Mini Normal 2168 | So Many Bats! | Game Over!

[Mundivore]

VOTE: Odd Day Jester

clown detected

activating anti-clown measures

[Mundivore]

I have an extreme bias towards not eliminating fun slots.

I have an extreme bias towards eliminating clowns. Surely, you can be brought to the side of reason. Consider this: clowns wear face-paint. Face-paint masks your identity. Hiding your identity? Scummy. Destroy the clown, or you will surely perish to it.

First game here in a while. Im interested to see how site meta has changed, what the players are like now, how I hold up as a player, etc

Please do me a favor and outline your typical playstyle with these questions:

Intuitive, or analytical?
Independent, or Collaborative?
Aggressive, or Passive?

I will respond to my own questions once I get some responses to the survey. As this is my first post I would also like to say good luck to you all! Hopefully this will be a good game!

You probably won't get the returns you want from this. In a game of social deception, even the townies have motivations to be insincere.

[Mundivore]

I'm clownreading shelly. This super aggressive behavior seems detrimental to her no matter her alignment.

And I think you all know what I think about clowns.

VOTE: shellyc

[Mundivore]

I'm clownreading shelly. This super aggressive behavior seems detrimental to her no matter her alignment.

And I think you all know what I think about clowns.

INTERESTING, tasty, very tasty

opportunistic wagoning, -2 townpoints

Stuff doesn't happen if people don't get voted for.

mudivore reads?

it's not as detrimental as you may think

I don't like readlists either. If someone wants to know what I think of someone, they can ask. Otherwise, posting readlists feels like it gives scum more ammunition than anyone else. Scum like to kill people who townies think are town. Scum like to mislim people who townies think are scum. And the list itself is non-content, something scum can create and share to appear as if they are contributing to the discussion while really only reacting to it in a way that is favorable to them.

[Mundivore]

I'm headed to bed. I'm only happy I was able to catch up with this monster thread first. I have seventeen MafiaScum emails in a row with the exact same subject thanks to you nerds.

[Mundivore]

@Noraa ask for royalties, too

[Mundivore]

And I think you all know what I think about clowns.

What if i told you the character in my avi is called Clownpiece.

VOTE: NorweiganboyEE

that whole innocent child thing has to be the most awkward thing i have read in a while

Holy moly, agreed. Although I can kinda feel JV's response to it, b/c they were the mod of Doggos. That game shows for sure that crazy aggressive Day 1 play is well within shelly's playbook lmao.

***

Anyway, this is a super high volume thread. I play this game for a hobby, not a living, though, so I can't promise I'll output to all y'all's standards. I'm doing my best to stay caught up, though.

In all seriousness, my urge to lim shelly is still there, but I worry it comes close to lim on policy more than anything else. Her play is so ridiculously aggressive that it feels like it could easily mislead the town. Not to mention, her SR'ing of anyone who looks at her funny is distracting, even though my gut tells me she's town this game.

[Mundivore]

And I think you all know what I think about clowns.

What if i told you the character in my avi is called Clownpiece.

VOTE: NorweiganboyEE

that whole innocent child thing has to be the most awkward thing i have read in a while

Holy moly, agreed. Although I can kinda feel JV's response to it, b/c they were the mod of Doggos. That game shows for sure that crazy aggressive Day 1 play is well within shelly's playbook lmao.

***

Anyway, this is a super high volume thread. I play this game for a hobby, not a living, though, so I can't promise I'll output to all y'all's standards. I'm doing my best to stay caught up, though.

In all seriousness, my urge to lim shelly is still there, but I worry it comes close to lim on policy more than anything else. Her play is so ridiculously aggressive that it feels like it could easily mislead the town. Not to mention, her SR'ing of anyone who looks at her funny is distracting, even though my gut tells me she's town this game.

wasn't the innocent child thing directed at me? -________-

JV did initiate it, but someone commented on how JV's reaction felt weird and overacted. I was saying that their response is fairly understandable to me.

IDK, I feel like it was pretty clear throughout that exchange that you were both joking. It was just... really odd.

[Mundivore]

I am inno child and everyone who fights against me will be sentenced to death

could someone confirm this?

shelly plays mafia with the same mentality as a wingsuit diver. She just yeets herself off a cliff-face and hopes not to be dashed against any rocks.

And I think you all know what I think about clowns.

What if i told you the character in my avi is called Clownpiece.

VOTE: NorweiganboyEE

that whole innocent child thing has to be the most awkward thing i have read in a while

Holy moly, agreed. Although I can kinda feel JV's response to it, b/c they were the mod of Doggos. That game shows for sure that crazy aggressive Day 1 play is well within shelly's playbook lmao.

***

Anyway, this is a super high volume thread. I play this game for a hobby, not a living, though, so I can't promise I'll output to all y'all's standards. I'm doing my best to stay caught up, though.

In all seriousness, my urge to lim shelly is still there, but I worry it comes close to lim on policy more than anything else. Her play is so ridiculously aggressive that it feels like it could easily mislead the town. Not to mention, her SR'ing of anyone who looks at her funny is distracting, even though my gut tells me she's town this game.

this post concerns me. remind me maybe to read this entire iso?

You won't have much to read. I still haven't exited RVS mentality... this is a very hectic game, and I tend to keep my reads to myself until I find them useful.

What vast experience do u have playing with me

That read like sarcasm IMO.

[Mundivore]

In all seriousness, my urge to lim shelly is still there, but I worry it comes close to lim on policy more than anything else. Her play is so ridiculously aggressive that it feels like it could easily mislead the town. Not to mention, her SR'ing of anyone who looks at her funny is distracting, even though my gut tells me she's town this game.

Can you articulate on why your gut is saying she's town? Acknowledging that aggressiveness and unpredictability for her is at best NAI, and at worst scum-indicative, why?

Also, this is a personal request, but I would love to see a clown readslist from you. Nothing to do with alignments, just a tiered list ordering people from CLOWN to

not really a clown

. I'm gunning for top clown, so give me some tips if you have them.

I feel like scum!shelly would have tunneled harder, and been more opportunistic with joining new wagons rather than roaming around and shifting vote moderately frequently. I think one of the reasons that shelly scumreads joining wagons so heavily is because she loves to do it as scum.

***

Here are my clownreads:

Bugspray, Tayl0r, and Saudade —

clownn't

Bugspray didn't tolerate early clowning out of Jester, Tayl0r seems nice and level-headed, Saudade has been nice and reserved.

Noraa, Redados —

clown-lean

These two have been in two other games with me. Clowns follow me everywhere. What am I to expect when I see them, lurking after me among the throngs of plastered faces and colorful wigs? Surely, if they are not clowns, they are being influenced by them. I can only pray they will find their way to freedom from the circus—it is too late for me to safely save them.

Jester —

CLOWN

Self-voted day 1, like a buffoon. Has a Joker profile picture. When I hear him around the corner, I hear him first by the

slap-slap-slap

of his comically oversized shoes. Ocassionally, I must suppress a chuckle in his presence. I must not laugh. It is how they spread.

NorweiganboyEE —

CLOWN

Has clown-claimed. Even if he was lying, such goonery as a fakeclaim is an act of clownery in its own right. A recent clown, perhaps—we must destroy him before his power grows.

Shellyc —

CLOWN

Would absolutely start a fight for no reason other than to win it. There is a dark, sinful fire in her eyes. This is not a typical clown, not patient, manipulative, nor insidious. No, instead she is an old clown, a clown which has gone mad from the endless immortal hours that a clown inevitably endures. A clown who remembers older, darker, deeper gods. Who would spill blood to see it spilt, to feed the earth, to forestall cleansing apocalypse. I fear this clown, but she does not fear me.

[Mundivore]

Every time you fluffpost, Noraa, an angel loses its wings and falls down to Earth to become a giraffe. Are you really okay with that?

I always thought giraffes had a few too many eyes to be from around here.

2. Mundivore - I like

his

their

clown gimmick, which ironically makes

hi

the

m pretty clowny himself. Hasn't done a whole lot content-wise, but wanting to policy elim shelly while admitting

his

their

gut says she's town is slight +town for

hi

the

m, given

his

their

following reasons in 899 are okay.

If you gaze into the clown, it gazes back into you. I fear it is already too late for me.

[Mundivore]

u missed "himself"

My pedantry has failed me. I cannot succeed at this game.

[Mundivore]

Hrm. I'm tired of all the fluff.

It feels like there hasn't been any really consequential scumhunting at all in these entire forty-two pages. Nobody has made behavior with actual

stakes

. I don't know if I can confidently eliminate even a single pair of scumbuddies with any degree of confidence.

Things won't happen unless town starts voting for people. I've been part of the problem, but it's easy enough to fix.

VOTE: Saudade to E-2.

I actually don't like this wagon. I like Saudade for town. However, either this entices scum out to put more votes on people, or I get shown a more compelling wagon, right? But somebody really needs to start taking risks for us to actually

learn

things.

[Mundivore]

Nobody has made behavior with actual stakes.

Oh were my baits not useful enough? Were my Grendel and Jackson and Noraa reads not strong enough?

Nope.

[Mundivore]

It feels like there hasn't been any really consequential scumhunting at all in these entire forty-two pages. Nobody has made behavior with actual stakes. I don't know if I can confidently eliminate even a single pair of scumbuddies with any degree of confidence.

Seriously? What about Jacko/I pushing shelly, or shelly pushing Grendel/Jacko? You have nothing for associations despite all that?

Simply put, without any real stakes for those events, I can't confidently say their scum play would deviate in any way from their town play. People react primarily to incentives. I don't think there have been any plausible consequences for any single person in this game so far.

The one possible exception is shelly's fake IC reveal, but that's only true since shelly didn't make it as obviously a joke as it was. But that's not helpful either, since town or scum would react to an IC reveal in the exact same way there, so we don't get any real information about JV from it. We are still quintessentially in RVS.

Honestly, I think this Saudade wagon carries at least one or two scum on it. I think that if I had more time, I'd go over the wagon and really look at people's reasons for voting onto it. But in the mean time, we need to accelerate the pace of voting and making meaningful decisions in this game. Nonsense decisions don't yield information. Nonsense plays don't yield information. Town and scum play quite similarly so long as we expect that they're playing well. Scum players have an incentive to look like town, so that they aren't elimm'd. Town PRs have an incentive to look slightly scummy, so that they aren't NK'd. Vanilla townies have an incentive to look like Town PR's so that they get NK'd instead of the PRs, which means they have an incentive to look slightly scummy as well. Playing towards the 'middle' of the block is a conveniently viable strategy for all players.

However, there are plays which can be made which have fundamentally different consequences for scum than they do for town. Analyzing how people react to these plays are the only way to get actually concrete information about the game state.

—The later votes on a wagon. (Reason: scum know the outcome of the wagon. The only way scum wins is by creating enough mislims. Scum are more likely to turn a wagon on a townie into a viable wagon.)

—Shifting off of a heavy wagon. (Reason: scum know the outcome of the wagon. The only way scum wins is by creating enough mislims. Scum are more likely to find reasons to abandon a scum wagon.)

—Heavily pushing a viable wagon. (Reason: scum know the outcome of the wagon. The only way scum wins is by creating enough mislims. Scum will not heavily push the wagon of scum and are more likely to heavily push a town wagon.)

—Hammering or declaring intent to hammer. (Reason: scum know the outcome of the final vote. The only way scum wins is by creating enough mislims. Scum may be willing to hammer a townie for weaker reasons. Scum are generally unwilling to hammer scum unless the town is already resolved in their target, in which case they'd quite like to hammer scum.)

—Claims. (Reason: scum are likely to claim a PR to survive the day, but unlikely to get NK'd in retribution. Scum may claim a PR that is very unlikely to appear in conjunction with an existing town PR, in which case a CC can secure a 1-for-1 trade at worst which is very town favorable on average.)

In order to run into any of these plays, it is essentially a requirement that there must be a player who could plausibly be elimmed. I don't like the Saudade wagon but we aren't going to learn anything about the game state with all the wagons hovering around E-3 or worse. To advance the game state to a point where we can actually get concrete information from the role reveals on elim and at night phase, we need to be making sure that the wagons are non-trivial.

[Mundivore]

Nitpicking people's mannerisms and speech, poking at the early votes on a wagon, I think these things are pretty inconsequential at the start of a thirteen player game. I've seen scum caught out because of it, but the real reason that it's pro-town is because it creates viable wagons. It feels like there are pages and pages of people pick-pick-picking at each other without actually trying to vote someone off. We don't progress the game without stakes.

[Mundivore]

I mean, I just turned Saudade's wagon into a much more viable wagon. By my own reasoning, a Saudade town flip (at

any

point in the game, even if we leave this wagon for a better one) should make me appear more scummy, and a Saudade scum flip should make me appear more town.

I'm aware of the fact that my vote looks more scummy than not. As I said, playing towards the middle is a fine strategy. The point is, I'm making a play that has consequences. Votes, and the ways people react to votes, and the ways people react

with

votes, are the only thing that have consequences and therefore any concrete long-term meaning in this game. If you're serious about your doubt of me, vote for me. Things need to

happen.

Otherwise, town will keep floundering until we run out of time and we're forced to elim the person with the most votes on them just so that we don't give scum an extra kill.

[Mundivore]

Hrm. I'm tired of all the fluff.

It feels like there hasn't been any really consequential scumhunting at all in these entire forty-two pages. Nobody has made behavior with actual

stakes

. I don't know if I can confidently eliminate even a single pair of scumbuddies with any degree of confidence.

Things won't happen unless town starts voting for people. I've been part of the problem, but it's easy enough to fix.

VOTE: Saudade to E-2.

I actually don't like this wagon. I like Saudade for town. However, either this entices scum out to put more votes on people, or I get shown a more compelling wagon, right? But somebody really needs to start taking risks for us to actually

learn

things.

you have no scumreads?

I have scumreads. But they're so weak that they're mostly meaningless. The only concretely scummy things that've been done this entire game are Jester's self-voting and me voting against my own interests. In a thread this bloated, it's so tremendously hard for things to be scummy without genuine consequences attached. Voting is the sole engine which drives this game. Until there is more voting, we don't get information.

Hrm. I'm tired of all the fluff.

It feels like there hasn't been any really consequential scumhunting at all in these entire forty-two pages. Nobody has made behavior with actual

stakes

. I don't know if I can confidently eliminate even a single pair of scumbuddies with any degree of confidence.

Things won't happen unless town starts voting for people. I've been part of the problem, but it's easy enough to fix.

VOTE: Saudade to E-2.

I actually don't like this wagon. I like Saudade for town. However, either this entices scum out to put more votes on people, or I get shown a more compelling wagon, right? But somebody really needs to start taking risks for us to actually

learn

things.

why do you like saudade for town?

If I'm going to be honest? It's simply because I don't understand the cases against them, and because nothing they've said pinged my scum radar. I've not gotten a gut 'ping' against them, and with the amount of output this thread is creating, keeping up with it is all I can do. Rereads are prohibitive with how long this thread is. If you still feel like your case is strong, and can succinctly summarize it or easily reach a link back to the primary context, I'd appreciate it.

Hrm. I'm tired of all the fluff.

It feels like there hasn't been any really consequential scumhunting at all in these entire forty-two pages. Nobody has made behavior with actual

stakes

. I don't know if I can confidently eliminate even a single pair of scumbuddies with any degree of confidence.

Things won't happen unless town starts voting for people. I've been part of the problem, but it's easy enough to fix.

VOTE: Saudade to E-2.

I actually don't like this wagon. I like Saudade for town. However, either this entices scum out to put more votes on people, or I get shown a more compelling wagon, right? But somebody really needs to start taking risks for us to actually

learn

things.

The motivation and frustration with game state is good but the vote is not. Why vote against vla player you town lean and not support small time but existing Redados wagon? Competing wagons should in theory create a higher information game state than one dominant wagon and a bunch of isolated votes.

The redados wagon, I'm interested in, actually. In fact, VOTE: Redados to E-3. I think it's just Red's "resting pocket face" that experienced when he was VT in Doggos, but I still want to see more activity out of him.

I just wanted votes on the biggest wagon, partially because questionable play might keep me alive versus NKs, and partially to cause things like the below to happen:

a vote count would be great.

that said afaik the jester wagon is not really viable, and now that ive slept i do think redados probably has more scum equity than jester, so

VOTE: redados

still willing to go saudade, but not until saudade is in the thread and posting.

Tayl0r Swift is now a likely scumbuddy if saudade flips scum (supports the competing wagon). Tayl0r Swift is essentially confirmed town if Redados flips scum.

I'm not going to claim that my prodding alone caused Tayl0r to vote, but I'd like to think it was an influence.

***

I plan to move to Redados wagon unless somebody on saudade wagon gives me good reason to stay.

[Mundivore]

VOTE: shellyc

I have an operating theory that opportunistic wagoning is one of shelly's scumtells. The source of this theory is that when other people do it, she calls them scummy.

The fact that she applied her vote to the Redados wagon to make it 'actually useful' without much additional reasoning and didn't do the same on the saudade wagon smells off to me.

[Mundivore]

red = redados' scumteam

[4] Redados:

UNOwen

,

Noraa

, Tayl0r Swift, shellyc
[4] Saudade: MiniMegabyte, NorwegianboyEE, duppin, JacksonVirgo
[2] shellyc: Odd Day Jester,

Mundivore

[1] Noraa: bugspray
[1] MiniMegabyte: Saudade
[1] UNOwen: Redados

so you think scum haven't bussed each other at all

I mean, tbh scum have no incentive to bus each other in RVS. The average player will

not

interact with a lot more players than they

do

interact with so it's not particularly a scumtell to avoid voting for a couple of different people. And getting scum taken out in RVS is really, really shitty, no need to make it any more likely.

[Mundivore]

hey sorry, I've been feeling off for a while, haven't checked the thread in a couple of days. Catching up now.

[Mundivore]

WELCOME DAVE

oh as for my own read on Saudade I said early on why I thought he was slightly suspicious earlier, generally it comes to me getting the impression that he was just trying to be heard and make sure he had a presence without actually attempting to game solve. My initial plan was to just give him some time and wait for him to do something. he and a couple of other players talked about him having good reads and I have to admit I thought it was a bit odd how he kept talking about his own good reads while also saying he had no real reads yet since it is early on in the game. Don't get me wrong it obviously makes sense for him to not have good reads yet and it is definitely not fair for me to call him out for that, but i think you will agree that it is harder to fake good reads as scum which was why I wanted to give him some more time to see if he would come with these so called "god reads", but then a little later norwee decided to vote on him which I did not expect, but I decided to join the wagon since I thought it would be interesting to see what would happen. Unfortunately he had to deal with some real life stuff which made the push rather lackluster in my opinion

Something feels off to me about this...

oh as for my own read on Saudade I said early on why I thought he was slightly suspicious earlier, generally it comes to me getting the impression that he was just trying to be heard and make sure he had a presence without actually attempting to game solve. My initial plan was to just give him some time and wait for him to do something. he and a couple of other players talked about him having good reads and I have to admit I thought it was a bit odd how he kept talking about his own good reads while also saying he had no real reads yet since it is early on in the game. Don't get me wrong it obviously makes sense for him to not have good reads yet and it is definitely not fair for me to call him out for that, but i think you will agree that it is harder to fake good reads as scum which was why I wanted to give him some more time to see if he would come with these so called "god reads", but then a little later norwee decided to vote on him which I did not expect, but I decided to join the wagon since I thought it would be interesting to see what would happen. Unfortunately he had to deal with some real life stuff which made the push rather lackluster in my opinion

Why is this post so weird? It sounds defensive and unnatural explaining his own logic/thought process at the time. Maybe it's just the wording that's pinging me.

Oh hey, I wasn't the only one who noticed.

noraa I feel like I can't win with you.

scum slip. No shit scum!redados can't win with me. I'm SRing u so hard.

As I said when I gave my reads before he hasn't really done much to change my mind. No matter what his alignment is I believe he is too caught up on Noora's push on him.
What I will say though is that I am actually a bit surprised with his latest posts as I did not expect him to defend me. If he is scum it seems more logical for him to at least try to discredit me a little bit since I called him scummy.

My current limpool is {noraa, unowen, mundivore, shelly} although I'll probably have to widen that to avoid a mislim of course.

Where is bugspray?

Where is mundivore?? Mundivore has done very little hunting today and has stayed mostly under the radar. VOTE: Mundivore

wtf? Why are u voting a really inactive slot now?
VOTE: Redados
ur so scummy its unbelievable

Why do you think that's a scummy thing to do?

Lurkers/less active players are easy to get mislims on

I mean, she's right... but I don't know how AI this is because the case is so weak. This is more like 'player-prod' than anything else, which I'd call about 51% town-leaning.

[Mundivore]

@bugspray part of the reason I have fewer posts than you is that I tend to react to or say multiple things in the same post. I don't like being very spammy. I fewer large posts to many small posts, though I'll still spam a bit if things come to me after reading them.

Something feels very offputting about duppin to me right now. Think shellyc is town this game, although I'm surprised she ignored my vote on her, that seems pretty OOC. I have my reservations but... she's not as scummy as one of the players she pressuring, Redados. Red feels like a weak scum case, though, and I think I have something better.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: duppin

This is my first fairly confident scumread, so far. I don't have a ton of time today, but I'm going to be composing my scumcase where I have time/energy for it. The summary of my case is: duppin is playing

defensively

but not

cautiously.

Usually, when a townie is defensive, it's because they don't want to be mislim'd. If 'avoiding mislims' rather than 'finding good elims' is their mindset for their towngame, then that generally implies an overall cautious playstyle.

But duppin is fairly confident in his reads and his play in general. He's playing like the primary focus he has is finding good elims. I don't get the 'cautious' vibe from him, just 'defensive.' Which pings pretty hard scum to me, because it's a mismatch in demonstrated priorities. Player who prefer a 'finding good elims' mindset tend not to worry about being proactively defensive, because it reduces the chance they'll get NK'd and takes up time that could be used to find a better elim. Meanwhile, duppin feels like he's occupied with remaining in a town-read slot, despite appearing to prioritize elimming people rather than not miselimming people.

I'm about 90% confident on this read. We'll see if actually going through his ISO convinces me further or dissuades me.

[Mundivore]

Mundivore, what does OOC mean
I feel like your case is legit, but can you actually 1) quote things and 2) elaborate why people cant have a “finding good eliminations” + “don’t get eliminated myself” mindset. it’s possible imo

OOC = Out Of Character. It's not what I expected you to do.

1) That's what the scumcase is for. I'm going through his ISO to build it. Expect a very large post and then either more or less confidence from me on my read depending on how that turns out by... eh, I dunno. Before the end of today, I hope. I've got a separate tab open, and I'm working on it there.

2) It's certainly possible. But in practice, every time I've seen someone who prioritizes finding good elims, they tend to rely on the activity of their own scumhunting to provide their townie cover, rather than try to retroactively maintain their own towniness. They think their scumhunting will speak for itself, because it's in good faith and hence self-exonerating. The main reason to defend yourself while actively scumhunting is if you don't think it'll be a valid tool to defend yourself with later. Which belies either very low confidence in the quality of their scumhunting (which is normally associated with a player who seeks primarily to avoid miselims—people with low confidence in their scumhunting also usually don't do too much of it) or alternatively reveals that the scumhunting is done in bad faith. I.E., that they're scum.

I think that if there's a problem with my case, it's that I'm over-reading duppin's defensiveness. Hence, my ISO-dive to verify my suspicions, and conglomerate some evidence.

[Mundivore]

I think it's most interesting if I only use the meta of people who I personally have played with. I know that it's suboptimal play, but reading extra games sounds rancid. Besides, doing it this way gives me an incentive to play more games and get to know people.

[Mundivore]

Mundivore, what do you think of PLUSjoyed?

I TR'd JV, and I don't see any reason to change my read on the slot yet.

[Mundivore]

oh mundivore is here, i would really like you to go more in depth with your read on me. you claimed you were 90% confident that I was scum (whats up with the 90% reads this game?), yet you also seemed to imply you were unsure and would have to ISO me, so I would like to know where you are at now?

While I still feel like you're my most concrete scumread thus far, my confidence has dropped back down into the realm of relative ambivalence. I'm still building a scum-case because I think it might be interesting to have out there, but I'm looking over it and I'm not terribly convinced.

[Mundivore]

Mundi I want a read on me as well please while ur here

Nah. <3

[Mundivore]

I'm not fond of my reads being easy to follow, unless it's a read that I think will save a townie or sink some scum.

[Mundivore]

@mundivore do you think your case is going to be done before deadline?

Unlikely, lol. Things are a little hectic for me IRL, and I'm not going to be satisfied with my work unless it becomes a wall of text.

Town needs to rally a wagon pretty soon, huh? Most viable ones are PLUS and Tayl0r? I'd prefer Tayl0r, of those two. Consider me a vote for 'town getting an elim.'

Except there's a lot of suspicion that town has a vig? I can't say I exactly follow what's happening, though. Let me read these last few pages again.

[Mundivore]

Okay, I missed the claiming action that was going on. That's sort of weird. I could go for PLUS, I could also quite happily go for Norwee here. If this is TvT, then it's really tragic, but it really heavily reads as TvS to me.

[Mundivore]

hey I missed a bunch of the thread at the end of last day. I've got a bit more time on my hands rn so I'll try to keep up.

@bugspray: probably a good idea to unvote so someone doesn't yolohammer, the day just started and there's a lot of analysis still available.

[Mundivore]

Noraa, I don't even need you to believe I'm town, so it doesn't matter if I can convince you or not. I simply want you to look at who else we can elim today.

This is pretty damning imo.
VOTE: Noraa

Absolutely.

Okay, I missed the claiming action that was going on. That's sort of weird. I could go for PLUS, I could also quite happily go for Norwee here. If this is TvT, then it's really tragic, but it really heavily reads as TvS to me.

Why TvS?

the TvS read is so weird to me on day 1. what makes you believe that discussion is more likely to be TvS? you said the same about me and tayl0rs discussion. Like I understand having an independent scumread on someone, but I am not sure I really follow the logic that any of these day 1 discussions are more likely to be town vs scum

I agree with this. Shelly comes across as the type of player who is willing to make these sorts of guesses based on intuition though.

This is me growing suspicious of Mundivore at days end. He never returned to the thread, so I never got to develop this suspicion.

I'll be honest? I completely forget why I had that read.

if noora is scum i can definitely see mundivore being scum with her, but i am not really sold on the UNOwen case

I want to argue against that very badly based on the reasons that 1) I'm not scum; 2) I think Noraa is obvscum here. But I don't really have anything better than that.

so yeah only 2 possibilities remain really
1. we have sk, and they killed bm to frame noraa. unlikely
2. we have an absentminded vig who shot bm and they haven't woken up or won't claim (unlikely)

I'm pretty sure that serial killers aren't Normal in mini games? So I don't think that's the case.

If there is a vig, do you think their claim is worth it? Miselims are bad, but are they as bad as losing a vig? This is a legit question, I'm unsure. My gut says the claim is worth, but I don't know for sure.

[Mundivore]

If there is a vig, do you think their claim is worth it?

If the vig is so bad that they target one of BM/Taylor who both said they could confirm their role. I'd rather they just claim and die tbh.

I mean... yeah.