Perfect Masquerade [Game Over]

[Lady 9]

Let's make the first page all odd numbers

[Lady 9]

Is it bad I already want to town lean Lady 7

[Lady 9]

I think no

I feel good about that

[Lady 9]

Are the gentleman feeling intimidated now?

[Lady 9]

Is it bad I already want to town lean Lady 7

You could Town read everyone if you wish ^_^.
That way if someone doesn’t feel Townie they will be the only one who isn’t your Town Read.

The wording here confuses me.

Why are you approaching me like this anyway instead of commenting on the read I put forth? I know it's extremely early in the game but that's kind of the point.

[Lady 9]

Hello. I wish we had more memorable names.

We could come up with memorable nicknames based on avatars. That might be easier than numbering everyone.

[Lady 9]

Hello. I wish we had more memorable names.

We could come up with memorable nicknames based on avatars. That might be easier than numbering everyone.

That would help me a lot. Can we do this?

Be the change you wish to see!

By the way, I was serious about my town read on Lady 7. Just off the first page she immediately comes off as much more carefree and unconcerned about self-image in her tone. Dawn's memey posting seems a lot more forced by comparison. Lady 5/Dawn why did you ignore #30?

Misty can join my early early town leans too.

Me. It hit me wrong.

What about it? You think it was overly conciliatory?

I think overall her posting has been forced and that post in particular was too concerned with how people view her slot. Townies can read like that sometimes but it's more often a scum trait,

especially

in the early game where establishing yourself can be awkward.

[Lady 9]

Lady 5 rolled scum tbh

<_> Lady 3 rolled Neutral.

Also, I find this a weird response to a scum read.

I think L7 is > rand town as well, but not for anything before 19.

My read has definitely gotten stronger since then. But I wanted to put something out there early and I find RVS/early-game tone is the best way to generate that.

Do you have any other > rand town reads, Gent 3?

[Lady 9]

Not sure if I lack reads because I'm distracted -- having a weird af day today friends -- or because of the nonmemorable names.Gentleman 3 is now Crowman. I can do Dawn and Misty. Is Lady 9's avatar Celeste? Lady 2 can be... Eyes? 7 will just have to be 7, hope no one else is a number.

It's not strange to lack reads ~3 pages into the game. Do you usually have a lot of reads this early?

My avatar is Madeline from Celeste, yes. I don't mind if people want to call me Madeline.

[Lady 9]

I like Gentleman 3 not being afraid to out a lack of reads. It'd be easy to BS another couple town leans to look productive when I pressed them.

[Lady 9]

I read Dawn's posts while pretending the smileys weren't there and I now like them. Also, this is weak but don't think using them is a quality scum tactic at first glance. It's bound to rub some the wrong way.

People care about smiley use?

The use of smileys isn’t alignment indicative. That wasn’t even part of the critique.

Maybe not deliberately, but yes, I think small things like that affect people. I also think that avatars play into reads on a subconscious level.

At least one person mentioned it.

I would think the smiley's would be a pre-decided roleplay quirk regardless of alignment. The potentially AI part was the asking if the quirk bothered anyone.

[Lady 9]

It seems initially scummy and lessens your chances of getting asked to the dance because it seems like you're afraid of engaging in a read of a player.

Why does a joke suggest that she's afraid of making a read?

The question isn't directed at me, but I want to point out that it seems to me like Lady 5 is specifically avoiding making non-joke posts. She's ignored my more serious posts twice now. Joking is fine but she doesn't have any non-jokey content yet.

[Lady 9]

The more significant part of 75 was that I think their posts are town aside from this issue anyhow.

Can you be more specific? What exactly do you find townie in her posts?

[Lady 9]

I interpret that apathy as townie. I think that scum care a lot more about getting town read than town do right now.

I think the jokey/blending-in playstyle can be a strategy to get widely town read in itself though.

[Lady 9]

Why are we arguing whether smiley faces are AI?

I think that's an oversimplification of the discussion. But anyway, offer something else to talk about if you have a problem with it.

[Lady 9]

Should we go for optimal pairings or just wing it?

I'd like a mix of both. Widely town read slots should be picky in their choices, choosing other widely town read slots. Ideally, the pairs should be roughly paired according to consensus. But I don't think it's the end of the world if there are some rogue pairs. Mechanically though it would suck to have a universal scum read and universal town read pair up.

@Lady 9 (My nicknames aren't going to stick, are they? I'm getting used to it.)

You may hate this, as you seem like an analytical player, but I buy these as genuinely at ease posts. Specifically, 21 and 24, and now 84 as well. I like 106 too, as the tonal slip speaks of someone who's not overthinking their posts.

I don't hate it! I don't think I ascribe the same importance to that tonal slip as you do. But I think how you're approaching your read on her here is townie.

[Lady 9]

I mean the key is to make T/T pairings. If flips make a difference in how likely a pairing is to be T/T, then sure, but I'm wary of that because scum have pretty much no incentive to avoid bussing, so associatives will probably not be helpful.

I'm wary of that because scum have pretty much no incentive to avoid bussing, so associatives will probably not be helpful.

The possibility you may be correct about this has me shook.

I don't think that's necessarily true? Especially if town manages to play well enough to force an S/S pairing, bussing isn't necessarily an optimal strategy for scum.

[Lady 9]

I'm confused as to why you townread Lady 4 because I think she's been the only person I outright scumread so far.

Despite her overly conciliatory posting earlier, she's going against the grain on the Lady 5 read in a way that reads genuine to me. Also, snark in #68. Maybe my weakest town read so far but still edging there.

[Lady 9]

We want Gentleman 2 ideally to be the NK bait.

Why would we want the confirmed Town to die?

It's so that the other T/T pair that we can hopefully confidently create survives until end game.

[Lady 9]

Gent 6, elaborate on your Lady 4 scum read?

[Lady 9]

Both claims are essentially unfalsifiable, essentially meaningless, and they're the kind of thing that scum use often when giving townreads to town in the early game because they sound good.

I think reads off tone are a more player-specific thing than AI thing. It's the way they arrive at that read that's AI.

In this case, Lady 4 came into a game state where most people were skeptical about Lady 5, and that kind of going-against-consensus even though the player clearly cares about being conciliatory strikes me a more likely townie read.

[Lady 9]

If anything, I would say that having a random townread on a player who hasn't really done much and who general consensus points to being below average is a scumtell for that player.
I say that even though I also townread that player, but I wouldn't really be able to put a lot of words to it and I certainly wouldn't give those specific words. I'd just say meh I think that they're town.

That's a good point, and I agree in a vacuum. I'm not sure I read her posts as "having a random townread" though.

[Lady 9]

And then their only scumread is Lady 7, who just so happens to be the only other person who called them out earlier in the game.

Did you just complain that I had a read too early, and now I don't have enough reads for you?

I don't love Lady 3 either, I just didn't see any reason to mention it.

I think that's a misrep of what he's getting at here

[Lady 9]

Ok so, thoughts on holding a vote for which Lady to kill? An unofficial one.

It'll happen naturally enough through pairing. I think even if there's an unofficial vote there's probably gonna be some rogue gentleman who will extend a dance invitation to the voted lady.

[Lady 9]

What I had an issue with was how you presented that read to everyone,

you took several posts to do it

and never said anything about it.

That's kinda the part I liked because I thought I could track her process. You think how it was drawn out was forced?

[Lady 9]

I do not like Lady 2.

I like Gent 6's thoughts here even if I partly disagree. He's gone against some of the consensus in a much stronger way than Lady 4 and he has specific reasons for his pushes. I feel like he has a less diplomatic/charismatic style in general and is going to garner scum reads just by nature of being grating--no offense meant here. But if you look closer I think he genuinely believes his reasoning, and I don't think it's all bad either. I do wish he wouldn't just drop it just because someone said he was barking up the wrong tree though, I'd rather have this than an echo chamber.

pedit:

Also, I think that townreading Gentleman 2 just for the IC post is bad play. I don't think it's alignment indicative that they didn't check which player the IC was.

is this serious?

[Lady 9]

VOTE: Gent 4

[Lady 9]

VOTE: Gent 4

Lady 9, who do you townread?

My strongest town reads are probably Lady 7 and Lady 8.

To a lesser extent I've liked Lady 3, Gentleman 6, and Lady 4.

That's roughly in order. I need more gentleman reads.

[Lady 9]

I actually get good vibes from Gent 4 too but that isn't based on anything concrete.

[Lady 9]

Fair. I probably wouldn't like me either, and I know it, and it's really gnawing at me. Something isn't gelling. I want to be engaging here. Like genuinely I do. But it's not working, apparently. Like it's apparent even to me that I'm trying to say something but I get passed right by, like a ghost. Maybe it's posting while working, here and there, while other people are managing to have actual back-and-forth conversations.

Okay, that's fair, I noticed that the posts you did have were complaining about Lady 5's use of smilies rather than engaging with the game and that concerns me.

Like L9, G3, L7, G6 are all sensible. L5 is ... fine. Can stay. L4 ... feels kind of like I do?

I do actually like the broad strokes of the treanding-towards-consensus reads I'm seeing. I actually like all the active gentlemen fairly well, G3, G4, and G6 all Townleaning for me.

Flipping this around, do you have any scumreads?

[Lady 9]

The gents are both keen beans I think, they both had avatars pretty early.

Can you elaborate on this, how do you know that they had avatars early?

I wouldn't bring it up if I wasn't considering asking L9 but I wasn't going to do that if they were getting replaced because I wouldn't know if I thought I was going to get along with the new slot holder.

Sure, wouldn't be bad to be able to discuss reads with you either

[Lady 9]

I was more trying to figure out why you would do that?

[Lady 9]

This seems like a nothing question. I mean if you're interested in how to view their profiles sure, but sounded like you were trying to get a read off my method somehow.

Am I wrong to be thinking like this?

[Lady 9]

Wheres homegirl Robin at?

Still around, did you want to talk?

It seems initially scummy and lessens your chances of getting asked to the dance because it seems like you're afraid of engaging in a read of a player.

Why does a joke suggest that she's afraid of making a read?

The question isn't directed at me, but I want to point out that it seems to me like Lady 5 is specifically avoiding making non-joke posts. She's ignored my more serious posts twice now. Joking is fine but she doesn't have any non-jokey content yet.

I may be keeping a serious tone to maintain the roleplay I’m somewhat doing but I see no problem with joking around at this point.

Sure, but they seemed to be going out of their way to avoid the more serious posts, which is the real issue here. And they didn't acknowledge 102 either.

Sure but I see two problems, the fact that we essentially need 2 T-T pairings going into Intermission, and the fact that lack of meta reads will likely make this a lot harder to do effectively.

It's certainly possible to play mafia effectively without using meta. It's probably the case that meta doesn't change winrate too drastically due to poor applications.

We want Gentleman 2 ideally to be the NK bait.

Why would we want the confirmed Town to die?

It's so that the other T/T pair that we can hopefully confidently create survives until end game.

How are you so certain Orange (my place holder name for L8) was going to say this? If not why cut her off?

I don't think I cut her off, I think the question was open ended discussion on what we should be doing.

I do not like Lady 2.

Why is this?

At the time I wrote that I'd have considered them to be active lurking - not really getting into the game, talking about use of smilies, not really offering anything. They've since turned that around, I actually liked their responses that came out after a bit of prodding in 244 and 343.

[Lady 9]

Now that Lady 5 has actually started posting game related comments I don't like then overly much, both in terms of I don't agree with their reads and don't understand where they're coming from. For example they said that they like the way Gentleman 3 thinks but I can't find any real solvey posts from them and a lot of following up on tangents so I'm kinda questioning where that comes from.

I'm unsure on G1 so far. I'll try to read it again but their entrance didn't really make too but of an impression on me last night.

I'm very torn on Lady 4. They have posts that ping me town and posts that ping me scum. I'm undecided on them so far.

I think that the majority of G4s shtick is NAI but I'm leaning town on them anyway.

Still think that L8 is very towny, I feel kind of guilty about the fact that they only want to pair with me and I'm torn between them and 9 but those two are my definite townreads among the girls and probably who I'd want to pair with if they weren't, so.

I had one other big townread but MS is awful right now and I don't want to deal with five minute page loads trying to remember who they are, so I'm just not going to bother.

I'm strongly opposed to G2 trying to pair with scum and play town hero

If you feel like you need to pair with Lady 8 go ahead, that's a probable T-T pair.

Since you wanted opinions on the rest of your reads:
-As mentioned Lady 5 has been avoiding some serious discussion, I don't feel good about her.
-I'm getting good feelings from Lady 4, I like posts like 431, 495, 500, 501. Maybe I'm just a sucker for the short and to the point way she's saying things.
-Gent 4, I had good feelings here too, though it should be noted that their more recent posts have been light on talking about the game
-Gent 1 strikes me as the type of person who I'd need more information from before being able to determine their alignment, their posting has been straight forward but I don't have a read there

[Lady 9]

Eh if I'm outing that I might as well out both of my reads.
I think that L7-L9 associatives look extremely likely to be SvS.
I think that L7 independently is the scummiest slot in the game right now.

Given that these are very unpopular reads my goal was to simply let town do what they want for a while and if we don't end up flipping scum to leave the dance with 9 and an explanation why later.

Well that doesn't seem helpful. I think its definitely better for you to pair with someone we think is town and to get your scumreads killed by voting for them instead, particularly because most everyone seems to be on board with you being town

Which means you should pair with lady 8, I guess, if that's your real strongest townread. I'm still open to dancing if that's what you want to do though

Yeah I might ask L4. Pending input from L9.

That looks good, with that being said, the only pairings with you that would be a problem with me would be Lady 1, Lady 5, and Lady 6. I do think it is important that we set up T-T pairings that we are in agreement on

[Lady 9]

I am more ok with you matching with L9 now though.

I'm still left unsure on a lot of the gents, while I feel like I have better reads on the ladies. I'm not quite sure what to think of Gent 5, Gent 4, or Gent 3. Gent 6 I'm ready to say is town with decent confidence.

Gent 7 has made little impression on me although they've posted. I kind of liked them posting their theory in post 572, it seems town are more likely to look and talk about loopholes using game mechanics than mafia. That being said, I don't think that is a good idea, as has been pointed out.

Gent 8 has only posted in a jokey way so far.

Gent 1, I'm leaning town here, I don't agree with whoever said that they were posting just to. I do want to hear what their small concerns with me are

[Lady 9]

Lady 9, may I have this dance?

I will not hold it against you if you decline.

Yeah we can dance if you want, let me know if you want me to accept this for real and i will. Only reservation here is knowing that I'm set to die if dancing with you, but if we can set up a few pairings that I feel good about then there isn't a problem, and maybe people will be more inclined to follow through with them that way

[Lady 9]

Lady 9, may I have this dance?

I will not hold it against you if you decline.

I accept

On second thought I don't think think there is a reason to delay this, and I know gent 6 is looking at me funny now, so *shrug*

[Lady 9]

You don't want to try and live to endgame?

I do, but I see that paranoia is starting to blossom. I'm thinking my biggest contribution to this game now would be to set up T-T pairings and then die. I'm at a point in the game where I'm able to pick and choose with Ladies I'd like to see live to the end. I'm going to be focusing on Gents now.

I mean, yeah, that's absolutely something scum might do to try to avoid giving away inside knowledge. I don't think L5 or G5 are scum but I don't think this specifically rules them out.

Can you explain why you don't think L5/G5 are scum? I'm not sure that you've talked about this before

[Lady 9]

We can only scumhunt in ladies right now and theres the possibility that all 8 of them could be town.

There are 9 ladies.

I don't. 1 and 6 are either going to start posting or get replaced. 5's posting gives me a headache and I think they're above average scum equity.

Hey, I agree with you. I'd like for either lady 1 or lady 5 to be left out.

The way you're defending her makes me want her dead more and you next if she's scum.

Deal.

If they pair together then they both die at the same time

2 got paired up with 9 whom I am not sure is town

1 I am leaning but not concrete that they are town.
3 is up in the air.
4 I think is town but want to see more from the replacement.
5 I'm not liking.
6 is town!
7 I think is town.
8 I don't remember.

Hi. I know you're paranoid but we are on the same page, compare your reads to mine here:

Spoiler:

I am more ok with you matching with L9 now though.

I'm still left unsure on a lot of the gents, while I feel like I have better reads on the ladies. I'm not quite sure what to think of Gent 5, Gent 4, or Gent 3. Gent 6 I'm ready to say is town with decent confidence.

Gent 7 has made little impression on me although they've posted. I kind of liked them posting their theory in post 572, it seems town are more likely to look and talk about loopholes using game mechanics than mafia. That being said, I don't think that is a good idea, as has been pointed out.

Gent 8 has only posted in a jokey way so far.

Gent 1, I'm leaning town here, I don't agree with whoever said that they were posting just to. I do want to hear what their small concerns with me are

I'll answer the last in a bit but the lady who should sit is the one who doesn't talk, says nothing when they do or talks so much that it blocks effective communication. That is the standard I will apply.

Right now that's you though, is this a lack of awareness on your part or are you committing to posting more?

Who should I be dancing with? :V

Lady 8 or Lady 7, or to a lesser extent Lady 2, Lady 4, or Lady 3. Or Lady 6, I kind of like her already.

[Lady 9]

Alright, I feel better now.

So, who wants to talk shop by the punch bowl?

I'd like for us to manage pairings as they happen to create T-T pairs, which is an effective way of winning in this setup, IMO. That necessitates that you get reads on everybody before predance is over

[Lady 9]

What's wrong with lady 3 and lady 7?

[Lady 9]

What's wrong with lady 3 and lady 7?

What's right with 3? For real, please tell me why everyone likes her, I don't get it.

7 has had a few posts that made me think she might be town, but a lot more neutral unmemorable ones. I don't trust her.

Hmm, I remember liking Misty's early posts, and she had more content than a lot of people at the time

If the only posts from 7 are neutral or towny, shouldn't you want them to get a dance partner? It doesn't sound like you scumread her

I haven't formed a strong opinion of you yet, but as you probably already have more posts than L1, it seems like you will at least try.

Hold on, are you leaving people out based on whether they will try, or whether you think they will flip scum? You're changing your method between posts here

[Lady 9]

Also, L9, why did you accept so early?

Forgot about this for a minute. I'll answer this by saying I didn't accept early (I didn't even accept the first offer I got), Gent 2 had been talking about it for a while, and finally made the decision to ask me. I'm counting on Gent 2 to lead the pairing discussion, as the IC, so when they say wait I wait, and when they say go I go.

[Lady 9]

My Lady, when are you normally around?

Usually the latter half of the day, I'm here now

I'd argue that this is even more important than partnering with someone you think would mesh well, after what happened to G2.

What do you mean "after what happened with G2"?

I just realized

You only need 4 town to win the game

People have been talking about this. Let's try to get two more T-T pairs together, who do you feel the best about?

[Lady 9]

Ooooooooh Explain this one!

I don't think L9 has ever been towny. Not much to explain.

Is there a reason you waited until after I was paired with gent 2 to bring this up? Because he tossed the idea around for quite a while and it feels like you didn't say anything

You know, for 44 pages in, there seems to be alot of uncertainty for reads.

I mean, theres a reason/excuse I, G2, and maybe one or two other have, but the rest of yall idk what to think.

There are still quite a few people who haven't posted substantially

I do like your posting ever since it picked up

Interesting.

I am leaning towards taking that. You've towned a little and I dislike most of my options.

I want to think about it for a little while first though.

I'm happy about it, in the sense that I've got the both of you as probably town, with room for doubt

This wont work, but lets try it because Im bored.

Lady 4, care to dance?

P-edit: we dont know that, i doubt that the above works.

*sobs*

You ask scum before me?

Oh, why do you think Lady 4 is scum?

[Lady 9]

Maybe I'm reading too much into it but L9's thread presence disappearing after pairing up with IC is v townie.

I think you are reading too much into it, I just happened to not be on yesterday

Personally, I feel like there isn't a need to try to read me unless our pairing survives the nightkill, and it may even be counter-productive (giving scum ideas, etc)

Everything that 6 posts feels like scumposting.

I see that you change this later, I disagree and think they are fine, and being argumentative with people is a town trait

L9, G2 was replaced out. We now have a new G2 that isnt as effective as the original

I noticed that they replaced out

[Lady 9]

I mean, I could always just ask someone else whose present. I'm just a little put out about this whole asking phase.

Do you townread lady 8?

[Lady 9]

Also, L9, why did you accept so early?

Forgot about this for a minute. I'll answer this by saying I didn't accept early (I didn't even accept the first offer I got), Gent 2 had been talking about it for a while, and finally made the decision to ask me. I'm counting on Gent 2 to lead the pairing discussion, as the IC, so when they say wait I wait, and when they say go I go.

Oh well it looks like I might not make it past predance, so might as well out some of my thoughts.

While L9 is probably right that we shouldn't worry about reading her until after intermission, I just wanted to point out that this post feels off especially with the tone of her posts thus far. Maybe means nothing, but feels like super catering to the IC. The IC really isn't much of anything except confirmed town. It doesn't make you better at reading people; it doesn't make you anything special except confirmed town. You know they're town and you know (hope) they aren't lying about their reads.

Lady 9 seemed like she had a mind of her own. I don't agree with G5? that doing stuff in the early game to progress the game is overly townie because that's like the most superficial reason to become townie ever. It's really not that alignment indicative because scum know that's how hey can look good and many scum try to make sure they look good early game, so that's a weak point.

So L9 looks like she has a big mind of her own and that's pretty much why G2 chose her, so why does she all of the sudden when paired with the IC be like when he says jump I jump type behavior? Feels like pandering. He's not infallible or special he's just town.

I thought I made it clear previously that I was hoping for the IC to lead or at least help lead discussion on pairings?

L9! What do you think about L6?

I still like her, 1250 I don't agree with, but I don't scumread her from bringing it up.

If you were serious about 1264 then that would change my opinion, but it seems like you aren't

[Lady 9]

Um, wow. There's a lot of new stuff here.

[Lady 9]

L9 you really need to be doing more than you're doing. The game hasn't coped well with your absence.

Yeah, alright. I don't have the energy to respond to every post within 60 pages, I'll skim through and give my impressions. This will happen later today. I noticed we're in dance stage, I'll talk about who I want lynched too

[Lady 9]

I ended up skimming through g5/g6/l5 anyway

This is me throwing in my support for lynching Gentleman 5

VOTE: Gent 5/Lady 4

[Lady 9]

As an example, in the early game, they called Celeste leanscum because of "small concerns" with no reason given.
They recently changed that to leantown because of Celeste's "effort" even though she's literally been an absentee slot for the vast majority of the game outside of D1.
They noncommittally give milquetoast takes and ask questions that they never really follow up on when they actually are posting alignment indicative content.

Very good points here.

Gent 1, why did your read on me change?

Gent 6, where are you focusing for the first lynch, gent 1 or gent 5?

G1 - So I really havent had time to personally witness him in action so I have to go by rereading. I really do not like his way of nicknames, as it makes going back kinda a pain if you dont know the person. I feel like most of his questioning didnt really go anywhere, and that he didnt follow through on any of it. #1658 seems like the only post worth its weight, the rest looks like just asking questions and nicknames. Meh slot.

I kinda agree with the posts above.

But the con is that L5 lives awhile longer.

I think Lady 5 is playing too weird to actually be scum this game. Gent 8 hasn't done anything, his proposals were pretty bad though. I'm in agreement that Gent 8 needs to go before the final 3-4 or so pairings, as he isn't doing anything to make himself readable

Gent 6, I'm halfway on Gent 3/Lady 6, I townread Lady 6 but don't have a read on Gent 3 (even after I look at his iso, I can't seem to get a good feel for him), can you explain why he is town?

[Lady 9]

Not surprised. We should focus on who is town today, we can probably win with 1 t-t pair. I like 3-6 right now. And my pair, naturally.

Now that we're down to 5 pairs left I'm hard eyeing pair 7-7 and thinking it's not likely for this pair to be 2 town (with the knowledge that I'm town)

In the sense that only 1 other pair can be t-t

[Lady 9]

Why isn’t l9 scum? Come on people, her approach to the game is so scum motivated it’s ridiculous. Starts off strong with some analytical posts early day one and then floats on the laurels of early town reads for the rest of the game. How is this town? How is this above suspicion? I also don’t like her post today, mostly in the part where she feels the need to include her being young oerslective. It’s like no shit, you don’t need to qualify that but sometimes scum do. Also if g1 is scum, she poo-pooed my earlier read on g1 for posting to post. Look at her beginning of first dance hop onto g5, which seemed to be sleeping g6 predance rather than any kind of assessment of her own.

So what is town about her? I don’t see it. Also if there are five pairs left and she confidently likes l6/g3, what that Piet should have said is she’s willing to tear through the last three pairs because they contain all the pairs. So why specifically say your taking a hard eye in 7-7. Kinda makes me think we’re actually a town town pair she needs to get rid of.

I mentioned your pair because I thought it was T-T yesterday but now with so many town flips I've changed my mind, plus determining between your pair and gent 3/lady 6 is pretty important. I think there is a sort of consensus agreement that lady 5/gent 8 and lady 2/gent 1 are both getting lynched today, which leaves your pair, Gent 3/Lady 6, and my pair. And I don't know what Gent 2 is thinking right now

[Lady 9]

If your in my position and you want to win and not lose to mafia.
What would you do?

Not that

I am also willing to move to G8, the longer this crap goes on the longer I can't believe he might be town somehow.

Can you vote G8? Save the mod the hassle?

I can

VOTE: Lady 5/Gent 8

[Lady 9]

I also see L5 just straight up lost her mind. I might be having a confirmation bias situation but that meltdown really feels like it comes from scum with how indignant it seems. It feels like such a selfish reaction to not having G8 around. I feel like town would be upset there was an empty slot at all, but L5 made it all about her.

I think that this a strange opinion to have.

[Lady 9]

L5, please do not leave dance, especially not before G8's replacement takes over the slot and says something. I'm really not comfortable with the way your pair is being pushed right now as the lynch that needs to happen first and I DO NOT want your pair to be the first pair out a) without you and G8 having time to give input that might make you readable and b) without enough people having to commit a vote to actually lynch your pair.

I'm a little confused, what is the problem with lady 5/gent 8 going first, if your pair goes next? And why does the order matter?

By poe, it's pretty likely that Gent 8 is scum, him replacing in and starting to play the game doesn't really show that, and it's hard looking at what he's saying right now without thinking that he could have been coached or whatnot extensively before posting this stuff. Basically what I'm saying is, though fascinating, I think we still need to lynch them this game.

As a reminder, we do have a deadline, and I believe we lose when that hits 0

[Lady 9]

It's a lot clearer than G8 is scum from my point of view, where I know I'm town, than it would be for you guys. For the coaching thing, his partners could have been telling him what to say when he came back (the old G8) and the new G8 could have picked that up right away upon coming in.

If the scum isn't in l5/g8, but also isn't me, what does the scumteam look like?

[Lady 9]

L9, what is your read on G1? And on me?

I think that G1 is mafia and that you are town

[Lady 9]

It's not that he's definitely being coached, it's that he could be getting coached due to the large absence and mafia wanting him to do something to prevent his own death

What are your concerns about people positioning to go to the end?

[Lady 9]

I'm not okay with my pair going first. I think doing so dooms us to a loss because of a double town lynch taking out too many town voices, though Gent 2 has been pretty quiet. Still, I think we should wait for Gent 2 to come in and lead us in a direction at this point.

Lady 2, what's the link between me and Gent 1? I think you're confirmation biasing a bit there. What has gentlemen 8 posted that is town indicative instead of just being null/catchup posting/shading other people (and they've disappeared again)? I'm confused as to the direction this game is taking

[Lady 9]

Can you go over why a scum G1 makes me look bad?

[Lady 9]

Are you going to leave the dance before you head to bed?

[Lady 9]

I've been okay to lynch Gent 1 this whole phase, and I believe I said as much. Lady 2 has been willing to leave the dance all phase, pretty much, which makes that a low priority lynch anyway. Gent 8/Lady 5 aren't leaving the dance, though, so we have to lynch them the hard way

[Lady 9]

Now i feel like he's town.

Of course you do.

Gonna be honest, I haven't felt too good about lady 7 for a while now, they kept saying they were going to leave so I was waiting to see what was happening with that. Their recent development is what I expected if she were actually scum. I'm even proposing that, while possibly unlikely, pair 7-7 has a chance of being a double scum pair here, barring that, one of gent 7/lady 7 is very likely to be scum on their own

VOTE: Gent 7/Lady 7

[Lady 9]

Knowing that I will probably step out next phase because we wont die

bro...

[Lady 9]

I've been trying to work with you here

[Lady 9]

@Lady 2

Don't leave while the 7-7 pair is still alive, please

[Lady 9]

Now i feel like he's town.

Of course you do.

Gonna be honest, I haven't felt too good about lady 7 for a while now, they kept saying they were going to leave so I was waiting to see what was happening with that. Their recent development is what I expected if she were actually scum. I'm even proposing that, while possibly unlikely, pair 7-7 has a chance of being a double scum pair here, barring that, one of gent 7/lady 7 is very likely to be scum on their own

VOTE: Gent 7/Lady 7

Do better!

This is beneath you and dumb.

@Lady 2

Don't leave while the 7-7 pair is still alive, please

You know I'm not scum.

Though this is probably the best laugh I've had since the town implosion this game, so do keep it up.

I 'know' it?

Something changed just now

[Lady 9]

5 pairs alive right now.

[Lady 9]

You know I'm not scum.

This is a pretty weird post to be making if you're as certain that I'm scum that you say you are, right?

[Lady 9]

And if you don't leave, I'm ready to force your hand.

[Lady 9]

Wow, Lady 7 really got aggressive all of a sudden.

[Lady 9]

You said you'd leave, yes, but I think you always intended for L2 to be the one to leave, and after you'd come up with a reason why you need another lynch to go through, like me

[Lady 9]

VoteCount 2.1

Gentleman 2 - Lady 9 [0] -
Gentleman 7 - Lady 7 [0] -
Gentleman 3 - Lady 6 [0] -
Gentleman 8 - Lady 5 [2] - Lady 6, Gentleman 1
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [3] - Lady 7, Lady 5, Gentleman 7

Not Voting [5]

- Gentleman 2, Gentleman 3, Gentleman 8, Lady 2, Lady 9

With 10 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

In this votecount, as a Gent 8/Lad 5 wagon are forming, both Gent 7 and Lady 7 are quick to instead start a wagon on Gent 1 - Lady 2

And then Lady 7 is awfully picky about the order we lynch in, seeming to have an aversion to 8-5, but tries to turn it on me instead

[Lady 9]

Leaving the dance

HAVE FUN SUCKAS

Well, sorry if you were town. I do think Gent 7 is scum still.

[Lady 9]

Leaving the dance

Gentleman 7, who was

Mafia

, has

left

in

Second Dance

.

Lady 7, who was

Town

, has

left

in

Second Dance

.

I'm very disappointed that you all pushed Lady 7 to leave the dance.

Lady 9 looks terrible after this Lady 7 push.

Uh, what??? The gent flipped scum

To throw the rest of us off and make her leave unreadable, I bet.

Weird, you still didn't think she was town?

Leave Dance

Gentleman 3, who was

Town

, has

left

in

Second Dance

.

Lady 6, who was

Town

, has

left

in

Second Dance

.

So, I wanted Gent 3/Lady 6 to be the endgame pairing because I realize that people don't trust me, now though BOTH of your pairings are scum, unless it's something silly like gent 8/lady 5

[Lady 9]

Lady 2, I need you alive to lynch Gent 8/Lady 5 - they're so joined at the hip that I doubt they leave at the end. We still need one of them to self vote, or for scum to bus, in order to get this lynch

VOTE: Gent 8/Lady 5

[Lady 9]

So you agree with me that G1/L2 should be the endgame pairing?

Who does Lady 5 think the scum is right now?

???

[Lady 9]

I think if we are looking to soft clear anyone based on G7’s voting patterns the G8/L5 pair is a better option.

Who is scum?

[Lady 9]

I have already done a quick scan of what has happened since I was last here, and I feel like I should try to think things over more. I definitely feel like scum were primarily in the background during first dance. My prime suspects regarding this are L9 and G7 currently.
UNVOTE:
I think G7’s vote is rather concerning, why would he be interested in a double town flip when that puts the game in do-or-die mode? In fact the more I think on this the more I feel like lynching those two is a mistake.

Why does he unvote Gent 8/Lady 5 off of L-1 here? Why does he unvote at all?

[Lady 9]

Hi.

I'm not leaving yet, this G8 looks like somebody I can work with.

[Lady 9]

Edit: I won't leave for the next 12 hours which I guess means I will leave tomorrow morning unless there's a very compelling reason not to do so. Sound good?

[Lady 9]

My list is your list but without the pairs where I'm mafia, so:

G1/G8
G1/L5
G8/L5

In that order of what's likely, too.

[Lady 9]

uhh, I think Gent 8 is much more likely to be scum than Lady 5 though

[Lady 9]

I'm starting to warm up to the idea of L2/G8 though

[Lady 9]

What impression?

[Lady 9]

It matters because Lady 2 pointed towards something being wrong in my read on lady 5 for a reason that I'm scum/their pair is to wn

[Lady 9]

What does that even mean?

[Lady 9]

L9 certainly does not win by being the last scum alive, at this point that seems like a no-win situation for her. So considering that it seems like a bad move to get rid of one of the people who could carry that burden for her.

Gentleman 7 was unlikely to endgame even before that point, not with the amount of heat on him that he had.

The scumteam needs to try to bring another player to endgame.

Who really suspected G7 before I did, honestly? I think at least during this phase I was the first one to really point the finger that direction.

[Lady 9]

Town is going to lose if G2 leaves, since I'm town.

Why is G1/G8 unlikely?

[Lady 9]

Lady 2 the big question is if I'm scum who is my partner, I don't get why you want me to die before figuring that out? Like, if you've made up your mind, seeing my flip isn't going to bring new info. And I was kind of expecting more written than just "Big paranoi" and "plausible" twice

Can you talk about the G7 stuff you're looking at day 1, how does that relate to a G1/G8 pair?

I think L5 made a decent point about G8/L9 maybe being less likely but I can reevaluate in a bit pending flip

Why do you need my flip to reevaluate? Shouldn't you be doing this all now?

It's not like g2 is going to flip scum

[Lady 9]

Is it remotely possible that the scumteam would not kill L9 if BOTH L5 and G8 were scum? Nahhhhh.

How would L5 and G8 being a scum pair relate to my pair dying at night or not?

[Lady 9]

Not surprised. We should focus on who is town today, we can probably win with 1 t-t pair. I like 3-6 right now. And my pair, naturally.

Now that we're down to 5 pairs left I'm hard eyeing pair 7-7 and thinking it's not likely for this pair to be 2 town (with the knowledge that I'm town)

In the sense that only 1 other pair can be t-t

[Lady 9]

Like you guys have to realize I've been pushing the same 3 pairs all phase, I've just been switching based on "which pair would be hardest to lynch, and which is willing to leave on their own"

[Lady 9]

Oh man oh man, Lady 2 is scum. Wow. She's with Gent 8. And looking back at her play during this phase, it makes a lot of sense.

OK, so here's what I'm seeing, going all the way back to the start of this dance phase, I'm casing this:

So looking at the pairs we have, I also don't have a strong bead on two T-T pairs. Not even one right now, honestly.

Excited but also horrified that old!L5 says G8 has posted in their PT but not in the thread????

I keep going back and forth on G1 myself. He's been okay in PT I guess.

I ... L9 voting L5/G8 over my pair is worrisome. I'm starting to think it would be better if my pair was kicked out first. If G8/L5 is T-T we're in a deep hole, though I guess the same is true if G1 is in fact Town and we're lynched first.

Her first real post of the day and she opens up by talking about how town is in a pickle if one of her pair or gent 8/lady 5 are town. But, she also doesn't really think that, apparently.

I'm paranoid now that L9 is actually scum with G1? But if that were true would she even be investing in getting the other pair lynched first?

I need to do more thinking, clearly. If my paranoia (?) that L5/G8 is T-T is true, maybe new!L5 and G8 (who exists maybe? Is there precedent for a slot not posting in-thread for over a week - yes I know including Intermission but still - and not getting replaced? L5 was replaced so quickly!) can help get themselves sorted?

Trying to set it up so her scum partner doesn't get lynched instantly.

????????

G7, what you do if L5/G8 flips T-T, explain now

I am VERY not sure about the push for G8/L5 to be the first lynch in this phase. And I'm more than a little paranoid that just as there's some light at the end of the tunnel with regard to old!L5 being a rule-breaking mess and G8 being unresponsive - just as there's a chance they might become readable - there are a lot of players saying "well of course G1/L2 and G8/L5 both need to go, L5/G8 definitely goes first".

VOTE: Gentleman 1/Lady 2

She votes her own pair instead of L5/G8, in response to Gent 7 voting L5/G8
At this point she's very ready for Gent 8 to go down, and doesn't expect to really get lynched here. She's voting herself so it doesn't look like she's voting nobody when mafia gets lynched. If Gent 8 flips here she's ready to declare her own pair T-T

L5, please do not leave dance, especially not before G8's replacement takes over the slot and says something. I'm really not comfortable with the way your pair is being pushed right now as the lynch that needs to happen first and I DO NOT want your pair to be the first pair out a) without you and G8 having time to give input that might make you readable and b) without enough people having to commit a vote to actually lynch your pair.

What is the actual reason that she doesn't want G8/L5 to die right now? She says it's because other people want to lynch G8/L5 and then G1/L2 after, and that worries her... but why does it matter, if both pairs are dying? it shouldn't, she should WANT L5 to leave here, and then she can leave herself if she really holds suspicions.

Then it shouldn't matter from your perspective whether G1/L2 is lynched first and G8/L5 second?

I

really

don't understand your perspective doubling down on G8 having to be scum. G8 could be scum, as I see it, certainly. I don't think he's said anything so remarkable yet as to make him a significant Townread for me. I also haven't seen anything which warrants wondering whether he's scum being coached by his buddies. It's just - let me repeat - bizarre to me that you jumped straight from me saying I don't want L5 to leave outright because G8 might become readable and because we lose information by having a quick leave without a lynch wagon to you saying that "it's hard looking at what he's saying right now without thinking that he could have been coached or whatnot extensively before posting this stuff". I never said that his posts upon replacing in made him look Town, even! But you had a vocal Townread on L5 previously and no read on G8, though you did say his proposals were bad and you didn't want to take him to endgame, so ... fair enough. But this is a very very hard pre-emptive case against trying to read G8 or letting him live long enough to post anything readable! And it's not like G8 is your only scumread - and I don't see how he could legitimately be your strongest scumread either, but what do I know. So just. What! How? No.

Everyone assumed L5/G8 would continue to be disruptive and unreadable by inactivity respectively and therefore have to go (G1, still a major suspect of mine, has really only posted about L5 needing to go, plus some shade during First Dance about G6 being disruptive and driving Town off a cliff but without committing to a scumread on him). Now that's changed - potentially, anyway. I'm starting to wonder whether they might not be T-T, a very valuable mislynch scum has been counting on for a long time now that's suddenly much less certain.

Basically, I don't believe you are Town at this point, L9.

UNVOTE:

G7, what the hell information do you take away from a G8/L5 lynch if they flip T-T?

Thinking.

She's been prepared for Lady 7 to leave Gent 7 this whole time, so she's going hard on him to distance the last 2 scum pairings. She thinks Gent 8 can be saved at this point.

This is now a VERY strong defense of the Lady 5/Gent 8 slot, when Gent 8 still hasn't really done anything but post a bit. I even mentioned that he could be getting coached, and it's possible Lady 2 herself was coaching him here, and she went hard against the prospect of that.

I like you a lot lady 2!

I'll be honest I like you too. I feel like I'm

supposed

to downplay that and question my Townread on you because our styles and attitudes are similar and maybe I just like you personally and am being pocketed (oh yes, Lady 2, partner of esteemed Gentleman 1, a real prime pocketing opportunity here this game!). But honestly you are my strongest Townread and if I don't work with that productively then I'm

really

not doing what I'm supposed to do, and anyway what of it, it's not like either of us really trust G7 so even if you were scum that's not really a major opportunity for you personally to use me to push your pair to endgame so yeah.

But in that case what do? Lynch L9? Or just lynch G1/L2?

I'm starting to be paranoid that it's G1, L9, one of {L6/G3} as deepwolf. I don't want to be too paranoid but my stronger reads here are G1 and L9 and G1's vote of G7 looks not really like a bus but more like something that avoids touching L9 right now and I think if I'm right and he is scum he just doesn't want to touch the deepwolf at all. If I had to choose one of the L5/G8 voters I've called out G7's explanation seems better than what L9 has here and what G1 has here too so. How do you see it right now?

It's at that point we realize that she never

really

plans on leaving, she's setting up to make it to end game here.

Look at her reads...

what happened to G7? She was going hard on him but he's not her scumread, her stated reads do NOT match what she was saying. She never really talked about l6/g3 either but for some reason they're 'deep wolf'. Actually, that whole list is town, because she's the scum in her pair, and I'm town, so wow. "G1's vote on G7 doesn't look like a bus" does she ever bring this up again, like in our current situation, where G7 flipped scum, but she's still pretending to be unsure on G1, and needs me to flip to 'reevaluate'? These aren't real thoughts!

And by the way, here's the person who has been pushing me as scum this phase after we didn't die. Her and Gent 7.

Soooo the game is pretty stagnant, we haven’t come to a decision for a lynch, and I do t think I’m in a town/town pair anyway. I’m seriously considering leaving tonight before I head to bed. That gives you guys 3 days and a couple flips to work with.

Don't, I will go instead.

Looking back and seeing that Gent 7 was scum. I don't know what this was about, but if she's scum then she doesn't ever plan to leave, just act like it and then that she's reconsidering

You and G1 have both been too interested in lynching G8/L5 first in Second Dance. Maybe because of that I am too paranoid that they're actually one of our remaining T-T pairs because otherwise it's not that they've been super readable, though actually G8 seems kind of okay right now. Not something I'd like to stake the game on but there's no one pair I feel comfortable staking the game on as T-T to be honest. If I had to, gun to my head, I'd have L7-G7 and L5-G8 in, though you could probably WIFOM me between L5-G8 and G3-L6 as the better endgame shot at T-T right now, which basically means I want G1 and L9 out first and then figure it out from there unless I was so wrong that those were both T-T pairs in which case I'd just suck at scumhunting this game, which I can't rule out.

Like if L5 is not scum she was hella lynchbait, no? And you yourself, L9, never scumread L5. And if G8 was really low activity due mainly to out-of-game stuff like illness ... yes it's bad that they have all that baggage and they're not super easy to read. But you know what, it's not like I've seen much useful or readable from you since ... since you accepted G2's invitation to the dance? Really.

And your strong pushback against me telling L5 to not just up and leave before new G8 has a chance to say anything useful and maybe readable ... no. Stop asking me what G8 has done that's Town. I'm not sure he is. He hasn't done that much. But I'm sure as hell actively and specifically scumreading you for the way you pushed back against the idea that they shouldn't go immediately as a given, essentially. I don't see why you would take that perspective if you're Town. And if you're scum, mayyyybe you're trying to preserve your own longevity by bussing a slot that's been thought of as completely compromised for a long time, seeing little downside to it because probably L5/G8 gets lynched, there's a scumflip, you're still fine yourself. Or maybe you're just securing a T-T lynch that you think is kind of a freebie.

G1 spent all his time First Dance scumcasing L5 and shading G6. But I don't really think those were real. The L5 stuff was all for the lynchbaity stuff she's done. It's like he was casing complete busywork.

Actually I should mention when suicide pacts came up yesterday, like right when G4 and G6 were doing their whole "come at me bro" stuff he started saying "hey, should I make one of these with L5 to get the pair out of the game" which ... yeah I don't know what to make of that except to think that L5 would have done a suicide pact with anyone in a reliable manner is just MOONBEAMS level. I'm not staking a Townread on that being a real desire for a suicide pact with L5 on his part.

I really really don't think you're Town, L9. And I don't

really

think G1 is Town either at this point.

VOTE: Gentleman 2/Lady 9

Look the chances of you being lynched as first pair out in this phase are low because I'm pretty likely to leave dance tomorrow morning. Then you'll get my flip, more importantly (given I don't think anyone has a strong scumread on me at the moment?) you get G1's flip. If G1 is Town and I screwed up, that's my mistake as much as anyone's for me leaving and I'm not exactly sure what the game looks like except I guess you'd have to put more scrutiny on people who pushed us as the first lynch for this phase?

But certainly if he's scum, by no means let L9 live to endgame.

Giant wall of text talking about how I'm scum and how Gent 8/Lady 5 are a town-town pair because people are pushing them for doing nothing

It fits my paranoia bias that L5/G8 is T-T. Still reading.

Looking back, G7 did push the G8 scum -> L2 scum thing during first dance while hard pushing L5/G8 as first lynch. That does largely rule out G8/G1 as remaining scum team here. If G8 is in fact scum, G7 does not really want to lynch G8 and have him flip scum for the privilege of being able to lynch me and get G1-scum flipped in the bargain.

Okay need to head out, more later.

So as soon as Gent 7 flips she starts building this narrative that G1 and G8 can't be scum together, even though she thinks G8 is part of a T-T pair, but at the same time she also doesn't want to leave the dance anymore

Wait, what? That doesn't make any sense, at all, from a town perspective.

G1 making good points tho?

If G7 got the two lynches he was pushing, L5/G8 and G1/L2, he might have won then and there for all I can see right now.

Oh yeah, her plans are definitely in motion at this point

You're wrong and probably scum.

Lady 2 is uncharacteristically unwilling to examine lady 6 at all. Where does her suspicion here come from...?

VOTE: Gentleman 3/Lady 6

Okay, I'll be V/LA probably end of Friday through Saturday so we need to get a move one.

L6 goes now, get flip, do business.

Very fast vote here

Lady 2, I need you alive to lynch Gent 8/Lady 5 - they're so joined at the hip that I doubt they leave at the end. We still need one of them to self vote, or for scum to bus, in order to get this lynch

VOTE: Gent 8/Lady 5

When did I suggest I would leave dance? Haven't done so since before G7 flipped.

Gets strangely defensive here about leaving the dance


And then now, she 'needs my flip' - which will end the game, and she has VERY little to say about who I'm scum with right now, and she probably told gent 1 she was feeling better about him in the pt too

[Lady 9]

VOTE: Gent 1/Lady 2

[Lady 9]

Here's where that falls apart:

Lady 7 said numerous times that she was going to leave. Scum knew it. Thinking that G7 was planning to actually go through with two lynches on mafia is. He was not expecting to be the last mafia alive. He would have never gotten to the 'lynch G1' part.

Here's a question: Why is scum G7 trying to setup a mislynch on your pair when you're talking about how you're planning on leaving the dance in your every other post? By your logic, wouldn't he be relying on your "T-T" pair to suicide?

He's setting up associations, so you can win the game

[Lady 9]

Okay based on right now L5/L9 team value has SKYROCKETED if you're asking

I'm not sure how to interpret this other than you fully committing after a push on you

[Lady 9]

@Gent 1

did L2 tell you she was feeling better about you in the pt after your recent discussion, or allude at it, without saying so in the main thread?

Think about it

[Lady 9]

I don’t have a tangible reason to think g7 is scum, some of it is just a flat tone and sometimes the sense that sometimes he’s posting what he thinks town him would post, but that one is difficult to be confident about without knowing the main.

So that’s where I’m at, a big fat no place. I don’t know how g6 thought so many people were being obvtown here. I’m not sure if it’s because I’m super rusty, or if obvtown has become such a useless commodity these days p, but I just don’t see it. And normally, I’d step in and try to be a guide, but it’s difficult when you’re tethered to someone you’re not sure is town. Right now I’m trying to figure out if I should try to get a scum lynch or if I should leave. It’s weird.

Anyway it’d be really nice if the town in this town started acting like it.

From before intermission, and I'm not sure- what she said in her pt. Regardless, it's a good bet that scum had some inkling that that pair wasn't going to survive with Lady 7

[Lady 9]

Correction: This is just after intermission

[Lady 9]

Gent 7 also said that G3/L6 were town, and scum really needed that lynch for a chance to win.

It's really obvious that Gent 7 was never planning to be the last person alive. He was spewing associatives on purpose. He was trying to make me look bad so you guys would lynch me (She's scum, but we'll lynch her last!). He was trying to make it look like he was trying to lynch your pair so you could reconsider your decision to leave, so you could live to the end, because everybody townread you, but not your partner

[Lady 9]

So let me get this straight

In your pt, you tell Gent 1 you are feeling better about him - I've noticed you have not denied this, nor do you seem to 'suspect' that G1gent 1 told me anymore.

You tell Gent 2 to leave. Let's assume he does leave, and that I flip scum

Then you do, what? You say: actually guys, I figured out that Gent 1 is town, so we're going to lynch gent 8/lady 5 now
EVEN THOUGH it was looking pretty clear that neither of them were considering leaving, and it requires 3 votes with 4 people alive? Why not just say you townread gent 1 ahead of time?

The answer is it doesn't matter, because the game ends when I'm lynched, and you just need to tide Gent 1 over until then

[Lady 9]

The reason I asked G2 to leave is because I'm scum

fixed

[Lady 9]

All of a sudden she got real convinced that her partner isn't scum, even though she supposedly had paranoi earlier, and all she could say for me/l5 earlier was "plausible"

[Lady 9]

Let me make something clear

G2 is a lot less inclined to leave than he lets on. I don't know what he's thinking, exactly, we'll figure out when he next comes on, hopefully, but he basically told me that he didn't have a read on me but wanted to see how other people reacted
And boy, you showed your hand on that one

I kinda pressed her a little in our pt and her defense was that she was as mystified by the gamestate as i was and therefore coudlnt be much help to me.

Also, this wasn't true, or at least I'd argue that it wasn't really true (we were both kind of inactive, but I definitely never just brushed off what he was saying) - I didn't argue against it at the time because frankly Gent 2 was fishing for peoples reactions, or something

[Lady 9]

I'm not 100% it's her with you I guess but it was very striking. I do actually now have a pair I can be okay with myself hinging the game on.

For something you were really hemming and hawing about before, you sure are lackadaisical about it now, just "l9 is scum, and l5's hard pivot was obvious!" except you're not 100, but if it isn't l5 then it's g8 because [undisclosed reasons], and all of a sudden you're super confident that Gent 1 is town

[Lady 9]

What do you want me to say about that?

Did you miss the part where she says she's prepared to leave, right before the part you bolded?

[Lady 9]

If there's enough consensus that my pairing has scum in it, then I will just leave the dance.

However, I will insist that you also leave if the game isn't over, L2. I find it nearly impossible that there isn't scum in your pairing.

I'm convinced.

I'm prepared to leave, G2. I think your pair is the TvT pair currently, but I will stay to talk if you need more.

She's prepared to leave so long as I leave, leaving only G2/L9 pair alive. She also explicitly states that she thinks you're Town and is happy with you being last alive.

...But if your pairing was town, the game would be over before she leaves, so the "leaving only my pair alive" stuff isn't what you should be calling scummy

This is what we call a perspective slip - you're calling out things that will happen after your pair leaves, while saying your pair is town, because really, in your mind, you know you're scum, so you're thinking about what happens in final 4 if you die, and you slipped up when describing this scenario

[Lady 9]

Really, this is why you shouldn't be on mafia while you're tired. Glad to hear you're enjoying the game again, though. I don't see a need to further argue with scum about why she's scum, though, I'll talk to you guys tomorrow, don't do anything rash until I get back, please

And to the above, that's a pretty lousy justification for the slip, that isn't at all what you meant

[Lady 9]

Seriously though, I wouldn't have caught you if I weren't in my unique position where the ic was my partner and there's 2 scum alive with 3 pairs remaining, so kudos to you for this game regardless

[Lady 9]

and also trying to get me to show emotional investment in the hopes that emotion looks scummy to G2.

I didn't do this, though. I don't think I ever referenced your emotions

[Lady 9]

I'm too old for pulling even a semi-all nighter. And My brain is friend for [presentation IRL type stuff but nonspecific here] where I will have to discuss things with LOGIC and REASON. But I will credit you guys for making me fall in love with the game of Mafia all over again.

G2, L9 is scum

Okay, so the next little bit is pretty much the same thing.

Can we lynch G8/L5 first?
1. They're both pretty scummy and I feel fairly confident at least 1 will flip scum (probably not both, though).
2. They're going to be lynched anyways and we might as well do it now. I'd rather have more information from that lynch first.
3. This will give me time to read and try to make an informed opinion that lets me sort through the noise a bit better?
4. This lets other people in thread cool their heads.

VOTE: Gentleman 8

L9 where is your catch up...
L7 do you have any reads L4 do you have any reads

I have reads but I'm keeping them in the PT.
Still haven't looked at G5, and I'm liking L8 less for her posts recently. They feel like they're just to throw doubt around in an unfocused way.

If G8 is scum, I'd be okay with a L2 lynch after.
I don't see them pairing up if they're both scum because I feel like L2 could be town who can live for a long time and G8 would be more of a burden. Yes, it's possible that G8 randomly invited L7 and then L5, but I don't really know, especially when anyone could just read a couple random pages and decide to keep L5 around.

I'm bad at reading AtE, though I think L5 isn't scum, but I still don't feel confident in that. I think 1 person in that team is scum.

G6, was it you who wanted G5 to die first? Why are they a better pick over L5/G8 for being first?

P-edit. Oh, I just realized you weren't talking to me. Oh well.

This is why I have ruled out G1/G8 as a pair. Because G7 would not have hard pushed a lynch on one (G8) of his two buddies to directly set up a lynch on his other buddy (G1) by virtue of his buddy's partner (L2) supposedly being scum with the first (G8). That's a very extremely risky hard bus for that stage of the game. Nah, if G8 is scum with G7, G7 is setting up a mislynch on a T-T pair here. And if G8 is Town G7 is just working on a mislynch and can go on his merry way regardless of G1's alignment when L8 flips T. This is why I don't think this logic holds true of G1/L5 as a pair - if he gets that lynch and it's T-S but L5 flips scum and G8 Town, G7 doesn't push on to push G1/L2 because L5-scum doesn't imply L2-scum like G8-scum does by his argument.

Oh, I do have a response to this though.

Your argument is that g1 cannot be scum with g8, because g7 planned to lynch both of them.

I present the following piece of evidence:

VoteCount 2.3

Gentleman 2 - Lady 9 [0] -
Gentleman 7 - Lady 7 [1] - Gentleman 1
Gentleman 3 - Lady 6 [2] - Gentleman 8, Lady 5
Gentleman 8 - Lady 5 [4] - Lady 6, Lady 9, Gentleman 3, Gentleman 7
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [1] - Lady 7

Not Voting [2]

- Gentleman 2, Lady 2

With 10 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

Look at the wagon on Gent 8/Lady 5. Gent 7 is on it, but so am I.

I pushed on Gent 7 pair this phase.

I've done the same thing that you say means gent 1/gent 8 can't be scum together, yet you've never mentioned that, didn't even consider it.

You're effectively saying that I bussed my whole team, but that g1 isn't scum because g7 would have been bussing his whole team, and that would be way too risky

[Lady 9]

L6 how confident are you that L9 is town?

95%

G1 and G8 pairings have both scum. I'd bet my life on it.

And hey, I can quote dead town too

[Lady 9]

Wherever I wanna be.

Hey you

[Lady 9]

These replacements are throwing me off

I'm pretty sure your scum and your predecessor couldn't come up with an answer to 4307 or most of 4272, among other things. Gent 8 is also scum. There's 2 scum remaining and 3 pairs

[Lady 9]

*you're

[Lady 9]

^ It should be very clear that the replacement is working off an agenda here

[Lady 9]

Alright I'll play nice - why G8? What's your clear on L5/G1/G8?
will be at a PC soon.

poe and just more likely than l5

[Lady 9]

If Lady 2 were town you'd have notes telling you that Gent 8/Lady 5 is scum

But you don't, because Lady 2 didn't specify "gent 1 isn't scum" even though she would have said that

The one trying to "play to a crowd" is you here anyway

[Lady 9]

When we're pushing deadline, I'll have no time to read this thresd

...No offense but then why did you replace in, if that was the whole point of the replacement?

[Lady 9]

I'm not throwing a cute comment to gent 2 in 4315, I'm trying to get his attention.

[Lady 9]

And I'm waiting for anybody else to get in here, your every post is dripping with scum intent and there's no further benefit to arguing with you

[Lady 9]

When we're pushing deadline, I'll have no time to read this thresd

...No offense but then why did you replace in, if that was the whole point of the replacement?

Uhh. You want them to read 4300 posts in the next 30 hours?

It looked like they were saying they weren't going to be around at deadline

[Lady 9]

Hi. OK. Don't leave on me instantly G2.

[Lady 9]

I guess I can talk about what my presumed retroactive game state analysis is. I think G8 was supposed to flip before G7 and G7 was supposed to use that as a point to be thrust into endgame. This makes a fair bit of sense if L9 is scum as that option likely does not last too long, but thinking about it you, by which I mean L2 if it is not clear, were probably a better choice to get to the end as long as I didn’t weigh the pairing down too far, so their chronic bussing honestly implicates L9 that way.

I wanted 7-7 pair out though

??

L9
if we are t/ting

i am like, desperate for you to engage with me when you get back into the thread


g1 i need to hear where your mind is at, please. as much detail as you can. no more PT posting.

I laid out my points

Your predecessor freaked out over it, ignored my points, and then you took the reigns and are also ignoring them

So no, I don't see you as town, and you're also doing this thing where You make a point, I make a counterpoint, and you point to that to say that I'm trying to look town or something

[Lady 9]

I'm too old for pulling even a semi-all nighter. And My brain is friend for [presentation IRL type stuff but nonspecific here] where I will have to discuss things with LOGIC and REASON. But I will credit you guys for making me fall in love with the game of Mafia all over again.

G2, L9 is scum

Okay, so the next little bit is pretty much the same thing.

Can we lynch G8/L5 first?
1. They're both pretty scummy and I feel fairly confident at least 1 will flip scum (probably not both, though).
2. They're going to be lynched anyways and we might as well do it now. I'd rather have more information from that lynch first.
3. This will give me time to read and try to make an informed opinion that lets me sort through the noise a bit better?
4. This lets other people in thread cool their heads.

VOTE: Gentleman 8

L9 where is your catch up...
L7 do you have any reads L4 do you have any reads

I have reads but I'm keeping them in the PT.
Still haven't looked at G5, and I'm liking L8 less for her posts recently. They feel like they're just to throw doubt around in an unfocused way.

If G8 is scum, I'd be okay with a L2 lynch after.
I don't see them pairing up if they're both scum because I feel like L2 could be town who can live for a long time and G8 would be more of a burden. Yes, it's possible that G8 randomly invited L7 and then L5, but I don't really know, especially when anyone could just read a couple random pages and decide to keep L5 around.

I'm bad at reading AtE, though I think L5 isn't scum, but I still don't feel confident in that. I think 1 person in that team is scum.

G6, was it you who wanted G5 to die first? Why are they a better pick over L5/G8 for being first?

P-edit. Oh, I just realized you weren't talking to me. Oh well.

This is why I have ruled out G1/G8 as a pair. Because G7 would not have hard pushed a lynch on one (G8) of his two buddies to directly set up a lynch on his other buddy (G1) by virtue of his buddy's partner (L2) supposedly being scum with the first (G8). That's a very extremely risky hard bus for that stage of the game. Nah, if G8 is scum with G7, G7 is setting up a mislynch on a T-T pair here. And if G8 is Town G7 is just working on a mislynch and can go on his merry way regardless of G1's alignment when L8 flips T. This is why I don't think this logic holds true of G1/L5 as a pair - if he gets that lynch and it's T-S but L5 flips scum and G8 Town, G7 doesn't push on to push G1/L2 because L5-scum doesn't imply L2-scum like G8-scum does by his argument.

Oh, I do have a response to this though.

Your argument is that g1 cannot be scum with g8, because g7 planned to lynch both of them.

I present the following piece of evidence:

VoteCount 2.3

Gentleman 2 - Lady 9 [0] -
Gentleman 7 - Lady 7 [1] - Gentleman 1
Gentleman 3 - Lady 6 [2] - Gentleman 8, Lady 5
Gentleman 8 - Lady 5 [4] - Lady 6, Lady 9, Gentleman 3, Gentleman 7
Gentleman 1 - Lady 2 [1] - Lady 7

Not Voting [2]

- Gentleman 2, Lady 2

With 10 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch

.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-11-24 03:40:36)

Look at the wagon on Gent 8/Lady 5. Gent 7 is on it, but so am I.

I pushed on Gent 7 pair this phase.

I've done the same thing that you say means gent 1/gent 8 can't be scum together, yet you've never mentioned that, didn't even consider it.

You're effectively saying that I bussed my whole team, but that g1 isn't scum because g7 would have been bussing his whole team, and that would be way too risky

This

Your slot is saying that G1/Gent 8 can't be scum together because G7 would have had to have been pushing on G8 and setting up on G1

I pointed out that it's the same scenario if I'm scum where I'd be pushing on one and setting up on the other

No response

[Lady 9]

I am reading both flipped scum at this moment, but I do think L9 is more likely scum than you. Her activity during first dance and her trajectory this dance have both felt suspect. Although I will find it a rather questionable design choice if the moderator ended up having the scum slots as the lowest numbers.

On a more humorous note, I feel like the last scum could be thinking, “The last line has been breached! Dang it, deploy it now!”

Hey do me a favor, read through pages 170-172 or so, and see if you can make the arguments that lady 2 can't

[Lady 9]

I don't think L5 has an interest to regardless of her alignment. L5's push back is survivalistic. The G5 G6 fight was secondary to the push on G8 which did get traction somewhat yesterday. Today, people forget G8 exists. Lady 5 picking fights, regardless of her alignment does something for someone.

I'm not opposed to a G1 lynch but I'm strongly in favor of a G8 lynch. So was G5 before he was shot.

Why? I still never have the soul reason why.

And no one forgot G8 exists. G1 was the Lynch Day 1 if G4 and G6 didn’t have a fit.

anyone surviving have a pov on whether the latter part of this applies to g7/g8 as well? don't believe i'll be able to dive it in time

It applied to gent 8/lady 5

i really want to gambit and test you, g1, but i'm terrified we'd just lose the game.

What gambit?

[Lady 9]

This game is really suffering from everybody who knew I was town leaving the dance

[Lady 9]

This is why I have ruled out G1/G8 as a pair. Because G7 would not have hard pushed a lynch on one (G8) of his two buddies to directly set up a lynch on his other buddy (G1) by virtue of his buddy's partner (L2) supposedly being scum with the first (G8). That's a very extremely risky hard bus for that stage of the game. Nah, if G8 is scum with G7, G7 is setting up a mislynch on a T-T pair here. And if G8 is Town G7 is just working on a mislynch and can go on his merry way regardless of G1's alignment when L8 flips T. This is why I don't think this logic holds true of G1/L5 as a pair - if he gets that lynch and it's T-S but L5 flips scum and G8 Town, G7 doesn't push on to push G1/L2 because L5-scum doesn't imply L2-scum like G8-scum does by his argument.

This is the argument that was initially presented

I pointed out that that same argument also holds true from my viewpoint, and why is it only an "extremely risky bus" when relating to her own pair, but not me, and that's a selective argument

[Lady 9]

I don’t really have much opinion on how they interacted with L9 themselves, just to be clear.

Do you think, if I'm scum, my game plan here is to vote out my team and try to make it to the end? You touched on this earlier I believe

[Lady 9]

It's not that it's clearing, it's that the argument your pred made also applies to me, but she ignored that and used it to apply to her own pair, and it wasn't a good argument, and it looks like it was your pred was setting up her pair for survival at the end

[Lady 9]

Could you also expand a little on where your G1 clear comes from? You seemed super confident on the G8/L2 solve yday and like... I'm still freakin out here fam

From my L2 case

I mean, it's either you or him, and I had thought L2 was town for a long time and then my read there changed. Also I started liking him when he started making these arguments:

I'm reasonably confident that removing this pairing and the IC pairing wins the game.

Gentleman 8 is likely town due to how he interacted with me in our PT.
Lady 2 is obviously town.
Gentleman 1's trajectory on Gentleman 7 is quite town now that I look back on it.

Lady 6's contributions since I entered the game are incredibly lackluster and have the same bad feel as Gentleman 7's did.
Lady 9 looks terrible after this Lady 7 push.
Gentleman 3 is either playing very strangely or is trying to carry a deadweight town to endgame for his team.

The path looks quite clear in my eyes.

My one objection here currently is that I do not feel as confident as you do that L9’s push of L7 was suspect. Had L7’s pair flipped double town I would wholeheartedly agree, but there is the question in my mind of the fact L9 pushed town paired with scum to leave.

L9 certainly does not win by being the last scum alive, at this point that seems like a no-win situation for her. So considering that it seems like a bad move to get rid of one of the people who could carry that burden for her.

[Lady 9]

Yeah I don't think you're town

@Gent 2, and whoever else is town, look at what happened with g3/l6 this phase. I wanted them to be the end game pair, right after gent 7 flips suddenly everyone is all over them

Gent 7 townreads that pair all game

I townread that pair all game

Both Lady 2 and Gent 1 are very tight lipped about them then all of a sudden they both vote him along with, I think, Lady 5/gent 8? And then Lady 6 leaves

Tell me they're both town

Tell me the scumteam saw the g3 pair, saw g3 saying that they should be the end game pair, and instead of voting them out, they just all say they're town? It doesn't make any sense

[Lady 9]

What about them?

I know she left, but she was still getting pushed, moves were being made

[Lady 9]

I'm complacent when it looks like g2 is about to leave on me?

[Lady 9]

That's a real funny thing to say

Where is your partner, btw? Weird that you're pointing that at me

[Lady 9]

nd the solve L5 was coming to and the way she responded to the L6/G3 death and the way she responded to my replace-in had me pretty sure she was scum.

Reminder that the predecessor here turned hard on Lady 5 as she suspected her, and this Lady 2 just kept going with that, and that she is now using l6/g3 stuff to justify that when she never talked about that before for l5?

Gent 1, if you have any sense left in you you'll leave when you get here. And gent 2, if you have any sense you'll tell him to leave

[Lady 9]

it feels like she's just sitting around praying for G2 to make the wrong decision.

g2 making the wrong decision doesn't win me the game though

I need gent 1 to leave or vote himself

And what you're calling me going complacent is me going to sleep

[Lady 9]

I feel like town!her surely realises she's fighting a losing battle and needs to work any angle she can to close this

Lady 2 said, literally the complete opposite of this before, I'm pretty sure

[Lady 9]

Wish l5 hadnt left like that...

Give me something to work with

[Lady 9]

Implying that I thought L5 was scum for pushing me is pretty disingenuous

For pivoting onto you, yes, that is why you scumread her. If you were following notes like you say you are, then that carried over

Isn't saying I need to engage in good faith contradictory to saying I need to work any angle I can to close this..?

Calling a G8/L2 scumteam yday while hard pushing towards lynching the pair without really clocking any interest in sorting between them is pretty clearly positioning.

There was tons of sorting going on

[Lady 9]

I'd even be more comfortable with a stance of "well I know for a fact I'm not scum ergo lynching L2/G1 wins me the game

That's poe

[Lady 9]

2) a suggestion that she should be clearing you for the same reason she's clearing G1 only a few hours before she had to be v/la until the end of the game. The former would be a waste of time to engage with. The latter was impossible for her to engage with in the time constraints. I've asked you to substantiate and elaborate on this so I can check my pred's position. You've refused to do so.

This is a real bad faith argument and I've already called you out on saying this before

I'm not arguing that she should be clearing me, no, just that she can't selectively clear her own pair for that while ignoring that interaction in others

There was time for her to respond, yes

I have elaborated on this in recent history to you, yes

[Lady 9]

This is why I have ruled out G1/G8 as a pair. Because G7 would not have hard pushed a lynch on one (G8) of his two buddies to directly set up a lynch on his other buddy (G1) by virtue of his buddy's partner (L2) supposedly being scum with the first (G8). That's a very extremely risky hard bus for that stage of the game. Nah, if G8 is scum with G7, G7 is setting up a mislynch on a T-T pair here. And if G8 is Town G7 is just working on a mislynch and can go on his merry way regardless of G1's alignment when L8 flips T. This is why I don't think this logic holds true of G1/L5 as a pair - if he gets that lynch and it's T-S but L5 flips scum and G8 Town, G7 doesn't push on to push G1/L2 because L5-scum doesn't imply L2-scum like G8-scum does by his argument.

This is the argument that was initially presented

I pointed out that that same argument also holds true from my viewpoint, and why is it only an "extremely risky bus" when relating to her own pair, but not me, and that's a selective argument

It's not that it's clearing, it's that the argument your pred made also applies to me, but she ignored that and used it to apply to her own pair, and it wasn't a good argument, and it looks like it was your pred was setting up her pair for survival at the end

[Lady 9]

I think that you are scum. I am considering G1 as scum, because it's either you or him. if he's scum, then it seems like you've made up your mind anyway, so I can only hope that you are scum

[Lady 9]

Again, you were the one who asked me to bring up these arguments again numerous times, so you can stop the "so... ok?" stuff

[Lady 9]

I don't think you actually were

[Lady 9]

I've been trying to get his attention in our pt

[Lady 9]

No I said I was taking a hard look at 7-7 early

I wanted 3-6 to go to endgame, I thought I made this clear?

[Lady 9]

Not surprised. We should focus on who is town today, we can probably win with 1 t-t pair. I like 3-6 right now. And my pair, naturally.

Now that we're down to 5 pairs left I'm hard eyeing pair 7-7 and thinking it's not likely for this pair to be 2 town (with the knowledge that I'm town)

In the sense that only 1 other pair can be t-t

Now i feel like he's town.

Of course you do.

Gonna be honest, I haven't felt too good about lady 7 for a while now, they kept saying they were going to leave so I was waiting to see what was happening with that. Their recent development is what I expected if she were actually scum. I'm even proposing that, while possibly unlikely, pair 7-7 has a chance of being a double scum pair here, barring that, one of gent 7/lady 7 is very likely to be scum on their own

VOTE: Gent 7/Lady 7

@Lady 2

Don't leave while the 7-7 pair is still alive, please

Why isn’t l9 scum? Come on people, her approach to the game is so scum motivated it’s ridiculous. Starts off strong with some analytical posts early day one and then floats on the laurels of early town reads for the rest of the game. How is this town? How is this above suspicion? I also don’t like her post today, mostly in the part where she feels the need to include her being young oerslective. It’s like no shit, you don’t need to qualify that but sometimes scum do. Also if g1 is scum, she poo-pooed my earlier read on g1 for posting to post. Look at her beginning of first dance hop onto g5, which seemed to be sleeping g6 predance rather than any kind of assessment of her own.

So what is town about her? I don’t see it. Also if there are five pairs left and she confidently likes l6/g3, what that Piet should have said is she’s willing to tear through the last three pairs because they contain all the pairs. So why specifically say your taking a hard eye in 7-7. Kinda makes me think we’re actually a town town pair she needs to get rid of.

I mentioned your pair because I thought it was T-T yesterday but now with so many town flips I've changed my mind, plus determining between your pair and gent 3/lady 6 is pretty important. I think there is a sort of consensus agreement that lady 5/gent 8 and lady 2/gent 1 are both getting lynched today, which leaves your pair, Gent 3/Lady 6, and my pair. And I don't know what Gent 2 is thinking right now

[Lady 9]

In addition I do not understand this whole feud between L2 and L9, what is the root cause of it?

Read from here:

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p11395826

[Lady 9]

but I think L9 does not look to good for that push because it seems to be trying to open up our pair as a mislynch.

?

What? The only pairs alive at the time are your pair, my pair, and lady 5/gent 8. And I know I'm town. What am I supposed to argue?

[Lady 9]

I'm trying to point out that Lady 2 is trying to false clear you to go back on her saying she was going to leave, and that it really doesn't make sense

[Lady 9]

Anyway, going to have to go back to my day soon.

Will you be on at deadline if needed?

[Lady 9]

I don't think she ever referenced dance 1 for that read though

[Lady 9]

Man this game is like theseus ship

When lady 2, lady 5, gent 2, gent 8 have all been replaced, is it even the same game of mafia anymore?

[Lady 9]

And I pointed out that that isn't a position that she can defend because it's not a scenario that is unique to your pairing, but you brushed that aside

[Lady 9]

No I said I was taking a hard look at 7-7 early

I wanted 3-6 to go to endgame, I thought I made this clear?

I will get to your isolated content later today most likely but specific when is “early”?

Early in this dance phase, when 5 pairs were alive

I quoted some posts at the end of the last page

[Lady 9]

Okay everylady except lady 2 has turned on auto invite and lady 2 should def turn on auto invite

reading consensus: Gentleman picks should be

3 picks his lady first
1 picks his lady next
8 picks the lady at the end

I concur.

This is very much worth looking at

Gent 8 jumped out of line to pair here, he didn't want to pair with l2.

[Lady 9]

And at the time L2 was agreed upon to be town, and lady 5/1 were the ones set to be left out of the dance, so there was very little risk to this

And he jumped in line to grab LADY 5 of all people, instead of yoinking L2

[Lady 9]

Gent 8 you've been keeping up with the game?

No, not really. I'm rather struggling to care about you loud-mouthed people at all. Your desire to begin dancing before the dance starts frankly baffles me. I don't consider the pre-dance festivities to be of much worth whatsoever. If I am paired with a bad dancer, I will leave. If not, I shall stay. In this sense, it matters not a whit with whom I am paired, and the desire of you youngsters to try and solve this in the pre-dance smacks of rank hubris.

Good day.

Why did you pick L5 over 2 or 1?

I like the number five, as I liked the number seven.

In seriousness, I have not, as has been noted, been following. I selected a number more or less entirely at random from the list of eligible bachelorettes.

Again, I feel the choice of partner is entirely superfluous, and that it is hubris to attempt to solve much of anything before partners are decided.

[Lady 9]

using pairing logic there's no reason you/g2 shouldn't have died during the intermission :c

I was very inactive at the time, as was g2.

[Lady 9]

It means you're scum and he really didn't want to have to pick you when your slot had towncred and his slot was set to be lynched first (which it was, until town pairs imploded on themselves during the first dance)

[Lady 9]

Him picking like that was wolfy already

[Lady 9]

i don't think he could have gotten away with that regardless of my alignment...?

He got away with it for l5

[Lady 9]

i still don't understand your clear on g1 and your agenda against me is completely unbelievable

there's like, a universe where this argument is t/t but i think town!l9 actually evaluates that at some point..? doubling down on doubling down like this is a mislynch agenda

i appreciate that if she's town, she needs to lynch this pair - but i *had* anxieties about g1. i don't dislike his iso and the main read i have there is sheeping the former l2's rundown of the game. just l9's conduct since my replacein is so clearly positioning i'm here like ://

I've evaluated it

You went back to saying I was scum

I'm not clearing g1. But if he's scum, then we've already lost because you're going hard on me. Plus I think you're just more likely with these disingenuous arguments and the way your pred revealed her hand

[Lady 9]

- insisted that i, and g8, are scum, at the exclusion of every other slot. she has not evaluated her reads on any other slots, just doubled down on us being the scumteam.

Reminder that the living pairs at this time, from my point of view, are:

G1/L2
L5/L8

L9/G2

What do you want me to reevaluate?

[Lady 9]

despite my slot and l9 heavily scumreading each other, she absolutely insisted that l5/g8 flipped first

This is just untrue and I even asked gent 2 to move/look at you in the pt

[Lady 9]

I don't know where this mathematical advantage is coming from but I've done everything I could to show that I'm not scum by pointing to things that make me less likely scum and things that make you more likely scum

Unless I thought one pair was scum-scum which I didn't, there would be no need to reevaluate the pairs from my point of view? I know both of the pairs have scum in them, so

[Lady 9]

What am I supposed to reevaluate when my partner is confirmed town?

[Lady 9]

I'm simultaneously posting too much and not enough in my pt, got it

[Lady 9]

Half the posts in my pt are me asking gent 2 to just sit down and read the game, even highlighting parts that I think are important, and asking what he's thinking because he isn't giving any info

[Lady 9]

Why do those calcs matter from your point of view? it should be either me or g1 to you, so why does mathematical advantage matter? Are you considering your own slot as scum?

[Lady 9]

They need to leave or self vote

[Lady 9]

Which is functionally the same thing

VOTE: Gent 1/Lady 2

[Lady 9]

I still think it's L2. I don't think town plays this the way she did.

[Lady 9]

On the off chance that she's town here, then it would have to be g1. But whoever is town in their pair will need to leave if we're doing this, or self vote, if you also vote them G2

[Lady 9]

Are you sticking around right now G2?

[Lady 9]

How much of the game have you read?

[Lady 9]

gg!

srry for slipping my scum friends

Yoink

my towncred now