Open 789: Two-Fold 2d3 [Game Over]

[Umlaut]

vote: testarossa

Been a while

Solid case, I will 100% sheep this.

VOTE: Testarossa

[Umlaut]

Stream-of-consciousness from the first couple pages:

Dann, why’d you change your vote to haven?

It's very small but I didn't like how she switched her vote from you to Umlaut. You had two votes on you at the time and RVS voting you would have built a sizable wagon. I wonder if maybe she was scared off by being the third vote on a (let's say town for now) wagon and decided to switch her vote to someone with no votes yet. Also, the "for sheeping" reasoning is kinda strange considering she had just sheeped people on the Menalque vote.

It's possible this didn't cross Haven's mind at all and I read far too much into it, but it was mildly scummier than I thought Dunnstral was.

Why'd you put Marashu at the bottom of your preliminary reads list?

This seems like a stretch honestly, like idk why haven would as either alignment be worried about a 3 vote wagon on means I don’t think that would be a “sizeable” wagon anyway?

Like I feel like you’re reading into this a lot. You’re also saying you think Dunn was legit scummy for that opening?

And teacher is exactly right, it was a joke about Marashu having rolled scum a frankly silly number of times for how many games he’s had

I don't think there's anything wrong with "reading into this a lot" on page 2, reads have to start somewhere. Do you disagree, Menalque?

It is absolutely a very stretchy reach. But I'd rather base a vote 2 pages in on a stretchy reach than nothing.

And yes, I think Dunn's posts so far this game have been marginally more scummy than anything else I've read. Which is like... a few percentage points. I don't think he's "scummy," it's just scummier than other posts by comparison of almost every post being NAI.

Oh good, Dannflor said the same thing. Town lean here, though weak because multiball.

Talk to me about dunny then? Bc I don’t really think anyone has done much AI yet apart from hiraki who I think is scum for meta reasons

Explain this (the read on Hiraki)?

[case redacted to avoid the wrath of the mod]

Oh, you did explain it. Good!

I really hate hanging reads on that kind of thing but I guess no one can help drawing conclusions from the evidence, so fair enough.

I think I’ve just moved away from this in my own approach and like to just solidly meme normally until my reads start firming up as people start pushing etc, and I think I’m trying to avoid being reachy myself as I’ve come to terms with the fact that my reads are like, not great

Somehow this seems really town (probably because I've been in a bunch of games with Menalque recently and this meta-progression makes sense)

Also I find Menalque absolutely demanding that Hiraki tell him why he's scum to be kind of town-indicative, I feel like scum would mostly want to ask once and let it die or just ignore it altogether.

ITT salt about being caught for the wrong reason.

Don't totally get this. What's the wrong reason in this case and what's wrong about it?

i've been on this site for 10 years and some lazy poster thinks that i've figured out the game on page 5? really?

...

i've been on this site for 10 years and this lazy poster doesn't think i know how to backdown with poise?

Seeing the old "if I were scum you would never catch me because I'm so fucking good" chestnut just makes me want to exile you.

At this point I’d like to hear from dunn, A50, and umlaut

Well now you've heard from me.

[Umlaut]

VOTE: Hiraki

I don't actually think much of the meta argument given but his stance toward Menalque has just been terrible.

[Umlaut]

in fact, i quite literally said the opposite, i don't even know how you get that interpretation unless you think that me saying "i don't know how to backdown with poise" is me saying i'm too good as scum

Wait, are you seriously claiming that when you wrote

i've been on this site for 10 years and this lazy poster doesn't think i know how to backdown with poise?

this was not a rhetorical way of saying "of course I can back down with poise due to my experience," you were literally saying that in fact you cannot do that?

[Umlaut]

Oh never mind, I reread what you said after, what you're claiming is not that you weren't asserting your level of skill but that the skill you're asserting is just "not a complete dufus" rather than "so fucking good"

I don't really think that makes it any better, to be honest.

[Umlaut]

Noticed you answered this:

In post 149, dramonic wrote:
ITT salt about being caught for the wrong reason.


Don't totally get this. What's the wrong reason in this case and what's wrong about it?

I mean the entirety of TH's iso has been scummy, but it's an expression, not a specific reason.
Like being a bp sk, playing a perfect game and then scum trying to shoot you and claiming it pre-lynch of their final member.

Granted we're very far from a perfect game

I know the expression, but it's a weirdly specific thing to say if there's not

a specific reason

that you think someone was "caught" on that was wrong. Also I didn't even realize you were talking about TH here, and in that case I don't even see the salt you're talking about.

[Umlaut]

Okay I think I’m at like

Dann, teacher - town
Umlaut, haven
Testa - townlean
Dunn - basically null but marginally above the other two
Gypx, A50 - null
Crush - true null
Dram - scummy
Hikari - scum

Can you explain the Dram read? I agree he's being

weird

but I don't see the scum angle.

[Umlaut]

Okay I think I’m at like

Dann, teacher - town
Umlaut, haven
Testa - townlean
Dunn - basically null but marginally above the other two
Gypx, A50 - null
Crush - true null
Dram - scummy
Hikari - scum

Can you explain the Dram read? I agree he's being

weird

but I don't see the scum angle.

I'm voting his scumbuddy

Sigh

Unless your name is Menalque I'm not interested in your explanation of Menalque's read.

[Umlaut]

What is it with people this game and asking for something to sheep?

"asking people for their thoughts" ≠ "asking for something to sheep"

Are you always like this?

[Umlaut]

Dram's case on TripleHaven is not exactly selling me.

Teacher is looking pretty town to me with what appears to be a genuine effort to understand and explain Dram's perspective.

Umlaut, what’s your read on dram?

Null I guess. Maybe slightly town because I don't expect scum to act in such an attention-getting manner and then double and triple down on it when it gets them heat.

Though my sense of paranoia just said "Dram's continued pushes here on Menalque are

so

absurdly uncharitable that I wonder if this is pre-planned distancing/busing" but I haven't actually run that through a sanity check yet, I just thought of it while I was writing this answer to your question.

Okay I'll keep reading now

[Umlaut]

Dram i wanna conclude that your bad case on me is just towny bad but the lack of anything else towny in your ISO is making me doubt that

This is kind of where I am on Dram too, I want to say scum would probably not make such audaciously terrible cases and insist on them against all logic but at some point I really need him to do something that's positive-towny and not just towny-for-lack-of-scum-motivation.

[Umlaut]

Actually I have to agree TH's recent posts are kind of bad, almost any explanation for that vote is better than "it was a joke" and then retracting it. 433 doesn't really look like a joke, particularly given he further argued the point in 436.

I don't even care if someone wants to vote A50 for not expressing his reads, I think a lot of players (including A50 here) are a lot more precious about their reads than is warranted and so I can't really scumread that in itself but I can see how someone would. But the double-down-only-to-backpedal here is quite awkward.

[Umlaut]

Ugh I shouldn't have signed up for another game, I thought I'd be more engaged this time but I'm just endlessly playing catchup

(Which I am about to do now)

2 + 2 = 4 - 1 = 3

On a completely unrelated note, I hate the way this is written.

[Umlaut]

Hi Gamma!

[Umlaut]

The only game she played on MS previously she was town. I noticed both Umlaut and Menalque were in it, and now I am even more confused because one (Menalque) is defending her and the other (obviously Umlaut) says she looks bad. Do I really need to read that game in details? (Hint: I am NOT going to, so settle it out between the two of you and return a decision ASAP if you please)

It's almost like Menalque and I can have differing opinions about something?

Like, what do you find confusing about this?

[Umlaut]

Hey all, sorry for dropping out of the game, I just couldn't keep up and ended up feeling too disconnected from it to really engage. Looks like the WW team was just screwed by bad luck but I'm glad Bell seems to have done good things with my slot at least.