was fooled in the eleventh hour.

[Gentleman 1]

I am reading both flipped scum at this moment, but I do think L9 is more likely scum than you. Her activity during first dance and her trajectory this dance have both felt suspect. Although I will find it a rather questionable design choice if the moderator ended up having the scum slots as the lowest numbers.

On a more humorous note, I feel like the last scum could be thinking, “The last line has been breached! Dang it, deploy it now!”

[Gentleman 1]

Spoiler:

VoteCount 1.0

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 4

-

Lady 3

[0] -

Gentleman 5

-

Lady 4

[0] -

Gentleman 6

-

Lady 8

[0] -

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[0] -
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [16]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 4

,

Gentleman 5

,

Gentleman 6

,

Gentleman 7

,

Gentleman 8

, Lady 2,

Lady 3

,

Lady 4

,

Lady 5

,

Lady 6

,

Lady 7

,

Lady 8

, Lady 9

With 16 alive it takes 9 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-19 02:34:47)

VoteCount 1.1

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 4

-

Lady 3

[0] -

Gentleman 5

-

Lady 4

[3] -

Gentleman 6

,

Lady 5

, Lady 9

Gentleman 6

-

Lady 8

[1] -

Gentleman 5

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[1] -

Lady 4

Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [11]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 6

,

Gentleman 7

,

Gentleman 8

, Lady 2,

Lady 3

,

Lady 6

,

Lady 7

,

Lady 8

With 16 alive it takes 9 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-19 02:34:47)

VoteCount 1.2

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 4

-

Lady 3

[0] -

Gentleman 5

-

Lady 4

[6] -

Gentleman 6

,

Lady 5

, Lady 9, Lady 2,

Lady 8

,

Gentleman 2

Gentleman 6

-

Lady 8

[1] -

Gentleman 5

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[1] -

Lady 6

Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [8]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 4

,

Gentleman 6

,

Gentleman 7

,

Gentleman 8

,

Lady 3

,

Lady 7

,

Lady 4

With 16 alive it takes 9 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-19 02:34:47)

VoteCount 1.3

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 4

-

Lady 3

[0] -

Gentleman 5

-

Lady 4

[5] -

Gentleman 6

,

Lady 5

, Lady 9, Lady 2,

Gentleman 2

Gentleman 6

-

Lady 8

[0] -

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[1] -

Gentleman 4

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[5] -

Lady 6

,

Gentleman 7

,

Gentleman 5

,

Lady 3

,

Lady 4

Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [6]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 6

,

Gentleman 8

,

Lady 7

,

Lady 8

With 16 alive it takes 9 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-19 02:34:47)

VoteCount 1.4

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 4

-

Lady 3

[3] -

Gentleman 6

,

Gentleman 5

, Lady 2

Gentleman 5

-

Lady 4

[2] - Lady 9,

Gentleman 2

Gentleman 6

-

Lady 8

[1] -

Gentleman 4

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[4] -

Lady 6

,

Gentleman 7

,

Lady 3

,

Lady 4

Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [3] -

Gentleman 6

,

Lady 5

,

Lady 8

Not Voting [4]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 8

,

Lady 7

With 16 alive it takes 9 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-19 02:34:47)

VoteCount 1.5

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 5

-

Lady 4

[0] -

Gentleman 6

-

Lady 8

[0] -

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[0] -
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [14]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 5

,

Gentleman 6

,

Gentleman 7

,

Gentleman 8

, Lady 2,

Lady 4

,

Lady 5

,

Lady 6

,

Lady 7

,

Lady 8

, Lady 9

With 14 alive it takes 8 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-19 02:34:47)

VoteCount 2.0

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[0] -
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [16]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 7

,

Gentleman 8

, Lady 2,

Lady 5

,

Lady 6

,

Lady 7

, Lady 9

With 10 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

VoteCount 2.1

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[2] -

Lady 6

, Gentleman 1
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [3] -

Lady 7

,

Lady 5

,

Gentleman 7

Not Voting [5]

-

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 8

, Lady 2, Lady 9

With 10 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

VoteCount 2.2

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[4] -

Lady 6

, Lady 9,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 7

Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [3] -

Lady 7

,

Lady 5

, Lady 2

Not Voting [3]

-

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 8

, Gentleman 1

With 10 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

VoteCount 2.3

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 7

-

Lady 7

[1] - Gentleman 1

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[2] -

Gentleman 8

,

Lady 5

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[4] -

Lady 6

, Lady 9,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 7

Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [1] -

Lady 7

Not Voting [2]

-

Gentleman 2

, Lady 2

With 10 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

VoteCount 2.4

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 3

-

Lady 6

[0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[0] -
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [8]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 3

,

Gentleman 8

, Lady 2,

Lady 5

,

Lady 6

, Lady 9

With 8 alive it takes 5 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

VoteCount 2.5

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[0] -
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [6]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 8

, Lady 2,

Lady 5

, Lady 9

With 6 alive it takes 4 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

VoteCount 2.6

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -

Gentleman 8

-

Lady 5

[2] - Gentleman 1, Lady 2
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [1] - Lady 9

Not Voting [3]

-

Gentleman 2

,

Gentleman 8

,

Lady 5

With 6 alive it takes 4 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

VoteCount 2.7

Gentleman 2

- Lady 9 [0] -
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [0] -

Not Voting [4]

- Gentleman 1,

Gentleman 2

, Lady 2, Lady 9

With 4 alive it takes 3 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

G7/G8 bus pattern is quite strong. G7 pivot from G1 to G8 d2 is interesting - either deeper bus or guilty conscience (lean weakly latter due to quick shift)
all i'm getting from this is that i want to check my predecessor's suggestion that G7 spewed that G1/G8 aren't scum together

In my own readings I noted G7 pointing at G8 and L2 being mafia together during first dance, and I am also seeing the bus strategy I think was mentioned here. This might get rough.

[Gentleman 1]

I don't think L5 has an interest to regardless of her alignment. L5's push back is survivalistic. The G5 G6 fight was secondary to the push on G8 which did get traction somewhat yesterday. Today, people forget G8 exists. Lady 5 picking fights, regardless of her alignment does something for someone.

I'm not opposed to a G1 lynch but I'm strongly in favor of a G8 lynch. So was G5 before he was shot.

Why? I still never have the soul reason why.

And no one forgot G8 exists. G1 was the Lynch Day 1 if G4 and G6 didn’t have a fit.

anyone surviving have a pov on whether the latter part of this applies to g7/g8 as well? don't believe i'll be able to dive it in time

I assume you are talking about whether G7 or G8 would have been lynched in that phase, if so G8 stood a good chance of getting lynched then, G7 not so much.

[Gentleman 1]

You didn’t Town yourself?
Also This is why I compare you with Gent 7 over Lady 9 with Gent 7 because of that vote.
Gent 7 also switched until G1 which is the right move. But then says Lady 9 is the scum. Which I feel a scum vibe of him saying that with no doubt in his mind.

It’s like it makes sense for the team to be G1, G7 and L6.

L6 scum Reads G1 but doesn’t push. Votes G8.
G7 Voted G8 previously, G7 tells mafia “Hey let’s kill G5/L4 and blame it on L9”. Then bus votes G1.
G1 telling mafia they give up and taking one for the team.

G1 In NO WORLD dose he vote G7/L7.
He may vote L9 to make it seem like a bus
He may vote L6 and try to convince me his Town even though that’s stupid.
Or vote L6 and tell G7 that they could be mafia.
He may vote G8 as it makes the most probable sense as a mafia to do that makes them Null Mafia leaving no interactions.

i'm probably spending too much time dwelling on this but it's an interesting universe
not sure this remains valuable when removing l6 from the equation (or replacing her with g1/l9) :/

Looking at that, I have trouble making out the message of the latter half of that post.

[Gentleman 1]

I have finished reading the flipped mafia and I am almost ready to decide who between L9 and L2 is mafia, but I want to read L9 because while I have looked at L2’s activity density around the time where the game went crazy I have not looked at L9’s, I have only used the fact her post count has been rather low and the fact I recalled little from her at that time to make my impression there.

I am still thinking L9 is scum, but I want to do whatever I can to increase my ability to get this right, so I am not locking myself in yet.

[Gentleman 1]

I guess I can talk about what my presumed retroactive game state analysis is. I think G8 was supposed to flip before G7 and G7 was supposed to use that as a point to be thrust into endgame. This makes a fair bit of sense if L9 is scum as that option likely does not last too long, but thinking about it you, by which I mean L2 if it is not clear, were probably a better choice to get to the end as long as I didn’t weigh the pairing down too far, so their chronic bussing honestly implicates L9 that way.

[Gentleman 1]

I don’t really have much opinion on how they interacted with L9 themselves, just to be clear.

[Gentleman 1]

Today will probably be a busy day with me being able to check in next right before deadline so I am going to quickly see if anything big has come up.

[Gentleman 1]

Checking in during a break in the activity. My honest opinion is G2’s conclusion will probably decide how this goes. Which makes me concerned that he has been rather quiet so far. Have I just been missing him?

[Gentleman 1]

I guess I can talk about what my presumed retroactive game state analysis is. I think G8 was supposed to flip before G7 and G7 was supposed to use that as a point to be thrust into endgame. This makes a fair bit of sense if L9 is scum as that option likely does not last too long, but thinking about it you, by which I mean L2 if it is not clear, were probably a better choice to get to the end as long as I didn’t weigh the pairing down too far, so their chronic bussing honestly implicates L9 that way.

I wanted 7-7 pair out though

??

L9
if we are t/ting

i am like, desperate for you to engage with me when you get back into the thread


g1 i need to hear where your mind is at, please. as much detail as you can. no more PT posting.

I laid out my points

Your predecessor freaked out over it, ignored my points, and then you took the reigns and are also ignoring them

So no, I don't see you as town, and you're also doing this thing where You make a point, I make a counterpoint, and you point to that to say that I'm trying to look town or something

You may have wanted them out more recently but my impression was the early plan was for G7 to go to endgame with the energy from bussing G8. In addition I do not understand this whole feud between L2 and L9, what is the root cause of it?

[Gentleman 1]

I guess the L2 and L9 feud revolves around L2 stating I could not be scum with G8 for reasons that could also work with L9? Honestly I would like L2 to expand on that if possible but I think L9 does not look to good for that push because it seems to be trying to open up our pair as a mislynch.

[Gentleman 1]

No I said I was taking a hard look at 7-7 early

I wanted 3-6 to go to endgame, I thought I made this clear?

I will get to your isolated content later today most likely but specific when is “early”?

[Gentleman 1]

Anyway, going to have to go back to my day soon.

[Gentleman 1]

How does this work if i think that scum is in g1/l2?

Like to lynch there we need 3 votes, or they would have to leave right?

Is this what you are thinking? If so please walk me through it. Your opinion is most important so you need to make it clear.

[Gentleman 1]

on G2's instruction i'll leave. i'm around til deadline. i think it's l9 but if he absolutely disagrees, i'd rather take the chance on flipping g1 than lose.

Would g1 do the same?

We have not been using our PT since the G8/L5 flip, so I have to speak for myself here, but I honestly at this point very much doubt L9’s motives so at least for now I am not leaving. L9’s only has to keep you on their side here if she is scum, while L2 or I would have to keep the other part of the pair in check. I feel like L9 is doing their best to cast doubt on both of us to get one of us to fold to her will.