Micro 935 | Chain of Command | Game Over!

[DoctorPepper]

Hello all!

by my count, you opened with 'hello' in mini 1582 and mini 1593, both as mafia. there was no 'hello' in mini 1591, micro 349, newbie 1537, newbie 1513, newbie 1500 and mini 1578 as town and micro 366 as mafia.

I don't like this one but, coupled with the "scum is in these positions". Mods don't do that

VOTE: Euphony

[DoctorPepper]

Startinng Bletchley park for Enigma code breaking as cryptography is permitted

Reporting in

/in bletchley park

/in imitation game?

Deciphering fractals.

/wave

:3

promise im a little less shit now but still shit after 6 years

Frequencies and folds.

break break

Bravo Papa

Private Kanna
Private OkaPoka

Rank and file.

Over.

So I take it youre claiming ensign? Or you've denoted Kanna and Oka to be ensigns?

[DoctorPepper]

VOTE: doctorpepper

The scum being in those positions thing was obviously a joke. Also don't rolefish kids.

I don't get why claiming people are this game's equivalent of VTs is a bad thing.

Wouldn't it be bad if I started claiming "Oh shit these guys are PRs"

[DoctorPepper]

VOTE: doctorpepper

The scum being in those positions thing was obviously a joke. Also don't rolefish kids.

Yeah I'll choose to take it seriously.


Besides the bigger ping was 22.

[DoctorPepper]

Unless this is hec-shiki, I've skimread some of shiki's other games and they've made pretty out there deductions

pedit: VT claims shrink the pool of possible PRs, no?

Aren't we playing under the fact that most people are VTs anyway?

If anything, if they're actually a PR they can just opt.not to claim it

[DoctorPepper]

Unless this is hec-shiki, I've skimread some of shiki's other games and they've made pretty out there deductions

pedit: VT claims shrink the pool of possible PRs, no?

Aren't we playing under the fact that most people are VTs anyway?

If anything, if they're actually a PR they can just opt.not to claim it

eh?

Ok, what kind of answer were you expecting from #43?

~k

TBH I just need to know what Quantum quasar is doing.

[DoctorPepper]

@DOCTORPEPPER; DO NOT DODGE MY QUESTION

That was the answer?

[DoctorPepper]

QQ is a weird player and it seems to be a consistent pattern. I'm gonna try to get the point of what they're saying because none of it makes sense

[DoctorPepper]

VOTE: quantumquasar

pat me on the back and sheep me

Yes sir

VOTE: QQ[/vote,]

I'm a bit worried this slot is lynchbait and that maybe what QQ does is NAI as it seems to be a common pattern, but I don't see the logic in voting for the AFK

[DoctorPepper]

Ugh.

VOTE: QQ

Mobile problems

[DoctorPepper]

I actually think Drew is town, idk where this is coming from

[DoctorPepper]

QQ is going after LHF

Now some may argue I'm going after LHF, but ehh who cares. What's more interesting is a general hesitancy for people to actually vote anyone.

so why don't you just want to cast a vote? nothing like a vote to make the game more interesting

LHF?

I use my vote carefully as I think town needs strong voting to win. We've also just started and plenty of time. Why rush to a lynch? Are you happy to waste a day and move us to lynch/

low hanging fruit, aka very easy targets that look reasonable to vote ~at least on a surface level

anyways, i don't doubt that you can parse through a thread of lots of talking and no action to get some reads but as it stands in today's meta, people need wagons and votes to analyze and well uh, this is not a 1v9 game

nobody said anything about death, although it is nice to always have the fear of a lolhammer to raise the stakes but better to get the ball rolling than wait until the deadline does it for us

You say a lot without saying a lot.

Mixed feelings on Drew, leaning not-so-good but willing to see more.

I have a pet theory why scum would want to wagon QQ and I don't think I like this.

VOTE: OkaPoka @Oka, what do you think about Drew so far?

Express your read. And why are you voting Oka if you feeling mixed on me?

I think drew is a relic of the past, its refreshing to be reminded of the ancient way of playing

Good to know time hasn't improved your game

I actually think Drew is town, idk where this is coming from

Why do you believe this?

Gutfeel.

You seem to be having real activity. Doesn't seem like scum trying to be active

[DoctorPepper]

Never said it wasn't. I'm just saying my gut tells me that Drew is being active in a way that I find productive to town, instead of people being active but not contributing anything to the discussion

[DoctorPepper]

To be honest, I haven't done a good job reading this game, I skimmed a lot (I hate meta too and a lot of the meta discussion here has been a big meh for me)

I still have Euphonia as my top scum read tho that may be because I'm super annoyed by the posting style.

Liking OkaPoka and Kanna so far.

[DoctorPepper]

I think I am good with Oka so far as my read on QQ aligns. So that's why I'm inclined to agree with them for now

Though agreed, not much to go on this game. Why don't we get the others involved, I can't seem to get anything off Aldus or Iconeum

[DoctorPepper]

Mostly gut on Kanna. I particularly liked pushing me for my QQ read earlier.

You, hmm so far I didn't like you for disagreeing with my Euphony push, but I do get your point on PR hunting.

But I wasn't really as much hunting PRs as I was trying to understand what QQ was doing because I never get what they're doing.

You're actively trying to get reads today so you're looking good for now, care to convince me otherwise on Euphony?

[DoctorPepper]

do you think i'm more likely scum for disagreeing with you?

i don't think i care enough to go convincing you otherwise? meaning my current read on euphony stems from playing with shiki twice and their posting so far is ~similar enough~ to their towngame to townbin them for the time being. (note that i have a terrible read rate of hectic, so.)

i was hoping to in the meantime be able to get a few stronger reads, because i kinda need them to feel engaged with the game, but i don't think anyone has particularly towntold or scumtold so far.

Disagreeing implies that you're town who doesn't agree with me. That wasn't my thought at first. I thought you were making a bad push because I took something I didnt expect to be a joke as a serious post.

I thought it was kinda mis-reppy at first, hence my initial read. But you don't seem like you are fake scum.hunting or looking for reasons to paint people as scum

[DoctorPepper]

DoctarRubicon, can you answer my question of what fizzed you about shiki's 22?

%¿¿♧ Hectic

It seemed like you were manufacturing a terrible meta read

[DoctorPepper]

Bruh, this is like the worst tunnel ever

[DoctorPepper]

why should i feel good about you choosing to vote pepper and more glaringly, choosing not to vote QQ

pepper has the awkward case + vote based on 'mod wouldn't do this you are scum for pushing this angle' while clearly RVS
QQ, as I said, is next in line

both are good votes

Yet QQ is my lynch target for today.

So either you're wrong or I'm bussing THIS early

[DoctorPepper]

...

...

[DoctorPepper]

ok im actually mildly shocked you did that but let me just sit on that for a bit

have you done this by now?

~
-snip-

Who knows maybe I think this is super important, maybe I think its NAI. Maybe I don't even know what to think.

me likey vote on ico still, sheep me for hugs

Ehh, why not

VOTE: Iconeum

[DoctorPepper]

oka i get you're being like that on purpose but just asking people to sheep you on whatever vote you decided to place this time is gonna get old at some point

pepper, what *are* your thoughts on ico?

Scummy (with only a little OMGUS sprinkled in)

[DoctorPepper]

Yeah you're not getting a claim this early.

Anyone else sus about the wagon on me?

The problem I have with QQ now is that I don't know if this is their scum play or if it's just NAI.

Nonetheless I'm sticking to my current vote

[DoctorPepper]

Wouldn't scum have more reason to be consistent because they know the game state?

[DoctorPepper]

Exactly.

Scum would be more calculated while town would most likely throw haymakers.

[DoctorPepper]

Hey Drew, what do you think of Euphony/Iconeum/Datusi?

[DoctorPepper]

Hey Drew, what do you think of Euphony/Iconeum/Datusi?

why are you inquiering about the townblock?

I doubt you're all town

[DoctorPepper]

oka i get you're being like that on purpose but just asking people to sheep you on whatever vote you decided to place this time is gonna get old at some point

pepper, what *are* your thoughts on ico?

Scummy (with only a little OMGUS sprinkled in)

If you scumread me, what is the basis of the scumread? You sheeped Oka's vote on me, who also didn't provide any reason for his scumread. And it only came *after* I voted you so...

You weren't really in the game until you voted me bruh

Your reasons for picking me as scum looks like scum faking activity and looking for a reason to lynch someone, so there

[DoctorPepper]

I feel like DrP...is a literal player(?) which makes some of the things he says more scummy than it is? Eg, the rolefishing thing earlier, I thought he was rolefishing too but i think from his responses/a readback, he wasn't actually doing that

I think pepper has a good chance of being scum because of what and how he pushed
A scumread on a player because he made a joke about a mod putting scum in certain position in playerlist isn't genuinely coming from town, even 'if you don't think it was a joke'

Even if a player says it seriously, what is scummy about stating that fact?

This is a terrible take.

I was legit trying to find someone pushing fake content. I don't get why I'm being pushed for this

[DoctorPepper]

1.Iconeum - VT
2.Datisi - prob town
3.Kanna - prob scum
4.QuantumQuasar - meh outside shot being scum
5.Euphony (Hectic + shiki) - prob town
6.Alduskkel - could be scum
7.OkaPoka - meh, could be town i guess?
8.Drew-Sta - meh
9.DoctorPepper - prob scum

You think I'm scummier than Also but you remove me from L-1 to vote him?

Whut?

[DoctorPepper]

Your reasons for picking me as scum looks like scum faking activity and looking for a reason to lynch someone, so there

->I think ur scum because you look like scum faking activity on the first thing that looks or sounds illogical and will take any reason to lynch someone, especially seeing how you never got around to sorting the slot

Pepper, if I used this reasoning to explain why I think ur scum, what would you say to that?

Well it sounds like a discredit

How was that faking activity when it was the first thing on the game?

If anything, the original post was the fake activity because if it was a joke then it did nothing to move the game phase and if it was serious then it was a bad push.

And worse, taking an obv joke seriously is a reason to scum read someone now?

[DoctorPepper]

The problem I have with QQ now is that I don't know if this is their scum play or if it's just NAI.

have you attempted to investigate this?

Haven't checked if they have finished games so I can't comment on what I have seen so far from him

[DoctorPepper]

hello this is shiki

i was reading through the thread and i came across something very interesting

keep in mind i came into the game telling myself that if a pattern emerges that doesn't make sense it is probably a mafia pattern

here i will tally up the total amount of posts people have made during this game

Iconeum - 93
OkaPoka - 69
Datisi - 63
Euphony (Hectic + shiki) - 53
Drew-Sta - 32
DoctorPepper - 31
Alduskkel - 30
Kanna - 29
GeorgeBailey - 21
QuantumQuasar - 19

as you can see Iconeum seems to be dominating the spotlight while players like GeorgeBailey and QuantumQuasar are lagging behind

now let's have a look at the number of times players have been the first to post on a page. i believe this practice is called PageTopping

GeorgeBailey

6

- 0 | 75 | 125 | 150 | 250 | 400
Iconeum

3

- 200 | 225 | 350
Kanna

2

- 50 | 275
Datisi

2

- 175 | 425
Euphony (Hectic + shiki)

2

- 25 | 100
Alduskkel

1

- 375
OkaPoka

1

- 325
DoctorPepper

1

- 300
QuantumQuasar

0

Drew-Sta

0

as you can see Kanna is 8th in post count but is 3rd in PageTop count. this is indicative that Kanna is intentionally going for PageTops despite posting less than what she should have. this something mafia do to make it appear as if they have more content and presence than they actually do, since PageTops are fortified watchtowers of a castle

even more alarming is GeorgeBailey being 9th in post count yet 1st in PageTops, i believe GeorgeBailey is mafia and is orchestrating this game

i would like to hear thoughts on my theory of GeorgeBailey + Kanna

Bruh.

Seriously?

[DoctorPepper]

*am aware it is a joke and am just expressing my displeasure in seeing it*

[DoctorPepper]

What does it do to advance the game state?

[DoctorPepper]

Not really an excuse don't you think?

Admittedly yes I haven't done much to advance game state also but I'm still not a fan of fluff. A lot of the game feels. Fluffy to me because I am not a fan of stylized posts that much and this game is quite full of it.

[DoctorPepper]

VOTE: quantumquasar

pat me on the back and sheep me

Yes sir

VOTE: QQ[/vote,]

I'm a bit worried this slot is lynchbait and that maybe what QQ does is NAI as it seems to be a common pattern, but I don't see the logic in voting for the AFK

why should i feel good about you choosing to vote pepper and more glaringly, choosing not to vote QQ

pepper has the awkward case + vote based on 'mod wouldn't do this you are scum for pushing this angle' while clearly RVS
QQ, as I said, is next in line

both are good votes

Yet QQ is my lynch target for today.

So either you're wrong or I'm bussing THIS early

Some of your opinion on Quentin was that you were afraid what he was doing was mostly NAI, so why categorise him as your "lynch target" and it as "bussing"? Was your Quentin vote serious enough to be considered that, and has your opinion on him changed now?

¬]]== Hectic

Quentin has done nothing to make me change my opinion of him.

Categorized it as bussing because you pegged us as scum.

He's my lynch target because I was voting for him today and from what I have seen in his games it's something I'd rather not deal with but I disliked his particular action today

[DoctorPepper]

To your point Datu, I'm not really a fan of shit-posty players and my old meta consisted of being frustrated at to the point of asking mod replacement because I argued with them too much (I know I know really shitty)

[DoctorPepper]

do you like me dr pepper :puppy_eyes:

Are you WK-ing me?

[DoctorPepper]

What does White Knighting mean now?

My age is showing

[DoctorPepper]

oh, is the "datu" nickname gonna actually stick lmao

opinion on aldus?

also how is that post white knighting actually

What would you prefer to be called?

Anyway, I see the case for Aldus as they've been very fluffy and I've only found their last few posts of any substance but for some reason I'm gut reading him as town-null just because my reads align with theirs

[DoctorPepper]

anything from dat or dats to denni dasani darius (yes i've been called all of those before) works really

just thought it was kinda funny for some reason as my name doesn't have an u (listen i've been in bed for 6 hours now staring at the ceiling dead tired unable to sleep, my sense of humour gets degenerated even more than usual)

I've been misreading it as Datu and was laughing at the fact that Datu means leader where I'm from.

Anyway, I actually think you're town and am wondering why you're so keep on Euph and Ico.

My initial reads have me at
Town:
Oka
Dats
Drew

Nullish Town
Aldus
Kanna

Nullish Scum
QQ

Scum
Icon
Euph

[DoctorPepper]

*am aware it is a joke and am just expressing my displeasure in seeing it*

Bruh

[DoctorPepper]

Am I at fault for not choosing to read you properly Euph because your serious game posts are clouded in a lot of fluff?

Fluff is scummy to me

[DoctorPepper]

Because you're posting makes it hard for me to take your serious content seriously.

Mainly tho I dislike your reads.

I generally think that fluffy is scum. Yes you post actual content but it's hard for me to take it seriously. To me, the fluff outweighs the content and I see that as scummy. Because the game state can be stalled and the content won't matter.

Actually, maybe I should ISO you to prove or disprove the hypothesis I made to you, but why are you concerned with being at the bottom of my reads list?

[DoctorPepper]

uhhh lmao ico/euph are my stronger townreads?

ico the fact is i've played a lot of games with him and he seems Just Town? he's got a Townblocc(tm) and is going through PoE and his reads make sense to me, and there's just enough "wtf is this shit ico" posts that i don't think he'd be faking so

euph you say "fluff is scummy" but like
80 posts of content and 10 posts of fluff are arguably much better than just 20 posts of content

i've played with hectic and he jokes around. like okay. cool. but why fluff is usually scummy is when it's offered instead of game advancing content not on the side of game advancing content

i'm pretty sure i have just as much if not more "non game advancing posts" but youhave me as town so

Unless I'm being completely blind here, Euph is 60-40 fluff to post and most of the post is based on me.

Isn't it a thing where the fluff obfuscates the content?

Anyway, you have been jokey but I feel like your pushes are genuine. And you're not content on just scum reading anyone (i.e. me) I think you're genuinely here to read me.

Euph doesn't have the same feel for me. That last one they were asking me why I took their joke seriously even after we talked about me not liking the joke and it being the catalyst of our discussion now.

Fluff is scummy to me because I'm fluffy as scummy. I mean I get having fun as a hydra and fluff posting, hell I do that too with my old hydras, but the ratio seems off

[DoctorPepper]

No, town me dislikes your playstyle and thinks it's scum. Town me knows that you are too widely townread at the moment to have a wagon going but would like to express my displeasure in your slot in the hopes of a future lynch or maybe in the hopes of me cracking the code to this game eventually.

Has my dislike for fluff clouded my ability to read you? Sure, but none of this is scum motivated like what you're trying to point out

[DoctorPepper]

I don't get your Aldus read and why my wagon or his is good to you

I dislike Ico's AtE read being Towny (and everyone who thinks this can explain why, maybe it's a relic from the fact that I'm from 2013).

Obviously I disagree with your read on me

But it all feels disingenuous to me.

P-Edit. I just read through their ISO again it's not a 20% split..

[DoctorPepper]

i just reread their iso and 10 out of 58 posts were fluff (non game advancing) which is under 20% so yeet

Either I'm not seeing what you're seeing or we have very different definitions of what constitutes fluff

[DoctorPepper]

you don't think ico's AtE is genuine? @drpepper

No.

I don't think AtE is Towny either

[DoctorPepper]

fluff = posts that don't advance the game in any way

asking game related questions is not fluff, responding to people about the game is not fluff, like idk what your definition of fluff is but

Fluff can be posts that are just there to look like activity.

I can't seem to find a lot of activity unless it's the line of questioning on me right now

[DoctorPepper]

No, town me dislikes your playstyle and thinks it's scum. Town me knows that you are too widely townread at the moment to have a wagon going but would like to express my displeasure in your slot in the hopes of a future lynch or maybe in the hopes of me cracking the code to this game eventually.

Has my dislike for fluff clouded my ability to read you? Sure, but none of this is scum motivated like what you're trying to point out

Yeah, it's not scum-motivated, but I still don't buy whether you scumread us over everyone else for "playstyle" or "fluff".

~}}"~~ Hectic

To clarify: I don't think it's a decision scum!you takes because you think it's a good play. It's something you do because you think it's right or natural, or are just lazy about it.

^7-5 Hectic

I could just be lazy about it sure, but it doesn't mean it's a scum thing for me to do.

[DoctorPepper]

...

This is why I barely have anything to contribute to the game.

How do you even read stuff here

[DoctorPepper]

this ain't fluff my dude

this is elaborate meta discussion that even i don't understand

and i'm the one that modded strawberry mafia lmao

Yeahhh, not a fan of meta.

I hate to be the guy that tells at clouds and dismisses everything I don't understand as fluff Butz if the shoe fits

[DoctorPepper]

ahh meta, something that used to be controversial and now is defacto

Are you serious? Please tell me you're joking

[DoctorPepper]

I get meta and to an extent town hunting (though honestly both are flawed)

I don't get AtE

[DoctorPepper]

These are things easily exploitable by scum noh?

[DoctorPepper]

Isn't that kinda too-scummy-to-be-scum? If Icon were scum what would you expect to see that you're not seeing in this game?

For DP, I think he's letting his dislike of Euphony's playstyle get the better of him; Euphony has plenty of content to analyze. I'd say DP reads like frustrated/misguided town.

Admittedly, Euphony and Iconeum raised some interesting points against DP on pages 20 and 22 respectively, so I should probably iso him to double check my read. I don't feel like doing that today though after writing that wallpost.

Are you WK-ing me too?

[DoctorPepper]

you don't think ico's AtE is genuine? @drpepper

No.

I don't think AtE is Towny either

I literally think ur scum here. You have expressed several scumreads this game so far, and you have not bothered to sort a single one of them. You just go 'this is scum, and then vote there'. No interaction to further sort. No intention to double-check for errors.

You just vote and tunnel. It's scum behaviour.

Yeah wouldn't it be easier for me as scum to just sheep the biggest wagon instead of going for unpopular opinions here?

You maybe miscontruing scum for someone who just doesn't play by pushing walls or post by post analysis because I got tired of doing that when I was active a few years ago

Plus if I was scum shouldn't I have hammered Aldus right now to save my ass from being lynched today?

[DoctorPepper]

Unless I'm being completely blind here, Euph is 60-40 fluff to post and most of the post is based on me. Isn't it a thing where the fluff obfuscates the content? Anyway, you have been jokey but I feel like your pushes are genuine. And you're not content on just scum reading anyone (i.e. me) I think you're genuinely here to read me. Euph doesn't have the same feel for me. That last one they were asking me why I took their joke seriously even after we talked about me not liking the joke and it being the catalyst of our discussion now. Fluff is scummy to me because I'm fluffy as scummy. I mean I get having fun as a hydra and fluff posting, hell I do that too with my old hydras, but the ratio seems off

so fluff is only scummy when it's convenient for you to push someone on, and can be null or townie depending on the situation like with datisi?

Gut feel. I feel like it's intentions based for me

I also feel like the push on me is just as lazy as my playstyle is

[DoctorPepper]

you don't think ico's AtE is genuine? @drpepper

No.

I don't think AtE is Towny either

I literally think ur scum here. You have expressed several scumreads this game so far, and you have not bothered to sort a single one of them. You just go 'this is scum, and then vote there'. No interaction to further sort. No intention to double-check for errors.

You just vote and tunnel. It's scum behaviour.

Yeah wouldn't it be easier for me as scum to just sheep the biggest wagon instead of going for unpopular opinions here?

You maybe miscontruing scum for someone who just doesn't play by pushing walls or post by post analysis because I got tired of doing that when I was active a few years ago

Plus if I was scum shouldn't I have hammered Aldus right now to save my ass from being lynched today?

what r ur unpopular opinions?

Lynch ICO, Euph is fluffy, Aldus is town

[DoctorPepper]

reminder still waiting on Kanna's reads

I'm in a confusing state right now but I think <Datisi, OkaPoka, Aldus, DrP> are town, the rest i can't tell you atm

Oh yay you're town

[DoctorPepper]

Discredit away but hey, these are genuine beliefs

[DoctorPepper]

Probably conf bias on my part that I already had you as scum and am kinda convinced

[DoctorPepper]

Do you think I have been trying to sort townreads and scumreads (albeit faked or not)?

I think you're also on the same path here.

You have your set townblock and scum reads and your line of questioning actually doesn't switch that much as it more or less confirms your own beliefs.

So from my observation (admittedly you have rightfully called me out for being lazy as I don't tend to wall or do post by post and actually have these as the back up to my claims, as right now I'm trying to feel mostly by gut), you aren't really engaging them much less confirming your own reads.

[DoctorPepper]

I mean I do realize that my play seems as if I'm not pushing anything but I guess it's just a departure from 2016 DP to 2020 DP as I used to do huge wall PbP analysis as either alignment and now just play lazily and base everything on gut

Not really convincing I know but my view of how to play the game has changed and is quite different from site meta

Only saying this because my lazy play is being misconstrued (either in good or bad faith) as scum play when TBH it should really be NAI.

So yeah, these are gut reads and take them or leave them as you will

[DoctorPepper]

you don't think ico's AtE is genuine? @drpepper

No.

I don't think AtE is Towny either

I literally think ur scum here. You have expressed several scumreads this game so far, and you have not bothered to sort a single one of them. You just go 'this is scum, and then vote there'. No interaction to further sort. No intention to double-check for errors.

You just vote and tunnel. It's scum behaviour.

This is kind of an implication that it's lazy noh?

I mean I think it's lazy

You can say it's scum but it's right there

[DoctorPepper]

You have your set townblock and scum reads and your line of questioning actually doesn't switch that much as it more or less confirms your own beliefs.

So you don't think i've been trying to sort, and that I just voted and be done with it?

I mean after a quick glance of your ISO, aside from meta reads you have just had your initial reads, you have been using your line of posting more to convince yourself or this town of your scum reads rather than sorting them

Which is like me with extra steps is what I'm saying

Like the engagement isn't there to prove or disprove your claims, it is there to validate what you are already thinking.

My issues with that is that if that's what I'm doing (and the behavior you are accusing me of as scummy), then it's coming from a familliar place

[DoctorPepper]

you don't think ico's AtE is genuine? @drpepper

No.

I don't think AtE is Towny either

I literally think ur scum here. You have expressed several scumreads this game so far, and you have not bothered to sort a single one of them. You just go 'this is scum, and then vote there'. No interaction to further sort. No intention to double-check for errors.

You just vote and tunnel. It's scum behaviour.

This is kind of an implication that it's lazy noh?

I mean I think it's lazy

You can say it's scum but it's right there

Nah, it's definitely not calling you lazy. I didn't scumread you because I thought you were being lazy. Rather that you intentionally were not sorting town and scumreads, which is a scumtell.

At best that's NAI don't you think? Or at least indicative of playstyle and not of scummy behavior?

[DoctorPepper]

Because you're assuming there's one way to play town and that's to constantly push reads in a way you're familliar with

Hell, I'd play like this as either alignment and it's kind of an active effort because I'm acknowledging my meta before this was really shit

[DoctorPepper]

I mean after a quick glance of your ISO, aside from meta reads you have just had your initial reads, you have been using your line of posting more to convince yourself or this town of your scum reads rather than sorting themWhich is like me with extra steps is what I'm sayingLike the engagement isn't there to prove or disprove your claims, it is there to validate what you are already thinking. My issues with that is that if that's what I'm doing (and the behavior you are accusing me of as scummy), then it's coming from a familliar place

that's a bit of a misrep, no?

I've already said that my scumread on you has dropped down, while you were my Numero Uno scumread before. I came back from hard scumreading Kanna (a day later, when the emotions from directly engaging weren't there), and i've been trying to sort in kanna/aldus to see what's going on there.

And right now I'm less sure about Aldus, because of a specific post he made.

So no, I don't agree that I'm holding on to my initial reads.

I'm probably blind for not seeing your drop on me or mistaking your engagement for a tunnel because the metadiscussion this game had has you as a player prone to tunneling.

I can claim that it seems that you are only flexible on your scum reads but your town bloc remains constant.

[DoctorPepper]

I'm not really excusing my play so to say I'm just pointing out that it's indicative of me having a lazy playstyle as opposed to my old one. And it should be NAI because I'd do the same regardless of alignment.

[DoctorPepper]

And it should be NAI because I'd do the same regardless of alignment.

If you use that as a means of defending yourself, why are you not taking my tunneling as NAI into account but rather as a means to scumread me?

Not as simple as that

Yes, I did not your tendency to tunnel as a player, which we have both conceded (not as town, not as scum, as a player)

I was trying see that you do have a death tunnel on your scum reads and you were trying to correct me that by engaging us you change your reads on them like Me or Aldus, but I still think we are firmly there because you engage us but your town bloc is untouched

[DoctorPepper]

this game makes my head hurt and i'm lowkey wishing i rolled scum to not have to figure it out

TBH same, rolling scum would make this easier

Two things:
I think I was awake and online when QQ voted for Aldus. There might be no way to conclusively prove this though.

Also yes I agree you don't need walls and PbP to push reads and admittedly that was how I did it before.

I will willingly admit I am beetlejuicing and I do post as a response to when people call my attention. I am at fault for dismissing the other contributions in the game due to preconceived gut tells about everyone, but I do think that these interactions have been solidifying my reads (and I realize this is ironic because I am accusing Ico of just confirming his scum tells rather than reevaluating his town bloc - this I will confirm)

[DoctorPepper]

Look, I'm willingly going to admit that I get why I'm being seen as not productive to town but I refuse to be read as scum for things that are at best NAI

I'm willing to work and learn how to play better and see what you guys are seeing that I am not with regards to Ico, Euph and Aldus.

But let's face it, the game state in and of itself is messy to read as it is don't you think?

P-Edit: That I still think you're scum

But maybe I do agree with you on this

VOTE: Quantum

[DoctorPepper]

I mean after a quick glance of your ISO, aside from meta reads you have just had your initial reads, you have been using your line of posting more to convince yourself or this town of your scum reads rather than sorting them

Are you standing behind this statement that i've never had more then my initial reads?

I'm saying you say you soften up your scum reads or vary their scumminess but your town block is solid

[DoctorPepper]

Because I feel like your push on me is quite inorganic and is based on playstyle tells rather than scumtells that you're trying to justify as scumtells. Your engagement with me feels like its a means to confirm your scumtells guised as a means to get answers from me.

And again, gut.

Though, a big town read of mine in Dats is playing like you with regards to me. So either in reading you guys wrong and I should pay better attention, or I'm being very stubborn with my reads with you, thus ironically falling into the same trap I am accusing you of

P-Edit: my scum read on you is the answer to 651.

Yes, it's because you claim your reads to evolve but really you're just switching around your suspects but you keep a pocket for your town reads. At best as a townie you are already conf biasing to incline that they are town and are interacting less with them with the risk of pocketing scum.
At worst, it looks like you're evolving reads but it's artificial, it's just a means to look like they're evolving when only thing that's happening is you're switching the order of scum reads (if that makes any sense)

[DoctorPepper]

P-Edit: That I still think you're scum
But maybe I do agree with you on this
VOTE: Quantum

this is totally not creepy

you still think i'm scum
but you agree with me that QQ is scum
so you vote alongside with me on QQ

UNVOTE:
VOTE: drpepper

Ahh yes because I've completely devolved into associative tells on Day 1 and have not considered the possibility of people I think are scum can be not scum together (i.e. I could be wrong)

And also I'm allowed to vote for other people other than my top scum reads

But I feel like this is going here

VOTE: Iconeum

[DoctorPepper]

pepper why are you comortable voting alongside me if you are that sure i'm scum

do you think it's me with QQ?

No, I could be wrong about either of you.

One of you could actually be town

But I think you guys could be scum, just not scum together.

Was hoping that if QQ was scum I'd be wrong about you but hey, let's see where this goes

[DoctorPepper]

... I literally did

[DoctorPepper]

Our engagement has me thinking you are scum, that read is solidified

But you do raise a valuable point hence I considered my read on dats seeing as you have a similar read as him on me and our interactions are the same. Thus either I could be wrong town reading one and scum reading the other.

Initially this is why I was willing to move to QQ so I could evaluate that bit hey, you're being so insistent I think we won't be proven right or wrong til we see a flip from either of us

[DoctorPepper]

1. I'm saying I want to reevaluate my read because I admit it's weird for me to scum read you and town read dats even if you are functionally the same with your interactions with me
2. I say it's weird that you claim your reads are evolving when you're just switching around the position of scum in your reads

[DoctorPepper]

I'm not trying to be dense on purpose but it seems like I'm very easily painted as I am here.

[DoctorPepper]

Does there need to be more?

2 is an oversimplification don't you think? You're painting it as mere OMGUS for scum reading me when I feel like it's because the push on me is disingenuous

[DoctorPepper]

1. I'm saying I want to reevaluate my read because I admit it's weird for me to scum read you and town read dats even if you are functionally the same with your interactions with me
2. I say it's weird that you claim your reads are evolving when you're just switching around the position of scum in your reads

How have your reads evolved this game?

You are literally quoting a post that has me wanting to reevaluate a read because I can't scum read a player and town read another for acting the same way

[DoctorPepper]

Well I got bored at work so here we are

I wanted to see why I'm town reading dats but scum reading Ico for having the same game

So I was gonna see a QQ lynch.

But since you wanna do this, I think only a flip will answer your question, be it from Ico or from me

[DoctorPepper]

I wanted to but you voted for me for voting for QQ, hence maybe I wouldn't have to and just see the flip from you to get an answer, or for you to see mine to get yours

P-Edit: I wanted to move on to another issue first because the discussion Ico and I are having are just gonna confirm whatever biases we already have on each other and then I could see if my read on either of you was wrong.

Let's admit it, this 5 page discussion we have had has done nothing but solidified our unchanging positions on each other.

[DoctorPepper]

Pepper aside from 'wanting to change your reads', have you actually done so over the course of this game?

Because you are pushing me for not having done so, while I actually have. And you are the one who didn't.

Keep insisting that you've changed your reads but I still think you're shuffling them around.

I wanna try to get something of QQ or at least understand why I read you and Dats differently. But maybe we can't get to do that because we keep devolving into this argument that leads to nowhere

[DoctorPepper]

1. Pushing somewhere else to remove an associative (i.e. I think QQ and Ico are scum but I don't think they are scum together).
2. Moving away from discussing with Ico because the discussion had turned out to just be us conf biasing all over the place.

I want to try to understand why my reads on you both are different and I can't do that if I keep engaging Ico because at this point we are both convinced that the other is scum and neither of us seem to be backing down. Our engagement is no longer adding to a good discussion

[DoctorPepper]

Ico: 'votes Pepper and pushes'
Pepper: 'ico is scum'
Ico: 'unvotes Pepper pushes Aldus says pepper might be town'
Pepper: 'yeah ico is scum because his reads aren't changing'

i think this is actually pretty accurate

Yeah this is a discredit

You aren't saying Pepper might be town more so as Aldus is scummier

Again, I tried to move away from this but since you voted for me while voting with you on someone I think is also scummy then I don't see anything else other than you 100% believing I must be scum for that

[DoctorPepper]

I wanna try to get something of QQ or at least understand why I read you and Dats differently. But maybe we can't get to do that because we keep devolving into this argument that leads to nowhere

I know exactly why you scumread me and townread Datisi

it's called OMGUS

OMGUS implies I should have scumread dats too

[DoctorPepper]

Ico, look I think that whatever argument we have isn't actually benefitting town if we are both town

You might claim this as me not being able to take the heat but let's admit it and cut our losses, our 5 page argument has not changed each other's minds

We can resolve to ensuring the other gets lynched today so town move on or we try to look differently because if we are both town then this game is stalling.

What's it gonna be?

[DoctorPepper]

Hey I'm being more active now and I'm actually trying to read and defend my accusations instead of just being lazy about it, isn't that a win in and of itself?

[DoctorPepper]

That proves nothing?

[DoctorPepper]

Ico, look I think that whatever argument we have isn't actually benefitting town if we are both town

You might claim this as me not being able to take the heat but let's admit it and cut our losses, our 5 page argument has not changed each other's minds

We can resolve to ensuring the other gets lynched today so town move on or we try to look differently because if we are both town then this game is stalling.

What's it gonna be?

UNVOTE:

sure let's call a truce for now

i demand a gif war later on to settle this tho

VOTE: QQ

[DoctorPepper]

I will say that this little thing we got made me more engaged in the game

I still refuse to do extensive meta or PbP and will go based on current interactions

[DoctorPepper]

Dats - 677

So if the game is wrong should your reads reflect that?

What about it feels wrong?

[DoctorPepper]

It's your scum read on me (half kidding)

I'm paranoid because I can't be reading you as town and Ico as scum despite the fact that you guys react to me the same way

[DoctorPepper]

i thought you had me in The Townblocc, and you're suddenly paranoid of me?

It's more of a consistency thing, my reads lose their integrity if I scum read someone and town read another for the same things

[DoctorPepper]

Yes. You guys have had the same ish push on me and very similar reads.

Therefore logically, unless one of you is a parrot, it's inconsistent for me to read you differently

[DoctorPepper]

correct me if i'm wrong, wasn't your townread on me based on the fact i'm reevaluating and not willing to just call anyone scum, but ico is a scumread because he's locked in his townreads/scumpool?

In a way, yes.

But still, it's weird that you guys act the same with my push.

I mean I recognize that I'm easily lynchbait and what I say can be pushed as scummy but it made me want to see if I was wrong about my Ico read or my read on you

[DoctorPepper]

I didn't

I wanna reevaluate that

[DoctorPepper]

QQ/Drew in that case

everyone else at least feels very involved at this time

I don't know why I'm not here but let's go QQ then

[DoctorPepper]

Why Drew and not Quantum?

P-Edit: I have no idea what any of those words mean

[DoctorPepper]

my

weekend vla

is starting about now

we have a holiday here in our fine country tomorrow

Are u also from Duterteland

[DoctorPepper]

I'm being seen as scum for wanting to cooperate because my 1v1 was getting town nowhere?

Coolbeans

[DoctorPepper]

Let's get this straight, I'm not afraid of being lynched.

If you insist on me day 1 there's plenty of associative a you'll get from my flip.

I'm not trying to defuse a situation that will get me lynched, I want us to move forward from stupid fights that won't really benefit town

[DoctorPepper]

Doctar7up kind of gives me the vibe of scum that's annoyed at being pushed for wrong reasons - regarding the "my reactive style/lack of walls should be a NAI thing". I don't like 652 because he seems to be trying to defuse a 1v1 which could result in his lynch but retains his scumread on Ico while pushing Quentin with him.

659 basically.

- i think QQ is town both because of their posts and because of The Gamestate(tm)

Could you elaborate on the gamestate read, and what you keep mentioning about how the "game feels wrong"?

Don't like 697 because it doesn't fit his confidence in scum!Ico from previous posts at all. Why are you again trying to defuse a situation if you think you have scum in your grasp? This isn't the DoctarPeppur I grew up with and admired at all.

/̵͇̿̿/'̿̿ ̿ ̿ ̿ ̿ ̿ Hectic

The DoctarPeppur u grew up with got force replaced from a bunch of games because of stupid fights with players like RadiantCowbells.

Of course I'm not gonna keep pushing if I feel like it's unproductive.

[DoctorPepper]

Ehh, I'm ensign

Just promise me you'll take a look at Ico and Euph after you lynch me ayt?

[DoctorPepper]

Ehh, I'm ensign

Just promise me you'll take a look at Ico and Euph after you lynch me ayt?

@Dr, why did you flip from Q to Ico so fast?

Because QQ is a viable lynch for me too and you can see that in my voting patterns

I've recognized that my 1v1 with Ico is more harmful to town because of the circular nature of the discussion

[DoctorPepper]

Anyone want kanna over pepper?

Drew have we played before?

Kanna is town tho

[DoctorPepper]

Idk why the wagon on me just died.

But if ever I do get lynched today, I feel like we should take a look at the most opportunistic vote in the lot

VOTE: DrewSta

This is a really bad push and something to look for on Day 2.

[DoctorPepper]

Nah man, you're just really opportunistic

[DoctorPepper]

761 is a really bad post and it doesn't bring anything new to the table. You basically just parroted the existing reads to justify jumping on the wagon

[DoctorPepper]

My goal isn't really to lynch you today, I'm pretty much resigned that it's me because you'll all find a way back to jump.to my wagon so for Day 2 I feel like town should take a look at you with more scrutiny

I mean, when my wagon loses steam you jumped immediately back to Kanna?

[DoctorPepper]

I actually think Drew is town, idk where this is coming from

Never said it wasn't. I'm just saying my gut tells me that Drew is being active in a way that I find productive to town, instead of people being active but not contributing anything to the discussion

My initial reads have me at
Town:
Oka
Dats
Drew

Nullish Town
Aldus
Kanna

Nullish Scum
QQ

Scum
Icon
Euph

so uhhh..... what changed from these?

761.

The jump on my wagon is opportunistic AF.

[DoctorPepper]

@Datisi that's why I followed your vote and because he voted me as alignment indicative when we're pro-organizing. That was in the past

Kanna and OkaPoka what happened to our team work? Euphony you joined us?

VOTE: Iconeum [/unvote]

Oka Kanna you're both town right?

This...

I don't understand anything from this slot

[DoctorPepper]

reminder still waiting on Kanna's reads

I'm in a confusing state right now but I think <Datisi, OkaPoka, Aldus, DrP> are town, the rest i can't tell you atm

Oh yay you're town

Why does this make Kanna town? Because she thinks you're town?

And why'd you find Drew-Sta's vote more opportunistic than Oogle's on your wagon?

£÷÷ Hectic

Kanna is intentionally taking unpopular stances

Oka's voting pattern is consistent

[DoctorPepper]

ok i realised i read oka's post wrong. this is the messiest I've ever played; i'm sorry

I said I was gonna post reads but you've all filled me with so much doubt I don't know anymore. For sure follow the procedure to make sure no one cc's me but then I think we should lynch one of <DrP, Ico> because there has been enough claims today + those lynches would give us information

「(°ヘ°)

I honestly don't mind getting Lynched if
it benefits this town. I'm confident in my reads enough to know that my flip will help you tomorrow based on who pushed .e.

[DoctorPepper]

pepper, you haven't responded to 798 and 818 (though the latter is somewhat a moot point now).

~

am I the only one who sees drew v icon as TvT screaming past each other?

~

i don't have things to comment on, so this isn't a wallpost, this is a fencepost

I feel like both are moot don't you think?

But yes, when I flip go after Drew, Euph and Ico.

I won't self vote but I think best town play is to lynch me today and use my wagon to find scum

[DoctorPepper]

Pepper

Why do you think it s a scumtell to'push you?

This is a huge misrep.

The scumtells isn't scum reading me, it's how flimsy the reasons are

[DoctorPepper]

both of those points are moot ~now~ but i would like it if you could still answer it as to what you were thinking at that time?

Didn't mention Drew in the first post because I thought nothing of it I'm the moment.

Then I had a literal shower thought and realized that I didn't like his post at all

[DoctorPepper]

Can you look at 761 for me again and tell me what in it you disagree. You're not squirming like I would assume mafia would, and I am in no rush to hammer and would like you to please respond to what I wrote.

I'm interested in lynching scum, not mislynching town.

I really dislike this post

That last line is something I would say as scum to fake town cred

Plus your 761 was so flimsy man. You're attacking me for my consistency (and even claimed OMGUS, which isn't even a scumtells in and of itself) even though I felt that my pushes were coming from a genuine place. Everything just felt so convenient that you were "content" with my wagon because my push was inconsistent

[DoctorPepper]

"your lack of logic in your voting pattern" - because I offered a truce from Ico as I felt that our fight was going nowhere and my pivot to QQ, a player I thought was a good lynch from the beginning of the game.

[DoctorPepper]

if you value consistency so much, what do you think of the bottom of 780 or 786?

In a way it is consistent, if you believe conf bias is also consistent

I was town read by Kanna, ergo Kanna views my interactions as townie

Ico was scum read, ergo Kanna views their actions as scummy.

I mean hell, aren't we all guilty of doing this as well?

[DoctorPepper]

Anyway, with an out captain, I feel like lynching a claimed VT is actually an optimal play so we don't reveal any more PRs or 2nd in commands at this point. I am play to be lynched on the provision that you use my wagon to find actual scum tomorrow.

I would say it's in Drew, Ico
Maybe Euph
Outside chance of QQ (admittedly the slot just doesn't make sense)

[DoctorPepper]

Pepper

Why do you think it s a scumtell to'push you?

This is a huge misrep.

The scumtells isn't scum reading me, it's how flimsy the reasons are

do you consider your reasons to scumread me are equally flimsy?

ie: not switching or evolving townreads IIRC? There wasnt anything else but this IIRC

Not necessarily true. That's the basis and I felt that our interactions felt like you were pushing me as scum and just tried to poke holes in my logic without attempting to engage me

That said I really took a step back when I realized my Dats read.

Have I completely reevaluated? Not yet. But today I'd rather see Drew go vs you.

[DoctorPepper]

UNVOTE:

unsure for now

I feel like this muddies the game up a bit

And now I'm worried that if you don't lynch me, I'll still be a huge question mark day 2 about how my AtE made me survive today and I should be lynched tomorrow.

Like worst case scenario you're lynching an ensign

[DoctorPepper]

also i'm a sucker for AtE

you don't get townie vibes from pepper posts recently ?

You really shouldn't. This seems again, very convenient. When my flip goes green I don't want you claiming "Oh I thought he was town in the end"

[DoctorPepper]

also i'm a sucker for AtE

you don't get townie vibes from pepper posts recently ?

You really shouldn't. This seems again, very convenient. When my flip goes green I don't want you claiming "Oh I thought he was town in the end"

Dude seriously

'look guys ico is scum he's not reconsidering antying'

reconsidering pepper

'look guys ico is reconsidering this is bad'

At best, exaggeration. At worst, misrep.

I don't trust you, of course I would say this

[DoctorPepper]

Ico, look I think that whatever argument we have isn't actually benefitting town if we are both town

Hmm, but you think Icon is scum. So did the argument benefit the town if Icon is scum?

can you answer this DP

this is a lame top of the page post but oh well

Not really. I'm not convincing anyone that Ico is scum.

Plus, at best all it does it muddies the waters and creates less productive discussion

[DoctorPepper]

so why'd you feel the need to add the "if we are both town" part if it also applied in the case where icon is scum

I had already expressed my concern with my scum read because of the Dats-Ico similarity

[DoctorPepper]

But also, I feel like scum Ico might want to say "This is you wanting out of a fight"

[DoctorPepper]

...

Who uses OMGUS as a scumtell in 2020???

[DoctorPepper]

Drew, I feel like it's so weird that you're still making a case on me because I've already outright said I'm okay with being lynched, as my flip will give this town some clarity on who scum is based on how they pushed my wagon.

You don't need to make a case, you could have just justified this as a vote to ensure a sure flip and to avoid outing more PRs

All this fluff makes it seem like you want an out for tomorrow to say "I genuinely thought he was scum".

This just makes it look worse. You're even claiming OMGUS is a scumtell when that meta has been dead since I joined MS. (I am choosing this as my takeaway because it's the perfect example of how flimsy this case is)

Also I know I disliked QQ, but I also dislike QQ being a counterwagon on Drew

Also Drew and Ico surely aren't scum together so a red flip from one should clear the other

[DoctorPepper]

I don't wanna do this because I'm lazy.

I'm not gonna try to bother and defend myself with how Drew has been misrepping my play. He claims I'm flipping my votes, implying that there is no rhyme or reason when:
1. I've wanted QQ lynched because this is a pattern of play I'm used to seeing from him elsewhere.
2. I've had a legitimate fight with Ico
3. I've found a reason to see scum Drew

And it's so weird claiming "I don't wanna mislynch town" after my claim and still going with a case on me

For the record, I don't mind the case but town drew wouldn't need to make one, ya feel me?

[DoctorPepper]

Bruh, I'm saying you never needed a case against me because I was okay with getting Lynched when I was L-1.

My engagement is the fact that it exists isn't necessary for town, it just seems like one to cover your bases tomorrow when I flip green

Also you're claiming Kanna is coming to my defense when she literally said she thinks lynching me is optimal. If we are scum would that make sense??

[DoctorPepper]

Yup, please just take note of my D1 interactions, I hope you guys pull through!

[DoctorPepper]

approximately the gamestate right now

Alternatively you could have done the Castlevania meme but this made me lo
Anyway, apologies for being really scummy but I hope my reads and flip get you gets somewhere.

[DoctorPepper]

i legit have no clue what meme you're talking about and that makes me sad

also for the record i highkey hate this lynch but i also highkey hate this game rn and have no clue what to do

Ugh don't judge me it's not Castlevania it's Jojo's Bizarre Adventure (oof) [img]https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/ori ... r4.jpg[img]

For the record I don't really blame you guys haha, I only really woke up in this game and started playing really late.

It's not like I don't understand why I'm lynched, but there is surely bad faith that drove my wagon.

[DoctorPepper]

[DoctorPepper]

@euph

May I ask why you flipped on me

[DoctorPepper]

You do realize this could be some scum gambit right?

As for me, I don't mind getting lynched. It seems like a good play if done right.

I'd rather Drew go. My worry is that I might be a constant question mark to town for the next few days and I'd end up getting ML-ed anyway

[DoctorPepper]

too hopeful coming into this day phase. actual townies would have crippling depression

Anyone can act demoralized. And townies can still be hopeful. I doubt this is an actual thing.

[DoctorPepper]

ya know, after seeing that hammer, i had a funny thought that oka and drew are scum together and okay talked him in the pt into hammering qq unclaimed

Oka didn't convince me. The idea it could be more made me go 'Fuck it, let's flip and see'. Selfish, I know.

The wording in your response to the accusation seems so off.

I'm not gonna pretend I didn't want QQ lynched because I did, but it seems like that wagon was used to counter yours after mine lost momentum.

[DoctorPepper]

Sure thing

VOTE: DrewSta

[DoctorPepper]

... I literally have no idea who is town this game and my reads are so off.

[DoctorPepper]

okay this gets us exactly nowhere

Story of this game TBH.

[DoctorPepper]

Pepper do you townread me or not?

I do now. I generally think that the truce yesterday made me read you as town. Scum you would have pushed me

I think it's in Drew and Euph with an outside chance of Aldus

[DoctorPepper]

Okay I'm very sus of EVERYONE who did a complete 180 of their read on me

[DoctorPepper]

It seems convenient TBH.

[DoctorPepper]

Because if everyone is town reading me I will be very hard to lynch

I also think this might make me prime for buddying/pocketing

[DoctorPepper]

Consider this a prod Dodge, work has been killing me recently. Will catch up when I have time on the weekend

[DoctorPepper]

Oof.

I am so sorry for my horrible play.

GG scum