Team Mafia 2020: Open Setup - Game Over

[pisskop]

Im here.

Game solving can now commence.

[pisskop]

Because it’s antitown to out the hoods.

Dont necessarily agree

Kind of in favor of outing the neighbor of neighbors we have.

[pisskop]

VOTE: Elsa Jay

I'm also against outing hoods right away. I think a neighbor should reveal when their partner dies, though.
The doc has utility outside because it can protect one of the 3-4 other confirmable town roles, and I'd rather not reveal it right away.

This a town vote. it is awarded town points.

[pisskop]

Right the fuck now, when every single one of us has three voices of reason in our heads.

I have 5 in my head.

[pisskop]

Yeah, I think Naci is obviously town but she’s wrong on Elsa.

Maybe. I dont recall too much on elsa. The vote itself is town.

[pisskop]

I read people by their associations to each other. By eliminating possible teams, I get a better grip on the game and VCA works better. It just gives a hard data approach to the game.

I know we're all gonna tryhard, and earn MafMonies for our team, but Im liking the idea of TLing Titus

[pisskop]

okay solution is we policy lynch lol hammerers

A real social statement would be to make this game

just

policy hammers.

[pisskop]

Townlean.

[pisskop]

Jingle tells me Pine and Titus are town.

Jingle can worry about his own game!!!

Ive been asked to provided a Jingle read, explicitly read a game to provide a read on Jingle.

[pisskop]

krazy's entrance posts are kinda bad tbh

Not jazzing to it, seems like filler. Not willing to do more than RVS vote it tho

[pisskop]

Okay, let's look at it a different way I suppose.

12 of us have neighborhoods, so 6 in total. 3 scum, 1 in each neighborhood. 3/6.

I've been informed math is scummy VOTE: Elsa Jay

A little late for what feels like an RVS vote? Maybe this was an attempt to progress the game?

[pisskop]

Rereading the setup I realized something interesting. I guess I didn't pay too much attention, but since scum have a rolecop, and can automatically eliminate 3 people from being the doctor since they're neighbors with them, the Doctor has a way higher then normal chance of getting shot.

I know we were talking about scumslips and townslips and elsa earlier. This would qualify as a potential scumslip imo.

[pisskop]

I see no harm in making my tardy RVS vote during my catchup.

fair.

[pisskop]

Some people just like having clean hands, Oka. Don't be rude.

ok, I wanna TR elsa for this.

[pisskop]

This would qualify as a potential scumslip imo.

Can you expand on what makes you think of it as a scumslip for Elsa?

Its more in line with how to find and execute a doc than how to break a setup. One thing I love doing as scum is analysing a setup, iso, or post and then using any information I don't deem hazardous as bait in the game thread.

[pisskop]

It helps to add a bit of false depth to my posting and make it look like I'm trying hard. Especially since its often not even applicable to town in any way, nobody's gonna challenge it or really need to discuss it at length.

[pisskop]

Are you scum here, Pine?

Swear to me mums, mate; this line right here is said between TvS more than TvT.

[pisskop]

I think, Titus, Krazy, Elsa, Oka, Pops and SS are town.

Willing to tentatively buy this list.

[pisskop]

You guys mind if I lurk the first few day phases out? I joined too many games and this is lower down on my priority list. My partners will probably check in later.

-Hectic

dont lurk. lurking is absolutely not a towntell for you.

[pisskop]

read the first two pages and i think Titus is probably town. dumb play tbh but if she's mafia revealing our neighbourhood doesn't help her mafia team. also her proposal was obviously going to be shot down so i don't think she was trying to make others claim as mafia. hope you liked my catchup i'll be chipping in when Hectic is busy

-Mysterious Stranger

I had to stifle the urge to vote you for this and previous postings.

[pisskop]

k

VOTE: Dr Talks to his cats

[pisskop]

You guys mind if I lurk the first few day phases out? I joined too many games and this is lower down on my priority list. My partners will probably check in later.

-Hectic

dont lurk. lurking is absolutely not a towntell for you.

I think that was setup for his hydra meme joke, not an actual announcement of lurking

fair.

its still enough to ping me though. Since hectic is known for being verbose.

[pisskop]

k

VOTE: Dr Talks to his cats

I’m assuming that’s a DDL vote?

yes

[pisskop]

piss sell me on eddie murphy over pine

Murphy is null to me. But the pressure I add isn't.

Pine I kind of could see from both angles. I think he's posting to be right on a line, honestly.


So I guess if I felt I could contribute more with a pine vote than a drdl vote I would

[pisskop]

hmph

VOTE: pine
you can do it pine!

[pisskop]

Think amrun might be town?

[pisskop]

lol

[pisskop]

what if you voted pine with us and when they TT i help you wagon krazy

[pisskop]

Mathblade

math, dont you play any more? or is it all alts?

[pisskop]

yea, but I really dont ,wanna use that to rep me.

[pisskop]

Town Tell

[pisskop]

nancy always bitches about town

VOTE: Nancy

Drunk!Titus is following Mathblade reads to see what the fuck happens.

Wtf is wrong with you?

Case meet point

point, case

[pisskop]

tbf piss your example isn't effective since nancy's alignment isn't known

i have a net town read on her.

[pisskop]

I’m starting to doubt my Titus tr, she’s way to smart to allow Math to direct her.

I dont doubt the ability of a sibling to modify the opinions of their kin.

[pisskop]

Titus, my official opinion about nancy is that it will never be 'too late to murderdeathkill'

Some players become harder to take down as the game goes on; nancy isnt one of them.

[pisskop]

I don’t know. Rn, I’m too tilted about you trying to mislynch me for God only knows what reasons.

why is a vote from a person who admits they arent sober so troublesome?

[pisskop]

I happen to agree with oka wrt his early postings.

[pisskop]

Yes, pressure will be very effective on somebody with almost no internet. Scare me out of airplane mode!

eddie refers to eddie murphy. being dr dolittle.

not eddie murphy. or did i read that wrong.

[pisskop]

He's obviously the Phone Operator.

I CC that

[pisskop]

Yes, pressure will be very effective on somebody with almost no internet. Scare me out of airplane mode!

eddie refers to eddie murphy. being dr dolittle.

not eddie cane. or did i read that wrong.

ebwop

Also going on record that I was unsure about this convo when it happened. Him using eddie murphy as a pseudonym for DrD was confuzzling to me too. at first

[pisskop]

Yea, but on a scale of 1 to 100, how much greater am

I

doing?

[pisskop]

Yea, but on a scale of 1 to 100, how much greater am

I

doing?

Knowing you, 110.

I'm pretty sure you haven't seen me at my best.

i consider myself to be a top tier player. not top 10, but certainly if you got a large game with the best players of the site than I'd have a home there

[pisskop]

hmmm

although a lot of super good players left soon after I joined . . .

[pisskop]

i accept your townread Eddie

[pisskop]

i do not tr heck. yu do?

[pisskop]

yea but the ones here in this game seem extra scummy.

[pisskop]

Youre justified in this scumread

[pisskop]

I am intentionally deciding to scumread hectic here.

[pisskop]

I am actually actually scumreading him.

[pisskop]

Its a personality read.

He is scum.

[pisskop]

In fact, I just checked my tote bag.

Ive got my nails, my hammer, and my cross. So Ima nail him to it.

VOTE: hectic

[pisskop]

NaCl.

hum?

[pisskop]

Because youll defend him for it?

[pisskop]

Why would RC and Amrun being teamies affect your read of amrun?

[pisskop]

RC is entirely too talked about over the 4 games. Can we please blacklist the pairing of the letters R and C for the duration of this game?

[pisskop]

Like seriously, he doesnt even have a chip in this game.

[pisskop]

Thank you.

[pisskop]

wagons plz happen

[pisskop]

I am also det. Pikachu.

det pika was fairly lit.

[pisskop]

town block

Town blocs fail because people call attention to them. Town blocs form naturally, with an unspoken understanding between the players. You dont vote for a town bloc. They just -are-

[pisskop]

it means vote for heck

[pisskop]

Wait, who can make a valid case for scum!kop?

[pisskop]

lol id love to hear it.

[pisskop]

shite. thats a good team too.

Equally likely that kuribo or mastina is saying this

[pisskop]

NaCl has fallen from my list of TRs. Did so a while ago.

P:


MASTINA YOU JERKOFFAGUS

[pisskop]

Im being deliberate in my play. Which is somewhat contrarian to my standard townplay. But my scumgame is not defined by deliberateness.

[pisskop]

id sure be interested in why you feel you can read me.

self meta sucks because you can never see everything

[pisskop]

meh.

my alts never seem as successful as the original, open or otherwise

[pisskop]

I say personality. What I mean is a combination of meta and tonal and a bit of soft tells.

[pisskop]

because its not insane to end a day before page 70?

[pisskop]

im not pling them

[pisskop]

VOTE: unvote i can always hammer

[pisskop]

just one more vote for heck plz

[pisskop]

just one more vote for heck plz

You want me to revote him right now?

I mean, if you do I intend to hammer the moment we get a new vote on them.

[pisskop]

I think S_S defending hec and elsa trying to quickhammer it is comment enough until we see a flip.

[pisskop]

ftr i dont particularly SR S_S right now.

[pisskop]

big oof elle

[pisskop]

nancy, still on board with heck? willing to revote him?

[pisskop]

I unbelieve him

[pisskop]

vote hec

[pisskop]

The time to 'read as genuine' is when he isn't the focal point. he's done this multiple times so far.

I sr his play here in this game, his reputation for being mislynched notwithstanding

[pisskop]

Im suggesting he's pulling out the appeals because of the wagon, not page number.

I expect that if the wagon wasn't present, neither would he be

[pisskop]

wagons are not the enemy. This eg wagon is providing a plethora of information

[pisskop]

like NDs unvote after i unvoted, your contribution, more elsa talk, wagon comp, etc

and who, if anyone, is the competing wagon

[pisskop]

Yeah, I probably would be less present if voted less, but people really need to stop associating defensiveness and survivalist nature with being scum, most town don't want to be mislynched just as much as scum don't want to be lynched.

Though, I do have reasons for being less present earlier, because I was V/LA.

This depends on the player though. I have bad case of acting survivalistic and putting more effort in when people start scumreading me.

survivalism isn't scummy in itself.

people lack the experience to differentiate between what scum can do and do do.

tbh i find doodles to be a loe hanging fruit rn, and the pine case underwhelming

[pisskop]

Isn't the lack of a competing wagon a bad thing?

i chalk it up to site meta being weaker than it should be more than this one game.

Afa pine, i mean aren't i pushing a scum!you agenda?

[pisskop]

let's bury that right now.
unless youre claiming doc, youre fake crumbing. agree or no

[pisskop]

@Pine: what do you think of Hectic as a scum player? Is he competent?

I don't have any scum data on this site unfortunately. I have 1 offsite however.

which is why i think you'll flip here.

[pisskop]

VOTE: nacl

I don't think heck survives the game, tbfrank.

[pisskop]

oka, I am disappoint

[pisskop]

if you manage to get a wagon on me I'll give you a cookie

[pisskop]

feel like every other game could flip scum without me feeling like the tables and chairs are on the ceiling

im not usually a locktown read

[pisskop]

im the towniest thing walking, and if you disagree you're just a poopyhead

[pisskop]

I townslipped, he’s in essence townlocked me

i think its something better slept on. it should be enough he isnt wagoned to infinity?

[pisskop]

Yeah, I probably would be less present if voted less, but people really need to stop associating defensiveness and survivalist nature with being scum, most town don't want to be mislynched just as much as scum don't want to be lynched.

Though, I do have reasons for being less present earlier, because I was V/LA.

This depends on the player though. I have bad case of acting survivalistic and putting more effort in when people start scumreading me.

This is, ftr, where i decided he might not be the best lynch of the day.

[pisskop]

But Hectic can’t take back that he said I townslipped because he’s lockscum if he ever does that.

I disagree, however I dont think it speaks for either you or heck's alignment either way.

maybe its better to take this to a maf discussion thread?

[pisskop]

"in retrospect nancy faked it"
or
"nancy drew 39 has been killed"
or
"nancy its lylo ive trusted you this entire game you gotta trust me its x"

"I guess I misread it"
"I was mistaken"
"Despite the earlier posting . . ."

[pisskop]

OR

Nancy Drew has died Last Night. They were

[pisskop]

Kind of leaning towards town, but not for a specific reason. Better posting I guess

[pisskop]

Also my teammates seem ambivalent about Kdog.

[pisskop]

piss would you ever be so naughty as to purposely buddy one person for your scum gameplan

Seriously? Im always choosing to arbitrarily bus a bud or pocket a townie as scum. And unlike most scum onsite, when I do it, I try to make it look like a natural progression.

[pisskop]

I legit plan out how many posts should happen in between a readflip when I do it as scum. And I crumb my changing reads.

[pisskop]

Gamestate and expected value of the buddy.

Usually, I want to buddy somebody for the whole day or for the day. So I either set up somebody to be SRed the next day or just try to pocket them to infinity.

[pisskop]

lol. I dont disagree. I think that oka is actually up there on the list.

[pisskop]

of people who are most likely to eat a bullet?

[pisskop]

Only people who have next to zero chance of being the NK volunteer to be the nk.

[pisskop]

How exactly do you "set up somebody to be scumread"?

???
I debated answering this one.

The safest way is to exploit their already present biases and ask leading questions early. The less safe way is to bus a partner and tie somebody else to them, or to crumb suspicions and false assertions.

Its all about media spin, baby. You take stock of how much influence people have, and plan around it. Most people dont see too far into the future.

[pisskop]

Doodles isnt on that list

[pisskop]

Game went off the rails after finally beginning in earnest.

People are all over the place

[pisskop]

Wow, I clearly have a lot to learn.

nah. its a lot of work.

I used to keep notes in an excel doc for my games.

[pisskop]

Cain.

[pisskop]

VANITY
WAGONS
AREN'T
REAL
WAGONS

VANITY
WAGONS
AREN'T
REAL
WAGONS

VANITY
WAGONS
AREN'T
REAL
WAGONS

[pisskop]

Where did Elsa go? Anyone have any rituals for summoning an ice queen?

never saw the movie, but with less than 50 posts Im unimpressed.

[pisskop]

oka's pushing so hard on me. its kind of sweet.

[pisskop]

im not even voting you ;-;

ohhh, your right. i could do a DrD wagon again.

[pisskop]

Pops gimme an eddie case

[pisskop]

out the secrets of the ancient worlds

Remember when people would play without reading their scum pts?

[pisskop]

VOTE: pops

[pisskop]

oka needs all the maf monies for his team

[pisskop]

my solve is heckboy/popsof-inscum/pairbondedpoisons with an outside flex of okapolka

[pisskop]

flexpicking^tm

[pisskop]

"setting up wincons"

I think its the perfect buzzword! Its very vague so its useful to push with

[pisskop]

why amrun again?

[pisskop]

I said he would endgame me, and he quoted me saying he would endgame me and said "get fucked kid"

that is bragging about endgaming me

But i mean, saying that to a not dead player is tantamount to suicide?

[pisskop]

my solve is heckboy/popsof-inscum/pairbondedpoisons with an outside flex of okapolka

“Pairbondedpoisons”?

Na and Cl are very dangerous when un-ionized

Oh okay, more salt jokes.

Does it make you mad? Bitter with envy? Hurt your pride?

[pisskop]

amrun's been off my own radar for a while. just kind of started a lurk.

I expressed my opinion of her tho.

[pisskop]

HUH?

Does it make you . . .

>.>
<.<

Salty?

[pisskop]

Elsa why did you lie about how much you like frozen 2?

should i watch frozen 1?

[pisskop]

Skitter gave this for you though:

SKITTER YOU BUM YOU ARENT READING ME?

[pisskop]

She says she’s not even going to try to read you, no way.

lol but skitter, LookAtMeI'mSooTown!

[pisskop]

mmmm

[pisskop]

king snek has digivolved into: fluffy chimera!

[pisskop]

This was a blessed gift. Dont trash it

[pisskop]

pre-flip are so silly

[pisskop]

Vote me or stop talking this is a waste of thread space

gotta say, this one post made me want to vote you instantly

[pisskop]

while im not sold on pops being scum, I think there's merit in it.
while im not sure about eddie either, Ive progressed in reads from 'oh so eddie is a middling poster, maybe town' to 'oh, this guy talks like he has some skelebones in his closet.'

[pisskop]

is it plus or minus rand

Id believe it to be 3/4 times

[pisskop]

that weird interaction wrt the boasting in the hood and pops not vioting eddie until now tho. whats up pops? y no vote b4?

[pisskop]

[quote="In post 1988, Krazy"][/quote]
VOTE: eddie

ill revote to flip pops, but I think this is the new flavor of the week.

[pisskop]

I think Krayz is pretty town.

[pisskop]

Ive been led to believe eddie was a statistically significant player, and while I see a lot of . . . "potential" in his play, I also have come to suspect it because he has a good AtE game. based on this one game.

[pisskop]

I think that's the sort of thing that's supposed to be modkill territory for team mafia D:

uhhhh... ignore me then please, I had no idea.

I personally dont, but I do think its getting a little tasteless.

[pisskop]

How the hell do I not got a single vote? Why are we back on Pops? Who the fuck is Eddie?

I have so many questions.

so read

[pisskop]

https://lichess.org/@/piskop

[pisskop]

havent tried that one. I used it on another forum years ago. Like 2013 ago

[pisskop]

Krazy has requested replacement.

Damn, he was probably town then.

stop

[pisskop]

NP

[pisskop]

OK, could you ISO Eddie and look at his interactions with you and Pops (he hard scumreads you both), and tell us what you think of his alignment?

Do you think Eddie / Me is SvT?

I think Pops/Eddie was TvS

Youre town who got into fisticuffs

[pisskop]

unwnd Id actually like your opinion on heckboy.

I hold a burning scumread of him in my heart.

[pisskop]

unwnd Id actually like your opinion on heckboy.

I hold a burning scumread of him in my heart.

Why?

Your start. I think youre still faking your reads and I think your contributions after your wagon fell off have been anti-meta in nature.

[pisskop]

I dont think hectic is trying to solve. I think he's trying to blend in.

[pisskop]

OK, could you ISO Eddie and look at his interactions with you and Pops (he hard scumreads you both), and tell us what you think of his alignment?

Do you think Eddie / Me is SvT?

I think Pops/Eddie was TvS

Youre town who got into fisticuffs

Based on?

Which one?

Eddie v pops is because they share a hood, eddie is trolling, and pops is admittedly acting funny.

Krazy is town because they feel and contribuite like it. I have no meta on Krazy, but like their play. Their early game was weak, but the stuff from before he voted eddie is gold.

[pisskop]

I think that the replacement is a good chance for people to re-evaluate their reads on the slot.

[pisskop]

talk to his teammates

this is overrated.

I just read an arguement that eddie lied and told his teammates he was town so they'd read the game differently

[pisskop]

Im surprised just how much 'influence' the team part of 'team mafia' has.

[pisskop]

So because Krazy said Eddie did this, you’re just going to accept this as fact?

what? No, Im irritated people are actually more concerned about the hearsay of players in other games than the game itself.

[pisskop]

you gotta do a read, unwnd.

iso your predecessor, read your teammaf thread, or even just check out our rockin red pt.

[pisskop]

[quote="In post 2484, Amrun"][/quote]
team maf isnt quite like regular maf.

Teams are supposed to supply replacements as necessary, and lose maf monies if the mod has to find one.
So favor calling is absolutely a thing.

[pisskop]

That said, policy lynching can also be a thing

say i wont try

[pisskop]

i feel like every slot has a > 50% to flip town

You need to have some faith.

Vote the single, independently most scummy player.

[pisskop]

Krazy Pops has a nice ring to it tho!

VOTE: salt

[pisskop]

Go K

raz

y for Sugar Pops!

[pisskop]

I think pops might be town tbh. Theyre reads are consistent.

I dont recall pops' scumgame. Anyone have an insight?

[pisskop]

Pops Piss Pine would be a wild solve

but not a

Krazy

solve . . .

[pisskop]

VOTE: salt because I liked pisskop's meme.

lets be perfectly clear that any potential associations and buddying is all one sided, EDDIE AND POLKA

[pisskop]

Sacrifice to the blood God

[youtube]v=cAPuZLHxXgE[/youtube]

[pisskop]

[pisskop]

You think pops is fake spewing you since PPP might become mainstream?

No.

I want to see if ed has the manbits to say, 'oh boi, pk is right'

[pisskop]

k.

but will it mainline?

[pisskop]

Ive already promised a certain lady id vote pops to flip them and move this train along.

[pisskop]

Well the question is is pops antispewing

no the question is: are they scum?

[pisskop]

I mean, cheeky, amrun, and I just won a game by scumwagoning and blaming the townie on the wagon. 2 twice.

[pisskop]

UNVOTE:

Elsa come vote pops so I can hammer

or you vote so i can hammer

[pisskop]

VOTE: pops

baby

[pisskop]

Pops if you flip red im going to be a sad panda.

[pisskop]

you put your right wing in
you take your right wing out
you put your feathers in
and you oka poke about

[pisskop]

lolol

[pisskop]

oka, no guts no glory

[pisskop]

they are L-1 now

[pisskop]

credit where credit is due, that was a snipe.

[pisskop]

not my neighbor

your tits.

calm them please

[pisskop]

Now that its been proven you were wrong on ppp
why dont you chillax and be a cool penguin?

[pisskop]

VOTE: UNWND

VOTE: PISS

My current solve.

also somebody who was hella wrong

[pisskop]

Now that its been proven you were wrong on ppp
why dont you chillax and be a cool penguin?

smh you killed pine just so i wouldnt push ppp

now i would think that killing pine is the last thing a scumkop would do.

doc in this setup is overrated anyway. the real reason id suspect is to frame poor pissy.

[pisskop]

yes, i think it does a good job of setting me up.

[pisskop]

hmmmm pops got really namedroppy when their wagon came to a head.

[pisskop]

VOTE: hectic

acshually

yes.

[pisskop]

elsa, titus, dolittle, nacl

^^

id like more out of these explicitly.

[pisskop]

ND, can you please not get us bogged down in krazy versus ND: the twoening?

[pisskop]

VOTE: heckboy

although pushing pine and vice versa is good stuff.


Id also totally buy that pine's reads have some merit and clout to push a lynch on a lurker who could otherwise stall and survive a few more days

[pisskop]

because the core town here is

- ND
- oka
- piss
- amrun
- unwnd
- SS

- eddie


leaving

- hecktic
- bob
- nacl
- elsa
- doodles
- titus

[pisskop]

i think our scum is doodles/bob with outside chances of elsa and hec

tbh

[pisskop]

What makes unwind, “core town”?

I think theyre highly unlikely to be scum.

krazy was pretty town, imo. i think theyre less likely scum than hectic.

[pisskop]

i think our scum is doodles/bob with outside chances of elsa and hec

tbh

VOTE: elsa

[pisskop]

VCA for one day only shows some probabilities.

i dont think pine dying + hec voting pine means anything.
the elsa case is slightly stronger, but id rather put a vote on a sr i can actually pressure.

[pisskop]

The right play is always to shoot at me last night

[pisskop]

Like, the level of hubris ive had to see this game is higher than ive been used to for awhile.


just . . . unabashed.

[pisskop]

In particular can you talk us through your town read on nancy. Why you town read her?

have you read her?

[pisskop]

I don't think it counts as hubris when I was right.

But that's a mechanical statement, not a because-its-me statement. You shoot the confirmed. Rolecop narrows down the doc if there's a save.

im not following.

[pisskop]

in my own words:

have
you
read
her