Newbie 2019 | Game Over!

[SJReaver]

Greetings and salutations!

I just finished my first game and enjoyed it so much that I wanted to jump right into another.

I wanted to share my thoughts and feelings so far. You see, I've skimmed this thread a few times! (Mostly to see the strange bean pictures, but I read things too)

Italian-guy

is town - he is the most towniest person in this thread. Open, engaged, flexible, and spontaneous. It's like watching a puppy-dog play in the snow.

Mini

feels town to me. Slightly town lead. Her expression of confusion early on read as genuine and made sense in terms of the content. Since then, she's warmed up and seemed to be trying more.

Pokey

- Town read. Active scum hunting and trying to prod the group into action. (Why is your avatar judging me? How does it know I drank milk straight from the container?) My problem, however, is that I find them overly competent compared to the rest of the group. They come off as experienced and confident, and people seem to have largely accepted them as townie without the same level of scrutiny others have received.

T-Bone -

Gnnnseefahsadsfnnn. Makes me nervous. Also, the push on Micc is odd. He's said almost nothing, and even if you viewed making a joke during the beginning of the game as suspicious (that's a reach), that's not sufficient evidence. However, it's an easy elimination that will get you no pushback for advocating.

I also found the implied threat to hammer Italian followed by the 'oh, there is no good or bad way to play' a strange swivel in tone. It feels like he was asking you questions you didn't like and you (successfully) shut him down.

Genius Jellyfish

- I had a slight sus about them at first because they didn't get an obvious joke, and then there was the overely long discussion about knowing how other posters think that might have worked as a side-note, but managed to dominate a page or two.

His playstyle is more mechanical than my own, so I don't know to what sense it's a communication style issue. (Italian was also part of that convo, but I read him heavily as town.)

Redos

- Not much yet. They seem to be highly interested in orthopraxy and optimal play. It makes me wary as I think it's easier to high scummy behaviors when you adhere to rigid notions of what should or shouldn't be said/done.

Shellyc

- Apparently a plagiarist? Null read.

Any other players? Micc is the invisible man.

UNVOTE:

While I'm here, enjoy some lava flow.

[SJReaver]

Toss questions my way.

I'll make tea; we'll chat.

[SJReaver]

I'm not too keen to eliminate you.

You could convince me otherwise, of course. Maybe adopt a New Jersey accent, a slicked-back hairstyle, and a fondness for mock executions.

Tell me, why do you think that people are reading you as suspicious? I see you're active.

[SJReaver]

SJReavers, Welcome to the thread.

Am I seriously a plagiarist? are you saying that I demonstrate no thought?

Greetings.

I don't know, and no.

[SJReaver]

@Porkens:

Thank you. I am new at this. You feel townie to me but you also come off as being experienced enough to be able to fake it well. How does a novice scumhunter best tackle that situation?

@Redados:

There's nothing scum-indicative of being put off by someone thinking you are scum. If you are town, you know they're wrong. The first instinct is always to want to push back. If anything, I think mafia are more likely to remain calm and rational because they're more interested in maintianing a facade.

[SJReaver]

I'd have to have decent reads before I could psyche myself out of them.

[SJReaver]

How did you robin tour previous game with reads?

What is a robin tour?

[SJReaver]

I death tunneled the town Jailkeeper, spent a good chunk of the game defending the Mafia goon despite the strongest player being sure she was scum, and only ended up hammering the roleblocker because we had nine hours left in the day and someone had to go.

[SJReaver]

But I'll do better this time, I'm sure!

[SJReaver]

Just some quick questions/comments for some of things from page 16:

@SJReaver: Welcome to our game. Appreciate you replacing in. I love your energy and positivity. You seem very happy to play and that’s always a good thing. I agree with a lot of what you said in your readslist, but my question is this. In 389 you said

Italian-guy is town

. Now while I can appreciate that vote of confidence, how can you be that confident? I’m a little wary of people just completely alignment reading me with no hesitation and with no evidence. I don’t want this to come off as if I’m rude, but I just would like to know if you can elaborate on your confidence in my read.

What sort of elaboration are you looking for?

'Open, engaged, flexible, and spontaneous.' That reads as townie.


Open - You put your thoughts and ideas out there. There is little in the way of hedging or keeping your cards close.
Engaged - You participate in the thread and your conversations are focused around hunting scum.
Flexible - When challenged or questioned, you are adaptive. You are not particularly wedded to any method and seem comfortable switching focus.
Spontaneous - Sometimes your posts are rougher and other times more polished. The lack of consistency suggests someone who isn't paying all that much attention to how they're coming off.

But I'll do better this time, I'm sure!

Why is this?

Why do I think I'll do better in my second game than my first? I assume I'll get better with experience.

Are you no better at the game today than when you started?

[SJReaver]

Whoa!, that wagon became a train. Here I told myself that this would be a slow game.

Let me grab a monster and I'll dive in!

[SJReaver]

Once upon a time, before caffeine and electric lighting, the majority of humans had little choice but to sleep at 1 am and get a good night’s rest. This is why they call it the Dark Ages.

Thankfully, we have progressed as a species and I can spend my night doing what matters: hunting for mafia scum!

But why dnt yall help me? try telling me what u think is the current situation and general impressions on every player

Sunflower-gal: Awesome. The best. Top ten.
Other people: ehh... they're okay.

Welcome to the game. Have a puppy.

Micc expressed scumleans on three people, Porkens, myself, and one of the newbies. He expressed stronger scumreads on both myself and Porkens, but proceeded to wagon a newbie. I reason that the reason he did that, is because he knows it would be a tougher fight to get another SE limmed, rather than a newbie. I reasoned he made that choice, because he is scum and doesn't want to have that fight on Day 1. Otherwise it seemed like it was a toss up between Porkens for I for his strongest scumread, and I think he should have tried to wagon his strongest scumread.

Damnit, I accused you of not having a solid reason for your scumread on Micc and then you spit out something like this. Now to see if you keep up the pressure on word/Micc or switch to an easier target.

Okay, so now you've devolved into...baiting? Please don't, this is a newbie game. I'm requesting that SE to SE, regardless of your alignment, or mine.

What do you mean by baiting here?

I believe you mean that word321 asking you for your opinion on redos and italian. Are you suggesting he’s trying to throw suspicion on one without doing it directly? Or, do you think he’s just fishing for your opinion so he can repeat it and get on your good side?

I'm referring trying to bait an emotional response with taunting. I don't want to be taunted, sure. I also don't want players taunting other players. It's not productive. It's also not very nice.

That also works. Thanks.

U cant fake that kind of reaction as scum; so the bait worked as intended

I find this entire T-Bone/word321 interaction strange.

I read it as T-Bone being blunt and straightforward while word321 claims he’s using some psychological kung-fu that doesn’t make a ton of sense.

It may be because I’m not used to word’s personality, but that comes off as oddly defensive. Combined with him spending his time arguing with T-Bone and not attempting to hunt mafia or give reads, this is making him more suspicious in my mind.

I have more pages to go, so I’ll see how it develops, but I’d like to stick my vote here right now.

VOTE: Word321

[SJReaver]

Okay, finished.

The T-bone and word interaction did not make me comfortable. So far, word has asked a bunch of leading questions and pontificated, but produced no solid reads.

Then a genius wagon springs up, which nicely pulls word's butt out of the fire by shifting focus.

I'm guessing there's one scum on this wagon.

A 3-person bandwagon. I can see how this is a solid vote, so I'm going to place this at E-1. GeniusGamer is my biggest sus as stated before.

Hmm...

[SJReaver]

Accidentally left out Italiano, should be this:
Italiano -> Minimegabyte -> SJReaver -> Porkens -> Hat guy (need to hear more) -> Redados -> T-Bone -> GeniusGamer

shelly, the problem with pretending that you don't remember word's name is that you've never had issues remembering names before.

Even on day one, you typed out red and noob's name as Redados and N0bleNoob. You obviously copy and paste those names. I suspect you did the same for that list above, except for 'hat guy.'

[SJReaver]

Are you trying to say that I look scummy by jumping on this BW, which I have stated that I agree with?

Yep.

Are you trying to say that Town's wincon is not to eliminate scummy people?

Oooh, that defensive reaching.

Pardon while I do my happy dance.

[SJReaver]

If I had copy and pasted, it would be MiniMegabyte, not Minimegabyte.

...I don't know if that's a good point or not.

Oh well, I'm voting for word right now, anyway. Let the smart people figure out if I'm right.

[SJReaver]

"Oooh, that defensive reaching."
What do you mean?
and in 511 why did you discredit yourself and ask SEs to help you out.

It means that's a bizarre take-away from what I said.

I don't think being honest discredits myself. I don't know if you made a good point or not, so I admitted as much.

[SJReaver]

And why don't you think the others that have jumped on the bandwagon like GeniusGamer are suspect?
You have said I'm a "plagiarist" in your opening post and you're still on me. What aspect of my play leaves more to be desired?

I don't think I look like I demonstrate no thought in ISO, and I didn't blindly jump on that bandwagon. I don't understand why you are trying to push me.
I said that he was passive and SR him in post 384 and even way back in post 106.

[SJReaver]

^^ Sorry, still getting used to the software.

I already have most of them as town reads.

My note on you was "

Shellyc

- Apparently a plagiarist? Null read."

My null read hopped on a wagon with a bunch of townreads. I believe it's a scum motivated wagon. I go through your ISO and it seems you forgot word's name despite not forgetting anyone's name before and stuck him right in the middle of your reads.

Ergo, I comment. Continued defensiveness leads to happy dancing.

Also please answer my above posts

I'm trying to consolidate.

[SJReaver]

Townreading too many people is a scum meta imo
Word replaced in a few hours ago, when I made the reads list. It was not a deliberate intention of mine
Why do you think this is a scum motivated wagon when there is evidence from ISO pointing to him being scum?

The majority of people are townies.

When it came up, how fast it came up, and who it came up on.

Also why do you think asking questions and inquiring is "continued defensiveness"?

Oh, don't worry. Your current questions are fine.

I totally think you're mafia and that you and word are partners. I expect others will be along to comment, and they might ask questions of either of us.

[SJReaver]

Where do you even get those pictures?

So you read GeniusGamer as town and concede this may be a mislynch?
I'm not mafia. I know PoE wise I might look bad, but I don't know how you consider me as scummy all of a sudden
For word, I haven't seen him post much, and I'd like to take a closer look at him

If I were mafia, GG would be a safe elim D1. You want to grab those weaker townies during the day and take out the stronger ones at night. That why I found T-Bone's pressure on Micc sus at first. Getting rid of people who are inactive is an easy sell and it doesn't reflect on you when they flip green.

When word popped in, and he began to interact with t-bone, I revaluated. T-bone wasn't going for an easy target. Word's baiting and mind games felt off as a response.

Then, up popped the Genius wagon. Porkens started it. Would Scum!Porkens make a sudden push like that if word was their partner? Yes, actually. I think they're bold enough to do so, but also I think they'd wait a bit. Italiano? He's a strong town read for me and hoping on second strikes me as in character.

That leaves Mini and you. As my null, I decided to look at your ISO, and I found something that struck me as out of character. It looks like a newbie scum attempt to distance themselves from a partner.

[SJReaver]

Italiano, why did you hop on this BW? without any further agreement / disagreement on the vote. There are 2 people on and i'd like to hear his defense before voting

^ 7:33 pm my time

A 3-person bandwagon. I can see how this is a solid vote, so I'm going to place this at E-1. GeniusGamer is my biggest sus as stated before.

^ 7:58 pm. So twenty-five minutes later with no time for him to make a defense.

Hmm…

Can someone else sniff at this and tell me if I’m reaching?

I will totally decide someone is scum and death tunnel them, reading everything they say as suspicious.

[SJReaver]

Let me help, as we're getting down to the wire.

I'm town mason 2. Genius is townie.

[SJReaver]

I've been pushing for word-shelly.

I think italino and porkins are town. I've been trying to figure out how to tackle a scum!Porkens and it gives me a headache.

If we want to talk about correct mason play and how this went down, that's fine, but I spoke up because I felt time was getting wasted. So let's at least look at our suspect list.

[SJReaver]

It's not time wasting. Italiano wanted to know if it was possible for mafia to fakeclaim Masons. That is a valid concern.

It is.

But he was also shooting a bunch of questions about the situation at Genius and I. It takes Genius while to compose his thoughts, and if I start in about what's happened, it could lead to its own discussion.

We have five active townies on right now. We could get someone to e-1 easily right now.

[SJReaver]

I suggest the person we are both voting for!

That's word321, by the way.

[SJReaver]

Here's my readlist:

Town:
SJReaver
GeniusGamer
ItalianoVD

Null:
Porkens
T-Bone
Hat Guy

Scum and/or Confused Townie:
ShellyC
MiniMegabyte

I would prefer to vote for Shelly or Mini today. Mini less likely to be scum than Shelly imo

I am confused on why you and Shelly both call him Hat Guy and have everyone else's name down perfectly. I feel this is something I need to look into because I legit can't remember half this stuff but word321 sticks in my mind.

[SJReaver]

Yeah, it’s as I said before, I only have our previous game together to go off of and she has played similar to last game where she was town, even down to not having really solid leads and “sheeping” others. I believe she is truly still trying to learn the game.

Mini also feels townie to me.

[SJReaver]

I guess his avatar is more memorable than his name.

It's Sunflower Gal, by the way.

[SJReaver]

No, Porkens was saying that they didn't give our their thoughts because no one asked for them in the beginning. They waited to be prompted.

[SJReaver]

I'm more interested in your current thoughts.

You haven't voted, so I assume you're weighing the possibilities. Are you waiting for someone else to respond to events?

[SJReaver]

• MiniMegabyte: As I said earlier, MiniMegabyte wasn’t really advancing the game in most of her posts. She pushed T-Bone for his laser focus on the Micc slot much later in the game. Honestly, I’m currently getting newbie town vibes.

In terms of suspicion, how would you rank the four people on your wagon: Porkens, Italiano, Mini, and Shelly?

[SJReaver]

We might be hitting night 1 soon, and I'm not sure I'll live through it.

If I don't, I enjoyed the brief time I had playing with you guys.

[SJReaver]

In regards to the town mason thing:

- I've been reading this thread for a bit and got my feelings/reactions before I joined. My original write up had GG as the main suspect and I was likely to vote him to see how he handled the pressure.
- The lack of interactions between Town Masons makes more sense when you see the Mason thread, because GG was attempting to constantly prod noob for thoughts and conversation, but was left dangling for most of the game.
- when I hopped into the thread, GG was at zero votes, and most people read me as having a town vibe. I was more interested in interacting with people who I was unsure of and didn't want to buddy up with him too quickly.

I was not prepared to log in and find him on the choping block.

Eh, since there is no claim to be had I can wait a bit.

VOTE: unvote

Let’s squeeze reactions out as much as we can.

Awww, you'd miss me.

[SJReaver]

VOTE: Shelly
im ok tackling copycat
id rather go there than on my own slot, thats for sure
and there is a small detail, but hers was the only slot that didnt immediatly vote on gg
ill try to review later the wagon on genius on detail to see how it rly went
today im kind of busy, so ill be brief
if u have some questions, ill try to answer em if i see em

If this is mafia-play, I can respect it.

If Shelly is red and you are red, she's probably past the point you could help her. Voting against her gives you a talking point in your favor tomorrow. And who knows, you might be able to turn it around.

If Shelly is green and you are red, a miseliminate causes people to reevaluate the proceedings and gives you one last townie to deal with. Voting yourself also means that the actual second mafia member isn't in the line of fire when people review the vote count.

"and there is a small detail, but hers was the only slot that didnt immediatly vote on gg"

I'm worried that GeniusGamer is ropebait. In Town of Salem, I was almost always eliminated early, no matter what side I was on, and it sucks.

If anyone is up to it, maybe give GG some tips on how to feel more townie?

[SJReaver]

We're at E-1! I feel like with time zones we should hopefully see a response from Shelly within the next ten hours or so.

We should!

Shelly, if you're reading this, I want you to know it's all good. I did a happy dance when I thought I'd uncovered your scumminess, but that's just because I get excited about these things.

Being redteam is hard. It can be stressful and unfun to feel like you have to examine everything you say or people are going to attack you. But being caught doesn't mean you're a bad player. You have seven people combing through everything you say over a week: it is not easy to make it through that.

Think of it as a trial by fire. It rough but it makes you a better player in the long run.

[SJReaver]

What does ropebait mean?

Passive:

A person who comes off as suspicious whatever their alignment and who tends to be mis-eliminated on a frequent basis.

Active:

A townie being set-up by mafia for a mis-elimination.

It seems to be a combination of personality, playstyle, or culture acclimation.

[SJReaver]

I'm vanilla town. I'm just a town, on the verge of a mislynch.
Why is this game so unforgiving to newbies? I don't see why I'm locked scum by everyone.
SJR and Genius are town. Italiano is town-read by locked town.
Also I know that fakeclaim is impossible. Sorry I just realised SJR was the second mason.
I think word is like so much scummier here. Porkens I could see him as scum but not as much

In my last game, I ended up at E-1 with a declared intent to hammer as well. It was my first game and it felt awful. Even when you're innocent, it stresses you out. All these people you've been trying to help and work with, and now it feels like they're turning against you.

But being miseliminated is not losing the game.

Go through the last couple of pages. Tell us what you think about people's posting. Is there anyone you want us to reconsider in light of this push? And don't just look at your wagon. What about people who aren't voting on you?

[SJReaver]

Intent to hammer on ShellyC

I'll give it another hour or so in case anyone wants to give parting thoughts.

[SJReaver]

I think that I would be happy on the ShellyC or Word321 wagon today.

Shelly's respond wasn't super motivating in regards to getting me to unvote. That was a bummer. However, based on what Word said regarding his activity today, I don't think we'll get any posts from him that proves his townie-ness to me, either.

I am keeping my vote on Shelly for now.

If we're correct, I can appreciate how their position is super unmotivating.

If we're incorrect... I guess we'll learn soon.

[SJReaver]

On word: t-bone, SJR, shellyc, Redados

On Shelly: Italian, Genius, Porkens

[SJReaver]

Sorry, Porkens unvoted. word is the last one on shelly

[SJReaver]

Can someone please hammer word already?

And it was a joke, Italiano.

[SJReaver]

You guys didn't kill shelly? I told you she was mafia.

I POSTED A DANCING GIF.

[SJReaver]

And you killed Mini. You are monsters. How could you kill the sweet koala?

[SJReaver]

Shelly, shelly... that was some pro scumplay. You dunked this town so hard Nike wants you to sell their sneakers.

[SJReaver]

Either way, how did u arrive at the conclusion that T-Bona simply decided to bus me/micc?

Ego.

"The super SE is doing a super SE play and I'm going to out-think it!" feels better than "I've miseliminated all my teammates because I've been tricked by a scum playing their first game."

[SJReaver]

My favorite part of the thread was:
"*shivers*"

hmm, I wonder if I failed to be persuasive enough. I knew I was going to die that night and sort of trusted that town would sort things out. Maybe I should have pushed harder? idk

[SJReaver]

My bad! One word and I didn't even get it straight.

We got you to E-1. You handled my death tunnel and being in the spotlight well.

The one post that stands out to me is the one about how hard it is to be a newbie and how this was your first game. I think it works so well because it's true: we've all been there. If you read the thread closely, you can see the point where Italianos brain goes 'protecc!'

I was happy enough to grab 'hat guy,' however. Little did I know who the true mastermind was.