Jigsaw's Revenge - Game Over

[Battle Mage]

Vote: Blake Belladonna

[Battle Mage]

Vote: Blake Belladonna

[Battle Mage]

VOTE: Battle Mage
Failed vote clearly scum fake-RVSing their partner

Before you go! What do you mean by this?

I think she didn't read properly. Worrying signs on Page 2.

[Battle Mage]

This playerlist is sick.

It's a pandemic.

[Battle Mage]

Vote: Blake Belladonna

Vote: Blake Belladonna

Good field work out there, Battle Mage. Blake Belladonna, I believe Battle Mage may want you to notice him.

I noticed.

I'm onto you

[Battle Mage]

Guys, only 7 more to lynch! We can make this the, like third shortest large theme day 1 ever!

Sorry, not much of a bw type

Spoilsport!

Unvote, Vote: A50

[Battle Mage]

Guys, only 7 more to lynch! We can make this the, like third shortest large theme day 1 ever!

Sorry, not much of a bw type

ive been saying, that you are the #1 person on this site at reading me...
i wonder if you still can retain this title after so long ?
we will see

why you assume he's town?

[Battle Mage]

@Mod: Why 12 to lynch? Am I secretly loved??

No I just can't do math <.<

We still get 3 kills per night though right?

[Battle Mage]

VOTE: farside
thats a super awkward response to me
i think she might have actually pulled scum here

This is probably my first game with farside in a few years, can we not finger her on the second page?

Gross dude.

[Battle Mage]

VOTE: xtomx
I am also the worst at previewing my post.

?

Your comment implies you know I'm town.
As scum i wouldn't have to figure anything out.

I won't charge you for that one

[Battle Mage]

VOTE: farside
thats a super awkward response to me
i think she might have actually pulled scum here

I have to hard agree. It feels like Farside is framing that as a scumslip, when it was actually just a cheeky comment on their meta.

VOTE: Farside

I will 'hard' disagree.

[Battle Mage]

I’d assume Detectic over here knows what he’s doing and would use gloves

Btw far side are you just farside22? I’ve okayed like one game with you if so.

One and only.

VOTE: farside
thats a super awkward response to me
i think she might have actually pulled scum here

You want to explain your comment?
Do you think i would try to sort you as scum?

Ah no way, I remember you! trippy

[Battle Mage]

By the way im wantes to comment about being fingered by pisskop, but he's like a kid brother and the idea gave me hives.

the reality might have given you something a lot worse...

[Battle Mage]

I’d assume Detectic over here knows what he’s doing and would use gloves

Btw far side are you just farside22? I’ve okayed like one game with you if so.

One and only.

VOTE: farside
thats a super awkward response to me
i think she might have actually pulled scum here

You want to explain your comment?
Do you think i would try to sort you as scum?

Ah no way, I remember you! trippy

*waves*

I remember many here. Its crazy to see so many still here after all this time.

I came back a few weeks ago, after about 10 years out!

[Battle Mage]

I will "hard" ask you why?

have a cold shower, and ask me tomorrow....creep.

[Battle Mage]

i'm reading, but have nothing to add.

[Battle Mage]

Has anyone in this game played with Morning Tweet before? I'm not really liking the vibes I'm getting from her, but I don't if that's normal.

Post #165 is a clear attempt at budding someone that appears to be a town leader going into the game, but her posts become most problematic when you get to Post #174.

"But what if it's

, like,

one of those doors"

When speaking out loud, people naturally add in filled words such as "like" or "um" to fill space because they are uncomfortable with silence while they are thinking. Making a post with the word "like" as Morning Tweet did here is not natural, it's a deliberate decision. The only possible motivation I can imagine for that decision is to appear more trustworthy/relateable. There's no reason for town to make that decision and for that reason, I .

I dig it VOTE: Morning Tweet

[Battle Mage]

So here's what I'm thinking:
1) It's not safe to massclaim our PTs

Why not? If what you say is true, then wouldn't scum already know what PT's we're all in, if everyone is supposed to post in them?

I would agree with you, but my PT representative says I'm not allowed.

[Battle Mage]

So here's what I'm thinking:
1) It's not safe to massclaim our PTs

Why not? If what you say is true, then wouldn't scum already know what PT's we're all in, if everyone is supposed to post in them?

Scum might not be in one or more.

all the more reason to massclaim and find dem scumz

[Battle Mage]

How does massclaiming hoods catch scum rn?

I don't flippin know....maybe some of the scum aren't in neighbourhoods, and we can out them that way.

[Battle Mage]

Am I reading this correctly? you drew my alignment from the use of the word "like"?

umm, like, yeah

[Battle Mage]

only kidding. I thought you kissing ABR's bum, and then conspicuously failing to engage with anything he said, was scummy.

[Battle Mage]

ah, okay! i wanted to discuss a little with my PT first

it looks like im going to be the ambassador for my PT!

the scum PT?

[Battle Mage]

ah, okay! i wanted to discuss a little with my PT first

it looks like im going to be the ambassador for my PT!

the scum PT?

(≧ω≦) no

what on earth is that??

you passed my test by the way well done. Evaded my clever trap!

[Battle Mage]

Gamma Emerald
GeorgeBailey
GuiltyLion
momo
pisskop
Xtoxm
---
Elsa Jay
Almost50

For my own reference later.

Great idea. This one is for my reference later...

Pine
momo
Morning Tweet
Elsa Jay
Gamma Emerald
VaultDweller
Vecna
Hectic
iDanyboy
GeorgeBailey
Drixx
davesaz
farside
Battle Mage
BBmolla
GuiltyLion
pisskop
Albert B. Rampage
Almost50
xtoxm
Blake Belladonna
Game Over

[Battle Mage]

excellent work Momo, you will go far.

[Battle Mage]

MOD: Who is Ranmaru?

[Battle Mage]

MOD: Who is Ranmaru?

He's a spectator. Someone who played in my last large theme, The Thing Mafia.

Those Who Watch Over Us = Spectators
Those Who Would Save Us = Replacements
Moments in Our Lives = Day/Night Starts

ah thanks!

[Battle Mage]

Am I reading this correctly? you drew my alignment from the use of the word "like"?

Not entirely. Seeing it gave me the urge to read your iso, and BM nailed the characterization of your interactions with ABR pretty well. This is furthered by you making post 207 after BM expressed his concerns but not responding to them.

I'm inclined to believe the support you've gotten regarding your tone from the other members of the town but I have three questions for you before I do.
1. Why didn't you respond to BM's thoughts of your interactions with ABR?
2. Why are you trying to buddy ABR? Do you have any reads that you want ABR's support to get hear or is it just to ensure your protection?
3. If this casual tone is something that you keep constant across all games, why do you choose to use it?

1. He said he thought it was scummy when I said "I love this guy!", because he perceived that as buddying-- I don't really.. see it that way. I do love the effort Albert is putting in!
2. this is a bit of a loaded question.. I'm not buddying ABR. I like him and what he's trying to get started regarding the neighbourhood nonsense (^ω^)
3. I played very seriously when I originally joined the site in 2016. It made me anxious and i had so little fun that I left the site. Now I'm having way more fun!

addendum: i don't equate a more casual playstyle with throwing the game, either. On day one especially, I try to find a few solid townreads. i think it's unreasonable for me to catch scum on the first day, so I *mostly* just find varying degrees of towniness and vote outside of that

This is a very good post. MT is denying the premise of my accusations but doing so with nuance. It's honestly what I would imagine as a town response to my post. UNVOTE:

I agree, but I don't feel quite as strongly as you! Happy with answers 2 and 3. Addendum is weak - I always hate the idea that townies are not looking for scum on Day 1 - even if it's actually how you play, saying it just feels counterintuitive. There remains an issue with answer 1 that I don't think you're looking from the perspective of trying to work out who is town or scum. Although you indicate in the addendum that's a playstyle choice, it doesn't sit great with me. A good townie is always paranoid (or maybe that's just me )

Unvote

[Battle Mage]

Xtoxm you coming back to play or respond to this game?
I didn't get the case meno made. Well i should say its a bit reachy so i feel neh about it.
@abr: not sure if you missed what my issue was. If there is no way to know who has access to the neighborhood, how do you know if every player posted is in the pt or not.
I really wasn't trying to say that bluntly because i didn't want to give scum any ideas but it's the biggest flaw to scum hunting the pt.

I share this concern.

I believe scum's fake claims are linked with there PT, so if it get's to late game and some one claims a flavor and that person should be in your respective hood they are probably scum.

What? Where did this come from?

Needs a home,

Vote: Danyboy

[Battle Mage]

that doesn't answer my question. What on earth are you talking about??

You believe scum's fake claims are linked with their PT - how come?

Feel like it COULD be a slip as I have no idea where you got this alleged info on the scum PT and flavour claims.

[Battle Mage]

Lets say you are in the PT flavored gorillas, and some one claims orangutan and they haven't posted in your PT, then they are scum. This way scum are punished for not posting in there PT.

I don't follow, maybe you can explain it to me in the PT?

[Battle Mage]

Lets say you are in the PT flavored gorillas, and some one claims orangutan and they haven't posted in your PT, then they are scum. This way scum are punished for not posting in there PT.

Jokes aside, I still have no idea how you 'know' that scum have fakeclaims in their own PT. Maybe I'm just thick, or you could be scum I guess.

[Battle Mage]

Anyone in a hood with flavor that fits with the hood could make that assumption, and it seems pretty valid to me.

my hood doesn't have flavour, does yours?

[Battle Mage]

Dave probably means a flavor of characters that are related or something to others.

For example, the Survivors of Saw 2 can have a PT together, or Saw V, ect.

I see...maybe I have flavour and don't realise it then? good thing im town I guess haha...

[Battle Mage]

I'm in a PT with

Battle Mage - who knows with this guy

I laughed.

[Battle Mage]

I believe scum's fake claims are linked with there PT, so if it get's to late game and some one claims a flavor and that person should be in your respective hood they are probably scum.

That's such a random deduction to make! I mean.. I can't really argue with it though.

i actually kinda think Dany wouldn't say this as scum, since if he were scum, he'd know the answer to whether or not their fake claims align with the PTs, and be less likely to just randomly comment on it

well, I mean that's the point of a slip isn't it. He knows something only scum know.

I know what you're saying here, but I'd argue that as town, he has no reason at all to PRETEND to know what fakeclaim options scum have. As scum, it's just about conceivable that he would be sloppy enough to admit he knew this in the game.

I have no idea how you "can't really argue with it" - because if you're town, you have no idea if it's true or not.

[Battle Mage]

I believe scum's fake claims are linked with there PT, so if it get's to late game and some one claims a flavor and that person should be in your respective hood they are probably scum.

That's such a random deduction to make! I mean.. I can't really argue with it though.

i actually kinda think Dany wouldn't say this as scum, since if he were scum, he'd know the answer to whether or not their fake claims align with the PTs, and be less likely to just randomly comment on it

well, I mean that's the point of a slip isn't it. He knows something only scum know.

I know what you're saying here, but I'd argue that as town, he has no reason at all to PRETEND to know what fakeclaim options scum have. As scum, it's just about conceivable that he would be sloppy enough to admit he knew this in the game.

I have no idea how you "can't really argue with it" - because if you're town, you have no idea if it's true or not.

Do you think it's possible that scum has been given fakeclaims that don't align with their PT?

*shrug* I haven't got a scooby

[Battle Mage]

I don't know what to tell ya Drixx. I just copied and pasted the player list from the first page as a joke.

Hello all you lovely people. So I'm in a hood, and our dear mod declined to give us a roster of who is in there.

I find it unusual that nobody has commented on this post.

I'm in a daychat PT too. There are at least 3 other players in it.

There are 21 players total, 16 town and 5 same-side scum.

Let's make some assumptions.

There are two neighborhoods or more, each with at least 4 players.

Nobody picked up on Drixx's post, because they don't want to out themselves as in his Private Topic or in a PT at all. If people weren't in a hood, they would be more interested in Drixx who claimed he was in one. Nothing in the setup said anything about PTs, except that daychat is active for all of them. So we have to assume everyone is in one.

Now what bothers me is the player count. Why 21 players and not 20? With 20 players, you can have 4-player or 5-player PTs with an even distribution.

21 can only be divided by 7. So are there 3 PTs, with 7 players each? If so, in my PT, 3 players have stayed on the sidelines so far, with 4 including myself announcing our presence, and in another PT, we know of Drixx.

What are possible distributions of scum in the PTs in 3 7-player PTs? 2-2-1, 2-3-0, or 5-0-0. The first one is the most likely (60%), the second one unlikely (30%), and the third option highly improbable (10%).

Therefore, if my assumption is correct that we're all in a PT, and that we all have scum in our PT, it's not safe to post our insights in the PTs as scum have daytalk and can share information, keeping the town out of the loop on content and slowing down scumhunting.

There's another possibility, however:

There could be a masons.

In this case, 21 players could break down like this:
3 masons in their hood
18 players remaining, 3 hoods with 6 players each

So here's what I'm thinking:
1) It's not safe to massclaim our PTs
2) It's safe for someone to claim not to be in a PT, although they might be lying about it and we don't have the means to verify.
3) If you're in a PT, you should announce your presence to the PT participants. Otherwise, you are damaging town cohesion and would therefore most likely be scum.
4) As the game progresses, if we clean out 2 scum from a single PT, it's probable that the remaining are town.

What about membership in multiple? What do you think of the possibility of one being an unknown masonry? (Do we throw that out entirely because of the flavor? Jigsaw is always watching in the films right? I only saw the first one).

Has anyone in this game played with Morning Tweet before? I'm not really liking the vibes I'm getting from her, but I don't if that's normal.

Post #165 is a clear attempt at budding someone that appears to be a town leader going into the game, but her posts become most problematic when you get to Post #174.

"But what if it's

, like,

one of those doors"

When speaking out loud, people naturally add in filled words such as "like" or "um" to fill space because they are uncomfortable with silence while they are thinking. Making a post with the word "like" as Morning Tweet did here is not natural, it's a deliberate decision. The only possible motivation I can imagine for that decision is to appear more trustworthy/relateable. There's no reason for town to make that decision and for that reason, I VOTE: Morning Tweet.

Not liking this by momo at all. Stream of consciousness posts are so common in forum mafia as to be ubiquitous. I don't know how anyone could possibly type that "reasoning" with a straight face.

Has anyone in this game played with Morning Tweet before? I'm not really liking the vibes I'm getting from her, but I don't if that's normal.

Post #165 is a clear attempt at budding someone that appears to be a town leader going into the game, but her posts become most problematic when you get to Post #174.

"But what if it's

, like,

one of those doors"

When speaking out loud, people naturally add in filled words such as "like" or "um" to fill space because they are uncomfortable with silence while they are thinking. Making a post with the word "like" as Morning Tweet did here is not natural, it's a deliberate decision. The only possible motivation I can imagine for that decision is to appear more trustworthy/relateable. There's no reason for town to make that decision and for that reason, I .

I dig it VOTE: Morning Tweet

And then Battle Mage comes riding in here with this awful follow on. That deserves a vote imo:

VOTE: Battle Mage

I carefully yet bravely head through the door.

As you pass through the doorway, your worst fears are confirmed. You see Pine, momo, Morning Tweet, Elsa Jay, Gamma Emerald, VaultDweller, Vecna, Hectic, iDanyboy, GeorgeBailey, Drixx, davesaz, farside, Battle Mage, BBmolla, GuiltyLion, pisskop, Albert B. Rampage, Almost50, xtoxm, and Blake Belladonna, all inside at the edge of the room as well. The room is enormous and stretches off into the distance in a seeming labyrinth of bizarre machines, dripping pipes and rusting walls. Amidst the group, disturbing weapons lay about, including guns, knives, pipes, and other seemingly alien objects. As well, tools of investigation and healing can be seen.

It seems the madman who placed the tape intends to realize the game of Mafia in full. No longer will votes and posts make a difference. Now, you must all fight for your lives. A large timer lies above, slowly counting down. Another tape recorder lies at in front of you, unplayed. Do you play it?

I pick up a gun and try to shoot

Battle Mage

with it. If that doesn't do anything, I'll snag a tool of investigation in the follow on chaos erupting from my attempted kill shot.

Gamma Emerald
GeorgeBailey
GuiltyLion
momo
pisskop
Xtoxm
---
Elsa Jay
Almost50

For my own reference later.

Hi Hectic. Can you plz explain this partial ordered list? Just a sentence on each would be great. Don't just quote your later post at me because that list is different, and I want to know why you felt the need to post THIS one here in the thread, when if it was really for your own notes you could have put it in a PT or some other place for notes.

Gamma Emerald
GeorgeBailey
GuiltyLion
momo
pisskop
Xtoxm
---
Elsa Jay
Almost50

For my own reference later.

Great idea. This one is for my reference later...

Pine
momo
Morning Tweet
Elsa Jay
Gamma Emerald
VaultDweller
Vecna
Hectic
iDanyboy
GeorgeBailey
Drixx
davesaz
farside
Battle Mage
BBmolla
GuiltyLion
pisskop
Albert B. Rampage
Almost50
xtoxm
Blake Belladonna
Game Over

And here comes strike two from Battle Mage. An even worse blank ordered list, and done (again) as a response to someone else doing it first. This is really bad "monkey see/monkey do" play.

I'm in a PT with

Pine
momo - attack on the bat is so weird it's town, but depends on meta
Morning Tweet - maybe towny but might just be tone
Elsa Jay - awkward entrance, Bambi could be scum
Gamma Emerald - our savior and the protagonist of this story
VaultDweller
Vecna
iDanyboy - probably town
GeorgeBailey - GeorgeBailey
Drixx
davesaz - bit off
farside
Battle Mage - who knows with this guy
BBmolla
GuiltyLion - i will sheep GeorgeBailey
pisskop - natural and healthy
Albert B. Rampage - i reserve judgement for now
Almost50 - disliked joke response to my question, pointing out "crumb"
xtoxm - okay push on farside
Blake Belladonna - Hello.

To be very clear ... this is what I don't want you to point at. Explain the original list as asked Hectic. Thanks.

[Battle Mage]

Why are wagoning battle mage?

I can explain the drixx one - it's cause he thought I posted a legit reads list with myself ranked somewhere in the middle.

[Battle Mage]

at this stage we may as well just claim who is in what hood. can designated hood champions please list the people they think are in their hoods and someone can keep a tally.

[Battle Mage]

[Battle Mage, Elsa, Vecna, Drixx] I can all see reasons to dislike. Dany is town, GuiltyLion a townlean. Felt bad when Elsa called me out for always distrusting him so yeah, happy to start a wagon on one of the other 3.

I don't like you either

[Battle Mage]

Morningtweet, what's your obsession with me?

he also dodged talking about it and instead made a big deal out of the readslist part of what drixx said

even with the very best look, BM is still null town for me. i do not know what town indictative thing he did to garner a few TRs.

Albert likes to be mysterious about his reads. I can appreciate that.

or maybe that's just regarding BM-- i dont know!

pedit: It's the latter ah!!!

VOTE: Battle Mage

(/ω＼)

[Battle Mage]

also if I'm null town, why you voting for me? derp

[Battle Mage]

But Elsa, I love you <3
520: Do you usually play more seriously as town or scum?

VOTE: Battle Mage

For his fake claim conversation with iDanyboy.

ah damnit, hit with the giant poop.

to be clear, you're voting me because I called out Danyboy on his potential scumslip? Nice one!

[Battle Mage]

You should put your vote where your mouth is MT.

Vecna's in the bottom tier as a joke, sort of

I want to vote BM until someone explains their town read on him-- seriously there's like five people who townread BM but i dont think I've seen an explanation why

Jesus Christ, this was earlier today!

So you don't understand why people think I'm town, hence you want to vote for me, although you also think i'm town, but you will vote for me anyway.

I literally can't believe scum could ever be this scatterbrained and disorientated. Morningtweet surely must be town.

[Battle Mage]

I have no read on battle mage outside of that whatsoever. I dont even remember any of the posts he has done. I dont care for your case on him. I dont want to involve myself.

This is all that I care about.

And your mega-over-the-top response to me following that

this fella is town. if he was scum, definitely think he would buddy up a bit here.

[Battle Mage]

well I hope I survive a bit longer in this game, partly because it's mostly about me, and partly because there's lots of interesting stuff to get into! However, I'm gonna have to hold back a little probably for a couple days due to combo of other games and work pressures. but kudos guys, you are making this v fun

[Battle Mage]

And theres like 3-5 people townreading him, so I was hoping someone would tell me why

For me it was mostly tone. Not so much "that's good posting", but more like "seems pretty easy going / unconcerned" kind of tone.
But I kinda like your case, and don't like the way that it's being brushed off. I'd rather see actual discussion about it. And more posting from BM.

dude I'm probably like the most prolific poster here!

But for clarity, I'm going

V/LA for next couple days

. I'll be around and posting a bit, but probably won't have time for much of great substance!

[Battle Mage]

well I hope I survive a bit longer in this game, partly because it's mostly about me, and partly because there's lots of interesting stuff to get into! However, I'm gonna have to hold back a little probably for a couple days due to combo of other games and work pressures. but kudos guys, you are making this v fun

Is this all you're gonna respond with? "I hope I survive"?

(ノ﹏ヽ) i could cry rn

erm….what? I'm VLA dude, gimme a break, I'm a key worker and shizz!

[Battle Mage]

You should put your vote where your mouth is MT.

Vecna's in the bottom tier as a joke, sort of

I want to vote BM until someone explains their town read on him-- seriously there's like five people who townread BM but i dont think I've seen an explanation why

Jesus Christ, this was earlier today!

So you don't understand why people think I'm town, hence you want to vote for me,

although you also think i'm town, but you will vote for me anyway.

what makes you think I townread you..?

he also dodged talking about it and instead made a big deal out of the readslist part of what drixx said

even with the very best look, BM is still

null town

for me. i do not know what town indictative thing he did to garner a few TRs.

oh

i meant that as "Even if I give him all the benefits of the doubt, he's only null at best". I didn't mean to add the word "town"

And you STILL don't respond to anything I or Drixx have said. Surely by reading 567 you could tell I don't townread you, right..?

With greatest deference, you're all over the place - I have no idea if you think I'm town or scum from 1 post to the next!

I'll catch up properly when I have more time, don't sweat it!

[Battle Mage]

it's been a long time I was a day 1 lynch target! a little sad, a little interesting! Will people be happy if I promise that I do loads of amazing catch up and analysis on Friday night/Saturday morning? I do think trying to dip in and do a little bit here would be a waste of time and probably just get me lynched haha.

Maybe I can show my amazing value and be spared!

[Battle Mage]

On a similar note, can someone walk me through the BM wagon?

Gut/slimmy feeling when i see him buddy up to tweet.
I have a weird reason as well that I'd rather not explain.

buddy up to tweet? I don't recall this, doesn't she want me dead?

I would love to hear your weird reason!

Looking forward to getting stuck into this game - be patient with me please (and try not to keep rattling off pages....)

[Battle Mage]

I'll be back on Friday night, and I'll EXPLAIN EVERYTHING.

Thanks ABR for holding it down in my absence, I see you doing the Lord's work.

[Battle Mage]

and try not to keep rattling off pages

game is pretty slow paced compared to others of this size.

it feels quicker than the other large theme I'm in at the moment. But I'm old school, and of the firm view that a game should take no more than 20 pages of solid text-wall content.

Also I'm really tempted to just get stuck in and respond to a few bits, but I know from recent experience I'll just get in trouble for not responding to everyone immediately, so I will take a holistic approach!

[Battle Mage]

Well take away my contribution then. Sigh.

it's been a long time I was a day 1 lynch target! a little sad, a little interesting! Will people be happy if I promise that I do loads of amazing catch up and analysis on Friday night/Saturday morning? I do think trying to dip in and do a little bit here would be a waste of time and probably just get me lynched haha.

Maybe I can show my amazing value and be spared!

I know I'm a dramatic person too, but Battle, how high is this on the dramatic scale? The "haha" makes me wanna murder you.

"murder", rather than lynch?

[Battle Mage]

Just finished work for the week, so no longer consider me V/LA. I will be back in force either tonight or tomorrow morning

[Battle Mage]

Almo, are 457 and 776, and 891 your reasons for wanting to lynch Elsa? A traitor crumb, foreshadowing that he's scum WHILE there's a wagon on him, and the fact his scumgame is stronger than his towngame?

True, but mainly the Traitor crumb.

she crumbed traitor in lnt too, as town
i would usually like to sheep you when you get a strong read like this, but i am worried you are wrong this time

I spat coffee on my computer when I read this. Complete unbelievable. I'm coming soon...

[Battle Mage]

I need a WC

Because I'm gonna be unleashing a whole load of poop in this place in a minute!

[Battle Mage]

the monkey is playing mafia...interesting...

[Battle Mage]

what a page topper!

[Battle Mage]

rapid fire thoughts - not sure of ABR's alignment, but willing to give benefit of the doubt for now as if he's town he'll be a big asset. Almost50's behaviour is odd - some meta would be valuable here.

[Battle Mage]

What has A50 been doing that’s odd? I consider myself a bit of an authority on his meta.

Perfect, you're just in time.

What is his meta?

[Battle Mage]

What has A50 been doing that’s odd? I consider myself a bit of an authority on his meta.

also did you intend this to sound as defensive as it came across? or were you aiming for neutral?

[Battle Mage]

within next 12 hours, I will do something crazy in this place, it's ok to get excited!

[Battle Mage]

@BB - no idea who you are. I generally don't go trying to work out who is an alt of whom unless someone is paying me the unpleasant kind of personal attention.

Blake Belladonna is an open Ankamius/Alyssa the Lamb alt.

No way!

[Battle Mage]

What has A50 been doing that’s odd? I consider myself a bit of an authority on his meta.

Perfect, you're just in time.

What is his meta?

What has A50 been doing that’s odd? I consider myself a bit of an authority on his meta.

also did you intend this to sound as defensive as it came across? or were you aiming for neutral?

His meta is doing weird things

And idk what about that seemed defensive? Are you saying I was being defensive of A50?

Yeah it had the vibe of a parent who thought someone had been making insinuations about their child.

I think A50 is definitely town anyway, so no issue there.

[Battle Mage]

Almost50 is TOWN.
Blake Belladonna is PROBABLY TOWN.

Remaining suspects:

Pine*
momo*
Morning Tweet
Elsa Jay
Gamma Emerald
VaultDweller
Vecna
Hectic
iDanyboy
GeorgeBailey
Drixx
davesaz
farside22
BBmolla
GuiltyLion
pisskop
Albert B. Rampage
xtoxm

Let's get to work!

[Battle Mage]

ABR or hectic might be scum-- not sure there yet

i was promised something exciting, BM! unless i missed it

Sorry I'm on the case now. Was just busy losing my other mafia games...

[Battle Mage]

Almost50 is TOWN - meta
Drixx is TOWN - open post reveal of hood, and subsequent near-obsession with hood, as well as general inquisitive tone reads strongly town.
Blake Belladonna is PROBABLY TOWN - meta
Gamma Emerald is TOWN LEAN - marginal, but townie vibes from ISO so far.

Remaining suspects:

Pine*
momo*
Morning Tweet
Elsa Jay
VaultDweller
Vecna
Hectic
iDanyboy
GeorgeBailey
davesaz
farside22
BBmolla
GuiltyLion
pisskop
Albert B. Rampage
xtoxm

[Battle Mage]

Almost50 is TOWN - meta
Drixx is TOWN - open post reveal of hood, and subsequent near-obsession with hood, as well as general inquisitive tone reads strongly town.
Blake Belladonna is PROBABLY TOWN - meta
Gamma Emerald is TOWN LEAN - marginal, but townie vibes from ISO so far.

Xtoxm is SCUM LEAN - slipped up early on and then struggled for a couple posts. Claimed not to be in any hoods, and this means she shouldn't be lynched. Wants to sheep - scummy. Claims farside is scum but won't lynch her to be nice. randomly claims to be town for no reason. Not scumbuddies with Pine.
Vaultdweller is MODERATE SCUM - claimed he didn't post in his hood for ages - what's he hiding? little contribution early, mostly cheap town reads, and trying to play probable town off against each other without getting too close to fire. Seems scared of ABR, so not scumbuddies. Pre-occupied with momo and Vecna.

Remaining suspects:

Pine*
momo*
Morning Tweet
Elsa Jay
Vecna
Hectic
iDanyboy
GeorgeBailey
davesaz
farside22
BBmolla
GuiltyLion
pisskop
Albert B. Rampage

[Battle Mage]

[quote="Battle Mage"]

Almost50 is TOWN - meta
Drixx is TOWN - open post reveal of hood, and subsequent near-obsession with hood, as well as general inquisitive tone reads strongly town.
Blake Belladonna is PROBABLY TOWN - meta
Gamma Emerald is TOWN LEAN - marginal, but townie vibes from ISO so far.

GuiltyLion is NEUTRAL - sensible and believable thought processes, although continual "do you think I am scum though?" leaves a bad vibe, and early behaviour could be worth revisiting after some flips (not sure if he's just a vote-hopper by nature, or early-game jitters). Also not in a hood.

Xtoxm is SCUM LEAN - slipped up early on and then struggled for a couple posts. Claimed not to be in any hoods, and this means she shouldn't be lynched. Wants to sheep - scummy. Claims farside is scum but won't lynch her to be nice. randomly claims to be town for no reason. Not scumbuddies with Pine.
Pisskop is SCUM LEAN - generally town vibes, but I was really pinged by this "But I really do agree that we should be posting in our hoods" and "Why else would we not know our hoodmates?" followed by "I'd prefer we didnt talk about the hoods at all D1" and then "I dont have a hood". Hedging bets early on by implying he might be in a hood (when it was less clear who was in and who was out), referring to "our hoods" and "our hoodmates"? Or, less likely, a slip in reference to the scum PT? Probably not scum with ABR based on interaction.
Vaultdweller is MODERATE SCUM - claimed he didn't post in his hood for ages - what's he hiding? little contribution early, mostly cheap town reads, and trying to play probable town off against each other without getting too close to fire. Seems scared of ABR, so not scumbuddies. Pre-occupied with momo and Vecna.

Remaining suspects:

Pine*
momo*
Morning Tweet
Elsa Jay
Vecna
Hectic
iDanyboy
GeorgeBailey
davesaz
farside22
BBmolla
Albert B. Rampage

[Battle Mage]

Towniest at the top, scummiest at the bottom.

Almost50 is TOWN - meta
Drixx is TOWN - open post reveal of hood, and subsequent near-obsession with hood, as well as general inquisitive tone reads strongly town.
Blake Belladonna is PROBABLY TOWN - meta
ABR is MODERATE TOWN - My head says probably town given his personality, the way he has stepped up to lead things, and the way people have reacted to it - in real time definitely felt like a panic-moment for scum. In my heart, I'm less sure, but clearly not a lynch in the short term.
Vecna is MODERATE TOWN - just lots of good townie vibes from his posts so far.
Gamma Emerald is TOWN LEAN - marginal, but townie vibes from ISO so far.
BBMola is TOWN LEAN - Interesting ISO, overall vibe is town, although protesting his own townie-ness isn't a great look. If my other reads were right, I could be interested in BBmola as a potential low-key scumpartner, but not one for now.

Hectic is NEUTRAL - more interested in flavour than game early. However overall vibe is confident, bombastic townie. If scum, probably not buddies with Dany - defence of him reads as pretty odd. Interaction with ABR of late rings alarm bells. Could be buddies with Elsa.
GuiltyLion is NEUTRAL - sensible and believable thought processes, although continual "do you think I am scum though?" leaves a bad vibe, and early behaviour could be worth revisiting after some flips (not sure if he's just a vote-hopper by nature, or early-game jitters). Also not in a hood.

Danyboy SCUM LEAN - early obsession with using flavour to break game is a minus. Scummy vibes from posting. Nervous about other's opinions, although picking out me and ABR as main targets would be ballsy play for scum.
Xtoxm is SCUM LEAN - slipped up early on and then struggled for a couple posts. Claimed not to be in any hoods, and this means she shouldn't be lynched. Wants to sheep - scummy. Claims farside is scum but won't lynch her to be nice. randomly claims to be town for no reason. Not scumbuddies with Pine.
Pisskop is SCUM LEAN - generally town vibes, but I was really pinged by this "But I really do agree that we should be posting in our hoods" and "Why else would we not know our hoodmates?" followed by "I'd prefer we didnt talk about the hoods at all D1" and then "I dont have a hood". Hedging bets early on by implying he might be in a hood (when it was less clear who was in and who was out), referring to "our hoods" and "our hoodmates"? Or, less likely, a slip in reference to the scum PT? Probably not scum with ABR based on interaction.
Vaultdweller is MODERATE SCUM - claimed he didn't post in his hood for ages - what's he hiding? little contribution early, mostly cheap town reads, and trying to play probable town off against each other without getting too close to fire. Seems scared of ABR, so not scumbuddies. Pre-occupied with momo and Vecna.
Momo is MODERATE SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Something to meta later. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy. And potentially with VaultDweller.

I'm going to

Vote: Momo

while I finish...

Remaining suspects:

Pine*
Morning Tweet
Elsa Jay
GeorgeBailey
davesaz
farside22

[Battle Mage]

Then again, I still get the feeling everyone in on some inside joke that I'm not aware of yet. Is this the part of the movie where I think I'm at a party hitting a pinata, but then it's revealed I'm on hallucigons and actually macheting a corpse? That's pretty morbid, Jigsaw.

I don't see whatever it is they see, but your paranoia about it does smell pooey.

[Battle Mage]

On a similar note, can someone walk me through the BM wagon?

Gut/slimmy feeling when i see him buddy up to tweet.
I have a weird reason as well that I'd rather not explain.

Farside, I would really like to know this weird reason please. Thanks!

[Battle Mage]

Towniest at the top, scummiest at the bottom. ALL DONE for now

Almost50 is TOWN - meta
Drixx is TOWN - open post reveal of hood, and subsequent near-obsession with hood, as well as general inquisitive tone reads strongly town.
Blake Belladonna is PROBABLY TOWN - meta
ABR is MODERATE TOWN - My head says probably town given his personality, the way he has stepped up to lead things, and the way people have reacted to it - in real time definitely felt like a panic-moment for scum. In my heart, I'm less sure, but clearly not a lynch in the short term.
Vecna is MODERATE TOWN - just lots of good townie vibes from his posts so far.
Gamma Emerald is TOWN LEAN - marginal, but townie vibes from ISO so far.
BBMola is TOWN LEAN - Interesting ISO, overall vibe is town, although protesting his own townie-ness isn't a great look. If my other reads were right, I could be interested in BBmola as a potential low-key scumpartner, but not one for now.
Pine is TOWN LEAN - Only saving grace really is that I buy the claim, and think it probably feels more town than scum. Gameplay wise, he initially just wants to lurk through the game. Indicates factual knowledge that Vecna is town. Sets up Drixx vs Vecna as TvS - I have both as town, so this could be a cheap scum play. Collapsed under pressure to produce 6 suspects - scummy. Claims to be in 2 hoods, although per claim, obviously seems legit.
Davesaz is TOWN LEAN - minor town vibes from posting, relative to other players, nothing to trouble me here yet.
Farside22 is TOWN LEAN - genuine scum-hunting, some minor alarm bells, but not worrying me for now. Odd relationship with MorningTweet noted, and odd comment about having a mysterious reason for thinking I'm scum.

Elsa is NEUTRAL - Could go either way I guess. Should be a good one to meta later, probably not worth a tickle today.
Hectic is NEUTRAL - more interested in flavour than game early. However overall vibe is confident, bombastic townie. If scum, probably not buddies with Dany - defence of him reads as pretty odd. Interaction with ABR of late rings alarm bells. Could be buddies with Elsa.
GuiltyLion is NEUTRAL - sensible and believable thought processes, although continual "do you think I am scum though?" leaves a bad vibe, and early behaviour could be worth revisiting after some flips (not sure if he's just a vote-hopper by nature, or early-game jitters). Also not in a hood.
GeorgeBailey is NEUTRAL - some reasoning is a bit shaky, but quite liberal with the vote which I always like. One to watch, and nothing more for now.

Danyboy SCUM LEAN - early obsession with using flavour to break game is a minus. Scummy vibes from posting. Nervous about other's opinions, although picking out me and ABR as main targets would be ballsy play for scum.
Xtoxm is SCUM LEAN - slipped up early on and then struggled for a couple posts. Claimed not to be in any hoods, and this means she shouldn't be lynched. Wants to sheep - scummy. Claims farside is scum but won't lynch her to be nice. randomly claims to be town for no reason. Not scumbuddies with Pine.
MorningTweet is SCUM LEAN - Lots of elaborate reads lists with very few actual suspects - what was the point? Odd relationship with Farside. Makes a ludicrously weak case on me in post #567, and desperate for acknowledgement of it. Presenteeism? Nervous about questioning ABR - probably not buddies.
Pisskop is SCUM LEAN - generally town vibes, but I was really pinged by this "But I really do agree that we should be posting in our hoods" and "Why else would we not know our hoodmates?" followed by "I'd prefer we didnt talk about the hoods at all D1" and then "I dont have a hood". Hedging bets early on by implying he might be in a hood (when it was less clear who was in and who was out), referring to "our hoods" and "our hoodmates"? Or, less likely, a slip in reference to the scum PT? Probably not scum with ABR based on interaction.
Vaultdweller is MODERATE SCUM - claimed he didn't post in his hood for ages - what's he hiding? little contribution early, mostly cheap town reads, and trying to play probable town off against each other without getting too close to fire. Seems scared of ABR, so not scumbuddies. Pre-occupied with momo and Vecna.
Momo is MODERATE SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Something to meta later. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy. And potentially with VaultDweller.

[Battle Mage]

Farside happy with BM readslist. Votes for Xtoxm - not my top suspect. No explanation.
MorningTweet happy with BM readslist. Votes for Xtoxm - not my top suspect. No explanation.

Tickle me curious!

You don't just go from townreading someone and advocating not lynching them today (all of the above), to being "99%" sure they're scum. This is exactly the sort of false bravado and confidence scum like to exhibit, and sometimes gets them townread:

I disagree with this. Scum will try and keep their reads as consistent as possible to avoid suspicion, especially a player as active as ABR. It's hard to read ABR this game, but the fact that he was willing to make a noted change to his reads as the game progressed has to be counted as townpoints, def not scummy.

This isn't true as a blanket statement at all, and varies from player to player. Are you aware of Albert's meta? Regardless, you need to look at each instance independently, and see if the switch is justified. Does his flip look justified based on that post I made? I really don't see it at all. I only surround myself with grey flags; you wouldn't find a red flag within touching distance of me.

VOTE: Albert

I want to hear the case, Albert.

This makes no sense.
If you think he is scum you should explain why.

In other news bm is warming my heart.
VOTE: xtoxm

I love it BM! Interesting that your gutread on Momo overrides the other scumleans, which have reasoning behind them. But i dont find that suspicious, im actually viewing that as a towny thing. i do feel like momo is one of those players who just kinda emits a scummy baseline regardless of alignment, though.

VOTE: Xtom

Pedit: maaan, am i gonna have to reevaluate iDany?

[Battle Mage]

On a similar note, can someone walk me through the BM wagon?

Gut/slimmy feeling when i see him buddy up to tweet.
I have a weird reason as well that I'd rather not explain.

Farside, I would really like to know this weird reason please. Thanks!

You are being way to nice and it is really making me think you are trying to please people. I remember you being more antagonistic in the past and this BM is someone I don't recognize. it gives me the hebbie jebbies.

Aww shucks...I think! I was actually meaning to drop you a PM outside the game (obviously not about the game!), but I'd better not now if you'll consider that scummy!

And to be fair, that's a very valid and observant read, so maybe you should vote for me!

[Battle Mage]

and the more I think on it the more I think Hectic is town. I really don't think he'd be so sloppy as scum to take the angle he took with A50, disagreeing with his scumread over reasoning to scumread a mutual scumread. That feels too disorganized to me to be an artificial thought process.

This is what happens when you overanalyze and get scared off a real wagon.

MT, you finally have the numbers for a bandwagon on a player on your list and you run off and vote Xtoxm?

The players in this game are not ready for mafia.

We're playing at a high level here. If you read Hectic's posts over again and still don't see it, then after a few days, you will be taken by the hand, and explained to like a 5 year old. Sit tight. Until then, if you start to see what everyone else is seeing, you can join the lynch on scum.

Boss - Momo is scum. Trust BM.

[Battle Mage]

Sigh, I guess we'll find out. I'm actually gonna go back on Elsa for now. Want him to come back and wow us.

Battle Mage being really friendly is completely NAI nowadays btw. He just has that star quality about him now. Would be the protagonist if Gamma didn't exist.

VOTE: Elsa Jay

I have no idea what you mean above. Please explain, preferably with reference to any games of mine you have been in, or read? Otherwise I may vote you for outright making stuff up.

[Battle Mage]

"Why else would we not know our hoodmates?"

This post of pisskop is entirely consistent with him not being in a hood. Pisskop is either lying consistently or is town.

You should look at Hectic AGAIN.

I disagree re: Pisskop, Boss. Taken at face value, it is

not

entirely consistent with him not being in a hood. It explicitly implies he

is

in a hood. Definitely scummy.

I don't necessarily think you're wrong on Hectic, but he doesn't scream scum to me like say....Momo.

[Battle Mage]

meh

VOTE: pine

Posts like this make pisskop look scummy. He needs to join the HECTIC WINWAGON.

Otherwise I may vote you for outright making stuff up.

THE FIRE RISES

Town or scum, you're the best dude.

[Battle Mage]

"Why else would we not know our hoodmates?"

This post of pisskop is entirely consistent with him not being in a hood. Pisskop is either lying consistently or is town.

You should look at Hectic AGAIN.

I disagree re: Pisskop, Boss. Taken at face value, it is

not

entirely consistent with him not being in a hood. It explicitly implies he

is

in a hood. Definitely scummy.

I don't necessarily think you're wrong on Hectic, but he doesn't scream scum to me like say....Momo.

Why do you think it implies hes in a hood?

He's using the 2nd person - "we" and "our" implies he is part of the hood. Because he doesn't have a hood, one would expect him to use the 3rd person "you" and "your". It would have taken a conscious effort to use the wrong tense, and so it was clearly a deliberate decision to falsely imply he was part of a hood. It's dishonest, and dishonesty is scummy.

I want to hear your thoughts on momomo!

[Battle Mage]

Sigh, I guess we'll find out. I'm actually gonna go back on Elsa for now. Want him to come back and wow us.

Battle Mage being really friendly is completely NAI nowadays btw. He just has that star quality about him now. Would be the protagonist if Gamma didn't exist.

VOTE: Elsa Jay

I have no idea what you mean above. Please explain, preferably with reference to any games of mine you have been in, or read? Otherwise I may vote you for outright making stuff up.

It's on an alt. Can't say more

You are allowed to say who your alts are...

Does anyone else know who Hectic's alts are?

[Battle Mage]

Hectic - if you're town, quit fooling around and vote Momo, or at least discuss his play to date, and my comments on Pisskop.

[Battle Mage]

BM I was gonna wait for pisskop to address this but - I agree with you he was falsely implying he was in a hood, but I don't agree that's necessarily scummy. When you pointed out the contradiction I thought to myself he may have just been trying to maintain ambiguity about whether or not he was in a hood to hide that info from scum.

I also had that thought, but if you wanted to maintain ambiguity you could either:

A. Not comment on it. This would make sense, given Pisskop claimed it wasn't productive to discuss anyway.
B. Use different language entirely, for example "Why else would neighbours/people in da hood not know their hoodmates?"

So I don't buy it - he deliberately used wording to imply he WAS in a hood, when he WASN'T. I can't work out the motivation really, as clearly he couldn't have carried the lie too far. But I guess I'd suggest he simply panicked and didn't want to draw attention to himself as being the odd one out, so lied to fit in.

[Battle Mage]

So far we know there are two hoods. If you also dont know who is in your hood than it sounds like scum could well be in them or watching them. Why else would we not know our hoodmates?

The full quote in context seems far more rhetorical to me. I don't see this as you say.

In fairness, that wasn't the only instance where he did it. We can agree to disagree.

[Battle Mage]

Momo is MODERATE SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Something to meta later. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy. And potentially with VaultDweller

Tell me more

I asked you first for your view on him.

[Battle Mage]

Sigh, I guess we'll find out. I'm actually gonna go back on Elsa for now. Want him to come back and wow us.

Battle Mage being really friendly is completely NAI nowadays btw. He just has that star quality about him now. Would be the protagonist if Gamma didn't exist.

VOTE: Elsa Jay

I have no idea what you mean above. Please explain, preferably with reference to any games of mine you have been in, or read? Otherwise I may vote you for outright making stuff up.

It's on an alt. Can't say more

You are allowed to say who your alts are...

Does anyone else know who Hectic's alts are?

I don't want to out them. You can just take my word for playing with you on an alt and metaing you in said game, and seeing you're acting like this in all your games right now.

Hectic, the point really is, your meta on me is wrong. like completely, factually inaccurate. So I don't understand how that could have come to pass, although understanding who your alt is might give me more of a sense of whether you are being honest in your view or not. And obviously it would help with reading you in general.

And respectfully, I think you need all the help you can get at the moment.

[Battle Mage]

Momo is MODERATE SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Something to meta later. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy. And potentially with VaultDweller

Tell me more

I asked you first for your view on him.

I know this isn't directed at me, but he's had all of a few post. Made a few cases and blended into the background.
I just have him a a meh read right now.

That is useful feedback, but there's a reason I directed the question to ABR specifically, so I do hope he answers.

[Battle Mage]

Momo is MODERATE SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Something to meta later. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy. And potentially with VaultDweller

Tell me more

I asked you first for your view on him.

It depends. He should be easier to figure out tomorrow in any case.

Everyone will be easier to figure out tomorrow. I'll be helpful and rephrase - why do you think Momo is town? why would he not be a good lynch today?

[Battle Mage]

Does Pine give you wood?

[Battle Mage]

Our intermittent side-character, Momo:

157 - Setup spec. NAI.
184 - Completely bizarre. Initially thought it was too out there to be scum, but then reconsidered that he could be aware of that, and the calculated way he pushes it makes it a little more scummy.
214 - I thought these questions were pretty reasonable.
221 - Changes his mind about Morning. Can come from scum or town. If he's scum, I don't think he intended to actually push Morning and accumulate votes, but get townread for the push, so this is probably NAI.
263 - Feels really political in a way, and seems to over-justify himself in scumreading Elsa Jay. Kinda scummy.
270 - Over justifies his reasoning for voting Elsa Jay, explaining philosophy of furthering the gamestate during Day 1. I mean, I don't disagree, but the roundabout way he explains his thought process and tries to keep his posts as airtight as possible does seem scummy, like he's afraid of leaving any cracks open.
324 - Disagree with reasoning voting Dany.
676 - Votes/pushes me while I'm V/LA and unable to contribute.
1099 - Pops in to disagree with me on a holistic take on how scum act in certain situations. It's safe to comment on and puts no focus on the wagon on me or Albert's push on me, despite being the first to actually scumread/vote me for entirely different reasons.

I'm fine with voting here for now. I have problems with the tone too, but I'm entirely unsure if that's a playstyle thing.

VOTE: momo

Nice work

[Battle Mage]

Drixx what do you think? Momo or Hectic, which one?

Drixx is on team BM!

If he knows what's good for him...

[Battle Mage]

So we're just going to ignore Hectic's meta on you?

To be honest boss, I was only dicking around. He was wrong about the meta, but I don't really see much motive to lie about it as scum, think he is probably just wrong.

I'm digging a Momo-lynch today, and if you don't think this is an informative and productive avenue to try, you're lying to yourself!

[Battle Mage]

ABR or hectic might be scum-- not sure there yet

i was promised something exciting, BM! unless i missed it

Do you see people's reasons for calling me an Acolyte? It sounds like cutting corners and poor storytelling to me!

Morning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

no i didnt see you do something specifically scummy, but i havent gotten my TR on you yet either :c The interaction between u and ABR i just think could be telling

@ABR wasn't there like, two people voting dave at that point? It wasn't going places like you make it out to have been. and you do like your reaction tests, cant i naked vote xtom if id like to?

I promise if we lynch Momo today, we can lynch xtoxm tomorrow - deal?

[Battle Mage]

It explicitly implies he is in a hood.

youre right. I did intentionally imply I might be in a hood. And as albert says, I did consistently say so to maintain that ambiguity. And futhermore, I did so when I knew people would state their hoodmates.

As I explained in post 1148, there was nothing ambiguous about it. Surely you're not actually trying to deny that you deliberately misled the town?

[Battle Mage]

But I guess I'd suggest he simply panicked and didn't want to draw attention to himself as being the odd one out, so lied to fit in.

jesus this is bad. Not, like, scummy bad; just regular terrible

Of course you would try to undermine anything which makes you look bad. But in reality, it's just common sense. You haven't given an alternative explanation for why you lied.

[Battle Mage]

ABR or hectic might be scum-- not sure there yet

i was promised something exciting, BM! unless i missed it

Do you see people's reasons for calling me an Acolyte? It sounds like cutting corners and poor storytelling to me!

Morning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

no i didnt see you do something specifically scummy, but i havent gotten my TR on you yet either :c The interaction between u and ABR i just think could be telling

@ABR wasn't there like, two people voting dave at that point? It wasn't going places like you make it out to have been. and you do like your reaction tests, cant i naked vote xtom if id like to?

I promise if we lynch Momo today, we can lynch xtoxm tomorrow - deal?

im not attached to the thought of lynching xtom. that being said, ill review hectics post on momo and prolly what others have said later when im off mobile.

i had momo as light town from the whole early game interaction with me, but he's not outside the realm of lynchability

Excellent, running up momo would be a great idea.

Pisskop, how about instead of spinning your wheels, you join us!

[Battle Mage]

lied


I mean, technically, it was...

Come on dude, if you're town you'd have to admit it was unhelpful and served no benefit? Or did I miss something clever in there? Aside from that, I think you were pretty well in the town category, so a good explanation would be helpful, and we can focus on lynching momo.

[Battle Mage]

Let me ask you, BM. Lets step outside the game for a second.

Lets say we're all playing prisoners dilemma, with a kitty instead of prison time. Except instead of set increments of money, we all put in a non-zero amount. You following me?

So, what benefit do I have to be directly blunt and honest when I could also fish for reactions and at the same time potentially protect another player by eating a bullet for them? Why should I not try to draw an NK, or fake crumb, or do anything like this?
You said yourself that it wasnt like I could go far with my 'lie'. Youre trying too hard m8t

I'm not sure if you hoped this would be rhetorical, but it isn't. The reason you wouldn't do those things as town, is because you will be mislynched for it. Obviously. One of town's greatest weapons is honesty, I'll always be sympathetic to lynching players who lie, particularly in this case for no obvious town benefit.

But ABR is only telling you his political truth. I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and allow you to live for many more days if you commit yourself to the righteous Momo wagon.

You know it makes sense, m8.

[Battle Mage]

*eats popcorn*
If given a choice between Mono or Hectic I'd lynch Mono. Can't we deal with Xtoxm today?

Sadly not - Unless we are united, Minister ABR will, in his divine wisdom, kill Hectic. This might not be such a bad thing, but it's clearly inferior to the Momo-lynch of my dreams.

[Battle Mage]

You TR abr, bm?

Absolutely!

[Battle Mage]

these were some of the (admittedly few) reads given by iDanyboy prior to his vote on Hectic. At the time of voting Hectic, it was being championed by ABR, who danyBoy previously called his strongest scumread, and momo, who Danyboy called 'just above null towards scum', and davesaz who iDanyboy hasn't commented on at all. Why is this 'not a bad wagon' in that case? What caused him to re-evaluate so massively on ABR, and why was this not indicated to the thread?.

I don't think about who I am voting with unless I have a a strong reason to believe they are guilty, plus with a game of this size I don't have a strong scum read and is hard to keep track of all the players. I found ABR's avoidance of the Vecna post weird but I also found Hectic's posting to be scummy and I wanted to get a wagon going that I agree with, and no one was voting ABR.

keep up danyboy - Momo is the play right now!

[Battle Mage]

the wagon being driven by your top suspect ABR? A likely story!

[Battle Mage]

Yes Danyboy, why are you following the guy you CLAIM to suspect most, on his wagon of choice, rather than somebody you love and trust like me?

[Battle Mage]

ABR or hectic might be scum-- not sure there yet

i was promised something exciting, BM! unless i missed it

Do you see people's reasons for calling me an Acolyte? It sounds like cutting corners and poor storytelling to me!

Morning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

no i didnt see you do something specifically scummy, but i havent gotten my TR on you yet either :c The interaction between u and ABR i just think could be telling

@ABR wasn't there like, two people voting dave at that point? It wasn't going places like you make it out to have been. and you do like your reaction tests, cant i naked vote xtom if id like to?

I promise if we lynch Momo today, we can lynch xtoxm tomorrow - deal?

BM is trying to line up lynches. This is never good behavior from town D1.

weak, cheap OMGUS. I was obviously joking.

[Battle Mage]

Also BM, what was the point of you making a readlist over the course of like 4 different posts other than to show off the fact that you're scumhunting? That's a calculated move.

Not calculated, perhaps a little obnoxious

i was like a day late doing it, so i had to keep the people happy, benevolent leader I am

also this looks like some more lame OMGUS to me.

[Battle Mage]

184 - Completely bizarre. Initially thought it was too out there to be scum, but then reconsidered that he could be aware of that, and the calculated way he pushes it makes it a little more scummy.

Genuine question. Earlier in this game, you called ABR scummy for going from townreading you to placing a vote on you.

You've now done the exact same thing to me.

Is it not scummy when you do it? Or were just using that as an excuse to get a wagon on ABR,

This is why my vote is on Hectic guys.

elaborate post to make a very simple point, and then a desperate appeal to the other big BW. this is scummy,

you guys, amirite?

[Battle Mage]

Ooooo buzzwords and bitchness. A nerve had been hit.

i was kinda expecting that tbh

Yes Danyboy, why are you following the guy you CLAIM to suspect most, on his wagon of choice, rather than somebody you love and trust like me?

if i vote momo will u love me

You know I will.

(you don't see these sorts of AtE very often!)

[Battle Mage]

Vecna seems a little panicky about the momo wagon? nailed 4 scum already?

[Battle Mage]

Hey Elsa, you misspelt Momo, twice!

[Battle Mage]

On a very serious note, I've just read Momo's ISO in 2 completed games where he was town. I'd describe him as bullish, a bit bossy, and fancying himself as the town leader (and slightly lazy - no offence!).

In contrast, his play here has been uncertain, with appeals to everybody else and using phrases like "honestly" and "genuine question" (neither of which formed part of his vocabulary in those town-games). Hectic has also realised and highlighted that, so gets upgraded to a Town-Lean for actually doing legit scumhunting.

Meta-cases are tricky because people change as time passes, but I don't think it's that common for somebody to go from being an authoritative and decisive town-leader, to a whimpering pleading town-passenger.

Momo is scum, and if you don't vote him, you're a dum-dum. The prosecution rests.

[Battle Mage]

Hectic *could* be scum, but that's only because i dont have a townread on him, not for anything specifically. id ask for someone to explain it to me, but im going to reread for myself first. there better be something more than ABR saying "HECTIC CONFIRM SCUM"

As far as I can tell, that is pretty much it lol. I don't think I've ever been more confused about why exactly I'm being wagoned.

Elsa's vote is really bad. It's like when the cinematographer decides to put the lights in front of the cameras. Elsa, any reasoning?

Don't worry dude, I think you're town.

[Battle Mage]

Momo - I honestly hadn't read this before I did my meta assessment of you, so erm... you're welcome!

I don't buy your tone below. It's sensationalist and not credible.

I'm in a PT with

Pine
momo - attack on the bat is so weird it's town, but depends on meta
Morning Tweet - maybe towny but might just be tone
Elsa Jay - awkward entrance, Bambi could be scum
Gamma Emerald - our savior and the protagonist of this story
VaultDweller
Vecna
iDanyboy - probably town
GeorgeBailey - GeorgeBailey
Drixx
davesaz - bit off
farside
Battle Mage - who knows with this guy
BBmolla
GuiltyLion - i will sheep GeorgeBailey
pisskop - natural and healthy
Albert B. Rampage - i reserve judgement for now
Almost50 - disliked joke response to my question, pointing out "crumb"
xtoxm - okay push on farside
Blake Belladonna - Hello.

184 - Completely bizarre. Initially thought it was too out there to be scum, but then reconsidered that he could be aware of that, and the calculated way he pushes it makes it a little more scummy.

Genuine question. Earlier in this game, you called ABR scummy for going from townreading you to placing a vote on you.

You've now done the exact same thing to me.

Is it not scummy when you do it? Or were just using that as an excuse to get a wagon on ABR,

This is why my vote is on Hectic guys.

I was always unsure about you.

Maybe, but the most definitive of your townreads initially in 236 is me. You can point out that you added the qualifier it depends on meta, but for everyone else you said something like probably town or likely town, yet for me, you said, its town. On top of that, the qualifier you gave was depends on meta, but u haven't done any meta diving, and as far as I can tell, other than Gamma saying that I've been a lurker in the past (sorry about that past) there's been no discussion about my meta. You're being disingenuous. You scumread ABR for doing the exact same thing as you did. That's terrible town play at best, or, more likely, scum.

[Battle Mage]

For posterity:

On a very serious note, I've just read Momo's ISO in 2 completed games where he was town. I'd describe him as bullish, a bit bossy, and fancying himself as the town leader (and slightly lazy - no offence!).

In contrast, his play here has been uncertain, with appeals to everybody else and using phrases like "honestly" and "genuine question" (neither of which formed part of his vocabulary in those town-games). Hectic has also realised and highlighted that, so gets upgraded to a Town-Lean for actually doing legit scumhunting.

Meta-cases are tricky because people change as time passes, but I don't think it's that common for somebody to go from being an authoritative and decisive town-leader, to a whimpering pleading town-passenger.

Momo is scum

, and if you don't vote him, you're a dum-dum. The prosecution rests.

[Battle Mage]

BM do us all a favor and don't repost to get pagetop.

I'm doing everybody a big favour by making it as clear as possible who should be lynched. I think we're getting lots more info from having 2 competing wagons than just 1 anyway, so this good-cop/bad-cop act is working great!

[Battle Mage]

of course we'll get a lot more info from lynching momo, because we can look with increased suspicion at those who have shown up, ignored the case, and to their credit, gone against the momentum of the game to join the hectic wagon. Elsa and Xtoxm both looking a bit worse if Momo flips red.

[Battle Mage]

Updated my reads list:

Almost50 is TOWN - meta
Drixx is TOWN - open post reveal of hood, and subsequent near-obsession with hood, as well as general inquisitive tone reads strongly town.
Blake Belladonna is PROBABLY TOWN - meta
ABR is MODERATE TOWN - My head says probably town given his personality, the way he has stepped up to lead things, and the way people have reacted to it - in real time definitely felt like a panic-moment for scum. In my heart, I'm less sure, but clearly not a lynch in the short term.
Vecna is TOWN LEAN - just lots of good townie vibes from his posts so far. Falsely alleged I claimed scum, then ran off, so down-graded from moderate town.
Gamma Emerald is TOWN LEAN - marginal, but townie vibes from ISO so far.
BBMola is TOWN LEAN - Interesting ISO, overall vibe is town, although protesting his own townie-ness isn't a great look. If my other reads were right, I could be interested in BBmola as a potential low-key scumpartner, but not one for now.
Pine is TOWN LEAN - Only saving grace really is that I buy the claim, and think it probably feels more town than scum. Gameplay wise, he initially just wants to lurk through the game. Indicates factual knowledge that Vecna is town. Sets up Drixx vs Vecna as TvS - I have both as town, so this could be a cheap scum play. Collapsed under pressure to produce 6 suspects - scummy. Claims to be in 2 hoods, although per claim, obviously seems legit.
Farside22 is TOWN LEAN - genuine scum-hunting, some minor alarm bells, but not worrying me for now. Odd relationship with MorningTweet noted.
Hectic is TOWN LEAN - more interested in flavour than game early. However overall vibe is confident, bombastic townie. Genuine scumhunting. If scum, probably not buddies with Dany - defence of him reads as pretty odd. Defence of himself has not been great.
Davesaz is TOWN LEAN - minor town vibes from posting, relative to other players, nothing to trouble me here yet.

GuiltyLion is NEUTRAL - sensible and believable thought processes, although continual "do you think I am scum though?" leaves a bad vibe, and early behaviour could be worth revisiting after some flips (not sure if he's just a vote-hopper by nature, or early-game jitters). Also not in a hood.
GeorgeBailey is NEUTRAL - some reasoning is a bit shaky, but quite liberal with the vote which I always like. One to watch, and nothing more for now.
Elsa is NEUTRAL - Could go either way still. Should be a good one to meta later, probably not worth a tickle today. Interactions would make a good fit for a Hectic or Momo scumbuddy.

Danyboy SCUM LEAN - early obsession with using flavour to break game is a minus. Scummy vibes from posting. Nervous about other's opinions, although picking out me and ABR as main targets would be ballsy play for scum.
MorningTweet is SCUM LEAN - Lots of elaborate reads lists with very few actual suspects - what was the point? Odd relationship with Farside. Makes a ludicrously weak case on me in post #567, and desperate for acknowledgement of it. Presenteeism? Nervous about questioning ABR - probably not buddies.
Pisskop is SCUM LEAN - generally town vibes, but I was really pinged by this "But I really do agree that we should be posting in our hoods" and "Why else would we not know our hoodmates?" followed by "I'd prefer we didnt talk about the hoods at all D1" and then "I dont have a hood". Hedging bets early on by implying he might be in a hood (when it was less clear who was in and who was out), referring to "our hoods" and "our hoodmates"? Or, less likely, a slip in reference to the scum PT? Probably not scum with ABR based on interaction.
Xtoxm is SCUM LEAN - slipped up early on and then struggled for a couple posts. Claimed not to be in any hoods, and this means she shouldn't be lynched. Wants to sheep - scummy. Claims farside is scum but won't lynch her to be nice. randomly claims to be town for no reason. Not scumbuddies with Pine. Has issues with women. Openly admits lurking. More likely with Momo than Hectic.
Vaultdweller is MODERATE SCUM - claimed he didn't post in his hood for ages - what's he hiding? little contribution early, mostly cheap town reads, and trying to play probable town off against each other without getting too close to fire. Seems scared of ABR, so not scumbuddies. Pre-occupied with momo and Vecna.
Momo is MODERATE SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Something to meta later. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy. And potentially with VaultDweller.

[Battle Mage]

Why are you lurking?

Because he's scum and doing his best show no info when he flips scum.

He's not doing a very good job of that - in terms of info, he's probably the best lynch today. But I prefer we lynch the scummiest player.

[Battle Mage]

you're a dumb fucking cunt battle mage
never join games with me again

I've reported to this to the Mod, as a breach of Rule 7.

[Battle Mage]

I'll be back when he's been modkilled. No time for people being directly and personally offensive without provocation.

[Battle Mage]

an unofficial warning? for calling someone that for no reason? dude I'm out....

[Battle Mage]

an unofficial warning? for calling someone that for no reason? dude I'm out....

Please don't leave.
I am not condoning xtoxm comment or even understanding why he said it.
Just let it go and move on.

Yeah you're right, no sense in letting him win. To be fair, it isn't like xtoxm is going to be in the thread posting much more anyway with his lurker strategy.

[Battle Mage]

@BM, Mod:

Please discuss via PM. There are new rules concerning demanding replace outs / threatening replace outs.

Yep we've spoken via PM, and I do know (and try to follow) the rules - didn't threaten to replace out. is there a rule against requesting a modkill for being a douche?

[Battle Mage]

Oops

[Battle Mage]

ah damnit, another pagetop!! maybe I should have gone after all

ABR ain't gonna like this...

[Battle Mage]

@BM, Mod:

Please discuss via PM. There are new rules concerning demanding replace outs / threatening replace outs.

Yep we've spoken via PM, and I do know (and try to follow) the rules - didn't threaten to replace out. is there a rule against requesting a modkill for being a douche?

Requesting a Mod Kill does seem like a little overkill bro. Kinda isn't your call to make.

I'm old school. Back in my day, that's just what would happen - no-brainer. People were nicer to each other back then of course...

[Battle Mage]

ill pick up from 1279 after work!

[Battle Mage]

heyyee so about those wagons

I think there's definitely a lot of town on hectic but im not impressed by the "reasoning", if you can call it that. forgive me if i missed where it is, i checked ABR, A50, and like someone else's isos to try n find it

BM has suddenly revealed himself as town so that's cool

i think I learn a lot more from a momo flip than a hectic flip. i do find it interesting that hectic had somewhat of a read 180 on momo, but i also had that townlean on momo and never went to really reevaluate the slot so i can see it as a town move

VOTE: momo

I agree with this assessment on Hectic - I saw it somewhat as self-preservation. Which for him, I'm considering NAI given the circumstances.

[Battle Mage]

Meta-cases are tricky because people change as time passes, but I don't think it's that common for somebody to go from being an authoritative and decisive town-leader, to a whimpering pleading town-passenger.

Why on Earth would you characterize me as a whimpering pleading town-passenger. First of all, the notion of me being a passenger is total bull shit. The current wagon on Hectic, I started that. I get that you want everything to fit your narrative, but if you even took the time look at a single vote count, you would see that the first vote on the current Hectic wagon is me.

I have changed my vote as the day progressed, but that doesn't make me a pleading passenger in any sense of the word. I've started and joined wagons as the game progressed. From my initial vote on Morning Tweet to now, my vote has always been exactly where I want it to be. Just because I've grown as a player and realized how FOOLISH you have to be to proclaim a game of forum mafia completely solved D1, doesn't mean that I'm whimpering. I get that you think of yourself as some sort of super genius, but you're not. You're nowhere near solving this game and honestly, chances are I'm not either. I think Hectic is scum, that's why I'm voting him, but I don't say ridiculous things anymore like proclaim to catching the entire scum team through preflip associatives D1.

I can be as bullish as you want, but there's a reason I haven't been playing like that (or I guess like this since you've clearly managed to bait me) this game. Mafia is a game of consensus building. I'm not well known enough on this site to be bullish and to tell people to follow me and to expect successful wagons on my scumreads.

To conclude, I'm not whimpering and I'm certainly not pleading. The fact that you would falsely characterize me as such is frankly insulting. I'm playing smart, even if that's something you can't understand.

It was probably a slightly crude characterisation, but you know what you mean! A lot of it really boils down to the way you type - I really like reading people through that because it's the purest way. People can easily perform a certain style as town and scum, but sometimes the precise wording they use, and the way they communicate can give you clues. Maybe I'm wrong of course, but I stand by the assessment - you are not communicating in a way you have as town, and your word-selection makes me think you are very likely to be scum. The defence that you are not well-known enough to be bullish doesn't stack up, as I've clearly said that you have been bullish in the past (when presumably you were less well-known than now).

It's not a question of whether I'm "solving the game" by lynching you - obviously if you're scum it's a great start, and if you're not - heck, I've lynched the player I think is most likely to be scum, which is the only way to play! And I do think drawing associatives are important, especially later once we get some flips, although I definitely don't think I've caught the whole scumteam today - you've got me confused with Vecna I think.

[Battle Mage]

I haven't caught up yet, but is my hood outted?

something to look forward to!

[Battle Mage]

iDanyboy (2) - Elsa Jay, GuiltyLion
Drixx (2) - VaultDweller, Pine
xtoxm (2) - BBmolla, Morning Tweet
Battle Mage (1) - Vecna
BBmolla (1) - GeorgeBailey
Vecna (1) - Drixx
GuiltyLion (1) - Gamma Emerald
Pine (1) - pisskop
farside22 (1) - xtoxm

Pretty much all of these players voting should pick a side now. We are close to deadline. I'll try to get my thoughts out on Hectic by Tuesday or Wednesday.

Added spacing for clarity on request

I'm picking a momo lynch over Hectic

Good work soldier!

Xtom why don't you explain a farside or Hectic scumread so we can talk maybe

Far side - instead of trying to work things out with me she is just returning the scumread, bc she expects to win out against me. Otherwise doesnt feel townie. I played with her a lot in the past.

Hectic - my strongest tr is vote there (a50) and abr who I also tr keeps asking me to vote there. Most of the wagon is my townread or townleans. At some point I need to compromise. I dont tr any of the slots on the alternate momo wagon.

I am also confused why you seem to put weight on the things I say, yet have me as a sr. It seems contradictory.

Cause id like to hear you say something, anything, so i have something to base a read off of

Xtoxm has posted plenty enough for you to have a read on him surely?

Ehh. Albert, did you switch to Momo or are you gung ho on Hectic? I'll follow you for now.

This is lame - scum points for you Elsa.

[Battle Mage]

BM, Pine, momo and I are in a hood. We believe momo is the scum. I was going to run Hectic up to L-1 to see who was eager to save momo and then shift onto momo last minute for the day 1 lynch.

How known within the hood is this sentiment?

First I've heard of it!

Only joking, we all share an unspoken bond.... I feel naked now my hood is outted....I thought we were gonna keep it tight?

[Battle Mage]

guys guys let me catch up!

[Battle Mage]

BM is your push on Momo mostly meta? You're saying he's acting more passive than he is as town, right?

Momo is MODERATE SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Something to meta later. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy. And potentially with VaultDweller.

Is there a specific post you think he really reveals how scummy he is?

Nope it's not mostly meta, the meta is just for added strength. The main argument is the wording he uses, taking pleading emotional tone, using phrases like "honestly" and "genuine question". His posting since taking some heat was pretty weak I think. I've probably covered the case better in my previous posts, so you're welcome to ISO him, or me and make a judgement for yourself!

this is exactly how I feel - the way ABR is pushing Hectic makes me wonder if there's some kind of scum slip there relating to hoods but I read over Hectic's ISO several times and don't see it.

I still don't like Danyboy's Hectic vote and Elsa Jay's is bad too. Badfeels from the wagon.

I also didn't like Momo's interactions with Battle Mage, saying he's "lining up lynches" and calculated-therefore-scummy for posting an evolving reads list both strike me as uncharitable/reachy pushes.

I can see a world where Momo is town and I can see a world where Hectic is scum but I'm feeling Momo over Hectic unless ABR has an especially compelling point on something I'm not seeing

VOTE: Momo

Very astute.

Im not sure about Hectic, but Battle mage is doing a thing here where he either wants to distract from the Hectic wagon, or wants to create two alternating wagons between momo and Hectic to set up the day2 mislynch.

I think this is a classic misguided townie move. No scum points here for you! It's pretty obvious I'm distracting from the Hectic wagon, so I don't think that's a tremendous insight. The reason is obviously because Momo is scummier. Unless you feel differently, I don't really know why you're bothering with this?

Hectic, BM, Blake Belladonna, maybe GE (4/5)?

wow this is a really bad scumlist

Interesting how of all the "bad readslists" in the game, this is the only one you choose to respond to

In fairness to BBmola, it's a pretty bad readslist. The first 3 are probably town based on the play so far.

VOTE: Hectic

This is the better wagon.

I don't believe you believe that, and the timing is a bit off. Scum points for you!

[Battle Mage]

Vote: Blake Belladonna

Vote: Blake Belladonna

VOTE: Battle Mage
Failed vote clearly scum fake-RVSing their partner

More later today maybe
Please keep the game length tolerable okay? Don’t post more than 100 posts in a day for the first 3 days imo

Now tell me that this does not look a bit funny in hindsight.

Why of all posts does Gamma pick up on BM voting for Blake belladonna, and calls it scum fake RVSing their partner?

Now tell me this scenario does not overlap at least conveniently with your PoE pools

And then debate with me whether these lines dont come from scum trying to get too cute in an overwhelming (read statistically significant if so inclined to avoid sensationalism) number of cases.

BM/BB as potential baddies together? GE as a teammate or a towny having a good gut sensation? Lets explore this further

What does this mean for hectic and Momo?

Thoughts whether if im accurate that BM is saving Hectic here, or just setting up for a 1v1 to set up the next mislynch?

Dude, everything here is predicated on me being scum. Do you have anything valuable to contribute? Your pal Momo won't be happy, he hates people who think they have the game busted on Day 1.

[Battle Mage]

Unvote

for goodness sake, let me catch up before we end the day! this is so exciting!

[Battle Mage]

Alright, whatever, I'm claiming:

I'm Detective Halloran, a Police X-shot Sleuth.

X amount of times, I can investigate someone at night to see if they're an

Acolyte

, but I can't detect Jigsaw himself with my check.

I've been crumbing it all game with my RP.

I knew you were town. 1-0 to me!

Good thing I left myself some wiggle room with that 1%.

Nice work ABR!

@vecna
i dont know about your theory. i have not found blake suspicious.
BM is gaslighting me which is a scum thing.
i dont know what it means for hectic.
momo should be town i think. unless my reads this game are way off momo is being pushed by scum.

What about momo reads town? I checked his meta and i dont see it.

Nice research Farside!

It's moot now. I think momo/vecna/blake makes sense.

I'm still leaning town on Vecna. Blake's recent movements haven't looked great, although the same could be said for Elsa. I'll update my readslist shortly.

Thank you for your service in drawing the NK tonight, BM and I will clean this game up quickly after you die.

There's bound to be a protective so maybe he doesn't draw the NK? Probably not worth speculating too much though! Yep we've got this one under control (unless Xtoxm is scum, and I get NKed)

BM, Pine, momo and I are in a hood. We believe momo is the scum. I was going to run Hectic up to L-1 to see who was eager to save momo and then shift onto momo last minute for the day 1 lynch.

I'm a bit sad you outted us! I was hoping we could do the big reveal once we confirmed Momo was actually scum.

BM, Pine, momo and I are in a hood. We believe momo is the scum. I was going to run Hectic up to L-1 to see who was eager to save momo and then shift onto momo last minute for the day 1 lynch.

...if someone was eager to save momo, they'd hammer me on L-1? And then you wouldn't get your scum lynch?

Battle Mage, please tell me about what's been going on in his hood.

I'll tell you when I catch up!

Wow, spoilers, Elsa.

Also, you're scum with momo, right?

That is possible yeah.

If we lynch momo, I think our hood will be all town remaining, and we can safely plan our next moves with Hectic drawing the NK. I'm pleased with this given the false positive potential of his role, it could really hurt town to have the cop run into a godfather N1 and have him ride it out deep into the game.

I don't think it's a given that Hectic draws the NK. But yes I think if Momo is scum, I'll feel much more at ease with you and Pine.

[Battle Mage]

The wagon on me has built ridiculously fast and is almost certainly scum driven. How fast I went from being widely townleaned/read is not natural. Hectic points out that he's been crumbing cop the whole game, but it's absolutely the fakest crumbing I've seen in a while. Scum can call themselves detective in their posts too.

It's clear that y'all aren't believing me, so I've decided to claim.

I am Simone, a 1-shot Trap Immune Survivor.

I was hoping that I wouldn't have to claim, so that scum could waste one of their traps on me, but it is what it is. Lynching me rn is not smart because scum can't get rid of me when they want to. My role adds value to this town.

Instinctively I don't buy this claim - it feels like a real easy fakeclaim.

I have faith in SirCakez' ability to write a good storyline. A hero will come to my rescue. I believe.

I'm not taking it personally regardless of your alignment, Albert; I'm just still a little baffled by the play and somewhat struggle to see it coming from town.

If momo flips scum, it makes you look better because of the hood. Otherwise, I can definitely see what you've done here as coming from scum as an act of performance/false bravado to get people to wagon a townie, and defuse pressure from other potential scum wagons at the time.

If Momo flips scum, I look doubly great because I'm in his hood and I drove his lynch from scratch!

[Battle Mage]

I can see a world where Momo is town and I can see a world where Hectic is scum but I'm feeling Momo over Hectic unless ABR has an especially compelling point on something I'm not seeing

Stay active, we will need you to finish off Hectic as the clock ticks to midnight.

Still 4 days left my man. I get it, we dont have forever, but using this already as an argument to push through the current biggest wagons......probably lines up well with what you want, but its not the greatest of reasons that should convince anyone else.

Vecna, you're right on this one! No rush!

It's not a 3rd party role.

It's a town role. Survivor is just the name of our PT. Being 1-shot trap immune is my role.

Remember what BM said about your town play being aggressive and bombastic. You didn't play the way a bulletproof town plays, and given both of your claims we have no choice but to end this now.

That's true, his role is fairly useless unless he draws an NK.

Momo, why word it so confusingly and not clarify that in the first post? Also, kindly explain what a fucking Trap is. Is that the gimmick here? Are we dealing with a team of Poisoners?

I laughed.

I can see a world where Momo is town and I can see a world where Hectic is scum but I'm feeling Momo over Hectic unless ABR has an especially compelling point on something I'm not seeing

Stay active, we will need you to finish off Hectic as the clock ticks to midnight.

Still 4 days left my man. I get it, we dont have forever, but using this already as an argument to push through the current biggest wagons......probably lines up well with what you want, but its not the greatest of reasons that should convince anyone else.

We've gotten everything we needed out of this day and a clear road map for Day 2. Take your time to catch up and stuff, then we're lynching momo.

Mate, I'm having fun, let me catch up at least and consolidate what we've got. If Momo flips scum I'm probably dead tonight.

It's not a 3rd party role.

It's a town role. Survivor is just the name of our PT. Being 1-shot trap immune is my role.

Remember what BM said about your town play being aggressive and bombastic. You didn't play the way a bulletproof town plays, and given both of your claims we have no choice but to end this now.

This is stupid at best and disingenuous at worst. We have literally 19 other options. We have four days to lynch someone else. Yeah, I'm not play agressively. Want to know a fact you can check with my meta.

I've never made it to LyLo as town because I always get lynched. I'm playing less agressively because I would like to actually see a game to it's end.

I mean your role is unverifiable right, so you may as well have claimed vanilla? it's not the strongest claim. I don't think it makes you more or less scummy, so I'm about as happy as I was before.

[Battle Mage]

Ideally before night I'd like Pine/BM to confirm that this was the plan and that they side with ABR here relating to Momo's 1337 but generally this all feels right and makes sense. I think Blake and Elsa look most bad here in terms of associations. I can seeeee why Vecna looks bad too but I kinda still think he's town bc my townread on him was so strong prior, though the sudden pivot to Gamma was a bit odd maybe a "let's set up a future bus" situation if it's like momo/Vecna/Gamma. I was trying to draw attention to Gamma many times this game bc Gamma feels heckin scummy to me still and didn't get any support from Vecna until now once other wagons are a lot more likely to go through

p-edit momo why would you WANT to make it to LYLO as town lol

There wasn't any plan. Basically, everyone was chit-chatting, mostly about how townie-looking Momo was, and then I read the thread and pointed out he was scum. And the rest, is history!

It's not a 3rd party role.

It's a town role. Survivor is just the name of our PT. Being 1-shot trap immune is my role.

Remember what BM said about your town play being aggressive and bombastic. You didn't play the way a bulletproof town plays, and given both of your claims we have no choice but to end this now.

This is stupid at best and disingenuous at worst. We have literally 19 other options. We have four days to lynch someone else. Yeah, I'm not play agressively. Want to know a fact you can check with my meta.

I've never made it to LyLo as town because I always get lynched. I'm playing less agressively because I would like to actually see a game to it's end.

Aggressiveness is a town trait. Scum can coast but town can't afford to. Bulletproof town have an even bigger reason to step up and take space in the game. You think I'm the scum in our PT? I don't believe you.

I wish you were in all my games, I wouldn't get mislynched as often for being too aggressive.

You think I'm the scum in our PT? I don't believe you.

It can't be anyone else.

momo - I know for a fact I'm town.
Pine - Yes, he's lurked a bit but nothing about his play seems particularly scummy.
Battle Mage - I don't like that he's scumreading me, but his casual tone and attempts at actually scumhunting don't seem scummy.
ABR - I can't read you well, but you've tried to make it seem like you're 100% town too deliberately and the way you're pushing this wagon is very sus. Your play seems scummy.

So yeah, out of the 4 of us, you're most likely scum.

This doesn't really match up with your reads in the PT. In the PT you had Pine as scum, me as poss-scum, and ABR as town.

And incidentally, Pine was sure you were town, but where is he now?

At least this hood explanation & hunt makes BM's weird actions a bit more understandable

Dude, you should see how scummy Momo is in the hood.

Well, at least were not losing any strong PR's by lynching Momo. Unless Hectic is town (his indignity to having to claim reads off the charts genuine) and is allowed to get a shot off on Momo, the odds of him ever being targetted by a NK are zero now.

what in the hell is this? ABR - does this stack up to you?

[Battle Mage]

Momo?

Momo, why word it so confusingly and not clarify that in the first post? Also, kindly explain what a fucking Trap is. Is that the gimmick here? Are we dealing with a team of Poisoners?

the more I think about this the more this is a super scummy post regardless of Momo's alignment, btw

I actually don't think I want to assume "there must be a scum in the hood" regarding the Survivor group, if momo townflips I don't think that has to point to scum in the other three. It's good to consider but I'm not convinced it's necessarily true.

I mean, the movies strongly imply that there is an acolyte in the survivors. Ofcourse, that is also the best way for a sadistic mod like cakez ( ) to create some awesome drama in this game.

ANYWAYS

Anyone could also figure out that the survivor PT is most likely to contain the strongest town PR's.

I WANT TO KNOW

_WHO_

In that PT started the witchhunt and instigated the others to join them.

Because -that- is the most likely scumslot in there.

I didn't start the witchhunt, but I perfected it.

[Battle Mage]

Momo, why word it so confusingly and not clarify that in the first post? Also, kindly explain what a fucking Trap is. Is that the gimmick here? Are we dealing with a team of Poisoners?

the more I think about this the more this is a super scummy post regardless of Momo's alignment, btw

I actually don't think I want to assume "there must be a scum in the hood" regarding the Survivor group, if momo townflips I don't think that has to point to scum in the other three. It's good to consider but I'm not convinced it's necessarily true.

I mean, the movies strongly imply that there is an acolyte in the survivors. Ofcourse, that is also the best way for a sadistic mod like cakez ( ) to create some awesome drama in this game.

ANYWAYS

Anyone could also figure out that the survivor PT is most likely to contain the strongest town PR's.

I WANT TO KNOW

_WHO_

In that PT started the witchhunt and instigated the others to join them.

Because -that- is the most likely scumslot in there.

BM was the one who first said he thought I was scum in the PT and ABR has believed pretty much the entire game that 1 in 4 of us have to be scum.

When I asked him what he thought of Pine lurking, he said Pine had to be scum because 1 in 4 and the rest of us (including me) are prolly town.

When BM asked ABR about me, he said I had to be scum because 1 in 4 and the other 3 (now including Pine) are town.

It’s ridiculously scummy. If that’s ur criteria for voting, vote ABR

This does read like sour grapes to me...

So noone in there started a hunt of sorts to figure out which of the people in your hood were scum? And was pushing the rest to hunt scum in your hood?

we've been working each other out of course!

BM, Pine, momo and I are in a hood. We believe momo is the scum. I was going to run Hectic up to L-1 to see who was eager to save momo and then shift onto momo last minute for the day 1 lynch.

How known within the hood is this sentiment?

First I've heard of it!

Only joking, we all share an unspoken bond.... I feel naked now my hood is outted....I thought we were gonna keep it tight?

So this wasn't discussed in your neighborhood much or at all before now?

I mean, I was the first mover on Momo that's for sure. He was town-read by ABR and Pine before that.

It was never discussed openly, we've all been reading through the lines. All of us think the pt has scum in it.

Yeah that's right.

Xtoxm can you vote momo?

in the sense that he has claimed a weak role, and im ready for the day to end. i guess? but not with any optimism of a scum flip.
and not yet.
there are days on the deadline and this is moving fast. i wanna see how some other slots react to this.

Oddly, I think Xtoxm would not say this in respect of scumbuddy Momo. So scum-Momo means town-Xtoxm. His recent surge in activity is NAI. I've deliberately not bothered to respond to his posts, but I have been reading them.

what in the hell is this? ABR - does this stack up to you?

Vecna is saying momo will not be NK'd if he's town, yes he's right.

I got that bit, but the middle bit:

"unless Hectic is town and gets a shot off on Momo" ??

[Battle Mage]

I'd like to hear from Pine before we lynch Momo.

[Battle Mage]

Also if Momo is scum, Pine is 100% town. I wouldn't be quite as certain on ABR, given he outted the hood which might be his play if he was scum with Momo ahead of a Momo-lynch. Although clearly he'd be probable town still.

[Battle Mage]

Hectic is a bad wagon because of votes like these. No reasoning behind them, other than it's a good wagon.

Keep reading, it comes out as you go.

Let's hear what you saw then, Dave, now that we know the case doesn't actually exist. There's not going to be any continuity errors on my watch.

Was waiting to do this till I got to the end of catchup, but found a post that requires my attention.
UNVOTE:

Did you even bother to ISO me? I find it hard to believe you missed what I said. But anyway, I'll go back and point you to the post after I finish.

why did you not believing Hectic, make you less inclined to believe he was scum?

[Battle Mage]

Can we not with the "if we lynch a scum inside of a hood, everyone else in the hood is confirmed town"? Especially if you've got like 7 people in a hood guys, its probably not going to hold true

I agree it's very possible for 2 scum in a hood otherwise the setup would be pretty easy for town I guess, but if Momo is scum, I think me and Pine are town for sure. And ABR is more likely town than currently.

Xtom why don't you explain a farside or Hectic scumread so we can talk maybe

Far side - instead of trying to work things out with me she is just returning the scumread, bc she expects to win out against me. Otherwise doesnt feel townie. I played with her a lot in the past.

Hectic - my strongest tr is vote there (a50) and abr who I also tr keeps asking me to vote there. Most of the wagon is my townread or townleans. At some point I need to compromise. I dont tr any of the slots on the alternate momo wagon.

I am also confused why you seem to put weight on the things I say, yet have me as a sr. It seems contradictory.

Cause id like to hear you say something, anything, so i have something to base a read off of

Xtoxm has posted plenty enough for you to have a read on him surely?

not really no. I think the only lurkier players at the time had been Pine, maybe George. That inital post was a response to Xtom being displeased with you scumreading him. But like, he hadn't posted enough to justify a townlean, thats for sure

I had loads of stuff on Xtoxm from his early posts, which is why I asked. Enough for a smart player like you to get a sense of his alignment?

I'm not running anyone else up today. If a doc is out there he can safely guard Hectic without worrying about being forced to claim. I'm ready to wrap this up and go to night if you are too xtoxm.

im not eager to rush onto the cw, tbh
with momo immediately clarifying that its not a 3p claim
1-shot bulletproof claim basically? thats a claim that at this point in the day almost certainly results in momo being lynched. anti-survivalistic claims dont *usually* come from scum..
i think BM is the more likely scum in your hood.

I can kinda see this reasoning. If momo were scum, i'd expect him to claim a stronger role than 1-shot BP. Especially when if he is scum, he's probably not an actual 1-shot BP and that's a fake claim. why fake claim if it's not even gonna be something strong?

Good questions. Lots of possible answers. Maybe he thought it would seem stronger than it actually does (this was seemingly apparent from his claim which said this was a powerful asset to the town). Maybe he thought a big PR claim would be countered or just seen as too unbelievable, so he wanted to go for something low-key and credible, which is highly unlikely to be countered? A lot of PR fakeclaims on Day 1 could be busted pretty quickly, and if his ambition is to survive for more than a couple more days, I think he would need a fakeclaim PR which ain't gonna draw an NK, or get him into trouble with any complicated interplay. In other words, I actually think it's the perfect fakeclaim for Momo-scum.

I'm surprised Dany is getting so much heat without being here. Interesting!

[Battle Mage]

why fake claim if it's not even gonna be something strong?

Mod provided fakeclaim.

I suppose. Couldn't scum pool all the claims together and pick the strongest one to use though?

You think he'd need to be provided that by the Mod?

It's a soft fakeclaim, anyone could make it up. Although I don't really know the flavour, so maybe that makes it trickier?

[Battle Mage]

Hectic is a bad wagon because of votes like these. No reasoning behind them, other than it's a good wagon.

Keep reading, it comes out as you go.

Let's hear what you saw then, Dave, now that we know the case doesn't actually exist. There's not going to be any continuity errors on my watch.

Was waiting to do this till I got to the end of catchup, but found a post that requires my attention.
UNVOTE:

Did you even bother to ISO me? I find it hard to believe you missed what I said. But anyway, I'll go back and point you to the post after I finish.

why did you not believing Hectic, make you less inclined to believe he was scum?

Let me rephrase your question and see if I get the meaning.
You're asking why, if I didn't believe that Hectic missed what I said, would I believe his claim and unvote him?
The disbelief is about Hectic as a person, not about his role. I can believe the claim and still doubt whether he was reading.

That's not what my question was, but it doesn't matter - I'm satisfied with your answer.

[Battle Mage]

That doesn't change that Hectic's post (that several of us questioned) was illogical as fuck. It needed a wagon when that was what we had to go on.

In general I loathe the idea of lynching a possible cop. Having people want to lynch me as a claimed investigative was unbearable in the TM game. There are things you just don't do and that's one of them.

was this a response to anything in particular?

[Battle Mage]

Updated my reads list:

Almost50 is TOWN - meta

Drixx

is TOWN - open post reveal of hood, and subsequent near-obsession with hood, as well as general inquisitive tone reads strongly town.

Hectic

is MODERATE TOWN - I buy the cop-claim. More interested in flavour than game early. However overall vibe is confident, bombastic townie. Genuine scumhunting. If scum, probably not buddies with Dany - defence of him reads as pretty odd. Defence of himself has not been great.

ABR

is MODERATE TOWN - My head says probably town given his personality, the way he has stepped up to lead things, and the way people have reacted to it - in real time definitely felt like a panic-moment for scum. In my heart, I'm less sure, but clearly not a lynch in the short term.

Blake Belladonna

is TOWN LEAN

Vecna

is TOWN LEAN - just lots of good townie vibes from his posts so far. Falsely alleged I claimed scum, then ran off, so down-graded from moderate town. Lots of scummy associations to consider when we get some flips, but mostly just feels like town chasing shadows.

Gamma Emerald

is TOWN LEAN - marginal, but townie vibes from ISO so far.

BBMola

is TOWN LEAN - Interesting ISO, overall vibe is town, although protesting his own townie-ness isn't a great look. If my other reads were right, I could be interested in BBmola as a potential low-key scumpartner, but not one for now.

Pine

is TOWN LEAN - Only saving grace really is that I buy the claim, and think it probably feels more town than scum. Gameplay wise, he initially just wants to lurk through the game. Indicates factual knowledge that Vecna is town. Sets up Drixx vs Vecna as TvS - I have both as town, so this could be a cheap scum play. Collapsed under pressure to produce 6 suspects - scummy. Claims to be in 2 hoods, although per claim, obviously seems legit. Surely town if Momo-scum.

GuiltyLion

is TOWN LEAN - smart dude, sensible and believable thought processes, although continual "do you think I am scum though?" leaves a bad vibe, and early behaviour could be worth revisiting after some flips (not sure if he's just a vote-hopper by nature, or early-game jitters). Also not in a hood. I buy it.

Farside22

is TOWN LEAN - genuine scum-hunting, some minor alarm bells, but not worrying me too much for now. Odd relationship with MorningTweet noted - if not in a hood, worth exploring.

Davesaz

is NEUTRAL - about as neutral as it gets. Some townie vibes, but "in all honesty" was the most minor of scumpings.

GeorgeBailey

is NEUTRAL - some reasoning is a bit shaky, but quite liberal with the vote which I always like. One to watch, and nothing more for now.

MorningTweet

is SCUM LEAN - Lots of elaborate reads lists with very few actual suspects. Odd relationship with Farside. Makes a ludicrously weak case on me in post #567, and desperate for acknowledgement of it. Presenteeism? Nervous about questioning ABR - probably not buddies.

Elsa

is SCUM LEAN - Should be a good one to meta later, probably not worth a tickle today. Interactions would make a good fit for a Hectic or Momo scumbuddy. Voting pattern very dodgy, and picking up potential bussing-heat. Worth a look tomorrow.

Pisskop

is SCUM LEAN - generally town vibes, but I was really pinged by this "But I really do agree that we should be posting in our hoods" and "Why else would we not know our hoodmates?" followed by "I'd prefer we didnt talk about the hoods at all D1" and then "I dont have a hood". Hedging bets early on by implying he might be in a hood (when it was less clear who was in and who was out), referring to "our hoods" and "our hoodmates"? Or, less likely, a slip in reference to the scum PT? Probably not scum with ABR based on interaction.

Danyboy

SCUM LEAN - early obsession with using flavour to break game is a minus. Scummy vibes from posting. Nervous about other's opinions, although picking out me and ABR as main targets would be ballsy play for scum. Not a big presence as things heat up. A natural partner for Momo.

Xtoxm

is MODERATE SCUM - slipped up early on and then struggled for a couple posts. Claimed not to be in any hoods, and this means he shouldn't be lynched. Wants to sheep - scummy. Claims farside is scum but won't lynch her to be nice. randomly claims to be town for no reason. Not scumbuddies with Pine. Strange interactions with Farside. Openly admits lurking. More likely with Momo than Hectic. Meltdown under limited scrutiny.

Vaultdweller

is MODERATE SCUM - claimed he didn't post in his hood for ages - what's he hiding? little contribution early, mostly cheap town reads, and trying to play probable town off against each other without getting too close to fire. Seems scared of ABR, so not scumbuddies. Pre-occupied with momo and Vecna. Very quiet now Momo is being lynched. A Momo-Vecna-VaultDweller trio would not shock me.

Momo

is LIKELY SCUM - Hard to really quantify, mostly a strong gut feeling. I just get super scummy vibes from his posting, including the wording used. Weak claim, unverifiable and not consistent with play. Meta suggests scum. Improved vibes late on, but defense looks a bit like sour grapes and frustration with Day 1 lynch, not overly townie. Could definitely see him as scum with Danyboy - obvious Day 2 play for a Momo-scum flip. And potentially with VaultDweller.

[Battle Mage]

why fake claim if it's not even gonna be something strong?

Mod provided fakeclaim.

I suppose. Couldn't scum pool all the claims together and pick the strongest one to use though?

You think he'd need to be provided that by the Mod?

It's a soft fakeclaim, anyone could make it up. Although I don't really know the flavour, so maybe that makes it trickier?

I kinda forgot about mod-provided fakeclaims, but ABR reminded me

if scum isn't provided fake claims, it'd be unfair for people who don't know saw characters. plus, they'd have to gamble that they choose a SAW flavour character that no one else has.

Possible, or the real flavour is just NAI?

[Battle Mage]

Hectic is a bad wagon because of votes like these. No reasoning behind them, other than it's a good wagon.

Keep reading, it comes out as you go.

Let's hear what you saw then, Dave, now that we know the case doesn't actually exist. There's not going to be any continuity errors on my watch.

Was waiting to do this till I got to the end of catchup, but found a post that requires my attention.
UNVOTE:

Did you even bother to ISO me? I find it hard to believe you missed what I said. But anyway, I'll go back and point you to the post after I finish.

BM i think it's pretty clear dave isn't implying that he's scumreading/townreading Hectic for the "finding it hard to believe comment". it doesn't really seem related to the unvote-- which was surely because of the claim

I know, it was all tickle, no prickle.

[Battle Mage]

Possible, or the real flavour is just NAI?

I dont know what u mean by this-- i mean that every role has a flavour character attached to it, so if you were to fake claim, you'd need a jigsaw character. But if you fake claim a jigsaw character that someone else has, then your claim would fail by default

I know, it was all tickle, no prickle.

oh, silly you (ﾉ>ω<)

I mean that scum could just have flavour which isn't obviously scum? So the flavour wouldn't give them away anyway?

[Battle Mage]

we're not waiting for Pine? Ok well I want a piece of this.

Vote: Momo

If I die tonight, policy-lynch Xtoxm tomorrow obviously.

[Battle Mage]

Also, just for the record, I have no PR, so don't waste an NK on me, scumbags!

[Battle Mage]

Also, just for the record, I have no PR, so don't waste an NK on me, scumbags!

Wtf is this antitown trash of a post? Terrible.

I'm pro-town brother!

[Battle Mage]

we're not waiting for Pine? Ok well I want a piece of this.

Vote: Momo

If I die tonight, policy-lynch Xtoxm tomorrow obviously.

I'm not voting Xtoxm day 2 if he votes for momo now.

I'm surprised he didn't bite on that!

[Battle Mage]

I'm your mother's lover.

That's a scum play man, you ain't my stepdad....

[Battle Mage]

in other news, I just won my first game in 10 years...

people are salty about it.

[Battle Mage]

in other news, I just won my first game in 10 years...

people are salty about it.

i just checked it-- and a perfect example that's why i hate the thought of being in lylos. if a townie messes up they're going to get absolutely destroyed by the dead

Haha you're much braver than me, I'm staying well clear!

[Battle Mage]

For anyone that cares. I was sent a pm last night that i was in a trap with pine and hectic. In order to save hectic one of us had to sacrific ourself. Pine agreed to save himself. Fat fucking bullshit that did.

not your fault - i'm not sure why Elsa chose to kill the Cop and himself? What was the alternative??

I had a similar thing. I was caught in a trap, and I couldn't walk out.

Because I love you too much baby

Couldn't post in my hood to celebrate the Day 1 lynch....so I will make up for it today!

[Battle Mage]

BM what happened in your game if i may ask?

I don't think it's in town's interest to say, so I wont for now at least.

I think we should all reveal and map out who is in what PT today, and use that to help shape our plan of attack. Scum has this info already, the fact we don't is not good.

I need to update my readslist, had some more thoughts during the night.

[Battle Mage]

ah i see. i figured scum already would know, but i am not really sure how they work

i am worried you and ABR lean on PTs too heavily. wagon analysis will probably be more useful imo. that being said, i dont really mind since the neighbourhoods arent being utilized for anything useful from what ive heard. which is understandable

Great, are you in a PT?

I don't know the extent to which they will be helpful or not for identifying who is scum - further down the line in the game I expect they will be more useful. I think we can probably make some helpful inferences now though. And it will also be helpful to unpick people's interactions in the main thread if we can see who is in their hood.

I will start making a running tally of PT/No-PT claims after work tonight.

I'd rather we didn't lynch somebody before then, so can the over-excited folks about to lynch Dany without too much thought, cool your jets?

Especially in light of that post from VaultDweller who was my #1 scumpick coming into today.

[Battle Mage]

I'm back. Haven't done a lot so far, except ISO dany, who seems to be the leading wagon D2

from what I can gather

.

So I'm happy with this vote

for now

:

VOTE: iDanyboy

"from what I can gather" - it's pretty obvious from even a glance at the thread - if you'd ISO'd him, you obviously know this.

"for now"?? He's at like -1 or something dude, you kidding me?

These are Momo-scum vibes I get here.

[Battle Mage]

with scum killing 3 townies a night, anyone looking to rush and waste today is either scum, or a complete idiot.

[Battle Mage]

people are respectfully awaiting my next post...

[Battle Mage]

Here’s the full report when I thought it was 300 word limit btw.

Welcome to the Channel Saw News

Today's top story, Logan "momo" Nelson has been hung by the Survivors. He is survived by his partners in crime, REDACTED, REDACTED, REDACTED, and Jigsaw.

BBmolla, true identity hidden, was lauded as a hero for his hammer.

"Well I told everyone I'd hammer in 10 minutes but I did it in 5. Cause justice waits for no one."

We caught up to Albert B. Rampage, true identity hidden, before everyone headed off to sleep.

"Well as everyone knows, I wanted momo lynched the entire day. Some people were talking about a Hectic lynch but I fought very hard against that and stopped that nonsense so we could lynch the real scum, momo."

Hectic, true identity hidden, had a comment, but he just kept holding up pictures of Mario characters and the meaning was unclear.

Battle Mage, true identity hidden, was tried to reach for a comment, but they were too busy updating their readlist once again.

We almost gave up on finding more comments, but we ran into Vecna, true identity hidden, insisting his reads were so bad it was interesting.

"I've just always felt like I had a special talent, that I'm different than everyone else. It's finally nice to get the recognition I've always craved."

Elsa Jay, true identity hidden, spent most of the day mopping and came in last second with a vote.

"I don't really play games the first day. I'll see you tomorrow."

Pine, true identity hidden, shared similar sentiments.

"I'm actually doing a lot of solving in my neighborhood so bug off would you."

In other news, farside, true identity hidden, was bodyswapped with farside22, a clone of them from the past.

Also someone died. More on that.

With Channel Saw News this is Pamela Jenkins, good morning.

You're a reporter?

I did find that funny, so kudos.

Also, curious, as everyone you referenced apart from ABR ended up in a trap last night

. Coincidence?

[Battle Mage]

I don't know what to say now.

Guilt got your tongue?

Well that was a very bloody night. Seems this game couldve also had a lot of townclears judging from those flips.

Which makes me wonder if those traps/games are initiated by scum to potentially get additional kills every night?

Even though ABR has been on point so far, id like to see his reasoning for removing a whole total of 10 people from the lynch list - since it seems everyone is sheeping that and just focusing on those 7. Which has the risk of leaving major blind spots.

Anyways im already softing here that I have more information thatll help us solve, but I think it smart to hold on to it for a little while longer

Surely it's obvious that at least some of the traps are initiated by scum? I mean, the flavour suggests that right??

I already figured you had info, so I don't think you have to worry about revealing. Not sure what it says about your alignment.

For anyone that cares. I was sent a pm last night that i was in a trap with pine and hectic. In order to save hectic one of us had to sacrific ourself. Pine agreed to save himself. Fat fucking bullshit that did.

not your fault - i'm not sure why Elsa chose to kill the Cop and himself? What was the alternative??

I had a similar thing. I was caught in a trap, and I couldn't walk out.

Because I love you too much baby

Couldn't post in my hood to celebrate the Day 1 lynch....so I will make up for it today!

Can you tell me if EJ chose to die in that trap? This is important.

You would need to tell me why it was important first, I'm afraid.

I'm back. Haven't done a lot so far, except ISO dany, who seems to be the leading wagon D2 from what I can gather.

His reasoning for voting hectic was:

He has ~70 posts and he hasn't pushed anything.

Then MT replies with

he's pushing momo now

to which his response is

That's now not when I voted.

He continues voting hectic after this revelation, which he shouldn't, given his only reason for hectic is, "he's not pushing". I find this pretty scummy.

On the other hand I would expect him to move to momo when it's clear momo was going to get lynched. Though he didn't have any posts in that period, so it could be that he just wasn't online.

So I'm happy with this vote for now:

VOTE: iDanyboy

This looks like a lot of cherry picking of post.

VOTE: vault

@BM: There was a lot of PT/No PT's days 1. I thought abr had a list.

Excellent, I'll ask him and do some research of my own and come up with something. Would be easier if people just came clean though

[Battle Mage]

Are we supposed to take this literally? Because im viting danny already

I don't believe Danny is scum. here's why:

Spoiler:

Has anyone in this game played with Morning Tweet before? I'm not really liking the vibes I'm getting from her, but I don't if that's normal.

Post #165 is a clear attempt at budding someone that appears to be a town leader going into the game, but her posts become most problematic when you get to Post #174.

"But what if it's

, like,

one of those doors"

When speaking out loud, people naturally add in filled words such as "like" or "um" to fill space because they are uncomfortable with silence while they are thinking. Making a post with the word "like" as Morning Tweet did here is not natural, it's a deliberate decision. The only possible motivation I can imagine for that decision is to appear more trustworthy/relateable. There's no reason for town to make that decision and for that reason, I VOTE: Morning Tweet.

I think you're reaching here, I used to type like that aswell and the only reason I stopped is because it doesn't make sense most of the time.

Do you see scum telling their p they're reaching with their case? that's almost subtle shading. One that doesn't get them any town points upon flip.

I believe scum's fake claims are linked with there PT, so if it get's to late game and some one claims a flavor and that person should be in your respective hood they are probably scum.

The idea is genuine and pro-town to propose.

The longer Pine dodges this game while posting anywhere but here the more sure I am he's scum.

I played a game with him recently where he did just that, he was lynched and turned out to be town.

I think ABR pushing Vecna but never voting him is scummy and would like to know if anyone agrees or disagrees. Its the strongest read I have so would like to get some discussion on it.

This is my first game out of New York and I'm not used to playing with so many people so I'm finding it more difficult to get reads.

Defending a town lurker earns you suspicion with no real gain.

I agree staying on Hectic is/was bad, but give the guy a break. He's relatively new.

I feel completely the opposite on the flavour suggestion. Now we know that scum get given fakeclaims, I feel like a fake flavour-solve is more likely to be on his mind as scum than town.

[Battle Mage]

Forgot one thing!

This message came over the loudspeaker in the middle of the night:

Welcome to ChannelSawNews

Today's topstory,Logan"momo"Nelson has been hung by the Survivors.He is survived by his partnersincrime,REDACTED, REDACTED,REDACTED,andJigsaw

BBmolla,identityhidden,was lauded as hero

"Well I told everyone I'd hammer in 10 minutes but I did in 5.Cause justice waits for noone."

Does this mean BBM is confirmed a townie?

Also, the 3 REDACTED+Jigsaw = NO SURVIVOR! Aaargh. So what the hell does that line in momo's PM mean??

No, it doesn't. It's NAI.

And what are you on about? The fact Momo was in the survivor PT?

[Battle Mage]

Rats! I think SirCakez is Scum. He knew all along momo was Scum and didn't say a word until he was hammered. He also gave him that fake claimm and in his Role PM no less. I mean SC already knows the characters he used for the game so he aparently gave momo one that didn't exist to avoid a CC.

But SIRIOUSLY, "You have many allies. [REDACTED]" certainly does hint there IS a bloody Traitor. Read THE WHOLE of that Role PM. It already have momo the Scum PT for starters, so what does "You have many allies" mean if [REDACTED] wasn't something like "You know you have a Traitor but are not informed of their identity"?

So, EJ was correct (but I still maintain it was scummy to mention it that way. SORRY EJ)

So, what are these games? Do Scum pick who plays in them or does the mod? What "decisions" were made that resulted in these deaths? Obviously only Farside and BM can answer this last one.

Why would the Mod pick? Obviously most are scum, maybe a minority town? Couldn't say for sure, but it's hardly a town thing to do by nature.

[Battle Mage]

glad i defended elsa at least
sadly i think she was vigged :c

Almost TMI, my man. Like, ALMOST.

Almost - what is the value of your traitor speculation?

[Battle Mage]

glad i defended elsa at least
sadly i think she was vigged :c

Almost TMI, my man. Like, ALMOST.

Wait.

The flavor implied that Elsa was exploded and that she was gassed. I Think both were because of the traps. I dont think there was a vig.

But I do think it was evident from flavor that the traps killed Elsa.

It could be that the Vig also uses traps to kill?

[Battle Mage]

Farside - who is in your PT?

[Battle Mage]

Not much in Vaultdweller's ISO on reflection. But definitely fits the bill as a partner for Momo - soft-heat without him ever being the top priority.

momo's reasoning on morning tweet is weak and battle mage looks bad for jumping on it so quickly

Vecna and momo hard defending battle mage like that is interesting. I can't see two teammates defending him so early in the game, unless he has a very powerful role. Though it could be that vecna is town and scum!momo jumped on vecna's defense of battle mage. Not sure what to think of the whole thing, but there's a good chance there's scum in it, probably either Drixx or Battle Mage/momo.

Who is in VaultDweller's PT?

[Battle Mage]

Why would the Mod pick?

Not as "hand pick on purpose", but rather "at random".

Not in a million years.

[Battle Mage]

ABR: Check PT first

[Battle Mage]

Danyboy's ISO is beyond dreadful, especially in light of Momo-scum.

I'm slightly leaning towards that over VaultDweller now. Especially if Vecna is town.

[Battle Mage]

Vecna, is VaultDweller in your PT?

[Battle Mage]

and yes A50 I confirm I am a lone soldier, not in any hoods.

By my count 4 players have claimed NO HOOD, and the leaders collectively report a total of 14 players IN HOODS. 3 players are either hiding within the hoods or are declining to claim they're not in any.

Those 3 are within momo/EJ/Gamma/VD/Vecna/Hectic/dave/farside. I have removed Pine, Dany & BM as they have declared they were in a hood one way or another. I also dropped George because I liked GL's reasoning for town!him.

So, my preliminary lynch pool as of now is in momo/EJ/Gamma/VD/Vecna/Hectic/dave/farside (but that doesn't factor in how I gut read any of these slots)

Im not in any hood, and in my experience it is rarely +ev for town to publicly claim all this shit when hoods are not universal.

Id make an argument to look into whom are pushing for the mass reveal just in case it later turns out it mightve been relevant, but meh.

(just to elaborate, PR's that have functionality or have abilities triggered/enabled based on hoods etc is what gives me hesitance)

ah I missed this! no PT for Vecna then!

[Battle Mage]

Vecna is NOT in a PT!!

yeah I know that NOW

[Battle Mage]

Farside - who is in your PT?

Ummmm i we outing all pt's.
I will say one thing.

Danyboy's ISO is beyond dreadful, especially in light of Momo-scum.

I'm slightly leaning towards that over VaultDweller now. Especially if Vecna is town.

Both these players are in a pt with me, in the large one, neither have given me anything to go on in there.

excellent - either of George Bailey or Blake? They are the last people missing from my PT/No PT list!

[Battle Mage]

Also bm: i had a theory in the trap pt that scum might see what was posted in the pt. I asked the mod and he said no comment.

Maybe Jigsaw does. As Jigsaw is probably not in a PT.

I think maybe we should be hunting Jigsaw today to reduce the damage from traps - what do you think?

Who do you think is scummiest in your PT? who is getting a lot of heat? Any inconsistencies with posting in the main thread? Not sure if useful to share here or not, so leave to your judgement how much to say.

[Battle Mage]

Can we clear up a theory i have bm, please.
George is in the pt. Blake no.

Great, and presumably Hectic wasn't?

[Battle Mage]

Let me know when you can give me a few minutes bm

Now is good!

[Battle Mage]

@Farside - Gamma and Davesaz are presumably the final 2 with you?

[Battle Mage]

Thanks MT and Farside - I'm making a list, just need to confirm Gamma and Davesaz

Then I think we should lynch someone NOT in a PT to maximise chance of hitting Jigsaw.

[Battle Mage]

Because you think Jigsaw is a traitor? Or because you think he's not in a neighbourhood?

The latter - don't ask me about traitors *shrug* nothing so far has persuaded me to take about that one way or another.

[Battle Mage]

what's the full list of not-in-a-PT? I remember ABR had one early game it was like me, Vecna, Xtoxm, Molla? then didn't a50 and pisskop claim no hood as well? Honestly that seems like a fairly town list and not best odds of finding scum - I agree there's likely at least one scum there but there's no gimmes. I'd have to talk myself into voting like a50 or pisskop or Xtoxm and I have decent reasons for thinking all of them are town. Probably at this point if I had to, I'd go for a50 with the over-emphasis on Traitor spec - maybe crumbing traitor himself.

Well I would guess there is 2 scum with no-PT (inc Jigsaw), and 2 scum in the 7-person PT.

It's worth taking the risk to get Jigsaw now as it might stop/slow down the traps.

I can't see A50 doing that as jigsaw. Jigsaw is a mastermind, someone clever, strategic. You were quick out of the blocks here - could YOU be Jigsaw?

[Battle Mage]

Intriguingly according to my list, we have 1 more person claiming to be in a PT than claimed PT numbers suggest. Farside confirmation of final places in big hood would be V helpful.

[Battle Mage]

what's the full list of not-in-a-PT? I remember ABR had one early game it was like me, Vecna, Xtoxm, Molla? then didn't a50 and pisskop claim no hood as well? Honestly that seems like a fairly town list and not best odds of finding scum - I agree there's likely at least one scum there but there's no gimmes. I'd have to talk myself into voting like a50 or pisskop or Xtoxm and I have decent reasons for thinking all of them are town. Probably at this point if I had to, I'd go for a50 with the over-emphasis on Traitor spec - maybe crumbing traitor himself.

I agree that's not a very convincing list. I have reasons to TR all of them except pisskop. But I actually didn't read very heavily into the whole "pisskop maybe lying about his PT status" thing yesterday, and was more focused on the Hectic/momo wagons.

Because you think Jigsaw is a traitor? Or because you think he's not in a neighbourhood?

The latter - don't ask me about traitors *shrug* nothing so far has persuaded me to take about that one way or another.

Yea the traitor stuff went over my head. The momo flip PM didn't show me anything that suggests traitor. Why do you think Jiggy doesn't have a neighbourhood? Apologies if you already said it though

Feels like a fit with the flavour - Jigsaw wouldn't be in the hood, he would have his followers doing that dirty work. And also makes sense with Farside's theory of Jigsaw being able to see the trap PTs. There must be a balance here. Jigsaw just being some goon in a PT seems weak.

[Battle Mage]

Are you factoring in that Pine was in two hoods?

Yes, I currently have the following on the 7 person hood:

Vaultdweller
Danyboy
Farside
GeorgeBailey
Drixx
Hectic

and 1 more from:

Davesaz and Gamma Emerald

[Battle Mage]

Vote: Xtoxm

[Battle Mage]

Based on what happened last night, and everything we've seen so far today, Xtoxm is a great bet for scum and Jigsaw himself.

Trust BM - I have never steered you wrong before.

[Battle Mage]

ah thanks Farside - I can count then, I just can't read....

Please be kind enough to join me in lynching Jigsaw today, to avenge the horrors we experience last night.

[Battle Mage]

you missed guilty lion, otherwise perfect

[Battle Mage]

ah thanks Farside - I can count then, I just can't read....

Please be kind enough to join me in lynching Jigsaw today, to avenge the horrors we experience last night.

A50/Xtoxm/pisskop

I added pisskop because is day 2 interaction looks really off, but those 3 are part of the non-pt list I would call scum reads.

Xtoxm is Jigsaw.

I am voting for Xtoxm.

[Battle Mage]

separately I do agree about Pisskop, but we can come to that another day.