Mini 2133: XP Mafia II (Game Over)

[Lady Chloe]

VOTE: Mastina

[Lady Chloe]

Day 1 begins!

Today, you must vote to put one of the following Public Mechanics into play:

[Neighborizer]
During the day, any player may pay 1 XP to neighborize another player. They may choose whether to add the target to an existing neighborhood created with this ability or create a new neighborhood. There is no limit to the number of neighborhoods a player can be in.

[Train Cop]
During the night, any player may target another player and learn whether or not the target trained that night. If this action fails for any reason, you will receive "Your action failed, and you did not receive a result."

[Disable Strongman]
The Mafia no longer have access to their 2 XP strongman ability.

This mechanic will remain in play for the whole game.

Vote for a mechanic using VOTE: Mechanic. The mechanic with most votes (plurality) will be put into play at the end of the day.

@mod: Will any of these Public Mechanics show up on Day 2 as options, or are we not aware of that fact?

Not public information.

Neigjborizer is effective for certain types of players. Not all.

Training Cop is an excellent option for town to strategize. This prevents lying on what actions people take. If the player list all train cops a different person, we can chastisize the scumteam's abilities if we all train and give result-context to any night kill. Town gains more XP than Scum in this manner.

Disable Strongman is tempting, but with the opportunity of upgrades in the game, any player not-training N1 may be suboptimal. If choices bleed over to the next phase in any form, I like this idea later.

VOTE: Train Cop

I'd prefer that we are open about who we would cop to best utilize this option.

[Lady Chloe]

Training Cop is an excellent option for town to strategize. This prevents lying on what actions people take. If the player list all train cops a different person, we can chastisize the scumteam's abilities if we all train and give result-context to any night kill. Town gains more XP than Scum in this manner.

We can't Train and Train Cop simultaneously I don't think.

MOD

Please clarify.

[Lady Chloe]

I need to work on my reading comprehension skills.

mastina is in the game so lets let mafia kill who they please

Night Kill analysis in this playerlist is viable

as in, it's my favorite analysis no one trusts or does and I just want to have fun

what's wrong with having fun

My kind of player.

Hectic we're building a fun bloc, wanna join?

Lul, you know I'm in.

Btw, random thought, but what if we select Train Cop, and then have everyone in the playerlist either

Train

, or

Train Cop Check

the person who's next in the list. That way, the scum who did the kill has a chance to be caught out, since they can't claim they were Training, since there's a 50% chance of the person behind them checking them. And they'll have to claim whether the person in front of them was Training or not. Actually, I just realised this has problems since scum could be next to each other, and order of claims matters a lot. Never mind. (Unless someone smarter than me can see another way).

5 players create a public pool of 5 people who they cop in, but don't out who they cop.
1 of the 5 cops must create pool of 6 because:
Everybody in the playerlist must have their names in exactly 2 pools. 13×2=26

The other 8 train.
This makes scum's predictability of who checks them harder even if scum exists in the cops.
This confirms more town will get XP than scum.
This confirms town exists within the cops.

This is the best I can come up with.

Whether we have a defined strategy over this tool, protections have a 1/13 chance of blocking a strongman kill. It's low utility here.

I like to think of Quest PTs to have a similar utility to neighborhoods, so I'm not convinced of the use here.

[Lady Chloe]

[Disable Strongman]
The Mafia no longer have access to their 2 XP strongman ability.

This mechanic will remain in play for the whole game.

I overlooked the underlined detail. I will refrain from reading walls on the phone.

VOTE: Disable Strongman

This is, and will always be the optimal option.

VOTE: Mastina

Do I know you?

Yes, relatively well. I /in'd because I enjoy the mod and several players in/out of mafia.

No, I do not plan to out my main.

No, meta is not strictly the best method to read me. This alt is a playstyle experiment.

[Lady Chloe]

This alt is a playstyle experiment.

Well let me tell you, if you're town it's a failure already. (I guess you could argue it's also a failure as scum if I pegged you this early, buthey, never know.)

Because I'm pretty sure this is not the result you intended from your alt:
HURT: Lady Chloe.

What do you expect from this?

[Lady Chloe]

Pine,

I disagree with that being a reason to vote change so quickly.

The idea that disabling scum's ability of a strongman does imply the possibility of such a role to exist, and since I realized that mechanics last throughout the game, Disabling Strongman is always the best decision.

Protection roles will never be reliable without this.

[Lady Chloe]

I will not join another option, even to compromise.

I implore others to follow my viewpoint.

[Lady Chloe]

Strongman. The opportunity to eliminate this role's function is present, so it is possible to have a Strongman scum PR.

[Lady Chloe]

Thank you.

[Lady Chloe]

Protection roles will never be reliable without this. (Disable Strongman Ability)

The principle still applies. I will not be a record tape.

[Lady Chloe]

Hectic,

There is no confirmation we can vote Disabling Strongman again:

@mod: Will any of these Public Mechanics show up on Day 2 as options, or are we not aware of that fact?

Not public information.

Why is Train Cop the better approach?

[Lady Chloe]

Lady Chloe, I'm assuming the setup is balanced in such a way that not choosing Disable Strongman won't be that bad for one of the following reasons:

1 - There's not that many protectives in the game/stuff relevant to strongmen.

2 - The option will be available again on a future day.

I asked why Train Cop was the better approach, not permission on why it's OK to the drop the Disable Strongman vote.

[Lady Chloe]

I think only the minimum number of players necessary should do the quest and we should vote on which players to do the quest during the day. This will, ideally, reduce mafia's influence inside the quest and potentially limit their access to the content discussed.

This approach assumes that town is always correctly permitting town into a quest. Scum have the power of voice, too.

This approach also assumes that mafia will

care

about this decision-making process, even in the threat of capture or vig.

To more thoroughly reduce scum's chances of success in a quest; at least 2x town should be present in a quest in respect of the current living mafia.

16. This game is 10 town-aligned players versus 3 mafia-aligned players.

3 alive mafia.
6 townies must join.

9 players is the minimum I'll accept for a well-functioning, town-led Quest.

[Lady Chloe]

Ame,

I read:

That's what I mean by a filter. It's not perfect, but it's something. If scum care about influencing the quest, they will have to do so first in the public thread, then in the private thread. It's just an idea though. I don't think it's that important if there's not obvious support for it. To be honest, my real agenda was giving critical PRs a way to avoid joining the quest without becoming a target for mafia. But increasing the number who join beyond the minimum kind of diminishes that.

I see your point. I like this idea best, thus far. Say no more.

[Lady Chloe]

Non-clarified reads.

Farkset-Pine-Not Known 15
Raya36-Ame
mastina-Pink Ball-momo-Ginngie-Springlullaby-Hectic
FotC

The day is young, fortunate ones.

HURT: Flight of the Conchords

[Lady Chloe]

springlullaby,

Entertain the value of Ame's plan. Read it more than once if you must.

[Lady Chloe]

Ame,

I would appreciate a nuanced opinion of choosing Neighborizer.

May you explain mastina's "mechanic orientation" in the previous game and how that correlates to her behavior here?

[Lady Chloe]

I have my reasons to avoid Questing. I share this thought now since you lot will learn my action either way.

Unless 9+ or all players Quest, I strongly doubt I will quest.

I will speak no further on mechanics, unless I am proposed better strategies otherwise.

[Lady Chloe]

momo,

I see a disparity in springlullaby's attitude towards you and Hectic.

Spoiler: springlullaby posting

mmm, so is train cop a bonus skill? Do everyone receive a train cop option at night?

mod:

Do I understand correctly that training at night would nullify all other action beside "train cop"?

^If the above is true than train cop is the better option.
1. Have everybody train
2. Have everybody select a target to cop

= 100% no nk, if other mechanics are not at play

If else, strongman is also an ok option.
Neighbor is useless.

capture: momo

VOTE: Neighborizer

Train Cop is relatively useless as almost everyone is going to want to train their ability.

Honestly, I'm fine with scum retaining their strongman kill. The chances of the NK being protected by the doctor/equivalent role are low and if scum wants to spend an extra XP point on a strongman, that's on them. It would be a waste of XP for them to do so anyway, so we shouldn't waste our public mechanic on blocking it.

Neighborhoods will give us more information and help us get reads and in a came where we can't lynch yet, it's more important that we get town reads than scum reads, especially with the quest mechanic.

How do you know scum can use xp on strongman? I don't see any info anywhere about that.

Come back Pine.

Vote:Disable stongman

Ok, I have an idea with train cop.

Every night everybody pledge to train xp. Except 1 person who train cop check 1 person selected in advance.

@Ame,

neighborizer is stupid, change now or you are scum.

@Concord

same.

Momo still scum.

Yes to quest. Let me be leader.

VOTE: Neighborizer

Train Cop is relatively useless as almost everyone is going to want to train their ability.

Honestly, I'm fine with scum retaining their strongman kill. The chances of the NK being protected by the doctor/equivalent role are low and if scum wants to spend an extra XP point on a strongman, that's on them. It would be a waste of XP for them to do so anyway, so we shouldn't waste our public mechanic on blocking it.

Neighborhoods will give us more information and help us get reads and in a came where we can't lynch yet, it's more important that we get town reads than scum reads, especially with the quest mechanic.

How do you know scum can use xp on strongman? I don't see any info anywhere about that.

It is public knowledge that the Mafia's factional kill costs 1 XP to carry out. The Mafia member making the kill may spend an additional 1 XP (for a total of 2) to make the kill a strongman kill, meaning it cannot be stopped by anything except for a commuter.

Ad hominem.

That's a great characteristic of.... OMGUS I THINK.

CAPTURE: HECTIC

-> Setup speculation that is wordy and wrong, then vote for bad ability.
-> Fluff and attempted buddying.
-> Afraid of "starting anything".

Yeah, I did my job for the day I think.

HURT: Springlullaby
Scummiest attempt to get townread I have seen in a while. I shouldn’t need to explain this vote and won’t because I’m about to sleep, but I’ll write up my thoughts tmmrw after I meta dive spring.

Should be noted that Hectic is taking a very distinct approach to this game...playing in a highly questioning manner. Haven’t played with him before, but I think his slot will prove to be readable by comparing the questioning tone with his recent games.

What that bit about Hectic exactly? Lot of words for nothing.
And unfortunately for you, you do have to explain your vote.

Are you pissed I found you and your buddy on my first two votes?

-She captures you, with little context but a poor Neighborizer choice.
-The context of her vote is given with the next post in this series; you implied a Strongman role.
-Farkset clarifies to her (and I) that Strongman is an ability listed by the mod in the first posts.

Invalidating her supposed reason to capture you.

-Still, she reasserts her scumread on you - with the context that it had been there since the first post - but captures Hectic.

For different reasons.

-Upon your reaction, she deems that both of you are potential buddies.

I want to know whether you believe springlullaby's push against you is different in nature to her push against Hectic, or not.

[Lady Chloe]

Apologies for the long-winded post, but I must interact with several posts in succession for transparency and sorting-sake:

^
Yes.

You say you misunderstood the mechanics.
I said you were wrong. Aka gearing the town toward bad choices for bad reasons.
Big difference.

I misunderstood the mechanics, and paved an otherwise different strategy.
You misunderstood the mechanics, and changed my perspective of how we should approach.
Ame was openly flexible about her perspective.
Mastina has been accused of "attempting a townslip."
Not Known 15 and Pine have changed votes, albeit for differing reasons under other contexts.

How do these situations yield different conclusions on our alignments - or, if not - how you approach us?

... what?

Your neighborizer choice was poor as well as the reason you displayed in justifying it.

Mastina and Lady Chloe did not such thing.

Are you saying that Mastina and Chloe are town, scum?

I believe you fail to differentiate mechanical choice and alignment. While a sound point on this approach exists, it is lazy.

Furthermore:
-You deem Momo/Hectic are scum.
-You differentiate that Mastina and I are different than Hectic in action, but not in alignment.
-You accuse Hectic as scum in the same sentence of inquiring whether he believes Mastina and I are town.

If Hectic said any read other than null - what would you have concluded?

Actually Hectic and Farkset can be scum together again.

You point the finger to many people, is that to overshadow the fingers pointed at you?

If you want a Leader position, you might want to stop forcing your will onto others.

[Lady Chloe]

They're both pretty close to null. But I like Lady Chloe better based on her recent posts and 282.

Side note: I'm pretty sure I know who you are, Lady Chloe

You may guess to humor me or others, but I do not guarantee any validation to your theories.

-

Lighter note, I like FotC's recent posting off first-glance.

UNVOTE:

I will assess critically later.

[Lady Chloe]

Farkset,

To clarify, I do suspect springlullaby as potential scum. However, the bolded statement was to give her the benefit of the doubt, so I may evaluate how she viewed the statement for a more accurate read of her.

springlullaby,

I will respond to you in full later. To further explain myself, I am not committing to Leader-ing you, nor am I committing to not. It is not a concrete call I make right now, as I'm unsure of whether I'll quest. The list is at 8 people, currently. Even then, my reservations of Questing are only slightly reduced by most or all the players joining.

[Lady Chloe]

springlullaby,

Nothing other than my original grievances of joining.

I will decide soon. I am quite likely to join.

I'd say I'll feel better the more others join, but with Ame's logic in mind, that feels hypocritical of me.

[Lady Chloe]

You have a lovely brain, Ame.

My main fear is we will not have the same option with Disable Strongman, again. A crucial town PR getting sabotaged in the Quest, another.

Leaving the possibility of the two outcomes above makes it hard to Quest and vote Neighborizer in good conscience.

Say, the two above outcomes occur, how may town best approach the game?

[Lady Chloe]

springlullaby,

I'm uncomfortable attaching the word "balance" to a game with thread and role mechanics that I'm both unfamiliar with and don't have a grand reference of sorting out.

Mafia could have Roleblock, but the principle of allowing Mafia an additional mechanical chance is counterproductive. I agree that town having a likelier chance of acquiring the item is a protown reason to Quest. I believe you have an optimistic viewpoint of this game, so it occurs to me that you may be quite genuine and reassures me of your motivation.

In any case, I have Quested.

I am remaining firmly on Disable Strongman.

My next posts will revolve around Capture/Not Capture and a readslist.

[Lady Chloe]

Hectic,

Why do you propose springlullaby to be closer to town but not articulate why she is misled on you?

[Lady Chloe]

VOTE: Disable Strongman

Spoiler: Vote Count

Unofficial VC

[Capture] Flight of the Conchords (4)- Raya36, Lady Chloe*, Farkset, Ame
[Capture] springlullaby (4)- momo, Pine, Not Known 15, Hectic
[Capture] Lady Chloe (1)- mastina
[Capture] Hectic (1)- springlullaby
[End Day] (1) - Flight of the Conchords

Not voting (2)- Pink Ball, Ginngie

With 13 alive it takes 7 to reach a majority.

Deadline is in (expired on 2020-04-20 13:00:00)

Public Mechanic Vote

Disable Strongman (8)- Farkset, springlullaby, Raya36, Pine, Not Known 15, mastina, Ginngie, Ame
Neighborizer (3)- momo, Flight of the Conchords, Hectic
Train Cop (0)

Not voting (2)- Pink Ball, Lady Chloe*

I'm not sure whether or not Lady Chloe's unvote counts toward the capture or the mechanic.

@mod

what should we use to unvote?

Apologies for the confusion, the unvote was on FotC.

I clarify this now as I skim, since I am quite busy today.

[Lady Chloe]

I am both busy and in mental distress regarding forum mafia as of this moment.

Be kind, and approach me with questions and assessments.

I will say, upon skimming the recent squabbles, 551 is one of the most blessed posts this game. Ame is a darling.

Also, I fear that many people speak of my alignment in association to others, without utilizing a direct approach to me.

That makes filtering the messages to decide who is town much more difficult.

[Lady Chloe]

I have already claimed to have Quested.

VOTE: End Day

[Lady Chloe]

So, you pushed someone to L-1 and they claimed a power role to avoid being captured.
Just like I said would happen.
Have you realized it's a bad idea yet, or are you all still being dense?
This day needs to end, and it should end without without using the capture.
We wait until lynch becomes available.

- Bret

Lynch will become available later in this setup? I was wondering how the game would progress flip-wise, then.

I no longer see any value in the Capture utility, especially with this idea.

It is a form to force claims and degrade viable town strategy.

[Lady Chloe]

Is it crude to suggest that I am tempted to not quest simply because Ame is not?

[Lady Chloe]

Ginngie and Hectic,

What do you two mean by refrigerator?

My curiosity is piqued.

[Lady Chloe]

My, it might be more fun if the above was not answered.

[Lady Chloe]

Pink Ball,

May you weigh the pros and cons you see to capturing an individual today?

[Lady Chloe]

Hectic,

Vote to end the day. Capturing yields more detriment to town than benefit, specifically the first dayphase.

There is less clear benefit since there are a total of 6 candidates of capture, currently. Town numerically consists of half.

I find that this is a gamestate that benefits mafia.

[Lady Chloe]

Hectic,

I would like to play the interactive game you humored Ginngie with.

[Lady Chloe]

I will return to the thread tonight or tomorrow.

[Lady Chloe]

I will say, before I convene with Pink Ball and Hectic, I want something answered.

Farkset,

Kerset has no patience and doesn't read discord

Still interested in chloe's comments

-Farkran

Well i was going to wait for lady chloe but this is taking a turn for the worse so i feel i need to step in now.

Why can't you handle any input that you don't agree with to exist in the thread?

[Lady Chloe]

I've made plenty of comments about this game but the only time I am worth discussion to you, Farkran, are the points where we don't align together. Or, I am a question mark based on how you read -other- slots, but not my own content by itself.

I have a strong distaste for how you approach me.

[Lady Chloe]

I townread Ame for her desire to have other slots give valued input before preemptive judgment is brought on them, and I find the opposite behavior with your slot.

What I wonder is, if this is playstyle, AI, or if I am misreading your intentions here.

Please correct me if I am misled.

[Lady Chloe]

Hectic,

As you wish, Lady Chloe.

You are on the RMS Moriarty. The course is set for

XP Island

. However, a tragedy has occurred. Captain

the worst

was killed in a freak accident while

Vending Fruit

to a

Paranoid Gun Owner

. The PGO fled the scene before anyone got a good look at them.

A short time later: springlullaby was found singing poems about Farkset nearby, while Ame was practising her demonic faces. You have a [Hydra, and Portable Ram] at your disposal.

Hydra. They have more eyes for different ways of seeing, and lips to make it harder to speak any lies.

For the record, Lady Chloe, my guess for your alt:

You used to train at that administration and then formed a team with those other 3. Ring a bell?

No. You best be more direct, or find another theory.

Pros of Capturing:

• Can examine wagons/votes for later.
  
• Capturing scum blocks their ability.

Cons of Capturing:

• Potential to block town PRs, or force them to claim.
  
• Wagon information is less useful as it's not that harmful for scum to bus.
  
• No information from a flip.

I think we No Capture.

I may add that even if a town PR claim does not occur in the face of capture, it may be for an important reason as to avoid a nightkill.

Unless the thread has a consensus scumread, capturing is - for lack of a more quaint term - "opening a can of worms."

I am not entirely against the idea of capture, but there are many pushes, and little clarity.

[Lady Chloe]

Pink Ball,

I think that not capturing has the same vibe that not lynching has. Would you no lynch on D1 because we don't have enough info? No, because the lynch per se is what gives the most info about players.

We capture someone, and then combined with later flips we get better and stronger cases on players' intentions. Not capturing is saving your money under your mattress. Guess what, you're losing money.

Say that capturing is always net positive for town here, where do you believe the votes should be going?

[Lady Chloe]

Farkran,

Well i was going to wait for lady chloe but this is taking a turn for the worse so i feel i need to step in now.

1) Capturing doesn't force anyone to claim. You are not removed from the game if you don't, you just lose 1 xp, up to 2 considering that you cannot train if you wanted to. Spring claimed on her own, and that was a terrible claim both in timing and nature. Voyeur is an uncommon enough role to assume no counterclaim would happen, and a weak enough role to validate surviving n1.

2) I find it very unlikely that a town PR only costs 1 xp to upgrade, even if it is a bad role. She said she misread, but then she never claimed the correct amount. After claiming role and xp, there was nothing to prevent her from telling the whole truth.

3) Spring votes end day in 664 after calling multiple people scum with great conviction. Inconsistent and survivalistic, and the timing of the vote sounds like sheeping chloe. This is reason A for believing spring is being either defended by scum or TMIed town, but scum is more likely

4) Post 651 is incredibly lamisty and assumes people have forced spring into a claim. It is not true. This is reason B.

I can compromise capturing conchord or chloe if not spring. I'm not voting day end to avoid wagonomics.

-Farkran

Chloe, i scumlean you - i have no issues with you as a person. I feel the need to correct wrong opinions and providing my own, but i don't want you to stop talking.

As you can see, i'm not immune to mistakes though.

-Farkran

I am not convinced by your latter post. You've already begun to say that you'd compromise on capturing me and two other players, instead of truly evaluating why I hold the opinions I do.

Your thirst for asserting your opinion over others while deeming not doing so - being the more scum-indicative approach - may come from a town mindset, if not scum who tries to control the narrative.

I added my reasons to Hectic's list for why no capture has a benefit.

Can you enlighten me on how you read Hectic and Springlullaby's interactions?

[Lady Chloe]

springlullaby,

MORATORIUM ON ALL CLAIM AND ROLE TALK

SCUM DO NOT NEED TO KNOW MORE

DO NOT ENGAGE WHEN PEOPLE ARE FISHING

I agree with your sentiment, but I wonder why you desire to dominate the thread with your presence.

[Lady Chloe]

Ame,

I acknowledge your claim, and I follow your train of thought on the capture, as I do with others who want to capture but am not quite convinced.

I want to strengthen my reads a bit more before I speak of them so openly.

Who am I to vote for, if not to avoid capturing?

[Lady Chloe]

springlullaby and Farkset,

May you both kindly

quiet down

?

It is hard enough to filter this game with 2/3 top three posters argue and bicker for pages on end, but for you both to assume I and other players pick sides is a scum-motivation or scum-favored tactic on both of you.

I'm speaking to you, Farkran, who deem Ame and I as potential associatives to potential springlullably-scum without even consulting our opinions of her, which is an easy excuse for you.
I'm speaking to you, springlullaby, because your voting is inconsistent and it's difficult to navigate where you want this day to go, you calling for my opinion is dismissive of what I try to tell you.

If you both believe the other is scum, then drop the conversation, and negotiate with other players.

This goes nowhere.

[Lady Chloe]

My, how informative these posts were after my 848

Spoiler: Conversation

springlullaby and Farkset,

May you both kindly

quiet down

?

It is hard enough to filter this game with 2/3 top three posters argue and bicker for pages on end, but for you both to assume I and other players pick sides is a scum-motivation or scum-favored tactic on both of you.

I'm speaking to you, Farkran, who deem Ame and I as potential associatives to potential springlullably-scum without even consulting our opinions of her, which is an easy excuse for you.
I'm speaking to you, springlullaby, because your voting is inconsistent and it's difficult to navigate where you want this day to go, you calling for my opinion is dismissive of what I try to tell you.

If you both believe the other is scum, then drop the conversation, and negotiate with other players.

This goes nowhere.

^
What do you want to tell me?

Also, I'm fine with voting end day.
Farkscum is obscum is what I'm saying.

@ame
The difference between you and chloe is that i scumlean chloe indipendently of springlullaby.

If springlullaby didn't exist, i would still scumlean chloe, but i would likely townlean you. The potential associative is there for both, but i'd look at you with more suspicion if springlul flips scum. Does that make sense as an explanation of my thought process?

I admit that i dislike springlul playstyle as either alignment, but i'm trying to analyze the slot impartially. I have no such distaste for chloe though, even if i still scumlean her.

Also raya, don't you think that scum would be able to fake being a mediator, wrt chloe 848? If you read that tonally, does it strike you as town as Pine's introductory plea? I think they ask for similar things but are immensely different tonewise.

Last but not least, i support hectic or raya for quest leader, as an alternative to myself.

-Farkran

springlullaby shows a willingness to indulge in my thoughts, while providing an option alternate to my vote on ending the day.

Farkran waits to reply to another person, outlining that I am independently a scumlean despite his previous reasons of suspecting me to be associative, and inquires to another player if they believe I have faked being the mediator.

While both may come from either alignment given a player's skill, I enjoy springlullaby's best given the necessity for town to reach a consensus on the game. One is an example of good faith solving, and the other being less so.

This was the hands-on sorting that I needed to read them better.

[Lady Chloe]

Blessed Ones,

And even if spring was scum which is unlikely, roleblocking a claimed voyeur is not ideal

This is the underlying point on why I haven't voted to capture springlullaby.

As well as point on my hesitance to capture. Some PRs may mechanically need as many XP-gain opportunities as available to effectively serve town.

Capture is not a lynch, but some town players may feel the reward of using their powers to it's highest potential to outweigh the risk of claiming.

This is my final point on the ability of no capture. I accept rebuttals.

[Lady Chloe]

Ame,

Lady

(1) What

is

your read on Spring?

I originally suspected her, mafia with either Hectic or momo for what I pointed out in 282.

I continually felt conflicted with her, since her insistence on deeming others as scum so loudly may be to block out the belying noise of scum itself.

Yet, I've grown to unsubscribe from the reasons other suspect her. I townlean her, she wears no veil to hide, and she asserts her views confidently with an option to compromise that doesn't alter her viewpoints. I think if she were mafia, she has placed herself in a disadvantageous and risky position. I have little desire to reconsider now.

848 was to survey her in a different manner than I did before, and I drew greater solidity in the read for doing so.

(2) What are your thoughts on Raya? In particular, I'm curious what you think about her read on you and on Pine as presented in 854.

In a game where scum have incentive to doubt others at any possible angle, Raya focusing on forging townreads is a grand strategy... and a town one.

For 854, she reads me correctly.

The nuance she followed up with in 874 for Pine and I, are hard to falsify with a scum mindset. She had ample opportunity to subtly shift the narrative against either two of us, as well as springlullaby and Ginngie, but did not.

(3) I don't think momo ever responded to your 282 or did he? If not, how come you haven't followed up on it? If so, what did you get (or intend to) get out of it?

He has not followed-up, to my belief.

I have no reason to follow-up until he has. I still suspect him.

I want his reply to that post - however irrelevant it may be now - to see how he rationalizes Hectic's and springlullaby's reads and approach. He voiced confidence in his capture vote, and I wanted to see if his rationale aligned with such.

(4) My spidey senses are going off about the quest. Please join me? I don't have a logical reason or anything, it's just intuition.

You mean, I remove myself from the Quest?

You voice a fear I've contained for days now. But I must have your confirmation, if we are both to Not Quest.

[Lady Chloe]

Farkran,

I replied to Raya because it was Raya pointing out that your 848 was town, while i think you could be able to fake it. It's not part of why i scumlean you, it's an opinion on whether or not that post was indicative of being town, so i asked Raya if he found your post tonally similar to Pine's. I think it isn't but that doesn't make you scum.

What's in good faith from springlullaby?

-Farkran

Your stance bewilders me.

You have yet to voice why I am independently scum for springlullaby, yet you've spoke of this read originally as if it had all to do with my connection to springlullaby.

Someone you could believe is town stated that I were town, but you think the reason to townread me on such is misled. But it is not part of your scumlean on me? Nor is it scum-indicative on my part?

How you view me is non-committal, Farkran.

As for springlullaby, I believe she takes to me in good faith since her reads are committed stances and this is consistent with her approach to the game.

[Lady Chloe]

There is one fear I have with you, Farkran, and it is that I am reading you too literally.

If you are not getting the results you desire from this thread as we speak, then it may be a point of reassessment. I don't mean your read on me.

p-edit

I am having trouble concluding who you speak about in the first paragraph, and how you connect the quoted posts to your assessment.

[Lady Chloe]

Hectic,

I am true about my original statement. I do not know who you hinted that I was.

Will we continue our interactive discussion?

[Lady Chloe]

Farkran,

Farkran,

I replied to Raya because it was Raya pointing out that your 848 was town, while i think you could be able to fake it. It's not part of why i scumlean you, it's an opinion on whether or not that post was indicative of being town, so i asked Raya if he found your post tonally similar to Pine's. I think it isn't but that doesn't make you scum.

What's in good faith from springlullaby?

-Farkran

Your stance bewilders me.

You have yet to voice why I am independently scum for springlullaby, yet you've spoke of this read originally as if it had all to do with my connection to springlullaby.

Someone you could believe is town stated that I were town, but you think the reason to townread me on such is misled. But it is not part of your scumlean on me? Nor is it scum-indicative on my part?

How you view me is non-committal, Farkran.

As for springlullaby, I believe she takes to me in good faith since her reads are committed stances and this is consistent with her approach to the game.

Answering to the bolded, since it is the main point of your objection:

No, that specific post does not make you scum. But it also doesn't make you town - in my opinion. I asked Raya what was the difference between your post and Pine's.

Why would you think that post in particular would make anyone read you as town, or scum?

You do not specify how the post impacts your read on me. Your focus seemed more on another's input. Let me know if I overlooked a follow-up that engaged your opinion beyond "she could be faking this."

This is an interesting question tbh, i'd like to hear why you would think that i should scumread you based on that. Why would a player who scumleans you find scumminess in every single one of your posts?

-Farkran

Not at all did I imply that you find scumminess in all your posts.

I am trying to understand your perspective, and you are failing me in helping me see.

[Lady Chloe]

Not at all did I imply that you find scumminess in all

my

posts.

My, I misspoke. I dislike Quote conversations.

[Lady Chloe]

This conversation displeases me.

I must refine my reads, voice them, assess Leader possibilities and reassess whether or not I Quest provided council from my townreads.

[Lady Chloe]

This conversation displeases me.

I must refine my reads, voice them, assess Leader possibilities and reassess whether or not I Quest provided council from my townreads.

[Lady Chloe]

Farkran,

See what occurs when I am displeased?

My psyche is split between two dimensions that impact both at once.

I must assassinate my clone to retain sanity. Good morning to you.

[Lady Chloe]

None of this was ever personal, Farkran. I don't know where you gathered this impression.

Yes, scum may fake 848, but my post in 901 veiled a solving utility, and you entertained the reality of me being scum more than one where I was sorting; but you did not commit to a viewpoint. That's my grievance with your approach to this slot.

My speech to Ame is related to my agreement with her. I had no prediction or expectation on how she would reply because I was not concerned with it.

Supposing by your final point that your post was directed more to understanding Raya, I will hold my tongue. Perhaps I misread you here.

I must eat breakfast now, I have more to think on.

[Lady Chloe]

For transparency, 916 was my attempt at humor. 914 and 915 were unintentional double posts.

[Lady Chloe]

901, 902, and 905 are posts I would like engagement on.

[Lady Chloe]

I am out of the Quest.

Town

Raya-Ame
FotC-Ginngie-Hectic
Pine-Pink Ball-springlullaby
Farkset
mastina-momo

Scum

A rough outline of my reads.

Hectic,

Where is this post about Kerset assessing the value of capture?

Hectic,

As you wish, Lady Chloe.

You are on the RMS Moriarty. The course is set for

XP Island

. However, a tragedy has occurred. Captain

the worst

was killed in a freak accident while

Vending Fruit

to a

Paranoid Gun Owner

. The PGO fled the scene before anyone got a good look at them.

A short time later: springlullaby was found singing poems about Farkset nearby, while Ame was practising her demonic faces. You have a [Hydra, and Portable Ram] at your disposal.

Hydra. They have more eyes for different ways of seeing, and lips to make it harder to speak any lies.

Nice. You carefully take out the hydra you had stored in your backpack. This one has 3 heads, and you hear several complaints behind you about how you're "ruining the game" and that "all hydras should be policy lynched". Your hydra snaps at them and scares the heathens away.

springlullaby has stopped singing Farkset's praises and is now staring at you inquisitively. Her eyes are sending a flurry of ^s your way. Ame seems to have fallen asleep; she must be entering her dreams to figure out the mastermind behind Captain

the worst's

murder.

Which players from [Flavor Leaf, Ginnie, Something_Smart, momo, Raya36, popsofctown] does your hydra contain? And who would you like to approach of [springlullaby, Ame]?

The hydra consists of:
Something_Smart. popsofctown. Ginngie.

Those three are ones I am most familiar with, are on good terms with, and would solve best with. Yes, this is an allusion to potential mains.

I would approach springlullaby to understand the shift in her attitude.

[Lady Chloe]

I believe you misinterpreted, bottom three are scumleans of any degree of confidence.

It is not a readslist structured by listing others in a category, but how I read them compared to other players.

[Lady Chloe]

I am not satisfied with the readslist on a universal standpoint.

I want to re-evaluate my reads until there are less than 2-3 lines, perhaps 4.

[Lady Chloe]

Town

Raya-Ame
FotC-Ginngie-Hectic
Pine-Pink Ball-springlullaby-

NK15

Farkset
mastina-momo

Scum

Dear, there is too many oxygen-mongers.

[Lady Chloe]

Town

Raya-Ame
FotC-Ginngie-Hectic
Pine-Pink Ball-springlullaby-

NK15

Farkset
mastina-momo

Scum

Dear, there

are

too many oxygen-mongers.

My clone committed that grammar mistake. Pardon me for one second.

[Lady Chloe]

Town

Raya-Ame
FotC-Ginngie-Hectic
Pine-Pink Ball-springlullaby-

NK15

Farkset
mastina-momo

Scum

Dear, there

are

too many oxygen-mongers.

My clone committed that grammar mistake. Pardon me for one second.

This is the original, or so, I must lead you all to believe.

[Lady Chloe]

NK15, why do you deem Farkset and springlullaby as likely containing scum, but you do not elaborate on what their questionable behavior is, and how that translates to your vote?

Blessed Ones,

I will be VLA until Wednesday, or perhaps Thursday.

I will check in today and tomorrow to consensus vote.

However, these are my solid townreads. I will not compromise here. {Raya-Ame-Pine-FotC-Ginngie-Hectic-springlullaby}

I will say, Farkset feels quite town in reading this past page, I'd be hesitant to consensus vote there, as well.

The PoE seems: {NK15, momo, mastina slot, Pink Ball} which, must contain town, so if anyone townreads these souls; please set your stance.

Hectic,

mastina replaced out due to a ban, I believe. It is unfortunate. It is not AI.

[Lady Chloe]

Farkset,

Mastina ban
Looks like it's true.

Chloe, why do you townread FotC?

-Farkran

Bret's line of reasoning to avoid ending the day in 651 is both a unique thought to the thread, and his frustration does not appear fabricated, namely because the End-Day wagon has had no true leverage.

709 and 815 convey a level of dissonance that I believe is hard to fabricate. Jemaine introduces a solve without any consultation of Bret, and without any hesitation of asserting his reads. Bret returns to the thread pages later with another scumread of his. There is no fluff to articulate any change of heart, or action that is set to deliberately make this progression more predictable, so it seems natural.

I do not think scum would out such information about their role in 741. Specifically, because the Neighborizer mechanic wagon never seemed a likely possibility it would be voted on in the end. I don't believe a scum hydra would consist of one head defending another head's choice of this mechanic if it both had resistance, and they were wagoned for a certain line of thought regarding it.

Jemaine defends, explains, and actively shows a desire to communicate with his head; but Jemaine also asserts his opinions outside of Bret's, so the defense does not feel like a playstyle that negates suspicion on them, but refutes and rationalizes them. 368 533 706 are a few posts aside from ones already listed.

1031, I don't think scum announces their presence in such a way in a slow gamestate. It pays them too much attention.

[Lady Chloe]

Ame,

Town
Raya-Ame
FotC-Ginngie-Hectic
Pine-Pink Ball-springlullaby
Farkset
mastina-momo
Scum

Can you elaborate on your Hectic and mastina reads? Regarding mastina, why is she lower than null?

I am biased against mastina. She has misrepresented me 617, enforced the belief that I am disingenuous without further explanation 613, and has utilized an entirely hostile approach to this slot 220 with no well-understood provocation. If this is how she reacts to unknown alts, I must know. Otherwise, her ultimatum of baiting me to out myself or I will be captured/lynched is incredibly contrived, and it frustrates me- obscuring my vision of the slot. 219

I'll reassess a replacement with new eyes.

Hectic? I skimmed Farkset's linked scumgames of him. This game has a different feel for him. I could take more time than I need reviewing his ISO in full, but any issue I've seen with his approach has felt more likely to come from town 1v1'ing than scum holding a certain position around the playerlist.

[Lady Chloe]

We need more dialogue on NK15 being town, not just declarative statements.

[Lady Chloe]

Farkset,

Illuminate me about Hectic?

As a further note to everyone; I am not questing.

Ame,

Lady, players like Pink have a hard time reading more than a few words. Others want dialogue. I don't know what to do. I'm trying to post in snippets to appease the former.

I understand.

Not Known 15,

Why did you shift from capturing springlullaby to capturing Farkset?

Pine,

Why is Farkset scum for his argument against Not Known 15?

[Lady Chloe]

Ame,

Then may I ask how you find this closer to his scumgame? I believe you have more tangible experience with Hectic than I.

Also, you are my strongest townread out of the proposed wagons-

Leader: Ame

Farkset,

We need more dialogue on NK15 being town, not just declarative statements.

Be careful, FOC will scumread you soon for that. He is already furious that we discuss capture target instead of instavoting {neighborizer + no capture}.
~ker

We need more dialogue on NK15 being town, not just declarative statements.

[Lady Chloe]

I am more comfortable voting FotC.

[Lady Chloe]

Hectic,

As you wish, Lady Chloe.

You are on the RMS Moriarty. The course is set for

XP Island

. However, a tragedy has occurred. Captain

the worst

was killed in a freak accident while

Vending Fruit

to a

Paranoid Gun Owner

. The PGO fled the scene before anyone got a good look at them.

A short time later: springlullaby was found singing poems about Farkset nearby, while Ame was practising her demonic faces. You have a [Hydra, and Portable Ram] at your disposal.

Hydra. They have more eyes for different ways of seeing, and lips to make it harder to speak any lies.

Nice. You carefully take out the hydra you had stored in your backpack. This one has 3 heads, and you hear several complaints behind you about how you're "ruining the game" and that "all hydras should be policy lynched". Your hydra snaps at them and scares the heathens away.

springlullaby has stopped singing Farkset's praises and is now staring at you inquisitively. Her eyes are sending a flurry of ^s your way. Ame seems to have fallen asleep; she must be entering her dreams to figure out the mastermind behind Captain

the worst's

murder.

Which players from [Flavor Leaf, Ginnie, Something_Smart, momo, Raya36, popsofctown] does your hydra contain? And who would you like to approach of [springlullaby, Ame]?

The hydra consists of:
Something_Smart. popsofctown. Ginngie.

Those three are ones I am most familiar with, are on good terms with, and would solve best with. Yes, this is an allusion to potential mains.

I would approach springlullaby to understand the shift in her attitude.

springlullaby points at you^ and then at Ame^. She proclaims she's being BoPed and that she is the only rightful leader.

popsofctown offers to play

Advance Wars: Dual Strike

with her. She refuses.
Something_Smart offers to calculate

EV

with her. She refuses.
Ginngie appears to be preoccupied watching

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure

. Fair enough.

This appears to be unproductive. Meanwhile, mastina jumps overboard, taking several walls with her! This is worrying; you're unsure if the ship will remain stable with the weakened infrastructure. Farkran and Ame do their best to put up some more, but it is a losing battle, and the ship is sinking.

Would you like to [Also Jump], [Ask Flight of the Conchords to give you a lift], or [Escape into Ame's dreamverse]?

Escape into Ame's dreamverse.

May I ask, do my answers provide any insight into my line of thoughts? Is this for fun? Or both?

Awesome <3 Anyone else? Spring? Lady? Raya? I'd prefer one of you three honestly.

Free immunity

Raya?

What does this allude to?

[Lady Chloe]

FotC,

Oh, I overlooked that detail.

Leader: Flight of the Conchords

This may not be my final vote, but my next-in-line option.

Ame,

What does this allude to?

These:

I've decided I don't want to capture Farkset today. The reason being that if we get the lynch mechanic tomorrow we shouldn't lynch the person we captured today (since they wont be able to NK). And I think Farkset's flip is more important than capturing them.

So does anyone want to volunteer to be captured today for potential lynch immunity tomorrow!? Pink? Hectic?

Apologies, but I'd avoid Capture for the same reason I avoid Quest.

[Lady Chloe]

Please continue, Sir Hectic.

[Lady Chloe]

You dive head first into Ame's dreamverse. Immediately, a cascade of vivid imagery and concepts bombard you. The overload of information is almost deafening, and you shield your eyes as a flurry of Farkran scumcases fly past you, barely missing your head. It seems that Ame has a

lot

on her mind.

You look up and see springlullaby, Not Known, and Flight of the Conchords high above you. They are surrounded by an aura of masonries and seem to be regarded as

Innocent Child

ren here. Then, you see it. Captain

the worst's

body; his beak is crooked and his feathers tainted with crimson. How could you, Ame.

You need to settle this once and for all. Do you [Report, Hammer, or AtE] Ame?

My first instinct is to Hammer, to arrive at a concrete conclusion for the supposed masonry by action.

But then I remember this is Ame's mind, and not quite reality.

AtE. Understand her perspective. If others do not and cannot?

Screw them.

I must arrive at my own conclusions.

[Lady Chloe]

You dive head first into Ame's dreamverse. Immediately, a cascade of vivid imagery and concepts bombard you. The overload of information is almost deafening, and you shield your eyes as a flurry of Farkran scumcases fly past you, barely missing your head. It seems that Ame has a

lot

on her mind.

You look up and see springlullaby, Not Known, and Flight of the Conchords high above you. They are surrounded by an aura of masonries and seem to be regarded as

Innocent Child

ren here. Then, you see it. Captain

the worst's

body; his beak is crooked and his feathers tainted with crimson. How could you, Ame.

You need to settle this once and for all. Do you [Report, Hammer, or AtE] Ame?

My first instinct is to Hammer, to arrive at a concrete conclusion for the supposed masonry by action.

But then I remember this is Ame's mind, and not quite reality.

AtE. Understand her perspective. If others do not and cannot?

Screw them.

I must arrive at my own conclusions.

You engage in dialogue with Ame's mind. You ask why she would commit such a crime and try and understand her motives. Ame tells you that the body of

the worst

is only a vision of the solve she had just concluded as you entered. She points out that the worst was shot and asks you to infer who did it.

Kerset attempts to chip in but you leave the dreamverse before you can hear what he says.

You pull out your trusty revolver. Everyone is gathered on the ship's deck. Who do you shoot?

The sky. I intend to get everyone's attention so they may explain themselves.

[Lady Chloe]

The shot rings out and you immediately have their attention. They're all turned to face you, and you see a wave of fear and doubt wash over their faces.

You explain to them that it's rather simple, and that you know the worst was shot to death due to seeing Ame's dream. They seem incredulous. Then, Pine points out the fact that you seem to be holding a gun yourself. Curious.

You recall back on everyone's appearance on the ship. Who would possess a gun? Or were

you

the murderer all along? Make your decision.

I am no murderer of ducks. But everyone has reason to suspect me.

I contemplate throwing the gun overboard, but that leads nowhere.
I contemplate kicking the gun in the middle of everyone, but that is risky.

I put the gun to the ground and rest my heel on it. I cross my arms, eyes moving from Ame, to the hydra, to Pine, and back to everyone else.

Surely, someone has a comment.

[Lady Chloe]

Jump off a Bridge: Ame, Lady Chloe, Farkset*

* = Presumption

[Lady Chloe]

I can't do it, she's a claimed power role. The appeal of the volunteer was that, by volunteering for the capture, we knew we weren't interfering with a town power. No capture is better than a PR claim. Sorry.

- Bret

I have a similar vex and I lean town on springlullaby.

I may hammer soon, but it is only to support the consensus of my townreads.

I also hesitate in capturing Raya, she is a stronger townread.

[Lady Chloe]

To clarify my viewpoint:

The question to ask is:

Why both town and scum were content to have disable strongman as the new mechanic and Ame as the quest leader, but there's so much dissent on the capture target?

Possible answers:
1) Scum is lurking and do not wish to engage the gamestate. This would point to town!Ame having very bad reads and scum residing in the less vocal players: {mastina slot, gingie, pinkball, momo, pine, nk15, raya}
2) All scum are in the vocal players and they're staging to the purpose of dismantling any town cohesion - this would point to either town!ame with good reads, or scum!ame: {farkran, springlullaby, ame, hectic, foc, chloe}

I believe the first possibility is the reality of this game, unless I am deeply misled on my reads.

[Lady Chloe]

Well.

That settles it.

[Lady Chloe]

The shot rings out and you immediately have their attention. They're all turned to face you, and you see a wave of fear and doubt wash over their faces.

You explain to them that it's rather simple, and that you know the worst was shot to death due to seeing Ame's dream. They seem incredulous. Then, Pine points out the fact that you seem to be holding a gun yourself. Curious.

You recall back on everyone's appearance on the ship. Who would possess a gun? Or were

you

the murderer all along? Make your decision.

I am no murderer of ducks. But everyone has reason to suspect me.

I contemplate throwing the gun overboard, but that leads nowhere.
I contemplate kicking the gun in the middle of everyone, but that is risky.

I put the gun to the ground and rest my heel on it. I cross my arms, eyes moving from Ame, to the hydra, to Pine, and back to everyone else.

Surely, someone has a comment.

Raya36 steps forwards to address you. Her gaze darts to the gun resting beneath your heel, then at you, and then flicker over to momo. You follow her eyes:



Now that you notice it; momo does seem to be holding a submachine gun. Interesting.

Your hydra notices too and growls silently. You see momo's fingers tense on his gun.

Do you [Quickdraw your

other

Trusty Revolver, Cast Fireball, or use the Power of Friendship]?

I challenge my foe with my

other

Trusty Revolver.

Miss Lady Chloe is what you would call a Boss Battle.

[Lady Chloe]

My readslist is at 4 lines.

My conviction rises.

[Lady Chloe]

Perhaps I should be open here.

Town

Ame-Raya
springlullaby-FoC-Farkset-Pine-Ginngie-Hectic
(mastina slot)-Pink Ball
NK15-momo

Scum

I will not predict or strategize around nightkills on D1.

Usually, they're either incorrect, or disrupt and doubtcast my own read progression within a game.

[Lady Chloe]

I did not anticipate the kills.

VOTE: Lynch

I will reevaluate my readslist in a day or two, I had a correct and an incorrect read.

[Lady Chloe]

May someone tell me who the Leader was and where the votes were placed?

[Lady Chloe]

We have no public mechanic to vote on today?

[Lady Chloe]

Ame and Knight,

May someone tell me who the Leader was and where the votes were placed?

Did you expect something different to occur from the public decision?

Not particularly, but decisions could have changed upon further dialogue. Furthermore, I have 0 context for half the positions people are stating in this thread currently, and I distrust that you opened the thread discrediting my transition EoD1 instead of being transparent. 1295

I did not anticipate the kills.

That's an odd way to start the day. What did you anticipate?

My nightkill.

[Lady Chloe]

speinglullaby,

Do you all have mush for brain.

> The lynch mechanic was unlocked by mafia dying.
> The gift mechanic is pointless and Pine says he fucked it up> it was the gift.

The fact that Ame doesn't interrogate it means they are scum.
They are also very probably a NK immune mafia, which is why they claimed what they claimed to draw the kill.

It's fucking easy.

Break this down for me.

Pine,

What possible reason would I have for inventing a story like that, Spring? You just don't like that I scumread you.

Elaborate, please.

lol *reveals largest scum tell about never interacting with my teammates*

Declares Ginngie scum with someone he shouted into the high heavens as 100% town.

ARE YOU KIDDING ME

Who is 100% town? I assume Pine?

[Lady Chloe]

sp

r

inglullaby,

Do you all have mush for brain.

> The lynch mechanic was unlocked by mafia dying.
> The gift mechanic is pointless and Pine says he fucked it up> it was the gift.

The fact that Ame doesn't interrogate it means they are scum.
They are also very probably a NK immune mafia, which is why they claimed what they claimed to draw the kill.

It's fucking easy.

Break this down for me.

Pine,

What possible reason would I have for inventing a story like that, Spring? You just don't like that I scumread you.

Elaborate, please.

Ginngie

lol *reveals largest scum tell about never interacting with my teammates*

Declares Ginngie scum with someone he shouted into the high heavens as 100% town.

ARE YOU KIDDING ME

Who is 100% town? I assume Pine?

Dear.

[Lady Chloe]

Raya,

Where do you find Pine-Ginngie being scum as most probable here?

Ginngie,

Hey Pine you're fucking here.

You're one of my favorite people I play with, do you agree that I avoid you when we're scum together and not if at least one of us is T.

What did you expect Pine to reply with here?

Knight,

@Ginngie you're hilarious, you're saying that you're aware of your apparent scum meta and you wouldn't play against it?

Yes because heart rate which is involuntary and posting which is voluntary is the same thing.

Ginggie stop fucking around

Irony laughed, then died laughing

Are you going to remain a mouthpiece echo of Ame's assessment on Ginngie or do you plan to enlighten me?

Pine,

Yes, and how has the recent information not changed the scumread or supported it?

[Lady Chloe]

Pink Ball,

> Doesn't disclose result of quest item and who they give it to.

Can we lynch this?

I find some of your posting insightful.

Scum and town were nightkilled, and the heat within the thread has doubled, does the pressure originate more from town or scum?