Newbie 2014: Aesthetic | Game Over

[Lunatic]

VOTE: Anthony

Out of a total of 7 posts made DP1, the first 5 were fluff/rvs.

Post 6 was mostly a response to mikul and him saying he was hesitant to bring arthur to L-2, with some minor FOS for him parroting. After stating he was tentative to bring the man to L-2 for vague reasons, his next post holds no qualms bringing him to L-1.

His contribution was next to nothing the entire day phase, and he contradicted himself with his intentions towards arthur.

[Lunatic]

@townlooter,

Thoughts about last day phase?

[Lunatic]

LOL, if you guys a scum team and win again I am quitting this game for good!

Seriously though, and very quick thoughts because I have to head out: votato and mikul feel decently town, everyone else, including your good self, kinda in the scum bucket. Brass and Anthony strongest scum leans because scum likely on wagon.

What about anthony?

[Lunatic]

I'll be here when more activity starts. Focusing on the other games for now. With the lack of activity in this , I've all but gave up on it. I'll contribute as there is useful information, I just don't want to talk to myself. Will post as stuff is relevant.

That self hammer boned us

Why are we boned because of one mislynch? We have two more fam. Don't give up.

[Lunatic]

Mikul what are your thoughts on vote to, so you still scum read him?

[Lunatic]

I'll be here when more activity starts. Focusing on the other games for now. With the lack of activity in this , I've all but gave up on it. I'll contribute as there is useful information, I just don't want to talk to myself. Will post as stuff is relevant.

That self hammer boned us

Why are we boned because of one mislynch? We have two more fam. Don't give up.

well we only have one more. i think we should all do ourselves a favor and re-read all of day 1. its really short, shouldnt take long

Assuming no protections there is a total of 3 mislynches just the 3rd one loses the game.

[Lunatic]

Mikul post

[Lunatic]

Mikul thoughts on votato?

[Lunatic]

Who are your top scum reads mikal?

[Lunatic]

2 scum are within Anthony, vex, townlooter and brassherald.

[Lunatic]

TL just seems to agreeable compared to last game. But again with how few posts there are its hard to get any rest. That and most people have been inactive on the weekends so by the time people start to half post the dp is nearly over again.

If we put the inactives under pressure they will post. Put anthony at l-1 lets see what happens.

[Lunatic]

2 scum are within Anthony, vex, townlooter and brassherald.

and id remove townlooter from that PoE i think. i think.

From behavior?

[Lunatic]

Not sure I picked up a town telling post. Id still like to see morr from town looter. And besides too

[Lunatic]

Also I am finding this series of lots of questions from Lunatic odd. You seem to be spamming single sentence, low effort, questions.

Why is it odd for a question to be single sentence? Should I post a paragraph to explain my question? lol

[Lunatic]

Also I am finding this series of lots of questions from Lunatic odd. You seem to be spamming single sentence, low effort, questions.

Why is it odd for a question to be single sentence? Should I post a paragraph to explain my question? lol

Well no, but I don't see a lot of value in you questions either - not really helping town, and could be a tactic to cause confusion. For example, your question about Anthony to me was straight after I said I had a slight scum lean on him because he was on the Arthur wagon. Doesn't really make sense by itself (hence I didn't bother answering it), what exactly about Anthony were you asking about?

I am trying to create activity in an otherwise inactive game. I didn't see where you had already read Anthony when I asked you.

I don't understand what you mean about how a question can cause confusion though. I would like you to elaborate on that please.

Also as far as short posts vs longer posts from me will depend on whether I'm at a computer or not. Work IP blocks mafia scum so posts will be from my phone and likely smaller and riddled with spelling errors as opposed to when I'm at home on my personal computer.

[Lunatic]

This is going to seem scummy and I don't care. I'm kind of over this game. There is not enough discussion or content to do anything productive.

Going to vote Anthony for a claim and tbh I would probably hammer him if he's at l1. 3 or 4 people have posted around 10 times this game and there is nothing to go off. We are basically yolo lynching off innactivity and I have no interest in caring

Giving up isn't the answer man. You wouldn't give up in a video game would you? Remember the innocent potato in that Diablo 3 rift we played that you visited first time? You didn't give up there.

There's 100% scum in those 4 people I mentioned and that makes our odds pretty good.

[Lunatic]

Don't hammer Anthony with 5 days left, we should keep him at l-1 until he or his replacement responds. Anyone who hammers him before a response ahould be treated as scum next phase. If you are town and hammer that, that means you will be losing town the game so think carefully.

[Lunatic]

Town looyer what happened between post 166 and 199 that made you so heavily reconsider your scum read of anthony

[Lunatic]

Mikal if you aren't going to participate after that please just ask the mod to replace out. There is no room for pessimism in mafia. You are throwing the game because you are mad at the inactivity instead of trying to make a difference yourself. That is pathetic man.

[Lunatic]

The mod already said he is working on replacements

[Lunatic]

its against site rules to publicly discuss replacing out and to encourage others to replace out

I was just made aware of this. That's not a rule on the site I play on so I guess I'm unfamiliar with the logic behind that. I'll just have to keep a mind out into playing games in the future who have a pessimistic attitude and refuse to be the change they want to see. I feel that attitude is detrimental to the nature of mafia.

[Lunatic]

Unvote, vtl mikal.

[Lunatic]

UNVOTE: Anthony

VOTE: Mikal

I'll give tenative reasons for this initally and post something more hard hitting when the replacements get here. For now, mikal as town should be pretty excited about things; this grim pessimistic reaction is unusual for how things currently stand in the game. Last time I saw this behavior I calles it out correctly as scum motivated, and I was right. I'm going to use the same logic towards mikal and treat pessimism and lack of wanting to try as a policy lynch moving forward.

[Lunatic]

I literally pursued lucky for the same thing in bullishes 2010s mafia.

https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/ ... -mafia-dp1

Lucky was scum.

[Lunatic]

I'll tldr it for it now.

" I don't blame you when you get frustrated as town because town is innactive or lazy". He also said it's a big problem on this site a few PM's before that when we were talking about the conclusion of the last game him and I won

If they allow me I'll post this but my vote isn't moving because this was less than a few weeks ago.

Being frustrated is one thing. Straight up giving up and not wanting to participate is another. I wanted to dismiss it as you pulling a b1tch move but my gut tells me you are doing this intelligently. Also how fast you responded and seemed to care after I voted you shows you are not all that disinterested in the game as you put on.

[Lunatic]

Fuck it. Gonna go ahead and full claim. Considered the last couple of days to do this anyway aalnd both weighes the benefits and the negatives of it. I think the positives outweigh the negatives because if we mislynch today we are on the lasy mislynch. I was confident that we could properly lynch today without resorting to this which is why i decided not to claim. But seeing as I may end up dying tonight anyway and then my results will not be out there and we will have more confusion, here it goes.

I am the tracker. When I initially read the game I town read mikes frustration about the Arthur self hammer. I still wanted to track him to make sure he was town though so I didnt have to second guess myself later.

He was seen visiting votato. With tracker theres only 3 possibilities for the second power role. Since Votato asled early in dp2 about something scummy mikal said in dp1 I am dismissing he is friendly neighbour. If he got a message saying mikal is town he wouldn't act suspicious of him. So I figured he is either jailer or cop. I stupidly dismissed he could be roleblocker or role cop. If he is jailkeep that looks good for votato because the night kill still went through. Technically if votato was scum he could have had the other scum mate carry the kill, though in general that seems a bad strategy and widens the chance of both scum being found out. If he is jailkeep mikal shouldnt have been excited about confirmation in votato narrowing down the pool.

Further he should have been excites after I soft claimed to him in the post where I mentioned Diablo 3. If he knew both I and votato were town the remaining scum pool is narrow between the remaining four I mentioned (now you see why i left out mikal nd votato from that pool).

Obviously if he is a doctor than that theory of votato being confirmes goes out the window. But I decide its best to out this result now because mike is saying he is quitting which is so anti town I cant even fathom he would do it as a power role. Mike will claim a power role now. Ive forced his hand. If he is the actual doc then he can protect me tonight and we get another tracker result. Of course he will die under that option but if hes scum role cop or roleblocker wed end up getting a CC in lylo which won't get us anywhere. Id rather risk the CC now and catch a guaranteed scum next day phase if we lynch wrong today.

And if mike really is the doc, this is a wake up call for him to get his head out of his ass and in my mind a positive as it still gives us a lot of POE to work with having two confirmed townies, only having to dismiss votato from the town pool.

If mike is the doctor his pessimistic no care attitude is extremely anti town ajd im not buying it.

[Lunatic]

I said I'm disinterested until something relevant came up

Word for word

You just directly contradicted what you said less than 2 weeks ago, one within the week. Especially when it's your main complaint on the site. If the mod allows this , I'll confirm it for the others but you have also townread me for this behavior. My vote isn't moving

Nah dude you were giving up. You wantes anthony to get hammered and said you didn't care about the outcome of the game. None of your qoutes will ever be me admitting to giving up in game. I don't do that. Go ahead dig through my mafia history and find a game where I have given up. I dare you.

[Lunatic]

I'm jailkeeper

This is what i suspected at first. If this is true you have no right to be pessimistic about the game when we had a remaining POE of 4 people and a 50% chance of lynching correctly. When i bread crumbed to you I expected excitement, giving up and being play with anthony potentially being town amd hammered was not the at if you are actually jailkeeper... If this is true in so god damned ashamed that you played it like this.

[Lunatic]

And now I'm dead , congrats

Doesn't matter. If no one counter claims you we can POE between the remaining four. If you are killed tonight I get another result with even higher percentage chance of getting scum on them assuming we lynch in those 4 today. If I was scum I would leave you alive and target votato. If thats the case and you protect me still no results but a strong POE pool with the remaining three. If we lynch incorrectly today a 66% chance tomorrow. And if correct a 33% chance assuming votato is killed.

[Lunatic]

Its worth mentioning that votato isn't 100% confirmed but it looks really good for him.

[Lunatic]

UNVOTE: Mikal

[Lunatic]

Dammit mike how did you not pick up my breadcrumb to you lol. That was the deciding factor for me in claiming.

[Lunatic]

I concur, I am almost just willing to dismiss votato as 100% town. He is experienced to enough I would assume he would grasp the logic of having 1 scum carry out the night actions.

[Lunatic]

Actually I Wana lynch herald. Check his profile. He's actively playing in another game and has lurked his ass off.

He was also posting on weekends and I remember him saying he doesn't play on weekends much

Also means he may have an innactive partner so he doesn't care.

I'm thinking Anthony and herald

I thoight herald was on v/l?

Also something bugs me about town looter too.

[Lunatic]

Townlooter scum read anthony until a wagon on him formed and it seemed he would actually get lynched. Then magically anthony is in the town pile. I can see him being Anthony's scum partner.

[Lunatic]

For the 2 town in this scum pile they will have a 66% lynch accuracy out of the remaining three. Interested to see the replacements thoughts.

[Lunatic]

Townlooter scum read anthony until a wagon on him formed and it seemed he would actually get lynched. Then magically anthony is in the town pile. I can see him being Anthony's scum partner.

I'm really bias but I can't see them killing porkins. He only posted like 3 times. Did he post something that implicated one of them?

If not it's an se going for how because they value his play

They could have targeted them because he is an SE. Isnt herald one too? He also didn't seem likely for protection I suppose.

[Lunatic]

Well the replacement is important now because I need to make sure their are no counter claims which will give us a guaranteed scum.

[Lunatic]

Votato where'd ya go? You got randomly quiet when the new revelations occurred.

[Lunatic]

Would a vanilla be told they were roleblocked

[Lunatic]

Votato can confirm

[Lunatic]

I am town-reading Anthony because I closely read his posts and feel like they are more newb than scum. Votato isn't wrong in his analysis of Anthony, but after the Arthur mislynch I am on edge and suspect someone is driving another, similar, mislynch. This will probably change once I have my head around your two claims.

The three people on his wagon earlier, are the three people who are town confirmed (assuming no one CC's).

Does that change your read on anthony, given you now seem to only be reading him as town because you suspect it was a sketchy wagon?

[Lunatic]

I feel that claiming was a bit silly, you were both already town.

I weighed the options before doing so, and figured the benefits outweighed the negatives.

Power role claiming in Lylo/mylo as scum to lead a mislynch is too easy. This is the perfect opportunity, we have results, we have 3 town confirms potentially, and you don't have to worry about mafia conning yall in the last day phase. They will have to try to con us today, or not at all. If they try a CC today, it is better than tomorrow where if we mislynch we will lose. It will guarantee us a scum at any rate if they try. Also if any town are among the four remaining POE, the statistical advantage of finding scum is 66%, where as for us it's 50%. The POE information is extremely helpful. That said, if the game was getting slightly more activity I might have re-considered doing this. That and if Mikal didn't start getting all pessimistic, which I naturally read as scummy.

[Lunatic]

ok i gues ill defer to mikul and lunatic since they were both in that game with you and know you better. but i still think brass is the best lynch today.

We were scum in that one together, and he was town. But his posts were very different from how they are here. First of all he was much less active and excited about the game. And most of his posts read as null to the other townies, which is ultimately how he got mislynched to win us the game. But yeah, he could have just learned from that game or something, but his posts are much more frequent here. I suspect he's more excited maybe from getting scum? I don't know.

[Lunatic]

As far as you are concerned, yes, but I don't see why you guys have cleared votat

He's not cleared 100%. But the logic is, as scum, it seems best to make one person carry out both the night kill and the roleblock so you have less people to potentially show up on tracker results. That means one scum gets burned instead of 2. Of course we have no way of knowing for sure if mafia are experienced enough to do that as a strategy, but it is assumed most logical scum teams would operate with that in mind. If that's the case, it looks really good for Votato being jailkept (roleblocked) and a kill still went through. At the very least he didn't carry out the night kill. That clears him as 50% not scum in my mind. I go further with it based on behavior though.

[Lunatic]

Also, don't out PRs as a PR when you don't see someone visit the night kill, that's the only way you get a confirmed guilty as a tracker, ugh.

Thanks for the massive bit of contribution here. I've explained why in detail I did this, and was tempted to even when I thought mikul was town. You are welcome to dis-agree with the benefits of the POE that you are conveniently in btw.

[Lunatic]

@ Mikul what do you think of Brassherald and his vote?

[Lunatic]

Obviously the best move for scum at the moment would be to join the Nash wagon, and I'm confident that there's scum in {Town Looter, brassherald, ArthurConyl}.

ArthurConyl is dead, I assume you mean anthony.

[Lunatic]

Im cool with it.

I would have expected a lot more post from an SE that just a quick quip and vote for the seemingly easy nash wasgon.

VOTE: BrassHerald

[Lunatic]

I'm not here as an SE to play the game for you, I'm here to help you get better at the game.

So, get better.

I'll settle for just lynching you, oh wise one.

[Lunatic]

I give a read, Nash is scum, his predecessor falls into the newbie scum tactic of just not posting. Hell, I replaced into a game where I won as scum because my partner did this and no one called him out. But, it's the "easy vote" so, what? Is it because I'm not sitting here typing pages of text? That's not my style, and I definitely don't want to read long posts, have less desire to make them.

So, what exactly is it I'm supposed to do to change your minds? Solve the game for you all? Not tell you that outing PRs is anti-town?

I mean, not exactly much for me to do at this point with the heavy confirmation bias going on.

Yeah the jackass role doesn't work out to well for trying to look townie. Actually making an effort and seeming to want to scum hunt would be another thing, but your just not there.

[Lunatic]

Connor also when you read this. You know how in liva mafia we always type something and what purpose it serves the next dp?

Yes

[Lunatic]

Connor thoughts on tl?

I still feel the same on him. The mahor thing I dont like is how flip floppy his reads are. He went from saying that Anthony was scum to town reading him when the three of us had our votes him. He's soing the same thing with brass now, after stating he finds him scummy but pointing out thimfs he thinks are townie but is still willing to lynch him. Seems mayne to absolve himself of being wrong. If town looter is scum I will suspect the Anthony slot strongly. I'm honestly okay with lynching randomly in the pool of the 4 people. We have a 50% chance of being right and honest day phase it will make the odds even stronger. The wagon info will be useful. It will be useful to see who distances themselves from each other or fights to defend another. I don't scum read nas though I think brass town or Anthony are my favorite options.

[Lunatic]

Can't determine if it's posturing or actual town. I feel like a scum tl would have went with the bandwagon on herald and likely tried to Lynch him

As far as herald goes, he is still im support of lynching him.

[Lunatic]

Holy crap 346 was unreadable. I hate posting from my phone.

[Lunatic]

I kind of want to Gambit this game

I want to Lynch Anthony and if he flips scum it basically confirms herald. I don't think he would bus him what that read scum

If Anthony flips town we lynch herald no matter what.

And hope that Poe works

I'm fine with anthony. It would kill an inactive slot and save the mod a replacement anyway.

[Lunatic]

Also heralds whining about pushing a boulder up a hill don't do much for me town reading him any better. The whole issue was that he doesn't seem to want to try and further the game, and his response is to get really defensive and complain about how people see him rather than engage further with the remaining player pool in a way that shows the deductive process being used.

[Lunatic]

Connor thoughts on tl?

I still feel the same on him.

The mahor thing I dont like is how flip floppy his reads are

. He went from saying that Anthony was scum to town reading him when the three of us had our votes him. He's soing the same thing with brass now, after stating he finds him scummy but pointing out thimfs he thinks are townie but is still willing to lynch him. Seems mayne to absolve himself of being wrong. If town looter is scum I will suspect the Anthony slot strongly. I'm honestly okay with lynching randomly in the pool of the 4 people. We have a 50% chance of being right and honest day phase it will make the odds even stronger. The wagon info will be useful. It will be useful to see who distances themselves from each other or fights to defend another. I don't scum read nas though I think brass town or Anthony are my favorite options.

Sure I acknowledge flipping and flopping can be a scum-tell - but it can also be someone trying to step back and objectively look at a situation without bias.

• Anthony's post that everyone seems to have an issue with could equally be a newbie post - I really don't think there is a lot of alignment indications in it (although I recognise my inexperience may be causing me to misread this). My initial scum read on him was purely based on POE (scum on Arthur wagon). If Brass flips green then Anthony will be back in the scum bucket.
  
• I've already explained my reasons for Brass being scum. But if I feel something in my gut when I read something, should I just stay silent on the matter? That doesn't seem particularly pro-town.

Pedit: My plan right now would be we lynch Anthony tomorrow if Brass flips green. If Brass flips red, I suggest we then lynch Nash (which will, based on his current posts, be a 1v1 between him and I).

Flip in and of itself isn't a scum tell. It just felt wierd on the anthony lynch to me is all. Sorry for the shorter posts, I am at work now. I've reas what you said though and have considered. I dont know if you would be the best lynch today.

[Lunatic]

Omg my spelling is so bad right now wtf I look drunk lol

[Lunatic]

I thought herald was on the guy who replaced vos

[Lunatic]

If Anthony hasn't been replaced yet, he's posting in the scum PM.

[Lunatic]

VOTE: Anthony

[Lunatic]

If Anthony hasn't been replaced yet, he's posting in the scum PM.

Mod already replaced him.

Just waiting on confirmation from the replacement

Alright I may join you on Town looter later, but I still really wanna hear from anthony or his replacement

[Lunatic]

If Anthony hasn't been replaced yet, he's posting in the scum PM.

Mod already replaced him.

Just waiting on confirmation from the replacement

Alright I may join you on Town looter later, but I still really wanna hear from anthony or his replacement

That's fine. Usually when I second guess myself is when I play my worse. Sometimes its god awful when I don't second guess myself but re read tls iso and you will see what I mean. He is weird af

I already agree with you homes

[Lunatic]

I will be on V/LA til the 5th. I'll be able to post a small amount from my phone here and there but the post will likely be of bad quality and riddled with spelling errors. I'll stay caught up but probably stick mostly to a few sentences. Ydrasse needs to make a convincing case for himself not to be lynched as he is my top candidate for now. I'm not so convinced town looter is scum except for my gut rubbing me the wrong way about him.

[Lunatic]

i showed up a bit early to work so i have a few moments but scanning his iso i don’t see a soft anywhere in it, maybe i’m blind but i don’t see that. why would i claim tho and narrow down prs.

also i don’t understand the fos on this slot, is it activity + him being hesitant?

Your previous slot (Anthony) claimed he was a cop with a guilty on mikul. We were in the process of questioning him why he chose mikul when he went afk. Can you answer for us?

[Lunatic]

Yeah I think right now ydrasse or quick are rhe best options

[Lunatic]

please do because i don’t really have anything to respond to here other than “yeah that’s scum.”

Here's the thing, we've got a small POE remaining and your in it. Your previous slot was very scummy in his vote dp1. Theres enough there to lynch him already. That and after you replaces I haven't seen anything from you to lessen my read where as I have less inclination to lynch town looter and nas bases on their responses. So it's mostly POE at this point. Also we habe a 50% chance to lynch correctly. The fact that most of the people on your wagon are confirmed town also looks good for the lynch.

[Lunatic]

All that plus we have less than a day left. Your lynch is as good as any, and will narrow the next phase down for us even further.

[Lunatic]

is there really enough based on like, ~10 posts? like, you guys have managed to talk yourselves out of lynching someone who is actually scummy fmpov. the fact that it can be said the poe can go this way without a whole lot of resistance is a sign that mafia is most likely content to take this elimination.

The three people who are confirmed town are the one on your lynch. The fact that you haven't been ly ched yet shows the mafia isn't all that content about your lynch as you haven't been hammered yet.