Xenoblade 2 Mafia: Game Over

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I am Emperor Ronald Reagan
Born again with fascist cravings
Still, you made me president

Human rights will soon go 'way
I am now your Shah today
Now I command all of you

to VOTE: SirCakez

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Oh are we all just mass-claiming today?

absolutely not

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: gamma emerald

-ronald reagan

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Oh are we all just mass-claiming today?

absolutely not

+1

i place 60% odds on 1 or 2 scum claiming here to encourage others to do it

possible for bm, unlikely for mwb. gut says mwnn's claim isn't scummy.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

oh nvm

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: gamma emerald

-ronald reagan

tell me which head tags as what
because depending on who this is I might have concerns

i'm the senile one

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Cakes, I, and a lot of the deathy, townread you in antechamber. This is NOT what I'm feeling here.

I am probably gonna have to do meta homework before surgery now, ugh, gods.

not seeing what you're seeing

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I was considering not having this conversation but I am going to do it anyway.

Why is claiming sub optimal?
Either select drivers should claim so we can get some amount of actions going through or we should full claim and organize the largest amount of actions possible.

Let's say hypothetically me and firebringer agree to connect up. Then there is a 50% chance we share the same trait as a driver/blade and we do nothing.
Idk do you think scum have such strong anti claim tools we should just throw away actions?

Because scum almost certainly have a role that states something like "You can pick a player and if they are a blade XYZ SUPERBAD STUFF HAPPENZ"

I would literally rather rely on blind pairing luck than this shit day one. Massclaim is gonna be a TERRIBLE look, if we go that route, bad shit's gonna happen. I don't like bad shit happening.

my assumption based on sample roles are that drivers are for the most part, functionally VTs that get to steer night actions. outing the class of roles in that sense amounts to outing PRs which is obviously a bad idea

-reagan

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

more votes for gamma please

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

personally i think we should kill all these chinese cartoon things

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Reasonings? I have some concerns in that direction, as well as in Firebringer's.
~strange

maybe later

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

excessive posting is antitown

said SirCakez, whilst himself boasting 33 posts in under an hour.

pretty grubby post, given he just said he was trying to break it off

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

excessive posting is antitown

said SirCakez, whilst himself boasting 33 posts in under an hour.

pretty grubby post, given he just said he was trying to break it off

Is grubby a bad thing in this sense?

yeah. way it shifted from him attacking cakez for not wanting to engage him to calling him a hypocrite for not wanting excessive posting, when arguing with BM was why his post count was so high...felt like he's twisting things to paint cakez in a bad light

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: gamma emerald

-ronald reagan

tell me which head tags as what
because depending on who this is I might have concerns

i'm the senile one

well if you don't make things clear I'm gonna treat you with lowest common denominator on how bad your posting looks for the two of you
which I'ma just say one of you probably shouldn't be pushing me legitimately at this point

the vice president tells me has a good track record of reading you although it's outdated. but we both think you're scummy.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

NoName might just be like this and I doubt he cares if I'm voting him

VOTE: midwaybear

This however

bad vote

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

NoName might just be like this and I doubt he cares if I'm voting him

VOTE: midwaybear

This however

bad vote

I think his help and posts are extraordinarily bland and serve no purpose other than to look townie

But not

bland, maybe, but first post came across as legitimate setup concern, and something like 282 is analysis, not posturing.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Pretty sure Noraa is actual scum here, guys.

maybe

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

NoName might just be like this and I doubt he cares if I'm voting him

VOTE: midwaybear

This however

bad vote

I think his help and posts are extraordinarily bland and serve no purpose other than to look townie

But not

bland, maybe, but first post came across as legitimate setup concern, and something like 282 is analysis, not posturing.

Last game I played with him (shoot me, this is all I have), his confidence was unbridled. I think anyone trying to pull out a solve that early is either baiting the room for more reads or they're not really worried about it being wrong cause they're scum if that makes sense

how recently was this? because i was in his most recent towngame that just ended a few days ago, and he was certainly not confident there. also, where's he "trying to pull out a solve"?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Couple months ago? I was scum in that game. He had great town tone and the initiative was there but a lot his posting were bordering between uncertainty/blind confidence if someone pushed him. His blind confidence lead him to some good reads but he just didn't have the authority to push them. I probably used solve in a stupid way, I was basically trying to say I feel his statements are too confident from a perspective of having played with him and just in general

he doesn't really play with as much confidence anymore, can say that from having tried to do the homework on him recently. but feel good about him being town this game.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Hey Guillotina didn't expect to see you here (It's Chelsea)
wanna vote Cakez or Regan and get a scum?

0/2 tbqh

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Couple months ago? I was scum in that game. He had great town tone and the initiative was there but a lot his posting were bordering between uncertainty/blind confidence if someone pushed him. His blind confidence lead him to some good reads but he just didn't have the authority to push them. I probably used solve in a stupid way, I was basically trying to say I feel his statements are too confident from a perspective of having played with him and just in general

he doesn't really play with as much confidence anymore, can say that from having tried to do the homework on him recently. but feel good about him being town this game.

I think we agree to disagree, but I dug you being on Gamma so I don't really have any beef with you atm

your meta being out of date makes sense for where the read is coming from anyway, i don't hate you for it, just telling you i don't think it's acccurate


i wish i could townread gamma for his aggro but it feels a little bit performative here

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Gamma's anger in this situation is NAI. As is most anger in mafia. I think he really is upset at BM and if he's a wolf he could just be honestly posting or upping it a little. Are we gonna catch scum Gamma off that theory? No, it'd be off other factors so I think it's best put to the side atm.

the "other factors" are why i'm voting him

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Gamma's anger in this situation is NAI. As is most anger in mafia. I think he really is upset at BM and if he's a wolf he could just be honestly posting or upping it a little. Are we gonna catch scum Gamma off that theory? No, it'd be off other factors so I think it's best put to the side atm.

the "other factors" are why i'm voting him

Can you quote them or catch me to speed?

you're free to peruse his iso

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I dislike that nobody had anything to say about Flavor Leaf despite me clearly asking

Until someone gives me a good reason I'm not letting scum have an excuse to townread him lol

i don't expect to get a handle on every player in a large on day 1 and i get the sense from him i shouldn't be making any judgment early. seems fine so far.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

MariaR ignored my guilty
Very sad

that's because you're not supposed to bus on page 1

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

It also just seems like your vote is based off pure dislike for his playstyle.

correct. because he's scum.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

correct. because he's scum.

Why is it because gamma is scum compared to town him just really getting irked?

in short: because he's not attempting to sort

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

But, yeah, I don't see this viewpoint from town on Cakez. Like, he's not going "Look at this read" it really feels like he's saying "Tell me why I'm scum!"

don't think "why me" is a reliable tell

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

But, yeah, I don't see this viewpoint from town on Cakez. Like, he's not going "Look at this read" it really feels like he's saying "Tell me why I'm scum!"

don't think "why me" is a reliable tell

You're going to have to give up your EM card.

~ strange

it's been 5 years since my last trophy run, the card is long since expired

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

But, yeah, I don't see this viewpoint from town on Cakez. Like, he's not going "Look at this read" it really feels like he's saying "Tell me why I'm scum!"

don't think "why me" is a reliable tell

You're going to have to give up your EM card.

~ strange

it's been 5 years since my last trophy run, the card is long since expired

It's been 36 years since 84! Don't lie.

shit i'm caught

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

If I lose my conviction on Cakez, I will vote MWNN alongside Bell.

have a slight townread on my good pal clint eastwood

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I kinda like Noraa rn but it’s still quite early wrt reading her

how do you have anything positive on her, and why mention this now

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I kinda like Noraa rn but it’s still quite early wrt reading her

how do you have anything positive on her, and why mention this now

Too slow noob. I reserved this line of questioning first.

your post didn't even come up in preview edit, we were that closely in sync

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

off to a good start

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I remember it started sometime in May, but after checking it ended in July.
About BM, I didn't really townread him. I just find the way he plays to be a little grating personally, but Cakez reasons didn't seem too substantiated to me. Considering that Cakez apparently only played in BM scum games, it's a bit weird. I like that Cakez backed off though, but neither of them are really confident reads rn.

Forgot to respond. Gamma/BM seems like a clear battle going on, what's your take on it?

Afk

It's bizarre and my initial impression is that Gamma is probably trying to sacc himself to make BM look better.

I could be wrong, but that's how it feels to me.

haha, i floated the idea of it being theater to the vice president but he thought it was too far-fetched

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

in short, I don't think I get any significant towncred from Gamma flipping scum.

glad to see we're in agreement

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

in short, I don't think I get any significant towncred from Gamma flipping scum.

glad to see we're in agreement

Has the VP posted yet?

the vice president would like to give the game his full undivided attention but is

out overthrowing a central american government

busy with work but has skimmed and given feedback, he won't be in until wednesday

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84467
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=84480

Read me in both of these and tell me if you think I handle a second of being scum with BM after I made up my mind on him.

In addition, curious why people are voting me at this point. I have given reads, so what’s the fucking deal?

i don't see what this game has to do with battle mage

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: fermis flames

Uhhhh you can’t vote us because we haven’t voted you yet for you to respond with this vote.

lmao

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I'm town this time btw.

I'm not town.

we know

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

The fact Noraa dodged addressing my townread on her is pretty damn dodgy too

what townread?

I had a light townread on you back when you had 6 posts
I’m not happy I stuck my neck out for you only to get repaid with betrayal and disregard

this is such a weird thing to say. like she's required to defend you because you called her town early?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Read further ):

i did but i'm not seeing good justification for that feeling.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

keep trying to post one little thing and get ninja'd. still don't feel the cakez vote. i felt the bell vote even if got stupid about it later. here? not vibing. will take a look again but that's where i'm at.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

was agreeing with bell on nora but i think i have to 180 now

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

was agreeing with bell on nora but i think i have to 180 now

Why the flip?

because of her last couple posts?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

is this how people felt about me when i was confidently pushing a bad read? i wonder

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

was agreeing with bell on nora but i think i have to 180 now

Why the flip?

because of her last couple posts?

They didn't have that impact on me. But, you do you.

~ strange

emotional claim under relatively little pressure seems non-scum indicative for her

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: Cobra Kai

let's shake things up

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: Cobra Kai

let's shake things up

I liked Cobra Kai's posts

i don't

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: Cobra Kai

let's shake things up

I liked Cobra Kai's posts

i don't

Spin requests that you stop making bad posts. Particularly if you're town.

~ strange

i have never made a good post and i never will

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

i re-iso'd cakez and while i do not feel as good about him being town i'm not seeing obvscum still

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

prolly scum somewhere in that weird pool of people who aren't lurking but also aren't particularly active
people like (cobra, reagan bush, beeboy, Maria, MWNN)

beeboy is my back pocket scum read.

and reagan is trying to be a dark horse in the running.

i'll have you know i plan to win a landslide vote

(the vice president gutread beeboy as scum off his start)

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

gutread dunn as town but somewhat worried by him seeming to actually give a shit

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

gutread dunn as town but somewhat worried by him seeming to actually give a shit

Why

which part

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

gutread dunn as town but somewhat worried by him seeming to actually give a shit

Why

which part

Why is him giving a shit a bad sign

because from what i have seen he frequently does very little as town

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

gutread dunn as town but somewhat worried by him seeming to actually give a shit

Why

which part

Why is him giving a shit a bad sign

because from what i have seen he frequently does very little as town

He also does little as scum
When he does do stuff though, I think him actually showing the level of engagement he is is actually a town tell

good to know, that takes away some of my reservation there

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

he doesn't need to be more readable lmao

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

he doesn't need to be more readable lmao

Given I don’t agree (and iirc so do a few others) with ffer’s read there, I disagree with this notion.

the only one i remember suggesting he's scum is cakez and it wasn't much of a serious read. but he's town.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Which scums tried to miseliminate him.

could be lld tbh

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Tbh I doubt I was a scum led miselim given those dark misgivings I mentioned before

there's probably scum who voted you purely by math, just have to look and see whose reasons felt real and who was after you because they saw a target

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

there's probably scum who voted you purely by math

They had what, 4 votes out of 21 other players?

This seems like some bad math

at different times, me/BM/brian/LLD/nora.

i checked, you're right, it is bad math, disregard

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

l4pe is scum btw

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

l4pe is scum btw

Hottake!

What don’t you like about them?

lot of neutral commentary filler type posts when i went bck over the iso and i didn't like the stuff about asking for people to sort, 1288 is pretty empty. i may wake up in the morning and hate this read though who knows

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

TM WF Syndrome

what is this

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

i should read before posting

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

those pages will mostly be left for muffin to muddle through.

laff

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

TM WF Syndrome probably tests positive on BSkies

What is TM WF syndrome?

Team Mafia White Flag Syndrome
It’s where I end up scumreading a bunch of town for being on a wagon I don’t agree on
The fact a good chunk of my sus list lined up with the people who voted me made me think it was happening again
I’m not writing off the whole set as town, but there’s probably a good chunk (3-4)

natural response when the wagon is on yourself, tbh

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Reagan I still disagree about midway, It's pure gut but something don't seem right. You make agreeable posts but I don't see your tenacity yet so I hesitate to townread you.
I think if Firebringer were town even if his shitposting would be more effective, pause for thought
Fermis is a constant presence but I find myself not really reading them, but something tells me they're alright
Dunn made two calls of provocation and everyone ignored it, why
Catching up doesn't ping me despite his posts up until now being mostly the joke
Sort Flavor Leaf now rather than later that is all I ask thanks

Gullotina/l4pe/ManWithNoName/Cobra Kai are all the same to me. I wouldn't doubt some scum being in there.

Huh that wasn't so bad

midway's out of his scumrange and really trying to figure things out, way he interacted with the cakez wagon showed legit concernat trying to figure out if it was a read people believed in or were just sheeping. this will be forgotten when he gets bored of the game on day 3.

i get the impression flavor leaf isn't easy to sort so i don't know how you're expecting to do it on day 1

i think guillotina is likely town for reasons not worth getting into right now

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

oh i found the post

l4pe is scum btw

Hottake!

What don’t you like about them?

lot of neutral commentary filler type posts when i went bck over the iso and i didn't like the stuff about asking for people to sort, 1288 is pretty empty. i may wake up in the morning and hate this read though who knows

i mean fair enough i havent played a game of mafia seriously in a literal year

so

im not used to actually trying as either alignment

should this make me town? nah

im just laying out what you should expect, and that is overall lots of shitposting

maybe i will put in a notable amount of effort later

interesting

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

i get the impression flavor leaf isn't easy to sort so i don't know how you're expecting to do it on day 1

town read, and like...exactly that, that mindset they're trying to push, or paranoia around me they're trying to create. why do they have paranoia? are they an alt? i don't know who they are.

This is a discredit attempt. Unwnd is scum. Bet.[

/quote]

BTW this is why his ego is dangerous

I'm just an avid game reader and I have second-hand experience u could say

"dangerous ego" would imply he's town here, though, no?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I would like him to be but right now I cannot read Flavor Leaf on suspension of disbelief. I think his content lacks and I want to seperate him from Don Corgi whatever and just Regular Mafia Guy. See that's why ego is bad, I don't read anyone special unless I either a) Have experience with you b) The game has progressed beyond D1 and you've established yourself to me and we've clearly not hit b) so why should he be treated untouchable?

i'm not treating him as untouchable but would say his content has been

fine

so far and don't understand why you're bringing him up other than non-specific paranoia

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Cake... reads of these four slots in particular, humor me....


Midwaybears
Nachomuffin (Catch up)
Fermis Flames
Firebringer

Other people are welcome to opine on this list plus cakes.

town
slight town
town
scum
still town on cakez but i'm getting pushback there

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Role.

Related.

Reasons.

Those five names are not randomly selected.

i don't really believe you

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

deja vu?

something of that nature

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Role.

Related.

Reasons.

Those five names are not randomly selected.

The thread silence heard around the world.

Nobody cares

oof

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

i don't really believe you

Why?

"1 in X" type informed roles don't typically make sense balancewise and i've seen a bad fake

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

uh if you're hammered you should out role info now before lock

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

LLD is more likely town?

based on?

Some gut but she doesn't give me the rage vibes that she gives as scum

gonna need more than that to leave her. Me no want to lose to scum LLD.

is there anything to this read other than paranoia b/c she's good scum

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

lets not lynch people that annoy us and insteaad lynch people that scare me.

still need you to answer whether there's more to this than paranoia

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

lets not lynch people that annoy us and insteaad lynch people that scare me.

still need you to answer whether there's more to this than paranoia

no, if there was i would have said so. u dont hold back ur best cards when ur trying to go for the big cat that is LLD

hate this but at the same time think it's a little more likely to come from town

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Maybe you should full claim...

no

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Why Firebringer? He has a very weird positioning if scum.

what does 'positioning' matter?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I hear what you’re saying Noraa. But you’re still being meek.

Ninja-
Interesting unwnd. Care to elaborate more?

This is the like the perfect game for Firebringer to excel in and he remains to be unseen. It's kinda hard to go further than that but I think it makes sense

the funny thing is i'm reading firebringer in that game cakez linked and it's like...a copy

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I hear what you’re saying Noraa. But you’re still being meek.

Ninja-
Interesting unwnd. Care to elaborate more?

This is the like the perfect game for Firebringer to excel in and he remains to be unseen. It's kinda hard to go further than that but I think it makes sense

the funny thing is i'm reading firebringer in that game cakez linked and it's like...a copy

I missed it, is this a good or bad thing?

Here
Read this game
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=77774
Gorkington pulled the same crap Cabd is doing this game, I got super frustrated and pissed off there too, and then because of the setup Gorkington basically single handedly cost most of the town the game when I got elimmed
And he had the same bullshit overconfidence

he was scum, kept calling cakez mislynch bait

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I town read l4pe and unwnd for whatever that is worth as well :V

okay, why

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I town read l4pe and unwnd for whatever that is worth as well :V

okay, why

i wasn't expecting much but i'm still disppointed

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I town read l4pe and unwnd for whatever that is worth as well :V

okay, why

i wasn't expecting much but i'm still disppointed

Feel like discussing your current vote?

~ strange

not really, it's pretty half assed, and the vice president doesn't agree. still processing how i feel about his more recent content

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

It's kind of shitty though, because it has to do with his AtE and I don't want to go into it, not because it's inaccurate, but because it might be.

Every scum who is brought low like that, they all eventually resort to cheap survivialism and emotional manipulation. Since they realize their other tool box isn't working. Unless they have a cool head.

yeah but town gets emotional too. i've killed a lot of townies for failing to read emotion well. what's different here?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

SRing someone with 10 posts. That is such a vanity and more compromise wagon material than anything else.

Misrep.

Also, what does them having 10 posts do to their chances of rolling scum?

I’m not even pushing the idea of fading LLD, i just want to see what happens when LLD gets pressured.

You cannot read someone with 10 posts. It is clearly compromise wagon material not an actual legitimate SR.

nora's making bad posts again

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

VOTE: LLD

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

there was a thing i wanted to say about LLD but i was waiting til i could get a reads list together

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I think she could be way more aggressive than she is, Bell.

Presidents jumping off me after minimal pressure or interaction is strange.

i got bored with it a while ago but your post about trying to bait nora out with a feint like some kung-fu maneuver convinced me to move on

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

tbh, it's not a very good wagon from my blind town perspective.

Everytime you post I just think 'yes' and by george you've done it again man

hrmery

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Man I really hate Flavor Leaf's posting please someone tell me why he's townread he's so full of himself

is being full of himself scummy? i like the way he's looking at things even if some of it is a little out there. recent posts where he was looking at peoples' trajectory on cakez was good, an eye for big picture stuff, what people are doing as the game progresses. you keep mentioning some dislike of him that seems almost entirely based in stylistic issues and never crosses the bridge to scum

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

well

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

maybe bush will be able to catch up during the 4 day night

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

@Brian - I think we’re correct in regards to LLD, but I don’t have faith in us being able to push it through.

Rip Day 1 LLD Dream-wagon.

To be fair, I was never expecting it to happen over Cakez anyway.

it was never happening period but let me get it on the record: i'm not really sure what LLD's doing this game, but it's a very easy way to play as scum, i've done it before, the naked vote minimal content thing. might be choosing not to project towniness, i don't know. but certainly don't see the townreads there

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

you again keep making these posts undermining him that also imply he's town

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

that got destroyed by so many ninjas but my old man brain forgot to quote

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

you again keep making these posts undermining him that also imply he's town

Who me? I don't think insidious is a way I'd describe someone to be town

the talk of "hubris" does imply it, though. thought you meant that the effect that had was insidious, not that his play itself was

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

reads
Bell, Gamma, BM
Cabd, Dunn, Maria, beeboy
Comfortable
Fermi, unwnd, Brian
Regan, cobra
Flavor, l4pe, Gullo, noraa, LLD, firebringer, MWNN, Cakez, catchup

will catch up later

beeboy's placement in this list is frankly offensive

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

however this ends up going i think i can pull together a decent list of townreads from this day phase

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

reads
Bell, Gamma, BM
Cabd, Dunn, Maria, beeboy
Comfortable
Fermi, unwnd, Brian
Regan, cobra
Flavor, l4pe, Gullo, noraa, LLD, firebringer, MWNN, Cakez, catchup

will catch up later

beeboy's placement in this list is frankly offensive

If I'm honest l4pe's is pretty not cool either. Or the presidential runoffs
-spin

i don't blame him for not being able to read me, and i've been playing this pretty low-key. being above the pile is good enough. l4pe is probably above bottom tier, though, yes.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

If someone not-Cabd has questions about stuff from the case I'll address it

do you have a full reads list?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I like beeboy for now because his reads are on unwnd and l4pe. I'm pretty sure he is pretty familiar with both of them, so it makes sense for town!beeboy to exclusively have reads on them.
Also, I know my readlist likely wasn't helpful for any of you.

no, it was fine, a lot of your townreads i/we agree with but there's a few points of difference. beeboy dropping some townreads on his friends without really playing the game and not justifying them, while getting scummoned just to vote maria for no reason isn't a good look. shows a lack of curiosity. like if there's a token demotivated lurkscum it's him. and how is it that beeboy gets a towny town read for that but the other two are lower? doesn't really track to townread

him

for those reads on them when you don't fully agree yourself, no?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

doesn't really track to townread him for those reads on them when you don't fully agree yourself, no?

beeboy has been lurky in most games recently, so I don't want to read him based off of that. It's not really about whether I agree with them to me(he could be right on both after all), it's just that I feel like it makes sense as a town approach from him. If he was scum, I don't really think he would be so lost(maybe).

bush tells me him being a lost lurksack is not abnormal for him as scum. he doesn't like playing it and can't summon the energy to keep up.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Why isn't Prism posting in the main thread?

he just started a new job and is acclimating. this was anticipated when we agreed to do this. i've conveyed his opinions when he hasn't been able to post himself.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

This is my first post of the game. I'm actually annoyed because I literally planned to post

starting right now

only to see midway's prod which I think is the first of the game lmao. That's not midway's fault, though.

I don't like to halfass games, and really like to devote my complete and laser-focused attention, so I really don't like to post without being completely caught up and aware of exactly all that has happened. I wasn't able to really be around yesterday, and I spent all day reading but only got up to page ~50 or so. When this fails, it's time to start working

around

the time limitations. Assuming I won't be useful to others until fully caught up might be a mistake.

I've been able to serve as a kind of check on peta's reads but it sucks for him to have to talk with someone living 50 pages in the past. The leading wagon of Cakez I generally agreed with. His interactions with Cabd early strangely seemed to assume Cabd town, and it was only later that he got more aggressive. I also really didn't like his 317. It made both a categorical error and an error by omission imo. The latter is more interesting. Cakez's point is to compare how defensive/OMGUSy BM got, but the first quote highlights what town Cakez was looking for in a town BM: passion. I'd classify BM as having plenty of it in the early game. I don't know if this is just wrong thinking by Cakez or outright scummy, but the interactions with Cabd led me to lean the latter.

I've got a lot of townreads/townleans, ranging from the hardtown Battle Mage to medium TR Gamma and the dart throw townlean Cobra Kai.

I don't know how to feel about the tracker claim without reading more, and I'm actually very wary of Cabd's start. I mostly agreed with all of his early townreads minus I think l4pe, but they're flowing too easily and are too easy for me see and understand. This is rarer than it sounds, and counterintuitively makes me worried they're faked. He's just seen several scumteams fall flat after not coming out guns blazing in early games, so playing very aggressively from the get-go makes a lot of sense....but the early reads I did tend to agree with. Tough call.

I'm really curious as to what your goals were coming into this game Cabd and of their origins. I see confidence and I see guns blazing in the wake of missed opportunities. The fact that I'm skeptical of how preemptive your explanation was speaks more poorly of me than of you. But was there anything else you had in mind coming into this one? I'm also a bit surprised by your approach to the Fermis slot, who you seem more inclined early to leave at "sort alignment via Tammy" rather than be more proactive in cooperation.

Bush

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I also took notes of some posts of interest, but appear to have lost them in the corner of my office, or more likely my car. I'll see if I can find them.

Feel free to bounce ideas off of me for anyone that wants, though. I'll be around for about an hour.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Ok maybe the Reagan hydra is actually town

What specifically about my post gave you that idea? This is rather fast.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Prism what does a dart throw read mean?

It's my term for what others would call a gut read. I call it a dart throw because even though the read exists, the more rational side of me doesn't put a lot of stock in them if it can avoid it. I might dig up the specific posts later, but I think I had something I want to ask Cakez and a bit of work to do on unwnd.

Bush

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Ok maybe the Reagan hydra is actually town

What specifically about my post gave you that idea? This is rather fast.

The fact it felt like you were genuinely sorting and were picking up good signals from what I’d skimmed of your big post.

Oh you sweet summer child.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Flavor seems to think Midway might be scum. Might be an interesting topic for us to talk about if you want to? You're a dart throw townlean for me too, can't remember how the President feels.

Me and Ronnie are both very sure that Midway is town right from the get-go, easily our single strongest townread even individually. Jumping right into mechanics and claiming blade was a very bold move, and even though I haven't liked/understood some of his early reads his questions in general have been very on point. Having seen what happened in FGO, this would be a very big step up for him imo

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Eh Flavor's busy with LLD. Maybe another time. I'll catch up with Cabd.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Eh Flavor's busy with LLD. Maybe another time. I'll catch up with Cabd.

GET BACK HERE YOU RIGHT WING WARHAWKS.

Did you have something for me (Bush) that I missed?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Well, he fits the spot I was filling Bell into. I've never seen townMidway, though.

I did like what he said against Nacho/Zmuffin hydra, though.

I was feeling off with their posts as well, but I can't put my finger on to why. Maybe it was the timing of their posts when other stuff was going.

Hm, okay, me being 50 pages in the past bites us here. Will circle back. I appreciate you trying for me though!

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Listen Gamma, you're not wrong in your result, and arguing about the process is kind of a waste when I think you're town anyway even if I'm not 100% on it. And your answer doesn't really surprise me.

That said, if you're looking to nail me in future games, I...would really review the entrances in the scumgames you've seen me play.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

My goal this game was "stop holding myself back when I get a strong scumread and let others talk me out of it"

Other things I had in mind? I wanted to roll mafia. I've not gotten a red PM since nearing two years ago, and If I do roll scum, I want it in a player list of people who will motivate me to work for every inch. Guess I'll have to sign up for another after this.

The Tammy-exclusive thing was a joke. Want me to pull up my ISO about their slot? Essentially, I have three different town things I look for, one per head, and all three are hitting them.

The ffery head I think is here to encourage me to vote my heart out after seeing what happened the last two games. Reads that she is partially responsible for stamping out, at that.

My memory had you being a bit more passive w/r/t the Fermis hydra, and leaving the ball more in their court, over more actively looking to bounce reads off them. This isn't limited just by my memory, though, but also by my own lack of familiarity with you. Shame. I have a long to-do list, don't I?

For now I'll just return to your early reads. Some of the ones I agreed with I already mentioned. I'll say your early l4pe townread I thought was a mistake, in the sense that very base level reflexive questioning are essentially freebies as scum and not that NAI. Super safe, often townread but NAI at best if not outright scummy imo.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

LLD, did you have something you wanted to talk to me and/or Reagan about?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Me/Reagan are going to take awhile to sort unwnd. In my real-time glancethrough I leaned town, but my more careful readthrough I found their posts on Gamma unnaturally convoluted and suspected they're performative. It's kind of annoying to get the telegraphed theme of what I'll argue later so my apologies.

Reagan seems to go back and forth on their more recent stuff w/ Flavor but that's a job for the the Bush of tomorrow/Thursday.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Me/Reagan are going to take awhile to sort unwnd. In my real-time glancethrough I leaned town, but my more careful readthrough I found their posts on Gamma unnaturally convoluted and suspected they're performative. It's kind of annoying to get the telegraphed theme of what I'll argue later so my apologies.

Reagan seems to go back and forth on their more recent stuff w/ Flavor but that's a job for the the Bush of tomorrow/Thursday.

i said i thought him having a meltdown here was probably town

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Maria and LLD are scum. I'll do my own investigating tonight, but I'm confident in Maria more than LLD.

I don't really want to get into mechanics. I say this because I know this post invites it so let me repeat that:

Exploring this thought of mine publicly right now is a bad idea. Think on it privately

I found Maria's mechanical claim about benefiting from knowing driver/blade targets plausibly a hard scumclaim. Food for thought. I've always found Maria a coinflip to read in games I've followed along with iirc, and have a lot more experience rolling scum against her, so I don't put a lot of stock in my skepticism about the more qualitative side of their posts.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

if you're saying this because I'm acting like I'm an investigative PR, that was the point. That doesn't mean I'm an investigative PR.

Your post just reminded me about Maria, might as well not be related at all.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I'm super salty about that kill, I wanted to ask when any of those heads rolled scum with me and ffery I really think I could have worked with this game. They were my 3rd strongest townread.

Either way, I'm completely caught up and my engine is revved. Let's do this shit.

Bush

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Those are some huge fuckin' posts from Cabd and Cobra holy shit, will tackle Cobra's in a second

For now here's where I'm at reads wise. Normally I like to do tiers but there's a lot of players and doing a strict ordering was more useful.

Town
========
Cabd
Midwaybear
Fermis Flames
Battle Mage
Gamma Emerald
ManWithNoName
Flavor Leaf
Cobra Kai
Dunnstral
Bell
BrianSkies
l4pe
LLD
Guillotina
unwnd
beeboy
Firebringer
Will catch up later maybe
MariaR
Noraa
========
Scum

This list starts getting sketchy around Dunnstral territory, I also think I'd burn either of Maria or Noraa with beeboy/Muffincho next on deck.

Briefly explaining the scumreads, I should backlink some of this w/ examples when I have time. I really want to get to reading the Cobra/Cabd posts, though

Maria's posts in general had me as very eh and at times super performative, I don't like their claim, and I need to check the Cakez vote timing.

I think Noraa's reaction to Cabd was a lot more concerned with asserting that Cabd & co. weren't all that great over genuinely trying to sort Cakez/Cabd. Their defensiveness was kind of fine? But I'm concerned as to why they're so concerned with shooting down other players' ego over just sorting them/the people following them, the concern is to win the game not prove Cabd is a moron.

beeboy just hasn't done shit and had a bad entrance imo

Nacho's interactions with Cakez reeked of blatant coaching to save him, he's not going to like me pushing him but w/e. At least it's not bad play if you were town, I just didn't get the vibe that genuinely sorting him was his intent, more that he was trying to get Cakez to reset and make better posts. Cakez's halfassed reaction made this worse.

Bush

P-Edit jesus christ the pace

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

You put me in the middle of your reads.
You're confirmed scum now RB84.

Reagan is very convinced you're town FWIW

I don't fuckin' know u tho sorry bud

I just thought you were noticeably lost early game and so I was kind of ???

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Cobra Kai's wall is great. He can take Fermis's spot. I'll look more into the specific points later but all of this is incredibly perceptive at a minimum. I'll trust that the motivation/validity of conclusion is there for now and review when we're not moving a mile a minute. Scum need to get the ball back in their court for sure but his Day 1 was already town to me.

For Cobra: I get why you think that post of mine is sketchy. I don't really think inviting the dialogue to shift into our (Reagan/Bush's) Day 1 play is really that beneficial here over just powertowning it and voting scum. That said, it might help you if you knew the question I had for Cakez 2665 is why the hell he defended us to Maria, I thought that was really awful.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Also he's not wrong that my opening post was sus lmao, I don't prefer to hold things back though. I found ffery really annoying in Illicit but they were blatantly town here and weren't treating me the same way.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Current pool I'm working with is Noraa/MWNN/Bush/MariaR. Muffin and I are in sync on the first two, not as hotly together on the latter two.

Mind elaborating where you differ in each of the last two?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

??? did someone lie about their role or not noraa lmao

agree with cabd that this sounds like a scumclaim btw

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

??? did someone lie about their role or not noraa lmao

agree with cabd that this sounds like a scumclaim btw

Shockingly this is a Bush post, I know I can channel the President sometimes on my better days

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Man I'm really tired and more in the mood to spitball over indepth reading, ~112 pages was really tough for me to get through and my eyes definitely glazed over today getting the last 20, but I feel like I'm just useless/might as well be an AFK vote machine if I don't engage with the big scumreads from two of my top TRs. Guess I should push through and do that.

Pushing Noraa is also good enough for me though lmao

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Dunn I was eh on at first but he had one really good post yesterday imo, 2482 was great and I remember finding all of these believable+didn't see much point in positioning this way as scum. Not really trying to set up miselims on anyone except maybe l4pe, which would be WAY down the line and is not a good candidate at that point in time iirc

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Pretty sure I can guess who based off that last post but just lmao @ trying to fish out more here instead of just claiming it and letting them explain themselves after the fact

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

What use does a town aligned player have for knowing who is driver vs blade on a wagon?

I would find it scum even from a single player

but FOR A WHOLE WAGON lmao

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Literally who here, having seen how town PRs/early scum votes have been completely steamrolling games (see: FGO), decides town needs an entire wagon rolecop to help them out

This is literally a counterbalance in case of a scum elim

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Nacho, can you review where you/Muffin are differing on me and Maria? I really didn't like your Day 1 and want some proof of work.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Also I'm 100% down to vote Noraa, top scumread even before the claim and won't cry if she instadies, but I don't like blitzgames and want to actually review the walls eg. on Guillotina

P-Edit: Stalling for time is actually a good point. Hm. Maybe we should just speedwagon it.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Eh there's not that much danger here, posting your results in the scum PT doesn't take eons

Yeah I'll wait

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Speaking of FGO, Cabd having seen my commentary from FGO I hope you realize that even if I'm busy most of day 1 the chance of me not immediately telling peta to be more aggressive ASAP is zero

game should be free assuming this is actually scum lmao, which if it's town so help me god

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

game should be free assuming this is actually scum lmao, which if it's town so help me god

Weird take

thanks

been a long time since we got to town squad in perfect blue

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I think LLD-Guillatina is an exclusive one scum list.

I favor guillatina in that grouping.

I'm a lot more favorable to LLD than Reagan was. I don't have her town, and was definitely skeptical in my early readthrough, but I think the best way to put it is that she's really betting on playing passively and only kicking into gear later to go the distance as scum. I'm not terribly familiar with her meta, just know her as a more aggressive player, but I'm really OK with people playing this way.

I dunno, it's not like playing this way is killer as town, but I think her explanation about the length/pace of the game was totally fine and plausible. Assume she's town imo and let her kick back while the team gets rolled if she really wants if she's scum.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

My characters name is like Poopie something or another. I forgot. One sec. Lemme go find the pm.

owo
I feel like this kinda fits the ability she gave out if I'm right about what she means
and I want to very much not be hasty about voting out Noraa if she claims the flavor I think she is going to, because tbh I think it conftowns her?

I just want to point out that if scum lie about their driver/blade status, N1 autoloss is completely possible from this single role.

This is not a town role lmao

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I mean I guess it'd take them reversing their class claims completely, which is stupid to begin with, but 2-3 doing it is completely plausible, as are them being on a Day 1 wagon.

This easily gives multiple guilties in a single night lol

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Cabd are you trying to go Guillotina today or Noraa?

I know it's been like an hour, not asking you to commit, just wondering whether I should read through the wall ASAP or whether it can wait a bit

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Drive My Car is a really underrated Beatles song, I was a fan of that post

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I mean I guess it'd take them reversing their class claims completely, which is stupid to begin with, but 2-3 doing it is completely plausible, as are them being on a Day 1 wagon.

This easily gives multiple guilties in a single night lol

Mafia are unlikely to fakeclaim driver when they're really a blade, and vice versa.

This is

already confirmable

if a town driver targets a scum blade fakeclaiming driver. Note that there is no option to select

nobody

when asked to pair up,

you have to pick one of the drivers, or it selects automatically

This is something that already exists in the game without the role claim.

You're not wrong, and all 5 would be truly stupid, but given the existence of Driver/Blades and depending on how useful scum pairings are there are plausible incentives for a few to selectively fakeclaim.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Maybe its just me but I feel like cobra has done an insane amount of quick and dirty pocketing. Very unnoticeable and surface level but its there.
SR.

It might be because he put in a ton of time to analyze and give thoughtful, perceptive reads that inherently are less likely to come from scum, even if individual players are more opaque. What specifically do you dislike? He's actually come out very aggressive this day between Guillotina and my own slot.

I dislike Flavor, Cobra, and Presidents atm.

What did you think of my evaluation of your Day 1? (Bottom of this post)

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

3020 is fair l4pe. I honestly shouldn't be engaging with Noraa either at this point while I'm at it.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Mmmm that's worth responding to for Dunnstral, I think your specific counterpoint undermines my doomsday one and reins it in a bit, but it doesn't change the fact that this seems like a scum counterbalance and very overpowered in the hands of town. Even if it's not a 2/3 guilty machine it still carries the potential and 1 is not unexpected at all.

I was already hardscumreading Noraa beforehand so even though I'm normally a very slow burn player, and still haven't voted personally, part of me really wouldn't mind seeing us speedrun the day.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Reagan is their buddy, gamma.

My entire approach to you is basically that I townread you Day 1 despite Reagan, and I get why you scumread us and I'm fine running up the team before we get to the point where I'm ever on the table.

If you want to take it and that's a good enough deal for me, hopefully you live long enough for it to pay dividends.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Okay, Guillotina case. Gotta push through, if I don't come up with a post responding to this tonight someone needs to wack me.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Why do we need a different Guillotina case?

Not making one, but reading through yours/Cabds and actually being able to engage with it instead of being a worthless real-time spitballer

I'm down to flip Noraa basically anytime though

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Why do we need a different Guillotina case?

Not making one, but reading through yours/Cabds and actually being able to engage with it instead of being a worthless real-time spitballer

I'm down to flip Noraa basically anytime though

You staying up for this? because painkillers and pain say I'll be awake.

Yeah, grabbing a soda and pulling it up now, shouldn't even be a big deal it's literally 17 posts but I'm slow as fuck and my brain definitely doesn't wanna work in dialed-in focus mode rn

after that TBD but let me know if you want to talk about any other slots with me, i'm also not that big of a priority atm though

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Reading Guillotina's ISO I think this slot is town.

Cabd I'm sorry but I'm posting this before I get to your wall. I'll engage with it directly as I feel appropriate, but I think it's worth getting my general thoughts out there. Cobra's is difficult to respond to but I made one point below as I went through.

476 is the type of coaching I think might come from someone more experienced/confident like Nacho. It's tougher to tell with a player with a noticeably smaller toolset. They might still have one/two unusual tools in their arsenal. I was still open to it [Guillotina scum] here. Interactions with Maria/Fermis are kind of eh. Pocket not accepted is a fine post but nothing special.

1255 is really interesting. The Cakez characterization is natural for someone who just sees the wagon happening and Cakez, while not quite playing terribly was...definitely free, and many called him always miselim'd. Guillotina moves to analyze the other wagons.

1314 is strong imo. Gamma is probably town. Not actively hunting for a miselim here off of Cakez.

1357/1398 are pretty natural responses I think. Not trusting Cabd is pretty fine, and he just fundamentally misinterprets Cabd's point. Not +town but not +scum imo. Still not actively looking for a wagon until 12 hours later:

1685 is when he really starts pressuring/sorting others. 1685 defense of Bell/attack on Noraa is okay imo even if it's like, a single and not a homer. Worth noting he presses her for why she's opposing Cakez. I get why Cobra's a bit skeptical of the positioning here but I just...don't think it takes him this long to mount another vote if he really wants to defend Cakez. It's a solid single.

1885 is just inexperience with the playerlist and 1897 he comes around to realizing what Cabd is saying.

1293 rings honest to me and his replaceout makes sense in the context of not realizing how fastpaced the game would be. The explanation for Cakez doesn't 100% line up but I can see it.

I'm totally fine with this slot sitting in the townpile. I know Reagan also thought they were town, which gives me confidence, even though Reagan's reads some shit this game and I've enjoyed flexing on him

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Okay Cobra now you can push me for defending scum instead of runnin' em outta town

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I literally do not understand what anyone is seeing on Guillotina.

Is...is it a me problem?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Re: Cabd

Looks like we picked up the same thing on 476 being kind of leading/coaching. I think it's plausible for someone a weaker player trying to sort the wagon too.

Your point on 546 is a good one imo, town Guillotina should also be looking for a place to vote, but I dunno. I felt really lukewarm about these posts with Maria in general.

I think you're really going wrong in your reaction to the two posts where he calling Cakez LHF, misread you, and voted on Nora. I hate to be mean but to be blunt I think the cross-bus, lighten-the-load-on-both approach you're suggesting is out of his reach for sure right now. Very little chance it's intentional if he's even scum at all.

I think the biggest, most obvious reason I can give for him being town is the timing of him looking at other wagons and the result he got from doing so.

1255 into 1314 is EXTREMELY strong play from Guillotina scum imo.

Scum Guillotina decides he's not going on Cakez, goes to look for someone else to push, and instead of cooking up some bullshit reason to vote Gamma he actually recognizes he's town and holds off.

This sequence is out of his range for sure imo

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Not saying Guillo is too noobish to do it, but it feels a bit ehhhh if that's the case.

We've established that slot is not a newbie.

Remember?

he has several games offsite on MU but is still relatively new. had a thing about him claiming flavor early that was possibly noobtown, however, reaction to cakez isn't good, and his last post stinks. site meta for him is heavily anti-bus for the most part, looks bad for him on cakez but i don't know if that quite squares with nora being scum? probably not worth thinking that hard about it

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

It's this trajectory. Guillo was saving Sircakes, and trying to act like they were LHF. They also joined Noraa, who I also have a scum case for, and was pushing hard yesterday for a bit. They then went to LLD only to end up on Cakez when it was obvious Cakez was going down.

He made it clear he was hunting for other wagons. I don't really like him moving off of Noraa but this sequence makes complete sense to me as someone who doesn't really want to go on Cakez and is having trouble keeping up with the game. His point on Noraa was okay imo as was him actually realizing what Cabd is saying/proposing and resigning himself to it.

What do you think of my description of the Gamma sequence in 3154?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

WHY HELLO MR. PRESIDENT, GOOD TO HAVE YOU BACK

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

he has several games offsite on MU but is still relatively new. had a thing about him claiming flavor early that was possibly noobtown, however, reaction to cakez isn't good, and his last post stinks. site meta for him is heavily anti-bus for the most part, looks bad for him on cakez but i don't know if that quite squares with nora being scum? probably not worth thinking that hard about it

Hm, wasn't aware of the anti-bus meta thing but the fact that our reads have now kinda flipped is hilarious.

Guess we can talk this out in the Oval Office though.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Cabd are you trying to go Guillotina today or Noraa?

I know it's been like an hour, not asking you to commit, just wondering whether I should read through the wall ASAP or whether it can wait a bit

This just feels sus to me for some reason
why'd y'all ask this?

I literally said EXACTLY why I asked this in the post dude

Noraa was already my hardest scumread, I'm fine speedvoting her but was fine engaging w/ Cabd's scumread if he didn't want to speedvote her

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

cabd if nothing else can u give ur reaction to this part of my post, rest is kind of obviously *~just our opinions man~* but chewing on this would be nice

I think the biggest, most obvious reason I can give for him being town is the timing of him looking at other wagons and the result he got from doing so. 1255 into 1314 is EXTREMELY strong play from Guillotina scum imo. Scum Guillotina decides he's not going on Cakez, goes to look for someone else to push, and instead of cooking up some bullshit reason to vote Gamma he actually recognizes he's town and holds off.

This sequence is out of his range for sure imo

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Reagen is kind of feeling like scum trying to not let town overpower scum right now. Their reads list is relatively political, which is funny considering their account. I don't know, something's pinging. It feels like they're actively placing up walls in discussion.

??? in the most political way possible feel free to tackle whatever walls you think i'm putting up

evaluation of my readslist is fine, def consensus placements

Illicit I was a demotivated piece of shit but might be worth contrasting this game with the two scumgames you've probably forgotten you played with me where I was extremely controlling of the flow/discussion of the game (Thaw and Scumsman)

Coming straight off of FGO with peta the chance that I don't insist on him being more aggressive that dayphase, even though I couldn't post myself, is actually zero.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

unwnd-I read it, I think your reads are mostly fine but you kind of got put on the backburner as far as discerning your alignment goes because my eyes started glazing over as I pushed through the part where you/Flavor just...kept going. I'm glad you're stepping back though.

Pushing through w/ Guillotina+the Cabd case on him has kind of sapped the last of my energy for intense focus but I don't think there's too much for me to respond to. Noraa we agree on. I don't know how to read Brian either and your place on Maria both takes a similar stance as me? The personal intro doesn't leave much room for me to work with.

Sorry if you're looking to bounce more off me here, I might hang up my hat for the night as I'm clearly at the end of my rope

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I'm kind of curious as to why Catchup is town to you unwnd, maybe you said it earlier, but honestly their reads seem similar to mine so maybe I shouldn't worry so much. I'm just concerned about the potential Cakez coaching thing+both being experienced enough to realize letting scum flip for free Day 1 is stupid

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Yeah I was getting a feeling people were getting on me D1 not because they legit thought I was scum but because of, in essence, not wanting me around. remember my "dark thoughts" I mentioned before? THIS IS WHAT I MEANT!!! It feels like the entire game has developed a primitive mindset of just attacking the people they dislike and trying to oust them from the game unfairly. Essentially it seems like y'all don't want Noraa to be playing here. It felt the same way about y'alls approach to me approach to me until I realized it wasn't that prevalent against me. But it really does feel like there's some personal vendetta you guys are levelling against Noraa and it's pretty fucked up.

Respectfully, even though BM has noticeably baited you at points/not been an angel, my perception is that you took the mild slapfight and immediately went way, way over the line. You have openly held the type of grudge you're describing here against BM with the blacklist and wanting him gone regardless of alignment. You've just hinted at similar with Firebringer (whose relevant posts to Cabd/mod I absolutely did NOT approve of). This makes the concern for Noraa you're describing here, justified as it may be in your eyes, deeply ironic imo.

You've done a lot better from what I can tell over the last half of the game, but I think it's important to minimize your own role in things instead of focusing on who is the agitator or the aggressor. Sort the slots, ignore the bait, work around the personal vendettas instead of fighting them out.

I know this isn't levied primarily at me, but this is also my first game playing with Noraa. She took my slot in Undertale and in my opinion did it justice, and I was grateful to have her take it. Nothing about this is personal.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I didn’t expect to mind meld with Cabd this day phase and expected I’d have to do more to impart my will.

Maybe with 2014 era cabd you might have! Or maybe if I wasn't on like... a SHITTON of painkillers and feeling very go with the flow.

It's actually really hard not to just fullclaim and get this fucker to night two already but here I am being good.

what do we actually want to get done before we send this to night phase again? i'm fine w/ nora vote, that was the one read i had during the night b/c she DS'd the cakez vote

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

cabd if nothing else can u give ur reaction to this part of my post, rest is kind of obviously *~just our opinions man~* but chewing on this would be nice

I think the biggest, most obvious reason I can give for him being town is the timing of him looking at other wagons and the result he got from doing so. 1255 into 1314 is EXTREMELY strong play from Guillotina scum imo. Scum Guillotina decides he's not going on Cakez, goes to look for someone else to push, and instead of cooking up some bullshit reason to vote Gamma he actually recognizes he's town and holds off.

This sequence is out of his range for sure imo

My initial reaction to this WITHOUT the reread is "But like, Cakez was defo going down by then and gamma was gonna be the obvtown counterwagon that would be called globally town, why would you vote it at this point?"

I think it's really weird how you go between giving Guillotina a lot of credit here, and then absolutely zero in others. Cakez defo going down contradicts the later vote carousel w/ Noraa->LLD->Cakez. I think Guillotina's demonstrated level+his struggle with keeping up with the game to begin with suggest that even if he saw Cakez was going down, spending 15 minutes reading Gamma just to defend him makes zero sense.

What your expectations are from this slot as scum-high, low, somewhere in between?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Mmmm, that's fair. My expectations are definitely a lot lower, and Reagan seems to think the same even though MU's aversion to bussing bothers him+the plurality voting there making the strategy you're describing more plausible.

At the risk of being offensive to Guillotina I just...don't see him even thinking to think that many layers deep to begin with. It has nothing to do with someone's intelligence or anything like that, it's just picking up on+correctly reacting to those currents that you're describing w/r/t the Gamma vote comes with a lot more experience.

I think the way he replaced out also shows this. He clearly had very little clue of what was going on this game to begin with, the pace was very much not what he expected.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Think guillatina is a high quality player masquerading as a middle quality player.

I am certainly not nearly as certain about this read as I was cakez, or as I am about Noraa.

Hence the tiered list.

will just say it's explicitly not true, they're nooby as hell, like i said, seen some of his games offsite on MU, not an alt or anything. can link the profile but that site's search function sucks ass. that said i disagree with the VP in that i think there's a chance he could be scum anyway

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Guillo could be town, but I think Nacho hydra is scum in that scenario majority of the time.

Pretty confused by this over just us. I suspect you know how easy it is to just harddefend townslots as scum with very little risk (provided you limit how many you do it with)

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Also I proudly have not liked Nacho alignment-wise in a single game we've played. It makes me glad to keep the tradition alive.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I'm gonna go ahead and call it a night, enjoy the new and improved Laconic Reagan

P-Edit: Somehow I missed an actual guilty lol, guess it's time to figure out who had that

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Maria’s town, gamma. I’m pretty sure final scum is Reagan.

nah

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Maria’s town, gamma. I’m pretty sure final scum is Reagan.

dw just let me bus into autoloss bb

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Reagan is definitely doing something weird this day phase trying to distract from Noraa.

?????????????????????????????????

flavor what the fuck lmao

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

i think we just need to ignore gamma atp

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

don't mind me, just tryna distract from nora

by hardpushing nora from post 1 of having read the game, even as two people enter on guillotina, while repeatedly saying i'm down to speedvote her and spending 15-20 posts saying she's blatantly scum for her role alone even w/o seeing the guilty

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

we literally still have mechanical things both you/cabd want to sort out

she's dead in the water

you can think i'm scum anyway but acting like i'm trying to pull the vote off of her shows that you're not reading my fucking slot at all

despite the lowercase this is bush

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

ya know what this doesn't even matter

bedtime anyway gnight y'all, fun to finally be here

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

yeah, reagon got better last couple pages.

im going to take credit from my extremely lazy posts

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Can someone help me with Dunstral.

Like I think he's scum but like.
I think he's not. It's very confusing.

Also, kinda think Guilo did *mumbles*

Also, dunno about people claiming, but it sucked being alone last phase.

we could maybe work something out, depending

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I'm trying to go to bed and stop F5ing the game.

Why do you do this to me? Why hurt me in this way?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Bell, legit just drive me tonight and one of us can live to shitpost about it.

Sounds lovely. Sure.

i don't mean to interfere but we could really use a Rider

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I guess I'm not going to bed.

If you told me 4/5 hours ago that I would be harddefending Guillotina and absolutely dismayed to see them flip my only guess would have been I saw God while socially distanced at a gas station or something

Can someone walk me through why we're fading a randomly scumread slot instead of mechanically confirmed scum? Are you just that worried that Guillo can only happen today or like what?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

"random" is a misnomer. "mechanically confirmed" isn't quite right either. I think my point is obvious enough and don't want to be pedantic over this.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I'm annoyed because basic if->then conditional, if noraa is scum->we should guillotina is the reasoning, seeing everyone vote guillotina instead of just waiting for tomorrow is really fucking annoying

and I don't agree with that reasoning and don't think guillotina is scum regardless so yeah I'm salty

P-Edit: Focus on the word choice if you fucking want Flavor, you know exactly what I'm saying

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Like walk me through why the vote on something that largely relies on Noraa scum is better than just flipping Noraa, if you have the scumread then fine w/e but can we at least vote in the right order and overrule me tomorrow

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Yeah, I don't understand people calling the Guillo push random.

people refers to me

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I need this answered:

Best protect target:
Best roleblock target:
Wild:

feel free to not answer if you're scared

literally no one fucking do this

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Flavor, respectfully, I get that you're annoyed by both me calling it random and by my disagreement on the vote.

But I've acknowledged the points repeatedly and several of my responses to you have made it clear that I understand why you think they're scum and that me being overruled is just part of the game.

Random was an unfortunate word choice because I'm annoyed and wrote a post in ~10s, and I'm annoyed because you're advocating voting my townread and shoving the townslot later. I think my point is obvious. If we disagree whatever but meet me halfway and stop focusing on the word "random"

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

shoving the

town

scumslot later.

classic freudian slip lads, when nora flips town i'm next

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Bell, legit just drive me tonight and one of us can live to shitpost about it.

Sounds lovely. Sure.

i don't mean to interfere but we could really use a Rider

cabd please acknowledge me

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

it'd be funny tho

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I appreciate you not sitting on Guillotina, even if it's just temporary Flavor.

I get wanting to take a shot on a scumread but I just...really don't see them as scum based off that interaction w/ Gamma.

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

Not sure which head is posting but your other head was a bit aloof/lacking emotion in their posts, which made it harder to read. I almost started to think it was intentional

peta plays how peta wants, sometimes it's Assassin in FGO and sometimes it's this.

I'm happy to let him. I got to flex on him with Cakez but I still have complete faith in the President.

All of the posts with capitalization are me, some of the lowercase ones today are too but it's like half/half

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

After talking it over with Reagan, we're fine saying we didn't link.

Bell, we would really like to link with you if Cabd is fine handing you off.

Cabd: Can you loan us a Bell?

[REAGAN BUSH 84]

I don't NEED it to be bell who visits me, but we certainly do want somebody in my town pool driving tonight.

i'm just saying it would be beneficial for us to have someone, if you can pick up what i was saying

-reagan