TM 2021 Large Normal: OEIS Mafia (Part Two Is Out)

[OkaPoka]

new year new okapoka let's see how long i can lurk before the chains of self restraint are broken

[OkaPoka]

new year new okapoka let's see how long i can lurk before the chains of self restraint are broken

Hercule's buddy.

i was actually told to become hercule's best friend by <redacted> in case of me red and him green

[OkaPoka]

you know, i am remembering that this forum makes a habit of responding to multiple posts in one post but you’re just gonna have to bear with me tonight

don't worry best friend, plenty of people split up their post into multiple posts

just dont be the person who posts as they catch up because everyone will want to strangle you even if ur a cute anime girl

[OkaPoka]

Reading every post before you reply is for nerd scum.

not referring to the innocence of spamming submit even with ninjaposters

referring to the terrible crime of asking a question about a post on page 82 when the game is on page 140 and the question was answered on page 93, but the way you catch up results in you ignoring other people's currentposting so the question gets answered like 10 times in thread over the course of an hour and you just ignore them all as you trudge your way to page 93

[OkaPoka]

[OkaPoka]

now i just need to pocket a setup spec nerd and we can fusion dance to create the holy triangle of scumhunting, setup spec, and chicken

a truly unstoppable juggernaut

[OkaPoka]

now i just need to pocket a setup spec nerd and we can fusion dance to create the holy triangle of scumhunting, setup spec, and chicken

a truly unstoppable juggernaut

i feel like you’re calling dibs on chicken and i really think that it should be up for discussion

the senate: today's agenda
-to discuss assignment of chicken

members of the senate:
-okapoka

1) okapoka would like to be chicken - all in favor of a vote say aye
2) 1 aye's heard, no objections
3) the vote was 1 - 0 in favor of okapoka being chicken
4) the senate now continues to recognize okapoka as chicken

[OkaPoka]

@ceph r u still an active member of the nrg? asking for a friend

[OkaPoka]

ur so impeached @Oka

you might be able to impeach me

BUT I AM THE SENATE


WITH UNLIMITED POWAAAAAAAH

[OkaPoka]

dgb would you like a committee chairmanship

[OkaPoka]

best friend needs to sign up for dance games whenever fakegod runs em

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: agar

sheeptitus.exe

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: innocent villager

choo

[OkaPoka]

can confirm dkkoba has a massive crush on hercule from epicmafia

[OkaPoka]

I am not liking Hopkirk's non-game related busywork. It feels like game avoidance.

meh even though most of hopkirk's posts are not really game related he's still in the upper %'s of game related posts

[OkaPoka]

absolutely comedic exchanges

[OkaPoka]

dgb is doing the annoying pbp catchup thing arghadsf!@EA

[OkaPoka]

I am not liking Hopkirk's non-game related busywork. It feels like game avoidance.

meh even though most of hopkirk's posts are not really game related he's still in the upper %'s of game related posts

I don't get good feelings from any of the posts because they are massively bloated.

I prefer terse, meaning-dense posts like #329.

cant really say he's avoiding the game though can u?

strip away the fluff he's still in the top for game-related content, even if there is a lot of fluff

[OkaPoka]

i mean he really isn't avoiding talking about the game

he's made plenty of game related posts in between his talks of modkills and conversations with this teammates about life

[OkaPoka]

dkkoba, our team's resident epicmafia expert, believes that the description hercule has for poe is fine

although i will add that not doing process of elimination stuff for PoE is strange but whatever

dkkoba has also asked me to do other things wrt to hercule but dkkoba isn't playing this game

[OkaPoka]

I won't bother asking hectic if he picked up any of their lingo while he was playing 'down under'.

Can you remind me roughly what you've done this game Oka?

voting innocent villager is really the most important thing ive done so far

other than that ive talked to people i guess

[OkaPoka]

i will say i am actively trying to link the worlds of hercule and everyone else together through consulting with dkkoba because apparently hercule is the protagonist of this story and every protagonist needs an expositional npc

[OkaPoka]

above post was @Oka (as is this post) because i didn't reload the page.

do you & koba have any thoughts on herc? you've played together a bit

i'll read IV properly now

have you ever played with radiantcowbells and his megafans

[OkaPoka]

above post was @Oka (as is this post) because i didn't reload the page.

do you & koba have any thoughts on herc? you've played together a bit

i'll read IV properly now

have you ever played with radiantcowbells and his megafans

i've played a few games with radiantcowbells and have on at least 2 occasions discussed them with people irl (when they naturally came up in the discussion). i assume you had more to ask here based on my response right?

hercule = radiantcowbells

dkkoba = megafan

not to say hercule has the same playstyle as rc but the aura of infatuation is there

[OkaPoka]

i don't really like the general scope of this comment? are there any specific votes you don't like on you right now

by general scope do you mean my scope is too generally sahding my votes? or you generally don't like my scope?

im gonna assume the former, but to answer your question no not really in particular atm. i will look more at some point maybe

not even my vote?!

[OkaPoka]

i don't really like the general scope of this comment? are there any specific votes you don't like on you right now

by general scope do you mean my scope is too generally sahding my votes? or you generally don't like my scope?

im gonna assume the former, but to answer your question no not really in particular atm. i will look more at some point maybe

not even my vote?!

i don't townread you like, whatsoever but you also have like 20 contentless posts which is fine. your vote on me was like "lol look at me im so sheepy lol" which yeah could be scum deflecting responsibility but maybe not. idk.

so u dont like my vote on you

[OkaPoka]

so u dont like my vote on you

mild dislike sure

could one say of unwnd, Dunnstral, Dannflor, OkaPoka, Ceph votes on you

you don't like my vote on you in particular?

[OkaPoka]

i don't really think about it in that way necessarily

i townread unwnd, Dannflor so I don't necessarily mind their votes?

i don't townread you, Ceph, Dunnstral (conflicted on him will have to reread, but i feel like i should have an opinion there maybe idk)

so maybe i don't like you, Ceph, or Dunnstral 's votes because I don't townread any of you? idk what you're looking for here exactly

im just looking for clarification because the way i read it, you said to hopkirk you didn't dislike any of the votes on you in particular. but you did naked vote me after me voting you so it did seem like you had a gripe with me voting you

[OkaPoka]

fair enough

[OkaPoka]

OkaPoka you'd never tell a lie right

Claim what alignment you are in the next post

you know whats funny is last time i got asked this question as scum im pretty sure i dodged the question for the shits and giggles

[OkaPoka]

OkaPoka you'd never tell a lie right

Claim what alignment you are in the next post

you know whats funny is last time i got asked this question as scum im pretty sure i dodged the question for the shits and giggles

I believe you chicken man

Read on Hopkirk?

lean townish, maybe even one of my top townreads at the moment

[OkaPoka]

lean townish, maybe even one of my top townreads at the moment

brief bullet points on this?

he's asked the questions i wanted to ask so there is an element of mindmeld there

to the point where i feel redundant trying to follow up but that's a good thing

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: agar

[OkaPoka]

fast wagons are good in fact lolhammers are underrated

[OkaPoka]

am i town duck

[OkaPoka]

am i town duck

idk are you

no i am town chicken

hows life the worst its been a while

[OkaPoka]

couldnt you say wagons in general are usually not purely town

[OkaPoka]

what's wrong with a lolhammer in team mafia

we'd very much scrutinize them in this format

[OkaPoka]

anyways

anyone find it strange that a50 is soliciting general reads on him

[OkaPoka]

ceph you need to go back to the animated avatar

im getting very grumpy vibes from you

[OkaPoka]

a50 is a lot of things but i don't think inexpressive is one of them

[OkaPoka]

a50 is a lot of things but i don't think inexpressive is one of them

super wants you to know that she just finds it difficult to read their tone because it comes across very stiff to her and she doesn't know how else to explain it

side note i'm about to assemble furniture with my friend so i'll be completely unreachable for a few hours

yeah i am finding almost50 stranger than usual this game but it has also been a while since ive played with him

[OkaPoka]

are your teammates following this game @worst

[OkaPoka]

am i antagonizing you a50? if so im sorry

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: titus

ok i dont mind voting here and agar made a cool post

[OkaPoka]

am i antagonizing you a50? if so im sorry

When you say it's strange of me to ask for teammates reads on me in TEAM MAFIA then I guess the answer is yes, it's frustrating. The whole tournament is based on a team to be playing the games the members are involved in. It's the only event where you can actually talk about an ongoing game to someone who is not playing in it (in your team PT/discord). How can you even tell if <insert name> is posting their own thoughts and not channeling their teammate's thoughts?

My request is simple: My ISO isn't even that big -at least not yet- so ask Pooky, Nancy & DkK to take a look at it and give you a preliminary read to convey to me and that would be it. Thank you

ill give my teammates some time to respond because they are busy with their own games but:

your iso is very dry and by your own admission, small. i find it strange that you want reads from my teammates on you (and likewise other teammates on you) when the people in this very game don't even really have opinions on you. do you feel like you've done something so significant, something so strong as to deserving opinions from people not in this game? that's what i find strange. you can just use common sense and realize probably most are null on you unless they have vocalized otherwise and you don't really need to solicit opinions, but for whatever reasons you feel like you need to be reassured of other people's reads on you?

[OkaPoka]

hey duck you think you know a50 well?

[OkaPoka]

it's been a while since we played together but yeeeeeah we go way back dude

so uh has this guy been transparently town?

[OkaPoka]

it's been a while since we played together but yeeeeeah we go way back dude

so uh has this guy been transparently town?

idk I haven't seen many of his posts - show me what you're seeing?

almost50 is claiming he's transparently town and anyone who knows him must agree with him

[OkaPoka]

kkoba is very interested in hercule case @jackson

[OkaPoka]

i should probably clarify

kkoba wants the full case with bells and whistles

[OkaPoka]

Oka what are your hottest take reads rn?

if you sort by activity, at least 3 scum bois are in the bottom half of the list

[OkaPoka]

I'd contest that isn't a read but I kinda agree a lot of the more vocal disagreements don't feel particularly manipulative (agar/Titus feels like it has the strongest chance of red atm)

how about like actual player reads? townreads can be hot too

idk if i have any hottake reads because i suspect most the playerlist might have at most 5 ish reads that aren't outside the bounds of null and there is nowhere near enough consensus

maybe something random like ceph could be scum

[OkaPoka]

personally:

i have lean scums on like abr, a50, ceph, titus

and lean towns on <REDACTED INDIVIDUALS> i think i mentioned hopkirk before tho

why do you ask for my reads

[OkaPoka]

I feel like you're keen for this game to get spicier and you're a spicy chicken so it seemed like an appropriate place to start.

could you fill me in on the Ceph scumlean?

ceph reads to me as someone who is playing a character more than anything

like the ms.net grumpy boomer archetype rather than a warthog

[OkaPoka]

dont really think its anything beyond that at this point

you really like the word performative dont u

[OkaPoka]

i dont mind i find it interesting

i just find it a little too on the nose you know

like we all like watching michael scott on tv but if you met michael scott in real life you'd be like okay steve carell, you don't need to method act and flex on me

[OkaPoka]

get a cute anime girl avatar and your whole perception will change is all im saying

when u sad posted in baton pass with the animated lion king character, it was very funny and read like a shitposter

but with this darkened realistic warthog that gives the vibes of isolation and loneliness, everything is so depressing

[OkaPoka]

like literally your pfp is an isolated warthog

not to personify a warthog but the eyes are looking down, its not even that in the foreground, it feels distant and isolated from everything

the ears are up but everything about it is looking down and away like its avoiding something, hiding some deep dark depression like a lost meerkat best friend from the great wars

trying to be happy but deep down inside, its depressed

@the worst you know i think there was a paper done and humans read emotions with the eyes

[OkaPoka]

my townreads are never juicy D:

[OkaPoka]

i just remember you correct reading me a lot in the past and very early to the point where i suspected i was doing something subconsciously that you were picking up on and i wonder if you still have that ability

[OkaPoka]

you know i think ceph is town

[OkaPoka]

its a culture war between boomer and zoomer energies

only one thing unites both cultures and that is cute anime girl

[OkaPoka]

according to dkkoba, resident expert on all things hercule related, u smell jackson and ur case smells

[OkaPoka]

gamestate/sanity check

for 42 pages, wagon movement has been awfully slow hasn't it?

[OkaPoka]

jackson, your case on hercule feels a bit tunnel-y

reminds me of myself

[OkaPoka]

idk - koba thinks your scum but im playing this game

[OkaPoka]

gamestate/sanity check

for 42 pages, wagon movement has been awfully slow hasn't it?

To be blunt, there's a lot of launchbait in this game. Or at least people I fall into a habit of wanting to elim

really? i feel like everyone has at least one redeeming quality that makes me not want to instantly elim them

list of launchbaits?

[OkaPoka]

again multitasking which is why this took so long

Hopkirk is close to a townread but he is not at the level of unwnd or hercule for me. i get the feeling he's just a good player which makes me paranoid of his scumrange. honestly my eyes glaze over his posting (potentially not ideal) but the vibe I get is that it looks like he's being helpful and engaging everyone in an effort to understand what's going on. if he's establishing himself to push an agenda i have a feeling we'll see it later but im very okay having this slot around for now.

JacksonVirgo - mostly a tonal read. i don't love 526 or 533 but the posts i thought were +town are: 534, 597, 598, 599, 647, 648. it's hard to explain it beyond just being openly frustrated and utterly not giving a shit about his thread perception which i have found in practice (in my anecdotal experience) to be a towntell for him.

A50 - this is like exactly the same as A50 in this one towngame we played and not at all how he played in this scumgame we did (granted he replaced in, which is different). there are moments like 112, 116, 619, 622 that ring eerily similar. "but it's just A50's playstyle!" you might say. okay sure maybe, that's why he's one of my weaker townleans i guess. also 737 is a really weird thing to post as scum but i obliged him since someone on my team thinks he can read him ok.

Xtoxm - unprompted and unpostury/interesting notes from Auro are good, i liked 642 for example. don't see an agenda from this slot, not postury, takes are pretty reasonable. other people townreading them too despite lack of content quantity which feels good. weaker townlean probably

TW - ill likely be revisiting this a lot bc im paranoid. here's the reasoning i gave earlier

rn it's leantown i think with the engagement and with the hinting on Datisi scumreading me so early (inside thing where town!Datisi has tunneled early town!me for two games in a row, i like that Datisi gave the read and the worst mentioned it unprompted). his entrance felt forced but on reread it's not bad. could be some confbiasing going on there so im conflicted, idk, im gonna just like worsty be a slow burn read for me.

and i think with your recent interaction with me im townreading you even more. i think your disengagement from this game is fine in the context of being busy and maybe even +town in a vacuum. also i think it's easy for scum!you to try and pocket me and you've done everything but engage with me and pocket me.

I'm ok adding IV to my townblock

i dont think that's how townblocks work

iv is voting you

[OkaPoka]

personally:

i have lean scums on like abr, a50, ceph, titus

and lean towns on <REDACTED INDIVIDUALS> i think i mentioned hopkirk before tho

why do you ask for my reads

Why are you redacting your TRs?

games are always more interesting with a little cageyness and also im insecure about my townreads

[OkaPoka]

personally:

i have lean scums on like abr, a50, ceph, titus

and lean towns on <REDACTED INDIVIDUALS> i think i mentioned hopkirk before tho

why do you ask for my reads

Why are you redacting your TRs?

games are always more interesting with a little cageyness and also im insecure about my townreads

The problem is this makes it harder to work with you. I don't agree with any of your scumreads either.

that's fine, im not confident enough on townreads to establish a frame of reference/poe to work off of yet

[OkaPoka]

personally:

i have lean scums on like abr, a50, ceph, titus

and lean towns on <REDACTED INDIVIDUALS> i think i mentioned hopkirk before tho

why do you ask for my reads

Why are you redacting your TRs?

games are always more interesting with a little cageyness and also im insecure about my townreads

The problem is this makes it harder to work with you. I don't agree with any of your scumreads either.

that's fine, im not confident enough on townreads to establish a frame of reference/poe to work off of yet

What can I do to help that? Because one of us (if you're town) is reading this game seriously wrong.

make more interesting cases and wagons

still early days

[OkaPoka]

@jackson what was ur teammates case/thoughts on hercule? afaik the case you presented is from your pov

[OkaPoka]

i unironically have ceph has town now

[OkaPoka]

its not really a thinky its more of a meme

ceph is probably in actuality closer to null but its funnier this way

i cant sort xtoxm, no votes, little posts, idk

[OkaPoka]

dgb is definitely faking reads

dgb is overly confident on reads as town from my experience, but usually will casework it a bit

im just hoping one of the people with decades of experience with em will explain everything so later

[OkaPoka]

man this amount of mindmeld with hopkirk is concerning stuff

[OkaPoka]

why did you flip on me n hercule?

[OkaPoka]

ur secret admirer says u were being cheeky with that lowkey scumtell

[OkaPoka]

ur secret admirer says u were being cheeky with that lowkey scumtell

are they expecting me to know what that means

well they said you did it on purpose so im testing that hypothesis

[OkaPoka]

why did you flip on me n hercule?

Don't be confusing RVS BS'ing with real reads.

tonally it feels like you have the same mindset as you had in RVS u know?

the presentation of your reads feel entirely random etc.

[OkaPoka]

why did you flip on me n hercule?

Don't be confusing RVS BS'ing with real reads.

tonally it feels like you have the same mindset as you had in RVS u know?

the presentation of your reads feel entirely random etc.

I've always done that, this is the first time I get a complaint.

If you have questions, ask away, there are reasons behind every placement.

now i only played epilogue (dance) with you but i dont recall you doing the readslist in dance

maybe im mistaken though

[OkaPoka]

your posting is pretty uninspiring

I've toned it down to let some sun shine on the youngins

who do you consider a youngin

[OkaPoka]

maybe if you had a bigger presence you could sway me but right now the duck is too powerful

[OkaPoka]

@jackson what was ur teammates case/thoughts on hercule? afaik the case you presented is from your pov

dont know if you missed it @jackson but here it is again

[OkaPoka]

hi again

chennisden

[OkaPoka]

damn it appears my 2 year old meta on a50 is out of sync with everyone including my own teammates

[OkaPoka]

its just a very passive game in general so its hard to see lines being drawn

[OkaPoka]

did this interaction end ? D: im waiting ~!

[OkaPoka]

no but do you see duck's point

the townread was established before the scumread was

[OkaPoka]

how would it look if you decided to flip on your newfound townread solely because they voted you

[OkaPoka]

i think it would have been really easy to just not make a comment there, or leave it at 'i havent got there yet'

basically what she did no?

[OkaPoka]

like never eliminate pile is a not an upgrade from town block

ive never heard of a someone offering their own town block to the chopping block

[OkaPoka]

is it townbloc or townblock

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: xtoxm

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: xtoxm

I scumread xtoxm too, but I would like your reasoning.

hi i see this question and am dodging it, ask again later?

dgb is definitely faking reads

dgb is overly confident on reads as town from my experience, but usually will casework it a bit

im just hoping one of the people with decades of experience with em will explain everything so later

can you elaborate on this?

by faking reads do you mean giving out a read you don't actually believe in? what's the town and scum motivation for doing that? do you think this is AI (independent of the opinions of people who have "decades of experience" with her, lol)?

i agree with DGB appearing confident on reads, town!DGB entered like this in LN 230 as well, stating reads as fact with no explanation (even similar to what i did early game here). I'm not sure what you mean by "casework" them a bit? is that what she's doing here?

well im agreeing with hopkirk in that i dont see an AI motivation for her dumping confident fake reads, DGB says it was rvs nonsense so okay i guess.

dgb is not really caseworking in the sense that there is some explanation with quotes and responses / analysis to certain posts. in my limited experience with dgb, there a little bit of that

[OkaPoka]

well im agreeing with hopkirk in that i dont see an AI motivation for her dumping confident fake reads, DGB says it was rvs nonsense so okay i guess.

dgb is not really caseworking in the sense that there is some explanation with quotes and responses / analysis to certain posts. in my limited experience with dgb, there a little bit of that

ok thanks so DGB is pretty null to you/potentially +scum from the lack of read explanation so far?

I guess but its less true null and more uncategorized

[OkaPoka]

why does this 1v1 feel oddly personal have you guys played with each other before

[OkaPoka]

ill allow it

witness unwnd answer the question about menalque

[OkaPoka]

its fairly obvious

[OkaPoka]

tbh i thought it was because mena probably wouldn't have read this game

[OkaPoka]

hercule lets use the power of friendship to make hopkirk and unwnd friends at least for today

[OkaPoka]

never bring up pre 2018 okapoka those were some darker times

[OkaPoka]

ikik same but what a g a l a x y b r a i n scum win that was

mechanically id still make similar plays but oh god the way i posted was so cringy

[OkaPoka]

hercule lets use the power of friendship to make hopkirk and unwnd friends at least for today

I do think it's likely town v town but I also don't want to stop anyone from exploring their scumreads. It's a bad habit of mine that has gotten me into trouble. I would stop a wagon on either though.

unless you mean they should just be friendly to each other, in which case, yes

yes but i want to form a voting bloc and that requires them to be friemds D:

[OkaPoka]

the time is now to make the orcs n goblins nervous

[OkaPoka]

Maybe it's my own impatience but I've mulling over my vote on AGar and came to my own conclusion he isn't going to respond. The game has changed and so too is the way I read most players. Back in the day I'd come through their words to spot contradictions but I find scum nowadays don't really give a shit about making convincing arguments, no, it's more about the presentation. Something that makes townies go 'well, by effort and substantiation he must be town!' because people have gotten so traumatized by a red PM these days and believe scum just won't effort as much as town that it's almost bordering ridiculous. I am against this mindset because it assumes that people enjoy losing, which I'm pretty sure if you're playing any game the objective is to win.

This vote is something almost all of my team agree on. I don't really bode well with (post) (post) (post) analysis and instead giving a general description of what I see.

As for what I see? I sorta let it slide but there was a moment where Hopkirk responded to me saying 'i kinda like to work list up and then down first, getting townreads'. This is fine in practice, yet he remained quite passive-aggressive. I also think that line alone is disingenuous but is playing a part of his style right now, which all seems quite excessive to me. I think Hopkirk in that instance only responded that way because it sounded good, not that he really believed it. If his MO was to look for townies and form townblocks, then what is his explanation of splintered ridicule throughout the ISO. The shift in dynamic doesn't bode with his own words. Go look at the way he silver tongues Hercule then ridicules others. This is not paraphrasing but this man really said 'don't like it when there's consequence for your actions, huh?' It's all based on

proving a point

which is both petty and scummy.

It'd be really easy and really lazy to say 'he is being LAMISTy' but seriously that's boring and using umbrella terms like that caution back to the days where people would do things like Why me = Fry me. Mafia Jargon doesn't make someone scum guys, and I actually think scum are more prone to be lazy about their reads because it's pretty difficult to try and convince people.

@titus this is it i am speeding this up hopefully i dont interfere with your methods

[OkaPoka]

the time is now to make the orcs n goblins nervous

alright, where do you want to go?

i dunno but if we start the rumblings of forming teams and we can box out the wolves maybe the wolves will do something ai in panic

[OkaPoka]

the time is now to make the orcs n goblins nervous

alright, where do you want to go?

i dunno but if we start the rumblings of forming teams and we can box out the wolves maybe the wolves will do something ai in panic

you have my sword

only people im comfortable adding to the bloc are unwnd and hopkirk right now

[OkaPoka]

uh oh i was told to sheep you not the vice versa what has the game become

[OkaPoka]

im actually somewhat comfortable with inviting ceph in as well and we both mutually townread him too

okapok, hercule, unwnd, hopkirk, ceph what are the odds any of us are scum

[OkaPoka]

Maybe it's my own impatience but I've mulling over my vote on AGar and came to my own conclusion he isn't going to respond. The game has changed and so too is the way I read most players. Back in the day I'd come through their words to spot contradictions but I find scum nowadays don't really give a shit about making convincing arguments, no, it's more about the presentation. Something that makes townies go 'well, by effort and substantiation he must be town!' because people have gotten so traumatized by a red PM these days and believe scum just won't effort as much as town that it's almost bordering ridiculous. I am against this mindset because it assumes that people enjoy losing, which I'm pretty sure if you're playing any game the objective is to win.

This vote is something almost all of my team agree on. I don't really bode well with (post) (post) (post) analysis and instead giving a general description of what I see.

As for what I see? I sorta let it slide but there was a moment where Hopkirk responded to me saying 'i kinda like to work list up and then down first, getting townreads'. This is fine in practice, yet he remained quite passive-aggressive. I also think that line alone is disingenuous but is playing a part of his style right now, which all seems quite excessive to me. I think Hopkirk in that instance only responded that way because it sounded good, not that he really believed it. If his MO was to look for townies and form townblocks, then what is his explanation of splintered ridicule throughout the ISO. The shift in dynamic doesn't bode with his own words. Go look at the way he silver tongues Hercule then ridicules others. This is not paraphrasing but this man really said 'don't like it when there's consequence for your actions, huh?' It's all based on

proving a point

which is both petty and scummy.

It'd be really easy and really lazy to say 'he is being LAMISTy' but seriously that's boring and using umbrella terms like that caution back to the days where people would do things like Why me = Fry me. Mafia Jargon doesn't make someone scum guys, and I actually think scum are more prone to be lazy about their reads because it's pretty difficult to try and convince people.

@titus this is it i am speeding this up hopefully i dont interfere with your methods

@okapoka, I have no plan right now. I'm too unfocused right now and I am having trouble seeing people's agendas.

You can always try to assist me. I'll tell you if not helping.

lets say scum can remove two players from okapoka, hercule, unwnd, hopkirk, cephrir

do you think town wins if that's your lylo? aka what are your thoughts on these 5 slots and are you confident enough right now that these 5 players should be never eliminated til towards the end

is there anyone you have any doubts on i guess

pedit: i guess you kinda answered it lma

[OkaPoka]

i have a picture of what unwnd scum would play like even though ive never played with unwnd scum before and its why im townreading that slot, but yeah its not exactly a scientific way of playing

[OkaPoka]

i have a picture of what unwnd scum would play like even though ive never played with unwnd scum before and its why im townreading that slot, but yeah its not exactly a scientific way of playing

well, go on then, share with the class!

unwnd as a person complains a lot about site culture and holds the opinion that scum suck because they put in minimal effort and scumhunting sucks these days because scum aren't even willing to play properly.

as a result i suspect unwnd would be the scum player that puts up reasonable effort in actual actively doing stuff

but this recent hopkirk case at first is complete cheeks and lazy even if it might be right, it would be right for the wrong reasons probably. there are a lot of better ways to attack hopkirk than introducing your case with a ramble about site culture and ending with a talk about buzzwords. idk maybe im crazy but i feel almost as if unwnd as scum would put in a bit more effort in digging up quotes and running a pbp analysis or something on casing hopkirk purely because i think unwnd sees that type of scumplay as very strong against how he perceives site culture meta.

but this is a very illformed thought because i have no idea of how unwnd actually plays lmao


also forming a townbloc without hopkirk or unwnd's consent as they crossvote each other is very much intentional

[OkaPoka]

in other words my meta on unwnd isnt games its the mafia discussion section

[OkaPoka]

the better the case you make the more i have to scumread you by obligation so beware anime cat? girl? ribbons? idk

[OkaPoka]

yeah and its probably? not SvS because hopkirk admittedly reacted pretty poorly to the case that really felt more like the ramblings of an old man nostalgic for a bygone era that may have never existed

maybe not now but that exchange was pretty hilarious

[OkaPoka]

what were agar and unwnd disagreeing about anyways? id think they'd get along

agar is very reminiscent of a bygone era of ms.net players that unwnd likes (i think)

[OkaPoka]

okay so let's form the read unwnd committee

dunnstral, titus, innocent villager are the members of this committee

[OkaPoka]

no i reserve boomers for people who complain about modern gameplay

you are just old school

[OkaPoka]

if anypne's wondering oka feels very engaged and sincere and like, the game i remember with him i thought he might be too scummy to be scum and he was actually scum, so i'm a bit dubious about his ability to fake the just like, happy lighthearted mood that radiates from his posts

aww my heart just melted

[OkaPoka]

its bad form the comment on things that pat yourself on the shoulder but thank your the warm fuzzies

[OkaPoka]

thank you for*

[OkaPoka]

okay duck you are in but on the condition you invite one more person to the unwnd committee so its an odd number

[OkaPoka]

also duck... ive noticed you have decided to skip over the attempted formation of a townbloc in your catchup

what are thy thoughts

[OkaPoka]

also duck... ive noticed you have decided to skip over the attempted formation of a townbloc in your catchup

what are thy thoughts

I wasn't paying much attention to it other than the hopkirk/unwnd lols - who else was in it?

me hercule hopkirk unwnd ceph

[OkaPoka]

well the next step of my towncore is when we enforce the hastert rule

[OkaPoka]

the idea for today i hope is if us 5 hold at least 4 town indubitably, we need to find the next 5 towniest player who will agree to the conditions of voting off someone using the majority of the majority rule

should spice things up tbh

[OkaPoka]

here's the full genius of the townbloc hastert rule

even though majority of majority "disenfranchises" people, it weirdly enough requires full cooperation and at sensible discussion among all party members because the party needs its people

and the disenfranished will necessarily form a counter party, running on a platform of ejecting someone else

now you have two competing parties, jockeying for votes with their own partisan views

imagine the content that can be generated through partisanship

[OkaPoka]

okay but imagination of a future game aside

yeah i agree creating a townbloc d1 and thinking that a winning poe can be found d1 is naively stupid

buttttt... i do think we are at the phase where some semblance of consensus and focus needs to be formed a bit because focused games are weirdly more dynamic and should force the people on the peripheries to not be able to pick and choose what they want to engage with

[OkaPoka]

worst

i haven't played with you in a while tbh

you feel like you drawing in extra scumreads this game or nah

[OkaPoka]

wow xtoxm is collecting a lot of votes

it kinda helps and ruined my reason to vote him which was a mix of annoyance at his logic and wanting to fish on whether he would react but i guess he is going to have to address it no matter what at this point

[OkaPoka]

okay but imagination of a future game aside

I feel like you'd be a blast to play secret hitler with <:

worst

i haven't played with you in a while tbh

you feel like you drawing in extra scumreads this game or nah

hmm does anyone other than Titus have an actual read on me? I think ABR is posturing and he's the only other one who's claimed to

unwnd said they were looking at me which I await with bated breath :3

we definitely haven't played together for a while. I don't play much anymore and try to allocate my mafia energy a bit more efficiently.


pedit: basically exactly. a D1 wagon on Titus is generally not very helpful for finding scum!Titus but my god do people read fascinating stuff into her posts. pressure on Xtoxm here is worth its weight in gold.

im so bad at secret hitler
--
don't actually know who else has scumreads on you but i may be overestimating the scumreads on you, im just wondering whether you are use to i guess, not collecting townreads? my recollection of you had you becoming a townread magnet
--
hercule is on xtoxm as well

[OkaPoka]

fair enough ):

[OkaPoka]

sometimes you just have to concede that some players cannot be caught without info

[OkaPoka]

He seemed to pull a lot of confidence out of one of your posts which felt (no offense) pretty understated and like a very late/safe read. Townreading you for townreading IV for scumreading you in that format is a really strange reduction of the IV/you interaction imo. It also felt like your post he's referencing was just you clarifying a choice of language when Oka got confused about townblocking?

His reasoning afterwards also feels really half baked and underconsidered given it was a pretty spicy read at that point. I get the impression he wants to position himself on the pro-Titus side of the gamestate, but not the impression that he has read your iso and come out with a coherent read that you are aligned with the town.

not even strange - arguably wrong but he's sticking to it and seemingly auro was too so something is amiss that requires well, talking to us

[OkaPoka]

I CONCUR

[OkaPoka]

THE AVIAN CREW HAS SYNCED UP

[OkaPoka]

pst and am student so my body still thinks time is human construct

i have no idea what to think of abr, ive heard this guy is a super domineering personality but here we have idk... a lurker?

[OkaPoka]

hello a50 can we take a peak at what you have so far

[OkaPoka]

my sleep habits are beyond human comprehension at this point

ABR is townread by Titus because she hates him and is compensating i think, Xtomx?, and unwnd i believe right?

[OkaPoka]

i guess unwnd is going to explain that read later but this game is v confusing

[OkaPoka]

hello a50 can we take a peak at what you have so far

In my next post

ok


also winterflakes seems to have an ABR townread

[OkaPoka]

man i know this sucks to use as a read but i wonder if jacksonvirgo's difficulty getting involved into this game could be potentially scumindicative? its worked as a tell in the past

[OkaPoka]

fair enough ill uncategorize jv and sort him out later

[OkaPoka]

oops mb ill sort them* out later

[OkaPoka]

why are you town on xtoxm? at least why is he so hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigh

[OkaPoka]

can u give general categories / criterion

[OkaPoka]

can u give general categories / criterion

I did (unless you're not talking to me)

i mean like:

i townread okapoka because he is cute, charming, and handsome

i scumread the_worst because he is a duck that goes quack quack

but more serious than that

[OkaPoka]

well okay this is the A50 im remembering now

[OkaPoka]

@Oka: I can try to explain tw just for you. Look at whom he's been voting of late. Titus and Xtoxm?? And he TRs DGB??? And has been avoiding me and yet says

I

was avoiding him, when I literally included him in my very first post??

Before that he was voting JV, but is now objecting a FoS on JV. If he knew JV was busy IRL why did he vote him earlier??

Well, that's the most you're gonna get from me, and it had been done as a favour to you.

i voted titus and xtoxm...

i suppose the question is worth answering from the duckie

[OkaPoka]

duck
IV, dgb, unwnd
Dunnstral (I like him but I'm sheeping)
Oka, Cephrir, Hercule
Dannflor, Flakes, A50, Ythan
Titus, AGar, Hopkirk
JacksonVirgo, ABR
Xtoxm

I'm probably wrong on someone in the 4p core, they're my adorable weak town tonereads

@dannyboi

[OkaPoka]

lol just noticed worst has JV as a top 3 scumread

[OkaPoka]

ive been agreeing with so many people this game im starting to get worried but ahhh last time i agreed this much good things happened until it didnt

[OkaPoka]

before i pretend to go to sleep its poe time

okapoka

hercule, hopkirk, unwnd, ceph

ducky, danny

a50? titus?

agar??? dunny???

iv, jv, xtoxm, uncrowned, dgb, abr, ythan

bruh there are still so manyyyyyyyyyy

[OkaPoka]

well do something about it! @abr

[OkaPoka]

if you think scum control the game state id expect you to post more and do more leading

rather than offer your vote to others?

[OkaPoka]

If people were wondering why I was townreading ABR it is the post above as I am completely in agreement lol

okay but what about before the above post

[OkaPoka]

it does but i feel like playing sheep is literally supporting the existing gamestate and if its a scum driven gamestate - you wouldn't want to support it?

what do you want to do today ABR, at least if you could get something accomplished in the next 24 hours, what is it going to be

honestly i am pretty intent on solely voting xtoxm right now, i don't find anyone else nearly as interesting to wagon as him

the next are a pool of bleh where i feel like im just trying to hit at rand i.e. guys like but not limited to abr, dgb, winter flakes

[OkaPoka]

so basically we are wagoning xtoxm for being wrong and then kind of moving the goalposts instead of admitting to being wrong (15-20 in his iso, particularly 19-20 being scummy posts)? at least that's what i'm getting from it?

yeah i guess that isn't technically incorrect

although wagoneers are extrapolating a bit in saying that him moving the goalposts is a result of him wanting to have a townread and then making up a reason for it

[OkaPoka]

hercule when ur there can u talk to me about spf and her reads

kkoba says spf is supposed to have some god tier reads soo do you agree whats up idk

pedit: 5

[OkaPoka]

also spf has to be related to saudade right

[OkaPoka]

hercule when ur there can u talk to me about spf and her reads

kkoba says spf is supposed to have some god tier reads soo do you agree whats up idk

pedit: 5

sure, i think i've said most of her reads to this point

fwiw all 4 of us have been focusing our reading /discussion efforts on one of the other games atm (we all flipped town, it's just the specifics of that game have lent itself to our attention, don't think I can/should explain much more than that)

so last thing I discussed with spf was to ask her to sanity check our towncore, but I told her it's not urgent and she said she would do it over the next couple days

okay i was going to ask about recent developments like her thoughts on xtoxm now and towncore lmao

but i guess we can table it

also if koba is seems to be a mega spf fan as well so i was wondering if spf is supposed to be a super scumhunter or what

what are your basic thoughts on xtoxm, are you voting him because you are sheeping me or do you think he's scum too.

[OkaPoka]

wow i shouldnt multitask but

koba seems to be a mega spf fan so i was wondering if spf is a super scumhunter or what (in ur eyes)

[OkaPoka]

bleh

anyways i was thinking maybe abr collecting townreads might be scum TMI'ng him? from what i hear is abr is someone you don't want to make an enemy out of and i dont think townies are going to be thinking much about who they want to make enemies out of early d1

[OkaPoka]

maybe hopkirk needs one of those avatar upgrades

[OkaPoka]

only way hopkirk v unwnd is svs is if hopkirk really wanted to advertise his dnd campaign

[OkaPoka]

12pm is noon though

[OkaPoka]

xtoxm clearly needs to address his titus read when its demonstrably on false grounds and i want to see it

and why him and auro both got that wrong

[OkaPoka]

[OkaPoka]

My main scumhunting comes from looking at how players react to pressure and after AGar I feel like scum have been controlling the game state and keeping us from consolidating. My POE is large. Who wants my vote?

I'm interested in an elaboration on this theory.

I feel like there's scum in DGB/the worst. Nobody's interested in bandwagonning them.

Don't worry about it ABR if you don't understand it

VOTE: DrippingGoofball

VOTE: the worst

ABR do you not see how silly you are being?

[OkaPoka]

Your argument is leading on my own meta is it not? You keep saying this isn't how I approach the game as town, and earlier you started to say +++scum because of Maria or something

Like it's all just nonsense

Your argument is that as scum you'd have your whole team behind you proofreading your posts?

I think that's nonsense

The way you have been approaching my slot

is

+scum

elaborate ?

[OkaPoka]

@unwnd please do elaborate in what is the weird shit dunn is doing because i dunno how to read dunn

[OkaPoka]

i dont see what you see - what is weird about dunn? i always find dunn weird to parse but that's neither here nor there

[OkaPoka]

Might just be too lost in the sauce. I'm not trying to play a perfect game and dunn is accusing me of preflip bs but

I get this way when I feel I'm not surrounded by town lol

is the preflip thing what you find weird? genuinely do not know as things may have gone over my head

[OkaPoka]

ceph do you not have meta experience with dgb? i just assumed you two had history given join dates but ...

[OkaPoka]

the maria and dunn dichotomy might be ms.net's most puzzling dichotomy

[OkaPoka]

anybody ever know what goes on whenever dunn and maria start talking to each other

[OkaPoka]

yes i know we are playing with unwnd but this feels like an extension of another one of dunn n maria talks

[OkaPoka]

anybody ever know what goes on whenever dunn and maria start talking to each other

Stop this misrep

I never talked to Maria, unwnd is the one who brought that in

yeah i know but this feels like another extension of a dunn maria interaction where both of you are referencing some common context or background that looks arcane to me

how should unwnd be interacting and sorting you? is there something special that unwnd should be doing because of shared context? is it just because unwnd isn't pointing out the weird stuff? what is the weird stuff dunn is doing unwnd? what was the ++++scum equity reason here:

okay so let's form the read unwnd committee

dunnstral, titus, innocent villager are the members of this committee

Unwnd saying they'd be willing to vote for me with no further explanation is +++scum especially with his team, for multiple reasons.

is it obvious stuff or meta stuff?

[OkaPoka]

sure okay

if we turn the clock back to post 1397, what were the reasons then and why did it specifically apply to unwnd's team? I assumed unwnd team was an implication about maria but if not do explain more

[OkaPoka]

"preflip" and "weirdness" are purely recent conceptions i want to go back to post 1397 and start there

[OkaPoka]

sure okay

if we turn the clock back to post 1397, what were the reasons then and why did it specifically apply to unwnd's team? I assumed unwnd team was an implication about maria but if not do explain more

Turn the clock back to posts 1791, 1792, 1798

we can get there later but i regret not asking then so im going to pretend i never messed up and turn it back to 1397

for what its worth i do agree the dunn read appeared out of nowhere from unwnd, here are the two posts that include dunn before 1397:

Dunn/Dann/Herc/ maaaaybe DGB/winterflakes

Kinda only agree on one, then the most defined read I have would be Dunn purely based on experience (even if it's Null), wherein he establishes himself later and if scum is caught on who he votes.

Right now outside of hopkirk vote I am looking at

Flakes/the worst/Titus/Dunn

Then maybe DGB. I can't remember why I scumread IV but it's probably outdated. I want to look into AGar more sincerely before I decide if it was a great vote after all

then you respond with:

okay so let's form the read unwnd committee

dunnstral, titus, innocent villager are the members of this committee

Unwnd saying they'd be willing to vote for me with no further explanation is +++scum especially with his team, for multiple reasons.

Clearly because the read appeared suddenly and without explanation. So why is it +++scum specifically for unwnd's team? I assumed unwnd team really means mariaR given dunn n maria are like peanut butter and jelly but if im wrong im wrong. Do you mean that the team should townread you, is the read the issue at that moment? What's the issue and why?

[OkaPoka]

I assumed unwnd team really means mariaR

well, you're wrong, I meant his whole team.

You guys are asking me to explain things 3 or 4 times and it's not really what I want to talk about.

okay sorry just bear with me, you mean the whole team.

but what about the whole team specifically makes unwnd's choice to have you appear as a scumread without explanation... scummy?

presumably most people who would have you appear as a scumread without explanation wouldn't be that AI or at least not + +++++ + + scum equity right?

[OkaPoka]

Do you mean that the team should townread you, is the read the issue at that moment? What's the issue and why?

The issue is the way he is reading me is not consistent with his team looking at this game with him being town, and also doesn't feel like what he does on his own

How does he go from null to scum with no explanation (it is later explained that this is because of eldritch signs and star constellations, and also because somebody else townread me)

Why can't i just have a read i want to express in the thread to see how others feel about it lol

okay unwnd what is your explanation of null -> scum transition?

and dunn what do you mean by the team looking at the game with him being town, what would you expect if he is town? again why is unwnd obligated to explain the read change 1000 posts through?

[OkaPoka]

we can go there next but i want to explore the mentality because clearly, you felt that unwnd and his team (because of their relationship to you) had to treat you differently than they would with other slots right? i mean I don't find that an unreasonable ask... i just want to know the nature of the relationship you expect from a town!unwnd and thus town!maria beeboy amph etc.

i mean you didn't really question them at the point of 1397, it seemed like it was more of a "well they just did scummy thing here comment"

[OkaPoka]

I do not understand the wagon on xtoxm nor how it has come about. Could've missed reasoning, but don't think I have? Composition feels like it sucks, would need a VC to confirm but I've seen some names I don't like on it.

This got ignored at the time but should get an explanation

again the xtoxm wagon is purely because xtoxm

1) had a townread on titus for townreading iv for scumreading her
2) but this reasoning was demonstrably false because titus had townread iv before iv scumread her
3) and xtoxm rather than backing up, doubled down on a faulty premise and also included auro backing himself up


so the argument is xtoxm and auro have decided that they want to townread titus (don't know why) and invented a reason as to why.

me n the worst are voting xtoxm presumably for this reason because it was us two who were quesitoning xtoxm. hercule mentioned xtoxm was in the lhf null scum poe. idk for others.

[OkaPoka]

we can go there next but i want to explore the mentality because clearly, you felt that unwnd and his team (because of their relationship to you) had to treat you differently than they would with other slots right? i mean I don't find that an unreasonable ask... i just want to know the nature of the relationship you expect from a town!unwnd and thus town!maria beeboy amph etc.

i mean you didn't really question them at the point of 1397, it seemed like it was more of a "well they just did scummy thing here comment"

Kind of?

I'm not asking for much, you make it sound like I want preferential treatment but really ignoring me all game and then calling me scum unexplained was worth commenting on

the way you worded it made it seem like your comment was only applicable in that case specifically because it was unwnd and team, am i wrong in saying that?

as in, if i did what unwnd did or the worst did what unwnd, that +++++scumequity would not be applicable

[OkaPoka]

okay i am glad we established that at least

so the issue i presume then you have with unwnd has to do with the fact that you would think unwnd and friends would explain their scumread on you because you are dunnstral? or because they would explain any read progression?

[OkaPoka]

i.e. would you have a problem with unwnd if they went from null to scum without explanation on a slot say... okapoka

[OkaPoka]

i.e. would you have a problem with unwnd if they went from null to scum without explanation on a slot say... okapoka

If they gave the same explanation, then yes.

I might be less likely to notice the read shift immediately, or think that it's significant

okay im glad we cleared that up (:

I've played with maria and know she frustratingly refuses to explain anything. is unwnd!town a vocal train of though-ter?

pedit: mmk

[OkaPoka]

be a pal and sum up your grievances with unwnd after 1397? quotes would be nice, ill be back in a few minutes

but uh pretend im 5 and don't know a single thing about how unwnd plays or how you play, so you can also leave cute little notes about what you think unwnd should be doing as town in the scenarios where unwnd is being scummy

[OkaPoka]

Once again, his read being based on other people townreading me, and me being weird but not wanting to/not able to explain it

Unwnd do you agree with the premise that dunn is scum because of certain people tring him?

Also what is the weird stuff dunn is doing?

Again im 5

[OkaPoka]

I dont understand your thought process unwnd

[OkaPoka]

I mean you might not be its just you are being cryptic on someone who i have historically struggled to parse

[OkaPoka]

in fact i think i am like 0/5 on reading dunn or something absurd like that

[OkaPoka]

Once again, his read being based on other people townreading me, and me being weird but not wanting to/not able to explain it

Unwnd do you agree with the premise that dunn is scum because of certain people tring him?

Also what is the weird stuff dunn is doing?

Again im 5

but doubling back what are your thoughts on this @unwnd

[OkaPoka]

i hope mass confusion is what you hoped for because i certainly am

[OkaPoka]

this just continues to give me auxiliary evidence that touhou (?) players speak in a separate plane of existence

[OkaPoka]

well on the bright side this is the highest concentration of dunnstral we've gotten all game