TM 2021 Large Normal: OEIS Mafia (Part Two Is Out)

[the worst]

first

[the worst]

WHAT

how did I actually let me get that

[the worst]

hi ythan. am I your friend? if not are you offended that I replied? what do you make of hercule being town?

[the worst]

I think we're friends now. This has been a magical moment, thank you.

Xtoxm you'd better believe I'm coming at you for rolling scum without me.

[the worst]

oh my meme worked Hercule is actually town
yeeet

[the worst]

VOTE: ythan what's friendship without a little murder?

[the worst]

I think we're friends now. This has been a magical moment, thank you.

Xtoxm you'd better believe I'm coming at you for rolling scum without me.

so we werent before? damn.

hmhm
i wonder if we're finally same team this time

of course WE are friends I was talking to ythan!

I know better than to guess your alignment on pg1 and I'm a bit confused you are already thinking this about me lol. what have I done that's struck you at this point?

[the worst]

VOTE: ythan

when y'all iso me after I'm n1'd: this is 2/2 scum

[the worst]

VOTE: ythan

why

VOTE: hercule

Already nervous.

Hercule town is my only non fake read and I LOVE that you're voting there

[the worst]

Just do what feels right and folks will deal with it. Here watch.

VOTE: hercule

I love this one less but we shall see what we see

hercule you mentioned that you were really excited to get this game started this morning, does your enthusiasm vary by alignment at all?

by extension is your activity generally similar (and I assume high) as both alignments?

dann my man please circle back to this after herc replies because I know you're better than this question in isolation

[the worst]

VOTE: the worst

VOTE: ythan

Sup wit dis?

changed my mind

decided I valued attempting to start a wagon more than voting ducky

you changed your vote after 20 seconds lmao how much thought did you put into this

[the worst]

dannflor townish

how do you figure?

[the worst]

lu worst

oh hehe

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

[the worst]

good vote unwnd, why did you make it though

[the worst]

Oh, I should also warn you all that I will try to make a good impression early on then lurk it out to eternity

@Titus, the worst & Dunn: We all know you guys voting me is inevitable, so let's get it over with.

nice to see you again <3 you'd better be town

[the worst]

I dislike when people make statements like 'oh gosh why didn't X roll TOWN with me?' Such a presumptuous way to provide a read that usually just comes from scum

nonsensical theory/personality write-offs which lack nuance are the death of accurate reads

if that's all that someone is saying, yeah they're probably tryna be cute. if it's mixed in with other reads, suck it up sunshine. as always *why* is that person saying that?

ftr this is a sincere question idk if you're talking about a read on someone or just making a pointless high level observation

[the worst]

hi ythan. am I your friend? if not are you offended that I replied? what do you make of hercule being town?

How the quack do you know hercule is town already? Just because AT&T betrayed him doesn't automatically make him a goof guy. AT&T could be early bus'ing

it was a joke. BUT....... it turns out I was probably right so I'm gonna claim psychic powers?

the worst why are you town reading hercule?

they're making towny noises and want people to townread them so I'm obliging! i'll work out if I'm wrong later. Where u at on them?

[the worst]

How the quack do you know hercule is town already? Just because AT&T betrayed him doesn't automatically make him a goof guy. AT&T could be early bus'ing

he is active off the bat and his fp seems excited, both things i associate at least somewhat with town
not into the trend of wagoning the most active player d1
idgi

if I were in a more patient mood I'd make like, exactly this post in response btw A50

[the worst]

Comment was related to my vote on IV, thought it was evident

hmm I did a few things irl between seeing your IV vote and reading that, so I may have just context failed. I'm pretty tired. Actually my post read as snippier than my brain was trying to be.

Better counterpoint: IV is addicted to saying cute nonsense. This daystart is absolutely typical of IV as either alignment. Has anything else he's done struck you as alignment indicative or just the fluffy comments?

Someone on my team agrees with you btw (but I haven't asked for their reasoning yet)

[the worst]

sure, I can see where you're coming from.

[the worst]

I liked something AGar posted

[the worst]

VOTE: the worst

VOTE: ythan

Sup wit dis?

VOTE: the worst

VOTE: ythan

Sup wit dis?

changed my mind

decided I valued attempting to start a wagon more than voting ducky

In all of half a minute?

oh yeah this

dann is acting really performative this phase and I tend to weakly lean towards AGar catching this coming from a critical thinking pov

[the worst]

who are you and can I have your autograph

[the worst]

this isn't the first time you've taken issue with someone for not talking about something you did and i wonder how many times you'll have to do this before you realize not everyone thinks the same way

Ceph, please, if this happened mafia would stop being a game

[the worst]

how about we blow this joint and play some 18p codenames instead?

[the worst]

oh hey AGar townposted again

[the worst]

your opening votes were performative

[the worst]

well

no

sorry you're wrong :shrug:

I've only read like the first 5? pages and the last page but from what I've seen you have been performative

[the worst]

am i town duck

idk are you

[the worst]

Do you think that's scum indicative for Dann, Duck?

not really, dann has like a massive amount of pizzazz

but I can see why it's startling to other people - I liked AGar's kneejerk more than I have a read on Dann's opening

[the worst]

well

no

sorry you're wrong :shrug:

I've only read like the first 5? pages and the last page but from what I've seen you have been performative

Oh okay

But no

why are you even taking exception to this? a 20 second vote change looks performative from the outside. what did you make of AGar picking up on it then?

[the worst]

Infinity agrees that AGar is townposting and likes the OMGUS vote on ceph

UNVOTE: AGar
VOTE: A50

please high five infinity from me

[the worst]

well

no

sorry you're wrong :shrug:

I've only read like the first 5? pages and the last page but from what I've seen you have been performative

Oh okay

But no

why are you even taking exception to this? a 20 second vote change looks performative from the outside. what did you make of AGar picking up on it then?

Oh I’m just being ornery now

I thought it was fine if a bit of a useless line of questioning at the time

I mean there's a reason I asked the question then dropped it - I assume you and AGar don't have experience and given that I quite liked it

pedit: meh, I think scum tries to make more of it. what do you think of his response to Ceph

[the worst]

I don't dislike my vote

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VOTE: AGar

VOTE: agar

VOTE: agar

There's almost 100% scum in this three

Why?

it's a bad wagon but I'd also like to know why there's scum in here

[the worst]

pretty sure speedwagons are close to rand alignment-wise?...if anything maybe scum are slightly less likely to join in if they feel exposed?

[the worst]

can we shade you for your reads being made up because you're scum though?

[the worst]

I don't know what I'm meant to glean from that

pedit: I hope the rest of your day gets better <3

[the worst]

we did give them a lukewarm welcome tbf, I'll try and read them again later.

@wint I just saw you're an Uncrowned alt, can I still have your autograph? <3

[the worst]

don't worry about the essay, I'm pretty sure eliminating Freud just ends the game.

[the worst]

yeah please

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how about we wagon theworst too

? why not

also tell him we dont care abt his input until we have literally any kind of mech info

I don't even care about my own input until we have more mech info

[the worst]

IV could you catch me up on how you're looking at this game rn?
Assume I have read and will probably read nothing

[the worst]

busy irl

nothing in particular, what's most exciting to you?

[the worst]

most exciting is that i don't have a red role PM in this madness, to be totally honest

Most exciting read?

are your teammates following this game @worst

intermittently ya

[the worst]

I still think AGar is net towny

[the worst]

why and how confident is "net towny"? from your ISO i see your reasons given were 1) you liked his callout of Dann's "overperformativeness" in his quick vote switch at the beginning and 2) you liked his knee jerk reaction (im assuming his omgus on ceph? or was it the other one? i liked his omgus on ceph)

i don't have any scumreads. my townreads are hercule and unwnd and I doubt any of that is going to change soon. My nullpile looks something like {Dunnstral, Winter Flakes, Titus, AGar, OkaPoka, Cephrir, DGB}

I thought his bite at ABR was pretty earnest as well

hard to say how confident I am but I have an exceedingly sinking feeling - it feels like he's being pushed more heavily than the average person would for posting what he's posting.

[the worst]

hi hopkirk, big fan

[the worst]

hopkirk while im on is there anything in particular you want to discuss/want my opinion on?

just FYI dude this kind of thing has strong "please force me to solve" energy which makes me pretty lukewarm about you

could you try taking a bit more intuitive even if you're not vibing it? I'm a bit loathe to trust you being cute and lost and trying to outsource reads after our last game.

[the worst]

try and put your reads forward rather than asking people to ask you for your reads

hopkirk just referenced your townreads which is making me sweat, do I need to read back?

[the worst]

oh
jeez
I'm not even reading this game and I have like 8 townleans/reads

who are the people between your townreads and null pile?

[the worst]

yeah I kinda.. didnt register that part of 811
I think I was subconsciously waiting for him to continue and ended up just closing the plot point in my brain

[the worst]

who are the people between your townreads and null pile?

everyone i didn't mention

{Xtoxm, ABR, Hopkirk, Ythan, the worst, Dannflor, JacksonVirgo, Almost50}

why are xtoxm, ABR, JV and I above rand?
why are hopkirk and dannflor not townreads?

[the worst]

oh yeah A50 is a better read to explain than ABR I guess

[the worst]

@IV- if it helps you with your estimate of how good my scumplay is i'm currently sitting on a 3 year & 25-30 game townstreak (including offsite stuff). It's an amazing feeling because I like being town. Any scum meta is very much out of date because I didn't even joke around back then. That only really started when Hectic joined the site. I was kind of a tryhard back then which is ironic because i was worse at mafia too... i do play a lot of irl mafia though (currently online but similar concept)

did you ask your team anything about me? i've mentioned that around gypyx recently.

this is good to know because until last team mafia I did not have you pegged as a jokey player. my most vivid memory of you is from a large back when I was a newbie and that tends to set the metric for how I read you :p

[the worst]

VOTE: Titus

this is gonna be a super wild question given I'm never going to read your long post in full but why did you wait until after you'd posted it to vote Titus? lol

[the worst]

He's on a team who would be able to make a post like that

Remember when we used to have to actually read what people said? Nowadays I just can just pick out alignment based on timing/delivery of posts

It's great

... hold on did you go back in time to personally attack me?

[the worst]

@ythan which wagon - agar?

[the worst]

you decided Titus was scum and posted a lengthy indignant argument to that effect but forgot to vote her?

[the worst]

you decided Titus was scum and posted a lengthy indignant argument to that effect but forgot to vote her?

I have been looking at this game for the better part of the last 4 hours, first reading from my last post forward, then an iso dive, then realizing I had no grasp on this game and re-reading from the very beginning because I needed a reset. Yes, I forgot to actually place the vote in the post, because my brain is mashed potatoes at this point. Would love to see your spin on this. Keely has chimed in that he thinks it's baffling you're making a big deal out of such a nothingburger.

vote me in 3 hours then, it stuck out like a sore thumb to me

[the worst]

I want bothered by the missing titus vote at all - why is it scummy and not just a mistake anyone could make?

in the spur of the moment it seemed to jar with his decisiveness about Titus being scum (like, to me if I'm sitting there spurting out why someone is scum it's very intuitive for me to vote them)

I don't really know if it's a tell it just makes me pause on the legitimacy of the case

honestly I really don't want to read AGar's post but this seems to be the fashionable wagon and I don't remember any of titus' posts so yeet

VOTE: Titus

[the worst]

I’m working but I’ve decided to change my mindset about this game, had a lot of personal and mental issues that overtook my mind so I’m going to re-catch up and try to focus hard, always an issue for me but I’m gonna give it a shot since this is a serious game more than usual.

Fwiw prior to re-catching up I think scum are Flake/Hercule. I’ll try and read back on interactions with Flake again and see if the slimy behaviour from Hercule is NAI.

I'd be like super interested in this when you get the time - glad you're feeling better.

[the worst]

I'm on the fence about how much to say but my team are like assertively undecided on AGar but I don't think I really have an opportunity to advance my read on him atp

[the worst]

it's been a while since we played together but yeeeeeah we go way back dude

[the worst]

played together regularly* that is

I'll never forget the heroic flashwagon in that nsg game lmao

[the worst]

it's been a while since we played together but yeeeeeah we go way back dude

so uh has this guy been transparently town?

idk I haven't seen many of his posts - show me what you're seeing?

[the worst]

lol

that's a very A50 thing to do

[the worst]

this is pretty armchair but I'd consider A50 a player who necessarily plays to an agenda (whether it's pushing his current read, having a fun time, being a scumbutt, etc.) - I pretty regularly find his earlygames very cognitively dense and difficult to parse for alignment but find he's easier to work with and easier to read closer to endgame.

I think there's a way to like tone? meta read him but that is viciously unfun

I have not been struck alignment-wise by any of his posts and I honestly don't think anyone on my team has either, he's dead null and that's not something I feel particularly stressed about.

[the worst]

I think it's probably technically positive but I kind of want to remain translucent on the issue for now. he's probably the most hotly contested read we have atm, for the most part we seem to agree on townreads.

[the worst]

I think letting the thread naturally decide it's course instead of enforcing a gamestate would be both healthy for it's players

But reading it later down the line

This is an error, I meant (And reading it down the line)

basically yeah

[the worst]

I'm confused as to why Peta is scumreading me @Hercule

Duck, read my ISO real quick. You'll figure out within maybe half of it that it's entirely nuts that JV is tossing this zero effort SR on me. The plus is you'll also figure out I'm town so, ye.

I don't really vibe JV's push on you but I don't think they've been like, idk the word exactly, kind of unfocused this game? it makes me outright not townread JV and kind of sympathetically nulltownish towards you but I don't have a confident read on either of you yet.

[the worst]

your posts are very attentive

this is a good take.

winflake's posts are either badass enough that they're coming from a pure mindset, or he's decided to intentionally ramp up his badassery for this game and I don't think I've seen anything that makes me strongly lean one way or the other.

[the worst]

look at me refusing to toneread people, you go duck

[the worst]

Although Duck I lowkey get the feeling you aren't really scumhunting at the moment. What gives?

where do you draw the distinction between "not present" and "not scumhunting", my dear hatless friend?

[the worst]

my greatest regret is not asking Mathdino for his secret A50 tell hacks

[the worst]

?

where did i say that

[the worst]

oh that was @unwnd

you didn't really answer my question about where you draw the distinction. I'm also not really sure what you expect to get out of me by asking me to guess why you feel a certain way about me.

what do you want from this exchange?

[the worst]

I want to figure out if you're just not high effort right now or if there's more to it. Feels like you're going through the motions atm.

not high effort + yes definitely going through the motions

[the worst]

A) He forgot how to read me early on, B) He's trying to keep me alive longer, C) He's outright scum and wants to keep his options wide open.

did you read my assessment of my ability to read you?

[the worst]

Flakes is more of a more blatantly aggressive scum such as Koba

I think I agree with him as like, assertive scum (different from Koba because There Is Only One Koba), but I find him prickly when mistreated as town and think I probably associate this attitude more with prickliness than assertiveness

[the worst]

Hint: You are wrong.

am I? I felt like that was quite a good assessment.

[the worst]

Worst you're third-wheeling this argument

Does above feel like town prickliness?

last few hours have felt more like town!uncrowned by like, a very slight margin, yeah.

I'm not going to gamble the game on this because it's pretty tonal, and I don't think he's really being pushed over things that are going to make him post AI content? I almost feel like unc spews his own alignment before too long if you just leave him to do his thing

[the worst]

also that argument was boring and this is an 18-wheel game, I'll make no apologies for butting in

[the worst]

*finger-gun*

[the worst]

I think your comment about me wanting you alive later in the game is pretty astute. I used to focus a lot more on like, gamestate manipulation and stuff, so I wasn't really thinking about it, but yeah you're someone I'd be happy to play the later game with.

[the worst]

Oka what are your hottest take reads rn?

[the worst]

I'd contest that isn't a read but I kinda agree a lot of the more vocal disagreements don't feel particularly manipulative (agar/Titus feels like it has the strongest chance of red atm)

how about like actual player reads? townreads can be hot too

[the worst]

respectfully, "does sorting by postcount work on this game" isn't a great tunnel to get lost in on day one of a large. or at any point in a large really

[the worst]

I'd contest that isn't a read but I kinda agree a lot of the more vocal disagreements don't feel particularly manipulative (agar/Titus feels like it has the strongest chance of red atm)

how about like actual player reads? townreads can be hot too

idk if i have any hottake reads because i suspect most the playerlist might have at most 5 ish reads that aren't outside the bounds of null and there is nowhere near enough consensus

maybe something random like ceph could be scum

so I'm back & forth on ceph but someone in my team super heavily townreads him. he's also posting a tonne better than he did in a marathon game I was in with him when he was scum - but I also have a fair bit of respect for his like gamestate comprehension & ability to post confidently so I'm biting my tongue a bit there.

who are the 5 outside null reads as you see them? who should we be reconsidering or bumping up/down outside of there?

[the worst]

Worst all your takes are very agreeable and that concerns me a brief amount

Because I think that agreeableness is almost becoming flattery on your behalf

I just don't see many edges

showing my edges takes a social capital investment which I don't really have the energy for atm - agreeableness is my default way of being. you'll get used to it.

do you have a non-tonal read on my content?

[the worst]

I feel like you're keen for this game to get spicier and you're a spicy chicken so it seemed like an appropriate place to start.

could you fill me in on the Ceph scumlean?

[the worst]

Tonal is almost never the way I will fully read someone. Edges can be applied in the way people wheel and deal with information. So far most of what you say is just not very daring, and I think even the most sensible town know they have to be daring sometimes.

I resent sensibility with every fibre of my being!!!

do I need to be daring atm?

pedit: that's fine, that does make more sense. I do feel like I'm stepping into the middle of a lot of lukewarm conversations in this game.

[the worst]

I have a sinking feeling this conversation has you push me towards explaining my behaviour in a meta context. I'm not very interested in self-meta but if it helps your brain I'm happy to oblige.

[the worst]

I do think Ceph adopts a persona in games to some extent ya
do you feel anything further than that or just that he's performative?

[the worst]

Yeah I'd love to see a bit more daring from you tbh.

I know you're aware that most lims don't go through unless you convince people, so I have to wonder if what's been presented is simply not what you'd personally want to lim

pretty much - I feel like we're going through the motions atm. earlygames larges are a tiring amount of people to engage at once, and I'm still very much working through my reads.

This convo may talk around the difference between pushing wagons & pushing through a lim. I've actually enjoyed the wagons so far, but I don't think I want any of them dead so I've been more interested in observing than putting my weight behind them.

the day is young

[the worst]

dont really think its anything beyond that at this point

you really like the word performative dont u

it's very under-appreciated

[the worst]

I wouldn't call you an unhappy vibe person Ceph.
Incidentally I'm sometimes confused about how happy I'm perceived as. people are weird.

this is indeed tangential

[the worst]

Oka the warthog is smiling

[the worst]

how are you not seeing this?

[the worst]

have you ever zoomed in on my classic duckling avatar? its eyes are terrifying.

anyway this tangent is way off the rails. I think your Ceph scumlean is definitely a hot take but also not very exciting. :C

do you have any juicy townreads to share?

[the worst]

why do you expect me to townread you then?

[the worst]

ugh I keep looking at Ceph's avatar and now it looks kind of bashful/flirtatious. the world is breaking.

[the worst]

I hate anime girls, no offense xtoxm

looking good Ceph <3

[the worst]

I heard breadcrumbs increase prosperity level if that helps convince you ~~~

what's your read on me, Mr. Oxm?

[the worst]

town

[the worst]

So you're seeing what I'm seeing, yet you decided to town-read them instead? Why

skipped earlier prompt because I figured you'd find this post

I think LAMIST posting is very slightly more likely to come from town at rand given current site culture where everyone seems to get excited about town role pms and curl up in the corner if they rand scum

it's only really a scum indicator in a broad context

so I'm willing to treat it as a superficial towntell on page one and revisit later in the game, yeah. I'm already getting cold on Hercule. Like there is literally no harm in me expressing a superficial read which I only give half a crap about in a really goofy way to try and get the game moving.

[the worst]

I get what you're saying but I don't see why that makes either of Uncrowned or Hercule more likely to be mafia than town. Maybe I'm solving top down, rather than bottom up

[the worst]

I am once again disagreeing vehemently with an unwnd post. (Source: 918)

and?

As I've said, I am completely fine with lamist behavior, it's when it tilts into blatant manipulation when it turns into something I despise.

what about his posting makes you think it's blatantly manipulative rather than just run-of-the-mill self signalling? I actually think he's guilty of worse LAMIST posting than what you've quoted and I still don't think it makes him scum

[the worst]

I heard breadcrumbs increase prosperity level if that helps convince you ~~~

what's your read on me, Mr. Oxm?

i dont have a read on you.
i have very little actual experience with you (ie being town) and the only time i was i got you wrong. i think knew somewhere in my heart you were scum but i let you pocket me (to a degree).
what ive seen from you so far is giving me little in either direction and i feel like im going to need to at least a cycle to begin getting a solid grasp on you.
my perception of your scumrange, and my determination to get you right this time, are combining to make me mentally reluctant to do anything with you.

you got anything on me?

I agree you kinda had me that time and I was very pleased when the opportunity to kill you arose

Basically vice versa tbh. I don't think you're being flashy and I think stuff like this reads earnest but I don't think either of those things are range-breaking for you.

[the worst]

I'm on the fence about how much to say but my team are like assertively undecided on AGar but I don't think I really have an opportunity to advance my read on him atp

i prefer this to forgetting about it. i don't wanna be like, party's moving to the next house let's forget this ever happened, but that seems to be where the thread is headed.

I still think that everybody jumping on them was preemptive/based on what is nai for him

And we haven't moved on from that

They had a good post, the vote thing is nitpicking, saying his team could make that post is true but there's no evidence for it, and the original argument wasn't convincing to me

this is quite good

[the worst]

jackson, your case on hercule feels a bit tunnel-y

reminds me of myself

they're pretty capable of pushing nonsense as scum (i mean this as a compliment) so I'm kind of pausing on this

[the worst]

Is it just me or is Agar being performative this game

I'll go reread my discord before I talk about Ceph but

[the worst]

you know, it's probably not a bad idea to take LAMIST as a scumtell for site meta health because we keep getting deepwolfed and our games are exhausting, we could just make everyone cut it out LOL

as a good member of the townsfolk I like this idea

[the worst]

I still think AGar is net towny

I struggle to see how anyone could feel Agar was townie without an informed perspective. The only things he's done so far are over react to my voye on him and OMGUS Cephrir.

have you been reading his posts?

[the worst]

I'd contest that isn't a read but I kinda agree a lot of the more vocal disagreements don't feel particularly manipulative (agar/Titus feels like it has the strongest chance of red atm)

how about like actual player reads? townreads can be hot too

Why does me v agar have the strongest chance of a red flip? If so, why did you wait for a wagon to vote me given your TR of Agar?

reducing my read on agar to "tr" is dangerous - you were closer on the last page, I'm perpetuating an argument between two : shrug:-factors in the hope I feel better about one of you.

I'm finding reasons I could townread AGar and not reasons why I could townread you, so my vote falls this way ezpz

also the two of you are weirdly mutually confident about the other being scum which is like, a weak agenda tell

[the worst]

TOWN

DrippingGoofball
unwnd
OkaPoka
hercule
Titus
Cephrir
WinterFlakes/Uncrowned

NULL

Dannflor
Almost50
innocentvillager
Albert B. Rampage
the worst
AGar
Hopkirk

SCUM

Xtoxm
JacksonVirgo
Ythan

YEET BAIT TOWN

Dunnstral

referring to dunn as yeetbait in this game made me nearly laugh

do you think this game is largely run by town & scum are severely struggling to get a foothold?

[the worst]

also the two of you are weirdly mutually confident about the other being scum which is like, a weak agenda tell

Do you mean scum agenda? Spit it out!

yeah!

[the worst]

DGB's posting is still scum.

case in point, balance of this post (above what i've quoted) continued to talk as tho he's absolutely unflinchingly correct, which is scum deflecting and hoping to slip back under the radar or town who just feels correct and it's fairly difficult to parse given titus isn't readable rn and we don't have any flips etc.

more immediately, agar - what is DGB doing as scum?

[the worst]

I'm not infallible

hard disagree

i'm tempted to just townbin A50 for being confident that like 4 different people can townread him. can anyone convince me this is a bad idea?

i mean i'm d1 passing him for it, so i have a mixed feeling about how bad the idea is.

personally i'd regard A50 as aware enough of his own playstyle to do in-character-zany things as scum. so when i think about clearing him, i get kind of anxious. but i do think it's more likely to come from town!A50 in a vacuum given the fact he would also consider himself to have endgame scum equity in this kind of playerlist so i'd probably consider drawing a tonne of attention to himself on d1 would be a kind of counterintuitive strat?

i think i think he's more likely town than i did before i started typing this post fuck yeah

[the worst]

i unironically have ceph has town now

ditto

@dannflor (i'm at my pc now so can have discord open) lilith has ceph town. she originally was vexed 395 didn't include a vote but really liked his later trajectory on IV and thought that the timing of the actual vote felt natural. 395, 399, 421, 499, 502 feel (duck-words) like a person trying to parse a thing and i think lilith generally just felt strongly similar to ceph's takes. she strongly scumread IV at the time but probably agrees with me at this point that he's more likely town (she's anxious about his cutesie/clueless approach to the game because he's proven able to emulate it as scum, but i do think he's pushing himself with reads in a way which he'd struggle with as scum - this is an epic tangent).

while i'm going back i made a note that https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12522178 <== this was either co-written or outside of IV's scumrange, and probably not cowritten because it missed dancefloor

i'm not really sure how i'd describe my townlean on ceph. i just think he's taking a solving approach to this game and i kinda believe his reactions/thought processes. he's probably a less prickly version of why i'm leaning town on you (this is still @dann)

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[instagram][/instagram]

dgb is definitely faking reads

dgb is overly confident on reads as town from my experience, but usually will casework it a bit

im just hoping one of the people with decades of experience with em will explain everything so later

dgb is my laziest townread because i think its wild reads read like its wild reads as town and they read like, funny. i don't know. they feel unnatural but not strikingly agenda-driven. they feel unnaturally real. there you go. if it's scum it's probably the deepwolf (or maybe like, hercule in a bad scenario, or uncrowned in the worst case scenario) - otherwise i don't fully get what it's going for

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I now have 4 solid TRs, 2 Town leans and one null-town

i am excited you're townreading xtoxm, and i will bite
who?

man this amount of mindmeld with hopkirk is concerning stuff

it made me feel better about you until you called attention to it

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you watching me agonize over whether you were being serious or not and saying NOTHING you absolute menace!!! i can't with u rn lmaoo

i know for a fact i am going to start applying this tone to actual hercule poirot and i am not even upset about that

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thats a lot of work to say you dont have a read on me guys

your posting is pretty uninspiring

me being on your "never eliminate pile" is solely due to that post I made? why do you townread that one so much?

you're on mine purely because of the way your left ear hangs lower than your right ear


i guess i'm caught up now!

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did you ever share your progression on xtoxm? i don't really think they're that towny

Spoiler: xtoxm progression

:shrug: =>
:shrug: =>
:shrug: =>
:shrug: =>
:shrug:

nth dunn town

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lol

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ABR why do you want me wagoned?

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If it quacks like a duck, it's going to taste like a duck.

this is likely a good read to elaborate on, because i think a lot of people are struggling to form a read on me and you're (for the most part) a lurksack this game

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lilith is the one with the read on me? Interesting...how about Datisi lol

he hasn't weighed in about you for a minute (not since lilith & i arguing about your alignment/meta from our last game)

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TW what's the rundown on Titus

also Ythan was v town to me early but I completely forgot about them since like page 8 which is probably a bad thing? Idk.

titus is posting nonstarter mechanical/unsolvable pre-flip vca reads which aren't really possible to engage with productively or read into

the nonstarter wagon on her is making me a bit sweaty though because her reads feel unnaturally confident for d1 which makes me think she wants to look towny

gonna be level with you i don't think scum look scummy this game. i just doubt they look towny. titus is a fine candidate.

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receipts?

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again multitasking which is why this took so long

Hopkirk is close to a townread but he is not at the level of unwnd or hercule for me. i get the feeling he's just a good player which makes me paranoid of his scumrange. honestly my eyes glaze over his posting (potentially not ideal) but the vibe I get is that it looks like he's being helpful and engaging everyone in an effort to understand what's going on. if he's establishing himself to push an agenda i have a feeling we'll see it later but im very okay having this slot around for now.

JacksonVirgo - mostly a tonal read. i don't love 526 or 533 but the posts i thought were +town are: 534, 597, 598, 599, 647, 648. it's hard to explain it beyond just being openly frustrated and utterly not giving a shit about his thread perception which i have found in practice (in my anecdotal experience) to be a towntell for him.

A50 - this is like exactly the same as A50 in this one towngame we played and not at all how he played in this scumgame we did (granted he replaced in, which is different). there are moments like 112, 116, 619, 622 that ring eerily similar. "but it's just A50's playstyle!" you might say. okay sure maybe, that's why he's one of my weaker townleans i guess. also 737 is a really weird thing to post as scum but i obliged him since someone on my team thinks he can read him ok.

Xtoxm - unprompted and unpostury/interesting notes from Auro are good, i liked 642 for example. don't see an agenda from this slot, not postury, takes are pretty reasonable. other people townreading them too despite lack of content quantity which feels good. weaker townlean probably

TW - ill likely be revisiting this a lot bc im paranoid. here's the reasoning i gave earlier

rn it's leantown i think with the engagement and with the hinting on Datisi scumreading me so early (inside thing where town!Datisi has tunneled early town!me for two games in a row, i like that Datisi gave the read and the worst mentioned it unprompted). his entrance felt forced but on reread it's not bad. could be some confbiasing going on there so im conflicted, idk, im gonna just like worsty be a slow burn read for me.

and i think with your recent interaction with me im townreading you even more. i think your disengagement from this game is fine in the context of being busy and maybe even +town in a vacuum. also i think it's easy for scum!you to try and pocket me and you've done everything but engage with me and pocket me.

I'm ok adding IV to my townblock

i dont think that's how townblocks work

iv is voting you

Haven't got there yet, but I'm ok with putting him in my never eliminate pile.

xtox my guy how did you get that from this

she was calling IV absolutely town (this is a near universal read atp), was called out for using "townblock" language when IV was voting her, then said it was ok he was voting her

all i'm seeing is a really safe townread on IV? oka's callout was kinda unproductive but how is her response towny?

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scum a typically reluctant to hard tr a slot thats going for them
auro also feels titus recent content is towny

"going for them"? iv has the assertion of a damp napkin. what scum is afraid of townreading him?

can auro expand on that please?

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sorry iv no offense ilu

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they're the same thing, i assumed "never elim" was a language clarification since they didn't mutually townread each other :/

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scum a typically reluctant to hard tr a slot thats going for them
auro also feels titus recent content is towny

"going for them"? iv has the assertion of a damp napkin. what scum is afraid of townreading him?

can auro expand on that please?

we havent discussed this specific interaction. its my own interpretation. auro said we liked her content on p44 a good amount. i'll see if he expands.

i'm only after your read on that interaction, i don't need your team's.

what scum is afraid of townreading IV here? what scum is afraid of doubling down on a townread on a widely townread, unharmful slot here?
more importantly: if you're talking about some scum who is nervous because they're under pressure and going to make conventional plays on what planet is titus that scum?

i don't understand how you've seen this post and made the connection that it's coming from a town mindset? frankly at all, but especially not for the reasons you're suggesting?

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gonna be level with you i don't think scum look scummy this game. i just doubt they look towny.

id love to hear more about this hypothesis. and why is "this game" different from a normal game?

quality of the playerlist and the fact I don't feel particularly good about any scumreads.

obviously scum players always play to be townread, and a lot of the game can be won by checking whether things people are doing are conventionally towny (they think they'll be townread for it) or actually legitimately towny (more sincere / the person may not realise what they're doing is towny sometimes).

nobody is like..failing that objective. I think everyone here feels entitled to be townread to some extent?

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im not sure how i feel about you flipping on me so easily, was my scumgame in 2160 really that devoid of reads/analysis? (lmao if that's what you thought it was that's fine)

you had reads but you outsourced any nuance/read depth and I feel like your thoughts here are actually your own, not recycled. Lilith is a bit more anxious that I just suck at reading you (maybe she's right!) but you feel different here.

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to be clear when you say scum!me would be "struggling to play this way", yes I believe you're totally on point with that but I also think scum!me will struggle, which is what you saw in 2160, which is why I'm wondering why you're evaluating my slot this way. sorry im not very eloquent

also i am almost entirely playing this game by myself aorn, Sirius and Ico are definitely not following my game and ive only been asking Gypyx to help me make the occasional ISO.

I don't need to pocket you so I don't need a reason you'll believe. I think I have a better metric for reading modern-IV than I did in 2160. by old meta you were easy because you clearly didn't care much for scumming.

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Hmm IV is causing me to waver in my Ythan scumread. I see what IV is,seeing. I have to think about this.

what's your experience with ythan? I see what IV is seeing too but given my impression of Ythan's personality I'd be pretty surprised if he didn't feel relaxed as scum

that's not even to say I particularly scumread him, I actually kind of also think he reads town but I'm sweatin

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VOTE: Hopkirk

You guys don't know it yet, but this has been scum all along

but that's my fav townread >:

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That bout of rage reeks of rabid scum.

reeeeeks

It reeks of rabid, not sure if scum

max of 1 scum in hopkirk/unwnd

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The read is absolutely true though, I just wasn't satisfied naked voting though

this makes a lot of sense - I don't feel like pushing Hopkirk is like a sensible thing for you to just randomly decide to do as scum there but your reasoning didn't feel like it was explained in a congruent/sense-making way.

We have time and I don't think anyone feels super urgent about sorting Hopkirk. Drop your case when you can - worst case scenario he's sorted later in the game when it's more pressing.

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We can discuss whether the anger came from a scum place or a town place until sundown without coming to an agreement.

But to me, it sounds pretty scummy because it's missing all the townie soundbites that I would have vomited all over the disagreement.

what would you expect from a townie in Hopkirk's shoes that was missing? we're probably looking for something fairly intangible but I'd be interested in getting some of your brain thoughts.

given I don't really think unwnd was pushing anything that would make scum!Kirk sweat I'm kind of surprised he got so angry about it. if I were scum and someone pushed me so ineffectively at that point I would be throwing a party in the scum pt.

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i was townreading unwnd until today and i'm voting them without necessarily scumreading them right now. i want to review that slot. i'm very concerned with their team as much as i am with the slot right now.

what about their team dynamic actually concerns you?

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okay so let's form the read unwnd committee

dunnstral, titus, innocent villager are the members of this committee

if you let me in I'll reveal my fairly strong unwnd read

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Yeah my townlist looks like

Ceph
ABR
Oka
Hercule
(A50)

the only one here that makes my gut sink is ABR - why?

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also duck... ive noticed you have decided to skip over the attempted formation of a townbloc in your catchup

what are thy thoughts

I wasn't paying much attention to it other than the hopkirk/unwnd lols - who else was in it?

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VOTE: xtoxm unspicy vote for a spicy reason

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Yeah, Hopkirk is scum a fair while before unwnd. That team dynamic blonde moment is an explicit town indicator and I am a touch nervous about the way Hopkirk defaulted to how it looked bad, rather than try to parse the mindset alignment it came from.

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also duck... ive noticed you have decided to skip over the attempted formation of a townbloc in your catchup

what are thy thoughts

I wasn't paying much attention to it other than the hopkirk/unwnd lols - who else was in it?

me hercule hopkirk unwnd ceph

This is like, the core of players I'm giving a D1 pass but not my towncore, lol, it's fine though. unwnd is one of my absurdly strong townreads.

I feel like the gimmick of towncores is that they're super cute when they're formed but everyone forgets about them when actual important mechanical information happens and on that basis I think this is pretty allowable, please add IV and consider DGB

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I had to google that and I threw up in my mouth a little (in the good way)

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that is the opposite of the game we are playing but you do you dude

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PRICKS of echo bay grits, MoI of the thing mafia, etc.
a tried and failed tradition as old as time itself.
if time were like 4 years old

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actually I'm being facetious, townblocks are really powerful in micros and in games with bad scum

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duck
IV, dgb, unwnd
Dunnstral (I like him but I'm sheeping)
Oka, Cephrir, Hercule
Dannflor, Flakes, A50, Ythan
Titus, AGar, Hopkirk
JacksonVirgo, ABR
Xtoxm

I'm probably wrong on someone in the 4p core, they're my adorable weak town tonereads

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I guess we could policy lim Oka for high treason.... Just kidding haha.... unless

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so I think the Hopkirk shitpush is a town misplay. the net result is that it pulls credibility from unwnd's actual push on Hopkirk and allows Hopz a powerful rebuttal because the actual case on him was incoherent. The "my team thinks" mistype is something that feels like it comes from a pretty natural mindset - "some members of my team think (and the rest are sheeping)" would have been a more accurate phrasing but it doesn't actually lend credibility to the rhetorical power of the fact unwnd has support for his scum!Kirk read; it's just a sloppy misspeak which allows Hop an easy rebuttal.

unwnd is capable of high effort as scum. they're capable of acting lazy as scum. they're capable of trying to sound natural as scum. I find it a hard to believe that they've constructed a shitty case on Hopkirk and then actually successfully hit send without realising that what they're trying to say makes literally no sense - there's also an utterly unapologetic mindset behind the error that makes me very strongly think it's a real thought.

This is like my second strongest impression behind the IV post which I think broke scumrange

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it was a townslip in a really non-slippy non-engineered way, the mindset just feels earnestly dopey in a way which I absolutely buy unwnd (a categorically undopey player) being dopey

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okay but imagination of a future game aside

I feel like you'd be a blast to play secret hitler with <:

worst

i haven't played with you in a while tbh

you feel like you drawing in extra scumreads this game or nah

hmm does anyone other than Titus have an actual read on me? I think ABR is posturing and he's the only other one who's claimed to

unwnd said they were looking at me which I await with bated breath :3

we definitely haven't played together for a while. I don't play much anymore and try to allocate my mafia energy a bit more efficiently.


pedit: basically exactly. a D1 wagon on Titus is generally not very helpful for finding scum!Titus but my god do people read fascinating stuff into her posts. pressure on Xtoxm here is worth its weight in gold.

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who's on Xtoxm? you, me, dgb, Dunn or am I missing someone?

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Ty implo

I mean I love that wagon to the point I don't feel remotely stressed about the shitty vc

@oka yeah I used to care a lot more about being townread D1 but that isn't my wincon

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Lilith largely vibes my reads but would put agar on his own island at the bottom of the read list but it's also largely just because of a real bad vibe and not something she can explain

UH WUT

she found herself nodding along to dgb's case in this post with great enthusiasm though

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I agree with that. I still think unwnd is displaying a nonguilty/pure mindset that is pretty hard as scum.

pedit: rude. your face is unimpressive

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JV gets scumread a lot when he's town and this game hasn't moved past that point yet, so I don't suspect him (this is a null read)

This is a quality take that I hadn't really thought about. JV uses they/them btw.

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I still think unwnd is displaying a nonguilty/pure mindset that is pretty hard as scum.

I think reads like this are bending over backwards to describe a tone read

I don't it would be particularly difficult for unwnd to be playing scum like this

this makes me think you're calling me unimpressive while glazing over my posts. honestly that doesn't surprise me in this game though.

There's a distinct difference between analysing mindset and tone-reading.

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Given the balance of his strategy has been a sheer wall of effort I find it pretty hard to believe that unwnd finds it intuitive to make a super shitty push against a mildly townread player who is also tryharding the game and then falling on his ass in the middle of it is an effective way to get townread - that's like a direct contradiction to unwnd's playstyle afaict?

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like it's such a wild version of reality where that series of posts is fabricated. it's also just an insanely believable slip-up.

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a D1 wagon on Titus is generally not very helpful for finding scum!Titus but my god do people read fascinating stuff into her posts.

Then why vote me at all?

of everyone on this plist I think you are the most capable of working that out

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because I don't have a confident read on either you or AGar, and we'd already pushed AGar - he just kept posting. he's playing to an agenda, but I don't know what the agenda is, so there's huge value in playing along with it and seeing what happens if we push you.

you're also a very polarising player so it's interesting to see how people react to pushing you for fairly meh reasons.

I remember dropping a note in my team's discord that my vote on you felt like something I'd do as scum and that was regarded as generally amusing but it wasn't a joke. lol.

anyway by way of progression I don't really feel like I'm any closer to sorting you or agar but I could see you as town here. I also think xtoxm's read on you was patently fabricated and I'm curious why he felt the need to post it. If he flips red I have some opinions but obviously pre-flip they're kinda just posturing.

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Spoiler: for titus' convenience

i tr titus tring iv for sring her

receipts?

1079

again multitasking which is why this took so long

Hopkirk is close to a townread but he is not at the level of unwnd or hercule for me. i get the feeling he's just a good player which makes me paranoid of his scumrange. honestly my eyes glaze over his posting (potentially not ideal) but the vibe I get is that it looks like he's being helpful and engaging everyone in an effort to understand what's going on. if he's establishing himself to push an agenda i have a feeling we'll see it later but im very okay having this slot around for now.

JacksonVirgo - mostly a tonal read. i don't love 526 or 533 but the posts i thought were +town are: 534, 597, 598, 599, 647, 648. it's hard to explain it beyond just being openly frustrated and utterly not giving a shit about his thread perception which i have found in practice (in my anecdotal experience) to be a towntell for him.

A50 - this is like exactly the same as A50 in this one towngame we played and not at all how he played in this scumgame we did (granted he replaced in, which is different). there are moments like 112, 116, 619, 622 that ring eerily similar. "but it's just A50's playstyle!" you might say. okay sure maybe, that's why he's one of my weaker townleans i guess. also 737 is a really weird thing to post as scum but i obliged him since someone on my team thinks he can read him ok.

Xtoxm - unprompted and unpostury/interesting notes from Auro are good, i liked 642 for example. don't see an agenda from this slot, not postury, takes are pretty reasonable. other people townreading them too despite lack of content quantity which feels good. weaker townlean probably

TW - ill likely be revisiting this a lot bc im paranoid. here's the reasoning i gave earlier

rn it's leantown i think with the engagement and with the hinting on Datisi scumreading me so early (inside thing where town!Datisi has tunneled early town!me for two games in a row, i like that Datisi gave the read and the worst mentioned it unprompted). his entrance felt forced but on reread it's not bad. could be some confbiasing going on there so im conflicted, idk, im gonna just like worsty be a slow burn read for me.

and i think with your recent interaction with me im townreading you even more. i think your disengagement from this game is fine in the context of being busy and maybe even +town in a vacuum. also i think it's easy for scum!you to try and pocket me and you've done everything but engage with me and pocket me.

I'm ok adding IV to my townblock

i dont think that's how townblocks work

iv is voting you

Haven't got there yet, but I'm ok with putting him in my never eliminate pile.

xtox my guy how did you get that from this

she was calling IV absolutely town (this is a near universal read atp), was called out for using "townblock" language when IV was voting her, then said it was ok he was voting her

all i'm seeing is a really safe townread on IV? oka's callout was kinda unproductive but how is her response towny?

scum a typically reluctant to hard tr a slot thats going for them
auro also feels titus recent content is towny

yeah
but she stuck to it and strengthened with the new information

how would it look if you decided to flip on your newfound townread solely because they voted you

i think it would have been really easy to just not make a comment there, or leave it at 'i havent got there yet'

scum a typically reluctant to hard tr a slot thats going for them
auro also feels titus recent content is towny

"going for them"? iv has the assertion of a damp napkin. what scum is afraid of townreading him?

can auro expand on that please?

i think it would have been really easy to just not make a comment there, or leave it at 'i havent got there yet'

basically what she did no?

sorry iv no offense ilu

like never eliminate pile is a not an upgrade from town block

ive never heard of a someone offering their own town block to the chopping block

scum a typically reluctant to hard tr a slot thats going for them
auro also feels titus recent content is towny

"going for them"? iv has the assertion of a damp napkin. what scum is afraid of townreading him?

can auro expand on that please?

we havent discussed this specific interaction. its my own interpretation. auro said we liked her content on p44 a good amount. i'll see if he expands.

i think it would have been really easy to just not make a comment there, or leave it at 'i havent got there yet'

basically what she did no?

no

they're the same thing, i assumed "never elim" was a language clarification since they didn't mutually townread each other :/

VOTE: xtoxm

scum a typically reluctant to hard tr a slot thats going for them
auro also feels titus recent content is towny

"going for them"? iv has the assertion of a damp napkin. what scum is afraid of townreading him?

can auro expand on that please?

we havent discussed this specific interaction. its my own interpretation. auro said we liked her content on p44 a good amount. i'll see if he expands.

i'm only after your read on that interaction, i don't need your team's.

what scum is afraid of townreading IV here? what scum is afraid of doubling down on a townread on a widely townread, unharmful slot here?
more importantly: if you're talking about some scum who is nervous because they're under pressure and going to make conventional plays on what planet is titus that scum?

i don't understand how you've seen this post and made the connection that it's coming from a town mindset? frankly at all, but especially not for the reasons you're suggesting?

scum a typically reluctant to hard tr a slot thats going for them
auro also feels titus recent content is towny

"going for them"? iv has the assertion of a damp napkin. what scum is afraid of townreading him?

can auro expand on that please?

hahahaha ilu too <3

it's accurate especially at this nebulous d1 stage where i don't have scumreads yet i don't take offense

i do agree that the "scum are afraid to hard TR someone 'pushing them'" seems like a bad take though, especially in the context you said where im getting more and more townread and am unconfidently sitting on the wagon. might be slightly +scum for Xtoxm

this is the convo

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He seemed to pull a lot of confidence out of one of your posts which felt (no offense) pretty understated and like a very late/safe read. Townreading you for townreading IV for scumreading you in that format is a really strange reduction of the IV/you interaction imo. It also felt like your post he's referencing was just you clarifying a choice of language when Oka got confused about townblocking?

His reasoning afterwards also feels really half baked and underconsidered given it was a pretty spicy read at that point. I get the impression he wants to position himself on the pro-Titus side of the gamestate, but not the impression that he has read your iso and come out with a coherent read that you are aligned with the town.

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I'm more concerned it's the only thing in his ISO

sure that's not great but it's fine for early D1 xtoxm; he gets spicier as the game gets spicier.

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I'm not concerned that it's literally incorrect, I'm concerned that I feel like he thinks he's making a safe read but can't explain it when actually asked. I think we're of similar minds there tho.

It's kinda like if someone asked me about my Dunnstral townread right. Like I'd be like "idfk lol he just seems towny". I think xtoxm trying to solve Titus and coming around to town there probably acknowledges that there's a level of like gut or something - why does he feel compelled to try and make himself look like he's trying hard to solve Titus?

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it all just feels

wait for it

are you ready? are you sitting down?

Spoiler:

PERFORMATIVE

like it's a read he wants to be seen to have but not a read he has

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why are you around so late?

anything you want from me? - what's your read on abr? it's stressing me out that I have literally no read on him

[the worst]

pst and am student so my body still thinks time is human construct

i have no idea what to think of abr, ive heard this guy is a super domineering personality but here we have idk... a lurker?

going by recent meta I think his reaction to new site meta is to just play really low-key unless he needs to but like. yeah. I don't think he's been stressed at all this game, I don't think he's really done anything AI, but he's showing up in town lists. I'm confused.

also fair, I seem to recall we used to share times online back in the day too. hope your sleep isn't too bad.

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why unvote me?

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Yeah my townlist looks like

Ceph
ABR
Oka
Hercule
(A50)

yeah you're right, unwnd's was the one that was eating the back of my brain.

[the worst]

I'm interested in the reset - I think it I can get a better read on you this game would get real interesting real quick.

pedit: unwnd, flakes, abr, Titus solve, gg

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I have the benefit of being pals with JV and know they're legitimately busy/side-tracked with other stuff at the moment. I am like, more inclined than usual to consider it a nulltell. they're also pretty good at scum

sorry I know "yo you should nullread X" is a pretty shitty take but at the very least I don't think that argument really cute the right way

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@a50 I think you know me well enough to hate cases, just let me inside your head. Wtf are you seeing with ABR? & Same for DGB I guess but I'm a bit less interested

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them

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you know I think out of all my shitty toneread list which probably has scum in it I think flakes is the towniest

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A50 pls don't ignore me. I see you ignoring me monkey pal. you're my fav distant species relative.

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Was my Hopkirk read daring? A bit. Was it poorly executed? A bit.

I was thinking over and I still don't regret what I was saying though. There is absolute truth there, just didn't place the right words. The post Dunn highlights about me saying 'I have a secret read' and thinking it's odd is kinda a spoiler itself. It was me saying 'well fuck, I am backloaded and if I don't say something about Hopkirk now it's gonna be lost.' Yes it's been in my PT but I won't go into semantics.

ah the secret read being hopkirk makes sense too

I mean that's how it read to me but I guess finding it jarring in a scummy way is valid. I found it jarring in a towny way! or something like that.

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@a50 I think you know me well enough to hate cases, just let me inside your head. Wtf are you seeing with ABR? & Same for DGB I guess but I'm a bit less interested

Feelings, nothing more than feelings

But seriously, you're asking about my TR on ABR and my SR on DGB and you're not concerned I'm SRing YOU??

not particularly no
I think dgb is dripping town, I'm kind of cruising

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I think dgb is dripping town, I'm kind of cruising

When was your last game with DGB? Cuz I think I played with her thrice in the past few months

first game ever, what extra knowledge does your meta wisdom impart?

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can we take a peak

I'm so fucking glad it wasn't just me

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@Oka: I can try to explain tw just for you. Look at whom he's been voting of late. Titus and Xtoxm?? And he TRs DGB??? And has been avoiding me and yet says

I

was avoiding him, when I literally included him in my very first post??

Before that he was voting JV, but is now objecting a FoS on JV. If he knew JV was busy IRL why did he vote him earlier??

Well, that's the most you're gonna get from me, and it had been done as a favour to you.

them*

I became aware of them being needed elsewhere after I originally voted there. The FoS is fine but their activity isn't a reliable reading factor.

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Ignore my TRs. Do you agree DGB this isn't Town!DGB who played in the most recent Baker's game or not?

i wasn't even in that game!

just go read it for us would you? tyia

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I kinda meant ignoring my responses while replying to other people on that page A50. I haven't seen you address posts to me other than the ones insisting I should have a read on you for some reason.

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I tend to like, say my spicy takes out loud in real time, so what are you looking for?

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ok this is a one sided dialogue unless you want self meta or an irl excuse

pedit: indeed, basically what oka said. I've...actually been pretty vocal about my strong reads? I just don't have many

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honestly I feel like I've been a fair bit less agreeable than normal? what have you the impression I was too agreeable in this game

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lol just noticed worst has JV as a top 3 scumread

like I said, I don't disagree with the read. I don't think their absence is a tell.

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I feel like this plist is kind of agreeable in general (ABR pops up once every few pages and says nothing and points in a direction and people aren't alarmed at that. lol) - forming townblocks is unlikely to end well.

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actually I should be more fair. there's a few fairly notable disputes (agar/Titus, hop/unwnd jump to mind) and other than those a lot of people feel kinda low energy.

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like I remember you pushing JV and like calling them scum to their face, but I don't really remember you trying to get others to join your cause?

why would I? I don't feel confident and other people are doing things I'm interested in too.

I was looking for something a little more than the reads list and more like... what is something you really want other people to get on board with

unwnd town
DGB town (I don't understand what y'all aren't seeing)
I think I caught IV town fairly quickly? but everyone kind of worked it out while I was asleep
Xtoxm should be top wagon

again I have been vocal about these things.

Okay, I mean it's also possible this impression I'm getting is a consequence of my own distance from the game. and maybe agreeable was the wrong word. sorry, maybe you're right about this being a one sided dialogue. I'll go back to reading you solo and I'll figure out where I come out and we can engage on that

I mean if you're trying to meta, just a reminder you've seen me play town in a large before. you've seen me scum in a large before, but not the earlygame. you were kinda inside my head in the last Team Mafia, too.

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The closest I've seen is your reaction to the Agar wagon but even then it felt like a weak defense.

why would I throw my weight against a wagon right at the start of D1 when I didn't have anyone I wanted cw'd? that's a patently terrible use of time