Mini Normal 2143 (Game over)

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Why did you vote him in the first place?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

What did he do?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

#97 was some nerd shit the game quick and i were discussing already ended

Understood.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I was looking for it and found it to be a moot point.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: NorewgianboyEE

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Why?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

i only have 1 townread right now but i am willing to give 5 town points to whoever can figure out who it is on

My guess is Firebringer.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Do I get 5 town points?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

i only have 1 townread right now but i am willing to give 5 town points to whoever can figure out who it is on

My guess is Firebringer.

wrong, 5 points taken away from hufflepuff

Strange. I don't remember you mentioned anything about points being deducted from some group.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

i probably should have subbed out when porkens joined.
I really don't want to play with him.

w/e i can lynch him i guess. This is not reads based but i think i will continue voting this as long as i am here.

VOTE: Porkens

In 1000 words or less, explain why you don't want to play with him?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Why do you think so?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Why do you think so?

These questions are literally the worst ones you could ask...

Why are they the worst ones I could ask?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

And also, you used the plural form of the indicative pronoun. Did you mean all of the questions I've asked up to this point, or you made a grammatical mistake and meant just the one you quoted?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

And also, you used the plural form of the indicative pronoun. Did you mean all of the questions I've asked up to this point, or you made a grammatical mistake and meant just the one you quoted?

I mean you look like a basic bro with all these surface level questions.

So, you aren't going to answer the question?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

What is posturing?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Past few pages have been lots of bickering between NPOM and Sakura, with firebringer and Fredrick finally joining in. firebringer throws (personal) shade at Porkens and wants us to figure out who's the one person he's townreading, while Fredrick just has a lot of inquisitive questions regarding everyone else's reads (but hasn't actually posted any of his?).

Regarding NPOM and Sakura, the chatter was mostly useless, but I did get a strong feeling it was either TvT or SvT, I think a scum-coordinated argument like that would look a lot more doctored/polished if you get me? Not much else to point out regarding those two, will look in more specifics later and try to give a better read.

Fredrick and firebringers action strike some mild scum vibes here. Regarding Fredrick, their curious nature kind of invites me to think they're scum who wants people to feel they're participating without actually doing anything. firebringer's first few posts and shading at Porkens might just be scum wanting to mislynch with an excuse, though I would probably have to look at the meta's of the players to make more accurate reads, I think.

I still have no reads.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Don’t have strong reads yet, but gut says Mohab for posturing all the time. Sakura Hana’s "low hanging fruit" shit also came out of nowhere. And i could see it as scum trying to look good by TR a popular scumread at the time.

What is posturing?

What is posturing?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I still do not understand what posturing is.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Thanks.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Not enough info itt for a reads list but popo is probably Town.

Why do you think so?

Why do you think so?

These questions are literally the worst ones you could ask...

Why are they the worst ones I could ask?

And also, you used the plural form of the indicative pronoun. Did you mean all of the questions I've asked up to this point, or you made a grammatical mistake and meant just the one you quoted?

And also, you used the plural form of the indicative pronoun. Did you mean all of the questions I've asked up to this point, or you made a grammatical mistake and meant just the one you quoted?

I mean you look like a basic bro with all these surface level questions.

And also, you used the plural form of the indicative pronoun. Did you mean all of the questions I've asked up to this point, or you made a grammatical mistake and meant just the one you quoted?

I mean you look like a basic bro with all these surface level questions.

So, you aren't going to answer the question?

Are you going to answer the question?

Let me give you some motivation.

VOTE: Quick

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Why are you so adverse to answer the question?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Oh, I just understood what you meant. The question is:

Why do you think popopopopopopo is town?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Oh, I just understood what you meant. The question is:

Why do you think popopopopopopo is town?

The way he is interacting with people tells me he is probably Town. No guarantees, but by the method I developed, he's the strongest TR by that standard. But sometimes I have "conflicting" reads based on different ways of reading people. Still, by BOTH he looks to be Town. Already talked about the other reason, that being his vote on NPOM.

How does popopopopopopo's vote on NoPowerOverMe make popopopopopopo "looks to be town."

By the way, I don't remember reading any reason for your belief that popopopopopopo is town.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Oh, I just understood what you meant. The question is:

Why do you think popopopopopopo is town?

The way he is interacting with people tells me he is probably Town. No guarantees, but by the method I developed, he's the strongest TR by that standard. But sometimes I have "conflicting" reads based on different ways of reading people. Still, by BOTH he looks to be Town. Already talked about the other reason, that being his vote on NPOM.

How does popopopopopopo's vote on NoPowerOverMe make popopopopopopo "looks to be town."

By the way, I don't remember reading any reason for your belief that popopopopopopo is town.

How does popopopopopopo's vote on NoPowerOverMe make popopopopopopo "looks to be town"?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I like popo's vote on NPOM based on what I know of them as a player and the fact that NPOM DOES actually have some Scum equity IIRC.

If you do not remember why popopopopopopo's vote on NoPowerOverMe makes popopopopopopo "looks to be town," there is no reason and as far as I am concerned, it does not.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

This post proves you wrong.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I like popo's vote on NPOM based on what I know of them as a player and the fact that NPOM DOES actually have some Scum equity IIRC.

If you do not remember why popopopopopopo's vote on NoPowerOverMe makes popopopopopopo "looks to be town," there is no reason and as far as I am concerned, it does not.

Ah, good. You found my reason. Thanks.

I do not understand that post (post 155).

[Fredrick A Campbell]

...
You guys have collectively spewed 13 odd pages of shit. Suggesting I can get an accurate read in all that mess is optimistic at the least.
...

Considering recent events, one man's shit is another man's treasure.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Let's take this step by step then.

First, what is IIRC?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

What did you read/remember that leads you to the conclusion that NoPowerOverMe has some scum equity?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

UNVOTE: Quick

Quick could be scum...something’s making me hesitate though so it’s not strong

What do you think now?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

More votes on the pig please.

Why?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Scumreading a townplayer(Quick)

How do you know?

VOTE: NoPowerOverMe

[Fredrick A Campbell]

For clarity: How do you know Quick is a townplayer?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

And I just checked. He never even voted for Quick.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

For clarity: Porkens never voted for quick.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

For some reason, I thought you said "voting a townplayer" instead of "scumreading a townplayer."

You want more votes on Porkens, place it there yourself.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

For clarity: How do you know Quick is a townplayer?

He seems engaged and trying to gamesolve.

And I just checked. He never even voted for Quick.

Quick could be scum...something’s making me hesitate though so it’s not strong

To me that's a scumread without saying it's a scumread.

UNVOTE:

[Fredrick A Campbell]

The quote shouldn't be there.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

UNVOTE: Quick

Quick could be scum...something’s making me hesitate though so it’s not strong

What do you think now?

Porkens, what do you think now?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

More votes on the pig please.

Why?

Scumreading a townplayer(Quick)

For clarity: How do you know Quick is a townplayer?

He seems engaged and trying to gamesolve.

And I just checked. He never even voted for Quick.

Quick could be scum...something’s making me hesitate though so it’s not strong

To me that's a scumread without saying it's a scumread.

So, NoPowerOverMe, you want(ed) more votes on Porkens because he is/was scumreading Quick, whom you assert is a town player. Is that an accurate representation of your thoughts?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll be online in exactly 1 hour (0545 GMT) for questioning.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

and also to be questioned.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Guess I'm irrelevant now.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Guess I'm irrelevant now.

What is your view on Cooldog? I have to go back and review their big posts.

They are making themselves useful. I'm still reading that big wall of text Trump would be proud of.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Sure you can spend some time on it. It took me between 30 and 45 minutes.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

It's a big fat wall. Trump wishes he could build what I built.

Spoiler:

...

Norwegian, thoughts on this Jester talk? What do you think should be done if there is a Jester?

I think jester talk is fine because it can be used to see who's got a scummy mindset or not. But i'm pretty sure it's just a fake claim so i don't personally care much about it. I don't believe this game actually has a jester.

...

This game does have way too many inactive players right now.

@Drew-Sta
@CooLDoG
@Blurryface3189
@Persivul

So, Looking at the mod's confirmation post, there's 1 player that hasn't confirmed yet.
Persivul is V/LA according to his profile so that could easily be the cause of him not posting. (Although an ego search turns out he's at least posting on his other games, V/LA supposed to end today so I hope we hear from him)
CD hasn't been on site for 2 days, could be the person that hasnt confirmed.
Looking at Blurry's site activity seems to be someone that posts once every blue moon.
Same with Drew.

Looks like we just got some people that just arent active in general. I don't think we can discern alignment from activity alone.

These two posts in tandem appear to be attempts to get attention off currently posting players and into the dark. Which is moving from difficult to lynch players and on to unable to be defended targets.

The decision to move there when neither of these players have formed strong scum reads they've advertised, plus the fact that they seem unwilling to push a wagon, suggests they're more comfortable with moving something on a player that is not posting, as they will struggle to defend themselves and if lynched, it is easy to absolve responsibility of their actions.
...

I'm not sure i want to trust Firebringer anymore. Because their read on Sakura makes no sense. Why are they so obvtown bruh?
VOTE: Firebringer

FB's argument was very clear, actually. Your distrust of it seems fishy. I'm not one to white knight, FB could be scum. But your argument around it seems odd.

It's like you want to get rid of them.

Also i'd like Sakura/Quick to actually explain why they tr FB, because that shit makes little sense to me right now.

quick scumreads me dude.

Not hard enough.

This appears to be a scummy, lazy tactic. You're throwing shit at someone and misrepresenting another players view to push your own.

I consider this a tell.

Also, it's a minor take considering half the game is dead. But all of the wagons seen so far have been god-awful. Can we please get a good and decent one going on FB for the sake of my sanity. Tnx.

Including your own?

I'm not sure i want to trust Firebringer anymore. Because their read on Sakura makes no sense. Why are they so obvtown bruh?
VOTE: Firebringer

its the fact that i don't think ur trying to manipulate me in anyway. i think and this is just a theory (and u might try it next time ur scum) u would more or less use me as a foundation to get ur placeholder/foot in the game by locking me in for ur read and then maneuver from there. I think ur playing this without that when the easy option of manipulating me exists and I think even if ur going for a more serious game u would still try to manipulate me in some way.

I'm considering the fact that you've TR NPOM, Quick and now Sakura. I'm not seeing how this game makes sense if all scum are in lurkers. Are you just trying to pocket most of the active players? And what's this "they would manipulate me if i was scum" BS? How do you know that would be scum!Sakura's play here?

You're too fluffy and pockety compared to our last game FB. There's a pretty big difference.

In Fungi Mafia FB was actually lightly scum hunting, also picking a couple few TR's. Not handing them out like candy. Also, even though he always jokes. It was intertwined with actual solving. Here he just doesn't seem to care. As evidenced by wagoning either for some personal BS reason that has nothing to do with the game, or encouraging a wagon a dude that hasn't even posted FFS.
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p11828723

doesn't seem like a lazy scum norwe push

This makes me second guess my view on norwe, but I also think it's a case of nor pushing to get something started on someone.

fungi mafia cliff notes of Norwee:
--> Sometimes gave some insight to players usually mild mannered. Usually only gave long cases for why he thought a player was town.
--> Doesn't try to take control of game or lead. Perfectly willing to take a back seat.
--> Passiveness

Ur scumcase on me doesn't match this.

Yeah, im comfortable with u in my townreads.

Disagree. This isn't what they're doing here IMHO.

Number 1 and 2 don't correlate with their existing behaviour in this game. I checked fungi, they were town. So what are you actually trying to say here?!

I'll come back to 622.

Also i'd like Sakura/Quick to actually explain why they tr FB, because that shit makes little sense to me right now.

Firebringer is an old friend and knows all my weaknesses and It hasnt felt like he's trying to exploit them, a scum!FB would have

probably

TR me much earlier considering I got into the game from the get go and would've been pretty easy to call me TR due to meta and I would be none the wiser. His explanation on his TR of me matches his play around me and so I figured he's probably town.

You're too fluffy and pockety compared to our last game FB. There's a pretty big difference.

Our last game he was pretty obsessed with me, but, I feel he was MORE fluffy on fungi mafia.

Basically my feeling also comes from the fact that Firebringer is a pretty strong player, he is perfectly capable of playing normally,

but where's the fun in that

, and getting himself townread in the process. Considering he's just being fluffy he's just having fun, and being in an environment of people that arent very familiar with him

to my knowledge

he'd have a much easier time just playing normally and getting townread as scum, than whatever he's doing right now, it feels kind of anti-scum, if you know what i mean.

There's a non zero chance he's playing this way in order to pocket specific people

including me

, and you're free to point and laugh at me if he flips scum, but at this point I don't think he's doing anything to advance any specific agenda.

That's buddying to get them in your pocket.

Oh and talking reads, I do agree that now this is more similar to the town norwegian than the scum norwegian i've seen. So norwegian can go into the town bin too.

You and Nor sit at opposite ends of the spectrum on FB, which IMHO is of interest given the links I've drawn to you both.

I don’t think FB flipping scum would equate Sakura scum based on FB’s play around the slot.

And that right there is an interesting post. Basically absolving Sakura from being mafia if FB flips scum. Why would you do that? How do you have any certainty that is the case?! It's a post of certainty, and I cannot understand how you can be so certain about them.

651/post], [post]653, 660, 664, 666, 683 I'll come back to later as there's a lot to analyse in there for me.

Porkens vote in 696 is odd.

Drew has been lacking too. He came, he left. And everyone forgot im.

Now you touch on me again. And not in the 'sexy Norwegian chick' kind of way.

You seem to like to shift focus at times when focus is on you.
...
Porkens appears to be trying to trap people but not sure if that's scum hunting or trying to get townies lynched by their own rope.

Tl:dr - I think Nor, Sakura appear to be scum at this point. I think we need to wait for Farken and Pers to contribute before we can proceed much further.

VOTE: NorwegianboyEE

Pages 28-32 are odd and I need to go review again. CoolDog's entrance changed the games dynamic a bit. I have to sift through what they've posted better as my initial thoughts are it didn't read right in placed and also read very well in others.

This is the shortest version I can compile. Not sure if Drew-Sta would approve of this.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

...

Norwegian, thoughts on this Jester talk? What do you think should be done if there is a Jester?

I think jester talk is fine because it can be used to see who's got a scummy mindset or not. But i'm pretty sure it's just a fake claim so i don't personally care much about it. I don't believe this game actually has a jester.

How..? It's the definition of WIFOM.

Here is what Drew-Sta says after quoting post 105, which I accidentally cut out.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Alright. It's Monday morning, I don't have meetings for two hours, and I have coffee.

We're at 32 pages. My reading from 23 to 32 showed Cooldog come into the scene. I think the thing he stated about meta just makes my heart sing so happy about that. Nevertheless there's a few things I am keen to go back and read through so in the process of going 1-32 now.

I will be more active from here on in.

This is scum.

VOTE: drewsta




Solid gold lock

I think Drew could be scum. Still doesn't seem like they are fully caught up, so I am waiting on that. They have no mention of scum reads, and they haven't expressed that they are taking the "find townie" strategy either.

But, why is this a solid gold scum read?

It’s a classic noncommittal oh I better post so it doesn’t look like I’m lurking what can I say that doesn’t vomit me in any way oh I know I’ll promis more later kinda post

Given I actually came good on my word and the above wall would suggest what I claimed was true to an observer (which it is - I seriously went through this fucking game thread twice - my sanity is now in danger) - where does that leave you?

I'm genuinely curious for reasons.

I'm also waiting for an answer, Porkens.

Since I have no other use for my vote now, I will VOTE: Porkens

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Going offline. See you at 0930 GMT.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

It leaves me with the fact that you are still scum trying to look town by reading the game and telling us what you think we think you should think.

Or he could just be town.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Anyway, I'll be online you at 1100 GMT instead of the earlier stated time.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

1130 GMT.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'm now online earlier than projected. I'll continue my reread of the thread.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Wiki tells suck anyway.
I guess that’s all you can resort to when you eliminate meta and all beauty from your life?

It mentioned that more research is needed anyway.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

That’s2 players i hate now. And no, it has nothing to do with OMGUS.

I don't fully understand the reasons. Is it because they don't use meta?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

That’s2 players i hate now. And no, it has nothing to do with OMGUS.

I don't fully understand the reasons. Is it because they don't use meta?

And they tunnel their vote on town because they don't like my playstyle.

I'm not going to scum-read you for your playstyle, but I am finding you very hard to read along with Firebringer and his merry men.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

No need to get personal.

Calling players oldies creates an in-group and an out-group, which could be very divisive.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

i seriously eyeroll anytime a boomer tells me "OHH META CAN BE MANIPULATED" like of course u fucking moron. the idea is to finding the nuances the player isn't aware of or has a hard time changing and using that to inform you of the player. Not this revolutionary idea. But boomers can't adjust because they tried using meta once or twice realize "ohh shit people changed I can't use this anymore" and then went "ohh well meta is trash" instead "Ohh this meta is outdated I need to readjusted".

I don't think this is a problem only boomers have.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Considering my personality, it is fairly ironic that my avatar is a man from the 19th century but my mindset is of the 21st century.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

If that's the definition of a boomer, I agree with you. I just don't get annoyed by it.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Wait, there are people that don't understand that?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

The spoiler is a thirty to forty-five minute read.

It's a big fat wall. Trump wishes he could build what I built.

Spoiler:

If someone does something scummy on the first page, it's still scummy. Wanting to lynch a claimed jester because we may not find other scum is scummy. Why not just find scum?

I agree with this.

That's such a weird way of looking at it: I am proposing we lynch him in case we have no other reads, I'd rather mislynch a Jester than deal with a headache claiming to be a Jester the entire game, especially if we have no better leads. But I am not adverse to lynching someone else if we have to, I guess.

It's also instaloss coz no one would lynch the Jester and the Jester wouldnt lynch scum.

I disagree jester is still town

Lynching negative utility is low-hanging fruit in my opinion

They are a voting member of the town.

I know it's early but entertaining the Jester discussion is bizarre. 87 is the most strange I've seen in a while too.

Norwegian, thoughts on this Jester talk? What do you think should be done if there is a Jester?

I think jester talk is fine because it can be used to see who's got a scummy mindset or not. But i'm pretty sure it's just a fake claim so i don't personally care much about it. I don't believe this game actually has a jester.

How..? It's the definition of WIFOM.

I am Town reading quick.

I am scum reading Mohab. Scummy is as scummy does.

The views without justification get my attention here.

I claim vanilla town let's get on with Mohab.

This is oddball. VI or something...

Because there are other fish to fry.

And this is actually very silly.

Also I doubt any scum would've fallen for that, specially if at least one of their teammates is paying attention.

Speculating on scum's reaction to a reaction test is WIFOM.

What does it matter anyway? You're giving scum the opportunity to hide from you by describing how they would or wouldn't act? Or you're explaining away what is scum behaviour vs town behaviour? This comment is fishy.

NPOM looks like LHF to me right now.

Why?

If you believe his claim why does that not qualify as LHF for you.

Lynching a claimed townie is not LHF. It's easy NK, but not LHF.

There's WIFOM on what happens if he survives to D2 as well. Maybe then they become LHF, but not D1.

From my PoV, he does look scummy in a town way, that makes people just want to lynch him, but he's not even trying to accomplish any goal, and seems to believe he's found scum in Mohab and isnt convincing anyone either, plus it's weird to claim VT right then and there if he was scum, which makes him look like LHF for me. Because people want to lynch him for it.

You can't look scummy in a town way. You're either town acting suspiciously or not. Secondly, your emphasis on him being LHF is odd. Why are you guarding him?

My hot take is that Sakura, despite being second highest in activity, has not scumhunted at all.

I agree.

Oh hey, that's 2 soft shades already, any more takers?

You're very defensive at the slightest attention on you.

My hot take is that Sakura, despite being second highest in activity, has not scumhunted at all.

How very observant of you.

This is the sort of thing I consider for SvS, FTR.

Why?

This:

Wifom much?

There's WIFOM and there's things that make no sense.
So either I'm scum imitating my town game of townhunting over scumhunting, or I'm town.
No matter how much you ask me to hunt for scum in the "normal" way, That's not how I like to play, if you think that's scummy of me then sure go ahead and lynch me, that wont change how I play because I dont have fun playing that way.

... contradicts this:

Cool

Scumminess noted.

So I ask you, if I were scum why wouldnt I at least pretend to scumhunt?

Can I ask why?

And as a bonus, everything i've said about my meta and my personality is something you can research yourself, this isnt the first time I've been pushed for "not scumhunting" and i bet it wont be the last.

You seem to be doing a very hard job of townreading yourself for others sake. The continued push for people to meta you:

And as a bonus, everything i've said about my meta and my personality is something you can research yourself, this isnt the first time I've been pushed for "not scumhunting" and i bet it wont be the last.

... feels like 'Look! Look at it all! I'm town gais - I promise'. Then you turn around and do this:

You also said this based off a reply norwegian did to a post Quick made towards me:

Deflection. (Partner?)

Partner here seems to imply you think im scum and norwegian is my partner.
Am i wrong in that assumption?

... which is scum hunting.

Past few pages have been lots of bickering between NPOM and Sakura, with firebringer and Fredrick finally joining in. firebringer throws (personal) shade at Porkens and wants us to figure out who's the one person he's townreading, while Fredrick just has a lot of inquisitive questions regarding everyone else's reads (but hasn't actually posted any of his?).

Regarding NPOM and Sakura, the chatter was mostly useless, but I did get a strong feeling it was either TvT or SvT, I think a scum-coordinated argument like that would look a lot more doctored/polished if you get me? Not much else to point out regarding those two, will look in more specifics later and try to give a better read.

Fredrick and firebringers action strike some mild scum vibes here. Regarding Fredrick, their curious nature kind of invites me to think they're scum who wants people to feel they're participating without actually doing anything. firebringer's first few posts and shading at Porkens might just be scum wanting to mislynch with an excuse, though I would probably have to look at the meta's of the players to make more accurate reads, I think.

Tell me why a scum argument would be more coordinated or polished if they don't have daytalk (normal doesn't have DT)... This is a fishy statement to make. It's like... fake scum hunting.

Ok I'll let that go by if you promise to play the game normally with everyone else and just ignore Porkens. It'll be impossible to read you otherwise.

This is a strange interaction.

vote:porkens

sakura's point about shading without voting or even FOS is good, and firebringer is probably town.

I consider this sheeping and without good cause. Sits you in a healthy place for the wagon too.

vote:porkens

sakura's point about shading without voting or even FOS is good, and firebringer is probably town.

Why is her point about shading good?

shading people without calling them scummy or voting them does nothing except increase distrust between the town members. the fact that you even said "i never called you scum" after the shading is also very bad.

... that's, not what he did? I don't even think Porkens threw shade..? He critically analysed two posts that didn't fit together, and then laughed at it after, and then you come in a chainsaw? The claim Porkens made about them being active lurking is true - they are / were. Sakura having to refer to her meta as some sort of justification for her behavior wasn't actually answering the question but deflecting the issue.

Besides, there's nothing wrong with listening to others opinions.

Well, there is. We just haven't seen whether you're doing it for the right or wrong reason yet. It's an ambiguous decision making process which allows you an easy out.

vote:porkens

sakura's point about shading without voting or even FOS is good, and firebringer is probably town.

Why is her point about shading good?

shading people without calling them scummy or voting them does nothing except increase distrust between the town members. the fact that you even said "i never called you scum" after the shading is also very bad.

I don’t buy this. My “very observant” post about Sakura was scum hunting, and it led to useful discussion Through which we could develop our reads. I factually stated that I did not call her scum. That has no bearing on whether I think she or her actions are scummy. I’m not casting about trying to make people look scummy. I am asking direct questions and stating my thoughts in an effort to further the game state.

Your argument seems disingenuous to me.

Agree, it appeared to be a chainsaw.

why me? besides the fact i am scum

Well, that obviously means we are town.

Double reaction all the way....

Yeah, I saw that too. I can't make up my mind on NPOM.

This game does have way too many inactive players right now.

@Drew-Sta
@CooLDoG
@Blurryface3189
@Persivul

So, Looking at the mod's confirmation post, there's 1 player that hasn't confirmed yet.
Persivul is V/LA according to his profile so that could easily be the cause of him not posting. (Although an ego search turns out he's at least posting on his other games, V/LA supposed to end today so I hope we hear from him)
CD hasn't been on site for 2 days, could be the person that hasnt confirmed.
Looking at Blurry's site activity seems to be someone that posts once every blue moon.
Same with Drew.

Looks like we just got some people that just arent active in general. I don't think we can discern alignment from activity alone.

These two posts in tandem appear to be attempts to get attention off currently posting players and into the dark. Which is moving from difficult to lynch players and on to unable to be defended targets.

The decision to move there when neither of these players have formed strong scum reads they've advertised, plus the fact that they seem unwilling to push a wagon, suggests they're more comfortable with moving something on a player that is not posting, as they will struggle to defend themselves and if lynched, it is easy to absolve responsibility of their actions.

But why post once and then not post for several days? You are just asking to be scumread.

You sheep and then scum read but not really form any argument for it. It's proving difficult to defend your actions.

Nor pokes me at 416, then Sakura takes up the lead in 436 and Nor doesn't prod me again. This seems odd. Especially since both were the ones pushing for non-posters as possible suspects. The fact they didn't acknowledge each others posts on that either, plus what I've just said, appears to be distancing.

450 and 452 Nor reengages but doesn't push me at all. Sakura then drops off at 470.

So they either town read me now or don't care about the non-posters? I'm not following the behaviour at all.

i have legitimate strong townread on sakura now.

I'm curious when and why did u get this strong townread of me, I thought you'd have been able to get this way earlier than when you expressed it, but only now u get a legitimate one.

its the fact that i don't think ur trying to manipulate me in anyway. i think and this is just a theory (and u might try it next time ur scum) u would more or less use me as a foundation to get ur placeholder/foot in the game by locking me in for ur read and then maneuver from there. I think ur playing this without that when the easy option of manipulating me exists and I think even if ur going for a more serious game u would still try to manipulate me in some way.

So i wanted to make sure i didn't see u trying to get me to really townlock u.

This gets my attention from both.

Explaining what would 'allow you to be captured' by someone else via meta and then manipulated, is like... some weird buddying or something. I feel like Sakura's 'not going after someone' here if they have decent understanding of their gameplay to me matches with the whole 'look at my meta, I only town hunt' schtick.

To me it's SvT interaction and I'm leaning to Sakura being scum at this point.

They're very intent on knowing where people sit with them, and then get defensive when people push at them.

K maybe i jumped the gun townreading you and i retract it.

Let's talk about that process? For me, the only thing saving NPOM rn is their claim.

So? A person is either town or scum.
If there's scum motive behind their actions then they are scum regardless of what they claimed.
If what they claimed and how is towny then there's no scum motive behind their actions.

That's WIFOM. Of course intent is important. They're either lying or not. The trick is working out which.

What is the Scum motive for claiming VT? After ~reasons~ which I won't mention?

I think this is a little naive, or defending something that can't be defended e.g. I don't think you can defend a VT claim this early in the game. It's either a tactic or the play of a VI. I think this is one of the few times meta helps - is NPOW a VI? Their previous games can be indicative of this.

Out of the active posters, I would say both FB and NPOM have the best shot at being Scum.

I'll do whatever Fire does.

VOTE: Persivul

This makes me want you to eat lunch.

When you had previously said:

I take back my TR on you. I can see what you are saying, but that's not the impression I get from NPOM's play here. He either genuinely doesn't want a NK on him (which I have been guilty of before, honestly) or he is makes a WEIRD ASS PLAY here as Scum.

For now, I believe his claim.

Of course I don't want to be killed how am I supposed to help the town win?

That's the thing... You are low key saying, "No need to kill me because I am VT, look elsewhere" and that implies you think you are good at this game and can solve without being a PR.

Which looks like you forgot you had a townread on your slot, specially considering i called the slot LHF/Lynchbait and you fought me on it.

Gee, this appears to be scumhunting. But I thought you didn't do that...

...
You guys have collectively spewed 13 odd pages of shit. Suggesting I can get an accurate read in all that mess is optimistic at the least.
...

Considering recent events, one man's shit is another man's treasure.

You can fish through my shit all day long mate.

Scumreading a townplayer(Quick)

You seem so, so certain...

For clarity: How do you know Quick is a townplayer?

He seems engaged and trying to gamesolve.

And I just checked. He never even voted for Quick.

Quick could be scum...something’s making me hesitate though so it’s not strong

To me that's a scumread without saying it's a scumread.

Yeah... no.

I'm not sure i want to trust Firebringer anymore. Because their read on Sakura makes no sense. Why are they so obvtown bruh?
VOTE: Firebringer

FB's argument was very clear, actually. Your distrust of it seems fishy. I'm not one to white knight, FB could be scum. But your argument around it seems odd.

It's like you want to get rid of them.

Also i'd like Sakura/Quick to actually explain why they tr FB, because that shit makes little sense to me right now.

quick scumreads me dude.

Not hard enough.

This appears to be a scummy, lazy tactic. You're throwing shit at someone and misrepresenting another players view to push your own.

I consider this a tell.

Also, it's a minor take considering half the game is dead. But all of the wagons seen so far have been god-awful. Can we please get a good and decent one going on FB for the sake of my sanity. Tnx.

Including your own?

I'm not sure i want to trust Firebringer anymore. Because their read on Sakura makes no sense. Why are they so obvtown bruh?
VOTE: Firebringer

its the fact that i don't think ur trying to manipulate me in anyway. i think and this is just a theory (and u might try it next time ur scum) u would more or less use me as a foundation to get ur placeholder/foot in the game by locking me in for ur read and then maneuver from there. I think ur playing this without that when the easy option of manipulating me exists and I think even if ur going for a more serious game u would still try to manipulate me in some way.

I'm considering the fact that you've TR NPOM, Quick and now Sakura. I'm not seeing how this game makes sense if all scum are in lurkers. Are you just trying to pocket most of the active players? And what's this "they would manipulate me if i was scum" BS? How do you know that would be scum!Sakura's play here?

You're too fluffy and pockety compared to our last game FB. There's a pretty big difference.

In Fungi Mafia FB was actually lightly scum hunting, also picking a couple few TR's. Not handing them out like candy. Also, even though he always jokes. It was intertwined with actual solving. Here he just doesn't seem to care. As evidenced by wagoning either for some personal BS reason that has nothing to do with the game, or encouraging a wagon a dude that hasn't even posted FFS.
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p11828723

doesn't seem like a lazy scum norwe push

This makes me second guess my view on norwe, but I also think it's a case of nor pushing to get something started on someone.

fungi mafia cliff notes of Norwee:
--> Sometimes gave some insight to players usually mild mannered. Usually only gave long cases for why he thought a player was town.
--> Doesn't try to take control of game or lead. Perfectly willing to take a back seat.
--> Passiveness

Ur scumcase on me doesn't match this.

Yeah, im comfortable with u in my townreads.

Disagree. This isn't what they're doing here IMHO.

Number 1 and 2 don't correlate with their existing behaviour in this game. I checked fungi, they were town. So what are you actually trying to say here?!

I'll come back to 622.

Also i'd like Sakura/Quick to actually explain why they tr FB, because that shit makes little sense to me right now.

Firebringer is an old friend and knows all my weaknesses and It hasnt felt like he's trying to exploit them, a scum!FB would have

probably

TR me much earlier considering I got into the game from the get go and would've been pretty easy to call me TR due to meta and I would be none the wiser. His explanation on his TR of me matches his play around me and so I figured he's probably town.

You're too fluffy and pockety compared to our last game FB. There's a pretty big difference.

Our last game he was pretty obsessed with me, but, I feel he was MORE fluffy on fungi mafia.

Basically my feeling also comes from the fact that Firebringer is a pretty strong player, he is perfectly capable of playing normally,

but where's the fun in that

, and getting himself townread in the process. Considering he's just being fluffy he's just having fun, and being in an environment of people that arent very familiar with him

to my knowledge

he'd have a much easier time just playing normally and getting townread as scum, than whatever he's doing right now, it feels kind of anti-scum, if you know what i mean.

There's a non zero chance he's playing this way in order to pocket specific people

including me

, and you're free to point and laugh at me if he flips scum, but at this point I don't think he's doing anything to advance any specific agenda.

That's buddying to get them in your pocket.

Oh and talking reads, I do agree that now this is more similar to the town norwegian than the scum norwegian i've seen. So norwegian can go into the town bin too.

You and Nor sit at opposite ends of the spectrum on FB, which IMHO is of interest given the links I've drawn to you both.

I don’t think FB flipping scum would equate Sakura scum based on FB’s play around the slot.

And that right there is an interesting post. Basically absolving Sakura from being mafia if FB flips scum. Why would you do that? How do you have any certainty that is the case?! It's a post of certainty, and I cannot understand how you can be so certain about them.

651/post], [post]653, 660, 664, 666, 683 I'll come back to later as there's a lot to analyse in there for me.

Porkens vote in 696 is odd.

Drew has been lacking too. He came, he left. And everyone forgot im.

Now you touch on me again. And not in the 'sexy Norwegian chick' kind of way.

You seem to like to shift focus at times when focus is on you.

More votes on the pig please.

Why?

Scumreading a townplayer(Quick)

For clarity: How do you know Quick is a townplayer?

He seems engaged and trying to gamesolve.

And I just checked. He never even voted for Quick.

Quick could be scum...something’s making me hesitate though so it’s not strong

To me that's a scumread without saying it's a scumread.

So, NoPowerOverMe, you want(ed) more votes on Porkens because he is/was scumreading Quick, whom you assert is a town player. Is that an accurate representation of your thoughts?

This is accurate, but I think you're floating up the wrong shit show mate.

Porkens appears to be trying to trap people but not sure if that's scum hunting or trying to get townies lynched by their own rope.

Tl:dr - I think Nor, Sakura appear to be scum at this point. I think we need to wait for Farken and Pers to contribute before we can proceed much further.

VOTE: NorwegianboyEE

Pages 28-32 are odd and I need to go review again. CoolDog's entrance changed the games dynamic a bit. I have to sift through what they've posted better as my initial thoughts are it didn't read right in placed and also read very well in others.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Really like how you just clarify things and get everyone up to speed.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Unfortunately, it still tells me nothing about your alignment.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

u could always ask me questions

That's true. Unfortunately, I have no idea what I could possibly ask that will help me determine your alignment.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

u could always ask me questions

That's true. Unfortunately, I have no idea what I could possibly ask that will help me determine your alignment.

at least u didn't ask me if i was town. I would have had to say no, otherwise my honesty streak ends.

Since you've been claiming to be scum, I'll just treat you as such.

VOTE: Firebringer

L-3

[Fredrick A Campbell]

What do you two think of Porkens? Their recent changes of vote make little sense.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

What do you two think of Porkens? Their recent changes of vote make little sense.

Scum.

And is that based on prejudice or observations?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Since it is also based on observations, what observations?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

i don't think his reads make sense with what he has posted. His posts look more like he is trying to look like he is doing something.

look at his progression on sakura and see what i mean.

I don't see what you mean. Isn't it possible for someone to have this thought progression?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Disrespectful? Criticism isn't disrespectful. Calling people names is.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'm going to sleep. See you tomorrow. (Latest, 0400 GMT)

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Disrespectful? Criticism isn't disrespectful. Calling people names is.

if i wanted to call people names i would direct them right at them. I think u and drew got way to defensive of my rant on meta haters and decided u belonged to the group and my rant was at u guys. Which is like ???? since both of u decided to also distance urself from the group i labelled but also felt marginalized by me.

i don't think his reads make sense with what he has posted. His posts look more like he is trying to look like he is doing something.

look at his progression on sakura and see what i mean.

I don't see what you mean. Isn't it possible for someone to have this thought progression?

Firebringer, isn't it possible for someone to have this thought progression?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Post 920 isn't supposed to be there.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

...
WRT porkens i'm talking about votes around post ~250 and onwards. None of those looked serious, and the wagon died on its own without need for scum intervention. Also i like most of porken's takes and votes so far.
...

Two questions.

1. How did you know the wagon died without scum intervention?
2. If none of Porkens' posts around post 250 and onwards looked serious, how is it that you like most of Porken's takes and votes so far?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: Fakran

[Fredrick A Campbell]

CooLDoG, I was messing around in those few posts. You know as well as I do that those two players (NorwegianboyEE and Firebringer) are not taking this game very seriously, so, I didn't when I was engaging with them.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll be online in exactly 1 hour (0545 GMT) for questioning.

CooLDoG, I was messing around in those few posts. You know as well as I do that those two players (NorwegianboyEE and Firebringer) are not taking this game very seriously, so, I didn't when I was engaging with them.

But Norwegian and fire both seem to actually be playing the game. That's part of my VOTE: unvote

I have not been using any of their posts to read them because all the posts they have made that I am aware of does not seem to determine their alignment.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll be online in exactly 1 hour (0545 GMT) for questioning.

CooLDoG, I was messing around in those few posts. You know as well as I do that those two players (NorwegianboyEE and Firebringer) are not taking this game very seriously, so, I didn't when I was engaging with them.

But Norwegian and fire both seem to actually be playing the game. That's part of my VOTE: unvote

I have not been using any of their posts to read them because all the posts they have made that I am aware of does not seem to determine their alignment.

so u think all of reads/thoughts could be from either alignment?

Yes.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I have not been using any of their posts to read them because all the posts they have made that I am aware of does not seem to determine their alignment.

What reads do you ACTUALLY have then.

Right now, I have yet to find a single real read. I'm still asking questions in a bid to get a read.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Asking more questions.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

jesus, u have 0 reads?

Yes.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

i don't think his reads make sense with what he has posted. His posts look more like he is trying to look like he is doing something.

look at his progression on sakura and see what i mean.

I don't see what you mean. Isn't it possible for someone to have this thought progression?

Firebringer, isn't it possible for someone to have this thought progression?

Firebringer, isn't it possible for someone to have this thought progression?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

The actual reason I voted for Firebringer was because he said he rolled mafia so many times.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll be online in exactly 1 hour (0545 GMT) for questioning.

so you are basically telling us a lie, right. LYNCH THE LIES!

What do you think I am lying about?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

You said you rolled scum.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Fred do u have conflicting thoughts on any players that make it hard to form reads....I have a hard time with this "I have 0 reads". Is there some posts that make u go town and others that go scum so ur not ready to make decisions. What is it?

It is exactly that.

I scum-read Quick in the first days then I see some posts other players make that present and argument suggesting Quick might be town, leaving me uncertain now.
I scum-read you, Sakura Hana, NorwegianboyEE, Mohab500, and NoPowerOverMe simply because you were just doing strange things and spamming the thread. But I also considered that the motivation may not be malicious and again, I am undecided.
CooLDoG and Drew-Sta, I truly never had a read on.
Mohab500, I mentioned earlier, but it was really their readlist that made me reconsider that scum-read.

I could give more details about the history of my fluctuating reads on the other players if you think that helps. I decided not to mention it because I thought it would have added nothing to the game.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Fred do u have conflicting thoughts on any players that make it hard to form reads....I have a hard time with this "I have 0 reads". Is there some posts that make u go town and others that go scum so ur not ready to make decisions. What is it?

It is exactly that.

I scum-read Quick in the first days then I see some posts other players make that present and argument suggesting Quick might be town, leaving me uncertain now.
I scum-read you, Sakura Hana, NorwegianboyEE, Mohab500, and NoPowerOverMe simply because you were just doing strange things and spamming the thread. But I also considered that the motivation may not be malicious and again, I am undecided.
CooLDoG and Drew-Sta, I truly never had a read on.
Mohab500, I mentioned earlier, but it was really their readlist that made me reconsider that scum-read.

I could give more details about the history of my fluctuating reads on the other players if you think that helps. I decided not to mention it because I thought it would have added nothing to the game.

Gun to ur head. I take indecisiveness out of it.
Where do these people fall in after?

Quick-null
Sakura Hana-null
Firebringer-null
NorwegianboyEE-null
Mohab500-null
NoPowerOverMe-null
CooLDog-null
Drew-Sta-null
Fakran-I am probing
Persivul-I am waiting
popopopopopopo-probably town (that seems to be one read I have and forgot about)
Porkens-null (I have not had time to check on his ISO because of recent in-game events)

Pull the trigger if you don't like that I am this indecisive on so many people. Just remember that you will be lynching me for a read-list you don't like instead of seeing something which makes you think I am scum (unless you consider my read-list to be coming from scum, in which case, there is nothing I can do about it.)

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Super Town:

Firebringer
Mohab500

Towny:

Fredrick A Campbell
Drew-Sta
Quick
CooLDoG
popopopopopopo
NorwegianboyEE
NoPowerOverMe

Leftovers:

Farkran
Persivul
Porkens

You know, it's kinda funny how everything falls into place.
VOTE: Farkran

How can you even be this certain about Firebringer and Mohab500?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

real talk, fredrick u might never want to be in a life or death situation because it sounds like u would freeze and be unable to react. Which usually isn't good.

At the end of one's life is death. Not too much of a problem to me.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

What you read as town I read as null because I could imagine scum doing these exact things.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I thought I didn't.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

like go through porkens posts on sakura early. He pushes sakura on a few things. It wasn't "ohh i scumread u" but it was enough to warrant like "i am worried about what u are doing". Then when sakura gets defensive he goes "Ohhh I am not even scumreading u though". When it is painfully obvious he is suspicious at least from his posts. Then eventually it just goes to townread. Its like bad.

I read his ISO and I see what you mean now.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll be online in exactly 1 hour (0545 GMT) for questioning.

real talk, fredrick u might never want to be in a life or death situation because it sounds like u would freeze and be unable to react. Which usually isn't good.

I also agree with this. Bad reaction is bad.

I also agree with you. The important part is do you think a player with bad reaction is town or scum?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: Porkens

L-3

[Fredrick A Campbell]

From experience, is it better to read ISOs or reread the whole thread?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll do whatever Fire does.

VOTE: Persivul

NoPowerOverMe, are you still going to do whatever Firebringer does? How is it that you know you can trust him?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

BTW, I informed mod that I was VLA for 5.22 - 5.25 but it didn't get into the notes.

@mod, please confirm this in thread.

Someone already said you were V/LA during this time. Any idea who that might be or how they might know?

This post answers both your questions.

So, Looking at the mod's confirmation post, there's 1 player that hasn't confirmed yet.
Persivul is V/LA according to his profile so that could easily be the cause of him not posting. (Although an ego search turns out he's at least posting on his other games, V/LA supposed to end today so I hope we hear from him)
CD hasn't been on site for 2 days, could be the person that hasnt confirmed.
Looking at Blurry's site activity seems to be someone that posts once every blue moon.
Same with Drew.

Looks like we just got some people that just arent active in general. I don't think we can discern alignment from activity alone.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: Mohab500

L-3

[Fredrick A Campbell]

So Mohab care to explain this?

Anyways, UNVOTE:

until we get a claim

because I don't trust one of you not to randomly hammer.

VOTE: Drewsta

Hammered without a claim here.

I mistook your vote and thought you voted for Mohab500 so yes, L-4.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

But now that Firebringer has voted, it is L-3.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Explain yourself,

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I do not understand what you are trying to say.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Moab will give more opinions and wagon hop more. Porkens will do and say nothing.

And what are we going to do with Mohab500's opinions?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

You do realize how much WIFOM there will be, right?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

What will lynching Porkens achieve?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Why lynch Porkens first then?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

How do you even know that Porkens is scum?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

If you wanted Porkens to be lynched, why vote for Drew-Sta?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

that night kills makes a whole lot of sense btw if the team is Persivul/Mohab/Porkens

I do not understand. Why would it make "a whole lot of sense"?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Porkens, do you scumread Mohab500 or not?

VOTE: Porkens

[Fredrick A Campbell]

that night kills makes a whole lot of sense btw if the team is Persivul/Mohab/Porkens

I do not understand. Why would it make "a whole lot of sense"?

Firebringer, I would like to understand.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Porkens is not voting for anyone. Does he always do that?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

So Mohab care to explain this?

Anyways, UNVOTE:

until we get a claim

because I don't trust one of you not to randomly hammer.

VOTE: Drewsta

Hammered without a claim here.

Nothing much to explain here. I didn't want us to waste the day discussing how scummy an obv town is so I just ended it. I usually can't resist quick-hammering anyways, so do know that L-2 is L-1 in this game.

"how scummy an obv town is"

Why was he obv town to you?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: Mohab500

L-2

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll say it loud and clear. MOHAB...AND...PORKENS...ARE...BOTH...EQUALLY...VERY...SCUMMY.

If they are equally scummy then i'd assume you would just vote for Mohab since they have more votes. But that's not what you've been doing.

Sometimes I wonder if you guys even read the thread.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll say it loud and clear. MOHAB...AND...PORKENS...ARE...BOTH...EQUALLY...VERY...SCUMMY.

If they are equally scummy then i'd assume you would just vote for Mohab since they have more votes. But that's not what you've been doing.

Sometimes I wonder if you guys even read the thread.

NPOM is voting Porkens right now. Not Mohab.

Let me refer you to page 71. I have already grilled NoPowerOverMe over his decision.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'll say it loud and clear. MOHAB...AND...PORKENS...ARE...BOTH...EQUALLY...VERY...SCUMMY.

If they are equally scummy then i'd assume you would just vote for Mohab since they have more votes. But that's not what you've been doing.

Sometimes I wonder if you guys even read the thread.

NPOM is voting Porkens right now. Not Mohab.

Let me refer you to page 71. I have already grilled NoPowerOverMe over his decision.

Yes, and? Do you disagree with the prospect of NPOM being scummy for their stance?

In my opinion, I didn't think it scummy.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Although at first, I did.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

1 he's scum 2 less likely to slip or tell than Mohab.

Why lynch Porkens first then?

He's not going to give us anything.

How do you even know that Porkens is scum?

A) he had the most to gain from the drew lynch B) He and Mohab have strong associatives d1, and have been suspiciously silent day 3) The mohab hammer was scummy.

This doesn't seem like malicious intention. In addition to that, I have had a scum-read on Porkens since I read their ISO as Firebringer suggested.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Let's make things simple. Read Mohab500's ISO and see if it even lines up with what she is claiming

[Fredrick A Campbell]

So Mohab care to explain this?

Anyways, UNVOTE:

until we get a claim

because I don't trust one of you not to randomly hammer.

VOTE: Drewsta

Hammered without a claim here.

Nothing much to explain here. I didn't want us to waste the day discussing how scummy an obv town is so I just ended it. I usually can't resist quick-hammering anyways, so do know that L-2 is L-1 in this game.

"how scummy an obv town is"

Why was he obv town to you?

I don't know. I initially townread him, mainly from looking at tone, reads, etc... but I later called him a scum-lean because I was influenced by the rest of the players and thought my argument for reading him as town was bad, since no one agreed. Clearly the town here is fairly confused and in fact i have more confidence in my reads now than ever, so it's time for me to start totally ignoring your reads and opinions, and start actually thinking solely for myself.
...

When did you start to call him scum-lean?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Or you could quickhammer and end Day 2 like you suggested.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I was a Town Neighbourhood Encryptor. The scumteam is probably popopopopo, NPOM, and Fredrick (slightly unsure about the last one). Good luck town.

Who's in the neighbourhood?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I asked for a claim because I wanted a reason to unvote. I wanted to quick-hammer/end the day and because I felt like everyone else was afraid of hammering, I thought I'd bring someone else to put him at L-1 then hammer myself. As for why I wanted to end the day, I felt like you guys were non-committal in getting someone lynched and that a flip might help us start heading in a better direction. The comment about PR's was just to troll.

Why do u think someone is affraid to hammer when U posted in ur unvote specifically that U were affraid someone was going to quick-hammer.

That is the opposite of what u are claiming now.

It's useless at this point. She self-hammered.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I was a Town Neighbourhood Encryptor. The scumteam is probably popopopopo, NPOM, and Fredrick (slightly unsure about the last one). Good luck town.

Who's in the neighbourhood?

Bumping this so Mohab500 can answer it.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I really thought I wasn't going to get lynched, but I guess I was too hopeful haha.

You wouldn't have been lynched if you didn't hammer yourself.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

The third scum is gonna be the tough part.

I tracked Persivul to CooLDoG last night.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Should I have claimed?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

That's unfair though. The slot was so inactive and I didn't think this would happen. I should've asked for a Sakura kill tbh.

Had you not said that, Persivul could have fakeclaimed.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

True.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

We're waiting for the flip. I'll be watching over from the dead thread, good luck everyone. Again, sorry for throwing the game like that, teammates .

And hinted that there is more than one teammate left.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Rules: Claiming scum - by yourself is fine. Claiming scum with another player is against the rules.

Technically, she claimed scum by herself.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Can we be sure it is Porkens though?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

If it is not, the third guy is going to be tough to figure out.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

That's unfair though. The slot was so inactive and I didn't think this would happen. I should've asked for a Sakura kill tbh.

Anyway, Mohab500 has, in effect, confirmed Sakura to be town.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Don't know how you know that, but that is the case.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

We have forgotten to consider popopopopopopo, Quick, and Fakran. They could very well be just like Persivul.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I wonder if I should have unvoted so Mohab500 doesn't get to quickhammer.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

How quick?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

By the way, we are in twilight.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Yes.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Mohab500.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Yes, sir. Mohab self lynched. Fred claimed he track guiltied Persivul. We are 99% sure on Porkens.

I tracked Persivul to CooLDoG.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Have you read the thread?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

He wasn't hoping.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'm trying to reread quickly. I see a bunch of votes for no reason and then a selfhammer which is like the worst possible way to play the game regardless of the flip.

The wagon was {sakura, popopo, firebringer, mohab, frederick, norwee, mohab} am i correct?

Yes.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I'm not sure if you would consider the votes to be for no reason in context.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I think the main reason we got so royally fucked here is because our night actions all were bad luck. We killed VT's and identified PR's too late everytime.
Night 1 we found out Frerick was PR. But he already tracked Persivuls kill that night.
Night 3 we found out Farkran was PR. But he already investigate Popopo that night.

Very bad luck. I actually just went to random.org when I got my role PM and randomised the list of players. Persivul happened to be on top.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

norwe how did you correctly pick PR for investigation on each night ?

Idk. It was just pure gut feeling.
Night 1 i chose Fredrick because i thought he was saying little to hide something. (A PR role)
Night 2 i don't really remember why i chose Quick. I guess i just thought it would be a good idea to check since i was seeing them out as a mislynch for later.
Night 3 i chose Farkran because i was just paranoid that if they had a PR role they could be a problem. And i wanted to make sure they didn't.

I would say my posting rate is about equal, if not more than my last game. However, relative to players like you, Mohab500, and Firebringer, that rate is completely blown out of the water and suddenly I'm one of the mid-level posters as Farkran put it.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Farkran and Fred saved the game. true mvps

He saved the game by using RNG.

The one time random.org is an mvp.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Firebringer, I read a game you moderated and you seemed to have a beef with neapolitans. What is up with that?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Did anyone notice that both scum and hood were single minded? They had the same opinions on everything.

You have forgotten that the PTs will only be released 24 hours later.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

like one game i played a neo got a vt check on a player and thought that means they were scum. And then lynched them. My god the shit storm that was.

i wasn't Neo in this game i am referencing. Someone else was.

That was some poor logic. If you get a not VT, it doesn't mean they are scum. It only means they are not VT, which means that they may be a town power role or scum. Not a hundred percent confirmation.

A similar thing with my tracker result. I was weary of publishing it at first because it only meant the player visited the player who died last night. It didn't mean they were scum and Persivul may very well have not been. I only decided to publish my result at the last minute because I thought the game was solved. In that way, Mohab500's anti-town behavior influenced me to publish the result.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I really need to host a game.

I promise unimaginable amounts of fun

Ever moderated a game before?

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Me too. I have already in to mod a game in the normal queue.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Don't take that to mean you should continue to play this way, though. It may have done more harm than good.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

If scum hadn't known I was a tracker, town would have lost a power role for what might have been nothing.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

Ok.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

My apologies, I tend to take jokes seriously.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I enjoy these games. Any feedback on me as a player is happily accepted.

It makes zero diff if you were right for the right OR wrong reasons. All that matters is that you were right.

I don't think you played bad and I think the Town was dumb as rocks to lynch you.

While it made zero difference for the outcome of this game, using flawed reasoning would not give neither correct results nor incorrect results with any degree of consistency and should be disposed of.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

I thought about mentioning that I frequently get investigated N1 but I thought it's not really fair for me to always make others take the risk, plus I made a good entrance and figured I was safe. Tracker is probably someone I've burned in the past as scum, but hiding behind an alt. Secret alts are for pussies.

I don't remember playing with you. I only used my other accounts many years ago and do not remember any of the players I played with.