Mini Normal 2107 (Game Over)

[alimdia]

Thoughts:

wake88: statement is null

agree with ultimate, saudade definitely seems overzealous. I surely hope that you are kidding when you said you found 1 scum already, then 2 scum.

Wimpy vs vork exchange on page 3 has completely taken over the thread.
I think there is a high likelihood that there is one scum in the 2 of them. In my last and only game, this happened and indeed, one of the participants was scum.
If it was TvT, one or both of them would realise that continuing to engage in useless arguments doesn't help town at all.
Despite the fact that Wimpy's first vote has a really bad reason, I actually don't think he is the scum in this exchange.
VOTE: saudade

Vork's 100% nonbiased and accurate readlist volume #1

{papa-mason, profi}
{wimpy}
{plank, elly}
{wake}

People who need to post more and I'm going to bug in a bit
{salad, Zote, Looker, almidia}

What the fuck is papa-mason?

[alimdia]

I - voted the wrong person

VOTE: Vorkuta

[alimdia]

Wanna guess what other person I know said the exact same line he did and turned out to be scum?

This is also why I am voting - I caught someone saying the exact same line.

Umm how many times has someone said the exact same line but turned out to be town vs scum?

@Saudade, answer this q as well please.

[alimdia]

Wanna guess what other person I know said the exact same line he did and turned out to be scum?

This is also why I am voting - I caught someone saying the exact same line.

Umm how many times has someone said the exact same line but turned out to be town vs scum?

@Saudade, answer this q as well please.

question does not make sense - we are looking at a solitary person making a statement on their own and I've encountered it to be a scum thing before... there isn't anyone else for it to be Vs

I think you didn't understand the question.
You are saying you caught someone saying the exact same line before, and they were scum.

I'm asking you how many times has this happened?
And also: how many times has this happened, but the person who said it was actually town?

[alimdia]

Wanna guess what other person I know said the exact same line he did and turned out to be scum?

This is also why I am voting - I caught someone saying the exact same line.

Umm how many times has someone said the exact same line but turned out to be town vs scum?

@Saudade, answer this q as well please.

This is a weird question. Zote the Mighty does not approve. Why defend Wake's behavior at the beginning?

I'm not defending Wake's behaviour. I'm scumhunting from the responses.

[alimdia]

After reading all the pages.. profii u havent answered my q yet

@wimpy thanks for digging up the games lmao. He had been avoiding answering the question prob cos he got caught in a scum tell.

so... Regarding saudade's experience
1) person experience
2) sample size of 1
I realise that me saying the argument between X and Y being most likely TvM probably is also sample size of 1 from my personal experience, so ill retract that argument too
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Profii
I haven't played with 'papa mason before', I was just wondering cos nobody had username papa mason.

Something tells me I have a higher winratio than you as both town and scum so please dont lecture me

I have a 100% win ratio as town. You should therefore sheep me all game.
See how that doesn't make sense?

Btw I think scum self hammering doesn't break the rules

[alimdia]

Zote gets it

Of course I do. I am the Great Intelligent Zote the Mighty after all.

I appreciate the readability and brevity of your posts. Even with the third-person referencing, your stances are easy to understand.

Again, self hammering is literally against the rules.

Again, Day 1 sucks because I have nothing to actually work with, so, yeah, I'm willing to hammer at L-1 Day 1.

• I agree
• I agree, but I wouldn't blindly hammer. I don't feel the majority's always right, so, a group of players getting someone to L-1 wouldn't automatically require me to hammer

---

I am very comfortable with my Saudade vote.

Why are you very comfortable?

[alimdia]

@Wake88 There has been so much discussion now that it feels like Day2, just without flips. What are your current reads?

[alimdia]

I actually think saudade is town now.
Same with wimpy even though he replaced out @Mod can you actually convince him to stay?)

[alimdia]

I think I answered?

I can't find it? I just had a look through your ISO again. The closest I could see is this:

question does not make sense - we are looking at a solitary person making a statement on their own and I've encountered it to be a scum thing before... there isn't anyone else for it to be Vs

which I already addressed, and asked a follow up question.


Anyway, using a

personal

experience thing as a reason to vote someone is ... a pretty bad reasoning.

Now if you were to say that Wake88 is not contributing much at all, other than saying Wimpy is a townread, which multiple people, including me have also mentioned, then thats a different story altogether.

[alimdia]

reading UltimatePlank - seems more of a annoyed town than scum? I could be wrong though.

Looker: scummy, can't quite put my finger on why, prob gut and post #272 as well as the other posts being fluff

Sadalaman: I'm not happy with his contributions so far.

I just woke up and 10 pages appeared, Timezones, amirite?
I didn’t like the TvT clash between sausage and wimp, (yes I tr both of them). About vork, I can see why he would be scum but last time I’ve seen scum!Vork, he was too obvscum to be scum and won the game that way.

Yoink, I find it scummy that Saudade focuses on either wimpy or wake, just judging the other people on who they side with. Plank, why did you vote Vork?

Down to wagon on: Looker, Sadalaman, profii depending on his answers.

@Saudade - Can we get on one of those wagons? Idt Wake88 wagon is going to give us more information, regardless of the flip


Also, I looked through Wake88's games. He hasnt played a game in a long while and the last few he has played he didn't say that D1 shit.
So... still a null point.

[alimdia]

Sadalaman: I'm not happy with his contributions so far.

Down to wagon on: Looker, Sadalaman, profii depending on his answers.

Join me fren

Ye sure thing mason buddy, your post 308 makes sense

VOTE: Sadalaman

I have definitely seen someone make a similar statement and caught them as scum day 1

I have also been made aware that apparently I have seen people make similar statements and then they flipped town (what wimpy said)

I’ve also mentioned that it was like a page 1/2 scum read and I’ve hypothesised that there are scenarios where I’m wrong

As it happens, I agree with the point that wake hasn’t really got started in this game - it could be scum believing they are under major scrutiny so not sure how to enter the game but it’s just a thought rather than me saying “we must lynch right now”

I think I’ve got too swept up in this whole thing and I’m probably missing out paying attention to half the player list tbh

At this point we all agree that his first post is null.
The only reason to lynch him is because he is not contributing. But there are also plenty of other slots that are not contributing.

Profii is off the hook, I still have my eye on Looker though.

people doing bad things because they always do bad things

just sayin
this describes salad quite well.

You're free to push him- I won't get in your way, but that was just a heads up and a subtle way of letting you know that I prolly won't support your wagon.

yes I also hate it when someone does something scummy and then some random (from my POV) just say 'oh he just does that every game'

like can we have some examples? thats just bad gameplay. What if you're their partner and just say that shit out of nowhere?

You guys arent going to believe who my mason partner is

It's me obviously

[alimdia]

Unofficial vote count:
Wake88 (5): Saudade, profii, Vorkuta, Zote the Mighty Saladman27(L-1)
Elbirn (1): Elements
Saladman27 (3): Elbirn UltimatePlank alimdia
Not voting (2): Wake88 Looker

[alimdia]

*Warms hands on the gallows*

I ain't saying shit until someone claims intent to hammer.

And if you do, give me time to respond.

Come on the saladman bandwagon?

I will look at his normal game later when I get home

[alimdia]

Profii did you also miss this? Wake not self-hammering was well and truly established by now.

This game is really frustrating to read. I think there's scum in Vork or Elements. Saudade is likely just a really obnoxious town player I think, his carefree attitude probably doesn't come from scum and he does at least try the most minuscule of amounts to sometimes reign it in. I think that both Vork and Elements were piggybacking off Saudade and too willing to scumread Wake for not their own reasons. Profii is less guilty of this, and I can see a world where profii is town that I disagree with.

The only strong reads I have right now are Alimidia and Elbirn, who I'm pretty sure are both town. I'm not all that sure about my scumreads, but there's also a lot of day left. I also think that this lynch on Wake is just a gamble. I don't think the way he is playing right now has anything to do with his alignment.

VOTE: Elements

I'm less annoyed at this game now, and gun to my head, this is where I'd lynch today.

What about looker?

[alimdia]

I wanna hear a bit more from UltimatePlank

He says he best town read is alimdia
And from the Wimpy-saga he says scum probably piled on meaning one of {elements/vork/Saudade}


My questions are - why is alimdia so town and where does elements come into it as I don’t understand

Also, whilst I agree wimpy is likely town I am not sure that sheeping his slot is the wisest plan - being town inherently means uninformed ergo doesn’t actually know who the scum is.

Do you not town read me good sir?

[alimdia]

What about looker?

Off you go then start the scumhunt

You've mentioned Looker a couple times and have casted some suspicion towards him, but I was hoping you could be more specific. Also, I don't like how little he's contributed to this game, and I think putting some pressure on him is merited.

VOTE: Looker

VOTE: Looker

[alimdia]

Why would i bother regurgitating reasons?

Because it’s easy for scum to sheep wrong town and be like yep I just agreed with that dude he sounded clever

I don’t like that post, at all.

VOTE: ultimateplank

so now I'm town

[alimdia]

I don't understand if I'm supposed to take these as jokes or serious claims. I feel that this is intentional. I feel you blast so much bullshit and fake news that you intentionally obfuscate the thread so that people can't get solid reads.

Wait so....

You're ignoring all the other people saying 'Papa Mason' and just straight claiming Mason with no partner but you think that I 'blast so much bullshit and fake news that you intentionally obfuscate the thread so that people can't get solid reads.'

Are you sure you're not only attacking me because.... I'm voting for you?

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... d_You_Suck

[alimdia]

I don't understand if I'm supposed to take these as jokes or serious claims. I feel that this is intentional. I feel you blast so much bullshit and fake news that you intentionally obfuscate the thread so that people can't get solid reads.

Wait so....

You're ignoring all the other people saying 'Papa Mason' and just straight claiming Mason with no partner but you think that I 'blast so much bullshit and fake news that you intentionally obfuscate the thread so that people can't get solid reads.'

Are you sure you're not only attacking me because.... I'm voting for you?

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... d_You_Suck

• You're deflecting; I'm targeting the concept. Saying "They did it, too!" doesn't make it any better. My sentiment still stands.
  
• I'm familiar with OMGUS; it typically involves a vote. I'm also familiar with attacks - this is not one.

Um no, maybe others can weigh in on this, but OMGUS

does not

have to involve a vote!

You specifically quoted and called me out on doing it and tried to paint me as intentionally doing it (I was) to blast bullshit and fake news to obfuscate the thread (????), when I was clearly doing it as a joke as a reply to saudade's claims and also Vorkuta's.

[alimdia]

I have a really bad headache I'll play later

Hope it goes away soon!

Finally, the wake wagon filled up really fast with a very small amount of resistance, and fell away as fast.
Whereas this looker wagon has some real resistance to it. People are either not commenting on it or parking their votes on people with just 1 vote. We need to pressure this slot more.

Join me on this wagon!

[alimdia]

Lack of protest of the wake wagon falling down is noted. Any thoughts from anyone?

Are you talking about the 3 people still on wake or other people?

[alimdia]

That's basically what I'm feeling at the moment, for what it's worth.

I really, REALLY hate Day 1 because I've got nothing tangible to work with.

I've got both profii and Zote getting fussy over putting pressure on Looker, and I'm not so sure how to read that so early in the game.

Go ahead and read Zote's ISO. Theres a shitload of posts, but he's probably said the same amount of non-fluff as you.

VOTE: Saladman I'm interested in pushing this. Ultimate Plank is another wagon I could get on board with as well.

literally only things Zote has talked about Salad so far:

I've seen town!salad be really inconsistent that way as well.

Oh please don't tell me saladman is mislynch bait I hate when I'm not allowed to push on people doing bad things because they always do bad things HaHa lol so randumb

From the rumblings I've heard deep in the depths of Hallownest, where I just slayed a great 30 foot long beast, Salad is known for being what one would call 'lynchbaity.'

In short, I can't stand Day 1. Least favorite part of the game. We have literally nothing to work with.

I don't mind hammering at L-1, but I will relax on it being a quickhammer, because we'd need a claim.

If something interesting happens during Day 1 then I'll pick at it, but I'm not interested in being paranoid-psycho on everything Day 1 like others can and do. It's a waste of my time. As bodies hit the floor I can actually start parsing out who is who.

Boycotting Day 1 entirely isn't the way to go about it though cur. There's plenty of information to be gained from wagons such as who supported it, who was against it, who hopped on etc. In particular I did not care for Saladman's hop on, especially with his intent to put you at L-1. It felt overly cautious .

Basically only case is 'overly cautious L1'ing wake'

Same with him wanting to wagon UltimatePlank, the only times he mentions ultimate are 'why do you townread alimdia' and 'why you pressure Looker'

LOL!

[alimdia]

Ugh the votes are all over the place. Its hard to analyse when people start a 1 vote wagon all over the place.

[alimdia]

So you think Looker is town because he is trying to figure out if someone else is town or not.

Which is what most of us here are doing?

[alimdia]

That's basically what I'm feeling at the moment, for what it's worth.

I really, REALLY hate Day 1 because I've got nothing tangible to work with.

I've got both profii and Zote getting fussy over putting pressure on Looker, and I'm not so sure how to read that so early in the game.

Go ahead and read Zote's ISO. Theres a shitload of posts, but he's probably said the same amount of non-fluff as you.

This was improperly quoted - that's not what Zote said in post 319. (Is this part of your blast bullshit and fake news M.O.? ) [I was joking. Notice the smiley.]

That's basically what I'm feeling at the moment, for what it's worth.

I really, REALLY hate Day 1 because I've got nothing tangible to work with.

I've got both profii and Zote getting fussy over putting pressure on Looker, and I'm not so sure how to read that so early in the game.
So, here's the deal: I'll keep my vote on Elements until he returns or is replaced out; however, upon his return and input, I'm prepared to place my final vote of D1

Sorry about that, I think I was trying I must have deleted the wrong header/footer of a quote when editting. I try not to do too much nested quotes, heres the post I meant to quote (by wake88)

That's basically what I'm feeling at the moment, for what it's worth.

I really, REALLY hate Day 1 because I've got nothing tangible to work with.

I've got both profii and Zote getting fussy over putting pressure on Looker, and I'm not so sure how to read that so early in the game.

[alimdia]

Wait so post #396 or #414 is me exploding? I just had a look at both of them and.... its just me defending myself against your claim that I'm intentionally obfuscating the thread. FYI you're still only pointing at me for doing that.

A quick search for the term 'fake news': People were using the terms “fake news”, as popularised by [redacted to make it not political], to discredit opponents, in this case: me.

[alimdia]

Lack of protest of the wake wagon falling down is noted. Any thoughts from anyone?

I feel it was opportunistic scum, honestly. When people don't have to give reasoning, anybody can jump on a wagon.

Your 334 said that you haven't read wake yet.
Your 393 and 403 also don't mention wake.

Your next post, which is the post I am quoting, suddenly straight up slips that wake is town. Hmm? Where did that sudden town read come from? I think it's definitely a slip

If we assume that's an accident.... who is the opportunistic scum on the wagon? Why is your vote on Elements, who needed to be prodded by the mod and thus actually hasn't posted in a while.

[alimdia]

suddenly straight up slips that wake is town

can you clarify that please ?

He said opportunistic scum jumped on wake's wagon, which implies he knows that wake is town.
The other possible implication is that he town read wake hard, which I showed that there was no evidence in my 438 that that is the case.

[alimdia]

I have a really bad headache I'll play later

Hope it goes away soon!

Finally, the wake wagon filled up really fast with a very small amount of resistance, and fell away as fast.
Whereas this looker wagon has some real resistance to it. People are either not commenting on it or parking their votes on people with just 1 vote. We need to pressure this slot more.

Join me on this wagon!

I would investigate those members on the Wake wagon. My wagon's experiencing resistance because: (A) The reasoning is weirdly selective - you target me over Element despite him having no content (B) The scum that jumped on Wake looking for a quicklynch would look hella scummy if they hopped on my wagon with no hesitation

Why don't you do some investigation yourself instead of putting a vote on an afk person until they come back? That makes no sense. 5 other people aren't gonna magically jump onto his wagon before he gets replaced or comes back.

Let me help you a bit: Saudade, profii, Vorkuta, Zote the Mighty Saladman27(L-1)

Saudade: you conceded at #334, so I assume TR here
Zote the mighty: you conceded to zote that saudade was likely town, so.... I assume TR here
profii: 0 direct posts about him, either reading him as town, scum or even null. Some indirect discussion about rule discussions and your latest post where you said you felt like it was 'opportunistic scum' on wake's bandwagon.
Vorkuta: 0 direct post until you under-summarized the case on you
Saladman27: 0 mention at all, not even indirect

Okay so..... you've basically been tunneling on Saudade until you agreed he was town, didn't look at Vorkuta and Saladman much, slightly looked at profii. By your own admission you should be looking at people on Wake's wagon. Why are you focusing on Elements again?

[alimdia]

I need people to support this wagon. The evidence is damning...

@Plank, come back on this
@Saudade, @profii, @wake88 What do you think of the stuff I just laid out? Join the wagon if in agreement please
@Eibirn, @Elements hopefully you guys read my stuff in detail

Also... if someone, for example me, lays out a good case about why someone is scum, provides evidence, example and so on...
Why does anyone that reads it have to provide additional original reasoning in order to join the wagon? The whole point is I'm trying to
1) find scum
2) convince other people to agree with me and vote with me.

If my case convinces people, I don't see why they have to find some other extra reasoning to vote with me.
It's only when its like ... the wake wagon where there's not really a case that its suspicious.

[alimdia]

My man park your vote here while you afk

[alimdia]

I need people to support this wagon. The evidence is damning...

@Plank, come back on this
@Saudade, @profii, @wake88 What do you think of the stuff I just laid out? Join the wagon if in agreement please
@Eibirn, @Elements hopefully you guys read my stuff in detail

Also... if someone, for example me, lays out a good case about why someone is scum, provides evidence, example and so on...
Why does anyone that reads it have to provide additional original reasoning in order to join the wagon? The whole point is I'm trying to
1) find scum
2) convince other people to agree with me and vote with me.

If my case convinces people, I don't see why they have to find some other extra reasoning to vote with me.
It's only when its like ... the wake wagon where there's not really a case that its suspicious.

Firstly I think you a town. You seem pretty convinced that Looker is doing something worth digging into which is cool. I wouldnt expect scum to drive a day 1 wagon from scratch like this...

However, I am curious about Looker, but I dont feel a need to vote right now... I have specific questions, if he answers them satisfactorily, then cool, I probably wont vote. If not, I'll either ask more questions or just vote. I dont feel the need to just jump in though - what if we evaluate someone and we decide they are town, but they dont want to work together because they feel like you gave them a hard time? then how do we catch scum - we need to play the long game here... it's a team sport.


To your point about extra reasoning - I would say on day 1, it's not like we have a PR saying I saw slot X do action Y to slot Z which is clear scum - if that was the case I'd say fine, quick-lynch. This is day 1 - we know nothing - all the players are humans and have their own perspective, I'd expect it to be simple enough for 10 different people to evaluate a situation and say 'I agree with part A but not so much part B' and have 10 different opinions - if people all come in and just go 'yep vote' at this early stage, something is wrong - so there isn't a rush right now.

I mean look at how fast the wake wagon went, and how slow this Looker wagon is, even tho my case on Looker has way more content than the case on wake. Also what questions? Have you asked them to Looker or are you waiting for him to answer my case?

That's basically what I'm feeling at the moment, for what it's worth.

I really, REALLY hate Day 1 because I've got nothing tangible to work with.

I've got both profii and Zote getting fussy over putting pressure on Looker, and I'm not so sure how to read that so early in the game.

Go ahead and read Zote's ISO. Theres a shitload of posts, but he's probably said the same amount of non-fluff as you.

That's not even my post cur! This feels like an intentional misquote

I've already addressed this in 436. Are you intentionally not reading to throw sand at me?

[alimdia]

Do you not agree that Salad was being a bit too cautious when announcing intent to put Wake at L-1?

As for Plank, some of his reactions have been pinging me. In particular I did not like his hop on the Looker wagon. 408 is a sketchy post as well and it feels like a jump reaction to someone questioning the Looker wagon. Sort of like a 'why would you not vote for this person?' kind of reaction.

Do you expect me to have full cases on people when we're still early in Day 1 and little has been established? I find it troubling that you are so confident in your reads.

Yes he was a bit too cautious, but that could have been a mariad of reasons - e.g. town afraid of someone quickhammering, or scum trying to not look opportunistic are the top 2 that come to my mind.

I don't need you to have a full case. Just more than what you had for Salad, where you went from "Salad is lynchbait" to "Vote Salad because of L-1 thing"

Regarding your comments about Plank, those comments would have been good ... when you made the accusation of Plank being scummy, instead of only now, you know what I mean?

[alimdia]

So basically the case against Looker is his lack of contribution or substance in his posts. Is that not very similar to the case that was against Wake in the beginning? I find it odd that the players in support of the Looker wagon were the same people who were against the Wake wagon are in support of the Looker wagon despite the similar reasoning.

No that is not at all the full case against Looker. Simply ISO me and look at my last 10 or so posts, some of which were literally on the last 1-3 pages.

Let me remind you all that just because your points may be correct and make sense, that does not mean that the case you've built will yield scum at the end of it

...... so how do we yield scum then?

I had UltimatePlank marked as scum in my mind but now I feel otherwise

Explain more?

I had UltimatePlank marked as scum in my mind but now I feel otherwise

Can you spoonfeed me a reason for plank-town? I have a lot of lazy scumreads and he's one of them, help me narrow things down friend

They decided to completely fabricate my read on wake which I had at no point eluded to or given and used that to push me as scum multiple times. When no one was joining in they as good as dropped it.

In 409 they responded to profii in such a jumble of minced words I had to read it twice to understand what they were saying. It's phrased in such a way to make people skimming the thread think salad is scummy when in actual fact the arguments being used are cyclical and make zero sense.

I think 435 and 456 are distancing posts. 435 starts out looking like looker is building up a scum case for UP but then looker decided to keep his vote on me even after using UP's push on me as reasoning for them being scummy? Doesn't make sense.

I think both Looker and UP are scum here.
VOTE: UP
because I don't know how many looker is on and I cba to count.

I do believe that Looker is on 4 votes at the moment. Also.. can you say plank instead of UP? Took me a while to figure out who UP was.

[alimdia]

Lack of protest of the wake wagon falling down is noted. Any thoughts from anyone?

I feel it was opportunistic scum, honestly. When people don't have to give reasoning, anybody can jump on a wagon.

Finally, the wake wagon filled up really fast with a very small amount of resistance, and fell away as fast.
Whereas this looker wagon has some real resistance to it. People are either not commenting on it or parking their votes on people with just 1 vote. We need to pressure this slot more.

Join me on this wagon!

I would investigate those members on the Wake wagon. My wagon's experiencing resistance because: (A) The reasoning is weirdly selective - you target me over Element despite him having no content (B) The scum that jumped on Wake looking for a quicklynch would look hella scummy if they hopped on my wagon with no hesitation

[...]

So, here's the deal: I'll keep my vote on Elements until he returns or is replaced out; however, upon his return and input, I'm prepared to place my final vote of D1.

Based on your post above, edited for clarity, you should be looking for someone who was on the wake wagon who didn't then join your wagon.

1. Well who is it?

2. Why do you instead continue to have a bizarre fixation on Elements instead? If there was a time to move on over to bigger and better things it's with this post, but instead you posture about how you're going to move and continue to vote park someone who at the time wasn't even here.

Yea exactly, look at my post 443

[alimdia]

@Elements, never mind after some recounting, it seems like Looker is still on 3 votes. Plank unvoted and then re-voted him again.

I think while finding connections is crucial in this game in terms of looking for scum partnering possibilities, we shouldn't have 2 seperate wagons. I need to read Plank later to see what you are saying, but for now if you think Looker is scum, you should be on the Looker wagon.

[alimdia]

Your next post, which is the post I am quoting, suddenly straight up slips that wake is town. Hmm? Where did that sudden town read come from? I think it's definitely a slip

If we assume that's an accident.... who is the opportunistic scum on the wagon? Why is your vote on Elements, who needed to be prodded by the mod and thus actually hasn't posted in a while.

I draw reads from circumstances sometimes. It looks hella scummy if somebody (or a group of people) jumps on Person A with no reasoning.

No you had 0 mention of wake, and then suddenly you assume wake is town. 0 analysis in between. You didn't express any reads in between.

That's subjective - I

am

investigating. My intent was not to quicklynch, so I don't see why "5 other people magically jumping on his wagon before he gets replaced" would be important. Are quicklynches important to you?

You still haven't investigated the people on the wake wagon, conveniently ignores my post 443 where I help dissect the wake wagon and how Looker has almost 0 scum reads on the 5 people on wake's wagon.

Hm... "Are quicklynches important to you?" Where did that question come from? I was saying your vote is useless on Elements because nobody was gonna wagon him at the time. Your vote is very important for analysis later. The fact that you parked it on someone to 'waste your vote' was highly suspicious when combined with the rest of my case- that was what I was saying

• So you agree with me that the Wake wagon was suspicious? But fault me for finding it suspicious?

You've just said it was suspicious with a sudden blindsided town read on wake when you previously had nothing on Wake. Where are your actions to support your words?

I think while finding connections is crucial in this game in terms of looking for scum partnering possibilities, we shouldn't have 2 seperate wagons.

I need to read Plank later

to see what you are saying, but for now if you think Looker is scum, you should be on the Looker wagon.

This is the same phrasing I used when referring to Wake. Why did you find it scummy?

I didn't have a sudden town or scum read on Plank with nothing in between a few posts later? Whereas you did.

I feel alimdia's attacks are because I accused her of unsubstantiated garbage.

Um.... Thats your defense?

I'll claim on Friday, or you can find out earlier by hammering.

Its Tuesday now. You need 3 days to make a claim?
Looker basically didn't defend the meat of the case at all other than 'flimsy reasoning' and 'unsubstantiated'. Someone else has to see this right?
Someone that has a similar viewpoint state an intent to hammer and force a claim immediately please.

[alimdia]

Can someone TL;DR key points the wagon on looker?
I've caught up but I still don't get it

Have you ISO'ed me yet?

[alimdia]

VC 1.5

Wake88 (5):

Saudade, profii, Vorkuta, Zote the Mighty, Saladman27

(L-1)

Saladman27 (3):

Elbirn, UltimatePlank, alimdia

Elbirn (1):

Elements

Not voting (2):

Wake88, Looker

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch

Deadline: (expired on 2019-11-18 03:00:00)

VC 1.8

Looker (4):

Wake88, alimdia, UltimatePlank, Elbirn

(L-2)

UltimatePlank (3):

profii, Saladman27, Elements

Wake88 (2):

Saudade, Vorkuta

Saladman27 (1):

Zote the Mighty

Not voting (1):

Looker

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch

Deadline: (expired on 2019-11-18 03:00:00)

---

Mod Notes:

Saladman27 is V/LA until 11/14

It's pretty strange that those 2 wagons comprise of no overlap.

What's the reasoning do you think?

Interesting how those three on mine jumped onto Salad instead.

You mean 2? And did you mean plank?

[alimdia]

However, I am curious about Looker, but I dont feel a need to vote right now... I have specific questions, if he answers them satisfactorily, then cool, I probably wont vote. If not, I'll either ask more questions or just vote. I dont feel the need to just jump in though - what if we evaluate someone and we decide they are town, but they dont want to work together because they feel like you gave them a hard time? then how do we catch scum - we need to play the long game here... it's a team sport.

Did he answer your questions satisfactorily, if at all?

Also the second part of your statement doesn't really make sense. How is your evaluation of looker going? This isn't big brother here, this is mafia?

[alimdia]

Looker

, I would ask you to please claim.

No quick-lynching, the rest of you. I want this information.

so you can declare yourself as a quick-hammer'er but when you are on the wagon we have to wait until you are satisfied?

I am not going to quick hammer but this double standard is outrageous

Yea er wake?

You mean 2? And did you mean plank?

I'm really curious about Salad who was a bit weird about voting Wake, waiting until he was actually online - then not only doesn't vote the looker wagon, but criticised someone for going on that wagon where I highlighted that sheeping point.

I'd like to hear more about that[/quote]

Ah I see what you're doing

I'm already voting him.

I want a claim. Some sort of information.

I don't like that he's delaying it until Friday.

Someone post intent to hammer so he will claim.

That would probably have to be profii or Saudade

[alimdia]

Middle quote failed, meant to be this:

I'm really curious about Salad who was a bit weird about voting Wake, waiting until he was actually online - then not only doesn't vote the looker wagon, but criticised someone for going on that wagon where I highlighted that sheeping point.

I'd like to hear more about that

[alimdia]

At this point Looker's wall of posts, the contents in there towards me are just 90% saying 'nothing' and straight up misdirection

A prime example is...

No you had 0 mention of wake, and then suddenly you assume wake is town. 0 analysis in between. You didn't express any reads in between.

Are you expecting reads to be given out pre-Day 1? Where do you think they come from? They're derived in-game from interactions, so I don't see why you'd expect them to be telegraphed in RVS

Except your post 334, 393, 403 are not pre-Day 1 anymore. Its after a crapload of stuff has happened

Lack of protest of the wake wagon falling down is noted. Any thoughts from anyone?

I feel it was opportunistic scum, honestly. When people don't have to give reasoning, anybody can jump on a wagon.

Your 334 said that you haven't read wake yet.
Your 393 and 403 also don't mention wake.

Your next post, which is the post I am quoting, suddenly straight up slips that wake is town. Hmm? Where did that sudden town read come from? I think it's definitely a slip

If we assume that's an accident.... who is the opportunistic scum on the wagon? Why is your vote on Elements, who needed to be prodded by the mod and thus actually hasn't posted in a while.

I really don't get your case. You say I'm scum for finding Wake's wagon suspicious, but you weren't on it either. I legit thought this was you being upset over the trash comment.

You're scum for straight up saying wake is town with 0 prior mentions of wake and also still not analysing the wagon?
Also I already disproven by my posts earlier: "being upset over the trash comment"

Scum doesn't act scummy on purpose. In fact they try their best to not look scummy.
What I look for are what they don't do, contradictions and posts that imply prior knowledge.
You:
1) didnt investigate wake wagon still. Its been a couple days. Every time we talk about it, you talk about me, answer other stuff, instead of analyzing the wake wagon.
2) You imply prior knowledge of wake being town when you had 0 mentions about wake before. Yes I expect reads to be given out before you make a statement that implies you 'know' they are town.


I'm probably done responding to Looker's walls unless theres anything new there. So far its more of the same.

[alimdia]

I think someone on that wagon should unvote

Why?

I am starting to see the case against Looker, but I'm not 100% confident that they'll flip scum. I still find it unsettling how confident alimdia is in his read and if Looker is lynched and does flip green, that's one suspect for tomorrow.

Also don't care for Elements's or Plank's votes on Looker either.

Do you really think that if looker flips green that makes alimdia scummy ?

I mean the guys signature says 100% town win rate and it looks like he completed 1 game - he is just super cock sure

Are you thinking what I'm thinking profii? About Zote.
Wbu saudade?

[alimdia]

about Zote's comment*

[alimdia]

Are you thinking what I'm thinking profii? About Zote.

Ive on idea ?

Hi-five?

Who do you wanna lynch?

Also saudade.... gonna need more from you mang

[alimdia]

How many days has it been since we were promised a claim?

2 I think? But you didn't threaten hammer so he's still not claiming.

If wake88 flips scum Looker is scum as well

Based on what? Show me your big beautiful brain processes

Lynch wake get two scum, enough of this horseshit

Why are you even mad?

If wake flips scum then I can see why you say Looker is scum. But if Looker flips scum then the opposite doesn't hold true.
Therefore we should vote Looker because he is more likely scum independently.

I’ve still no idea what he is on about

I thought you previously said you had 'an idea', but now I see its 'on', which was prob a typo for 'no'.

Oh well. I believe that saying if X flips green then look at Y is typically a scummy thing to do. In addition you are soft defending Looker by attacking some of his wagoners, but at the same time with no arguments to support him.

I am starting to see the case against Looker, but I'm not 100% confident that they'll flip scum. I still find it unsettling how confident alimdia is in his read and if Looker is lynched and does flip green, that's one suspect for tomorrow.

Also don't care for Elements's or Plank's votes on Looker either.

I am starting to see the case against Looker, but I'm not 100% confident that they'll flip scum. I still find it unsettling how confident alimdia is in his read and if Looker is lynched and does flip green, that's one suspect for tomorrow.

Also don't care for Elements's or Plank's votes on Looker either.

Do you really think that if looker flips green that makes alimdia scummy ?

I mean the guys signature says 100% town win rate and it looks like he completed 1 game - he is just super cock sure

Potentially, mostly because I don't find the case against Looker very compelling.

I'd look into Plank and Elements too upon a town!Looker flip.

[alimdia]

He promised to claim on Friday btw. Today is Wed, so 2 more days.

[alimdia]

I mean elements is on the looker wagon.

[alimdia]

wow typing with capital letters so much effort imo

VOTE: Elements

new and exciting direction for this game wow so exciting

Why are you doing this exactly?

because looker is obviously stubborn and doesnt care to claim until he feels ready, and even if put to L-1 with intent probably doesn't give a shit on principle

i have problems with Elements' play and i think that's a better tree to bark up until we're collectively ready to lynch someone

also i agree with alimdia here regarding looker as the most independently scummy. i also think scum!Looker implicates others here too, whereas them being scum doesn't necessarily implicate looker

The problem is that...
Friday is gonna roll around and Looker is gonna be like 'Yeah I'm not on L-1 I'm not claiming' and then when we get them to L-1 again they're gonna stall more.
Why put your vote on Elements as 1 vote? Hes on the looker wagon atm after all. Just

FOS

him while keeping vote on Looker.

[alimdia]

I think someone on that wagon should unvote

Why?

Elbirn can you stick your vote back? I want a claim on Friday or earlier, not more stalling

[alimdia]

Can someone TL;DR key points the wagon on looker?
I've caught up but I still don't get it

thoughts on looker wagon after I replied to this?

How many days has it been since we were promised a claim?

Does this mean you are interested in getting on the wagon?


Also I just ISO'ed you
0 interactions with Looker
0 proper interactions with me other than saying I need to post more and you'll follow up but never doing so.

[alimdia]

actually alimdia what do you think of vorkuta?

my read on them is kinda just stale at this point

initially he has a bunch of fluff posts, gets into a scrap with wimpy, then lurks after Wimpy replaces out.
He asks about main poins on Looker wagon, then doesn't respond.
0 interactions with Looker
0 proper interactions with me other than saying I need to post more and you'll follow up but never doing so.

I don't much much on that slot unfortunately.

[alimdia]

if we force a claim from elements, and we decide it's not scum and switch to looker i consider that better than parking a vote on the looker wagon for 2 days.

i don't consider elements cleared regardless of what looker flips. or do you think scum!Looker = town!Elements?

i think scum looker clears basically you and Wake. that's it.

um
I consider looker stalling till Fri very bad. Thats why I was trying to get someone to threaten hammer

[alimdia]

The person who claimed hes hammering whoever gets to l1 first, then doesnt hammer him.
Its because its his scum buddy

bro he was on the wagon he can't hammer

[alimdia]

The person who claimed hes hammering whoever gets to l1 first, then doesnt hammer him.
Its because its his scum buddy

bro he was on the wagon he can't hammer

Pretty sure he had le hammer at a point

Actually no I just read through and he joined the wagon relatively early and stayed on, and thus could not hammer.

[alimdia]

At this point you are getting less and less TRed by me

[alimdia]

You're just tunneling on wake at this point

[alimdia]

Disregard my point if wake is scum so is Looker

What about other way around?

[alimdia]

initially he has a bunch of fluff posts, gets into a scrap with wimpy, then lurks after Wimpy replaces out.
He asks about main poins on Looker wagon, then doesn't respond.
0 interactions with Looker
0 proper interactions with me other than saying I need to post more and you'll follow up but never doing so.

I don't much much on that slot unfortunately.

Yes- because I've ISO'd you and all that but the case on looker seems iffy and nowhere as decent as the wake case is.
Also he posts sporadic walls so idk what I event want to ask him.

I mean back pre-wimpy replace you didn't have too many posts so *shrugs*

Whats the wake case other than speed hammer day 1?

[alimdia]

Disregard my point if wake is scum so is Looker

What about other way around?

Hang on 1 second
You think wake is scum like 90% right?
So that means looker is also 90% scum? (90%*100%)
By your logic voting out looker is the same as wake for you

[alimdia]

Theres very heavy resistance on this Looker wagon

[alimdia]

I said I think almidia is town because he is driving the looker wagon from scratch but at what point should I consider that he could be using it to not really get involved in all the other slots in the game whilst still appearing active and participating

I mean you can make the same argument for Saudaude?
At this point I just really need a flip so I can look at connections because theres quite a few inactive people.

And its counterproductive for me to call out people that join my wagon when I think Looker is scum

[alimdia]

He is at L2 at the moment.

If plank swaps back and Elbirn states intent to hammer, we'll have something.

[alimdia]

That's not a hammer.. Looker was already on there.

We need Elbirn (cos saudade clearly isnt) to states intent to hammer and Looker to claim already

[alimdia]

I mean gotta claim before hammer, I wouldn't say thats way too eager?

Also deadline in like 3 days, we won't learn shit without a flip.

[alimdia]

Sorry I've been gone a while. I found a great beast in the depths of Hallownest and slayed it with my weapon, 'Life Ender!' I will catch up soon.

thoughts on wagons?

[alimdia]

So it’s friday and there have been at least 2 double votes

This basically tells us looker should claim I think

AiNt ClAiMiNg WiToUt InTeNt

[alimdia]

@Mod, the latest vote count doesn't have the updating deadline in there

[alimdia]

Also

My V/LA starts in 2 days and will last for 2 days

[alimdia]

You're just tunneling on wake at this point

Is this humor?

Not really. I've been looking at other people. All Saudade has been saying is 'mason', 'wake scum'.

That's not a hammer..

Looker

was already on there.

We need Elbirn (cos saudade clearly isnt) to states intent to hammer and Looker to claim already

Obvious typo was obvious , I clearly meant Wake given all the context

[alimdia]

Also he didn't claim?

[alimdia]

hammerintent

Please hammer.
Friday is nearly over and he hasn't claimed

[alimdia]

hammerintent

Please hammer.
Friday is nearly over and he hasn't claimed

I'll do it I'm crazy

ye do it on midnight

Also happy cake day

[alimdia]

Well depending on the flip you all should be looking at different people over the night.
Let's not lurkfest on Day 2 as well, and hopefully wake and everyone else that has also been lurking increases their content

[alimdia]

Anyone that speedhammers today must hang tomorrow.

Also no lynching is dumb. I'm pretty sure scum shot at me last night as confirmed town.

<3 protective role

[alimdia]

Mathematically its optimal.

Not when there's basically almost confirmed town...

[alimdia]

I have some of my thoughts down regarding everyone on the Looker wagon, and everyone on the alternative wagon on the time Looker was lynched.

Before I post them though, I'd like to wait for everyone to post their own thoughts so people can't just conveniently sheep me
On day 1 I accepted some people following me because the looker wagon was very hard to get going and if I was attacking people that jumped on the wagon it'd definitely go nowhere.
However, its day 2 now, with a scum flip, so I expect everyone to have some thoughts.

Finally, I believe the setup is 3v8, which causes 2 mislynches and 2 nightkills to go into LYLO (3v4)
Similarly, newbie games are 2v7, which cause 2 mislynches and 2 nightkills to go into LYLO (2v3)

@Elbirn I haven't outed anyone or claimed anything? But there are only 2 reasons why there would be no night kill last night, and I choose to believe one of them over the other. But yes, don't claim

[alimdia]

Specifically Saudade, you said if wake is scum then so is Looker.

In that case, what about the other way around?

[alimdia]

I don't think profi claimed?

He was just agreeing that I was the most likely NK candidate.

[alimdia]

Mathematically its optimal.

Not when there's basically almost confirmed town...

Finally, if another night kill is prevented, then that means an extra lynch.
So....
Mathematically it's only optimal to no-lynch at MYLO with

0 confirmed town

Neither of which is true.

[alimdia]

Alimdia, how do you read Salad currently?

I can't help but think he may be Scum, in that he hammered his partner as a move to reduce suspicion on himself.

Still waiting on people to give reads first tbh. I don't want to dominate discussion again since the other scum can just hide easily if I'm wrong

I have some of my thoughts down regarding everyone on the Looker wagon, and everyone on the alternative wagon on the time Looker was lynched.

Before I post them though, I'd like to wait for everyone to post their own thoughts so people can't just conveniently sheep me

[alimdia]

Wow I didn't know about the daytalk part, but in the back of my mind I WIFOMed myself about whether or not there is 2 or 3 scum, since Looker's flipped PM implies there is only one partner.

[alimdia]

This means we can POE the last scum out pretty easily

[alimdia]

Specifically Saudade, you said if wake is scum then so is Looker.

In that case, what about the other way around?

I retracted that read please read the game,
the read was based on the assumption that Looker was at L-1 and wake didnt hammer him, but wake was already on the wagon.

The person who claimed hes hammering whoever gets to l1 first, then doesnt hammer him.
Its because its his scum buddy

bro he was on the wagon he can't hammer

Pretty sure he had le hammer at a point

Anyways wake is scum here regardless of what ya'll be saying
Hes completely out of the game in a typical scum way to be

You never acknowledged that he didn't have the hammer whole of day 1.

we should be no lynching today.... ~_~

No. See:

Mathematically its optimal.

Not when there's basically almost confirmed town...

Finally, if another night kill is prevented, then that means an extra lynch.
So....
Mathematically it's only optimal to no-lynch at MYLO with

0 confirmed town

Neither of which is true.

[alimdia]

VOTE: Profii

I think Profii is good.


btw my posts are shit so far cos I'm v/la still kinda.

[alimdia]

VOTE: Profii

I think Profii is good.


btw my posts are shit so far cos I'm v/la still kinda.

nah alimdia, profii is much less likely to be scum than sausage

I meant profii is good as in town

[alimdia]

Multitasking just means can kill and do action at the same time. SO the other scum could be multitasking roleblocker.

Also, are serial killers allowed in normal games?

I know we're getting into setup speculation here

[alimdia]

When I'm not V/LA I'll post better shit.

Its hard cos Looker didnt talk to anyone on Wake's wagon.

I can't tell if he was expecting to get lynched and decided to give 0 information or what.

[alimdia]

Alright guys, I'm posting all my reads now, partly because if there isn't actually a doctor out there, I won't make it til Day orl Night 3. If there is, please protect me again.
Okay, thats my PR directing done.

I'm going to chill on the quotes because otherwise this post will be massive:
Suspicious:

Vorkuta Day 1:

0 interactions with Looker, keeps asking for TL:DR for key points on hammer, hammer intent on post #627. DOES NOT HAMMER after midnight.
I know for a fact he was online because he was posting in other threads. So this is very suspicious. Waiting on his partner to do a fake claim to draw out a town PR perhaps?
Tunnels on wake like Saudade and Looker.
At post 80 and 119 he says
"People who need to post more and I'm going to bug in a bit
{salad, Zote, Looker, almidia}"
Never follows up on that, so its something scum can easily say to make it seem like they are doing stuff, but is not.
Never directly talks to me until post #569
Never talks to Zote day 1....
Does talk about salad in post 309, but maybe to prevent wake wagon from losing steam.
Keeps vote on wake all of day 1 starting from post #163
Vorkuta Day 2: Nothing he has said so far has changed my mind

Saudade Day 1:

Is very much based on Looker's day 1 actions. See below
Tunnels hard on wake wagon.
Refuses to go on Looker wagon.
Since we know scum team of 2, bussing your partner on day 1 = you're fucked. Saudade could very well be Looker's partner.

Day 2:

Asks for no lynch....

Meanwhile Looker day 1:

Looker's random vote was on Saudade. Scum have a higher than average chance of voting their partner.
Post #222, "very comfortable with my Saudade vote." with 0 reasoning.
Looker talks to Wake.
Looker talks to Zote
'Reluctantly conceddes that Saudade is not scum anymore, when he didnt have a case to begin with.'
Starts attacking me because I am trying to wagon him.
Attacks Saudade again, when in the last post he just said conceded on Saudade
Basically majority of his posts are either at me or Saudade. Votes Elements for trash reasons, we discussed this on Day 1.
Votes UP because Up sheeping wagons.

[alimdia]

I think that UltimatePlank, Eibern, Wake, Elements, profii and to a lesser extent Zote are town.
Unfortunately, that means Saladman is null.

No, I'm not going to explain why, nor will I say who I think is 'most town'. The players that go back to read posts based off Looker's flip, the way his wagon formed should be able to form their own opinions.
Plus it might put a target if I lay out a good case of why they are town. Plus, there is always the possibility I might be wrong about one of Vorkuta/Saudade being scum. I think town has the game in the bag, barring any 'non-normal' mechanics.
Scum will now have to choose between PR hunting, killing other 'really town looking people' or killing obvtown me. If they fuck up another nightkill (I'm assuming the last one was protected but yea), that's an extra lynch for us.

Yes, I'm WIFOMing scum right now.

In conclusion, I'd like to vote either Saudade or Vorkuta, based on my previous posts.
I want to give Saudade the opportunity to formally claim mason if he's serious about it, and out his partner to confirm, since there is only 1 scum left. And having 2 more confirmed town would help greatly.

[alimdia]

Interesting that traitor is included in normal.

Also, Looker's role PM was shown, and it said nothing about traitor?

VOTE: Vorkuta

Once again, giving Saudade to claim or withdraw his claim of mason.

[alimdia]

Gut's telling me it's Profii.

casepls

[alimdia]

Interesting that traitor is included in normal.

Also, Looker's role PM was shown, and it said nothing about traitor?

VOTE: Vorkuta

Once again, giving Saudade to claim or withdraw his claim of mason.

I am big dick mason and you will deal with it as such

You're not rly helping yourself much here

I'm trying to do Vorkuta here first

[alimdia]

I'm hoping tomorrow.

I really wanna do Vorkuta first cos at least Saudade talks.

[alimdia]

People currently on Saudade wagon, assist me pls?

[alimdia]

Assist me with voting out Vorkuta. idk I'd rather have more active people voting the next day in case we get it wrong.

[alimdia]

History as huge as my big mason penis

mason partner out yourself plx

[alimdia]

I mean I agree that Saudade is scummy, but its mostly because of Looker's actions, and a little bit of him tunneling wake on Day 1. There are more suspicious people, like Vorkuta

[alimdia]

Vorkuta or Elements

Excellent can you vote Vorkuta

[alimdia]

Vorkuta or Elements

Excellent can you vote Vorkuta

Think hes at l1 or something

by my count he has 4 votes.
If you want I can unvote and you vote so I'll be the hammer later

[alimdia]

Sadly ultimateplank is the only one with a decent transperent motivation to voting me, the rest do not.
And elements vote looks the worst

Is my vote on you not good?

[alimdia]

oh yea but I said you were in my top 2 scumlist.

[alimdia]

Can put put Vorkuta on L1?

[alimdia]

Saudade who do you think is scum?

Vorkuta or Elements

??

[alimdia]

I said profii was town, but not because of the unvote on wake

[alimdia]

UNVOTE:

I'll unvote, then you can put him at L2

[alimdia]

Well I'm not quickhammering

[alimdia]

Is he actually gonna post though

[alimdia]

So ... @vorkuta can you claim?

[alimdia]

>.>
<.<

Was hoping for a claim there buddy

[alimdia]

p.s. protect me if vorkuta isn't scum k thnx

[alimdia]

Can someone explain?

[alimdia]

I claim even night tracker, guess what I got boys

could be helpful if you told us

I agree, spill it.

Also, nobody died last night so I'm not really buying the 'even night tracker' considering how Vorkuta was a 'night 1 only watcher' instead of an 'odd night watcher'.

[alimdia]

Also because nobody died 2 nights in a row, we get an extra lynch.

You're welcome.

[alimdia]

Mathematically superior

[alimdia]

Why is everyone claiming lol.

[alimdia]

Yea... unless you give results, I'm gonna have to assume you are lying. You're incredibly anti-town right now.

[alimdia]

I feel like all the town are just trolling and the scum is just chilling and afk-ing

[alimdia]

I'm like not voting on the off chance he is trolling town.

But at least he should... give his actions?

[alimdia]

Lowkey already mad that Vorkuta just low efforted Day 2 when he could have just claimed on the outset and gave us another confirmed town.

[alimdia]

Feels like everyone were like, meh, imma park my vote here and fucked off the thread as soon as they voted

Also didn't you say Elements was scum yesterday?

Who do you propose we lynch then? Other than wake.. since he was on the looker wagon with me very early on

Do you rly think there were 2 scum wagons on day 1?

[alimdia]

zzz claim your actions and stop with this 'you'll regret it' bullshit.

Vorkuta didnt claim in time and got hammered. I don't wanna see another quickhammer.

But if you keep giving vague claims instead of building cases on people after a day you're prob fair game.

Also... this is like the only game where we lynch scum on day 1 and lots of people are still floating.

[alimdia]

Also the scum rolecop got lynched day 1 so they have no idea who is what.

But eventually there will be a kill if the other scum is a roleblocker.

[alimdia]

So can we stop with the itchy hammer fingers.

[alimdia]

I targeted Profii last night with my Night 3 1-shot Jailkeeper ability.

got crumbs?

[alimdia]

And how the hell have there been no NKs yet this game?

this game is tilting me

[alimdia]

Should we just massclaim?

[alimdia]

I targeted Profii last night with my Night 3 1-shot Jailkeeper ability.

got crumbs?

before that though....

[alimdia]

Should I decide on order or popcorn?

[alimdia]

Also @Wake88, you believe that I am town, yes?

[alimdia]

Also @Wake88, you believe that I am town, yes?

I'm about 90%, although none of us are truly confirmed.

Regarding Looker were you for (and pressed) his lynch before I initially votes for him?

Also @Wake88, you believe that I am town, yes?

I'm about 90%, although none of us are truly confirmed.

Regarding Looker were you for (and pressed) his lynch before I initially votes for him?

Looker votes: you voted post 377 I voted post 385 UltimatePlank voted post 387

however I said looker was scummy in #302, asked for wagon on #375 and I also built most of the case, I think.

Should I decide on order or popcorn?

Clarify?

Re: claim order

Popcorn
In this claim method, the players choose by consensus one of the scummier players to claim first. As each player claims, they declare the next person to claim. The effectiveness of this approach is entirely dependent on how "close" the players are to finding the scum.

Confirmed Player's Choice
In the situation where a player is known to be town (e.g. an Innocent Child, or a player who was found to be innocent by a Cop who's since died), it's typically most effective to allow that player to determine the claim order. This makes it impossible for the scum to manipulate the process.

If we do popcorn, since you already claimed wake, you pick the next person and so on.

If we do Confirmed Player's choice, well.. if everyone agrees I'm town I can list a claim order.

[alimdia]

Just before we get into any more claims we need to consider that Saudade had a n2 action and inferred that he looked at Wake

But he was trolling A LOT which damages his credibility

However, Wake hammered pre Vortuka claim which damages his credibility

It also bothers me that Wake jumps straight in with a claim that contests Saudades soft claim.


I think before we go into mass claim we should say do we believe Wake

I personally don't and just to be clear my role doesn't give me any info that can verify this JK claim or not

The thing is Saudade was a even night tracker, what could he have 'seen' that made him vote wake (other than trolling), keeping in mind wake claimed being a N3 JK.
Finally, I don't really believe wake's claim, hence why I asked if he thinks I'm town or not to see if he does a 180.

[alimdia]

That's what I'm saying- if wake is lying he _could_ have been doing something n2 that saudade _actually_ did see

He could have been concerned that because saudade claimed n2 tracker and we now see that is guaranteed fact he felt like he needed to jump in with a claim today that discredits Saudadea _actual role_

I'm not flip flopping. The above is my thought process. And also other reasons but it's not the time to share them yet.

Finally, Saudade must have tracked Wake to somewhere on Night 2, otherwise he wouldn't have voted you? Now that we see Saudade's flip, we know he was telling the truth, but he might still be trolling. But you can't just say 'he's trolling' to blanket cover up the track. Given that Saudade tracked Wake to somewhere on Night 2, it seems a bit suspicious that you would claim a night 3 action.

[alimdia]

@Wake88, claim again with exact role please.

[alimdia]

lol

[alimdia]

Whats loyal?

[alimdia]

A Loyal action cannot succeed on players of a different alignment.

PEDIT: Why didn't you claim that from the beginning?

Finally... I see that you removed the '1-shot' when you corrected it.

[alimdia]

Also, did your action fail?

[alimdia]

I see, Alimdia. However, that does not in and of itself clear you. Scum team members typically distance themselves from one another, and Day 1 is no exception. However I don't recall you resisting the Day 1 wagon on Looker, so typically Scum would resist. A high-level Scum, however, could still go along with it. Do you understand my concern Alimdia?

That said, I'd like Profii to claim next.

Wanna claim and pick the next Profii?

[alimdia]

Alimdia, how many games as Scum have you completed?

The thing is profii, so far if you look at all the claims, there is no full powered PR role that acts every night. You get what I'm saying?


By the way, the reason why I wanted a mass claim was to see if anyone was a N3 powerrole as well.

[alimdia]

claims and flips*

[alimdia]

I have never been scum @wake88

[alimdia]

I mean you have a modifier that says you can't use it to roleblock scum basically. And you use it on Eibirn?

Anyway, does this mean we are stopping the claim?

[alimdia]

Alright fellas

I'm a Town Night 3 _______

I was thinking it soft-counter-claims Wake's role by having 2 Night 3 PRs? Not so sure anyone though. I don't have any useful results so will not claim the rest of my role.

[alimdia]

Interesting ignoring of my post wake

[alimdia]

I wish you'd read the thread Eve

Loyal definition is on the wiki and also explained in the last 2 pages: fails if targets town

As for why I'm not claiming the rest.. read the thread

[alimdia]

Salad, theres usually no more than 3 PRs in an 11 game?

But so far we are not full powered PRs either, we're effectively one-shot on a specific night, which makes us basically named townies if we didn't get any useful info.

However, having 2 night 3 power roles is the part I was focusing on, which was why I was grilling wake on his claim earlier.

[alimdia]

Sorry but 46 pages is like a short novel!

I will be paying a lot of attention from here don't worry

You said you aren't claiming it because it's not every useful but I don't see a reason to not claim it since you've already used your ability so scum won't have more or less incentive to kill you if you know what I mean. Why not be transparent?

That being said, I'd rather have your original reads instead of being able to have a clean slate so to speak from Day 4.

[alimdia]

I don't like this Eve sheeping

only 4 claims+revealed Salad?
Saudade, Vorkuta, Wake and I

[alimdia]

Oof I keep typing stuff wrong.

Wake, ignoring my claim isn't going to make it go away.

[alimdia]

Its possible, its just that means there's too many 'named townies' effectively.

[alimdia]

Well idk

Only thing for me to go off right now

So you'd rather sheep than read the game or ask questions?

I am reading the game from here

Ok Wake why did you jailkeep profii?

I jailkept my Scumspect but didn't realize what the Loyal modifier did.

I thought your scumspect was eibirn, not profii?

[alimdia]

I will re-read Saladman's posts when I get home.

[alimdia]

I only claimed because I was a little dubious about Wake's claim. so I guess here is my full claim.

I am Town Night 3 doctor. To have a JK and a doctor on the same night? idk I was suspicious, so I pushed wake really hard about his claim.
I protected Elbirn last night. I am not notified if my ability failed or not (I asked the mod)

My breadcrumb on Day 2 when I saw that nobody died:

Alright guys, I'm posting all my reads now, partly because if there isn't actually a

doctor

out there, I won't make it til Day orl

Night 3

. If there is, please protect me again.

I specifically said Night 3 when it should really be Day 3 in order to crumb. I said the no doctor part to crumb and WIFOM scum.

When I saw nobody died, my first assumption was that there was
Night 1 doctor, Night 2 doctor and Night 3 doctor. That was quickly proven wrong when Vorkuta flipped however.

If we think its possible to have a night 3 loyal JK and doctor, then I'll look at saladman as mentioned when I am free.

[alimdia]

That being said, do unvote Wake so theres no fast hammers and what not. And also so we can scrutinize more people

[alimdia]

As in people unvote on wake

[alimdia]

BUT hes okay with quickhammering on looker when his lynch looked inevitable, however he voted anyone BUT looker beforehand on day1

i think people actually need to reread day1

Zote the mighty aka Eve:
Looker 'conceded' to Zote that saudade was likely town.
Zote had a lot of fluff content on Day 1, heavily defended Looker.
Zote was also worried that Profii hammered him at one point

Re-reading Saladman, indeed he only has a scumread on Saudade very early on in post 300, then basically nothing.
He did hammer Looker but said it was a prod dodge later.


Town reads in no particular order:
Plank
Eibirn
profii

[alimdia]

The only reason I thought wake is town was because he was the counter-wagon to Looker, but even Looker didn't want to vote Wake and looker instead tried to counterwagon on someone else.

Plus his JK claim. FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

[alimdia]

You may have voted looker first but you never helped me after that. I'm pretty sure I made the majority of the case and asked more people to hop on...

If you were looker's partner I wouldn't even call that a bus

[alimdia]

That being said, do unvote Wake so theres no fast hammers and what not. And also so we can scrutinize more people

As in people unvote on wake

Why are you so placid towards the second N3 protective role?

Because I don't want another quick-lynch, and the only reason I have for being suspicious of wake is because of his claim, and the way he forgot the loyal modifier in his initial claim.

You may have voted looker first but you never helped me after that. I'm pretty sure I made the majority of the case and asked more people to hop on...

If you were looker's partner I wouldn't even call that a bus

How many games have you won in that town 100% win rate stat? Doesn't that mean you're a safe lynch since even if you flip town we'll probably still win? I see a strategy

I re-read this multiple times and have 0 idea what you're talking about. You're not that much better than Zote the unMighty

[alimdia]

Case please otherwise I'm prob doing eve or saladman

[alimdia]

Deal er...
You're not scum right?

[alimdia]

What happened to profii being your scumspect as well.

Can you make a case that has some D1-3 elements instead of only from what happened D4?

[alimdia]

You may have voted looker first but you never helped me after that. I'm pretty sure I made the majority of the case and asked more people to hop on...

If you were looker's partner I wouldn't even call that a bus

How many games have you won in that town 100% win rate stat? Doesn't that mean you're a safe lynch since even if you flip town we'll probably still win? I see a strategy

Because I don't want another quick-lynch, and the only reason I have for being suspicious of wake is because of his claim, and the way he forgot the loyal modifier in his initial claim.

You may have voted looker first but you never helped me after that. I'm pretty sure I made the majority of the case and asked more people to hop on...

If you were looker's partner I wouldn't even call that a bus

How many games have you won in that town 100% win rate stat? Doesn't that mean you're a safe lynch since even if you flip town we'll probably still win? I see a strategy

I re-read this multiple times and have 0 idea what you're talking about. You're not that much better than Zote the unMighty

[alimdia]

BUT hes okay with quickhammering on looker when his lynch looked inevitable, however he voted anyone BUT looker beforehand on day1

i think people actually need to reread day1

Zote the mighty aka Eve:
Looker 'conceded' to Zote that saudade was likely town.
Zote had a lot of fluff content on Day 1, heavily defended Looker.
Zote was also worried that Profii hammered him at one point

Re-reading Saladman, indeed he only has a scumread on Saudade very early on in post 300, then basically nothing.
He did hammer Looker but said it was a prod dodge later.

@Eibirn, the gist of my reads on Eve/Zote and Saladman.
Saladman seems more like a lurker, slightly more null. Zote was more of a fluff poster that also didn't vote Looker the entire time. Eve is about the same in terms of contribution.


VOTE: Eve

[alimdia]

I don't see how thats relevant whatsoever to scumhunting in this game.

Re: Finished games, its 1/1.

You're basically coming in here with 0 of your own original reads and still haven't 'caught up', I wouldn't want you around in LYLO.

[alimdia]

Yeah its not really fair for the rest of us.

If you're town you fuck us over.
If you're scum its still a terrible way to win, if you win.

[alimdia]

the only other townread i have from beyond day1 is profii, who i'm sure is town alongside alimdia/elbirn

wimpy replace out never gets less town no matter how i re-read it, profii is conftown and alimdia is my only actual townread based on play

i wanna say that eve's obstinance is probably more likely to be town than anything saladman has done tho

Why is profii conftown?

[alimdia]

Why is wake at L-1 when theres Eve or Salad?

[alimdia]

I don't wanna play with people who play against their win condition ffs.

So far thats vorkuta (60% since he was V/LA), Saudade (90%)

[alimdia]

Its null because it could easily be faked as scum if he counted and realised it wasn't a hammer.

[alimdia]

Okay I'll make you a deal

I'll do my best Elbirn-effort to summarize why its Wake if you can summarize why you suspect eve/salad. You may have already done so elsewhere but uhh I don't remember and I suck. Anyway if we do that we can compare notes and through the power of giving a damn we can actually solve the game instead of speed lynching people one two three break

Wheres the summary?

[alimdia]

Elbirn, what the FUCK?

WHY would you vote for such a STUPID FUCKING REASON?

YOU ARE SCUM. No way would Town go with such bullshit reasons for this lynch.

Elements, Eve, you both fucked up.

I say lynch Eve next. Elements fucked up as well.

so you think Elbirn is scum but you'd lynch me for messing up?

This wasn't at me but I absolutely lynch people that lol-hammer and it flips town. That includes you wake if you lol-hammered Day 1.
Because theres 2 possibilities:
A) you're scum, we lynch you, we win
B) you're town, we lynch you because if we don't, scum would lol-hammer all the time and claim mistake and get away with it. And if you're town, everyone hates you because you just lost us a lynch

[alimdia]

why are you so mad? you need to relax it's just a game

I don't like bullshit, idiotic, illogic, contrived reasons for lynching someone

There's NO GOOD REASON to lynch me. Especially if you're Town. Elbirn I no longer Townread. His reasons for trying to lynch me have been complete and utter bullshit.

And that does make me MAD. Makes me PISSED. As Town you're supposed to used your head and be logical.

but town can be wrong and people have different opinions

that's literally the whole point of the game

You haven't even read Day 1.
You can't be wrong because you have no knowledge of what happened because you didn't read at least Day 1.

Seriously Eibirn, I'm waiting on your wake case because I'd want to policy lynch Eve slot over Salad the lurker now.

[alimdia]

Let's not play guess the setup

Let's just judge then for how they've played this game

Who's actions have been more scummy? Vote that one

You replaced in 5 days ago.
You contributed basically nothing. Shooting from the hip as wake calls it.
You said the quote above but haven't actually read up and judged anyone, other than shooting from the hip.
We said 'just read day 1'
That hasn't happened yet.

At this point, if you're town, If you're town, You're doing an incredible disservice to town and should never replace into a game longer than 10-20 pages. You are a prime candidate for scum to leave for LYLO to lose the game for town. And if you're scum... well we win.
Thats what a policy lynch means.

[alimdia]

VC 4.0

Wake88 (3):

Elbirn, Saladman27, Eve

(L-2)

Elbirn (2):

profii, Wake88

Eve (1):

Elements

Not voting (2):

UltimatePlank, alimdia

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline: (expired on 2019-12-09 02:15:00)

'later this week'

Stop talking about catching up and actually catch up.

And yes, keep your vote on me so you don't 'lolhammer' someone else.

[alimdia]

Well I read Zote's posts, they're so much fluff but he did do a half-ass attempt at defending Looker.

@Wake88, given my breadcrumb, you believe my claim right?

[alimdia]

I wanna pressure people that weren't on the Looker vote.

[alimdia]

...... whos still trying in this game, put up their hands.

[alimdia]

You have a case on Eibirn?

[alimdia]

why in the everloving fuck are we voting elbirn

stop voting elbirn

VOTE: Saladman

this is a better wagon

Can we do Eve? Look at her reaction to your post

[alimdia]

Why is Profii and Plank null? Profii was a major character in Day 1 and looker actually interacted with plank

[alimdia]

You people need to stop having lives and post more

have you caught up yet?

[alimdia]

Wake, I claimed my target already. It was Eibirn.

@Mod V/LA for the next 36 hours

[alimdia]

Can we lynch... Eve.

She still hasn't finished rereading

[alimdia]

GG fellas, quickhammered watcher before they could claim, and our tracker was trolling. gotta change my sig soon

[alimdia]

You deserved the win slogging through this game!

[alimdia]

Yea you actually helped hard
That wagon stalled so hard I was convinced it was scum

[alimdia]

Not sure it could have gone thorugh without you