Newbie 2010: Pride Month | Game Over

[Homura]

Happy Pride Month!

Spoiler:

[Homura]

Did you roll scum again, Snowblaze?

[Homura]

Umlaut, what's your actual read on gibus?

[Homura]

Feels like pi town.

[Homura]

Why are you getting defensive at a vote?

Not a fan of Snow's posts, but I didn't read that as particularly defensive. What are you seeing?

[Homura]

I'm going to really need you to explain this because I don't see it at all.

Meta read. Actually feels townier than his town game. Wording of "that was something that just stuck out" (75) feels good.

[Homura]

@Ghost Ganster: Homura has been relatively inactive as town in previous games.

This is likely not going to be popular, but I don't care too much if they're town. Giving lurkers a pass is bad, in my opinion, even if meta is at play. It's just too good for scum.

She has yet to even vote, randomly or not.

@Homura, what are your scum-reads? Do consider using your vote as well, please.[/quote]
Feel one of Snow and Elmo is scum. pi and Umlaut likely town. Your reasoning about me is ill-formed but not necessarily scum-indicative.

[Homura]

This is likely not going to be popular, but I don't care too much if they're town. Giving lurkers a pass is bad, in my opinion, even if meta is at play. It's just too good for scum.

She has yet to even vote, randomly or not.

@Homura, what are your scum-reads? Do consider using your vote as well, please.

EBWOP —

Feel one of Snow and Elmo is scum. pi and Umlaut likely town. Your reasoning about me is ill-formed but not necessarily scum-indicative.

[Homura]

It's concerning that you have reasons to scumread nearly everyone on the playerlist

Where are you seeing "scumread nearly everyone" from? Post seems like general thoughtposting with both town and scum reads.

[Homura]

What makes you say... basically all of that?
-Why do you feel one of Snow and Elmo is scum? Why aren't you voting for one of them? Why aren't you doing something to see if you can clarify your either/or opinion of them with questions, pressure and such?
-Why are piisirrational and Umlaut likely town?
-Why do you think my reasoning about you is ill-informed and non necessarily scum-indicative?

You'll be disappointed if you expected a full-length analysis of my reads at this point of the game. My reads are mainly tone so far.

Your reasoning is ill-formed because you advocated for a policy lynch on a player you labelled a lurker despite the game having gained little tread. Unless you pushed me as a reaction test (which, based on my gauge of your play in this game so far, I think is unlikely), your reasons for wanting to lynch me stem more frequently from newbtown wanting something to push. That's why I didn't think you're scum.

I dislike the style of interrogation you took with this post, however. The rapid-fire questioning feels unsubtle.

[Homura]

Could you explain how "one of Snow and Elmo is scum" could be based on tone, please? Also, would you consider at least mentioning/quoting the posts that tonally gave you those reads (and the town ones), or even just the main one for each?

And could you answer the questions "Why aren't you voting for one of them? Why aren't you doing something to see if you can clarify your either/or opinion of them with questions, pressure and such?"?

For Snow, I feel like she's taking a more cheery, airy tone with her posts that I find a little off-putting. Don't know what to think about the implication that she took for granted I'm town. I have also consistently misread her in our games, so slight paranoia plays a role as well.

Elmo's ISO in general feels like a collection of bad-faith pushes on players — don't enjoy her misconstruing Snow's post as overly defensive.

WRT to the second bit — my play has lessened in proactiveness since the quarantine. I tend to keep my cards close to my chest nowadays, because I lack the energy for thinking up questions that I can analyze critically. Consider this an excuse if you wish.

[Homura]

If you list all the players with a reason towards being scum (or unhelpful) you get:
Elmo
Raya
Hectic
Snowblaze
Piisirrrational

That's 5/8 players that Homura has to get a read on.
(There were some town points for some of the list too but it's still concerning since scum can do this to keep their options open or to look busy without making any committed reads)

You were referring to Ghost here?

[Homura]

Raya, thoughts on Ghost's push on me?

[Homura]

Okay, but did you consider that other players can analyze the answers to your questions anyway? You don't even necessarily have to be the one doing the analyzing (though that's always good). This is a team game. If you're town, you should be playing to help yourself

and

your teammates. So even if you can't follow up, asking questions, adding pressure, voting people, is always helpful.

Surely if my tone is different to previous games when I was scum it should imply that I’m

not

scum.

The fact you were scum in your game together wasn't in Homura's post. If it's true, then your point is very valid, the omission is scummy in itself, and her explanation for listing you as possible scum loses whatever little basis it already had (I'm not a huge fan of meta).

The difference is in contrast to all her previous games, not just scum games. I considered her tone off-putting in a vacuum. My post was not nebulous enough to misunderstand this.

I consider scumreading someone based on a lack of evidence fallacious except in certain circumstances, and so will not engage with you on this thread of thinking further.

[Homura]

Snow can be town now, though.

Ghost vote on Elmo.

[Homura]

Why did you ask this of Raya specifically? I'd assume you already knew Raya had him as scum?

I did. I also think Ghost is obvtown. My intent should be clear.

[Homura]

I do think there's a more flippant element to her play than scum would have, but that can't be counted as a point in town!Elmo's favor.

[Homura]

TStbS is not towny.

[Homura]

A point which I only apply to Newbies, anyway, because the tactic is used uncommonly by more experienced players like Elmo FME.

[Homura]

that this is kind of nitpicky

Yes. It is.

[Homura]

...wow.

[Homura]

Ghost vote = Soft vote. An FoS.

Not sure how that was misconstrued.

[Homura]

Why is being unsubtle scummy?

It’s unsubtle because the questions on literally every single point in my post is not only excessive but feels less like wanting a statement from me than making a statement on me himself. Everything about my play — what I did, even what I didn’t do, is wrong or scummy or bad. There’s no sense of “I’m not sure if this player is town and I want to find out by asking about their motivations and reasoning to find out” and more “I really want to get this player lynched no matter what”. But that’s since been admitted so the point is moot — that’s what it felt like at the time.

I had him as town for his overall play besides this, but writing this post makes me feel that the push was a lot more bad-faithy than I originally felt.

[Homura]

Or maybe I’m just aggravated in general by the amount of strawmen my posts are being made into. And all coming from my townreads.

I feel like I barely got to play the game.

[Homura]

Thoughts on Raya, Hectic?

[Homura]

You’re in my solve pile rn, but to answer your question: not necessarily. It depends on why you were faking it.

Explain?

[Homura]

Don't have much to add. Think game is PoEable if my suspicions on something are correct.

[Homura]

Elmo, what's your readslist looking like?

[Homura]

I thought I was mostly wrong about you because it didn't gain any traction. Why is that scummy?

Why does that mean you were wrong on Raya?

[Homura]

scumlean on Umlaut (Umlaut is a pretty darn good player so I haven't seen anything here that isn't, IMO, a "towny" or "scumhunting" post which would be easily imitable by Scumlaut)

Is there anything concrete substantiating your scumread of Umlaut other than paranoia?

[Homura]

Typically I'd create a finalized readlist during EoD to table my thoughts, but my theory makes putting down all my cards anti-town and my play hasn't yet progressed to the stage where I feel comfortable gambit-playing.

For now, I'm putting my no-lynchpool as {Snowblaze, pi, M2H}. Everyone else is fair game.

[Homura]

Why is M2H in your pool?

I considered their predecessor town for the most part and feel their own ISO was generally towny; the more relevant reason is that they're less involved in the associatives surrounding the two biggest wagons, along with Snow and pi.

[Homura]

I really hate how much of the day Homura has spent not voting

VOTE: Homura

My lynch pool today is Hectic, Gibus, Homura. It seems significant that Hectic and Gibus are both at -2 and that both of those wagons built up quickly at EOD and they're voting each other. Surely both aren't scum together but it makes me paranoid that neither is scum. However, this could also just be because town finally realized there's a need to collapse onto a lynch at this point after my wagon fell apart?

I think we need to scrutinize the people who hopped off of my wagon and onto one of Gibus or Hectic with very little reason or commitment, so... Hectic or Umlaut?

Right now I'm scumreading Hectic more than Gibus. I realized that I misread Gibus's post about elmo and think that it is actually rather town of him to go against some vocal town leaders and give Elmo a town read. Obviously, Elmo wasn't even around enough to consider that a good target for pocketing, and there were plenty of low hanging fruit posts there to park an easy vote. Since I know for a fact that my slot is town, I also know for a fact that he wasn't doing it to protect a scum buddy. My suspicion is still largely based on the way Gibus switched around at the end of the day to 2 people in his POE which he's never provided a reason to scum read, and eagerly await his response.

This is a really strange vote considering you haven't indicated an inkling of what your progression on my slot might be and your explanation for doing so in 384 seems disingenuous. What exactly were you hoping to get out of me?

[Homura]

So, take my post at face value: I don't like that you haven't been voting and want to know why.

Take it as a matter of circumstance, I guess? I generally vote only after having a degree of certainty in my reads, and I have been lacking a concrete scumread for most of the dayphase up until the point where I ghost voted your slot. But I'm hard-pressed to see why abstaining from voting entirely is scum-indicative.

[Homura]

FMPOV, the fact that both opposing wagons have traction should indicate that it's not a single scum player driving the game.

[Homura]

I have a null read on you based on your posting, but I find it scummy that you've not been using your vote the entire time. I wanted you to explain why you have not been using your vote to pressure and scum hunt, as well as more commentary on the recent developments before EOD, and I thought that voting you might successfully cause you to do so. Plus, I like to use my vote to get something done at all times but wasn't ready to put either of the other two at L-1 yet, so I voted the last person in my POE.

I definitely admit that this can look strange, but I really don't think it can be construed as scummy as scum have every motivation right now to pick one of the 2 existing wagons this close to end of day when obviously one of them would have to be town if I were scum.

I mean, when you essentially naked vote me a day before deadline and the rest of your post is about why players other than me are scummy, I'd gather only that you scumread me and are willing to end the day with my lynch. It felt like you would have voted Umlaut and asked me the questions you did in this post, but instead you went about it in this roundabout way — provoking me to ask you first before pressuring me — and I just find it difficult to see this coming from a town-motivated perspective.

I don't think your defense WRT the competing wagons holds water when scum generally prefers not to be limited to choosing between their partner and a townie.

[Homura]

To be honest, I’ve caught up a while ago and I really wanted Snow to respond before posting because it would confirm or deconfirm the theory I based most of my reads and my view of the game around, but I don’t think it’s affordable to wait now.

VOTE: Umlaut

Prefer going here. Snow’s semi-CC means this has a higher chance of nailing confscum than a Hectic lynch.

[Homura]

Rare sighting of a Homura vote. They said it was a myth...

[Homura]

I don't see Raya or Nauci making that NK, either.

Intent.