Among Us Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Taly]

OH MY GOD BIOINFORMATICS CLASS CANNOT END SOON ENOUGH

[Taly]

ok im here these next 3 minutes will be the best chance yall get to determine my alignment

[Taly]

Welcome Abroad to

D

I

S

B

E

A

K

I am your Captain,

Taly the Beakest

. I wish you lot well on our mutual travel through space!

If you know what the hell Skelda is, that is the model of this air ship!

Because I love to control the world one day and have everybody unwillingly depend on me for their lives, one of my tasks brings me DIRECTLY southeast to the Cafeteria!

I need not explain myself further I just hope I remember my airship driving lessons.

[Taly]

ok im here these next 3 minutes will be the best chance yall get to determine my alignment

yall dropped the ball on this smh

i have 2 tasks

[Taly]

TOWNSPEW OR DIE TALY

I PLANNED A POST LIKE 155 ALL DAY WANTING TO CRUMB SHIT AND EVERYBODY IS CLAIMING NOW

will get my thoughts together in like 15 mins?

i understand the POVs of all arguments on whether to claim or not, at least arguments that ive skimmed through haph-hazardly

[Taly]

i lik

Alright. I wanna start off with an RQS this game. Questions are as follows:

1) what power role have you not been that you want to try out, and why? Don’t factor in your current role, answer this question assuming you are vanilla this game.
2) If you were scum, who would be your a) D1 miselim push, b) N1 kill, and c) partner you’d want to bus you and go to the end, given each person was the correct alignment for that specific action?
3) What is your skill with mechanic-heavy setups? If you’re not skilled at them, do you intend to get better with practice or rely on others?
4) What is your favorite candy?
5) What would you say is your biggest strength and biggest weakness as town/scum/in general?

1)

MASONS. Masons.

2)

ehhh idk I'd ride the thread out a good bit on this one for that D1 mislim. I'd probably NK

Ali

because I don't know how similar their town and scumgames are but they seem to like power a lot. Me no like bussing and me not smart to think of which scumteam I'd ruin this plist in but being aligned with

Titus

is always fun, right?

3)

[redacted]

4)

im mid range with mechanics.... people in this plist will think 2-3 steps ahead of me... even though i usually feel good about what i want to do.

5)

nah

ok actually reading through thread now

p-edit

but what i WANT explained 100% right now is, why no lim? or would this explanation defeat the point?

[Taly]

okay this is actually a stupid question, but if we wanted to win, do we actually eliminate like ever?

i actually thought about this last night tbh

if we lim people now, we ensure that we will never complete tasks?

but then im wondering, how is reaching this wincon possible without town dying anyway?

OH MY GOD BIOINFORMATICS CLASS CANNOT END SOON ENOUGH

Pay attention Talk!

yea thats why i want to get the mech shit out of the way early

cuz post restricted days later will suck for mech talk

softclaim: both of my tasks involve post restrictions at some point during or after their completion.

every1 claim what rooms you need for your tasks

i will excel it and figure out optimal pathing

alisae will probly do it faster and better

gut instinct

pooky/ali

are not T/S.

ok good people are just spamming, i literally took like a 5 minute break and there were 4 pages

i'm not going to keep up with all this hyperposting nor am i going to be rereading the hyperposting that i miss, just as a heads up

i'm going to do other things now

relatable but there must be something you can contribute to the convo?

Lol

I think we are giving scum a lot of info here, but whatevs

yes

this is why it's very stupid what we're doing

but alisae is playing that magic pipe and everyone's marching along following alisae right over the cliff's edge

murder/reckoner

gave boos to this mech claiming that i liked upon reading them. want to think a bit longer on how sound those concerns are.

k i get it

ali

can powerwolf surprisingly well and in the event of a recent game ending, i am intimately familiar with that about them.

but what is your goal with this post and stating resistance in this manner? that this

is

what is happening?

I don't see the need to claim them today, personally. I think this can wait for a few days and we can just make groups today so no one is isolated.

the point of claiming is so that we can map out the optimal pathing so that everyone completes all their tasks in 2-3 days

and each roomgroup is big enough to prevent mafia bonus NKs

there is also leashing so that people don't wander off on their own and get NK'd in a room with a baddie

this is the only method to room-claiming that i like doing but idk how effective it is if half the town is on board versus the others

re: bolded/underlined
Does amount of people going into the room ever matter? I didn't notice any restriction to amount of peeps going someplace.

prob gonna reread the setup again soon

[Taly]

okay this is actually a stupid question, but if we wanted to win, do we actually eliminate like ever?

i actually thought about this last night tbh

if we lim people now, we ensure that we will never complete tasks?

but then im wondering, how is reaching this wincon possible without town dying anyway?

real important, want to make sure this post is not skimmed over.

also, people can sabotage?

oof im missing details with the setup

[Taly]

Town has an additional win condition and wins the game immediately if all tasks are completed.
When a town player dies their uncompleted tasks will become public information.
Anyone (even imposters) may claim tasks that are public information by PMing me.
Tasks claimed by mafia that are not completed are not counted against the town completing all of their tasks.

oh, so dead townies can still have their missions be completed or null-in-void.

so it is possible for us to win via completing tasks.

i feel slightly better about

alisae

then

fuck it

I have a task in Admin, and Navigation.

literally the only con i see to claiming here is wine and paranoia that i have at least SOME control of dispelling if i were transparent about where i am going.

p-edit

I'm going to electrical. I'm doing my task.

Either a) scum kill me and leave less for y'all to do

Or b) scum kill elsewhere and I can get those tasks.

Agreeing to anything else seems stupid.

i like this way of giving information. doesnt feel oversharing but provides context, and this disposition puts the claimer in SOME vulnerability so it is likelier sincere information .

but i dont know which of my rooms im going into yet, and the longer i put off claiming, the smaller my window is for making use of it.

and after all, there is still

some things to learn

from people grouping with me into a room.

p-edit again

232 is

OWER's

case a poor one,

Cakez

?

[Taly]

boom, mic drop.

my posts are very informative

i demand gifs of toucans, peasants.

Captain Taly the Beakiest

awaits.

p-edit

then

bell/cakez

, are you guys focused on sorting or plainly mech discussion rn?

p-edit again fml

was

titus

town in baby sitter or scum? or was that a game?

p-edit a third time, i hate my life

fuck it No Elimination

may as well not half-ass it, but idk if im 100% sold on this yet.

[Taly]

p-edit a third time, i hate my life

fuck it No Elimination

may as well not half-ass it, but idk if im 100% sold on this yet.

wtf

VOTE: No Elimination

[Taly]

Does anyone have post restrictions that will really strongly impair playing the game as normal on later days?

hr is a good look at my posting with both rstrictions at play

i am vry much into walling but i try not to do that. so it may not b a problm.

[Taly]

why are there only two votes for no elim

@pooky/ali

[Taly]

i am going to be much lower post count when i get post restricted cuz my post restriction is kinda annoying

PT with me at some point and ill be your megaphone the following phase

i mean, we both go to navigation.

p-edit

Like, I don't know how to get through to you all that hedging all of our bets on Task Completion and almost entirely ignoring traditional scumhunting is bad in a closed setup and the people who are pushing No Elim are probably scum.

Agree but disagree that the people pushing no elim are scum. Except cake who is scum.

damn it, my first non-scumread.

i need to powerwolf harder, FFS

ali

taking my spotlight

[Taly]

psssst

pooky

PT with me at some point and ill be your megaphone the following phase

i mean, we both go to navigation.

k ill dip from thread, dont want to add noise while im filtering through it. i think half the people posting rn is driving in a decently articulated point, just that people may want to read and digest the POVs more.

p-edit

ISO me and youll learn a lot

DG

i promise

[Taly]

k i will listen for more people to discuss their thoughts

UNVOTE:

id give context to my vote but im lazy

p-edit

ISO me and youll learn a lot

DG

i promise

It panned out!

finally, someone appreciates my contributions

quick leaving thoughts

also,

haschel's

posting is underrated
putting in a lot of effort to sorting

ali/pooky

cakez

, why no lim and not claim?
i like

aka

,

bell

, and

titus

vibe but nothing strong enough to make alignment assessment.

ower

being lonely on his push rn feels more like a town slot.

p-edit again

ewww, but i dont like that people say

ower

is town WHILE disparaging his post. 229

his reasons in that post are the same reasons why im not shelving

pooky/ali

here.

[Taly]

My brain hurts. I have zero idea on how to approach this day play without wagons. My data is my crutch.

I kinda like Taly though.

you might get your wagons later if thats something we're doing

yo

ali

where the wagons at or where the discussion for them at

how do you feel about the plist lumping you and

pooky

in the same vein together and by extension, how i am a contributor to that perception?

Hot take: The entire scum team hasn’t claimed locations yet because they are waiting to figure out what to do.

i feel like this take is a bit easy

pooky

, i have made posts toward you

*attacks*

What us the consensus? Are we all claiming? Will we know if the scum kids?

what is

YOUR

consensus and are

YOU

claiming?

Gut. Also not sure town Titus would go this route usually, though that’s more of a guess then something i’m confident in.

you feel like you have more life here than the one reference i have of which i cannot mention.

do you have reliable meta with

titus

?

our townbloc is pretty big for this early in the game

yall form reads quicker than i do in larges, man.

is the townbloc just based around how compliant people have been with your mechanical approach?

[Taly]

im fine with people knowing where my destinations are.

id love a group joining me, the more the merrier

for no lim, im going where the plist goes, tbh.
the reasons i give will not advance discussion and will probably just create wine.

how about you guys ask me questions?

[Taly]

murderkitties

, i like your 563 but i feel like your 365 went a bit hard onto a slot relatively early for the games pace

how has your

cakez

read progressed?

TAAAALLLLLYYYYYYYY!
1) How are you?
2) Who is your worst read at the moment?
3) Is there anything so far you disagree with?
4) Why are you upside down? ( ͜。 ͡ʖ ͜。)

1)

good, bout to get to college work, need to stop letting mafia distract haha

2)

no particular scumreads... need to reread

TGP

because they did not pass the vibe check.

alisae

passed the vibe check but not yet the deepwolf check. i think you are quite fluffy even with your wall, tbh - i want more concrete statements from you.

pooky

feels agenda-y but that doesnt ping me by itself.
i think the amount of times

reck

comes into this thread only to say

"i wont read and i denounce the threads mentality"

is genuine BUT is being used deflectively.
actually did not care for this readslist from

BM

i think it's most likely that Alisae is town and Titus is scum. Akarin town, Pooky town, Cakez town.

felt very early to make reads on these players, at least mostly town-ones.

id rather

BM

just explain these reads. i think

OWER

prodded them at some point but if they replied, the answer wasnt noticeable enough for me to see it.

(maybe OWER prodded murderkitties instead)

3)

disagreement is not the correct word... more cautiously inquisitive. this town did not have a very cohesive start with everything considered.

4)

why i am upside down you ask?
my nails are lavender D:< not as red as my role PM or as green as what id want to brag they be.

[Taly]

VOTE: reckoner
Nah, not letting you act like you’re willing to play ball and then try to run away with it when you realize you have to play fair

oh, not eliminating anyone to give us time to do tasks is pretty smart actually? i think?

How’d you know that came up?

And yeah why the fuck are you okay with the no elim but not the plan portion?
VOTE: Reckoner
TGP you had a point about looking at who supported what.

Don't like these votes at all

Titus wagon feels scum driven

nani

so both

reck/titus

have poor votes pledged against them?

what is a good vote rn, if no limming was not an option for you?

[Taly]

actually you know what

unless

the scumteam or most of the scumteam is

{pooky/ali/BM/OWER}

, this game does not seem hard.

by extension, i think this group of 4 players are either majority-town or majority-scum

(3:1) (1:3) or (4:0)

probably will get to ISOing somewhere about that at some point.

[Taly]

oh cool, i figured out which group of players i want to solve first before reaching page 50 in a large theme.

p-edit

Can you explain that a bit more, why those 4 in particular

BM

expressed early townreads on

Ali/Pooky

, one of the first to side with them, but also was on the train of being iffy with

OWER's

opening about

Pooky/Ali

, but still proceeds to assert that

OWER

is obvtown.

OWER

is similar to

BM

in this respect but in the opposite direction of detailing

Ali/Pooky

as scum with actually valid reasons imo.

Ali

has a knack for wresting control of the gamestate so I would not be surprised if she were coordinating the plist to do mech stuff

Pooky

seems squarely focused on mech stuff and is actually arguing with

OWER

, but they dont push the other too much.

Alternatively, a much more faithful POV of these 4-

Pooky/Ali/BM

all came to the same conclusion and are in good sync, which makes their reads of each other overall pretty credible or at least understandable.

OWER

is an interesting slot in this situation, on one hand, he has a valid viewpoint on

Pooky/Ali

... the other, is that it is weird AF for him to wagon

Titus

after doubling-down on the

Pooky

scumread. Interactions make him least likely to be aligned with the other... OR

(2:2)

situation involving him is where i would start to investigate.

i have post links to back up but this is my full-spew perception of the 4 slots.

[Taly]

the gist is that these 4 slots have very well documented stances on each other and thats the biggest point of interest i have in the game rn

[Taly]

ffs i randomly skimmed and saw the words

"double kill"

note to review setup so-

If you are alone with an imposter in a room during the night phase they will be given the option to kill you. Only one extra imposter kill can happen per night.

ok yeah, +100 to +3 person groups, ideally.

but you know, we have an odd number of players

so we could like.... have more than 3.

[Taly]

aww fuck, im gonna be deep into

ali's

pocket before i get to that ISO group huh

[Taly]

i want attention

*goes back to typing up presentations on highly detailed genetics concepts and research articles*

[Taly]

can someone condense the cases on

BM

and

Haschel

?

flea

i notice you say

Hasch

is sus but are still on

BM

, why?

i liked

reck's

732, to be concise, i dont think they are manufactured takes.

reck

, hmu

p-edit

Blitzo is scum :sadface:

Sell me on this.

you inquire like this a lot, what is the purpose?

[Taly]

read posts 0-150 of

pooky/ali

they did not begin with asserting their plans and they are consistently building off the other... really hard to fake this as theatre imo.

BM

does little on his own but agree with the two of them until 129 by asserting his own post. not much else to note there.

pooky/ali

feeling more comfortable in that townbin tho they aren't talking to me >:

p-edit

flea

i notice you say

Hasch

is sus but are still on

BM

, why?

BM is my greater sus atm there is something off and I'm about to do an ISO dive

ehhhh. not a fan that you sus'ed the other popular wagon because it feels like youre waiting to jump elsewhere

but ill wait for your ISO dive before further thought.

If the person is town I get their fellow perspective on where they're at in the game, which helps me shape my own reads.

If the person is scum then their read will be fake or will have an agenda behind it, which will show, albeit most likely not immedietly.

i feel

reck's

thoughts here. you're approaching this similar to how i would

OWER

.

[Taly]

^ You think Flea's bussing or?

unsure because i havent given

BM

his due investigation but i wouldnt be surprised

or the inverse in that

flea

would be prepping for a bus on

haschel

even then, i wouldnt been keen to search for associative-tells like this just yet.

but why do you ask? what is your read on these three players above?

also, we're both in navigation

bell

;D you know what that means...

[Taly]

^ You think Flea's bussing or?

unsure because i havent given

BM

his due investigation but i wouldnt be surprised

or the inverse in that

flea

would be prepping for a bus on

haschel

even then, i wouldnt been keen to search for associative-tells like this just yet.

but why do you ask? what is your read on these three players above?

also, we're both in navigation

bell

;D you know what that means...

Solving slumber party and if my reads are right you stab me?

Haschel meh, BM and Flea slight town. But nothing ground breaking.
Trying to figure out why you're horse before the carting.

yeah i dont feel strongly on them scum tbh.

im actually townhunting here. the influx of noise is making a focused scumhunt difficult until i get a better universal analysis of the plist.

mechanically, i feel good, i like the claims and groups ideas. just so people are aware

if i understand your idiom, you're saying im doing Step 2 and ignoring Step 1, is that correct?

[Taly]

read posts 0-150 of pooky/ali

they did not begin with asserting their plans and they are consistently building off the other... really hard to fake this as theatre imo.

alisae is so in tune with me

e is precious

pooky

name at least 3 things you're mindmelding with me on RIGHT NOW.

if you cant find 3 then invent a reason that humors me

[Taly]

That's correct Taly,

me brain fried

if youre referring to me not taking a more AGGRESSIVE play by voting people and wagon hopping, ill just be honest and say i havent fully digested the past 10 pages well.

and so im really just spewing what comes to mind with the few posts that pique my interest

flea/ower/BM

sorting.

p-edit

Taly what reads do u have atm

Solid Town: Bell/Alisae/Pooky/Reckoner/OWER*/Gamma*

* are tentative but its still a relatively solid read

i am going to lobotomize myself if im getting pocketed at this point in the game, somehow.

[Taly]

bell/ali

, hmu with reads.

my brain has been working all day, and my one brain cell is fucking dead atm.

so ill be off after this post, but i still want to hear where you guys are at with solving

<3

[Taly]

@Taly,

Pooky, alisae, you (or you're doing a good job of faking some pretty detailed thoughts!), Flea,
even though I gave a warning about the doggo the doggo is still town spewing from my pov.

The rest are kinda meh, I could prolly point to weak town leans/scum leans but per post it would balance on and off.
Titus I'm rapidly vacillitating on because she looks like obv scum, but she's always scum/third party so.
Have I even played with town titus.
Oh. Yeah sort of.

a tactic scum!taly likes to use is they like to make it easier for other people to spew themselves

Maybe I just really like Flea's posting this game and I'm biased tho.

So you're saying that Taly is good at being scum? Aight.

i refuse to be LHF this game, ill do stuff soon.

i legit have had 9 hours nonstop of working on assignments, i have 5+ projects/tests due in less than 2 weeks, and as soon as tomorrow.

i also have 2 doctor's appointments tomorrow and Friday because my body is rebelling

i
am
fucked

but yeah, sorry if im a bit ambiguous rn. ill utilize it as a means to gamesolve soon.

[Taly]

Maybe I just really like Flea's posting this game and I'm biased tho.

So you're saying that Taly is good at being scum? Aight.

missed this.
They can be. Idunno if you saw my MtG thread but I came out of a scum hydra with them. Their scumplay is fairly green. TBH when we hydra'd, they told me something that I needed to look out and to kill them on site if they do it but I don't recall what that is for the life of me.
I think I have an idea on how to catch scum!Taly if it exists in this game but if that world exists, it won't be until a wolf before him dies.

i dont remember saying something

exactly

like

"kill me on sight if i do something"

, but i might have.

i cant tell if your take on me is to be pragmatic knowing what im capable of, or youre positioning around me since your approach to me right now is to shelve me.

basically, are you taking to me in good faith here? i feel like ive had more posts directed to or about you than otherwise, so i want to know if the distance is intentional.

[Taly]

Maybe I just really like Flea's posting this game and I'm biased tho.

So you're saying that Taly is good at being scum? Aight.

missed this.
They can be. Idunno if you saw my MtG thread but I came out of a scum hydra with them. Their scumplay is fairly green. TBH when we hydra'd, they told me something that I needed to look out and to kill them on site if they do it but I don't recall what that is for the life of me.
I think I have an idea on how to catch scum!Taly if it exists in this game but if that world exists, it won't be until a wolf before him dies.

i dont remember saying something

exactly

like

"kill me on sight if i do something"

, but i might have.

i cant tell if your take on me is to be pragmatic knowing what im capable of, or youre positioning around me since your approach to me right now is to shelve me.

basically, are you taking to me in good faith here? i feel like ive had more posts directed to or about you than otherwise, so i want to know if the distance is intentional.

atm ur just completely not on my radar

ehhh, fair. i could be busting more balls here.

but my posts so far have actually helped me solve including this interaction

my townread on you right now is genuine, it's not 100% strong or concrete, but your vibe is a huge difference from what i observed in our scum hydra. you take initiative but your disposition to the plist does not hinge on other peoples' input, and after rereading your entry, i dont think youre trying to bend the plist to your will. youre making valid points on how to achieve town's wincon.

im probably gonna dump a spew when im not just solving casually to retain sanity.

perhaps, ask me questions that are less vague than reads?

cant guarantee ill answer tonight but i will

[Taly]

yo, be brief

i didnt plan to post again tonight

[Taly]

Taly is by far my strongest townread for being the person who is visibly doing the most scumhunting.

This wasn't on the list of things I think I'd read upon my lazy half-ass skim But I'll take it.

Flea/OWER/Murder

, you all have very different vibes than in https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=84987 where I was scum hydra with

Ali

wolfing on all of you townies

flea

, you are much more upfront with POV, kind of hard to navigate and get to the meat of your posting, and you take so much initiative here that I don't know how genuine that is.

OWER

, your dog pic is really fucking cute and that probably contributes to the pocket, can you give me an in depth take on

BM/Ali/Pooky

? You are far more active in pushing your ideas than the linked game above.

Murder

, WHERE YOU AT? methinks I skim over you so much that you are an assassin meant to kill us all quietly... but tbh I sympathize, I think I'd be FAR less

"not-on-the-radar"

if people took the time to read me more.

I stand by

Bell/Ali/Pooky/Reck/OWER/Gamma

town

TENTATIVELY

. I want to reread them as well as

BM/Murder/Flea

before I double-down 100%.

If I can make a solid towncore with at LEAST 6-7 people AND find a vote this dayphase, I'd be golden with solving in the future.

DG

;3 I'll vote soon, I never disappoint.

also who is

Blitzo

? i demand everybody who reads this post to say

"

Blitzo

is town/scum/?"

so I can gauge how many wagons this gamestate actually wants to have...

[Taly]

i keep waffling on whether to lim or not.

id love to group if there were a way to prevent everybody from outing role information, but without grouping, no limming looks more attractive as that shows 2 deaths are possible tonight.

yall need to lock it up.

[Taly]

i keep waffling on whether to lim or not.

id love to group if there were a way to prevent everybody from outing role information, but without grouping, no limming looks more attractive as that shows 2 deaths are possible tonight.

yall need to lock it up.

it's really just math in my head.

what's better?

1-2 town deaths (no lim)
2-3 town deaths (incorrect lim)
1 scum death and 1-2 town deaths? (correct lim)

[Taly]

also i just want to say 936, that was so fucking wholesome and sweet ty

bell <3

ill give

flea

their due diligence soon, i think i should take time reading their replies in depth more

waiting for

murder

to get to that keyboard lul

[Taly]

Why do you think she rolled scum?

*exasperated tone*

All fluff no substance... a ball of scum dipped in cutesy sauce.

...

have you actually read my posts?

i was getting excited to hear a good reason to scumread me, because lord knows, there are better ones than this.

[Taly]

Phoneposting

Titus, what is your rationale for this being town me via meta?

Battle, can you te me what your POV of your wagon is?

[Taly]

DGBs ISO is pretty much "kill BM, get people to vote with me or they are scum" etc.

Also I saw someone attach lurksack to BM (I think Cakez and Flea added to this but I don't know the context) and I am floored by this because the game has been going for less than 3 days

Needless to say, the lack of people creating condensed cases for the current wagons does little to persuade me.

Also Blitzo is an interesting ISO. Little content aside from just nearly disagreeing with things and trading BMs life in this game for a conversation with DBG...

I don't know why Akarin and Murdercat are even a thing re: last page.

I want Titus to explain her meta takes and evaluate their strength openly. I think her frustration to DGB is sincere and I want to lean in on the way she approaches this plist read wise.

[Taly]

You wouldn't be scum again would you taly

Does this post serve a purpose?

trading BMs life in this game for a conversation with DBG...

eh?
also re: lurksack BM he's been posting but for context he had like 200 posts a few hours into xenoblade 2 mafia and had posted 2 times the amount of the next highest poster
so this is contrasted just off of that, but I don't believe in raw activity reads, same with how I read creature, it's about the content of the posts as well.

Talking about how Blitzo hopped on BM wagon because DGB prodded him to votepark somewhere.

I don't know why Akarin and Murdercat are even a thing re: last page.

Did you not see my reason for voting or do you not agree or do you not understand it?

1st and 3rd. Explain it?

Pedit

Yall I am male LOL

[Taly]

Ok I'm tired downplaying myself to get people grouping with me or seeing how sincere people read me.

This nonstop mech talk has only made it more difficult for me to read players and no conclusion has come from it whether mech or solving standpoint.

If you want to group, requote this list in a chain
If you don't then cool

[Taly]

VOTE: DippingGoofball

I want to start here. Undeveloped thoughts from this slot.

[Taly]

Aka, Ali, you guys don't want to group?

[Taly]

VOTE: DippingGoofball

I want to start here. Undeveloped thoughts from this slot.

This is OMGUS.

You know me better than this,

Titus

.

I want Titus to explain her meta takes and evaluate their strength openly. I think her frustration to DGB is sincere and I want to lean in on the way she approaches this plist read wise.

What in particular?

Meta. You townread

Flea

and I off of it in one of your early spews.

If you want to group, requote this list in a chain

Taly, come to Electrical tonight.

Titus reads all over the place here - unusual for her.

Ignoring the baiting from Flea - I have been pulling out some great reads so far imho.

I'd love the

Titus/Alisae/You

PT but I'm going to

Admin or Navigation

for tasks.

I agree with your take on

Titus

, usually they stick to a few thoughts at once.

ok
Does anyone else have the feeling with Taly's posts that she is writing a lot of words but none of them actually mean that much?

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

I thought I said a lot with my vote, something you ached to see..

Btw, do you have thoughts? Hard to find those from you.

Spoiler:

ok
Does anyone else have the feeling with Taly's posts that she is writing a lot of words but none of them actually mean that much?

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

I highly doubt DGB read any of taly's posts b4 responding here.

Pooky

, everybody is paranoid of me and nobody is approaching me in the game right now.

Spoiler:

Flea is doing a lot of that LAMISTy stuff but it's superficial - long ISO cases which don't strike a balanced objective line, are a scum move I've used many times in my youth.

This is where you and I differ, you read my ISO as a case and as an attack, not me running over my thoughts on you and adjusting or confirming my read.

It's my thoughts, not a case. If people agree with it, they agree with it. If people want to supply me with non-meta information or differing ways of reading a post, then I'll sit, consider and adjust.

I'm a brain spewer I just put out whatevers in my head as I'm reading something.

I mean I don't think it's so much that "we differ", as you're wrong. There was no obvious attempt to "adjust" your read - you singled out a bunch of posts which were completely meaningless and objectively NAI, and tried to contrive to make them seem scummy to bolster your position. It was a case of "I've said BM is scum, now I have to prove it" rather than "I wonder if BM is town or scum".

I'm open to the idea that you're just town who got carried away, but I'll wait and see if you take a more objective line to appraising people going forward.

I love how you're telling me what I did <3
I love how you completely missing the face I'm a brainspewer.
I love how you're completely hooked on being defensive.
It's kinda cute (◍•ᴗ•◍)❤

Flea

, the more you suggest

"I am a brainspewer, this is how I go about posting and thoughts"

makes me think that this approach is intentional, and it stumps me when I'm trying to find where your head is out outside of quote-by-quote walls and 1v1s.

[Taly]

Taly it's because your avatar keeps changing like somebody who can't make up their mind in the loading screen

lol

<3

but really, im a bit agitated with the thread.

such a distinct lack of cohesion in the plist.

i literally do not get learn anything reading these elaborate quote-to-quote convos that discuss something rooting back to mechanics or are about wagon placement.

Flea/Murder/{Alisae/Battle Mage/Titus}/Taly

are what I have down for people who want to group.

I believe

Murder/I

share a destination. I'm good with this as a start to the group.

Up until 1335 I didn't have a notable impression with

Murder

outside of the random emphasis on mechanic plans and random votes that I don't agree with. The linked post is a bit nuanced, and I like it.

Murder

1)

Why

Blitzo

?

2)

Can you explain game 2170 and how it relates to

Pooky

read? I don't agree with their

"let's lim in the non-claims"

because I think that can be role-fishy and motivation behind an agenda (oriented to getting people to work with their plans) is what I'm evaluating

Pooky

on rn.

3)

Without ISOing

Haschel

, I relate to their arduous running relationship with the thread and reading... and I don't understand the scumreads on this slot because they seemed a bit based around him agreeing with

Reck

on mechanic POV

[Taly]

also

i think this is the first time

Battle Mage

does not sus me in a game LMAO

does scum-

BM

really give

Flea

the benefit of the doubt here? 1296

[Taly]

<3

you sure make a toucan feel special

Murder
1) Why Blitzo?
2) Can you explain game 2170 and how it relates to Pooky read? I don't agree with their "let's lim in the non-claims" because I think that can be role-fishy and motivation behind an agenda (oriented to getting people to work with their plans) is what I'm evaluating Pooky on rn.
3) Without ISOing Haschel, I relate to their arduous running relationship with the thread and reading... and I don't understand the scumreads on this slot because they seemed a bit based around him agreeing with Reck on mechanic POV

Anything for you Taly

1. Honestly, I am on board with no elim so this is kind of just a park vote representing my general read on Blitzo. All his posts are kind of hand wavy in a way I don't like. Like off the top of your head, can you remember any of Blitzo's reads? I remember there being some vague suspicion of me but other than that I can't remember. But then you read the iso and like there is stuff there, but I don't feel like any of it is actually changing the game at all if that makes sense. So basically, I think Blitzo is posting a lot of look busy fluff. I can give examples, but honestly I think it's kind of clear what I mean from a general skim of the iso.

Blitzo

has briefly mentioned and discussed 9 people in this game total. So your vote makes sense.

I'm not following the mindmeld with

DGB

in 1057

Blitzo

, can you give a simple reads post?

2. I think Pooky in death curse feels a lot more intentional compared to Pooky in 2170. Like the same kind of energy is there in both games, but I feel like it was directed differently, if that makes any sense. I SR'd Pooky in both games though so /shrug

3. I think HC is more likely scum than Reck because I expect scum to be less vocal than Reck is being if they want to try to derail the grouping. I am mostly null there though.

Jury is still out for me on

Haschel

but I do like your reasoning there.

Also, omg so many

Death Curse

mentions... I'll just have to read

Pooky

there and build some baseline on reading them.

p-edit

1310 felt like I was looking into a mirror.

BM

is probably town.

p-edit

also

i think this is the first time

Battle Mage

does not sus me in a game LMAO

does scum-

BM

really give

Flea

the benefit of the doubt here? 1296

haha well you're in my neutral pile I guess!

and I certainly could - scum-BM is highly skilled!

nononono

pretend to scumread or townread me, being neutral-read is painful AF.

also same, i relate to your flex about being good scum when someone implies a favorable POV to you.

[Taly]

Spoiler:

murderkitties

, i like your 563 but i feel like your 365 went a bit hard onto a slot relatively early for the games pace

how has your

cakez

read progressed?

TAAAALLLLLYYYYYYYY!
1) How are you?
2) Who is your worst read at the moment?
3) Is there anything so far you disagree with?
4) Why are you upside down? ( ͜。 ͡ʖ ͜。)

1)

good, bout to get to college work, need to stop letting mafia distract haha

2)

no particular scumreads... need to reread

TGP

because they did not pass the vibe check.

alisae

passed the vibe check but not yet the deepwolf check. i think you are quite fluffy even with your wall, tbh - i want more concrete statements from you.

pooky

feels agenda-y but that doesnt ping me by itself.
i think the amount of times

reck

comes into this thread only to say

"i wont read and i denounce the threads mentality"

is genuine BUT is being used deflectively.
actually did not care for this readslist from

BM

i think it's most likely that Alisae is town and Titus is scum. Akarin town, Pooky town, Cakez town.

felt very early to make reads on these players, at least mostly town-ones.

id rather

BM

just explain these reads. i think

OWER

prodded them at some point but if they replied, the answer wasnt noticeable enough for me to see it.

(maybe OWER prodded murderkitties instead)

3)

disagreement is not the correct word... more cautiously inquisitive. this town did not have a very cohesive start with everything considered.

4)

why i am upside down you ask?
my nails are lavender D:< not as red as my role PM or as green as what id want to brag they be.

Like look at this post for example
So much words but I don't actually get much from it?

Cakez

, why are you only looking at one of my earliest posts, and one at a time for this?

Yeah, I don't believe your stance here.

[Taly]

Shit.

My townreads are generally people who scumread each other.

BM-Flea

Pooky-Reck

Murder-Alisae

with

Gamma/OWER

floating off somewhere.

This gamestate sucks.

p-edit

I'm hard-town on Cakez

Case it.

[Taly]

Shit.

My townreads are generally people who scumread each other.

BM-Flea

Pooky-Reck

Murder-Alisae

with

Gamma/OWER

floating off somewhere.

This gamestate sucks.

p-edit

I'm hard-town on Cakez

Case it.

Then again, I like

Bell/Haschel

but that's 10/16 of the players.

Blitzo/DGB/Titus/Akarin/Cakez/TGP

become PoE...

Unsatisfying.

ISO Groups if I ever have time to complete them

Battle Mage/Pooky/OWER

~

Blitzo/DGB/TGP

~

Akarin/Titus/Cakez

That's half the plist, but at least I can relate

Individual V Hollistic Solve

thoughts together better, and garner some feel of scum.

[Taly]

Taly-

let's just work outside of our respective townpools then. We aren't too far off each other tbh.

i've played 1 game with cakez town, and 1 game with cakez scum. In the nicest possible way, when he was scum he was completely obvscum, and when he was town he was pretty obviously town. As scum he got elimmed on Day 1 for basically trying to run a fake-meta gambit on me (as well as some other things i think). In this game, he's giving believable pro-town takes and coming across much more natural. I think cakez is sweet.

Can you link the games? Is this your only reason for

Cakez

town?

By your logic,

Cakez

would be town to me because I do like his consistency with the

no lim

option.
I feel like scum would likelier go for the no lim option as a unit/group and/or they did not feel control of the gamestate to create a town lim.

I want to talk about the context

Titus'

vote there but

Cakez

and

You

are both consistent with your takes of this as you agreed with

Ali/Pooky's

mechanical ideas moreso publicly than others.

The reason why I'm not no-limming is because I agree with

Alisae

, it's not a decision to make until EoD1.

holy shit

BM

you just figured out how to get me to spew.

[Taly]

let's just work outside of our respective townpools then. We aren't too far off each other tbh.

Where do we agree and where do we disagree?

Flea/Haschel

are probably my most loose townreads at the moment because I don't like the angle

Flea

pushes here and

Haschel

is quite elusive and I feel that's plausible for scum more often than town in games of this velocity.

I think

DGB/Reck

are very good slots to look at WITH them because

DGB

feels like a parrot to

Flea

without the wallposting and

Reck

for reasons

Murder

mentioned in 1309

[Taly]

Cakez

, why are you only looking at one of my earliest posts, and one at a time for this?

Yeah, I don't believe your stance here.

It was a random example I could quote a dozen posts from your ISO

Why so defensive?

mainly just pissy because i am giving content and im upset with the handwave dismissal i sense from 1/3rd of the plist. ill get over it soon.

Meta. You townread Flea and I off of it in one of your early spews.

Compare this with Death curse.

you were scum in death curse?

i wasnt even in death curse

p-edit

I agree with your take on Titus, usually they stick to a few thoughts at once.

What do you call the repeated insistence that we no vote?

I feel the yucks here.

im wondering why vote to no lim this early D1?

Titus

, you've kept your vote on no-limming - to my understanding - for around 800 posts at this point.

580 was the first post that followed it, and it begins with you discussing the likelihood that you could be mislimmed.

Is it fair to say that part of your vote is defensive or deflective from suspicion

(especially since you say your wagon is scum-driven)

? Why is it not?

[Taly]

I'm starting to like Blitzo more.

VOTE: Taly

Is this your way of ignoring me?

Like, if you vote me, you don't have to answer my points toward you.

That's how I feel you interacted with

Battle Mage

, or lack thereof interaction:
746 753 757 772

If I vote your second ranking scumread, would you jump off me like you did

Blitzo

?

@DGB - You're not wrong on that front but I'd still like you to talk to me about stuff.

Sure, park your vote somewhere.

@dgb - Sure.
VOTE: battle mage
Now.
What's the deal?

Great vote!

Deal with what? I don't know what you are referring to.

[Taly]

@DGB - what constitutes jumping off of BM here?
Why is Taly scummier?
I'm aware that you said something about him being wishy washy (which I don't think is wrong) but I don't see how that's enough to warrant switching?

Because, unless I understand otherwise,

DGB's

votes aren't to solve but to barter.

Speaking of being ignored, Taly you wanted clarification on my murdercat vote, but never followed up on whether or not that actually clarified anything for you. I mostly just requoted myself after all, but since you said you missed it I thought it might be enough, but might also not be.

Any thoughts on that?

Sorry about that, I didn't respond because it fell under the umbrella of

"I don't know how to read this convo because it's nothing but disagreements and saying mech stuff with too many words"

Not that I didn't listen to you, I did. I just didn't see anything specifically AI.

Now, am I misled to think

Murder

is closer to town than not here?

[Taly]

I think the most frustrating thing about mech talk is it's completely necessary in setups like this, but people's eyes glaze over when it starts.

I think there's plenty of AI stuff in there. Specifically in MurderCat's

approach

to sort-of agreeing with stuff but not pushing it. As their responses to me trying to point that out where they got into "well I was among the first to claim" as a defense. Why do you think that's totally irrelevant to alignment?

I guess, but if people don't want to do a specific plan, I don't see the point in discussing much further.

I'm pretty solid on my approach with the setup.

>

No lim decision is delayed a little latter D1.

>

I want to group but I don't think everybody should, especially if they'd rather not.

>

Claiming rooms is up to the person but I think it helps the above two setup takes more.
Do you want to group with somebody for your room today? I made a requote post-chain that never went beyond

Murder/Flea

...

As for

Murder

, I didn't see the

"I was the first to claim defense"

or the context around it? But I don't think

"sort-of-agreeing"

is AI as a principle because there's 16 slots to sort in 7 days with a lot of focus on mechanic discussion. So I'm not convinced of your read here unless you give tangible examples...

also, do post links instead of quotes if you must. That's easier for me to look at, please.

p-edit

@Taly - dcan you go more in-depth on that barter statement?
Why is that scummy?
Who are your other scumreads and why?

Because for

DGB's

votes - until mine - have been onto more popular wagons and I can't tell if they're trying to push people off reads or to upstart a wagon that threatens to lim.

I can't tell the sincerity behind their posts and I feel like they're dismissive to anyone they think is scum, which is usually more annoying than scum, but I want to push it right now.

Titus

is someone I'm sorting heavily because I don't know what to make of that OMGUS take of my vote on

DGB

and I want to gauge their POV over the no-lim vote just yet.

I honestly don't have many scumreads at the moment. Not something I want to admit, but I'm working to rectify this.

@Taky My votes are to make the game move forward, not to barter. To create alignment indicative content. Pressure people, force them to take stances, inspire them to participate. Yeet scum if I do it right.

Then what changed your mind on

BM/Blitzo

?

p-edit

mainly just pissy because i am giving content and im upset with the handwave dismissal i sense from 1/3rd of the plist. ill get over it soon.

I am reading your posts but I am struggling to get a ton from them
Thus my post

I don't know what to say other than... just tell you to ask what you want to know? Uh.

It's definitely more in-good-faith to just ask if I'm not clear about something rather than perpetuate the narrative that I'm convoluted, which I feel others have done.

(Alisae, DGB, Reck, even Murder a little)

I don't know what else to do for you.

/shrug

[Taly]

Can someone explain to me why TGP is town?
Akarin's read is probably the third or fourth person that has stated such in yet I see no reasons for any of them.
Why is it so hard to get people to explain things this game?

I'd like

TGP

be discussed more. I don't have a good grasp on them and I didn't care much for their posts as I recall my last impression of them.

p-edit

Spoiler:

Can someone explain to me why TGP is town?
Akarin's read is probably the third or fourth person that has stated such in yet I see no reasons for any of them.
Why is it so hard to get people to explain things this game?

Gunna put you down as inexperienced on mafiascum.net meta.

@Blitzo to you. It's a bad habit where I don't really remember to address people half the time.

Honestly, I've been on MS for years on/off and I still feel

Blitzo's

pain here.

[Taly]

ill get to

BM

better explanation better but mainly i dont see scum-him interacting with the people who has voted him as he does.

as for spew, don't worry about that

blitzo

, you're already doing it by just chatting real-time.

and

BM

read is not wishy-washy

p-edit

bell

what do you think of

blitzo's

latest posts and

DGB's

rationality in the post you just quoted?

[Taly]

going to sleep. night

[Taly]

VLA until Sunday.

[Taly]

just peeking through as i skimmed and saw lots of votes

can we hold off on any quick gamestate hammers before i get back with posts? ive been thinking about this thread on/off as ive been MIA, and im getting over a good bit of frustration i had last night.

late tomorrow or early sunday, i should be back.

Spoiler: {CAUTION} This spoiler is a vent on RL shit happening right now outside of Finals week.

barring i dont go to the ER because i think i have a hematoma after 6 weeks with an armpit lump thats becoming sore, 2 useless doctor's visits with horrendously long waits with doctor's offices that dont follow up or communicate each other... general blood test and an ultrasound that lead to more speculation with no result. does not help that i am a heart patient on blood pressure medicine.

didnt even get a referral to a hematologist which i am waiting on. and everything i mentioned ABOVE has been a 3-week on-going thing of continual bullshit.

and today i had a cardiac MRI check-up but of course... but of course... youll only get scanned for what your specialist orders to the radiologists, and nothing else that could be a problem.

yeah 2020 can fucking pucker up and kiss my ass... and the US healthcare system too.

I'm going to electrical with Battle Mage and Titus

And then after that Taly we can go on a date together
does that interest you?

omg i missed this the first time

<3 eeee alisae

loves me

but yeah im interested in this us PTing

dont we go to

admin

together?

[Taly]

If

{BM/MC}

contain any scum then I'm confident that I'm a scum pocket. :/

OWER

, do you think 1318 and 1563 gamestates can realistically coexist?

IE, mine from a solving standpoint and yours from a narrative control point.

[Taly]

I'm here. I'll have more thoughts out soon.

While I see no other

Flea

game where they spew at this volume, I'd like to hear the inconsistencies you see in their ISO

Alisae

. If you're looking at more than one slot to yeet, then I feel there's time to be made productive before any hammer.

Titus

, this question is important for me to sort you.

Titus, you've kept your vote on no-limming - to my understanding - for around 800 posts at this point.

580 was the first post that followed it, and it begins with you discussing the likelihood that you could be mislimmed.

Is it fair to say that part of your vote is defensive or deflective from suspicion (especially since you say your wagon is scum-driven)? Why is it not?

I'm currently gauging whether I scumread

Cakez/TGP

or I'm very biased because I don't like their progression in this game so far.

-

Namely,

Cakez

finally hopping onto a lim wagon that is the MOST popular yet 1573 with little context, specifically since they don't reference why they feel no limming is good.1555. I also think they've been unfair in their disposition towards, but this part is of least importance here.

- TGP

is because they've 1/3rd of their ISO revolves around scumreading

Blitzo

since their entrance, and I wasn't fond of the TvS disposition between

MCat/Blitzo

in 1637. I want to know why

MCat

was a townread that wasn't discussed much in their ISO, they've been widely suspected this game in general.

I forgot

Gamma

was in this game. I liked the mindmeld with

Alisae

on

Blitzo

wagon, but that's how I remembered them...

MCat

is quite a self-aware mafia player by posting 1628, which is the first foothood I've acquired reading that slot. I think I'll be reading other people's reaction as much as his solve content.
I'll take advantage of their willingness to answer me;

Bell, Taly

You are both posting vaguely townie things but there is nothing there that I think is never scum from either of you.

I don't know how well you understand

Bell

-meta but I don't think you're strong with

Taly

-meta.

So what classifies as

"never scum"

for either of us?
He can address this when he brings up his solve.

1633 is top tier posting on

Bell's

end.

Still wrapping up an ISO, but

Alisae/OWER/Bell

are my highest townreads. My scumread on

DGB

remains.

Haschel/Reck

is probably my next ISO if I do any more before EoD1.

If I had to be candid, I haven't felt that many wagons this D1 were very compelling. Part of the fault is mine, and I'd say the rest is a lack of cohesive casing that makes reasons behind a wagon less coherent.

I'll clear the air and say that I'm weary of being a pocket to

Pooky/BM

. I'd like their input on this.

Akarin

feels tonally good as town. I just wish they'd solve more, I see lots of mech from that slot and I don't think it's intentionally rolefishy but I get that impression.

I just don't feel the yuckies people get with the

Blitzo

slot? Perhaps this is me reading too passively, but I don't read them and think

"this is fake."

[Taly]

- Namely, Cakez finally hopping onto a lim wagon that is the MOST popular yet 1573 with little context, specifically since they don't reference why they feel

no limming is good 1555.

I also think they've been unfair in their disposition towards

me

, but this part is of least importance here.

fuck, i butchered this.

[Taly]

- Namely, Cakez finally hopping onto a lim wagon that is the MOST popular yet 1573 with little context, specifically since they don't reference why they feel

no limming is good 1555.

I also think they've been unfair in their disposition towards

me

, but this part is of least importance here.

fuck, i butchered this.

Dude I talked about no elim plan for ages in the early game and everybody knows it
You're trying to misrep me here

No, I'm wondering why you changed from wanting a no lim for so long to voting a wagon that has the highest potential to be a lim of the wagons thus far. 1555 1573

I'm getting tired of your insistence to paint my intentions as hostile.

[Taly]

The last time I was present in the thread I was frustrated, and to call 1316 1331 as hostile is valid.

But my argument to your 1272 was true.
I felt that you cherry-picked one of my earliest posts (and not my whole ISO) as a means to say that I don't have a lot of content, and 1319 still did not give much information on why you thought that.

You inquired about it, and I gave an emotional answer with frustration directed at more than just your slot. Your reply in 1348 doesn't help me realize what you don't follow.

My major issue with your approach to me resides

after

my 1351. I distrust the way you frame the interaction with me.

1832 read as dismissive because you made a post about my content, I engaged, and it looked like you wrote it off by saying I shouldn't have commented.
I gave you a way to engage with me in 1351 and I don't think your assessment that I'm trying to appeal to you is accurate or fair. 1388

If I wanted to appeal to you, why am I interacting with you in hostility, in your eyes?

The assessment doesn't make logical sense to me.

1661 reads as poor faith because you're more focused on detailing why a scumread on me is valid rather than dispelling what uncertainty you have with my posts.

I can understand that we could be miscommunicating, but I don't follow your assessment of my posts and if you're town, I'd rather you work with me here.

[Taly]

Cakez

, I'm not looking for a detailed rebuttal outlining your POV.

I want you to engage with what content I've created, and if you feel that I still haven't provided anything, don't confbias a reason to sus me, explain it.

[Taly]

Stepping from the thread a bit has helped me think a lot through.

This post was the start of my frustration the last time I posted:

Shit.

My townreads are generally people who scumread each other.

BM-Flea

Pooky-Reck

Murder-Alisae

with

Gamma/OWER

floating off somewhere.

This gamestate sucks.

And this was the root of my solving issue:

I honestly don't have many scumreads at the moment. Not something I want to admit, but I'm working to rectify this.

So, I went back to the posts where I felt

most

confident

actually you know what

unless

the scumteam or most of the scumteam is

{pooky/ali/BM/OWER}

, this game does not seem hard.

by extension, i think this group of 4 players are either majority-town or majority-scum

(3:1) (1:3) or (4:0)

probably will get to ISOing somewhere about that at some point.

oh cool, i figured out which group of players i want to solve first before reaching page 50 in a large theme.

So, before I throw a D1 solve into the thread; I'm dumping in my ISOs on

Battle Mage/Ali

and

OWER/Pooky

.

Also, with

Akarin's

1533... I see

Bell/Pooky

may be my PT buddies

<3

[Taly]

Spoiler: Alisae+BM ISO

real talk tho
lets talk about mechancis
I have no idea how to play this setup and I don't want to turn my brain on to think about it so...

I'd think

Alisae

regardless of alignment would be invested with alternative wincons, so for them to follow-up on a mechanical discussion they began in 29 and 30 makes this seem like a genuine thought project rather than a means to gain thread control.

I have 1 I think. I go to a room, then I do my task.

First interaction,

BM

immediately works with

Alisae

upon their 38 proposition.

54 reinforces that

BM

takes this plan in good faith.

yo Alisae - let's go electrical first!

Sure

This doesn't feel S/S at all. Unless they improvised a plan involving too much role speculation I refuse to dive into now, both of them are restricting themselves a lot N1 by publicly accepting how they do their tasks.

And they're the first, there's no clear indication in the thread that everybody will just march to the beat of their drum.

It feels unnecessary for these posts to come from both as scum.

VOTE: XreckonerX

Vote is reasonable. 89 was when

Reck

came in to just doing nothing... on page 4.

I could be wrong but I think being okay with a no lynch but also being not okay with claiming actions feels like a weird combination to come from scum

Gives

Cakez

benefit of the doubt. Something to note for later.

243 by

BM

and 387 by

Alisae

feel asynchronous.

BM

casually comments on

OWER

painting

Pooky/Alisae

as scum and yet

Alisae

outlines their thoughts to

OWER

in a constructive manner that is removed from doubtcasting

OWER's

intentions.

This is another point for non-S/S but I think this leans to

Alisae

town a bit. My experience with scum-them is that they're quite to control perception and opening up to

OWER

is the opposite of that because they're literally giving someone else control of the game's narrative.

Alisae

also questions

OWER

and... as I have context to how they think as I've recently hydra'd with them.... no alarms are sounding with their inquiry.

meh
too early to tell
if ur scum u'll obvscum if ur town u'll obvtown me thinks

Very lax take on

Titus

, good to document.

VOTE: titus

This may be 100+ posts ago but if

Alisae/BM

S-S ever existed... they're not following each other onto wagons and are only focused with the other's thoughts via setup.

yo ali where the wagons at or where the discussion for them at

how do you feel about the plist lumping you and pooky in the same vein together and by extension, how i am a contributor to that perception?

I don’t really care at the moment tbh

Apathetic, could be voting somewhere, isn't... first vote is at 646 on

Haschel

.

Why not jump into the young, chaotic gamestate that makes Large Themes insane? Doesn't. Sensible.

Also, unphased by the association to

Pooky

. This is good. This is a point against

Pooky/Alisae

S-S because I think effort would be placed into trying to dispel this thought ruminating in the thread.

700 is to murder but pooky can answer to idc

Again, prompting

Pooky

when it's not necessary.

Ya I want some Chaos
I trust you to create that environment

You're town, Pooky is town, that's what I got so far.

hey, I'm town!

There's a trend with

BM's

posts where they continually inject the idea that they're obvtown and by implication, shouldn't warrant suspicion... I don't like this type of posting because it serves nothing to a conversation but I've seen

BM

do it as town before.

you know
it now occured to me that maybe we shouldn't have said what our post restrictions were?

What are the pros & cons?

well I thought a con was scum get to fake post restrictions, but apparently they already have a list, so this isn't a con.
the pros would be I'm not actually sure. Its fun. There we go.

If

Alisae's

scum, they're

very comfortable

, and we're fucked.

But that's too much of a paranoia-driven thought process. I don't see an agenda here.

you're planning to elim me today so does it matter?

Flippant. I'm starting to sympathize with the

BM

wagon, although, I'm unsure how NAI this statement is.

So I can start getting a ball rolling on something other than mechanical talk and setup speculation.

This doesn't take long to think about.

I also want to see more posting from you in general since this posting from you doesn't feel like what I've witnessed first-hand in O799.

I was the boss in that game. here I'm a pawn amongst queens.

plus i'm not big on mech talk really, and I like simple plans that people actually deliver on. the idea of doing half a massclaim and then abandoning it, is a bit wtf?

I can see this from scum POV trying to revive more information about mechanics, but

BM

began this game interacting with mechanical discussion... so this isn't surprising or worrying to read.

@Taly,

Pooky, alisae, you (or you're doing a good job of faking some pretty detailed thoughts!), Flea,
even though I gave a warning about the doggo the doggo is still town spewing from my pov.

The rest are kinda meh, I could prolly point to weak town leans/scum leans but per post it would balance on and off.
Titus I'm rapidly vacillitating on because she looks like obv scum, but she's always scum/third party so.
Have I even played with town titus.
Oh. Yeah sort of.

a tactic scum!taly likes to use is they like to make it easier for other people to spew themselves

The post I dislike most about

Alisae's

entire ISO.

Bell

was sending an olive branch and reading me with good faith and they interject with a reason to doubtcast that.

I also feel like it's a slight misrep because I bring people to spew regardless of my alignment. Me getting information from others is not what's specifically AI, it's what I do with/during/before/after that information.

I don't fault

Alisae

though... I'm a hard metaread.

Maybe I just really like Flea's posting this game and I'm biased tho.

So you're saying that Taly is good at being scum? Aight.

missed this.
They can be. Idunno if you saw my MtG thread but I came out of a scum hydra with them. Their scumplay is fairly green. TBH when we hydra'd, they told me something that I needed to look out and to kill them on site if they do it but I don't recall what that is for the life of me.
I think I have an idea on how to catch scum!Taly if it exists in this game but if that world exists, it won't be until a wolf before him dies.

This is another reason why I didn't push

Alisae

.

I think looking at me at a later day is a valid way to sort me if I don't get nightkilled... I just hope

Alisae

isn't posting this as a precursor to case me when it's most viable to lim me.

I mean, I've only been caught as scum via associations and busses before... and I'm mislimmed more often.

But relatively speaking, I don't get limmed often at all.

Maybe I just really like Flea's posting this game and I'm biased tho.

So you're saying that Taly is good at being scum? Aight.

missed this.
They can be. Idunno if you saw my MtG thread but I came out of a scum hydra with them. Their scumplay is fairly green. TBH when we hydra'd, they told me something that I needed to look out and to kill them on site if they do it but I don't recall what that is for the life of me.
I think I have an idea on how to catch scum!Taly if it exists in this game but if that world exists, it won't be until a wolf before him dies.

i dont remember saying something

exactly

like

"kill me on sight if i do something"

, but i might have.

i cant tell if your take on me is to be pragmatic knowing what im capable of, or youre positioning around me since your approach to me right now is to shelve me.

basically, are you taking to me in good faith here? i feel like ive had more posts directed to or about you than otherwise, so i want to know if the distance is intentional.

atm ur just completely not on my radar

Fair. I admit and I think I told

Alisae

that I fall into the background often as scum.

But this isn't very intentional, if my word means anything here, it's a large theme.

My second thought was that TGP was entirely forgettable.
I might let that develop for a bit and see what happens.

obviously i can't prove this, but i think blitzo wrote this AFTER previewing and faked it so they didn't

what the fuck

My thoughts exactly.

1240 is an interesting take from

Alisae

onto

Haschel

. They're a scumread (I presume) and yet

Alisae

sees a post that they don't agree with and decides not to push it further.

Ali is a known powerwolf and wants to manipulate the gamestate/narrative to eir advantage and the fact that they were one of the first people pushing No Eliminate plan makes me suspicious.

I'M NOT EVEN DOING ANY OF THAT
omg
im malding

Can we move on to no elimination and compliance? I am bored and this feels like an RVS that will last forever.

HOLY SHIT TITUS
NO
STOP
LET PEOPLE SCUMHUNT IF THEY WANT TO THERE'S NO HARM IN THAT.

lmfao

Yeah my townread on Ali rn is based on the fact there's been no AtE or weird aggression lol

I use emotion as town.

Alisae's

rage caps are even funnier with this interaction. They call themselves out to

Flea

. Town does this more often than scum if they feel a read on them doesn't make sense, and 1443 is a later vote so this post - in context - may be affecting

Alisae's

read on

Flea

adversely.

If you want to group, requote this list in a chain

Taly, come to Electrical tonight.

Titus reads all over the place here - unusual for her.

Ignoring the baiting from Flea - I have been pulling out some great reads so far imho.

>

Interested in working with me.

>

Knowing the 1440 vote progression on

Titus

, makes me wonder if this was in some form a planned vote. Although, I did agree with

BM

here.

>

I also agree with

BM's

take to

Flea

, it's hard to figure out what their thoughts are on

BM

because it's veiled in walls mainly looking at posts rather than

BM

as a whole.

I don't think

BM

has really accomplished much specifically with their wagon but perhaps that's a playstyle disparity between us and how we think?

also I'd missed your post Taly, but I havent really bothered explaining reads as the game is moving so fast, and it isn't like anyone is sheeping me right now

at some point when things calm down, I'll collate everything and decide what to do.

In the meantime I guess I just need to avoid getting elimmed myself haha

my townblock is pretty good: Pooky, Cakez, Gamma, TGP, Akarin were in there, I forget who else. I can buy OutWorldER as town from those voting me. Leaning town on Alisae too.

DGB is doing pretty standard scum tactic of just tunnelling someone they see as an easy target. Titus is a bit erratic but also distant and doesn't feel as invested in the game - more in line with scum vibe than town vibe. Blitzo has been scummy but he also feels like the sort of player who scum would push as a cheap mis-elim. Flea is doing a lot of that LAMISTy stuff but it's superficial - long ISO cases which don't strike a balanced objective line, are a scum move I've used many times in my youth.

Aside from

Cakez/TGP/Akarin

townread confidence strength, I mindmeld

BM

with his reads, town and scum.

I'm not sure about

Titus

but I agree with

DGB

assesment.

I'll reserve thoughts on

Flea

when I spew a D1 solve.

I detected genuine emotion from

BM's

1310 and I don't think scum angles frustration this way very often. It could've been channeled into an aggressive push and I don't think

BM

is trying to placate

Flea

just to get pressure off.

Taly-

let's just work outside of our respective townpools then. We aren't too far off each other tbh.

i've played 1 game with cakez town, and 1 game with cakez scum. In the nicest possible way, when he was scum he was completely obvscum, and when he was town he was pretty obviously town. As scum he got elimmed on Day 1 for basically trying to run a fake-meta gambit on me (as well as some other things i think). In this game, he's giving believable pro-town takes and coming across much more natural. I think cakez is sweet.

The most helpful post to me this game.

Unless

BM

is hard-attempting to pocket me, I don't know why scum-him wants to work with me when

Cakez/Titus/DGB/Akarin

have all either taken frustration to my posts, scumread me, or have had negative commentary on my POV.

VOTE: Titus

Haschel, you with me?

I'm with you

VOTE: Titus

VOTE: Flea

...Asynchronous and D1 is halfway finished. Why go on different pushes now?

Synopsis

I really don't see how

Alisae/BM

are S/S here, or everything they're doing is to distance them in the context of how they read the game.

I will note, they don't often state reads on the other, so I will be attentive to this in the future.

Alisae

is town because their POV lacks what I'd imagine scum-them,

at the very least

, this stage of the game.

BM

is less confidently town, I wonder if their more flippant disposition is to nullify suspicion and placate others.

[Taly]

Spoiler: Pooky+OWER ISO

MechPooky:

10 rooms

4->3->3

Nelim to win? More town people = faster task completion

ok mass task claim time

i have navigation and cafeteria so I'm a fat pilot

First bits of content of

Pooky

are mainly setup but actually drive the mechanical discussion narrative.

I assume Shea has put enough thought into this that this probably won't just win the game for us.
I also assume that we can't just no elim to a task victory easily.
Not that I'm saying we shouldn't do this but ya know

susp

I can post link a lot of

Pooky

just saying

"susp"

to

Murder

, some with

Haschel's

posts, and I've noticed some for

Gamma/Rec/OWER/I think Cakez?

.

On one hand, this is

Pooky

simplifying his reads as he's stuck on working toward a mechanical solve versus anything else.

The other hand, is that these posts are just placeholders so pushing to lim a slot makes more logical sense...

And on a deeper look,

Pooky

is trying to test the waters; either to evaluate how the thread interacts with the other, or try to push people to follow his narrative by continually repeating the same rhetoric.

Looking at

2

:

2

in terms of TAI and SAI. Can't parse off his

"susp"

posts alone.

i think murder cat is trying to go for the reactor sabotage

At least in contact with

Murder

, the 1st and 4th reasons are possible ways to look at this. Mechanical solve orientation, or thread control.

1

:

1

motivation I'm seeing.

This narrows down

Pooky's

way of thinking slightly in context of his later posts.

97 reinforces this take.

VOTE: Pooky

Pooky/Alisae are scum.

Immediately trying to get town to divulge all the information scum could possibly want, pushing NE's so they don't have to face any possible pressure, and distracting town away from actual scumhunting with our alternate win condition.

All of this is a favorable game-state for scum, not town. Town should want the locations they have to go to be secret so that scum can't plan where they're going without making reads (outside of circumstances were Town should want to team up with other Town in a hood.) Town should want scum elims for obvious reasons AND to reduce likelihood of the big scary extra kill. Town will still want regular elims for the reasons we always want regular elims. Tasks become distributable anyways when they die and we can push the public tasks to people who are widely TR'd and already going to the same location (which would be a scenario we'd actually want to have people claiming tasks.)

Thank you for coming to my TED talk. Please stop falling for scum ploys to give them a favorable gamestate.

Strong entry reads.

OWER's

posts in time should clarify the sincerity of them.

why would pocketing even matter if we're going for a task win?

This is a reply to

OWER's

410 and there's NO direct commentary on

OWER's

post about

Pooky/Alisae

.

I think

Pooky

focusing on the task wincon is becoming genuine but I also feel that his lack of reply about the

Pooky/Alisae

S-S assessment is a side-step rather than taking his reply as nonchalance.

This was after

OWER/Alisae

discussed in depth about each other's stances on how to go about the game.

One last thing before I dip out of this thread for a while because my head gets woozy when I think too hard.

The No Elim plan is also awful because it prevents PR's from forming reads and will make Town night actions awful.

why would pocketing even matter if we're going for a task win?

pedit: two last things

Town PR's exist, unknown scum utility exists, people getting smart to this BS plan will exist.

OWER

brings the strongest counterpoint to

Alisae/Pooky

among EVERY other slot in this game.

Town can have role-incentives to tell or NOT tell what their role information is, and vice versa for scum.

This makes

OWER's

stance far more genuine and less likely to be a fabricated argument just to contrast

Alisae/Pooky

.

every one of your complaints has to do with solving this game by killing the bad guys

im proposing we solve the game by just doing all the tasks as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Pooky

seems to miss

OWER's

point but I don't think that's AI.

Again,

Pooky

sticks to the same goal of the game. Though I wonder, if

Pooky

were scum doing this, why didn't he come after

OWER's

opposition sooner when the ideas were fresh in the thread and could've easily been shaded like the many other voices that did?

BM/TGP/etc.

I think this favors T/T more than T/S, but after so many posts with

Pooky

reiterating the same line of logic, I begin to trust his disposition less.

And I've said, 1000 times and I'll keep saying it:

Trying to win off solely off mech in a closed setup is setting up town for failure

You are setting up town for failure

You are scum.

Actual last post, I'm going to log off and wait for others because I'm sure others are not happy with me spamming shit up.

nope

Outworld sounds more like ignorant town than scum tho

Casual. Is

Pooky

like this as scum?

The benefit of the doubt for

OWER

is there, which makes me think not.

OWER

is an interesting slot in this situation, on one hand, he has a valid viewpoint on

Pooky/Ali

... the other, is that it is weird AF for him to wagon

Titus

after doubling-down on the

Pooky

scumread. Interactions make him least likely to be aligned with the other... OR

(2:2)

situation involving him is where i would start to investigate.

I mostly went with the Titus wagon to get things off this mech talk and encourage town to ditch the awful No Elim plan.

Already it's paid off since we've got more tangible things to go after and our positions in the game now are not solely based on support/opposition for the Pooky/Ali plan, at least for the people involved in this wagon.

I had reservations about Titus's posting before this recent bout since it feels like she should've at least had some weigh-in on the mech posting but this recent streak seems mostly like standard Titus.

Titus's points against BM ring true and considering his stances earlier his flip will help us sort the Pooky/Ali plan so I'm on board there.

VOTE: Battle Mage

@Titus

Who do you think are the scum on/were on your wagon outside of Battle Mage or is BM the only read you've got there?

Did not make his reply post a rationality to why my solve is misled or push me in a specific direction.

I'm very strong on

OWER

town even by this point.

I'm still in vehement disagreement of No Elim being good here, especially considering recent events.

At the very least, I'd like to flip somebody with hard stances on it, flip Me/Reck or Pooky/Ali. Then use the alignment to determine who's right.

I don't personally like this approach lims mainly for a way to resolve the gamestate.

But since

OWER

scumreads

Pooky

and/or

Ali

at this point, it makes sense.

It is iffy that he lumped

Reck

in with himself. Feels like a dichotomy creation. He doesn't expand on this, so I don't think it's an agenda.

why is murdercatto not tryharding this game?

highly susp

Biggest concern for

Pooky

is why he feels so strongly on

Murdercat

but is so focused on mechanical discussion.

It feels noncommittal to say you're solving this game via mech but keep detailing an actual solve for a slot.

can someone condense the cases on

BM

and

Haschel

?

flea

i notice you say

Hasch

is sus but are still on

BM

, why?

i liked

reck's

732, to be concise, i dont think they are manufactured takes.

reck

, hmu

p-edit

Blitzo is scum :sadface:

Sell me on this.

you inquire like this a lot, what is the purpose?

If the person is town I get their fellow perspective on where they're at in the game, which helps me shape my own reads.

If the person is scum then their read will be fake or will have an agenda behind it, which will show, albeit most likely not immedietly.

Good reply.

OWER's

approach has a lot of context toward gamesolving with this answer.

read posts 0-150 of pooky/ali

they did not begin with asserting their plans and they are consistently building off the other... really hard to fake this as theatre imo.

alisae is so in tune with me

e is precious

I don't think S/S flaunts buddying this hard, maybe not even S/T.

Alisae

being likelier town, but I also have to consider that

Pooky

may be trying to pocket.

Taly is by far my strongest townread for being the person who is visibly doing the most scumhunting.

This wasn't on the list of things I think I'd read upon my lazy half-ass skim But I'll take it.

Flea/OWER/Murder

, you all have very different vibes than in https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=84987 where I was scum hydra with

Ali

wolfing on all of you townies

flea

, you are much more upfront with POV, kind of hard to navigate and get to the meat of your posting, and you take so much initiative here that I don't know how genuine that is.

OWER

, your dog pic is really fucking cute and that probably contributes to the pocket, can you give me an in depth take on

BM/Ali/Pooky

? You are far more active in pushing your ideas than the linked game above.

Murder

, WHERE YOU AT? methinks I skim over you so much that you are an assassin meant to kill us all quietly... but tbh I sympathize, I think I'd be FAR less

"not-on-the-radar"

if people took the time to read me more.

I stand by

Bell/Ali/Pooky/Reck/OWER/Gamma

town

TENTATIVELY

. I want to reread them as well as

BM/Murder/Flea

before I double-down 100%.

If I can make a solid towncore with at LEAST 6-7 people AND find a vote this dayphase, I'd be golden with solving in the future.

DG

;3 I'll vote soon, I never disappoint.

also who is

Blitzo

? i demand everybody who reads this post to say

"

Blitzo

is town/scum/?"

so I can gauge how many wagons this gamestate actually wants to have...

BM's play is far different from what I remember in the game I played with him, where was very active in engaging other people and wasn't really a passive fluff-poster like he is here. Especially given there's a lot of contradictions in his play so far. (Compare 111 to 129, 75 and 153). Other posts like 198 and such ping me.

Ali is a known powerwolf and wants to manipulate the gamestate/narrative to eir advantage and the fact that they were one of the first people pushing No Eliminate plan makes me suspicious.

The thing that really pings me about both of them is that neither put a vote down in RVS, which even Pooky did. Maybe I'm seeing things that aren't there but to me it signals that they knew the plan they wanted to push before the game started, despite Ali saying e hadn't thought about the setup and didn't want to.

Pooky is probably my weakest SR after a bit of thought, but I still have a lot of reservations about people trying to push a mechanical victory in a closed setup and his somewhat disingenuous approach to opposition such as in 1113. I think of the three, he's probably the most likely to just be overeager town that's tunnel visioning on a alt. win-con.

As for why my play is different, it's mostly because after that game I finally figured out how I want to approach mafia games as town, how I want to read them, and a style of analysis. Which is why I'm more confident and a bit more thought-out here.

Regarding more mech-talk:

I think Leashing is fine but better to be done in a limited manner. Ideas include:

A) Having 1 claim in each area. That's 10 claims but at the very least we'll know that 1 person should or should not be in that area.

B) Getting task claims out of high SR'd people to track their movement.

C) TR's task claiming with each other to form town-blocs. If we do this right we can essentially have multiple groups of Masons running around.

I think seeing the Areas as just rooms to do tasks in and avoid multi-kills is a bad idea. I think having hoods which anyone can enter is a pretty powerful ability for Town for the same reason why Neighborizer is a strong role in the right hands.

OWER

starts to see some points that are helpful to the mechanical discussion, and I think this makes logical sense with his dissipating scumread on

Pooky

.

This is likely not S/S because while they both seem to calm down with each other mutually, their stances are explainable.

ok
Does anyone else have the feeling with Taly's posts that she is writing a lot of words but none of them actually mean that much?

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

I highly doubt DGB read any of taly's posts b4 responding here.

Liked this post. I felt similar to

DGB

. If

Pooky's

letting me lean on him interaction-wise through a soft-defense, then he's subtle with it.

Really like this post from Taly, reasonable suggestions and thought processes, a lot of which are similar to how I'm thinking about the game.

Haven't been posting a lot due to being busy with other things, but I will say that I do have stuff to work with here, I just need time to formulate it into my thoughts on the game.

I don't know how this can be a pocket, honestly. This is at a time in the thread where I'm scumread but not pushed for a lim. Awkward stance to support my posts as scum.

My strongest TR's at this point are Akarin and Bell, mostly because they least fit into the game-state as I observed in 1553. I also think Blitzo is somewhat likely to be town for those reasons. The wagon on him doesn't really seem to have a driver? At least that I've observed, and despite no-one really coming to his defense it's mostly stalled, and while normally you could attribute that to the No Elim plan there seems to be a consensus to vote anyways so the stagnation of his wagon suggests to me that he's probably town.

I keep thinking about it and I'm mostly talking myself into a Murdercat vote the more I do. He seems to be the main one keeping the game in stagnation and furthermore has expressed content with this game-state, despite the current trajectory of this day being mostly bad for town with the weak reads from most players and lacking motivation. He shows no initiative to try and influence the game-state in any way and his posts such as 1180 showcase that he has no initiative to force other slots to make AI content.

VOTE: Murdercat

As an aside, I had time to think about it and I've mostly come around to the claiming rooms part of the plan, though not to the No Elim portion.

So I've got 1 task in Cafeteria.

I don't feel too confident with a

MCat

solve at the moment but this and 1625 aligns very keenly with the gamestate read he proposes in 1553 and

OWER

would have to be top level scum to be this detailed in thought process AND fabricate a concrete conclusion.

your links don't work

my scumteam will be bad at this stage but something to the effect of {MC, BM, ?, ?}. My other reads are weak, don't fit into the game narrative and I'd rather see a lot of things before deciding MC's partners (assuming that I'm right on MC, which I think I am.)

Could've construed

Flea's

post links as a scumslip but just lets

Flea

know.

Synopsis

I... I don't see scum-

OWER

. At all.

I have reservations with

Pooky's

disparity between wanting to mechanically win so strongly but also solve in a manner that doubtcasts quite a few players' post with low context.

But I have no clue who

Pooky's

team would be, and I like some of their posts.

So

OWER

is solid town around the tier of

Alisae

,

Pooky

is low-town to

"I'm sorting"

around

BM's

level.

[Taly]

Spoiler: Pooky+OWER ISO

MechPooky:

10 rooms

4->3->3

Nelim to win? More town people = faster task completion

ok mass task claim time

i have navigation and cafeteria so I'm a fat pilot

First bits of content of

Pooky

are mainly setup but actually drive the mechanical discussion narrative.

I assume Shea has put enough thought into this that this probably won't just win the game for us.
I also assume that we can't just no elim to a task victory easily.
Not that I'm saying we shouldn't do this but ya know

susp

I can post link a lot of

Pooky

just saying

"susp"

to

Murder

, some with

Haschel's

posts, and I've noticed some for

Gamma/Rec/OWER/I think Cakez?

.

On one hand, this is

Pooky

simplifying his reads as he's stuck on working toward a mechanical solve versus anything else.

The other hand, is that these posts are just placeholders so pushing to lim a slot makes more logical sense...

And on a deeper look,

Pooky

is trying to test the waters; either to evaluate how the thread interacts with the other, or try to push people to follow his narrative by continually repeating the same rhetoric.

Looking at

2

:

2

in terms of TAI and SAI. Can't parse off his

"susp"

posts alone.

i think murder cat is trying to go for the reactor sabotage

At least in contact with

Murder

, the 1st and 4th reasons are possible ways to look at this. Mechanical solve orientation, or thread control.

1

:

1

motivation I'm seeing.

This narrows down

Pooky's

way of thinking slightly in context of his later posts.

97 reinforces this take.

VOTE: Pooky

Pooky/Alisae are scum.

Immediately trying to get town to divulge all the information scum could possibly want, pushing NE's so they don't have to face any possible pressure, and distracting town away from actual scumhunting with our alternate win condition.

All of this is a favorable game-state for scum, not town. Town should want the locations they have to go to be secret so that scum can't plan where they're going without making reads (outside of circumstances were Town should want to team up with other Town in a hood.) Town should want scum elims for obvious reasons AND to reduce likelihood of the big scary extra kill. Town will still want regular elims for the reasons we always want regular elims. Tasks become distributable anyways when they die and we can push the public tasks to people who are widely TR'd and already going to the same location (which would be a scenario we'd actually want to have people claiming tasks.)

Thank you for coming to my TED talk. Please stop falling for scum ploys to give them a favorable gamestate.

Strong entry reads.

OWER's

posts in time should clarify the sincerity of them.

why would pocketing even matter if we're going for a task win?

This is a reply to

OWER's

410 and there's NO direct commentary on

OWER's

post about

Pooky/Alisae

.

I think

Pooky

focusing on the task wincon is becoming genuine but I also feel that his lack of reply about the

Pooky/Alisae

S-S assessment is a side-step rather than taking his reply as nonchalance.

This was after

OWER/Alisae

discussed in depth about each other's stances on how to go about the game.

One last thing before I dip out of this thread for a while because my head gets woozy when I think too hard.

The No Elim plan is also awful because it prevents PR's from forming reads and will make Town night actions awful.

why would pocketing even matter if we're going for a task win?

pedit: two last things

Town PR's exist, unknown scum utility exists, people getting smart to this BS plan will exist.

OWER

brings the strongest counterpoint to

Alisae/Pooky

among EVERY other slot in this game.

Town can have role-incentives to tell or NOT tell what their role information is, and vice versa for scum.

This makes

OWER's

stance far more genuine and less likely to be a fabricated argument just to contrast

Alisae/Pooky

.

every one of your complaints has to do with solving this game by killing the bad guys

im proposing we solve the game by just doing all the tasks as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Pooky

seems to miss

OWER's

point but I don't think that's AI.

Again,

Pooky

sticks to the same goal of the game. Though I wonder, if

Pooky

were scum doing this, why didn't he come after

OWER's

opposition sooner when the ideas were fresh in the thread and could've easily been shaded like the many other voices that did?

BM/TGP/etc.

I think this favors T/T more than T/S, but after so many posts with

Pooky

reiterating the same line of logic, I begin to trust his disposition less.

And I've said, 1000 times and I'll keep saying it:

Trying to win off solely off mech in a closed setup is setting up town for failure

You are setting up town for failure

You are scum.

Actual last post, I'm going to log off and wait for others because I'm sure others are not happy with me spamming shit up.

nope

Outworld sounds more like ignorant town than scum tho

Casual. Is

Pooky

like this as scum?

The benefit of the doubt for

OWER

is there, which makes me think not.

OWER

is an interesting slot in this situation, on one hand, he has a valid viewpoint on

Pooky/Ali

... the other, is that it is weird AF for him to wagon

Titus

after doubling-down on the

Pooky

scumread. Interactions make him least likely to be aligned with the other... OR

(2:2)

situation involving him is where i would start to investigate.

I mostly went with the Titus wagon to get things off this mech talk and encourage town to ditch the awful No Elim plan.

Already it's paid off since we've got more tangible things to go after and our positions in the game now are not solely based on support/opposition for the Pooky/Ali plan, at least for the people involved in this wagon.

I had reservations about Titus's posting before this recent bout since it feels like she should've at least had some weigh-in on the mech posting but this recent streak seems mostly like standard Titus.

Titus's points against BM ring true and considering his stances earlier his flip will help us sort the Pooky/Ali plan so I'm on board there.

VOTE: Battle Mage

@Titus

Who do you think are the scum on/were on your wagon outside of Battle Mage or is BM the only read you've got there?

Did not make his reply post a rationality to why my solve is misled or push me in a specific direction.

I'm very strong on

OWER

town even by this point.

I'm still in vehement disagreement of No Elim being good here, especially considering recent events.

At the very least, I'd like to flip somebody with hard stances on it, flip Me/Reck or Pooky/Ali. Then use the alignment to determine who's right.

I don't personally like this approach lims mainly for a way to resolve the gamestate.

But since

OWER

scumreads

Pooky

and/or

Ali

at this point, it makes sense.

It is iffy that he lumped

Reck

in with himself. Feels like a dichotomy creation. He doesn't expand on this, so I don't think it's an agenda.

why is murdercatto not tryharding this game?

highly susp

Biggest concern for

Pooky

is why he feels so strongly on

Murdercat

but is so focused on mechanical discussion.

It feels noncommittal to say you're solving this game via mech but keep detailing an actual solve for a slot.

can someone condense the cases on

BM

and

Haschel

?

flea

i notice you say

Hasch

is sus but are still on

BM

, why?

i liked

reck's

732, to be concise, i dont think they are manufactured takes.

reck

, hmu

p-edit

Blitzo is scum :sadface:

Sell me on this.

you inquire like this a lot, what is the purpose?

If the person is town I get their fellow perspective on where they're at in the game, which helps me shape my own reads.

If the person is scum then their read will be fake or will have an agenda behind it, which will show, albeit most likely not immedietly.

Good reply.

OWER's

approach has a lot of context toward gamesolving with this answer.

read posts 0-150 of pooky/ali

they did not begin with asserting their plans and they are consistently building off the other... really hard to fake this as theatre imo.

alisae is so in tune with me

e is precious

I don't think S/S flaunts buddying this hard, maybe not even S/T.

Alisae

being likelier town, but I also have to consider that

Pooky

may be trying to pocket.

Taly is by far my strongest townread for being the person who is visibly doing the most scumhunting.

This wasn't on the list of things I think I'd read upon my lazy half-ass skim But I'll take it.

Flea/OWER/Murder

, you all have very different vibes than in https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=84987 where I was scum hydra with

Ali

wolfing on all of you townies

flea

, you are much more upfront with POV, kind of hard to navigate and get to the meat of your posting, and you take so much initiative here that I don't know how genuine that is.

OWER

, your dog pic is really fucking cute and that probably contributes to the pocket, can you give me an in depth take on

BM/Ali/Pooky

? You are far more active in pushing your ideas than the linked game above.

Murder

, WHERE YOU AT? methinks I skim over you so much that you are an assassin meant to kill us all quietly... but tbh I sympathize, I think I'd be FAR less

"not-on-the-radar"

if people took the time to read me more.

I stand by

Bell/Ali/Pooky/Reck/OWER/Gamma

town

TENTATIVELY

. I want to reread them as well as

BM/Murder/Flea

before I double-down 100%.

If I can make a solid towncore with at LEAST 6-7 people AND find a vote this dayphase, I'd be golden with solving in the future.

DG

;3 I'll vote soon, I never disappoint.

also who is

Blitzo

? i demand everybody who reads this post to say

"

Blitzo

is town/scum/?"

so I can gauge how many wagons this gamestate actually wants to have...

BM's play is far different from what I remember in the game I played with him, where was very active in engaging other people and wasn't really a passive fluff-poster like he is here. Especially given there's a lot of contradictions in his play so far. (Compare 111 to 129, 75 and 153). Other posts like 198 and such ping me.

Ali is a known powerwolf and wants to manipulate the gamestate/narrative to eir advantage and the fact that they were one of the first people pushing No Eliminate plan makes me suspicious.

The thing that really pings me about both of them is that neither put a vote down in RVS, which even Pooky did. Maybe I'm seeing things that aren't there but to me it signals that they knew the plan they wanted to push before the game started, despite Ali saying e hadn't thought about the setup and didn't want to.

Pooky is probably my weakest SR after a bit of thought, but I still have a lot of reservations about people trying to push a mechanical victory in a closed setup and his somewhat disingenuous approach to opposition such as in 1113. I think of the three, he's probably the most likely to just be overeager town that's tunnel visioning on a alt. win-con.

As for why my play is different, it's mostly because after that game I finally figured out how I want to approach mafia games as town, how I want to read them, and a style of analysis. Which is why I'm more confident and a bit more thought-out here.

Regarding more mech-talk:

I think Leashing is fine but better to be done in a limited manner. Ideas include:

A) Having 1 claim in each area. That's 10 claims but at the very least we'll know that 1 person should or should not be in that area.

B) Getting task claims out of high SR'd people to track their movement.

C) TR's task claiming with each other to form town-blocs. If we do this right we can essentially have multiple groups of Masons running around.

I think seeing the Areas as just rooms to do tasks in and avoid multi-kills is a bad idea. I think having hoods which anyone can enter is a pretty powerful ability for Town for the same reason why Neighborizer is a strong role in the right hands.

OWER

starts to see some points that are helpful to the mechanical discussion, and I think this makes logical sense with his dissipating scumread on

Pooky

.

This is likely not S/S because while they both seem to calm down with each other mutually, their stances are explainable.

ok
Does anyone else have the feeling with Taly's posts that she is writing a lot of words but none of them actually mean that much?

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

I highly doubt DGB read any of taly's posts b4 responding here.

Liked this post. I felt similar to

DGB

. If

Pooky's

letting me lean on him interaction-wise through a soft-defense, then he's subtle with it.

Really like this post from Taly, reasonable suggestions and thought processes, a lot of which are similar to how I'm thinking about the game.

Haven't been posting a lot due to being busy with other things, but I will say that I do have stuff to work with here, I just need time to formulate it into my thoughts on the game.

I don't know how this can be a pocket, honestly. This is at a time in the thread where I'm scumread but not pushed for a lim. Awkward stance to support my posts as scum.

My strongest TR's at this point are Akarin and Bell, mostly because they least fit into the game-state as I observed in 1553. I also think Blitzo is somewhat likely to be town for those reasons. The wagon on him doesn't really seem to have a driver? At least that I've observed, and despite no-one really coming to his defense it's mostly stalled, and while normally you could attribute that to the No Elim plan there seems to be a consensus to vote anyways so the stagnation of his wagon suggests to me that he's probably town.

I keep thinking about it and I'm mostly talking myself into a Murdercat vote the more I do. He seems to be the main one keeping the game in stagnation and furthermore has expressed content with this game-state, despite the current trajectory of this day being mostly bad for town with the weak reads from most players and lacking motivation. He shows no initiative to try and influence the game-state in any way and his posts such as 1180 showcase that he has no initiative to force other slots to make AI content.

VOTE: Murdercat

As an aside, I had time to think about it and I've mostly come around to the claiming rooms part of the plan, though not to the No Elim portion.

So I've got 1 task in Cafeteria.

I don't feel too confident with a

MCat

solve at the moment but this and 1625 aligns very keenly with the gamestate read he proposes in 1553 and

OWER

would have to be top level scum to be this detailed in thought process AND fabricate a concrete conclusion.

your links don't work

my scumteam will be bad at this stage but something to the effect of {MC, BM, ?, ?}. My other reads are weak, don't fit into the game narrative and I'd rather see a lot of things before deciding MC's partners (assuming that I'm right on MC, which I think I am.)

Could've construed

Flea's

post links as a scumslip but just lets

Flea

know.

Synopsis

I... I don't see scum-

OWER

. At all.

I have reservations with

Pooky's

disparity between wanting to mechanically win so strongly but also solve in a manner that doubtcasts quite a few players' post with low context.

But I have no clue who

Pooky's

team would be, and I like some of their posts.

So

OWER

is solid town around the tier of

Alisae

,

Pooky

is low-town to

"I'm sorting"

around

BM's

level.

[Taly]

wtf how did that double-post

[Taly]

Unless I'm on a mary-go-round getting mindfucked by

Alisae/OWER

simultaneously, I like this solve.

Without ISOs elsewhere, here's where I'm at.

Strong Townreads: {Alisae, OWER}

Weaker Townreads:{Pooky, BM, Flea, Bell, Akarin, Gamma, Blitzo}

Sorting/Volatile Reads: {SirCakez, Titus, Murdercat}

Contains Scum Via PoE + Interactions: {Haschel, Reckoner, TGP}

Confident Scum Independently: {DrippingGoofBall}

I plan to resolve

{SirCakez/Titus/Murdercat}

reads.

{Haschel/Reckoner/TGP}

I STRONGLY doubt contain all scum, but they make the most logical sense in respect to my townreads.

This isn't a very realistic readslist D1 but it's 16p I'm reading in 1 week, so...

[Taly]

oh. beautiful.

my top townies scumread each other.

like in half of my games.

[Taly]

The last time I was present in the thread I was frustrated, and to call 1316 1331 as hostile is valid.

But my argument to your 1272 was true.
I felt that you cherry-picked one of my earliest posts (and not my whole ISO) as a means to say that I don't have a lot of content, and 1319 still did not give much information on why you thought that.

You inquired about it, and I gave an emotional answer with frustration directed at more than just your slot. Your reply in 1348 doesn't help me realize what you don't follow.

My major issue with your approach to me resides

after

my 1351. I distrust the way you frame the interaction with me.

1832 read as dismissive because you made a post about my content, I engaged, and it looked like you wrote it off by saying I shouldn't have commented.
I gave you a way to engage with me in 1351 and I don't think your assessment that I'm trying to appeal to you is accurate or fair. 1388

If I wanted to appeal to you, why am I interacting with you in hostility, in your eyes?

The assessment doesn't make logical sense to me.

1661 reads as poor faith because you're more focused on detailing why a scumread on me is valid rather than dispelling what uncertainty you have with my posts.

I can understand that we could be miscommunicating, but I don't follow your assessment of my posts and if you're town, I'd rather you work with me here.

I'm not sure why you are so hung up on that one post I quoted - as I said it was representative of your whole ISO. It was not meant to be the "one post" I was trying to nail you on.
I feel your posts are just padded out a lot with a lot of waffling and unconclusive content and I feel it could be scum motivated as people tend to go "walls = town."
In 1382 I was being dismissive, because I felt like you were looking for something that wasn't there. Thus I was calling the response scummy.
Appease =/= appeal. I'm using appease in this context as trying to diffuse pressure on you by giving me what I want, basically, by trying to "explain" yourself as town motivated.
And in 1661 I'm shooting down your claim that I haven't said why I want no-elim. Which, you still haven't explained why you said that when it's blatantly not true.

I never explained myself to be town-motivated in my mind. I was telling you about a more productive way to solve me.

And I stand by my stance. It was not my intention to misrep you like you understood in 1661. I didn't explictly say you never discussed no limming at all.

I was talking about how you didn't mention it in 1555 I wanted to know how your progression changed between THAT POST and your vote on

Murder

.

I get frustrated when people tell me I don't contribute when I gave reads about the game. I'm trying to mitigate this.

I don't like feeling dismissed, and it wasn't just

your post

that I got tense over, I was also vexed by

DGB's

disposition towards me and the disconnect I had with

Akarin

.

~~~

Aside from game stuff, I will admit I was angry IRL the other night and I AtE'd in the thread when I should've just logged off.

I apologize for how I presented myself. My difficulty with IRL frustration exacerbating my negativity in the game was why I VLA'd. I behaved less than responsibly. It is nothing personal to any of you in this game <3

Cakez

, I'm not looking for a detailed rebuttal outlining your POV.

I want you to engage with what content I've created, and if you feel that I still haven't provided anything, don't confbias a reason to sus me, explain it.

I will try to do this - I feel you will be a valuable player here if you're town.

I appreciate that.

I also have to say I tend to read long ISOs as scum motivated because people rarely read them through and they look townie on surface level

especially so early in the game when we don't even have flips to use to look at early-game associatives

I mean, sure.

But I wall and ISO regardless of my alignment,

even in D1

.

Alisae

can vouch I do this as scum AND town, and

Titus

knows I like ISOing a lot as town.

And this isn't to take away your suspicion of me, I'm just giving you a heads up that this isn't AI by itself.

[Taly]

Before I go off, I'd like to hear why

BM

isn't town from

Gamma

, and why

Blitzo/Bell

are townread that you're unsure about

Cakez

.

I've done a lot today, haha, bye.

[Taly]

Taly

has used

"

24

-Ho

ur G

rac

e Pe

riod

"

on

Gamma Emerald

! It is super effective!

maybe scum:
taly - I've been getting the heebie jeebies based on how Taly is interacting with me. Like I feel like I've been interacting with Taly a lot in the game but I've stayed in the light shade territory the whole game.

I was a bit afraid that I was being pocketed by you but this read kind of destroys that idea.

(Full transparency, I figured if I were pocketed by scum as I mentioned in 1621,

{You/Pooky/OWER/BM/Haschel}

contained the scum I thought would be doing that.)

Also, if ANYTHING I've posted about you has been shade in

any

form, you have my sympathies because I think you'll spontaneously combust if I actually intended to shade you.

Our solves don't align that much

MC

. What do we do?

Unless I'm on a mary-go-round getting mindfucked by

Alisae/OWER

simultaneously, I like this solve.

Without ISOs elsewhere, here's where I'm at.

Strong Townreads: {Alisae, OWER}

Weaker Townreads:{Pooky, BM, Flea, Bell, Akarin, Gamma, Blitzo}

Sorting/Volatile Reads: {SirCakez, Titus, Murdercat}

Contains Scum Via PoE + Interactions: {Haschel, Reckoner, TGP}

Confident Scum Independently: {DrippingGoofBall}

I plan to resolve

{SirCakez/Titus/Murdercat}

reads.

{Haschel/Reckoner/TGP}

I STRONGLY doubt contain all scum, but they make the most logical sense in respect to my townreads.

This isn't a very realistic readslist D1 but it's 16p I'm reading in 1 week, so...

I can help you with your middling reads. SirCakez-town, Titus-scum. Murdercat - no idea!

Briefly case

Titus

, or explain that read.

I want

Titus

to real-time chat with me when she caaaaaaannnnnnnnn.

omg where she at

[Taly]

Also

@Taly

I think it's wiser to say I used "24-Hour Grace Period" on you?

true but now i will literally stall hammers so you can post,

gamma

p-edit

Titus made a case on me - which was based on a misunderstanding.

I subsequently cleared up the misunderstanding.

She ignored my clearing up of the misunderstanding and continued to lazily push her case on me.

Titus-town tends to read more closely and be able to adapt and flex better than Titus-scum, and this feels more like the latter. I wouldn't bet my house on it, but it's a scumlean for sure.

See this is why everybody who scumreads

BM

fucks me up a little.

I was sorting a slot

(Titus)

BM

gives his reads.
I ask for

BM

to explain that

Titus

read.

BM

gives me a CONCISE explanation to his POV in regards to

Titus

.

That's more of a

"we work together"

mentality I get than from half the slots this game.

Alternatively, I could be

BM's

pocket but I have no clue how to dispel this D1.

Or

BM

is just a

Taly

whisperer whenever he doesn't want my slot to eat the lim... literally one or the other seem to be the possibilities now.

Anyway, I'll reread

BM/Titus

convos with this context.

p-edit again

I still feel MC is the best elim here, not just from a probability of hitting scum standpoint but also from an associative solving standpoint.

I feel like a good case for Flea scum can be made regardless of MC's alignment due to how fence-sitty fae've been on the wagon. But I also have an aching feeling scum is setting them up to be lim-bait.

I keep tailing back to

Flea

town, they feel genuine, but I'm not strong on this.

Can you explain why

MC

is a good flip based off associatives?

Also, if ANYTHING I've posted about you has been shade in any form, you have my sympathies because I think you'll spontaneously combust if I actually intended to shade you.

Our solves don't align that much MC. What do we do?

That's why I say light shade. I'm not that confident about my reads so I don't think you should be trusting me to hit scum. I think tomorrow will be more useful, I know there will be post restrictions but we have all night in a hood.

I'm not trusting you to hit scum.

I'm trusting you to be transparent.

[Taly]

where the fuck are my uncontested townreads FFS

how am i expected to deepwolf

yo

bell

what is your hangup with

cakez

? your vote is still there, no?

[Taly]

I'm going to start reading through the bottom 3 tiers of my reads, including my vote tomorrow.

DGB

, your focus on me has dipped a lot but I haven't ever been more present within this game than today. What gives?

I still don't feel satisfied with the main wagons.

The closest I have to scumreading one is

Murder

but they're showing a self-awareness that I don't think comes from scum often?

I've never been invested in the

Blitzo

case or reasons to sus them.

And I townread

BM

.

Like, I figured people would be trying to convince me otherwise by this point.

[Taly]

I'll decide what to do with my vote tomorrow. Very tired.

1671 and 1708 are good posts that elaborate my townread on

BM

.

Titus

, this fucks with my brain:

If I get miseliminated for voting scum and having a life, I can live with that. We still should be no executing though. If we do miseliminate, I'm objectively the best one. So like I said, no hard feelings.

1)

Need a strong case on why we should no lim.

2)

Why are you ever a good mislim option... why is mislimming ever a choose-able option here... you're not even in a competing wagon at the moment.

3)

Is your

BM

scumread based around your case in 1293? Has it evolved?

[Taly]

Obvtown is not the word I'd describe

Pooky

here but I don't have the time, energy, or feel the need to say what I've already said with a slot I still think is net town.

Nini

<3

[Taly]

i feel like taly has completely avoided me the entire game while engaging with 99% of the playerlist and that has me confused

yo, lets rectify this

1)

How much does our solve align? I recently made a readslist.

2)

I get the impression you're familiar with

Haschel

, what are your insights on that player?

3)

Thoughts on the counterwagons to

Murder

? Has your read on

Murder

changed since his readslist?

some of my townreads scumread you but i dont agree with the

you/haschel

argument that was brought up earlier in the game.

i also like a good bit of your posts but im having difficulty forming strong scumreads this D1.

What should I do about this?

i definitely feel better oriented in this game BEFORE i went VLA, but i think flips will help me most from this point aside from skimming ISOs.

[Taly]

Taly your Ali+BM ISO links to oog post I don’t think you intended to reference

FUCK FUCK FUCK.

sorry

TSQ

i sorry

damn site linking BS

[Taly]

Titus

, this fucks with my brain:

If I get miseliminated for voting scum and having a life, I can live with that. We still should be no executing though. If we do miseliminate, I'm objectively the best one. So like I said, no hard feelings.

1)

Need a strong case on why we should no lim.

2)

Why are you ever a good mislim option... why is mislimming ever a choose-able option here... you're not even in a competing wagon at the moment.

3)

Is your

BM

scumread based around your case in 1293? Has it evolved?

I want this answered.
VOTE: Titus

to give you the motivation

[Taly]

i feel like taly has completely avoided me the entire game while engaging with 99% of the playerlist and that has me confused

yo, lets rectify this

1)

How much does our solve align? I recently made a readslist.

2)

I get the impression you're familiar with

Haschel

, what are your insights on that player?

3)

Thoughts on the counterwagons to

Murder

? Has your read on

Murder

changed since his readslist?

some of my townreads scumread you but i dont agree with the

you/haschel

argument that was brought up earlier in the game.

i also like a good bit of your posts but im having difficulty forming strong scumreads this D1.

What should I do about this?

i definitely feel better oriented in this game BEFORE i went VLA, but i think flips will help me most from this point aside from skimming ISOs.

1) considering I'm in your "contains scum" pool I don't have much to say about it. I disagree about Alisae. I disagree I think about Akarin, BM... honestly most of it. DGB doesn't scream scum to me. the thing we most agree on imo is OWER being town
2) i am not super familiar with haschel as a mafia player, and i believe meta is trash. all i know is the one game we played together he also sat back and sorta participated less overall, and what i know of his personal life fits with not being able to sit here and no-life the game.
3) it's intriguing but mostly i think the idea of "scum counterwagons" is probably overblown and not as common as people think it is. i dont think it's likely for that to be as coordinated. that being said, the battle mage wagon intrigues me the most. i'm not interested in pursuing blitzo today, and in fact would wager that blitzo scumreads are likely coming from at least one scum who is doing the lazy "the lurker is town" bit that scum do from time to time. i think you, haschel, and bell need to get off your vanity wagons and go for something else. ideally, tgp/pooky/battlemage would as well, but im pretty sure im asking some scum to be useful if i were to do that, so i'm not going to bother

I have reservations about

Alisae

but I don't think pushing now accomplishes much.

Nobody has bit with

DGB

and I'm wondering if my initial issue with

DGB

was playstyle. I feel like they're pushing for people to give far more content than they've provided themselves.

If I had to be candid, I don't care much for a

Titus

wagon, I just want to ensure they're not avoiding me... and also see how other people change votes.

I think I'm about to employ a strategy in Mafia that I've

never

done before.

[Taly]

I'm so over it... the fact that I almost always end D1's without being on a wagon OR on a vanity wagon.

Usually, I hit scum with vanity wagons.

But, I also want to avoid having no vote... I'll no-lim vote before then.

I'm not near that point yet, and I'd rather not reach it if the thread consensus differs.

[Taly]

You know what

Flea

, I've detected a lot of paranoia from your slot so you double-downing on that

BM

vote makes little sense to me.

Murder

, I sympathize strongly if you're actually town here but I'm not feeling your solve or motivation that much, is there something to be done about that?

TGP

, is it accurate to say that you're being really focused on

Blitzo

and pay little heed to other slots? Because that's how I feel about you.

Pooky

, I don't know if my townread on you can survive if you say you're obvtown again WHILE keeping your vote on

Blitzo

without further context.

Alisae

, if you think I'm scum, give me at least 2 people I've been hard-defending this dayphase because that's the only way I'll think your serious about reading me. The number doubles D2.

BM

, I'm not wanting to inject myself between you and

Gamma

, but do you think your counterwagon -

Murder

is actually scum here, or town?

Reck

, case me your

Titus

read.

Haschel

, do something with more than one to two slots at a time, please. I'm not just talking about posts, you come into the thread and speak only on a few aspects of the game at a time.

[Taly]

Cakez

feels sincere and not malicious in any way shape or form.

Bell

, I really need you to open up about that scumread there. Your vote there is looking less cute, doge.

Speaking of scumreading

Cakez

,

Murder

, you've mentioned

Cakez

to be scum before but if I'm correct, you find that most of your wagon is town. What do you make of

Cakez's

vote?

Titus

, this fucks with my brain:

If I get miseliminated for voting scum and having a life, I can live with that. We still should be no executing though. If we do miseliminate, I'm objectively the best one. So like I said, no hard feelings.

1)

Need a strong case on why we should no lim.

2)

Why are you ever a good mislim option... why is mislimming ever a choose-able option here... you're not even in a competing wagon at the moment.

3)

Is your

BM

scumread based around your case in 1293? Has it evolved?

I want this answered.
VOTE: Titus

to give you the motivation

Flea

, if you like that this post happened, then where is your vote to reflect it?

Also, I like your lighthearted tone but I'd appreciate a serious reply to 1862. Since you unvoted

BM

, I assume you feel the least strongest in this wagon than you have for the entirety of D1 so far.

If you're town you shouldn't be self-voting anyway?

Normally I would at deadline, as a miselim that would happen later is better than a no elim. I don't think that's the case here.

I'll need everybody scumreading

Murder

to walk-me-through how this post comes from scum.

[Taly]

{Alisae, OWER}

{Cakez, Bell, Akarin, Murder, Pooky, Gamma, BM}

{Reckoner, Haschel, Blitzo}

{TGP, DGB, Flea, Titus}

This is where I'm at and how I've changed in the past 24 hours.

I'm feeling icky about this 3v1 between

Gamma/Titus/Flea V BM

that literally has not died this entire game.

Surprisingly

Reck/Haschel/Cakez

are the only people who've recently made any sense to me in these past few pages.

[Taly]

I'm feeling icky about this 3v1 between Gamma/Titus/Flea V BM that literally has not died this entire game.

This is one of the most unnecessarily frustrating interactions that I've ever seen if all these slots are town.

My top townreads consensus are all going

"LET'S LIM

MURDER/BLITZO/NOBODY AT ALL

"

Am I high

Someone help

[Taly]

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee*splat*

lmfao, non-game talk, this made me laugh, you're a treat

flea <3

[Taly]

This game gets much easier for me if I believed

MC and/or BM

were scum but I'm not thinking this way here.

They're so disconnected and the OPPOSITE of bussy if they truly were S/S wanting to distance. You'd think one or both would be gung-ho on limming the other.

And as scum individually, they're BOTH on wagons LESS powerful than them.

No Lim/Blitzo

.

I'm either a complete village idiot or one of the most accurate people in this game right now.

please explain to me
why in the world we are voting murdercat
who is transparently bleeding town
and not blitzo
who is transparently bleeding scum

just kidding the group think was never at nolim

i genuinely do not understand this game at all but will try my best here
the bm wagon is not great. i don't have particularly strong feelings towards it, but considering i by and large scumread or nullread the people on it, BL is likely town.
after reevaluating the entire murdercat thing, i'm a bit confused on why a wagon exists there but i don't think a nolim is good here and i also think it is town driven and if i'm right on blitzo, wagonomics implies murdercat scum because of the development of the BM counterwagon so VOTE: murdercat

Try to convince me within the timespan of 200 posts how you shifted from thinking

MC

was bleeding town and that

Blitzo

- your longest running scumread - was the best lim option, to the alternative scenario of

Murder

being scum.

VOTE: TheGoldenParadox

Alisae has really vanished from this game and I don't like it

i have such a love/hate thought process toward

alisae

in this game rn

[Taly]

Try to explain to me

within the timespan of 200 posts how you shifted from thinking MC was bleeding town and that Blitzo - your longest running scumread - was the best lim option, to the alternative scenario of Murder being scum

in a manner that makes coherent sense.

VOTE: TheGoldenParadox

That's a better way to phrase it.

[Taly]

{Alisae, OWER}

{Cakez, Bell, Akarin, Murder, Pooky, Gamma, BM}

{Reckoner, Haschel, Blitzo}

{TGP, DGB, Flea, Titus}

This is where I'm at and how I've changed in the past 24 hours.

I'm feeling icky about this 3v1 between

Gamma/Titus/Flea V BM

that literally has not died this entire game.

Surprisingly

Reck/Haschel/Cakez

are the only people who've recently made any sense to me in these past few pages.

If you feel murdercat and BM are town, why are you still casting pressure votes? Why aren't you hard pushing a wagon or no elimination?

They're not quite pressure votes. I'm trying to solidify or debunk potential solves.

p-edit

Oh no. You of all people do not get to just drop a vote with no reasoning and walk away. Why Battle Mage over the other wagons? Does the case against Murdercat make sense?

Battle Mage has been my number 1 SR for ages, so it's hardly unexplained.

There were two questions in my post and you only answered the former.

Stop dodging the question. Does the case against Murdercat make sense?

I haven't seen it but I am not caught up yet.

I'm literally doing everything in my power to hardpush wagons.

I'm not willing to no lim unless MORE people agree to do that as a collective closer to deadline.

....

p-edit again

wow, right after i jumped onto

TGP

,

Pooky/BM

go to

Titus

.

oh well, not mad at that.

im going to take a breather...

[Taly]

lol i fucked up that quoting and p-editing

the

"..."

was strictly for the

titus

quote

[Taly]

ah sorry Taly!

lol np

kind of gut feels towny for you guys since your votes arent dependent on my word and ive been VERY assertive with my thoughts today.

anyway imma dip

[Taly]

if we no lim i BETTER have more than just

Bell/Pooky

meeting me in

Navigation

[Taly]

ya
i think i am going to
VOTE: no elimination
and just struggle for the rest of the game.

*malds intensely at alisae*

[Taly]

ya
i think i am going to
VOTE: no elimination
and just struggle for the rest of the game.

*malds intensely at alisae*

what do you want me to do?
I have nothing to work with and I genuinely don't know how I should be playing this game
How do you expect me to function as a player?

and also my reads are fucking awful.
I have no grasp of whats going on in this game at the moment.

Like I am just completely lost.

*guiltily malds intensely at alisae*

but real talk tho

why arent you confident in your reads? id prefer we talk through this

[Taly]

why arent you confident in your reads? id prefer we talk through this

I just don't feel good about anything
Like I just don't know where to go or what I want.

I felt like this until I started voting

Titus/TGP

today... and when I ISO'd

you/OWER/BM/Pooky

I felt a little better.

I don't think I have the time to properly sift through and confirm whether

DGP/Titus/Flea/TGP

is anywhere near a decent solve. Considering I somewhat half-assed this latest readslist, I'm only really solid on the people I'm voting right now.

But I like my townreads. I don't like the popular lim wagons.

I'm afraid that no limming will just have us repeat D1 or D2, even if we get NK flips.

This may be confbias but I feel like the thread's disposition to my votes and ideas simply confirms my understanding of the game at hand.

p-edit

Sounds like

Murder/Reck

were a solve you liked and it doesn't seem so strong now.

Alisae

, just for fun
What color would you say I am right now?

[Taly]

me too please
what do we do Taly

Looking at my vote is a strong start if you want to follow my instruction, but I'd prefer you guys give some thoughts too.

Do you have reasons why we SHOULDN'T lim

BM

?

I want to be sure I have a good understanding of your slot.

actually nto is the wrong word
I haven'tbeen reading your posts would be better to say

Well, for a big recap on me.

>

I claimed my rooms.

>

I withheld voting until these past 2-3 days, my first being on

DGB

.

p-edit

alisae

is pretty much spewing the reasons behind why ive townread them for most of this game thus far.

>

I ISO'd

you/BM/Pooky/OWER

to acquire the beginnings of a solve, I townread all of you to a degree.

>

I switched onto

Titus

because my

DGB

read faded and I wanted to push elsewhere.

>

I recently voted

TGP

with an actual reason supporting a scumread.

[Taly]

This is so weird.

Am I actually directing people this game?

That's new.

[Taly]

omg i fucked up that p-edit again

[Taly]

I'm honestly surprised that

Titus/Flea

have not fought me over my reads yet.

[Taly]

Taly

has been last seen hospitalized for carrying all the town from

Among Us Mafia

on his back.

[Taly]

If you're town, it's stupid for you to get mislimmed period.

I don't think your flip or any flip now will determine what we end up doing D2.

Either hop on a wagon you agree a vote with or vote to no lim, but tbh, I'd prefer not to no-lim.

I'm honestly surprised that

Titus/Flea

have not fought me over my reads yet.

Titus is scum but her buddies aren't bussing

Who are the buddies?

[Taly]

but tbh, I'd prefer not to no-lim

Why though?
VOTE: TGP
I'll sheep you

I think I'm voting scum. It's good to try and do the task wincon, but we can't gauge how viable achieving that wincon is just yet and even then, I'd rather solve the game through reads as well.

I understand the fear of losing potentially 3 town provided we miselim especially since we aren't grouping, but a miselim occurred, this is the time to afford one through a scumread the majority of the total plist feels.

The only way I'd be 100% OK with no-limming is that MORE people claim rooms so we can actively work to group and prevent the possibility of 2p rooms.

[Taly]

but tbh, I'd prefer not to no-lim

Why though?
VOTE: TGP
I'll sheep you

I think I'm voting scum. It's good to try and do the task wincon, but we can't gauge how viable achieving that wincon is just yet and even then, I'd rather solve the game through reads as well.

I understand the fear of losing potentially 3 town provided we miselim especially since we aren't grouping, but a miselim occurred, this is the time to afford one through a scumread the majority of the total plist feels.

The only way I'd be 100% OK with no-limming is that MORE people claim rooms so we can actively work to group and prevent the possibility of 2p rooms.

i concur with supporting the room claiming.

Unfortunately, having everybody agree to this is unrealistic... some with potentially good reasons.

At most, we can

reduce

the probability of an additional NK.

So if we're looking at a no lim decision, I may just hammer. But I'll give intent with a time attached.

[Taly]

wtf i told you not to post in thread go back to the scum PT

[Taly]

we have scummies to win

[Taly]

i guess my humor falls on deaf ears

no, i dont think its weird to intent hammer no lim off principle, but it is close to the deadline so

p-edit

I'm honestly surprised that

Titus/Flea

have not fought me over my reads yet.

Why would I? Your read is your read. v( ‘.’ )v

and

DGB's

post about saying

Titus

isn't getting bussed? thoughts?

[Taly]

im becoming really bored with this

"x does y so ill do it too"

mentality in the game.

TGP

, you're still saying

Murder

is scum based on your townreads voting him but 1637 was a defense of

Murder

when he was getting voted.

And

Murder's

vote on you is recent, after you made 1838

Flea The Magician - I scumread this but apparently you think they don't spew this much as town

as scum?

yeah mybad you're right here

amazing what you learn when you read the next post instead of just responding ( ◞･౪･)

alisae

was talking about my read of you.

did you comment on this simply because

BM

was involved with the convo? this adds nothing to the convo.

[Taly]

ill be back before deadline tomorrow.

[Taly]

but me want to finish my navigation task N1

me dont think i survive long enough to finish the admin. im in there for 2 nights.

[Taly]

though ill prob cry tears of joy being in those N2 and N3 PTs.

[Taly]

but me want to finish my navigation task N1

me dont think i survive long enough to finish the admin. im in there for 2 nights.

or admin tbh

[Taly]

people need to tell me if they have to be in a room for 2 nights so i can adjust the table

don't make the same mistake i made, kids! claim your nights if you feel its necessary to properly plan.

Taly

has been last seen hospitalized for carrying all the town from

Among Us Mafia

on his back.

Hold on
Thought you preferred “she/her”? Did that change? Is that a sticking point for you? Have I been disturbing you with incorrect pronouns?
I’M SORRY

haha, np.
I was born male and I identify as male.

I don't personally mind being misgendered. I'm usually called ma'am over the phone or when someone talks to me from behind, and I'm a bit more on the

"feminine"

side in personality and appearance.

So I'm used to people thinking so unless I correct them.

If you're town you shouldn't be self-voting anyway?

Normally I would at deadline, as a miselim that would happen later is better than a no elim. I don't think that's the case here.

I'll need everybody scumreading

Murder

to walk-me-through how this post comes from scum.

I don't see why this post is notably towny at all, Taly.

On theory I actually agree, I wouldn't self-hammer here either. But I don't see why that stance is particularly towny.

Don't think it's particularly towny either but I asked to see how people who scumread

Murder

would interpret an open-ended post to see how good-faith the wagon was, since I didn't feel compelled by the reasons.

[Taly]

people state they don't understand why Murder was wagoned and like:

I thought I made my case pretty clear?

Some people who were voting him didn't understand why

I'm worried I'm being pocketed and TR'd for superficial reasons.

If it eases you, I've been pretty upfront with my opinions of the

Murder

wagon and my townread on you began well before that wagon started.

Who do you think contributed most to the

MC

wagon disintegration?

What happened around VCs 1.37 to 1.41? Were any of those wagons in response to a wagon on scum?
What to make of Flea's wall about my iso, that for some reason did not end in a vote on me?
What to make of TGP, who has had a weird progression on me (as I noticed while doing some of this).

Don't lim me thanks. Good night.

dw bb i got you

<3

I'll do some VCA myself soon for that first question.

I think

Flea

could be scum based on their pushes rather than how people perceive their content. It's not strong enough for me to pursue and I feel like

Flea

is an easier solve later...

Flea

is the only person in the plist at the moment I think could be pocketing me. But I'm not worried about it, tbh, and I'll avoid getting confbias here.

Congrats with that

TGP

insight, that's where I've been at.

[plan]

Something like this is probably ideal right now, then Gamma doesn’t have to be alone on N2.
If DGB or Blitzo have either Admin or Comms it would be good to claim one of those and go there first instead.

If we kill Murdercat I think Cakez should probably play it safe and we'll just have others accompany him on N2 and N3.

Important to talk this out now.

I think this is the best plan so far if we all want to get the 2-nighter plans out of the way.

I don't think having ONE 2p room is bad IF it's planned.

The reasoning is that IF there's 2 NKs a night and we could verify that a 2p room existed, that narrows PoE, and may even discourage scum from NKing.

But that's as far as I go in condoning that course of action.

~

I want

Hachel

to respond to 2186 and 2187 and I want

Titus

to give input on

MC's

disposition of the wagons in 2181

[Taly]

I also think 2-nighters MUST be in a 3p group, at the very least for the first night.

{Akarin/Taly/TGP (Provided His Survival)}

I feel I have a strong reason but I'd prefer not to say here.

[Taly]

i'm not reading 3 pages ping me if something is worth responding to

you dont have to comment on all or any but i think these are good posts to get a feel for the plist.

Spoiler: relevant posts methinks

If we do go elim route then I want MC, TGP, Blitzo or Haschel

If we do go elim route then I want MC, TGP, Blitzo or Haschel

oh i could not care what happens to TGP
VOTE: TGP

A bunch of people said "I don't know why MC was wagoned" and then suddenly the wagon stopped.

Which is the thing I was questioning. I thought I made myself pretty clear.

you know what sure
I'll vote haschel too
fuck it

Murderkitty,
I think it's normal for you to do little D1, I also think that without Noraa sucking up all the attention you're gunna get pressured for it early game day and that you'd have some kind of motivation to try and solve based on that or at least live.

I don't think it makes sense that he didn't vote titus, but voted TGP after saying he felt he would die if he tried to vote titus opportunisticaly.

You're here Murderkitty. Respond?

Yeah I'm here. TGP isn't a real wagon, looks less opportunistic (well to everyone except TGP). It's effectively still a no elim vote, but it's showing support to Taly who I think 1. Needs it and 2. Deserves it.

I think I have given reads on everyone in the game. I am solving. I need more info. That could be an elim but night kills and neighbors also work.

MURDERCAT
Battle Mage
No Elim
TGP
Titus

I really don't like how Gamma is constantly throwing my name down here.
He says I'm town but I keep showing up in his lim pool, and I have no wagon.
Gamma's play has raised question marks for me before though and wound up being town so maybe wait and see.

VOTE: Haschel

Let's mix it up.

Okay actually looking at the mod ISO the MCat wagon never dropped by more than 1 vote per VC
So now I’m quite curious where this allegation of it “dissolving” really even comes from?

I guess I'd say Cakez, Taly, Pooky, and BM. And I'm townreading Taly and Pooky.

I guess maybe I contributed too, at least stealing away momentum, but the wagon was feeling like it was going too quickly when I checked in last night and I wanted to make sure it didn't hammer before I got time to come back to the game.

Mcat/Aka

also have had big brain posts on THIS page.

[Taly]

VoteCount 1.59

titus [4]

haschel cedricson pookythemagicalbear battle mage gamma emerald

MURDERCAT [3]

outworldER xRECKONERx thegoldenparadox

Battle Mage [3]

blitzo DrippingGoofball titus

thegoldenparadox [3]

taly murdercat alisae

sircakez [1]

bell

Haschel Cedricson [1]

Akarin

no elim [1]

sircakez

Not Voting [1]

flea the magician

With 17 alive it takes 9 votes to be executed.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2020-12-08 15:40:31)

nani

9 hrs till deadline.

[Taly]

but me feels bad if we lim town

titus

and

alisae

sees town there

i know this may seem irrational because holistically the

TGP/Flea/Titus/DGB

team makes sense to me... or I believe at least 2 scum reside here, with

TGP

slightly more likely as scum.

i really want

Titus/Haschel/TGP

to follow up soon, i can make the strongest decision in this scenario.

[Taly]

if you want to help

BM

, elaborate on what

Titus

-scum's angle here is in regards to her vote, the wagons, and her POV of the game.

you probably think youve beat this to death already but i think this is the one time to repeat the thoughts.

[Taly]

you know what, just remove the solve for a bit instead of trying to rationalize it, it may dissipate into thin air before D2.

i need to just focus on the wagons at this point.

[Taly]

We just have me take a task and force BM to take a task after ensuring no one dies. Provided I don't fuck up tomorrow, it leaves us in a great position.

I smell a crumb somewhere on here.

Why does scum-

titus

vote for any popular wagons unless she thinks she can't actually no lim? This POV makes some sense because no-limming option has had week-long resistance.

My biggest vex is the

BM

tunnel and insistence that we're all still in RVS even though she has prompted scumhunting earlier in the game.

Her thought process does not feel very clear but I don't know if that's TMI'ing something TAI or SAI.

[Taly]

while im at work, focus on the fact me and Gamma are actually united on the Titus wagon.

That is borderline absolute confirmation she is scum here.

What is the significance of

you/Gamma

agreeing on

Titus

?

I'll be back soon.

[Taly]

Cakez

, I'm a bit up in the air.

TGP >/=/? Titus = No Lim = Haschel

at the moment.

Unless you lot believe at least 2 of the scumteam exist within

BM/Haschel/Pooky/Gamma

AND

Pooky

is getting hard pocketed

(because

Pooky

is well townread)

I have no clue what's scum led about this wagon aside from

Akarin's

points on

Haschel

.

I feel like

Haschel

isn't providing context to his scumhunting and so his motives for pushing

Titus

seem both veiled and potentially disingenuous.

But I also review back and I dislike

Titus'

play around

Reck/Haschel

.

HC is scum riding off town Reck's coattails to disrupt the game.

this is an extremely spicy take considering until you posted this i had forgotten HC was even in the game, what is HC doing that is "disruptive"

Sheeping your no claim position.

Also reminding people Reck scumslipped in a post

Point this out to me.

Also Reck is the only person talking any sense right now; I too have already decided which room I'm going to tonight. I'll let you know where it is tomorrow.

this? this one post is what qualifies as "riding my coattails" and "disrupting the game"???

Yup. He's putting interest and motivating you to push garbage to try and stop town from coordinating. That's disruptive and riding your thoughts.

To my knowledge, she was one of the first people to inject the

Haschel/Reck

TvS. She asserted doubt into

Haschel's

intentions WHILE saying

Reck's

opinions were

"garbage"

and still townreads

Reck

in the same vein. It feels like a TMI on

Reck's

alignment because this functionally provided doubt to

Reck's

thinking without having to push him as scum for the POV.

[Taly]

TGP

is the only

Murder

vote I can confidently say has scum motivation.

I'm tempted to just vote

Haschel

or

Titus

, but I feel like vote hopping right now will only create more chaos.

Right now, I'm thinking

Reck/Alisae/Pooky

are all town and

Haschel/Titus

could be S/S.

[Taly]

You think Haschel is bussing?

I don't know why else

Haschel

focuses on

Titus

unless it's like him as town to just sit on one person for the entirety of D1.

[Taly]

be back soon

[Taly]

wait hold up, my vote should at least reflect my current POV

VOTE: Haschel

i want to see what this does to the votes.

murder/alisae

be freeeeee

p-edit

k,

blitzo

.

[Taly]

You think Haschel is bussing?

I don't know why else

Haschel

focuses on

Titus

unless it's like him as town to just sit on one person for the entirety of D1.

to be perfectly candid, i can see a situation where

titus

is town more so than

haschel

with this idea.

k for real, ill be back soon

[Taly]

last bit

cakez

vote someone, if we no lim it might as well be because we run out of time.

i still think a lim can be pulled off on more than one slot, contrary to

BM

.

[Taly]

akarin <3

at the very least, i have quite a few strong townreads ending this dayphase, more than just

alisae/OWER

at this point.

To my knowledge, she was one of the first people to inject the Haschel/Reck TvS. She asserted doubt into Haschel's intentions WHILE saying Reck's opinions were "garbage" and still townreads Reck in the same vein. It feels like a TMI on Reck's alignment because this functionally provided doubt to Reck's thinking without having to push him as scum for the POV.

I mean, Reck's opinion

is

garbage, but I think he sounds like townier garbage too.

Why do you think it's TMI?

Reads felt solidified too soon but that could be a playstyle disparity.

Who do you want Taly? Titus? I mean the three of us could move there I guess if you really think an elim is better.
HC seems .. unlikely at this point

Haschel

but I can compromise on

Titus

. I'd rather not no-lim off plurality but I like that better than

BM/MC

lims.

[Taly]

I feel like there's a world where Flea/DGB are scum together and another world where Titus/TGP are scum together.

my first true solve this game was that both of these realities existed simultaneously.

and yes, i did think this was mostly through

flea/dgb

and

titus/tgp

potential associations.

i also agree and sympathize with

BM's

2255 but im not acting off that at the moment.

[Taly]

MC

, do you think

Titus

is more likely scum than

Hasch

? Everything considered?

[Taly]

happy bday

bell <3

@Taly are you here? You disappeared after asking me about Titus I was curious where that was going

I'm a whim away from voting

Titus

, though, I'm wishing

Haschel/Titus/Alisae/OWER/Pooky

could all start magically posting but I don't think we have time. >:

[Taly]

this game is fucking wild

[Taly]

Haschel

, do you have any other reads?

[Taly]

Fuck.

I agree with

BM's

assessment that my understanding of the game is best approached with a

Titus

flip.
I feel like

Haschel's

sole-minded focus on

Titus

is still really weird.
I don't like

TGP's

last minute rally to lim

Haschel

even though I somewhat wagoned him earlier.
While I disagree with

Akarin's

perception of

Haschel's

reply,

Titus

is a townread for several of my townreads.

[Taly]

Fuck.

I agree with

BM's

assessment that my understanding of the game is best approached with a

Titus

flip.
I feel like

Haschel's

sole-minded focus on

Titus

is still really weird.
I don't like

TGP's

last minute rally to lim

Haschel

even though I somewhat wagoned him earlier.
While I disagree with

Akarin's

perception of

Haschel's

reply,

Titus

is a townread for several of my townreads.

how are you weighing these rn?

Consequences of

Titus

or

HC

potential townflip. I agree with

Murder

, I have issue finding

Hasch

in a specific solve right now.

I will say, I'm good with the night plan.

p-edit

Fuck.

I agree with

BM's

assessment that my understanding of the game is best approached with a

Titus

flip.
I feel like

Haschel's

sole-minded focus on

Titus

is still really weird.
I don't like

TGP's

last minute rally to lim

Haschel

even though I somewhat wagoned him earlier.
While I disagree with

Akarin's

perception of

Haschel's

reply,

Titus

is a townread for several of my townreads.

question for you Taly - is Haschel's sole-minded focus on Titus any worse than Titus' sole-minded focus on me? I think not, therefore I think Titus is the play for you.

And to play devil's advocate, is it accurate to say you've focused a lot on

Titus

D1?

[Taly]

50 minutes day end

UNVOTE:

If I don't vote

Titus

in the next 25 minutes consider this a no lim vote.

[Taly]

VOTE: Titus

I'd rather we flip. I'm sorry

Titus

. :/

Something held me up

[Taly]

yikes i shouldve leaned in on

akarin

more EoD1

taking full responsibility that i am the sole reason that that EoD1 was 100% cursed

in retrospect, im wanting to pause a moment with the

titus

insta-wagon.

akarin

dying removes one of the strongest defenses to

titus'

wagon.

Bell

, can you explain your vanity wagon on

Cakez

throughout D1?

Cakez

, what lolwagon attempt are you talking about in reference to

Gamma

?

Haschel

, why did you think you were likely to die tonight?

[Taly]

Alisae was hardcore disengaged in Admin last night. I can understand losing track of the task because of that. Plus, why does she rep out as scum, when she kinda has a workable alibi? It seems more like she’s town who lost the will to play following fucking up her responsibility with her “role”.

I validate this information, as well as

Blitzo

being with us in

Admin

due to what seems to be a block in

Electrical

.

UNVOTE:

SHEEP TALY STILL UNTIL I REREAD THE ISO

mine or

titus'

? i encourage both

p-edit

Toucan Sam: For starters I felt that Two Sheds would want me dead.

huh? do you mean two rooms of people or?

[Taly]

FUCK MY PEDIT WASNT COLORED

GOTTA LEARN THIS SHIT QUICKLY

[Taly]

FUCK MY PEDIT WASNT COLORED

GOTTA LEARN THIS SHIT QUICKLY

does that mean you fail? damnit, this is not going well

WE COULD FAIL?

[Taly]

Reck has one that's even worse he can only post quotes and votes

Let's make this easy for him.

I townread Cakez. I scumread Cakez.
I townread Taly. I scumread Taly.
I townread Alisae slot. I scumread Alisae slot.
I townread Haschel. I scumread Haschel.
I townread Murder. I scumread Murder.
I townread Gamma. I scumread Gamma.
I townread Blitzo. I scumread Blitzo.
I townread Pooky. I scumread Pooky.
I townread Titus. I scumread Titus.
I townread Flea. I scumread Flea.
I townread Battle. I scumread Battle.
I townread OWER. I scumread OWER.
I townread Bell. I scumread Bell.
I townread DGB. I scumread DGB.

Flea, what is your post restriction? Htsgrosegkpa I can't read your posts at the moment.

[Taly]

oh I forgot TGP, lmao.

I townread TGP. I scumread TGP.

titus

, where are your reads at right now?

p-edit

I AM WORRIED TALY IS SCUM WITH TITUS FOR HOW END OF DAY WENT

JUST SAYING

ehhhh i wouldnt have wasted time waffling so much, i didnt need to vote

titus

to distance.

[Taly]

im gonna think a bit on

akarin's

position in the game EoD1 and build off that for a bit.

Murder

, why am I potential S/S with

Titus

if you're looking for my opinions, word, and vote there without asserting a stance yourself?

One poste:

Ie Tolde yoe soe.

Pedit: Hmme does Gammae usuallye lacke ae sense ofe humore?

Dide anyone goe missinge ore ende upe someplace else?

yoe belle whate ise youre beefe withe cakeze?

p-edit

Does anyone thinke Tituse isn'te scume ate thise pointe? /:e

what's your basis that

titus

is very likely scum here? you took issue when the wagon grew in strength mid-D1.

p-edit again

second thought,

OWER

...

alisae

and i completely disagreed with our read on you and i want to know that my perception of your slot isnt blind.

you seem more active and assertive in this game than you were in Student Council. is this AI or personality?

p-edit again FFS

Still not interested in Taly elim until later maybe

this feels lazy

and why take issue with

gamma's

push on a

titus

lim but not with

BM's

, my EoD1 vote or

murder's

intent to?

[Taly]

m lvng HC's rstrctn, ngl ll

Tht's 2 fld. 'd ssm n fckps llwd, t lst, 'm nt llwd ny wth ths n.

cn't s vwls, hpflly ths wll hlp --> bcdfghjklmnpqrstvwxyz.

thnk Bll fld, tht's 3.

im loving HC's restriction, ngl lol

That's 2 failed. I'd assumine no fuckups allowed

can't see vowels, hopefully this will help

think bell failed, that's 3.

~~~

well, shit.

flea

can't do vowels.

uhh

+ you townread someone
- you scumread someone

what are your reads atm?

[Taly]

Hmph, is murdercat scum too?

WHY BECAUSE OF AKARIN?

Nope. Because you just did the other prediction I had last night of what scum would do.

That plus you defended Bell who is also probably scum.

Titus

, I'm really trying to get inside your brain for a second, because I both did not follow your scumread on

BM

D1 nor do I think (not of your own fault) you gave much input on your wagon.

If it gives context to my disposition towards you, I'm hesitant with people's eagerness to lim you right now, especially after that

Akarin

NK.

Can you explain how you predicted

Bell/Murder's

posts here?

What are you thinking scum is doing in this game, right now? And if answering that defeats the purpose of your predictions, then who is a townread?

p-edit

To my understanding, everybody who went to

Electrical

last night couldn't, so I'll just wait and see who, if anyone confirms

Titus

was in their room.

Also thinking about it I could see how Alisae's play progressed as scum here. Putting together the entire timeline, e started off strong but lost focus and ended up not having control of the town, and it went downhill from there. But the thing is, e was working with us in Admin to shore up a read list, and I don't see why e puts in that effort just to throw it all away after fucking up eir PR. I would expect e'd either just not give a care about forming those reads, or stick to the game. It seems like the rep-out was driven by exasperation and frustration at bungling everything, which is such a weird and crazy thing for scum to do.
So overall, my townread there isn't as strong but it's still there.

Based on principle, I'm not alignment reading

Alisae's

rep out. I don't think their disengagement was scum-motivated because they seemed to have some confidence within their reads last night.

[Taly]

@Talye, dide Ie never explaine thate he seemed toe be selectively votinge while simultaneously takinge the positione ofe none ofe hise votes being serious 'because we're noe eliminating todaye?'

What do you think of

Cakez's

opener on

Gamma

, and does it make any sense in this game to assert that

Alisae Slot/Akarin

were T/S?

[Taly]

bell

, your posts and ISO feel a bit lifeless at the moment, where are you at with

cakez/maestro slot/tgp/murder

?

did not expect this but i actually like

DGB's

2616 and 2697

the former question is to garner a striking answer from

titus

on her POV better than i had, and the latter comment is a concise and practical approach to

gamma

that wasnt littered with an apparent fear to survive or argue

gamma's

position.

DGB

, i dont think you gave much context to your

titus

vote or reasons D1, id like to hear them now.

[Taly]

how did

gamma/alisae

become auto-scum after an

akarin

flip?

like, does

gamma

work this hard to off a partner EoD1? and what about the reality

flea

proposed where

titus

is town?
i COULD see the argument that

alisae's

vote onto

titus

was a bus but they sided a good bit with

akarin

on the

titus

lim prior.

and BOTH of these two voting (including my own vote) had the intention of utilizing a flip to analyze alongside a scumread or reason to suspect

titus

-scum

everybody in this game has this knack of indirectly telling me that im getting pocketed by their scumreads

it starts with either a

taly

townread or

"i DoNt WaNt

TaLy

DeAd NoW!!1!"

and then bam

Akarin

townreads me but wants

Murder

dead, but I townread him

Murder

is following me onto places that I think is generally town-minded for the willingness to mindmeld

BM

and

Titus

were coming at each other but with a townread on me

Akarin

dies after a PT with

Alisae/Gamma

end where im solidly confident that

akarin

was town for their disposition on the

titus

wagon
now it's

Gamma/Titus

coming for

Bell's

life while

BM

has a solve that they're ALL scum

Alisae slot

was all about

"wtf

taly

"

with my townread on

OWER

while

OWER

townreads me and wants

Murder

dead too

this gamestate is a bitch to navigate. i dont trust the thread's consensus right now because i think its highly agenda-based regardless of the angle one would take here.

and when i try to assume

akarin's

reads, the more im thinking

"my reads were really fucked up D1 or i need to assert my personal reads then with a huge aggression right now"

BM

, i need you to sit me down and explain to me your solve with

Alisae/Gamma

because i dont think

Alisae's

apathy is AI and i agree with

Gamma's

hesitation with

Bell

.

And namely, if you think

Maestro/Gamma/Titus/Bell

are all scum, then why push the replace-in

(Maestro)

of ALL people?

it's so weird to brand an S/S/S argument around

Gamma/Titus/Bell

and then actively don't engage with that.

[Taly]

this game is so fucked, i love it.

i just need that ONE scumflip to get a hold somewhere.

[Taly]

and if

titus

is in everybody's solve then why is she still alive rn? why is her lim dependent on my timing of the vote EoD1?

yeah, im not convinced. town AND scum are on her, regardless of her alignment.

DGB

, why do you think

titus

wasn't bussed D1? If you still think so?

I'm honestly surprised that

Titus/Flea

have not fought me over my reads yet.

Titus is scum but her buddies aren't bussing

Do you think any of

Haschel/TGP/BM/Murder

were counterwagons forged by scum?

Because

{

Akarin

, Taly, OWER, Blitzo}

were the starting votes to the rivaling wagons late-D1, but those don't reflect your

Titus/Alisae

scumreads. If they have, it hasn't been mentioned.
And if we narrowed this down further to ALL the people that townread

Titus

, we have:

{

Akarin

, OWER, TGP, Cakez}

off the top of my head.
I want to hear your read on

OWER

.

[Taly]

I'm kind of waiting for someone to nod their head at me or just tell me I'm crazy.

[Taly]

I just don't think your response to

Gamma/Titus/Bell

is realistic if you believe it could be all S/S/S, but I may be jumping the gun here.

At least, why is

Maestro

most likely scum here? The task dismissal by itself doesn't compel me to rethink one of my strongest townreads D1.

[Taly]

I think I'll let the thread evolve until tomorrow before I place a vote. I'm not stalling like I did D1.

[Taly]

*watches MURDERCAT*

@Flea, I am pretty sure you voted me, but your PR makes it hard to understand.

@Taly, Your thoughts on Bell?

Bell

was probably my weakest townread D1. But town because I liked that he approached

Murder's

self-meta in good faith when

Murder

was being wagoned.

At the time, I also liked

Bell's

unvote when your wagon got traction. 1460

Two instances where

Bell

could've easily sided with the thread and pushed a lim on someone and he didn't take it.

During the night,

Gamma/I

were fearful of potential

Cakez/Bell

interaction containing scum because

Bell

effectively voteparked on

Cakez

and

Cakez

was OK with no limming at all while still trying to scumhunt. It didn't feel too natural of an interaction.

Now, I'm weary of

Bell

. I don't have a strong paranoia or even so much a scumread there, but

Bell's

posting (maybe due to the restriction) is very defensive in tone and his ISO does not provide a lot of context to his reads, or reads period... I think he's reacting more than acting and that reminds me of the ONE instance I have of him as scum. (I can't elaborate due to site rules, but I think you know exactly what I'm talking about.)

I'm fine with the pressure on

Bell

here.

Given your stance on 2747, do you think this read progression is or could be S/S?
1623 1626 1627 1628 1633

I do notice that

MC/Bell

have a very similar disposition to each other D1.

"X looks different than in Game Y but not enough to worry me."

1623 1691
Perhaps they can elaborate there.

I'm kind of waiting for someone to nod their head at me or just tell me I'm crazy.

NODS

ugh oh my god why can't we just be masons, everything in this game would be 100 times easier.

For the record I still am suspicious of Two Sheds. However, it is now my opinion that she should not be the elimination for today and I'm willing to at least explore Liberty Taco for a little bit.

Alright, Liberty Taco. You were the first vote on Two Sheds yesterday, then unvoted because the wagon "felt gross" and then mentioned her exactly once for the rest of the day. Now today you start off asking if there is anybody who doesn't think Two Sheds is scum. Can you elaborate on what changed?

gonna need translations on this one

I got you.

Decoding The Haschster

Bell = Liberty Taco

Titus = Two Sheds

Taly = Toucan Sam

Maestro = Moistinoips

Reck = Mr. William "Will" Reckoner

DrippingGoofball = Funsphere

Murdercat = Minecraft

SirCakez = Lord Bakery

Gamma = Steve

Akarin = Karen

(LMFAO)

I don't know who

Jub-Jub

is yet, though.

BM/TGP/Pooky/Flea/Blitzo

are the only unaccounted for names that

Jub-Jub

could be. Also unsure if

The Haschster

has a nickname for the mod lol

[Taly]

Flea

bb, can you bold names? Does that work within your posting bounds?

That'll make it easier to read your posts, for me at least.

Sorry for the inconvenience, haha, I genuinely feel for you.

[Taly]

I don't envy

Flea's

and

Reck's

restrictions, my god.

I think mine is pretty manageable. ...Until I stop being able to use

"e"

in posts.

[Taly]

I'm really wanting to channel

Akarin

and make a N2 room plan.

I'll do that for whoever the fuck wants to minimize kills and give town as much control as possible.

[Taly]

"Sure thing

Taly

I'll try and remember to bold names to help readability."

I literally read and understood that 3 times sooner than I would've otherwise since I could pin down a

noun

in your sentence structure.

[Taly]

bell

, what's my alignment?

there's only one correct answer.

[Taly]

oh my god

with my vote, i want to do a readslist, i wrote like 5 reads each with at least 1 paragraph rationale to them and its a lot of work to make my brain make sense

ill finish it soon.

[Taly]

i think i can :EFFORT: a readslist alongside a vote

this'll suck because i cant do nice colors D:<

Town

Gamma

: They were the first to vibe with me in our

Admin PT

and followed through with my townbloc exercise without contention or condition. Their whiteknight on me feels organic because their aggression in this game has doubled since D1 and with good reason he outlined a townread on

Akarin

in the PT and she flipped so. It's also because he pushed for a

Titus

lim for multiple reasons, a lim didn't happen, and now he's acquired scrutiny for wanting to force a lim on a, at-the-time, widely scumread slot

(Titus)

. No. I'm not limming this slot, and I dislike every push on

Gamma

right now.

Cakez

: I'm rapidly warming up to

Cakez

. I take heed to

Gamma's

hesitation with this slot and I don't recall many points where I agree with this slot. I will say, their trajectory is very towny, in respect to me and

Akarin

post-flip. I feel like they've actually taken my pokes on their posts with sincerity. 1678 1868 2678 They took

Gamma's

counterpoints in good faith. 2679 They have a strong push to work with slots despite any disagreements or hangups they have with them. I trust

Cakez's

POV here.

Blitzo

: I don't have a lot of well-worded explanations for this slot, because I agree when people like

BM

say that this slot pokes for information more than they give it out. However, trying to rationalize a scum-angle on this slot is weird as fuck. For the LATEST example, the push to keep

Titus

on trial in 2832 is an argument that I think would miss scum whether

Titus

was town or a buddy because this is AFTER the thread doubting this consensus.

Blitzo

was the most silent in the

Admin PT

but they hung out with

Alisae/Gamma/Me

because they found our cell to be one of the towniest.

Maestro

: Almost entirely fluffy since their entrance, which I can't tell if that's AI of this player. I've already stated my points in D1 that I townread

Alisae

pretty strongly and I still doubt that

Alisae

is scum especially post-

Akarin

flip and NAI replacement that made sense for

Alisae's

constant disengagement in the game.

Murder

: Eveyrbody is giving me a hard time with

Murder

, it feels. It gives me flashbacks to

Merchant's Daughter

over 1 year ago where

Krazy

was hard scumread by all the slots I townread, but I townread

Krazy

and ALL OF TOWN doubtcasted my read there, and we lost in elo because I was right about

Krazy

all along. https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=78670

No, I don't understand why people think

Murder

is scum. If anyone does, I want them to talk to me like I'm a 5 year old and explain it.

I townread

Murder

because he went from sus'ing my lukewarm POV on his slot to taking that as an opportunity to work with me when most of the plist wanted him eliminated. 1705 2004 2024 2033 2322 2371 He was transparent about the fact that he couldn't give a confident solve D1. 1710 2249 I believe him because his actions reflect someone trying to solve the game whether it is to townside with a player or give full context and ideas to their thoughts on mechanic in regards to gamestate. 1691 and 1692 He even asserted his own ideas above my own when he felt it necessary. 2347 2404 I feel like

Murder

-scum would've changed tune the second

Akarin

jumped onto him and I don't think he's actively tried to absolve or downplay the suspicion on him.

His disposition towards me reminds me of how he handled

Infinity

in

Student Council

. Slight paranoia, very, very strongly wanting to work with a slot despite this. I think this is

Murder's

method to gamesolving that I personally vibe with. https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=84987

Unless I'm literally loony-toons level stupid this game and

Murder

-scum is tailing a strong, red-herring associative to my neck (which I don't think is true because he's not a braindead sheep), I'm still feeling good about

Murder

being town. If any of you think I'm misled, I damn-well expect something RESEMBLING of a good retort because I've not seen one.

Reck

: I don't think

Reck

is malicious. Yes, the vote on

Gamma

is lackluster but I can't hold it against

Reck

to do little to gamesolve D2 because of his restriction. Still, I can't tie a specific agenda to him and out of the nay-sayers to players working to accomplish some form of mech

Pooky/Alisae/Akarin

, they were one of the less hard-lined players because they saw the value of grouping. They also don't have any reads where I just outright dislike or think is never impossible. If I were asked to give a specific post or stance where I strongly believed came from town in this slot, I'd draw a blank, tbh. But this does not

~feel~

like scum. Shitty reasoning, I know, but I'm content with that provided our stage in this game.

OWER

: My ISO, I felt was very thorough on

OWER

and my townread feels well reasoned. 1673 If scum, I don't think it's with any of

{BM/Alisae slot/Pooky}

outright unless he's EXTREMELY effective with theatre and they've spent D1 pocketing me. I will say, I do agree with

Alisae's

issue with

OWER

mentioned in the

Admin PT

and it boiled down to two overarching points:

1) Alisae

felt

OWER's

take on them was garbage because

Alisae

, in their mind, was not trying to control the game.

2) OWER

is more active and aggressive this game than when he was mislimmed as town in D1,

Student Council

.

And I agree with these reasonings, and I'd like

OWER

to contest these when he can. I like

OWER's

content but I don't have a strong grasp on how best to read them because they seem to have a large tonal range than I believed. I like their assertions about the gamestate 1563, their willingness to work with me 1625, and the insistence of evaluating

Akarin's

flip as a form of NKA to catch scum. 2603 I just really want to see them post more content now.

Battle Mage

: This man gets my sympathies, I felt the volume that they 1v1'd MULTIPLE SLOTS D1 is something I see from town more often than scum. I made a lot of my points about them in my D1 ISO 1671 and other than

Akarin

townflip as a potential thing to look at for interactions, I don't see a reason to doubt my initial analysis. I'm solid on them as town.

My only vex with

BM

at the moment is that I feel that they're very cautious D2

(2719 2810 2847)

and I don't have context on how he came to this behavior from when he was strong on that

Titus

lim EoD1.

I can see his change of heart happening being in a PT with

Titus

. But neither could've ended up in

Electrical

, since people going there had to relocate, from my understanding. Ultimately, I like that

BM/Titus

seem to be working in good faith but I'm iffy because

BM

is still putting her at arm's length BUT is going with her solve at the same time.

Titus

: She never really responded to my points on her near EoD1 but it's not that I opened D2 demanding that of her. I think she's a bit easier to read as her thoughts aren't hyperfocused on

BM

now, I don't know what has led her to change on

BM

.

I don't really want to pry either. 2850 implies she knows something nobody else does and she's playing it smartly to try and figure out the thread first. OK, that makes her prediction posts 2640 2661 a lot more sound.
...shit...
After posts like 2620 2850, 221 has given me several new potential interpretations to

Titus'

gameplay right now and I'm OK with her being in the townbin.

Overall, I'm a bit frustrated with

Titus

but I trust they're actually solving the game here. I'm frustrated because they think I forced my posting EoD1 as scum 2823 and I want them to work with me if they think I'm misled on

Murder

2821.

TL;DR The above rounds out my townreads.

Pooky/Haschel are in the Sorting pile.

{Flea, DGB, TGP, Bell} are where I am at. But this isn't a team-solve.

I'm also not quite satisfied with Flea/DGB remaining this low, so I'm really just looking at: {Bell/TGP}

[Taly]

Yeah, my readslist could've been more fully realized AND conformed less to the thread's progression

But I've wanted better plist cohesion D1 and to just say "fuck off" to that with a counterwagon to solve my lower placing slots, I'm OK with VOTE: Bell

Bell

, 2818 you gave almost no concrete read in the game, and it was only on a portion of the plist.

How about we change direction, since your wagon has gotten a lot of traction, what votes on it come from scum, and which come from town? Try to have a definitive take.

TGP

, I'm not a fan of your posts as a whole at the moment.

1)

What happened to the

Blitzo

-scum analysis?

2)

I feel like you deflected my wagon on you EoD1 as you pushed for that

Hachel

lim, is this accurate? Also, why not

Haschel

now?

3)

Is it fair to say that your

Maestro

scumread and vote is a bit... lacking? Are you talking about the replacement being bad on principle or

Maestro's

posts?

[Taly]

Yeah, my readslist could've been more fully realized AND conformed less to the thread's progression

But I've wanted better plist cohesion D1 and to just say "fuck off" to that with a counterwagon to solve my lower placing slots, I'm OK with VOTE: Bell

Bell

, 2818 you gave almost no concrete read in the game, and it was only on a portion of the plist.

How about we change direction, since your wagon has gotten a lot of traction, what votes on it come from scum, and which come from town? Try to have a definitive take.

TGP

, I'm not a fan of your posts as a whole at the moment.

1)

What happened to the

Blitzo

-scum analysis?

2)

I feel like you deflected my wagon on you EoD1 as you pushed for that

Hachel

lim, is this accurate? Also, why not

Haschel

now?

3)

Is it fair to say that your

Maestro

scumread and vote is a bit... lacking? Are you talking about the replacement being bad on principle or

Maestro's

posts?

[Taly]

omg fuck this double post thing

[Taly]

omg fuck this double post thing

NO OH MY GOD

[Taly]

my level of tilt in this game has just tripled

[Taly]

ok i rescind my thoughts on

maestro

being fluff and 5x more sympathetic to

alisae's

rep out

carry on

also idk what

gamma

meant about that

reck

scumslip nor care atm tbh.

is there a way you can give reads while rhyming,

maestro

? i could help you rhyme if you need it haha

[Taly]

ok im in love with

maestro

now

i have no clue what

"Dead

Titus

"

means and i probably skimmed over it if there were a specific quote

[Taly]

Taly I'm definitely down to merc Bell and TGP but your scumpile looks light to me

its kind of intentional, i dont think trying to outline a massive team solve is the best starting approach to this day

i have conflicting arguments on people's alignment both in my townreads, sorting pile, and scumreads.

so im really just voicing what i feel confident in, whether it's logic or gut-based.

also because i was too tired to finish the readslist haha ;p...

Replacing into a PR fest is not my ideal day
I'm still just forming thoughts on who I think should stay

If you really wanted to ask me for my say
On more specific folks you'd like for me to sway

That'd probably be much easier than just now going "Hey!
Maestro have you got some reads or don't you want to play?"

I think your soul is without greed
But I implore you for such a deed
Look at

Murderkitty's

ISO of me
Is thinking his soul be pure, the key?

p-edit

ok im in love with

maestro

now

i have no clue what

"Dead

Titus

"

means and i probably skimmed over it if there were a specific quote

Post 2635
Come alive!

i honestly have no clue what

akarin

meant about sabotaging or if/how sabotaging is possible, but the

"Dead Titus"

part referred to the fact that

Titus

was on the brink to being limmed and may not be able to do anything with her plan.

[Taly]

titus

, did you read my readslist wall earlier?

[Taly]

some passing thoughts

I'd like to see

Titus

acknowledge my points on

Murder

or at least his frustration so I can trust that she evaluates him in good faith.

Gamma

, where are you at with

Titus

right now?

Murder

, where were you going with that

TGP

vote?

I'me lurkinge thise oute
Soe, like, ife you're expectinge me toe towne spewe ine ye olde english, ain'te happeninge.

As EVERYBODY learned EoD1, I'm VERY patient.

This strategy isn't productive because it's not going to dispel my worries with your slot. So I'd like you to answer my question when I posed the vote.

Ys.

Hschl ddn't kll m lst nght nd thr ws n xtr kll. W wr ln.

WFM.

thr rsns ncld, bt rn't lmtd t:
- Y'r bth scm (---)
- Y'r bth twn (-)
-

HC

s scm wh dcdd t "clr" by n-kllng (--)
-

Tts

s scm wh dcdd t "clr" by n-kllng (+)

Nbdy shld b clrd n ths vdnc ln. t's smthng tht's bsc fr mpstrs t pll n th ctl gm.

OK, I can see a counterpoint to

Titus/Haschel

but I think it's best we assume

Titus'

POV here. We have nothing else to go off of.

But I do want Haschel to validate Titus' statement. That those two were alone in a room last night.

Also, my first task is only half-finished. I'm staying in Admin tonight.

[Taly]

post linking 2113 because that chart has too many color tags for me to care about quoting and editing it to fit my restriction.

[Taly]

I townread Taly. I scumread Taly.
I townread Alisae slot. I scumread Alisae slot.
I townread Haschel. I scumread Haschel.
I townread Murder. I scumread Murder.
I townread Gamma. I scumread Gamma.
I townread Blitzo. I scumread Blitzo.
I townread Pooky. I scumread Pooky.
I townread Titus. I scumread Titus.
I townread Flea. I scumread Flea.
I townread Battle. I scumread Battle.
I townread OWER. I scumread OWER.
I townread Bell. I scumread Bell.
I townread DGB. I scumread DGB.
I townread TGP. I scumread TGP

your restriction doesn't work on quotes, does it?

[Taly]

Bell

, here's a dose of self-meta, since you've said before that you like it:

If I'm scum here, I've refined my scumrange to match my townrange in tone, which is incredibly difficult because I'm a very stream-of-conscious person as town, everything considered.

As town, I'm messy but just roll with it.
As scum, I'm calculated and only let people catch me if I want them to.

My play in this game is counterintuitive to almost everything I'd try to do as

Taly

-scum, and I can't say I'm risky enough to play like this just to brand myself as town when it's unprompted.

I have a principled obligation not use self-meta to manipulate you. So I'm giving you my word that you can take this information in anyway you see fit, and this post is meant to solve you.

[Taly]

Murder

: Eveyrbody is giving me a hard time with

Murder

, it feels. It gives me flashbacks to

Merchant's Daughter

over 1 year ago where

Krazy

was hard scumread by all the slots I townread, but I townread

Krazy

and ALL OF TOWN doubtcasted my read there, and we lost in elo because I was right about

Krazy

all along. https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=78670

No, I don't understand why people think

Murder

is scum. If anyone does, I want them to talk to me like I'm a 5 year old and explain it.

I townread

Murder

because he went from sus'ing my lukewarm POV on his slot to taking that as an opportunity to work with me when most of the plist wanted him eliminated. 1705 2004 2024 2033 2322 2371 He was transparent about the fact that he couldn't give a confident solve D1. 1710 2249 I believe him because his actions reflect someone trying to solve the game whether it is to townside with a player or give full context and ideas to their thoughts on mechanic in regards to gamestate. 1691 and 1692 He even asserted his own ideas above my own when he felt it necessary. 2347 2404 I feel like

Murder

-scum would've changed tune the second

Akarin

jumped onto him and I don't think he's actively tried to absolve or downplay the suspicion on him.

His disposition towards me reminds me of how he handled

Infinity

in

Student Council

. Slight paranoia, very, very strongly wanting to work with a slot despite this. I think this is

Murder's

method to gamesolving that I personally vibe with. https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=84987

Unless I'm literally loony-toons level stupid this game and

Murder

-scum is tailing a strong, red-herring associative to my neck (which I don't think is true because he's not a braindead sheep), I'm still feeling good about

Murder

being town. If any of you think I'm misled, I damn-well expect something RESEMBLING of a good retort because I've not seen one.

Battle Mage

: This man gets my sympathies, I felt the volume that they 1v1'd MULTIPLE SLOTS D1 is something I see from town more often than scum. I made a lot of my points about them in my D1 ISO 1671 and other than

Akarin

townflip as a potential thing to look at for interactions, I don't see a reason to doubt my initial analysis. I'm solid on them as town.

My only vex with

BM

at the moment is that I feel that they're very cautious D2

(2719 2810 2847)

and I don't have context on how he came to this behavior from when he was strong on that

Titus

lim EoD1.

I can see his change of heart happening being in a PT with

Titus

. But neither could've ended up in

Electrical

, since people going there had to relocate, from my understanding. Ultimately, I like that

BM/Titus

seem to be working in good faith but I'm iffy because

BM

is still putting her at arm's length BUT is going with her solve at the same time.

Titus

: She never really responded to my points on her near EoD1 but it's not that I opened D2 demanding that of her. I think she's a bit easier to read as her thoughts aren't hyperfocused on

BM

now, I don't know what has led her to change on

BM

.

I don't really want to pry either. 2850 implies she knows something nobody else does and she's playing it smartly to try and figure out the thread first. OK, that makes her prediction posts 2640 2661 a lot more sound.
...shit...
After posts like 2620 2850, 221 has given me several new potential interpretations to

Titus'

gameplay right now and I'm OK with her being in the townbin.

Overall, I'm a bit frustrated with

Titus

but I trust they're actually solving the game here. I'm frustrated because they think I forced my posting EoD1 as scum 2823 and I want them to work with me if they think I'm misled on

Murder

2821.[

Commentary on these reads in particular,

Titus

Also

DGB

, why no response to my wall? You're not going to argue or try to parse my POV toward you?

[Taly]

huh

why not

bell

lim while

reck

gets the task since he has no others?

also, does

reck

even want the task?

Reck's Dialogue Tree

Yes.
No.
Maybe.
I bite my thumb at Taly.
I bite my thumb at OWER.
I bite my numb at Pooky.
I bite my thumb at Bell.

[Taly]

huh

why not

bell

lim while

reck

gets the task since he has no others?

also, does

reck

even want the task?

because reck just tried to quickhammer Bell

that makes me sus bell elim, i still think he's good chance being scum, which is why i want him to have the task. bell taking task also leashes him to me cafeteria.

im trying to figure out what the purpose of your reaction test was, if you felt

Bell

was scum, testing the wagons implies you had doubt?

and since you still sus

Bell

as potential scum, your push on

Reck

implies a bus, but

Reck

is now likelier scum? am i getting this correct?

[Taly]

Taly, serious question - does your PR say you have to blue up quotes as well?

Not specifically, but it's easier to just blue everything so I don't miss something

Reck

I knew that my vote wasn't a hammer on

Bell

.
I thought I hammered

Bell

.

[Taly]

nah, it wasn't a hammer.

hmmmm. im gonna think about this.

the

ower/flea/pooky/murder

simultaneous conclusion of shock/scumread on

reck

due to his vote does not feel universally sincere, very

"gotcha"

vibes, or people just dont read VCs.

but giving

reck

the nicest interpretation of knowingly L1ing

bell

feels like a very quick conclusion provided he didn't seem sure in 2672.

and dispelling doubt or uncertainty is much more difficult for the latter than the former.

[Taly]

why do all of my townreads always want to kill each other

im starting to think thats a good sign im correct with most of my reads because towns are fucking wild.

[Taly]

2113 for reference

UNVOTE:

took short break, with some consideration I think I want to see Bell post again before deciding how to end the day

regardless, our plan for the night should be setup during this time

Night 2 Plan

Cafeteria:
OutWorldER
Bell/Reck (whoever doesn't get limmed and takes Akarin's task ~

*Taly puts pillows on Reck to protect him while also vaguely sus'ing him at the same time*

)

Navigation:
Pooky

Storage:
Flea

Admin:
Taly

(Cannot Leave)

Weapons:
Gamma

Security:
TGP

(I assume Cannot Leave)

Electrical:
Titus
Blitzo
Battle Mage
Maestro
DGB

Reactor:
Cakez
Murder

{The Haschster?}

help me fill in the blanks

This is our room assignments **IF** we don't group, but I really want us to group tonight again. So some people will have to compromise doing their tasks tonight. Everybody in Electrical would otherwise finish their task tonight, to my belief.

Namely, TGP and I are two-nighters, so I don't think we can move. Flea, Murdercat, SirCakez or Gamma could compromise (but Gamma has already compromised so I'm hesitant to ask that of him again).

I'm also going to Navigation provided I survive to N3, so Pooky could hold off until then and we meet up.

[Taly]

...

We've just established that imposters can lock doors. Why are we telling them where people are planning to go again?

Because I'm not a fan of 2 town deaths at night, and the more people I have in my room, the more I'll learn about this game.

I can't control whether people group or not, but I'm going to get pissy if I find myself in a PT alone in this game.

[Taly]

Murder

, what's your solve looking like right now?

You've flipped between

Titus

and

TGP

but you haven't pushed either of them much and you don't seem to have grievances with the

Bell

lim.

If you have a case from any read of you confidence you have in this game, I'd like to hear it.

[Taly]

Gamma

was with

Alisae/I

in

Admin

. I don't know where

BM

was.

Hmmmm.

DGB/TGP

, what were your reasons for the

Maestro

wagon?

[Taly]

You guys realize that scum instadies if they try that with the current plan, right?

Titus and HC both had outs though because we wouldn't have known where they went
(HC for not claiming and Titus for being kicked)

It's definitely still possible one or more is scum but I think Occam's Razor says it makes them more likely to be town.

Sure, maybe.
Except when someone dies and you realize that everyone is accounted for, you just lim the people who are unaccounted and you hit scum.
So they don't have a choice because they're the only ones left - even if they claim another room, everyone just accounts for where everyone else is and they're left in the cold by PoE.

It's the same concept where you don't see scum instaclaiming cop guilties just to get townies limmed - it does nothing.

+1 to

MC's

point but I want to make the distinction that I'm not clearing anyone off this premise.

I believe

Titus/HC's

progression to be natural in light of their room sharing, and while it is possible scum does this for towncred (or their both S/S), that's a WIFOM argument and it doesn't align with the current solve I having going on with my head unless I rethink a large portion of the game.

Furthermore, I haven't faithfully put

Haschel

in the townbin. I'm weary of and are shelving them, and there are players I scumread with higher strength.

Do you think scum exists on

Bell's

wagon? How many scum?

[Taly]

i believe Titus could be town, pushing a mislim on Bell-town here. Which means maybe we're just on the wrong track.

Although I'm sympathetic to the idea we need to lim SOMEBODY, I also think a lazy mis-elim after 124 pages is dumb.

Where's the doubt coming from? The fact that

Titus'

argument could or is flawed, or that the gamestate doesn't make sense for town to lim scum?

My POV with

Bell

is that they're playing similar to an instance I know of them to be scum. I cannot elaborate, but they haven't responded much to the points onto them, their reads aren't too fleshed out, and they were quite inoffensive D1 and haven't outlined many unique opinions of the game. I don't know what their baseline is, so my reasoning in this basis is weak, but I think

Titus

knows something I don't and I trust that.

If you had to wagon 2 more people right now, who would they be? I think you voted

Blitzo

recently but I'm still not seeing much detail to your thoughts there aside from painting their posts as OMGUSy or WIFOM-based. I don't entirely disagree, but I want more thought than that.

[Taly]

VOTE: Bell

I'm ready to end the day, I think we're all ready for the night, decently confident on Bell's flip

pedit: bruh

What do you think about each individual vote on the

Bell

wagon?

I'm not asking for much detail. I'm really just trying to figure out this gamestate.

Bell

is a largely unrivaled wagon and I'm surprised a lim hasn't gone through yet. Off-wagon scum would've bussed or had completed the lim on town so far, I think?

It's just weird to me because any counterwagons D2 so far have been ineffective and not strongly pushed, so I don't know if my PoE pool being off-wagon people (like the rest of the thread) makes sense.