Newbie 1987 | Game Over

[72offsuit]

VOTE: Maduisha (who shall be named Mad for short, going forward, barring strenuous objection)

Because Ma stands for Mafia.

And you thought that you could sneakily hide your alignment in your username...

A sheep in wolf's clothing if I ever saw one.

[72offsuit]

S

U

P

C

H

U

M

PS

I

'

M

T

H

E

S E M I E X P E R I E N C E D P L A Y E R

A

N

D

I

'

M

H

E

R

E

T

O

HELP

T

H

E

F

U

C

K

O

U

T

O

F

T

H

I

S

G

A

M

E

Way to keep a low profile. Big shiny type font and an Epstein/Trump avatar :O

[72offsuit]

I see we have a few newly-registered players in this game.

What is everyone's prior experience in playing mafia (forum mafia or otherwise)?
Do you prefer playing as town or scum?

This is my 3rd game of forum mafia. I have also previously played browser-based mafia (epicmafia) and enjoy hidden identity board games
I prefer to play as town. I enjoy solving/deducing who is who in the zoo. I find being mafia can be stressful.

[72offsuit]

Dear new players:
please upload avatars!

as a SEMI EXPERIENCED PLAYER, it is my job to policy lynch anyone who refuses to get an avatar day 1. This is uhhh in page 4, subsection 11, of Semi Experienced Player's Guide 101

Agreed. I have also read said manual. A fine read.
Avatars make for much easier identification as to whom the post belongs to at a glance.

@ ObviousScum (OS): As an SE (how could anyone have missed this fact), are you more skillful in playing as town or scum / do you have a better win rate as town or scum)?

[72offsuit]

@ ObviousScum (OS): As an SE (how could anyone have missed this fact), are you more skillful in playing as town or scum / do you have a better win rate as town or scum)?

pika-pika, pikachu!

wait, shit, wrong alt

uhhh clearly as obvious scum I am the best scum player that ever played scum, my scum play is the best, best of the best, world-class scumgame. everyone comes to ms.net to see OS's scumgame. he's so subtle, so wiley, so charismatic. it cannot be denied!!!!

:3

How about you, did your answers change since last game?

Lol. Why am I not surprised it's you DP. Thought Hetic would be in this game too based off the games queue.

As to which alignment I am stronger at, I think I'm slightly better at town.
Though I think i'm decent at scum, poker definitely helps with the bluffing - Side note - I've got a great poker face... my po-po-ker-face-nah-nah-nah

[72offsuit]

First is the worst... Second is also the worst >:(
My brother is in Phi Kappa Phi...
VOTE: Phi Kappa Phi

I smell OOT

What's OOT?
If anyone is going to use abbreviations, please elaborate for us abbreviation-dummies/not-cool-kids

[72offsuit]

artofproblemsolving.com

do they do like classes on mafia or something? or is there a forum somewhere

Or is this secretly a plug?

LOL, I'd love if it was a plug for some mafia-based merchandise. But, ye if you could clarify what sort of site this is/relevance to your mafia experience.

[72offsuit]

so you're saying it was off-topic? I think it was more an indication that was the reason he chose phi for RVS

I understood this as they share a common interest that maybe they want to further discuss in another forum, pardon the pun.

[72offsuit]

I see we have a few newly-registered players in this game.

What is everyone's prior experience in playing mafia (forum mafia or otherwise)?
Do you prefer playing as town or scum?

This is my 3rd game of forum mafia. I have also previously played browser-based mafia (epicmafia) and enjoy hidden identity board games
I prefer to play as town. I enjoy solving/deducing who is who in the zoo. I find being mafia can be stressful.

I've been playing mafia on and off for a couple of years. I like playing awkward third party roles but barring that I also like playing as town.

Is epicmafia still alive?

Ye, its still alive, but I don't play on there much at all now, it can be a bit spammy/troll-ish/aggro

[72offsuit]

Oh we're on page 2

Time for OBVIOUSCSCUM thoughts

"how to play scum"
maybe play scum by being nice? your goal is to get into the townblock and endgame, right, and it will be easier to do that if people like you. plus the game will be more pleasant for everyone if the scum are nice

"how to play town"
even though I just said scum should try to be nice (i.e. "pocket" townies), I don't think it's healthy for a game if you get too paranoid about every pleasant interaction. it can be hard to fake niceness; hell it can be harder to fake niceness and solving than it can be to fake aggression. plus if everyone is calmer then you will be able to think about the thought processes of players easier

these have been obviouscum thoughts, thank you for your time

Is this some weird role play thing where you have a different posting style based on the alt account that you log in with?

What are everyone's thoughts regarding OS admitting to this being an alternate account, in particular linked to an account that i just played a game with.
OS played under the account DetectivePikachu (DP and I were both town).

Is the act of OS admitting this is an alternate account alignment indicative? What are people's thoughts?
I'm wondering if !scumOS (scenario of OS having rolled mafia this game) versus !townOS would admit, versus not admit, to being an alternate account, or if I'm barking up the wrong tree completely and this has no relevance at all...

[72offsuit]

The completed game is Newbie 1984 if anyone was wondering

[72offsuit]

wu seems a little townie
VOTE: clidd

What makes him seem townie to you?

[72offsuit]

Oh we're on page 2

Time for OBVIOUSCSCUM thoughts

"how to play scum"
maybe play scum by being nice? your goal is to get into the townblock and endgame, right, and it will be easier to do that if people like you. plus the game will be more pleasant for everyone if the scum are nice

"how to play town"
even though I just said scum should try to be nice (i.e. "pocket" townies), I don't think it's healthy for a game if you get too paranoid about every pleasant interaction. it can be hard to fake niceness; hell it can be harder to fake niceness and solving than it can be to fake aggression. plus if everyone is calmer then you will be able to think about the thought processes of players easier

these have been obviouscum thoughts, thank you for your time

Is this some weird role play thing where you have a different posting style based on the alt account that you log in with?

What are everyone's thoughts regarding OS admitting to this being an alternate account, in particular linked to an account that i just played a game with.
OS played under the account DetectivePikachu (DP and I were both town).

Is the act of OS admitting this is an alternate account alignment indicative? What are people's thoughts?
I'm wondering if !scumOS (scenario of OS having rolled mafia this game) versus !townOS would admit, versus not admit, to being an alternate account, or if I'm barking up the wrong tree completely and this has no relevance at all...

Wait I don't think an alternate account necessarily is alignment indicative.
Since after all your alignment is determined AFTER you decide which account to join the game with.

What I'm trying to get at here is not about the existence of an alternate account, but the fact he CHOSE TO REVEAL/ADMIT to me that this OS account is an alternate for his DP account.
He could have kept this information to himself, as I would have no way of knowing that I have played with him (OS) previously had he not revealed this.

[72offsuit]

Yes, Jackson. How can you be so serious and seriously town read someone as serious as OS... seriously?

Why so serious? The Joker says hi

[72offsuit]

wait did natsu have an avi or not at game start

he didn't right?

or damn did 1984 actually break that streak?

Im pretty sure Natsu had an avatar from the very beginning

[72offsuit]

Pretty sure both having a No avi and getting an avi are both NAI (Non-alignment indicative) .

Why would scum provide town with a reason to vote for them?

[72offsuit]

@ GW - what is wtmoo?

[72offsuit]

I Don't see the link you are making here.

A newbie who doesnt like town and who rolled town team would do the same. Not get an avi and self vote. Hence NAI. Im still not seeing how you TR (town read) GW.

[72offsuit]

Is the act of OS admitting this is an alternate account alignment indicative? What are people's thoughts?
I'm wondering if !scumOS (scenario of OS having rolled mafia this game) versus !townOS would admit, versus not admit, to being an alternate account, or if I'm barking up the wrong tree completely and this has no relevance at all...

I don't think it's the kind of thing that's never alignment indicative, but I question the motivation here considering (I assume) most of us haven't played with OS before.

This post feels a little weird to me, a very, very slight off ping.

Are you stating that my post re: pondering of Os's alt a/c claim is scummy? Feels a little fence-sitting-ish. "questioning my motivation". Just feels. Very non-comittal.

The use of double negatives also feels awkward. You could have said "i think its the kind of thing that may sometimes be AI, but in this context given noone has. Played with him b4..."

[72offsuit]

Hi Mad, welcome to the game. Can you answer the questions that I asked earlier?

[72offsuit]

Stll waiting on clidd. I hope thos isnt going to be a rqeally slow game.

[72offsuit]

@ JacksonV / JV - you mind answering my earliwr questions?

[72offsuit]

I see we have a few newly-registered players in this game.

What is everyone's prior experience in playing mafia (forum mafia or otherwise)?
Do you prefer playing as town or scum?

This is my 3rd game of forum mafia. I have also previously played browser-based mafia (epicmafia) and enjoy hidden identity board games
I prefer to play as town. I enjoy solving/deducing who is who in the zoo. I find being mafia can be stressful.

@ JV these questions

[72offsuit]

How long does clidd have before he gets prodded?

[72offsuit]

Not sure if it's shyness or something, but it weirds me out that a lot of people haven't even voted yet

It weirds me out that you had voted for somebody who hasn't even posted yet

Yeah, voting for people that haven't even showed up feels wrong. I don't really know who to vote for yet, but those asking for people to cast votes aren't giving me good vibes, and two of them have votes on the same person.

I agree with these
There's no point in forcing everyone to cast a vote, especially this early in the game.
Also it's especially not good to vote for people who probably haven't even looked at the thread yet
It's much better to wait till they actually post something before voting them

This feels like a contradiction. You are saying pushing for people to vote is a bad idea.
JV votes PKP and we get a very non-chalant response from PKP at being voted. This prompts you to scumread/at least question PKP's response.

So basically JVs vote has stimulated discussion and a potential scum read on PKP and yet you are saying pushing others to bote is bad?

Votes are good because they stimulate discussion and force players to take a stance, rather than sit on the fence, which favours scum, as scum can then just come up with a fake 'scum read' late in the day to lynch a townie.

Im on board the GW lynch train.
Jump aboard people, plenty of room on the wagon.
Choo choo

VOTE: GW

[72offsuit]

I have scum-reads on GeneralWu and Kappa

I understand suspecting PKP because of the random clidd vote and saying it's weird not to vote, but why GW?

Overly serious, pings me as someone who wants to act like they're trying to solve the game when they're not.

Eh not as strong a read as Kappa but it's what I see aorn

so how am i "acting like i'm trying to solve the game when i'm not"?
Also how is being serious a bad thing?

This is why sometimes in the right context being serious is scummy, Straight from the wiki:

It's the so-called LAMIST - (Look At ME Im So Town!) tell and it's still relevant enough to have its own acronym! Newbscum usually are very concerned with 'looking good' to avoid falling under suspicion, but don't know how to fake-scumhunt. Instead, they will do things like pushing the lurkers to contribute, trying to "resuscitate" them by voting them, asking for reads on themselves, talking a lot about the game itself (this is called IIoA), claiming they are doing anything in their power to get information.

[72offsuit]

Your post fits the LAMIST tell in my eyes, therefore i think you are scummy

[72offsuit]

Not sure if it's shyness or something, but it weirds me out that a lot of people haven't even voted yet

This pings me weird, people don't need to vote this early and this is useless shade.
Die scum
VOTE: /vote Phi Kappa Phi

You provided one sentence of reasoning for voting phi.

I have scum-reads on GeneralWu and Kappa

You make this post, which seems out of the blue. You've stated your tiny bit of reasoning for scumreading phi in an earlier post, and now you repeat the fact that you scumread him, without adding anything to it. You also say that you scumread me, yet you only provide reasoning for your statement afterwards:

I have scum-reads on GeneralWu and Kappa

I understand suspecting PKP because of the random clidd vote and saying it's weird not to vote, but why GW?

Overly serious, pings me as someone who wants to act like they're trying to solve the game when they're not.

Eh not as strong a read as Kappa but it's what I see aorn

It's still early days. Hard to get a tome-full of scummy evidence when some players have a total of 2 posts.

[72offsuit]

At the start of the day you make reads based on what little posts there are and gut feel.
Scum reads based off little later on in the day or in later days, sure, is scummy.
But like I said, this game is super slow, with noone posting, which means scum will probs win, ~65% chance of scum winning at this stage I reckon

[72offsuit]

Given the lack of posting, what are people's stance on the policy Lynch All Lurkers?

[72offsuit]

Didn't you just say that pushing lurkers to contribute is scummy? Because bringing up that idea so early in the game sounds to me like an attempt to... push lurkers to contribute. Ah, well. I have nothing against lynching lurkers when the game moves a bit and there's more incentive to contribute (so, when there's actual information to work with, but people still choose not to post). Right now, I don't feel like lurkers are inherently scummy, because day 1 has been pretty clueless as to which direction to take, aside from gut feelings, and now I'm going to get to mine:

If I were forced to vote, I'd vote OS or PKP, because the clidd vote bandwagon was so weird, and because I think OS has only posted meme-y stuff, which is okay because it's the first day, but all of his posts are still of that nature and I'd like to see him talk a bit more. Although, a part of me thinks scum would rather get talkative townies lynched rather than lurkers, because that would increase their chances of winning, so I'm not exactly sure if my read of people is rather shitty. For now, I'll still abstain from voting, because I'd like to see more interaction.

Can you quote what you are referring to?
Is this directed at me or someone else?

Please be more specific.
Will help a lot, otherwise your posts will probably get ignored to be perfectly honest

[72offsuit]

I made a comparison with three other games, which he was town. I noticed that his pattern consists of a game start characterized by an expressive claim or announcement, marked by the use of wifom as a tool of persuasion to, at the same time that he is attracting attention, repelling suspicions due to the strong image of exalted self-confidence. Posts 18, 31, 46 show concern to help inexperienced players, being in coherence with the SE position established in post 8. Assimilation to past experiences in posts 45, 55, 56 and 85 demonstrate transparency in relation to the opinions formed, indicating progressive reasoning in order to develop the game forward, strengthened by the suggestion in post 97. In general, there is no bias in his lines, and his actions are motivated to progress in the team-game proactively. This is enough to consider him as lock-town, under the condition of BoP depending on how the first day and second day occur. If he is not killed within two days, however, I will regard his presence in the game as suspicious, unless there is a PR that has rescue (Doctor) helping him.

what's BoP

I agree that OS is pretty transparent and willing to help and move the game forward. But why would you say he is suspicious if he is not killed within two days?
I can see where you're heading, since towny players tend to be killed by mafia so that the mafia can conceal themselves better. So, if there's a towny player who somehow survives for a long time, he could be regarded as suspicious.
But, supposing that the mafia are townread by everyone in the game, they could also choose to kill scummy people, so that they don't get suspected for being "overly towny" or "so towny they're scummy" or something like that. I remember that happened in a game I played a long time ago on a different website.

This post pings me in a bad way.Very WIFOMY, doesnt further analyse a particular player, very general, general mafia theory, barely ties back to this game.

Someone jump on the GW wagon. Get on it!

[72offsuit]

Clidd, can you summarize what you see from OS and 72 that you don't think they'd be doing as scum? I read the post but I'm still confused why you townread them exactly

Clidd, can you summarize what you see from OS and 72 that you don't think they'd be doing as scum? I read the post but I'm still confused why you townread them exactly

Scummy
VOTE: phi

How is this scummy? I don't even know why both of us are TRs from Clidd's post.

[72offsuit]

To pass the message:

'' you must come back and communicate with us, otherwise you will be lynched ''

I don't understand your posts, 72offsuit. Could you be clearer ?

Which post or posts? All of them?

[72offsuit]

AS for my lynch all lurkers policy, I'm not prepared to hammer any lurkers just yet, but I'm more than happy to pressure, FoS and Vote for Lurkers. Lurking only helps scum.
So if you are town, don't lurk. If you are scum, lurk to your hearts content.

[72offsuit]

AS for my lynch all lurkers policy, I'm not prepared to hammer any lurkers just yet, but I'm more than happy to pressure, FoS and Vote for Lurkers. Lurking only helps scum.
So if you are town, don't lurk. If you are scum, lurk to your hearts content.

[72offsuit]

I made a comparison with three other games, which he was town. I noticed that his pattern consists of a game start characterized by an expressive claim or announcement, marked by the use of wifom as a tool of persuasion to, at the same time that he is attracting attention, repelling suspicions due to the strong image of exalted self-confidence. Posts 18, 31, 46 show concern to help inexperienced players, being in coherence with the SE position established in post 8. Assimilation to past experiences in posts 45, 55, 56 and 85 demonstrate transparency in relation to the opinions formed, indicating progressive reasoning in order to develop the game forward, strengthened by the suggestion in post 97. In general, there is no bias in his lines, and his actions are motivated to progress in the team-game proactively. This is enough to consider him as lock-town, under the condition of BoP depending on how the first day and second day occur. If he is not killed within two days, however, I will regard his presence in the game as suspicious, unless there is a PR that has rescue (Doctor) helping him.

what's BoP

I agree that OS is pretty transparent and willing to help and move the game forward. But why would you say he is suspicious if he is not killed within two days?
I can see where you're heading, since towny players tend to be killed by mafia so that the mafia can conceal themselves better. So, if there's a towny player who somehow survives for a long time, he could be regarded as suspicious.
But, supposing that the mafia are townread by everyone in the game, they could also choose to kill scummy people, so that they don't get suspected for being "overly towny" or "so towny they're scummy" or something like that. I remember that happened in a game I played a long time ago on a different website.

This post pings me in a bad way.Very WIFOMY, doesnt further analyse a particular player, very general, general mafia theory, barely ties back to this game.

Someone jump on the GW wagon. Get on it!

Post*, this one.

This post of GW's gives me bad vibes.
I think it is scummy.
He goes at length talking about night kill speculation, yet doesn't come to any conclusion really whatsoever, in what way that speculation relates to any particular players alignment.
Thus the lack of analysis.
Thus the post is IIoA - Information instead of Analysis
Thus it is scummy.
Posting for the sake of posting.
It is posting without adding any real content to catch scum.

[72offsuit]

I have scum-reads on GeneralWu and Kappa

I understand suspecting PKP because of the random clidd vote and saying it's weird not to vote, but why GW?

Overly serious, pings me as someone who wants to act like they're trying to solve the game when they're not.

Eh not as strong a read as Kappa but it's what I see aorn

so how am i "acting like i'm trying to solve the game when i'm not"?
Also how is being serious a bad thing?

This is why sometimes in the right context being serious is scummy, Straight from the wiki:

It's the so-called LAMIST - (Look At ME Im So Town!) tell and it's still relevant enough to have its own acronym! Newbscum usually are very concerned with 'looking good' to avoid falling under suspicion, but don't know how to fake-scumhunt. Instead, they will do things like pushing the lurkers to contribute, trying to "resuscitate" them by voting them, asking for reads on themselves, talking a lot about the game itself (this is called IIoA), claiming they are doing anything in their power to get information.

Your post fits the LAMIST tell in my eyes, therefore i think you are scummy

uhh if I remember correctly jackson was the one who thought I was being overly serious
Also how am I "pushing the lurkers to contribute"? Did I even say anything that was to push a lurker to say something?
In addition, I how have I "tried to 'resuscitate'" any lurkers by voting them? I never voted a lurker this whole game.
I may have asked for

reasons

for reads on myself, since no one can say "I think so and so is towny" or "I think so and so is scummy" and expect us to agree with him if he doesn't provide some good reasons.
I also didn't ask for the reads themselves.
And where am I "talking a lot about the game itself"?

seriously wtmoo where did this random accusation come from?
I'll have to take a closer look at 72offsuit's posts since they're striking me as weird.

I'm not saying tthat you have DONE EVERY SINGLE ITEM in that DEFINITION of LAMIST.
I was answering your question as to why being serious is scummy.

[72offsuit]

72offsuit and clidd are both looking pretty scummy right now.

It would be interesting for you to develop this. I am not sure if I understood your case about me.

Clidd, did you understand his case against me?

[72offsuit]

I have scum-reads on GeneralWu and Kappa

I understand suspecting PKP because of the random clidd vote and saying it's weird not to vote, but why GW?

Overly serious, pings me as someone who wants to act like they're trying to solve the game when they're not.

Eh not as strong a read as Kappa but it's what I see aorn

so how am i "acting like i'm trying to solve the game when i'm not"?
Also how is being serious a bad thing?

This is why sometimes in the right context being serious is scummy, Straight from the wiki:

It's the so-called LAMIST - (Look At ME Im So Town!) tell and it's still relevant enough to have its own acronym! Newbscum usually are very concerned with 'looking good' to avoid falling under suspicion, but don't know how to fake-scumhunt. Instead, they will do things like pushing the lurkers to contribute, trying to "resuscitate" them by voting them, asking for reads on themselves, talking a lot about the game itself (this is called IIoA), claiming they are doing anything in their power to get information.

Your post fits the LAMIST tell in my eyes, therefore i think you are scummy

uhh if I remember correctly jackson was the one who thought I was being overly serious
Also how am I "pushing the lurkers to contribute"? Did I even say anything that was to push a lurker to say something?
In addition, I how have I "tried to 'resuscitate'" any lurkers by voting them? I never voted a lurker this whole game.
I may have asked for

reasons

for reads on myself, since no one can say "I think so and so is towny" or "I think so and so is scummy" and expect us to agree with him if he doesn't provide some good reasons.
I also didn't ask for the reads themselves.
And where am I "talking a lot about the game itself"?

seriously wtmoo where did this random accusation come from?
I'll have to take a closer look at 72offsuit's posts since they're striking me as weird.

I'm not saying tthat you have DONE EVERY SINGLE ITEM in that DEFINITION of LAMIST.
I was answering your question as to why being serious is scummy.

It would be better if you focused on inactive slots, rather than maintaining this tunnel on GeneralWu. It seems much more likely that newbie

scum

is uninterested in this game. Which, clearly, is not his case.

That's a MASSIVE generalisation there. But ye, I think there is an element of truth there, if GW is town, scum is just rubbing their hands with glee.

[72offsuit]

lol?

[72offsuit]

Is that you FormerFish?

[72offsuit]

First

[72offsuit]

Cool, OS was one of my top lynch targets today. Thanks scum <3

[72offsuit]

VOTE: GeneralWu

[72offsuit]

Choo choo choo

[72offsuit]

I'm tracker by the way. GW visited the masonhood wielding a bazooka.

[72offsuit]

Some real top shelf scumhunting going down

[72offsuit]

OS:
It was obvious to me that he was town. I am sure many people didn't like his entry to the game; however, as pointed out by Clidd, it was consistent with his other games. Him being open on playing his alt is also indicative of having nothing to hide. If he was scum, hiding his alt may have subconsciously played into his behavior. I don't see how people thought he was LOCK-scum at all.

Lol... How was he obv town?

He was Null as.

You saying he was obv town is scummy as

[72offsuit]

Well, I have already expressed my opinion on Maduisha case. If majority wants to lynch her, that's fine, but I won't get involved for two reasons:

1° She being scum implies early-game suicide strategy.
2° Volatile behavior indicates authenticity of thought, difficult to fake as scum. Newbie!Scum usually plays more timidly, especially the first time. The way she attracted attention is opposite to that premise.

THIS. Town is reckless. Scum is calculating, has a scum private thread to discuss plans. Scum cares about appearances. Town is more likely to have an i dont give a shit attitude.
Furthermore, I seriously doubt! ScumMad's scum buddy to scummily hammer like that.

Mad is town.

[72offsuit]

Now, changing the subject: who is the second

mason

among us ?

72offsuit
Maduisha
GeneralWu
OldMapleNostalgia
ceejayvinoya (SE)
JacksonVirgo (SE)

At this point, the chance of fake claims has passed. There is no point in continuing to keep your identity hidden.

Agree with this. It would stop scum from ccing and give us a confirmed townie

A Cc gives 50*50 of lynching scum. Should be saved for tomorrow. Mafia have only 20 percent chance of night killing mason tonight. We scumhunt without a mason claim.

[72offsuit]

Well, we basically broke the game here if that's right.

You havent broken shit.

[72offsuit]

Mad, you, myself and the Mason are probably all town. Scum is in ceejay, maple, general and 72

My guess is maple and 72

Nice guess. Care to elaborate?

[72offsuit]

As of right now my solve is ceejay and GW. Their interaction early in the game sounded extremely artificial

[72offsuit]

Ok, guys

72offsuit

is scum. Vote on him.

Coolstorybro

[72offsuit]

Not sure if it's shyness or something, but it weirds me out that a lot of people haven't even voted yet

It weirds me out that you had voted for somebody who hasn't even posted yet

Yeah, voting for people that haven't even showed up feels wrong. I don't really know who to vote for yet, but those asking for people to cast votes aren't giving me good vibes, and two of them have votes on the same person.

I agree with these
There's no point in forcing everyone to cast a vote, especially this early in the game.
Also it's especially not good to vote for people who probably haven't even looked at the thread yet
It's much better to wait till they actually post something before voting them

This feels like a contradiction. You are saying pushing for people to vote is a bad idea.
JV votes PKP and we get a very non-chalant response from PKP at being voted. This prompts you to scumread/at least question PKP's response.

So basically JVs vote has stimulated discussion and a potential scum read on PKP and yet you are saying pushing others to bote is bad?

Votes are good because they stimulate discussion and force players to take a stance, rather than sit on the fence, which favours scum, as scum can then just come up with a fake 'scum read' late in the day to lynch a townie.

Im on board the GW lynch train.
Jump aboard people, plenty of room on the wagon.
Choo choo

VOTE: GW

VOTE: GeneralWu

I'm tracker by the way. GW visited the masonhood wielding a bazooka.

Would

scum!72offsuit

buss his partner ?

1. Im town
2. Had i rolled scum, in this scenario i would not bus when the game is like 70 percent won with mason dead night 1

[72offsuit]

How did i change my mind? What are you smoking?

[72offsuit]

Your vote is just bad. Your reasoning is bad. You completley ignored my responses to your questions which makes you scummy.

[72offsuit]

A genuine reaction would not have been confusing, but would have immediately contributed to the PoE.

Now, changing the subject: who is the second

mason

among us ?

72offsuit
Maduisha
GeneralWu
OldMapleNostalgia
ceejayvinoya (SE)
JacksonVirgo (SE)

At this point, the chance of fake claims has passed. There is no point in continuing to keep your identity hidden.

Agree with this. It would stop scum from ccing and give us a confirmed townie

Like this.

Your PoE means nothing.
You put yourslef as town which is looking less and less with your recent posts.

[72offsuit]

Welcome!

NEWBIE 1987

mod: Karnage

Player List

• 72offsuit
  
  
• clidd
  *
  
• Maduisha
  
  
• Phi Kappa Phi
  
  
• GeneralWu
  
  
• OldMapleNostalgia
  
  
• ceejayvinoya
  (SE)
  
• JacksonVirgo
  (SE)
  
• ObviousScum
  (SE)

* indicates a prod

Spoilers

Spoiler: living

• 72offsuit
  
• clidd
  
• Maduisha
  
• GeneralWu
  
• OldMapleNostalgia
  
• ceejayvinoya
  
• JacksonVirgo

Spoiler: dead

• Phi Kappa Phi
  Vanilla Townie
  - Lynched Day 1
  
• ObviousScum
  Town Mason
  - Killed Night 1

Major Events

• 5 - Day 1 Starts
  
• 230 - Day 1 Ends

• 231 - Day 2 Starts

Ebwop less and less likely*

[72offsuit]

Z idk why it quoted that, misclick, im on mobile

[72offsuit]

Because GW is scummier.

[72offsuit]

Both seem scummy to me for some reason, but I agree throwing someone under the bus super early on doesn't seem like a good idea for scum, so I'm inclined to believe they're not a team, for now.

Could you possibly get a more fence sitting post?

[72offsuit]

Mad's recklessness hammer just feels more like scum trying to pretend to be too scummy to be scum.

[72offsuit]

Your tunnel was hasty and ineffective. Even if it is not a buss, I am convinced that you are scum given your latest interactive comments about my theory.

Do you think scum votes for a player without too many scumreads on them, then asks for others to join wagon on said player, who has had at least one player already town read them?

[72offsuit]

Your tunnel was hasty and ineffective. Even if it is not a buss, I am convinced that you are scum given your latest interactive comments about my theory.

Explain how ineffective = scummy. I'm all ears

[72offsuit]

Your vote is just bad. Your reasoning is bad. You completley ignored my responses to your questions which makes you scummy.

"Just" ? I have never seen such a controlled and superficial response as this. The two genuine reactions here would be: 1. dialogue to improve the accuracy of the PoE (because you know that your role is not scum) or 2. Show firmness in the denials, making your opposition clear. In both scenarios you have failed miserably, as you choose to adopt a neutral stance.

Why would I agree with a PoE with someone I do NOT have a TR on?

[72offsuit]

Your tunnel was hasty and ineffective. Even if it is not a buss, I am convinced that you are scum given your latest interactive comments about my theory.

Ok, so if i'm lynched today, then you are happy to lynch GW tomorrow?

[72offsuit]

Im considering

you

and

GeneralWu

as a team. Checkmate.

^See above

[72offsuit]

L-2 now (2 votes to lynch) --> 72offsuit

Wrong. Its L-1.

Find it hard to believe you would make that mistake.

[72offsuit]

Your tunnel was hasty and ineffective. Even if it is not a buss, I am convinced that you are scum given your latest interactive comments about my theory.

Ok, so if i'm lynched today, then you are happy to lynch GW tomorrow?

Yes, we are.

And when you say " WE" who are you referring to?

[72offsuit]

Your vote is just bad. Your reasoning is bad. You completley ignored my responses to your questions which makes you scummy.

"Just" ? I have never seen such a controlled and superficial response as this. The two genuine reactions here would be: 1. dialogue to improve the accuracy of the PoE (because you know that your role is not scum) or 2. Show firmness in the denials, making your opposition clear. In both scenarios you have failed miserably, as you choose to adopt a neutral stance.

Why would I agree with a PoE with someone I do NOT have a TR on?

It is not how it works. You did not show collaboration with our mathematical solution. If you REALLY was town, you would have concisely elucidated why your didn't want your SR on it and probably would know who the scum team is (since you would discard your slot via PoE).

I just told you the plan sucks. Why would I agree with a plan that i dont see as benefiting town?

[72offsuit]

Im considering

you

and

GeneralWu

as a team. Checkmate.

^See above

And yes, you are bluffing here. You are very calm considering that tomorrow is lylo (at your point of view). Pointing at another player in this context is disconnected from the image of a town being wrongly accused. You seem to be digging your own grave with each reaction.

Lol you are scum or you are town with confbias.

You accuse me of being too calm. If i responded aggressively you wouldve said it was AtE.
If I was panicky you would say i was flailing.

[72offsuit]

Your tunnel was hasty and ineffective. Even if it is not a buss, I am convinced that you are scum given your latest interactive comments about my theory.

Explain how ineffective = scummy. I'm all ears

Attempt to materialize a death tunnel since day 1 that did not work. It is not the first time that I have seen scum doing this.

Just because you have seen scum do this doesnt mean its scummy.

Are you saying you have never played with town that does this?

Its non alignment indicative and you are making up as if its scummy.

[72offsuit]

Lol, I've never seen someone come up with so many fake scumtells

[72offsuit]

Broken record much? Pretty sure everyone knows your stance.
Hypocrite. Accuses me of tunelling.
Then procees to tunnel me.

[72offsuit]

Lynching player generating discussion and letting the lurkers lurk. Definitely not town play. At least 1, possibly both scum on my wagon.
Easy game.

The fact there are 0 counterwagons makes it pretty obvious im town.
Mafia doesnt bus when they have killed a PR.

[72offsuit]

You had your chance to contribute or at least try to dialogue with us. Needless to say, your reaction during my speculation with Jackson was pathetic, as was your vote earlier in the day.

Now you are just trolling me. Im going to stop wasting time responding to your garbage.

[72offsuit]

Your accusing mr of not having Dialogue with you? LOL
Keep on digging your grave.

[72offsuit]

Ebwop me*

[72offsuit]

Day 2

--> 7 players

2 mafia

vs

5 town

(

-2

--> Misslynch/Night-kill)

Day 3

-->

3 town

vs

2 mafia

(if mason alive, cc) --> (50/50 between both)

Maybe mason alive works (without mason chance is 2/5 of hitting mafia) but my life would be at risk.

Clidd only puts forward a situation where it becomes 2 maf vs 3 townie -Because he knows that im town

[72offsuit]

I just told you the

plan sucks

. Why would I agree with a plan that

i dont see as benefiting town

?

You had your chance to contribute or at least try to dialogue with us. Needless to say, your reaction during my speculation with Jackson was pathetic, as was your vote earlier in the day.

Now you are just trolling me. Im going to stop wasting time responding to your

garbage

.

Comparison with the reaction of a

scum

from a past game when accused by me:

I think looking for town reads over scum reads is viable in this setup.

Why you town reading Norway?

I agree, I'm not really scumreading anyone which now which is why I'm trying to work off of my townreads.

I'm leaning town on Norwee because I think as town he has a tendency to get pushed early when he's town and his play him mimics his town game decently well. I also need to look back and reevaluate Hectic's push on him.

Also I don't think clidd is new to mafia by any means so I think it's disingenuous to read him under the guise of 'he's a newbie'

By newbie I mean newbie to MS's way of playing. Which I think is reiterated by the

hot garbage logic

he has displayed. Like could be proven wrong tho. But I feel pretty happy with the level of effort I have seen.

Okies, I have issues with this bc I think your conclusions

are all wrong

.
1. I think given the mechanics and the need for traitors to not hammer each other that associative and reading in to information gathering allows for plenty of associatives later in to the game. I think fundamentally this game functions similarly to any other, just that some of the logic behind it changes. I don't think any play style is alignment indicative.
2. No daychat is common enough and has not been proven to change play styles a heap. I don't think there is likely any way to reliably signal traitor to traitor, however wolf could be signalling. Pre-day Strats tend to never go to plan in MS style mafia bc there is far too long required to hold up and any tenseness created by trying to illogically stick to a game plan gets scum read quickly. Over a few hours or 1 day, this can be expected to maybe work, but not here.
3. I kinda see your logic here but I don't think that the

logic doesn't apply to town

. We also don't want to hammer bc if we're wrong we lose flat out.
4. I think I covered this in point 2.
5. Given the small player list and that vocal people tend to be both strongly town read and strongly scum read, I think there is very little to be gained from looking at in thread charisma and presence as indicative of anything other than player skill neutrally.

Given that I don't really see your logic all together I think that any conclusions while potentially correct due to the near coin flip of any slot flipping scum, I think it would be purely coincidental.

Espeonage has been lynched. He was a

Werewolf Traitor!

All Wolfies and Traitors have been lynched. The town of Hectic, Norwegianboyww, AaronFrost, and. Clidd have won!

Another total garbage fake scumtull

Assumes im going to play exactly the same as a random player - sample size of 1 - you could have had 5 instances of town who stated similar statements and were town and convrniently ignored them.

Clidd's scumtells are forced and fake

[72offsuit]

VOTE: Clidd

[72offsuit]

Bizarre that GW has not responded to any of my accusation!/ pressure on him

[72offsuit]

If neither Clidd nor GW are the lynch for today, then i will vote for whatever OMN decides.

[72offsuit]

Yes, because he is your partner.

States he is going to ignore me... Continues to respond to me

[72offsuit]

Clidd/GW maf. My job is done.

[72offsuit]

Scum is definitely on my wagon.
Should be easy from here despite lylos

[72offsuit]

There is zero chance only town on my wagon

[72offsuit]

If neither Clidd nor GW are the lynch for today, then i will vote for whatever OMN decides.

I have already explained in 5 different dimensions why you are

scum

. Please be quiet and be held in silence. Waiting for real hammer.

VOTE: 72offsuit

Spoiler:

Clidd spoils hammer test

And zero actual legitimate scumtells

[72offsuit]

There is zero chance only town on my wagon

Why don't you hammer yourself, then there will be one on your wagon

Lol? So you are saying im town

[72offsuit]

Sounds. Like. A. Scumslip.

Clidd/GW/JV my top 3 wishes

[72offsuit]

And yet still responded to it...
Why would you respond if you arent going to read it properly?

[72offsuit]

I have voted. My vote is on clidd.

[72offsuit]

At least 1 out of Mad and GW is town. If not both.

They are 100 percent not BOTH scum

[72offsuit]

Boom

[72offsuit]

GW saying he prefers to lynch mad today, makes me feel like GW is scum, wanting mad lynched today, me to be alive tomorrow and be the lynch for tomorrow.

My current solve is GW + one of clidd/JV/ceejay

Probably GW/clidd or GW/jv

Mad as reckless-noob-town

[72offsuit]

i'm gonna do an ISO on 72offsuit later cuz he needs to be looked at

No need, just vote them

No cuz that's dumb. We already saw what it was like to end the day super quickly on day 1.
While I do kind of find something weird with 72offsuit I'll have to take a closer look.
I'm in favor of a maduisha hang right now.

Also guys I'm being serious don't hammer this quickly. I swear if we repeat that phi incident we're gonna be doing scum a great favor.

Who is scum to you, General Wu ? Maduisha ? why are you ignoring

72

all day 1 and 2 ?

Lol clidd is scumreading shading everyone and townreading NOONE

[72offsuit]

Classic scum move, so he can vote whoever he likes Tomorrow

[72offsuit]

i'm gonna do an ISO on 72offsuit later cuz he needs to be looked at

No need, just vote them

No cuz that's dumb. We already saw what it was like to end the day super quickly on day 1.
While I do kind of find something weird with 72offsuit I'll have to take a closer look.
I'm in favor of a maduisha hang right now.

Also guys I'm being serious don't hammer this quickly. I swear if we repeat that phi incident we're gonna be doing scum a great favor.

Who is scum to you, General Wu ? Maduisha ? why are you ignoring

72

all day 1 and 2 ?

Maduisha duh
I've been explaining why.
Her quick transition onto phi was not normal. Definitely not towny.
Also I wasn't ignoring him. More like he was just tunneling me since day 1 and not really giving good explanations as to why, and he wasn't intent on listening. I did say that his tunneling has been raising some red flags, though.

I have been listening. I said it was just a feeling you were scum. I didnt say i was never going to switch my vote off you. I found someone scummier. And have thus switched my vote.

[72offsuit]

Surprised I wasn't cc'ed -> Inclined to believe GW is town given that everyone was waiting on him to CC me. Can everyone go over there scum pool?
For me:
Scum:
Madu - I still believe she sacced herself with the extremely early hammer and started playing dumb about it, as seen by her initial posts today.
On the fence:
Clidd and JV - I have a bad feeling about them. They're controlling the game too much in my opinion, I'm not helping with that considering I have been inactive. Although 72 did have a weak defense, Clidd started calling for his head early into the day, and JV followed suit later. Unsure about this.
ceejay - Like me, he's been inactive/lurking, but I've had similar reads (besides OS) throughout the game. I would like to hear more from him.

Of course you werent cced. That would give us a 50/50 to lynch scum between CCs

[72offsuit]

Thats why i said scumhunt and post before mason claims. But noooo. Everyone else wanted mason yo cla early in the day. Fail move

[72offsuit]

OldMapleNostalgia

, you just need to trust me here, the game seems simple right now. I got both

scums

in my PoE.

OMN, clidd's POE is garbage.

Just go with your gut. You are the clear. Rest of town will sheep your decision for the lynch, if its me, then so be it.

Just comb through the day and arrive at your decision

[72offsuit]

72offsuit

refused to be lynched, because we would know his partner by association. He could've get me lynched tomorrow (if im confirmed scum in his pov).

Well duh nobody refuses to be lynched.
clidd you're not giving me towny vibes by making that post

OK for real I have to go now

Lol.. How Convenient to just disappear now

[72offsuit]

Just out your suspicions beforehand because you die tonight

[72offsuit]

72 had clidd as confirmed scum in his mind and GW as a side and when I called that out, he pushed me and clidd to the side and full scum-read GW.

Because they think that if GW gets lynched they'd be town-read for 'being right' where if they're lynched they think GW will be cleared because 'scum was scum-reading me I am clean'

This game is essentially solved once 72 gets lynched regardless of their flip, even though they're going to flip scum.

Ok. So when i flip green, who is scum. From your POV JV?

[72offsuit]

Clidd shut up. Im not 100 percent on you being scum.
You could easily just be fail town.

[72offsuit]

I want to hear JVs solve first, when i flip green, who the scum duo is

[72offsuit]

Fail town for your garbage "logic" against me

[72offsuit]

Do NOT hammer before JV has posted his solve for IF im lynched and consequently flip green

[72offsuit]

Can you guys explain why 72 is a better lynch than Madu, why doesn't anyone else think Madu is scum-lock? Sorry I wasn't fully following the thread.

They cant explain because im town and they have zero reasoning.

At this stage i still feel like Mad is town though.

[72offsuit]

OMN, are you saying you are only lynching between mad and myself? You are the clear. Are you not even considering amongst clidd/gw/JV and ceejay?

[72offsuit]

JV is ignoring my question

[72offsuit]

Only scum would ignore my question.
JV for scum