Mini Normal 2169 : random facts, game over !

[Bunno]

HELLO HUMANS I'M THE REINCARNATED PISRATIONAL

LET'SS HUNTTT SCUMMM GUYSSS !!11!!!11!

[Bunno]

[Bunno]

I'm Churros if anyone knows me in my previous lifes before I turned into a human rabbit...

By the way I'm going to play this game in the speedrun method, which I mean I'll only use 1% of my power or time, because I don't have any lately.

If you want me to be very honest, I've only come to:

- Post beautiful Ouran's images

- Try to correct my bad english grammar because I'll be using english for something in my private life

- Do semi-blind guesses in the scumteam because my gut is right more often than my brain.

If you point out any big grammar mistakes in my posts I'll appreciate it. (Feel free to correct minor ones as well but I don't want the game to turn into an english class for everyone else).

[Bunno]

Ok, I'll begrudgingly spend the next two or one and half hours reading this thread because I'll not be very active later probably.

[Bunno]

@mod I'm V/LA in weekends (saturday/sunday), therefore I'll post on Monday around 15:00 GMT, I know it in advance because it's time for lunch in my country and I plan to catch-up there.

If you accept it feel free to prod me if I don't post by that hour on monday.

[Bunno]

I thought I was a tsunami of energy and happiness
...and then u showed up T^T

[Bunno]

Ah ha ha, you think that I’ve fallen into your trap when in fact it is you who has fallen into mine!

I knew you would know that I would know that you’d read the public setup information, and my pretende to the contrary was a test to see if you would falsely claim a lack of awareness! However, instead, you chose to try to use your knowledge of my knowledge of what you would have done to shade me, which is definitely a scum-motivated move! Therefore you are indeed the scum here!

Uno!

Nostalgia...

[Bunno]

I'm Churros

*waves*

it's nice to have you

hello

Try to correct my bad english grammar because I'll be using english for something in my private life

always so mysterious, bunno

I can spoiler tag English stuff if you like to avoid it intruding too much into the main thread?

I'm not mysterious though

However yes to any english stuff

[Bunno]

I'm going to go ahead and make a prediction on what bunno will think my alignment is this game

bunno will think that I am

Spoiler:

scum

Why? You think you've been playing to your scum meta?

[Bunno]

Sending the role PM's, the game will start once i get 11/13 confirmations (currently 11/13)

Game has started, TheGoldenParadox and Battle Mage have 36 hours to confirm before being replaced

a replacement threat already? bloody hell. I'm vanilla town ok, just leave me alone!

[Bunno]

Page 3

My brain says BM is scummy but my gut says he's town

Last time I played with scum him he was more...tactictal. He's going on a rampage of conflict/attention posting which does look scummy, but is more common from townies. Contrast it to Noraa which is kinda playing cute and saying she's suspicious of someone but not acting on it. I don't have any read on Noraa, but her behavior feels like maintaining the status quo vs BM going out of his way to pursue something.

Dunno, I wanted to write this in case anyone is indecise on how they read the slot.

[Bunno]

her behavior feels like maintaining the status quo

This isn't necessarily bad by the way. I repeat, I don't have any opinion on her, it's only an example to contrast to BM.

[Bunno]

Maybe if you care so much about being meta-proof, you could go and look at...I dunno, one of my many dozens of completed games, and tell me whether you think I'm scummy, or the towniest town you've ever seen.

She didn't say anything about caring for meta but BM still insists. I could see him recently having played aggressive town games and be trying to replicate it here. Maybe I should ignore my assumptions. Maybe.

[Bunno]

I don't always get the chance to say this Bob,

as I always die Night 1

, but I love you, and respect you. You are probably the most under-rated town player on this whole website.

is this true...?

I don't think it was particularly the case back when I was around

It feels a bit too confident?

[Bunno]

"meta is trash"? an odd thing for a newbie who has never completed a game as town to say. Meta can be very useful, although it isn't a silver bullet. Also useful is the threat of meta - and the

"meta is trash" line is a real cheap

way to try and discourage people from using an alternative avenue for scrutinising others

Don't assume you or even people themselves know enough about themselves. In my 2 years experience meta has been a negative route for reads, often something disappoiting because many times I had a hunch for a scum read in the slot.

It's fine to use it but you've been posting about it non-stop.

[Bunno]

I obvtown a lot (you would see this is you opened your mind to using meta for knowledge). And my opinion is the only opinion I really care about. Except possibly Bob in this game, who I admire deeply.

If I was scum, I wouldn't claim I'm town, as like a lot of the older players, I'm not a fan of lying. It's unethical and goes against my religion. I'm sure you'll make some incendiary remarks about that next, so go ahead if that's your style. If someone asks you directly if you're scum, and you say you're town when you were actually scum, I think that's pretty classless.

This is weird for more reasons than one. Regardless of your beliefs on lying in a social manipulation/deduction game, if you're doubling down on not lying about vanilla townie, did you claim VT to try not to die N1?

Your reasoning/posts are confusing to me but that does seem to make sense? I don't believe you just opened the thread and thought "eh, gonna claim", some kind of motivation is necessary.

Maybe you were feeling cute at that moment, wanted to do something unexpected, etc, why?

I was even starting to conspire you could be a PR that had fake claimed VT to not die, but I don't believe it's the case anymore with this post.

[Bunno]

I feel moderately happy calling datisi town at this point

I don't, she's just using rethoric on Noraa

I don't see anything noteworthy on that?

[Bunno]

I obvtown a lot (you would see this is you opened your mind to using meta for knowledge). And my opinion is the only opinion I really care about. Except possibly Bob in this game, who I admire deeply.

If I was scum, I wouldn't claim I'm town, as like a lot of the older players, I'm not a fan of lying. It's unethical and goes against my religion. I'm sure you'll make some incendiary remarks about that next, so go ahead if that's your style. If someone asks you directly if you're scum, and you say you're town when you were actually scum, I think that's pretty classless.

This is weird for more reasons than one. Regardless of your beliefs on lying in a social manipulation/deduction game, if you're doubling down on not lying about vanilla townie, did you claim VT to try not to die N1?

Your reasoning/posts are confusing to me but that does seem to make sense? I don't believe you just opened the thread and thought "eh, gonna claim", some kind of motivation is necessary.

Maybe you were feeling cute at that moment, wanted to do something unexpected, etc, why?

I was even starting to conspire you could be a PR that had fake claimed VT to not die, but I don't believe it's the case anymore with this post.

wait a second, thanks for pointing this post out.

@Battle Mage, are you scum?

if i'm understanding you correctly and if you don't say you're town when you were actually scum, that's tantamount to a trust tell. this game is literally one where you're required to lie. am i missing something?

Don't point out the elephant in the room...

[Bunno]

Noraa did you find battlemages vote on you scummy or is your read on him still based allot on battlemages initial vt claim. And why do you think datisi is only null for following the vote of a person you think is scummy.

Am I reading the same game...?

Noraa disliked Datisi not explaining her vote, said it was anti-town, but that doesn't translate to scummy, newbies often find problematic when someone doesn't reveal their reasoning for doing something

Regardless of Noraa's alignment, this game is so full of misrepresentative rethoric...

Can you stop it if you're still doing those things currently?

I'm a chill person but this gets me a bit annoyed. Try to understand context before attacking someone.

[Bunno]

mostly for his sake

stop ego battles...

[Bunno]

I don't always get the chance to say this Bob,

as I always die Night 1

, but I love you, and respect you. You are probably the most under-rated town player on this whole website.

is this true...?

I don't think it was particularly the case back when I was around

It feels a bit too confident?

I would like an answer to this

How many games in the last 6 months did you die in N1?

[Bunno]

In what sense, even vaguely, can you be said to have “busted my ass”

i had a list of 2 scum, you were on it. immediately afterwards you voted for me, apparently at least partly due to your fear that i would elim you (as you quoted that post when you voted me). Sorry dude but I'm taking those bragging rights to the bank, I busted your ass.

[Bunno]

+ nice points for Taylor

youre just giving me townpoints for agreeing with you, which im really not. thats a bad reason to give me townpoints. you and BM are in a shitfight over nothing. both of you are overconfident, neither has given a decent reason for your scumread on the other.

Noraa isn't overconfident on anything (you could even say she's too hesitant on everything), I felt like it was clear that nice points weren't equal to town posts, this seems like posturing overall.

[Bunno]

Hey Taylor, I’ve got a question, why aren’t you voting?

ha i knew someone would say this.

well. there were 7 pages of stuff. i didnt want to vote before reading them in case i lolhammered someone. now im gonna take a look and see where i want to vote

Ok this is already slightly overdone. Rather than saying "I didn't vote because I had no read", "I didn't feel like it", etc, she gives an "I didn't want to lolhammer someone".

It's not bad per se but it doesn't look great when someone tries to paint their behavior in "good-townie" light when it's uncalled for.

VOTE: shelly

i dont like that menal and datisi townread each other and then proceed to put themselves on opposing sides of what seems at this point to be a TvT shitfight.

However here is the problem, she previously had a problem with "Shelly vs BM" being too confident (defaulting both to town), let me tell you this is

statistically speaking more common from scum

, they see people fighting on thread and are just "meh" rather than having a take on the situation/directly getting involved (she says they are both probably town but I find again that her mindset is rather "meh" about it).

However the pinnacle is shading both menal/datisi but rather than engaging them she just seems to vote shelly (shelly hadn't posted yet at this point), which is a...in her own words, a RVS vote.

Think about it though, why the hell vote shelly other than to subtly say "well I'm voting someone/doing something"? Shelly was literally a empty slot in a game that already had content on it, but Taylor seems very interested in maitaining status quo rather than doing anything with her voice, vote or slot.

This is page 7/8 thingy, but it's important.

[Bunno]

If she was to vote someone simply for the spirit of it, why would "I was afraid of lolhammering someone" be the gatekeep?

If she hadn't read/opened the game yet, she could simply say "well I hadn't gotten around to post?". However she tried to paint it in a LAMIST way.

I'm giving this a highlight because she seems to have 0 votes on her other than shelly which seems like a OMGUS from VC alone, but even more surprising is that it seems at first glance that

she never changed her vote from shelly

. I've not read it yet but I don't expect anything other than low-effort, generic pushes/contributions in her posts. She's also a low poster and that tells me she seems satisfied with the direction the game is going.

Dunno, it could be one and no one seems to notice?

[Bunno]

you think it isnt TvT, i disagree.

I mean, I think this

BM and noraa both apparently think this

Bob maybe thinks this?

Datisi thinks this

In other words, it’s a very natural and reasonable take to see this as TvS, so my point is you’re not seeing it that way, and I think that’s potentially TMIy — especially when you made posts commenting on it that did imply that you thought things that (predominantly BM) had said were AI but then you... call it TvT and vote a random player who hasn’t contributed anything yet

Yes, I find that a problematic sequence of events in a world where you’re town

The last sane man.

If you're scum this is simply sad...

[Bunno]

VOTE: Taylor

placeholder for now

if I find something more interesting I may change but at the moment I'm not confident anywhere else.

[Bunno]

I don't always get the chance to say this Bob,

as I always die Night 1

, but I love you, and respect you. You are probably the most under-rated town player on this whole website.

is this true...?

I don't think it was particularly the case back when I was around

It feels a bit too confident?

I would like an answer to this

How many games in the last 6 months did you die in N1?

I'll let this one slide as it made me laugh. My original comment was definitely hyperbole - and referenced the fact that I had been killed N1 in my previous 2 games, including at least 1 with Bob presumably.

Please explain what your angle is here? I'm curious as to why me using hyperbole about how frequently I die N1 in a bit of friendly chit-chat with Bob is noteworthy enough to mention - it gives the appearance of you being productive while actually wasting both our time (although as noted, it did amuse me! )

Also, your post sort of implies I should know who you are. Who are you?

You don't remember me but I played a game modded by firebringer with you. I thought you were scum in the first pages but you made a good unexpected fakeclaim (PT cop, if I remember right?) and I mistakenly TR you for that. You won the game by the way.

You played against scum!me in a game where I fakeclaimed investigative as well...

About the comment itself, it's just you seem very, very, very overconfident, I wanted to see if there's good reasons for that.

[Bunno]

join date of June 2020...claims to be an old-timer...something does not compute with this Bunno character

It's an alt...

[Bunno]

Replacing you wouldn't do anything other than to make it even more gray because although false, it could be interpreted as "if he was scum he wouldn't get replaced"

I recommend mod/you/anyone involved to simply put it in the past and move on.

I don't think game integrity has been damaged as long as we move on from this right now.

[Bunno]

Replacing you, although NAI from a certain perspective, could massively damage game integrity right now.

Let's move on.

[Bunno]

VOTE: menalque

Scummer

I think I'm leaning t v t on chapter one.
Not feeling a BM or noraa vote today

Not sure 'guessing all the scum from observers' counts as winning tho BM

Compare Taylor to this

Taylor seems a lot more uninterested in the game state, and interested in maintaining status quo.

Alonzo/Taylor made the same stakes/things in very different ways.

[Bunno]

VOTE: Bob

I get the feeling noraa Vs BM continuing benefits Bob, I don't interpret his posting as him truly trying to guide noraa there.

How do you feel about Bob @noraa?

I like this post

[Bunno]

I hadn't seen it before but BM, you seem to have mentioned one of the reasons for doing that is your religion. I suggest in that case you answer as both town and mafia from now on, that you can't directly answer if you're scum/town or not because of your religion/beliefs and the trust tell guidelines. That way, you aren't lying but neither is breaking any rules. It may get hot in the first game you claim that, but after that you can simply link your past games to people that doubt you and they'll move on from it.

My 2 cents in the situation. Feel free to ignore.

[Bunno]

You can even link your explanation in those games to my post here, people will probably understand your side and stop bothering you.

[Bunno]

Assuming what you said isn't a lie though I guess?

Either way, I suggest we move on. No replacements. It would only make it even more gray.

[Bunno]

both of you are overconfiden

??noraa is overconfident?? confused face.

Ah yes, someone that has read the thread/is paying attention.

[Bunno]

It's 5pm and I'm on page 13...

Does catching up take this much time...?

I might regret replacing in...

[Bunno]

you wanna do this in every single game we play in? fine

i don't have the patience to do this every fucking single time

this seems like voting menalque because he's pushing/voting you rather than because you genuinely believe he's mafia.

[Bunno]

All Datisi did was vote without giving a reason. Thats at most a little antitown/scummy

imagine voting someone without a reason in rvs

outragious

datisi how dare you

dissing his town read again

He said negative things about noraa but still town reads the slot.

Not getting good vibes from ico.

[Bunno]

I remembered as well now (I had forgot before), I've a slightly bad record on reading town!menalque. Dunno about his alignment at the moment but now I get the meme from the "bunno will scum read me".

I don't have a negative view on his slot atm though...more like null out of respect? His posting is good but nothing I think scum!mena couldn't perform.

[Bunno]

This is something I do based off of gut scumpings occasionally. I think the scum team is Taylor/BM/Datisi
this is purely gut and only here for me to reference postgame to see how well I did guessing the scum team
This IS NOT a read
This shouldn't be considered when looking at my stance in the game. This is pure gut

I hadn't read this post before somehow, ok let's elim taylor

I'm ok with noraa living a bit longer

not a town read but I can relate to the thought process on this.

[Bunno]

hmmmmmm ok

looking at 195 (since I didn't see it earlier), seems quite fence-sitty trying to call the scumteam and then saying it's not a read lol

it used to be in fact a 100% town tell for me until I began to get low and use it in scum games as well.

[Bunno]

yay someone else finds taylor scumpingy

hot take taylor is more likely to be scum than (noraa, BM)

Why were you voting Noraa rather than Taylor again?

[Bunno]

Pay attention everyone seems to be taking taylor as scummy but no one is actually reaching out to the slot

They make it a "I can pivot there" but not actually pivoting there in their own accord.

Taylor may actually be scum in this game regardless of anyone else alignment.

[Bunno]

My thoughts at the moment is

- Taylor scum

- maybe one scum in [Ico/Datisi/Bob]. Two would be too lucky?

I'm quite confident on the first take, not so much on the second, but willing to explore it.

[Bunno]

Trying to read shelly gives me existential crisis. But I would rather do Taylor for now, shelly is really "out there", constantly giving thoughts/engaging people, even thought some of his thoughts make me give him a dirty look, there's more problematic slots I think.

[Bunno]

BM, hot take

noraa counter tunneling and omgus'ing you isn't scum!indicative
noraa using the newbie card to get out of jail for free is NAI, because scum!noraa would probably be using that as much as town!noraa

I disagree, but the jury's out on everyone really - I'm not lock-scum on Noraa or anything mad. I think there's going to be high volume posting in this game, so I'm going to take more of a backseat and share my observations later.

In response to Datisi and Menalque calling me arrogant - not actually true, it's mostly just tongue-in-cheek really!

I'm aware my scumhunting record overall is pretty marginal at best, although on my day I can be very good, and am improving with age. I generally do my best work when i don't post so much, however that's also less fun! Also pressuring newbies in non-newbie games is just objectively the right thing to do.

I like this post.

[Bunno]

VOTE: Menalque

At least partly because it would be hilarious if we flip him Day 1 when he said it would be impossible, and partly to get to the bottom of this secret PT mystery.

fine i'll spill the beans

menalque is notorious for fake claiming with/towards me and my potential roles in game, and we tend to get into a fight over it early on. He's never hard claimed like this with me tho

IIRC it was Always town!menal who pulled this shit but i'll look towards Datisi 'The Keeper Of Games' for confirmation

I didn't know that

But if he does that everytime, why scum read him like that? Especially if it's a fakeclaim?

This...is weird?

[Bunno]

Oh ok scratch [Ico, Datisi, Bob] pool. I had forgot TGP and Iamusername exist. I do wonder if there's even more people I'm not aware of atm. I didn't double check the playerlist, it was feeling like too small of a room though...

I propose do Taylor and call it a day.

[Bunno]

Battle Mage is free to keep posting in this game, please avoid discussing about the suspected trust tell

based mod

To anyone:

I wager two hatsune miku concert tickets that Taylor is scum

what do you have to wager elsewhere huh???

Yes I'm very bold.

[Bunno]

also, i fking knew you were churros

wtf I said it in my opening posts

[Bunno]

based mod

I don't even know what based means and yet i feel insulted

It means "wise", kinda.

It's a compliment!

[Bunno]

BM what's your favorite type of ice cream

[Bunno]

The important ones from the top of my head:

- Don't announce you're replacing out of games or try to get other people to replace. Don't comment on replacements either (I kinda broke it early but...)

- Don't use the L word if possible

- Trust tells

- Don't scumclaim together with someone else, even if it's false. Scum claiming by yourself is fine.

I wouldn't say the above is for the last 7 years though...maybe only for the last 3 - 4 years. I don't think there's anything else important though.

[Bunno]

The important ones from the top of my head:

- Don't announce you're replacing out of games or try to get other people to replace. Don't comment on replacements either (I kinda broke it early but...)

- Don't use the L word if possible

- Trust tells

- Don't scumclaim together with someone else, even if it's false. Scum claiming by yourself is fine.

I wouldn't say the above is for the last 7 years though...maybe only for the last 3 - 4 years. I don't think there's anything else important though.

I was joking but thank you for the effort nonetheless!

[Bunno]

i think you asked about my VT claim, and whether it was some kind of gambit. It was not, i'm just a vt.

Confusing but nothing that putting an anime avi wouldn't make me forget

Even TW/Mena did end up putting an anime avi...can you be convinced BM?!?!11?!!

[Bunno]

I would pick a very very cute anime avi for you BM

People would stare at your avi, think to themselves that cuteness is justice, and mirror all your votes

imagine that blessing for a moment

beautiful right?

[Bunno]

I've given up on convincing you guys to vote taylor with logic

what about cookies though?

[Bunno]

no brag man but i've legit won every game i played as scum this year - will probably surprise you to learn that. i remember both games, you were a good player in both. I think in the first one, it was slightly marred by some post-game anger or something? dunno, that was a win that felt a bit like a loss. the second one i replaced in late on, and immediately got elimmed but i believe i did have you correctly as scum. I can't remember who won.

Both were sour games yes

I do remember you suspected me correctly yes

I'm not surprised at all, you do seem like a good player although I felt it was a bit too overconfident even considering that (I understand now it was tongue-in-check). The first game...hmm yeah there were some issues but let's move on. I still think it was a good game from both alignments overall.

[Bunno]

I would pick a very very cute anime avi for you BM

People would stare at your avi, think to themselves that cuteness is justice, and mirror all your votes

imagine that blessing for a moment

beautiful right?

Someone made me a bespoke avatar in a newbie game recently. I immediately NKed them the next night.

[Bunno]

my winrate as town is around 50% so im not that good a player lol

don't sell yourself short, winrates aren't a good metric for individuals.

I'll stop here because I don't want to sound as if I'm pocketing.

[Bunno]

Datisi I am 100% certain is very much capable of producing content yet I am not seeing much content. I think that may be a scumtell for him tho I have never played a game with him before so I couldn't say.

what do you consider "content"? because i feel like i've made content this game? like at least some? idk?

dunno datisi, I feel like I could put your ISO on youtube, naming it "tutorial how to play mafia saying generics things and using rethoric" and it wouldn't be out of context

not necessarily a bad thing but dunno, I don't feel you've posted anything noteworthy while there's one or other post for everyone else that says "eh this could be AI".

No offense.

[Bunno]

I dont agree with this. I can definitely see why people would SR my tunneling however it was far less aggressive than BM's tunneling. And tunneling that hard in the first ten damn pages is not something town would do bc town know literally nothing about the setup and are lost asf before some flips. I could see scum doing it but I can't see town doing that. I dont see how my logic is flawed. Tunneling that aggressively is definitely a scumtell.

sweet summer child...

you're in for a ride in any game archives in this forum...

I don't discredit your read on BM though. I wouldn't go that far.

[Bunno]

like Datisi actively wants to find logical inconsistencies by asking for people’s thoughts on things + has decent thought processes and reads upon looking at ISO

that's not towny, that means she can use logic.

Pointing out logical inconsistencies is like...standard play for scum.

I'm pointing this out because datisi seems to be sliding into a townier consensus block but I don't feel the slot has earned that yet.

[Bunno]

Ico in page 32 isn't half bad. I'm still puzzled why you acted as if you did scum read mena/datisi?

was it all a pun? it seemed genuine to me. I didn't double check but I don't remember you instantly switching votes off mena after revealing it was all fake.

[Bunno]

I went from being mentally Noraa's Guardian Angel to thinking her focus on BM even though everyone moved on is obnoxious

The choice of words she uses is a bit problematic as well, she imples overconfidence with "definitely", "very", "never", etc, but always end the conclusion with a "maybe", "somewhat", etc. If you're going to sound confident you can't bail out in the middle of it Noraa. I recommend only talking about what you are to some degree confident, if that means not talking a lot, it's fine.

Be realistic on how much confidence you've on it as well instead of using buzzwords.

My 2 cents, feel free to ignore.

[Bunno]

Like you weren’t under any pressure really

I wasn’t under a lot of pressure
Even if I were scum it’s not like I could use that to push you to an elim bc when you flipped it would prove I was lying

this is bad. the fake-claim was bad. the fake claim was only not that bad because it was obviously fake. if this post is genuine its town-indicative because youre upset that your gambit failed. but its far more likely that this post isnt really genuine and you were hoping to get a townie to give you free towncred by fake-claiming a neighborhood. you werent under that much pressure anyway, it was like page 5. i think town!you knows its early game and theres no need to be concerned about a little pressure.

^ still on a vote she claims RVS even though is suspecting mena. Let's see how that plays out in the next pages.

[Bunno]

Ok 832 from BM probably comes from town

Noraa at least for today let's try to look elsewhere if you're town.

[Bunno]

Each game varies. Depends largely on player list and the time zones of those players

The place i first started playing mafia you would get some players that would posts once or twice a week. There would be that little that the days often got extended by an extra 14 days. Making a day last 30 days.

there's a lot of content in the thread that bob didn't comment but he chooses to come and chill in this...

[Bunno]

wait am i right in thinking that menal shaded me for my RVS vote on shelly and then proceeded to join me on the shelly wagon? hmm i guess maybe im missing something in the 14 pages i havent read yet

still no vote

only shade while continuing to vote with your top suspect

[Bunno]

would people prefer to run up a bunch of people asap, or to just no-lunch today? i'm getting frustrated we feel so far from a consensus.

this is a bad post and you should feel bad for making it

for full disclosure, i was bored and avoiding work i had to, and this didn't necessarily reflect my heartfelt opinion at the time, nor at present.

However, I do not feel bad for posting it.

I simply feel negatively towards you for trying to guilt trip me for being a bad employee.

sorry you dont get to make scummy posts and then just say "i didnt mean it!!!"

what about actually voting people that you scum read

[Bunno]

Also interested who Taylor , Shelly and TGP think scum on their wagon might be.

not sure as i still have to catch up on 15 pages but theres only 2 votes on me. shelly always scumreads me so thats NAI, and teacher

i feel like should be able to see that im town

but ??. i havent read why they voted me

how would they be able to see you're town, you're barely present and have one random vote, one take on mena that you still didn't come to a conclusion, and a shade on bm. When you posted, you didn't even have half of those, only the rvs vote and calling nora/BM TvT.

This is in top ten fakest posts I've seen in my two mafia years. Sincerely, eliminate this slot. - by Churros, yours truly.

[Bunno]

Bunno I mean *

I've so many names sometimes I confuse myself

but let's call me bunno please

[Bunno]

Read this post please.

Everything from Taylor screams:

- uninterested in solving the game

- uninterested in solving slots alignment

- uninterested in eliminating mafia

- uninterested in other people posts (even going as far as saying noraa was overconfident when she would strumble on her own words way too often in the first pages)

- barely present

She's also someone everyone's been saying "yeah it's scummy" but very few people ever acting on those suspicious.

Do you think that it's a coincidence everyone dislikes the slot but no one is pushing it/people are always pressuring elsewhere?

Taylor is the definition of going under the radar, always try to give good excuses to everything (didn't vote because was afraid of lolhammering/ delayed posting because forgot bookmark BUT she was "frustated" that the game hadn't started).

Can we do Taylor?

I'm already voting her but I'll do it again for emphasis

VOTE: Taylor

It's literally a consensus SR, she barely has presence therefore isn't going to turn away the opinions on her slot likely, and is never getting nightkilled.

[Bunno]

shelly why is this the only game in which ive seen you try to form a townbloc?

also dont put too too much stock in me being on your wagon until i finish reading. my vote is ok where it is for now but i imagine therell be stuff in those 15 pages that changes my mind

In all of Taylor catching up posts, there's never a mention about stuff she finds shelly sketch for, but the vote is still here, she says she feels fine the vote is here, and her suspicious on mena are forever lost in the limbo since shelly is a more convenient wagon.

She also seems slowly acting like she scum reads shelly, even though her attitude about shelly tunneling her seems more similar to how you would treat a townie tunneling you.

Guys...guys...

[Bunno]

Readlists are lame and have got in my way more than helped me

readlists is just another thing everyone was doing and I followed but when put into question it doesn't help much at all

if you can change your mind on a town read, it's no town read at all. I'll give you my sparse thoughts

I feel good on you (BM) after some later posts.

Mena is ok for day 1.

Noraa/Shelly have troubling posts, but there is some good posts as well, fine for day 1.

Ico has some icky posting but I'm still sorting him out because there's good ones as well.

I'm unimpressed on Datisi/Iamusername

TGP everyone is been saying it's scummy, but I don't feel anything special about the slot. Can go either way easily.

Bob is icky

Taylor very icky

If you aren't here, probably null or I forgot.

[Bunno]

Oh right Alonzo

I like the fact he dislikes both bob and taylor

[Bunno]

I'll probably do colors next time

I'm tired

I had other things to do but I ended up spending all my day on catch up

I expected this to be a 2 hour thing...

[Bunno]

Ok I shouldn't do this post, it doesn't help me or anyone at all, but I'll do just for the giggles

In a 3 man team here (mena said it was 3 man?), a low effort strategy for scum!me is:

- If my team mate is under the radar, I push them but still try to make the elimination elsewhere by means other than my vote, keeping the distancing act through the game. I try to play a more and more insane character with time to people not look at my team mate as a plausible target, but still consider we're not scum together

- If my team mate is under fire, I come around, read the last posts to see where consensus is, acknowledge the consensus in thread, go read previous posts, TR my partner early, confidently defend him in the middle of the catchup, but in the very last posts make a huge deal out of a few posts and completely change my mind in a 1v1. Preferably doing it a lot faster than I currently did by not commenting on small things and by skipping lots of posts. It's important to do all the stages before many people come into the thread to say I'm partners with my team mate.

I would say Taylor actually has partner equity to me for those that know my meta about bussing, but if that helps elim taylor first....

[Bunno]

- If my team mate is under fire, I come around, read the last posts to see where consensus is, acknowledge the consensus in thread, go read previous posts, TR my partner early, confidently defend him in the middle of the catchup, but in the very last posts make a huge deal out of a few posts and completely change my mind in a 1v1. Preferably doing it a lot faster than I currently did by not commenting on small things and by skipping lots of posts. It's important to do all the stages before many people come into the thread to say I'm partners with my team mate.

In this one it would be good to plan with teammate a certain hour after my catchup for a very very light 1v1 where he'll act as if he's trying to pocket me/make me keep my town read

in that case I probably wouldn't have read too much today and said that I had to do something else/would more read later.

[Bunno]

This was your average dose of wifom by bunno

now I'm gonna do something else

I predict mena will smile in the above posts but dunno

[Bunno]

Last thing I know there's been many minor grammar mistakes in my last posts, but I had to post too fast to check on it. From now on I'm gonna be very chill probably so I'll do better.

See you.

[Bunno]

I know I said I was done for the day but I realized it's way too late to start working on certain stuff right now so I'm taking the day off

I'm here to shitpost

[Bunno]

I've given up on convincing you guys to vote taylor with logic

what about cookies though?

did i miss the part where you were trying to get people to vote me using logic?

no no

I even asked BM what his favorite ice cream type was

one snacks says more than one hundred words

[Bunno]

bunno I would like you to talk more about shelly and what the good!posting is before I consider joining you on Taylor

ok imagine you're shelly and imagine you're scum

it's early game and there's lots of fighting in noraa/bm and some distrust in datisi/menalque

do you

1) stop babblering/engaging people non stop until it reaches the point you start to sound like you're contradicting yourself because you're changing opinions too fast

or

2) you don't really care about solving the game so you just post some made up logical stances and be comfy

Her enthusiasm on engaging people seemed positive to me, some of her takes sounds too convenient to be true, like their timing on town reading/ scum reading you, and her mind zooning out of focus on who to push, but I don't often find people that talk too much and don't end up making a mess of their public images. There's a whole philosophy of "silence is gold" to be made in mafia games.

Contrasting it to Taylor that does seem very comfy on the current/past gamestates, I ain't eager to elim shelly in day 1.

[Bunno]

1) stop

I meant start

[Bunno]

Spoiler: eng

one snack

s

says more than one hundred words

Ty

Mena you're too nice for me

[Bunno]

llama

I don't understand the reference?

[Bunno]

I think you're underestimating how comfortable shelly is as scum and how high energy she is too

if that's an important part of your read on her I suggest you jettison it, meta her, and realise that her being engaged with the game/being happy to draw attention onto herself is absolutely not a town tell and she's fully competent enough to do that as scum

also, I don't think there was really any distrust between dats and me early game?

not in you as each other

I meant public consensus was lightly trending into "maybe one scum in datisi/menalque"

at least it was the kind of room temperature I was reading

About Shelly's meta...I don't know if I've stomach for meta, I'll consider what you said, but at the same time shelly seems on crossvotes with my top suspect taylor so even if it's not a very positive point I'm not very interested on shelly in day 1

[Bunno]

ehh I didn't really read it that way, I think like maybe 1-2 slots made an offhand comment on our early interaction?

okay I'm upgrading bunno to could be scum with noraa or shelly

other than that null-to-town

You guys keep thinking I use sensible tactics as scum like directly defending partners

that's why I feel no one gets me....

[Bunno]

You guys keep thinking I use sensible tactics as scum like directly defending partners

if anything that's the counterintuitive strategy from someone presumed competent as scum

If you guys are tying my boat with Noraa and Shelly I don't feel too bad. It's not great but there's slots I have a deeper distrust than those. I'm fine with it I guess. Let's see where my guts leads me to.

[Bunno]

Datisi asked me what I find positive on ico more recently

the posts are getting slightly blurry in my mind (I do vaguely feel I had another reason to like shelly as well but I kinda forgot), however Ico did call out Noraa on her rampage on BM, as he did call out the fact datisi is been very nullish, and honestly I've beentrying to remember something else for 3 minutes, even checked some of his ISO, but maybe that was it...? I genuinely am starting to forget individual posts and only remember the feelings I had about each slot.

In hindsight, maybe I skipped some of ico's recent posts because right now he seems almost too focused on noraa, but hmm dunno, I'm not trying to hyper solve in day 1 here, my current reads/gamestate is fine.

I'll sort more Ico as we go along.

[Bunno]

Spoiler: eng

If you guys are tying my boat^{would maybe be more likely to say wagon here than boat}

with

to Noraa and Shelly I don't feel too bad. It's not great but there's slots I have a deeper distrust ^of than those. I'm fine with it I guess. Let's see where my gut

s

leads me

to

.

Hmm, this one was enlightining

I'm still in my shitposting day so there's some errors I could fix by paying more attention, but this one definitely had useful corrections, thanks mena.

I confuse a lot where it's good/acceptable to use "with" in english, because in my native language you use "with" for...so many things. Almost everything connected with something else, you use "with". It's hard for old dogs to learn new tricks huh...

[Bunno]

I do also have some awkward uses of "to", "on" and "in". "Instead of" rather than..."rather".

I do wonder sometimes how I manage to play a game in english where saying stuff people comprehend is the point. It's a mystery.

[Bunno]

Looking back although my english is awkward I definitely improved a lot playing this game hmm...

Trivia fact is that I got around mafiascum.dot.com around 1 or 2 years earlier than my first account, but I couldn't understand english at all or type decently enough to be understood, so I ended up shining away from playing a game

[Bunno]

Oh yay ffs it’s another 15 pages!

just skip it and tell me where your head's at

Lol @crosspost.

My head is basically nowhere. I’ve come into the game when I could, but haven’t been able to interact really and just don’t have the thread of the game. I get the GP push but disagree, I don’t get the Shelley push, and I don’t have interest in the endless takes on BM/Noraa.

Taylor's situation didn't change a bit since you last voted her

Feel free to wagon her with me.

[Bunno]

thirdly, you've played with bunno before at least once

When? Searching my topics says no.

We played team mafia together...

[Bunno]

I came up with the name as well

Tea Ceremony Club I think?

best team mafia name...

[Bunno]

Blessed image edit'ed by me

[Bunno]

It's weird...can't believe it's only been nine months...

It feels forever for me. Is that just a me thing or not?

[Bunno]

As it seems you should from your “mysterious” thing with bunno

...?

[Bunno]

so I'll just defer to you/BM/bunno/dats and call him town for now

hmm, being nitpicky I wouldn't call him town, I would just say he's not a slot you should elim day 1 in this game. But I do understand the context, etc.

I've only come to the realization that half of my stress/paranoia in mafia, which is town reading the wrong people, can never exist if I focus solely on scum hunting...

[Bunno]

nope taylor has no idea where her attention should be in

that's another scum tell in my book to be honest but I won't overdo it.

[Bunno]

Taylor is been around the thread since yesterday night

0 new reads and developments

bails out of shelly wagon on L-1

says that "doesn't know" what to do with me pushing her

datisi soft-defending taylor it's been a long time now if anyone didn't notice, when people were suspecting taylor before datisi was like "yeah but there's scummier slots"

If Taylor is mafia consider putting datisi in the pool of untrustworthy people.

[Bunno]

shelly vs taylor is more likely than not something other than SvS. Their interactions doesn't seem like partners at all.

Taylor may have unvoted now but before she was slowly throwing shade on shelly when shelly started to town lean her.

Not impossible but probably not SvS.

[Bunno]

Taylor unvoting sounds less like a partner trying to bail out in the last minutes of bussing (which is a very very very rare thing to happen, you need to have too much courage to unvote your partner on L-1), and more like she wants to distance herself of shelly wagon even though she voted him it's been more than an entire week by now.

Look I've tried my best but I can't understand a world where it's town!Taylor.

[Bunno]

shellyc having no new reads over the course of 1 irl day is troubling for you, but noraa having exactly 1 (one) read for the entire game is fine?

noraa only recently started scumreading me (pure omgus), and had a forced townread because teacher was pulling their arm

but you townread that?

Did you actually read my read progression on Noraa or are you just projecting on me?

Noraa may not have many reads but she's been talking and commenting about slots and common topics, I said that recently I found obnoxious the fact she's barely doing anything out of insisting on BM, even did give you points for pointing out, but the difference here is that Taylor is around but I woudn't really say she's doing anything other than fluff.

Shelly had reads, now it's a bit more messed up, but she had reads through the game and pushed people.

Noraa commented on most of what happened in thread, did push BM, did TR Alonzo, had some minor read developments here and there. Even more important you said she seemed reluctant on her town game, which is exactly what's happening here in D1.

Taylor has been chilling around in this thread since yesterday night but doesn't have any pushes, her vote for an entire week was in her own words a RVS, and now she bails out of it on L-1.

It's not comparable, stop using rethoric/hyperbole to try to make it look like it's equal.

Taylor hasn't been playing this game - at all.

[Bunno]

bunno, ur trying to divert a lot of attention away from shellyc without trying to dismantle the actual points there are on shellyc

what do you think of the case?

Oh with all due respect shut up

If you can't see how Taylor is scummier than shelly I think it might be on you more than me

I can be wrong and if it's the case I'll apologize, but comparing Taylor's ISO to Shelly/Noraa is pure hyperbole/rethoric.

It's so bad that you look at Shelly/Noraa's ISO and try to say "look, they did this, it looks scummy right?", while Taylor you just zoom out and question yourself "ok but like, what have you been doing at all for an entire week?"

[Bunno]

I talked about shelly with Menalque already, look at my ISO as well. I'm not going to repeat myself over and over.

You say I'm trying to divert attention from shelly, but all I feel is that

people/you

are using shelly/noraa to divert attention away from Taylor

You just had thought "noraa" looked town but still shades her and says I'm diverting attention from them.

Stop the rethoric, I'm pushing my Taylor read, I'm confident on it, Shelly looks like Noraa to me, meh wagons, and you just turned around your opinion on Noraa in the last page.

Diverting attention from other wagons is just a consequence of pushing another wagon, it should only be obvious.

It may be I'm partner with whoever you want me to be, but it may be town that is trying to elim his scum read.

The only way you can discern from the two is to engage with my case on Taylor but you just try to compare it to shelly/Noraa and out yourself of voting Taylor.

It's not fun and you're back to null, nullscum if Taylor is mafia.

[Bunno]

If you can't see how Taylor is scummier than shelly I think it might be on you more than me

where the fuck am i defending a town!taylor? was it me voting there?

you outed yourself out of voting the slot in split seconds

voting and voting out is easy

staying in the wagon is another story

[Bunno]

I've no interest in wasting more of my time on this. Already wasted my entire yesterday. I'm going to have lunch.

I may be right, I may be wrong, but if you all can just stop saying I'm trying to divert attention from other people wagon and actually engage my Taylor wagon, that would be nice.

Not one

I repeat

Not one person has actually managed to excuse Taylor behavior by anything other than trying to compare it to noraa/shelly when it's not equal at all. You can use how much rethoric/hyperbole you want but the unique slot that is close to Taylor levels of contribution is Bob.

This game has been about Noraa/Shelly it's been 50 pages, more than one week, but when I introduce you a new wagon it's because I'm partners with noraa/shelly.

If you want to elim them so much, do as you wish. Just don't blame me for it later + I shouldn't be blamed if I miselim you later.

[Bunno]

yeah sure you just tunnel in on 1 slot

i'll try to be the townie here and try to look at the bigger picture

You need only to focus on one scummy person

After you eliminate one, rinse and repeat

I looked at everyone equally, Taylor seemed like the worst slot, I'm focusing on Taylor today

I don't like to use past games but I tunneled FlavorLeaf/Kuribo for entire 3 in-game days in TM 2020 and it turns out I was right, while the one screaming "yeah but you're too tunneled" was just letting scum slip.

Tunneling =/= bad

[Bunno]

you didn't touch on why shellyc isn't scum

, or on the actual points brought out against shellyc. You only went 'taylor is scum->wagons arent s/s so shellyc prob town'

No, I just talked it out with menalque.

You haven't been reading this game/my iso carefully.

[Bunno]

that would point towards someone in like (menal/GP/??)

menal was one of the first people to try pushing taylor

how do they have partner equity more than say, datisi that's been soft-defending/diverting from taylor wagon since the game start?

ico I don't understand your logic

I can see mena + taylor but not one of my first picks on pairing at all.

[Bunno]

I don't like to use past games but I tunneled FlavorLeaf/Kuribo for entire 3 in-game days in TM 2020 and it turns out I was right, while the one screaming "yeah but you're too tunneled" was just letting scum slip.

'i was right in this one game so i must be right here'

The point isn't I'm right on this

it's that my tunneling isn't necessarily bad

I probably always tunnel my SRs, it's how I work.

Sometimes I'm right, sometimes I'm wrong, it's life.

But don't try to say my read is bad because I'm tunneling.

[Bunno]

you didn't touch on why shellyc isn't scum

, or on the actual points brought out against shellyc. You only went 'taylor is scum->wagons arent s/s so shellyc prob town'

No, I just talked it out with menalque.

You haven't been reading this game/my iso carefully.

you didn't

you only voted and started pushing taylor since yesterday IIRC
the engagement you had with menal was fluff IIRC (about speeling and gramaar)
there was no discussion about taylor

i could be wrong but, point me at a general set of posts/pages?

---------------------

These posts. There's probably more bits and pieces scattered in my ISO.

bunno I would like you to talk more about shelly and what the good!posting is before I consider joining you on Taylor

ok imagine you're shelly and imagine you're scum

it's early game and there's lots of fighting in noraa/bm and some distrust in datisi/menalque

do you

1) stop babblering/engaging people non stop until it reaches the point you start to sound like you're contradicting yourself because you're changing opinions too fast

or

2) you don't really care about solving the game so you just post some made up logical stances and be comfy

Her enthusiasm on engaging people seemed positive to me, some of her takes sounds too convenient to be true, like their timing on town reading/ scum reading you, and her mind zooning out of focus on who to push, but I don't often find people that talk too much and don't end up making a mess of their public images. There's a whole philosophy of "silence is gold" to be made in mafia games.

Contrasting it to Taylor that does seem very comfy on the current/past gamestates, I ain't eager to elim shelly in day 1.

I think you're underestimating how comfortable shelly is as scum and how high energy she is too

if that's an important part of your read on her I suggest you jettison it, meta her, and realise that her being engaged with the game/being happy to draw attention onto herself is absolutely not a town tell and she's fully competent enough to do that as scum

also, I don't think there was really any distrust between dats and me early game?

not in you as each other

I meant public consensus was lightly trending into "maybe one scum in datisi/menalque"

at least it was the kind of room temperature I was reading

About Shelly's meta...I don't know if I've stomach for meta, I'll consider what you said, but at the same time shelly seems on crossvotes with my top suspect taylor so even if it's not a very positive point I'm not very interested on shelly in day 1

[Bunno]

that would point towards someone in like (menal/GP/??)

menal was one of the first people to try pushing taylor

how do they have partner equity more than say, datisi that's been soft-defending/diverting from taylor wagon since the game start?

ico I don't understand your logic

I can see mena + taylor but not one of my first picks on pairing at all.

let's agree to not bait me anymore ok

now, this post is important on D2 pending on who flips what, for post-flip/Association analysis and it's hard to answer this today

I used to think like this, but time after time I just realized that what NSG told me one day was really right

"Catch one scum at each time, rinse and repeat"

Overthinking stuff about other slots/associations is the top 1 thing which made me lose sight of my correct reads in previous games

[Bunno]

Ico I need to go have lunch/do other stuff.

I didn't want to tell you to shut up, but I got annoyed on the argument of "bunno diverting from noraa/shelly" while you guys have simply been sitting at them for the whole game.

I didn't want to bring up Team Mafia, I can be wrong here about Taylor, and previous games have nothing to do with my current guesses, but even if it was unintentional, don't try to portray me as a crazy tunneled person because I've been the victim of that mindset many, many times.

See you.

[Bunno]

I stand to the fact I adressed shelly, adressed noraa, but they weren't as interesting wagons as Taylor, therefore I'm pushing Taylor. It's all in my ISO.

Adress my case on Taylor without creating false equalities on Taylor/Noraa/Shelly because regardless of who is mafia, they're bad for different/distinct reasons and saying anything other than that is disingenuous.

[Bunno]

Alonzo and Taly in terms of content are considerably similar as well, but I've very different opinions on them

It's not only about what you do, it's how you do it and when.

Last post and I apologize if I offended you, it wasn't my intention.

[Bunno]

am i really not producing content though? like, exclude the 50% of the thread where i literally forgot about the game. in the rest of the thread i am producing content and am engaged... wtf

I'll give you a good look of what your posts look like in the recent 48 hours, of which you were around because you posted although in intervals

okay, that's interesting. i didn't know that, but that makes the shelly/ico interaction super interesting.

you think scum!ico and scum!shellyc are pocketing each other?

i do. gotta convince each other not to bus somehow

shelly/ico/bm seems absolutely like a viable scumteam to me.

that is literally our town block lol

I kinda like bussing as well. I have several completed games you can look at

pls no bus me

better try and pocket her asap

i wanna believe that noraa is LHF

do i have a wrong interpretation of LHF or?????

how is noraa lhf?

lhf = people shelly doesnt want you to wagon

noraa case in a nutshell:

-(counter?)tunneling on BM
-confbiasing, trying to make every post BM made into a scumtell
-not having other reads outside of BM
-not trying to have reads outside of BM
-after being forced into having a read, suddenly has a strong townread for reasons that previously had noraa 'all are null'
-increasingly bad posts in general

welcome to noraa

can everybody give like 2 people they want to elim today? would be good to get some hard data at this point.

donald trump and joe biden

second request that you respond to this @shelly

me changing reads to fit the situation is my general town play really
as town I have much lower confidence in myself

also, to the points that made me reconsider, things like the reaction to ico outing the fake was kinda artificial? the push on me for essentially swimming with the tide isn’t exactly town pinging either

so tunneling is your scumplay?

The important ones from the top of my head:

- Don't announce you're replacing out of games or try to get other people to replace. Don't comment on replacements either (I kinda broke it early but...)

- Don't use the L word if possible

- Trust tells

- Don't scumclaim together with someone else, even if it's false. Scum claiming by yourself is fine.

I wouldn't say the above is for the last 7 years though...maybe only for the last 3 - 4 years. I don't think there's anything else important though.

llama

I've given up on convincing you guys to vote taylor with logic

what about cookies though?

did i miss the part where you were trying to get people to vote me using logic?

link pls noraa

link pls noraa

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... start=1100

wow you posted 50% more than the next highest poster in that game. thats impressive...

[Bunno]

I'll pretend your OMGUS is an actual read as well rather than just defense mode because I have a thing for fantasies

[Bunno]

i feel like username is just kinda obvtown here, at least to me.

There's gems like this as well

[Bunno]

If you really had a problem with my takes/etc you would have voted me when you first acknowledged my existence/pushes here:

Taylor did you do a response to that entire curbstomp thing bunno did earlier?

theres not much to say... its wrong, and the confidence in being wrong makes me question why a good player who is town would be so insistent that im scum. i dont know what to make of it, but eh.

But you didn't because the wagon had no traction and you felt safe. You don't seem to scumread my takes/pushes, you just seem to vote me because it's safe play for you now that you're out of shelly and the wagons are turning.

Your last posts are the most contributive you've been, but it's only after you're in the spotlight.

[Bunno]

Not only that but I've been checking out and you seem to be post elsewhere more frequently

Because of site-rules I need to leave it at that, but the level of engagement here does seem unimpressive even considering your playstyle.

[Bunno]

I do notice that Taylor is producing much less content than she was as town in that one game that finished but besides that, nothing stands out to me

"One of the most universal mafia tells for most players (you're an exception noraa, not the rule) is fitting Taylor here but eh besides that I don't see anything else".

sigh

Either way for people that like meta, here's another reason for you.

[Bunno]

Hmm...maybe it wasn't a good idea to sign up for this. I thought I could manage by dedicating 30 to 60 minutes each 36 hours to this game, but there's...always so much going on in the thread

I don't think I can maintain my old levels of presence, mafia can't be that big priority in my life anymore...

I'll try to make this the last night I'm putting more than one hour here.

[Bunno]

Dunno if it's possible, but if you could rebuild your image of me to a very chill-loving casual player rather than the tryhard I was being up to now, maybe we could avoid future misunderstandings.

I thought things would go fairly smooth after I did some casing on Taylor, but Noraa keeps badposting, Shelly doesn't seem to find her own position in the game, and everyone is trying to do their own thing so far. Trying to keep people/wagons on focus requires camping this thread too much. Maybe it's time I conceive more to the fact I won't be able get my preferencial elims in this playstyle...?

[Bunno]

bunno where the fuck are you

sleep deprived

let's lower our expectations...I can't camp thread like the old days anymore...

[Bunno]

I can understand the motivation for Mena's annoyment but it seems like it went from 0 to 100 so quick...

It's something kinda weird to do as scum though save for a few cases. I don't know what to think about it because it's still confusing that it apparently exploded right away, no clear build-ups.

Mena did you have a bad day by any chance?

I've other ideas as well but I'll save them.

I'm not completely rejecting the idea of voting shelly to end the day here, although I'll mention that in a policy elim outside of Taylor, I may be slightly more interested in Noraa than shelly at the moment. But just maybe.

[Bunno]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=84280

here is a towngame where i had incredibly low content and was scumread for it

in my scumgame i had decent content and that is not why the scumteam fell apart.

your meta argument is shit and based on cherrypicking

why are you making accusations and gaslighting me rather than trying to engage me and figure out the truth

This doesn't really change my mind that much, one example of why (there's more but I'm gonna stick to this one here), is ChibiBear in Mini 2039: PicketyPickety.

She would later in endgame admit herself that our meta analysis on her was right, and she was playing very similar to her most recent town game which she hadn't a lot of content (what was different than her usual scum meta of contributing more), but ChibiBear was still mafia, we suspected her, but we let her out of the elimination because of flimsy "meta".

I only talked about meta for people that like it, but as an individual I'm focusing more on what you have posted here regardless of your past behavior.

[Bunno]

Some of noraas posts are just incindiery and there's too many of them for this not to feel like a tactic of some sort

Not a bad take...

[Bunno]

I don't know which one it is and Shelly was my first scum partner so i will be giving her the benefit of the doubt and assume her to be the town half

Noraa makes less sense to me by every minute it passes...

I would genuinely be getting interested in discussing eliminating noraa today or in the near future if this keeps up

I don't particularly feel she's scum but her posts doesn't seem to have any town logic I can understand on it.

[Bunno]

VOTE: noraa

mood...

[Bunno]

but its ok because you wont lunch me due to my role.

this should be held accountable and if you're lying you should be punished either way.

Anything other than a confirmable town role after this declaration is unnaceptable. If it's a town VT or town weak PR I would call this bad play territory.

[Bunno]

Taylor doesn't even pick someone she "believes" to be scum

She has literally no scumlean/pushes on a 75 page game

Noraa is bad but at the same time oh my god, are we really letting that fly?

In my view Noraa has unreasonably emotional reads rather than objective ones, but Taylor...not even that.

Ok though...I'll try not to care too much about this game.

[Bunno]

sorry i had to do that for the memes.

but seriously

VOTE: teacher

I'm the one to ask you

seriously?

are you going to pretend this is a genuine read from you rather than you just joining the hottest wagon?

[Bunno]

Teacher feels like a very random spontaneous wagon

Mena has been talking about "anyone but teacher", and says Taylor is sus, but never joins Taylor wagon.

Why is this game so messed up? It's not even about me compromissing anymore, Mena it's you that doesn't want to compromisse on Taylor at all.

If you/TGP which if I remember correctly sus Taylor do come with us on her wagon, we may have a shoot on getting someone other than teacher. I don't really feel any good reason for that random teacher wagon.

[Bunno]

sorry i had to do that for the memes.

but seriously

VOTE: teacher

I'm the one to ask you

seriously?

are you going to pretend this is a genuine read from you rather than you just joining the hottest wagon?

no im going to pretend its me joining the hottest wagon rather than a genuine read

sarcasm and sassy are fun sometimes but unhappily that's all you seem to be...

[Bunno]

Let's stop wasting time

I'm truly on the camp of "ok, anyone but random teacher wagon" so let's organize this because random elims doesn't seem fun

We've Taylor with 3 votes at the moment:

Taylor (3) - Bunno, Shelly, Teacher

Both Mena and TGP said they thought Taylor was sus, if you guys move on to her it's going to get on L-2. We can talk to Alonzo/Noraa on voting Taylor, getting to L-1, claim, etc. L-1 is our goal for now and it's not super hard to get.

Datisi/Bob doesn't seem likely to vote Taylor in my opinion.

[Bunno]

Noraa if you don't stop vanity voting BM or some other selfish wagon I'll keep voting you for the rest of the game and the blame is gonna be on you.

BM/Ico clearly isn't the elimination today by this point and we need any potential townies to use their vote to choose the more likely mafia option of what we've today. If Taylor was sitting on only one vote right now, I would do the same.

I was even thinking about voting shelly while catching up, but the wagon now seems to have dismantled/is harder to get through than Taylor. (I also enjoy Taylor wagon more either way...)

Anyhow, use your vote efficiently. Don't be a vote waster for selfish reasons.

[Bunno]

@Alonzo @Ico

Between Taylor vs Teacher, where are you leaning to vote at the moment?

[Bunno]

I"m done for tonight.

See you.

If wagons completely change again beyond my predictions I'll compromisse by the way.

I'm not compromissing on teacher though, it seems 100% a random elimination.

[Bunno]

I'm saying I will hammer anyone at L-1, not instahammer them

don't

I can understand compromissing but accepting a random elimination that you should be spiritually against doesn't seem wise

BM is saying you may be partners with teacher but I can only think of you doing this as mafia if teacher is town

most likely

. Acting mad so that you can hammer anyone that gets to L-1.

there's no good reason to use the full deadline but there's no reason to random elim just to end one day. We've like, 3 elims or so, don't waste it.

[Bunno]

Teacher feels like a very random spontaneous wagon

Mena has been talking about "anyone but teacher", and says Taylor is sus, but never joins Taylor wagon.

Why is this game so messed up? It's not even about me compromissing anymore, Mena it's you that doesn't want to compromisse on Taylor at all.

If you/TGP which if I remember correctly sus Taylor do come with us on her wagon, we may have a shoot on getting someone other than teacher. I don't really feel any good reason for that random teacher wagon.

what are your reasons against the teacher case? you hadnt posted them at this point.

I read the case but felt like your reasons were very generic. I actually had a slightly good impression of teacher's posts. He was one of the few ones interested in Taylor in the beginning as well.

Maybe if Taylor is town I would be a bit more skeptical of him but for now I enjoy having his slot around.

[Bunno]

I"m done for tonight.

See you.

If wagons completely change again beyond my predictions I'll compromisse by the way.

I'm not compromissing on teacher though, it seems 100% a random elimination.

I'd like to see you defend this position substantively, rather than repeatedly posting:

"Noooooo, anybody but teacher, i don't understand how we could do this, please!".

Like, you've read the thread, please engage with the case at least for credibility points.

I've given up on discussing on lenght the cases. I only have 30 - 60 minutes per day optimally

maybe more if the day is uneventful or I'm lazying around (which unhappily I'm in the last few days), but I don't want to discuss this because I don't see how I can change your mind easily or even at all.

I discussed Taylor for 20 pages and could only get 2 votes. Discussing is useless in many cases.

I'm explaining this for future events as well.

[Bunno]

bunno why are all your reads revolving around Taylor associatives. this sounds like a good way to backtrack on everything if you’re scum and Taylor is actually town tbqh

No, even outside of Teacher's Taylor read I do like teacher posts, but he's one of the best scum players in this playerlist I think.

I was floored once by scum!teacher while inspecting a game. Teacher's posts are always about logical inconsistencies, which is easier to fake as scum.

I would classify Teacher together with Aster, both are difficult to read especially in the early days.

However

, I don't feel any basis for a

Teacher elim

today.

(

question

: is it "Teacher's elim" or Teacher elim"? Because it's a elimination about teacher but not a elimination owned by teacher)

[Bunno]

you still think taylor is scum??

da actual fuq!?

?

What's wrong about it? I'm notorious for tunneling I feel. As I said, I tunneled in TM for 3 days, always talking about the same 2 players, and I wasn't necessarily wrong.

I may be right, I may be wrong, but there's no reason to always change your reads.

[Bunno]

I'm a bit tired of this. It's also good for the day come to an end so I can stop being distracted

VOTE: Shelly

L-1 by my count.

Datisi's vote was L-2.

I don't believe a lot in this wagon but if it's what you guys believe...

[Bunno]

By the way, if this is town I may be interested on people other than Taylor tomorrow.

Don't default my vote to Taylor, I low-key feel those recent wagons have been super awful and the amount of AtE is overdone.

[Bunno]

man this makes me feel like teacher/datisi/taylor is the solve

everyone remember this thanks

I was vt, sorry for the subpar play anyways, good luck.

If this is true it sucks, sorry.

It was either you or teacher but objectively speaking your flip does progress the game more outside of my own reads.

I could do teacher if it did progress the game but it truly doesn't.

[Bunno]

If you can't see why bob can be easily scum I don't know what to say to you.

[Bunno]

Vigilante always shoot on Taylor/Bob/Noraa here in my opinion.

[Bunno]

BM hard town if she is indeed green btw

what about me

your entire reason of your read on me was because I wasn't voting shelly

[Bunno]

Datisi also leaves my scumpool but idk where to yet

please don't

[Bunno]

BM hard town if she is indeed green btw

what about me

your entire reason of your read on me was because I wasn't voting shelly

You’re still nullish

[Bunno]

Are you willing to consider Taylor tomorrow though Mena?

[Bunno]

shall we all just agree scum won?

yes