Warehouse 13: The Mafia Game (Game Over)

[Titus]

I have a question.

Anyone have any idea how we bronze scum? If artifacts are good to pass to town, then what's stopping scum from just bronzing whoever gets the artifact and we get screwed?

[Titus]

BM, how would you feel about being wagoned D1 yet again? LOL

VOTE: BM

[Titus]

Tammy has a point that scum likely already have a plan for who they want and don't want to get the artifact because they likely know what it does. Mathblade's opening assertion that we just give it to town feels a bit TMI ish. At the same time, I'm not sure if that's the correct assumption because we have no clue what it does.

If it was such a good artifact for town, why not just keep it or force it onto a less skilled player?

Scum might very well want a vocal active townie with the artifact due to its downside.

Let's suppose the artifact is a zonk (meaning it has no upside). Our obvtown spends a day passing to their biggest scumread. Scum then just lies about the artifact or can counteract its effects.

This feels like a zero sum game. I'm not really sure how to get this game moving without any threat to the scumteam at all.

[Titus]

Guys you had to read the instructions to give the confirmation phrase in order to confirm.

There can't be this many of you that just do not know how the mechanics work. It is not possible that I understand or believe I understand the mechanics better; we're not in that big an upside down world.

Some of you have to be faking it.

Confirmation phrase? Seriously, the mod didn't make me but I'll read tonight.

[Titus]

Ok. I realized my error and read deeper. I think that we should look at two phases with different leaders. People good at townblocking should lead at assigning artifacts. Those good at scumhunting should lead bronzing. These are separate people. I'd defer to Tammy on the artifact (assuming she's town) and LLD (same assumption) leading the afternoon phase. It's harder to scumhunt here without pressure.

Catching up.

[Titus]

I think Spiffeh town BM scum Prism null LLD scum lean Cakez is prob town but scum in a very minor circumstance so not considering it. If I am right then Titus is town by proxy.

This sounds like gibberish.

[Titus]

The townreads on Sangres feel weird

Agreed. It's too early to get a read there. They feel like reads because of the fact Nacho is in the hydra.

[Titus]

I think the leashing idea is really not smart.

The only thing it does is keep things vanilla and powerless.

I am telling you elim me if you have to the plan is stupid.

Let’s assume Townread X gives an artifact and gives it to scum Y. Scum Y tells the truth we learn nothing.

Let’s assume Scumread Y gives it to Townread X. Townread truth tells we learn nothing unless scum intentionally want to force a 1v1 between those two players.

Assume it’s town and town. We learn nothing.
And assume it’s scum and scum we learn nothing.

Some artifacts will be meant to be passed I think and some kept.

Outing the plan is stupid though.

Math is likely town. I have said this before and gotten burned, so take it with a grain of salt.

[Titus]

Not sure what to think about Prism yet

MathBlade has been transparently town to me from jump and I'm not thrilled with there already seeming to be somewhat of a consensus scum read there

He's clearly not the most charismatic player itg (no offense!) and I feel that's being used to put him in the hot seat already and there is absolutely no scum motivation to start and maintain this back and forth with Prism so early on

+1 This is how I feel.

[Titus]

Ok what's your point here? This is such a dumb thing to nitpick.

My point is that I feel like you're making mountains out of emotional molehills by calling that a meltdown, and that's a real real strong alarm bell to me.

So again, I ask you, what part of that post you quoted do you call a meltdown? Two mildly peeved posts, if even that level of annoyance is hardly a meltdown, but that's the word you used.

-k

Why are we discussing the definition of a meltdown? Mathblade's emotions made him easier to read imo. Why care about the description?

[Titus]

VOTE: Prism

I think Tammy is town, so I am proxying her my vote.

[Titus]

VOTE: Kuribo

I wonder why Titus missed my question too?

Titus Cakez Pooky?

Which post?

[Titus]

Why are we discussing the definition of a meltdown? Mathblade's emotions made him easier to read imo. Why care about the description?

I agree with you on that, remember, reading emotions is how I read the game.

I'm asking why Cakez felt the need to use that word in particular. Meltdown makes it sound so much messier, more charged than what it was. I mean, it's not like I recently laid out exactly why I take a second look at players who do that or noted the very real fact that it has netted me scum on a shockingly accurate basis. I could be misapplying what amounts to a personal tell that only works when the target is me, but there's only one way to fine out.

So no, we're not nitpicking over a definition. I'm not even calling Cakez scum. But here's the thing: Attempting to paint another player as more angry or volatile than they are has serious scum equity. And so I want to know: why the word meltdown? And while we're at it, I want to know if Cakez thinks Math is scum or town. Many answers to these questions would be more than satisfactory to me, but I'll tell you one that isn't: "Why do you care?"

-k

This makes sense. Sorry for interrupting.

[Titus]

Hey Titus, got something up your alley. Make a list of everyone who sussed me at the start don’t forget yourself. Who is scum there

Here

I am actually going to hold on this question. I want to see the thread flow to determine which people are scum. It's a question to answer on a reread after a day or two. I just have to do it.

[Titus]

Hey Titus, got something up your alley. Make a list of everyone who sussed me at the start don’t forget yourself. Who is scum there

Here

I am actually going to hold on this question. I want to see the thread flow to determine which people are scum. It's a question to answer on a reread after a day or two. I just have to do it.

Why are you assuming you get more than one day? You bemoan the fact you’re the N1 NK usually. What’s different?

A) I haven't been the NK recently. B) I doubt I am in this playerlist C) Right now the question you ask hasn't matured yet. It's one of those things where you know scum are there but it's too early to know motivations of everyone. It's the same reason VCA takes time.

[Titus]

Limited access today

[Titus]

I think we need to move on to elimination phase.

@Math, I have lost the thread to what you're trying to say. I also frankly do not care. Take a VLA. Let the thread talk about not!you. If you don't, you'll be the elimination more likely than not. I only say this because I think you're town.

[Titus]

Tammy, how do you feel about me sheeping you on Prism?

[Titus]

*eats popcorn*

[Titus]

Dunn, what are your reads besides Prism?

[Titus]

@Math, I'm not sure I buy LLD's mason claim either, but I don't think it's necessarily scum driven. Pushing for the other hypothetical mason only helps scum if it is true and we're wrong. If LLD is a mason, she should have sat on the claim. LLD wanted control so that lead to the claim. LLD wanting control is NAI though. She's willing to lie to get it as either alignment. Best to punt and let her reveal alignment by play.

[Titus]

Math, there are at least three facepalms I see already from you, which prevent you from being effective or being the NK and increase your risk of being policied.

1) You still are not letting the thread breathe.

2) You claimed VT or strongly implied it.

3) Your setup speccing with no evidenve to do so.

4) In your rush to post, your reads are incomprehensible.

Wait a day. Then post a read wall.

I'm only suggesting this because I think your bonehead plays are anti-town but you aren't scum. Keep it up and I'll vote to policy you.

[Titus]

I TR Spiffeh. It's not locktown but strong enough for today.

[Titus]

What is Math doing that helps him survive? I am moderately TRing him and even I am considering a policy elimination.

[Titus]

Math, the thread wants to talk about Dunnstral.

What is your read there?

[Titus]

don't let the great be the enemy of the good

This Math. You have to understand every scumread you can get is good. As the game progresses, you can be more stubborn on reads but early it's all about building the core that gets consensus reads out.

[Titus]

Why would scum want me a let’s be generous and say below average player like me dead?

Free miselimination is a free miselimination

[Titus]

I'm also feeling a bit of dejavu on Math/Titus; I've heard the "math is acting bad and/or scummy but I think they're town, be better or I policy you" argument before almost verbatim.

Guilty. As a result that game, we got no scum eliminated. I had the other three I was willing to compromise on at some point. The thread wanted Math. We never could work together.

[Titus]

Spoiler: quotes

Hot take: dunnstral is scum again

This is not a hot take, it's a good one.

Three of Dunny's four posts have been low effort nitpicks, and the other was a mechanics question that I didn't understand. 174 specifically doesn't sound like something town says, questioning specific players about their sangres read is one thing but shading everyone town reading them without explanation is useless. It reminds me of Titus vs. Alisae when I caught him for similar shady, nitpicky posting where he'd lurk and post full quote-wall catch ups taking potshots at random shit that never ended up forming into genuine reads or having real progression.

And while I've been scum in my three recently completed games, Dunn has been town in all of them and he it was obvious from his first few posts. That's not the case here.

Maybe I'm calling this out too early and it would have been better to see how he continues to play the game without my interference but I kinda want to try and this is me trying

VOTE: Dunnstral

VOTE: dunnstral
Please be town Spiffeh

VOTE: dunnstral

After reading 8-20 this morning, I'd be a lot more interested in sheeping Spiffeh+SirCakez on Dunn vs. elimming Math this afternoon.

Still struggling really hard with my time management at the moment, but I'm hopeful about carve out a few hours this evening to focus on the game.
I am...rather happy the artifact went to LLD over Prism.

@Dunnstral, it appears possible in the rules for some characters to have started with an artifact, ahead of the N0 distribution.

I like Spiff, +SirCakez for the Dunn read and follow up, and I think SirCakez has been generally driving the game forward. With Spiffeh, I appreciate the willingness to TR Math and express discomfort with that wagon; I'm not all the way there yet on Math, but that's at least twice now they've posted something I thought was rather useful + aligned with how I'm reading the game.

I like Bell probably a lot more than I should at this point, this is almost entirely off of vibe and I don't know how well I'll be able to justify this read.
I like sangres, I like Tammy. Kitty Truama can also hang out in my town pile. LLD something something artifact claim something.

So as usual, I'm townbucketing way too many people; if I had to pick a few I feel strongest on, Spiff, SirCakez, sangres for weird reasons. I should put LDD here, but in the absence of the claim stuff, I wouldn't have TRed them personally.

I think those are most or all of the standouts at this point. I'm enjoying aggressive/abrasive Prism, but I don't like it just yet. Bjork + LLD confirmed to own artifacts at this point, that should make for an interesting night.

In terms of negatives, besides following the logic on Dunn, who I like as a vote because it helps resolve 1.65 townies (though I'll be paying attention to how many people seem willing to jump on that wagon real quick, myself included), and who I'm interested to see in the context of pressure on them (pedit: I want to think harder about the couple of posts Dunn has posted while I was writing this up):

I've gotten really no feelings from Pooky other than that damn avatar being a clear AtE and clouding my judgment, I just never know how to sort Titus, every system I've heard presented in prev. games has worked out terribly for the town I've been in, from context, it seems that BM picks up sus early in the game pretty regularly, but I havn't seen any townpings there yet, have a few spots even lurkier than mine which is a method of reading I'm not too keen on, and that about covers the field.

Still pretty slammed today, but I'm committed to carving out that time late tonight; order of operations will be trying to break up/sort out my town pile into some kind of sensible grouping/order, figure out who doesn't make sense in combination, and review the positioning around Math and Prism this morning.
VOTE: Dunnstral

I wonder if there is a traitor.

Based on what?
Even mentioning this unprompted feels like possible signaling if true

Like, why did you actually start talking about traitor?

Dunnstral - It's his gimmick that in every game he plays, he speculates early about a Mafia Traitor. Have you never played with Mathblade before?

VOTE: Dunnstral

Spiffeh, SirCakez, Battle Mage, and quiet are the 4 on Dunn. No need to worry about hammer. He's nowhere near range.

[Titus]

VOTE: Dunn

[Titus]

Dumb question Titus why were you waiting on me to vote Dunn before voting there?

Rewarding good behavior.

[Titus]

Smh

I think almost any wagon on Mathblade is town driven tbh. That doesn't say anything about his alignment. Math has trouble playing well with others which gets him wagoned frequently regardless of his alignment.

When people do try to work with him, he fails to see it unless it's on his reads and in his own time. That means he struggles to get wagons.

Then add in his hyperposting habits which focus attention on him...well...

[Titus]

I agree Titus is probably town which means she’s gonna say I suck at working together no matter what despite me in prior games actually being good town and she was in scums pocket so hard I deviated at the very end.

What caused your read change on me?

[Titus]

I agree Titus is probably town which means she’s gonna say I suck at working together no matter what despite me in prior games actually being good town and she was in scums pocket so hard I deviated at the very end.

What caused your read change on me?

I’ve had a town read on you.

Your townread is conditional on Dunn because you want me to stop pushing my top scumreads of Cakez and Pooky and consolidate super early.

I am going to be blunt with you. I am using the Dunn wagon to get reads. Such static reads aren't good. Use the wagon as a way to check your reads rather than supposing you're right. Let yourself and others solve the game over time.

How to host a murder isn't solved round 1.

[Titus]

i dont trust myself to read you Bell, you always look scummy to me

Sure.

I don't agree that Titus is probably town.

I feel like there are two factions in this game and I'm not sure which one is mixed with scum. But one faction is larger than the other, so I'll just go ahead and say the larger faction has more scum. Rather than factions I'd say there's 2 reads lists being thrown about.

Sure, Math. I agree that based on previous posts you've made, that your town games and scum games are probably similar in wording and sentence structure. Even though I've never played with town you. I don't see much reason for you to lie about that, though I'm sure there are differences.

i think it's too early to even draw that conclusion. feels like lots of quiet players not in either 'faction'. it's possible that all of: math, titus, LLD and Prism are town.

dunno why you don't believe my math-meta?

I like BM legit now.

I am souring on Bell fast.

[Titus]

dang, i shall be doing neither

Do you think Bell could be TMI on Dunn town?

[Titus]

Bell here is proper procedure for dismantling wagons you don't like:

-> Identify player(s) that is scummy on said wagon
-> Explain in charismatic detail why they are scummy, be sure to use buzzwords such as "opportunistic" to help drive the point home
-> Vote for them and urge others to do the same

Saying over and over that's it's a bad/scummy wagon without elaboration will accomplish nothing, and only makes me want to keep my vote here just to spite you for doing so

The pattern you're describing is why Bell is falling in my reads. The only reason I haven't voted him is because this Bell appears to be trying and that's a town Bell indicator. His pushes are vapid, empty and shading.

[Titus]

Bell here is proper procedure for dismantling wagons you don't like:

-> Identify player(s) that is scummy on said wagon
-> Explain in charismatic detail why they are scummy, be sure to use buzzwords such as "opportunistic" to help drive the point home
-> Vote for them and urge others to do the same

Saying over and over that's it's a bad/scummy wagon without elaboration will accomplish nothing, and only makes me want to keep my vote here just to spite you for doing so

The pattern you're describing is why Bell is falling in my reads. The only reason I haven't voted him is because this Bell appears to be trying and that's a town Bell indicator. His pushes are vapid, empty and shading.

The only reason you haven't voted me is because voting me would probably get you wagoned.

I don't care if I do get wagoned or not. I care about being correct when I fire. This shit can rapidly devolve into too many chefs in the kitchen. So I'll work with others on my unknowns until I'm ready to call my shot.

But just for good measure.

VOTE: Bell
VOTE: Dunn

Whenever you're ready to put some bite behind your bark, come at me.

[Titus]

If you cared about being correct when you fire, you wouldn't be voting Dunnstrall while saying that it was for VCA that you supported it.
You wouldn't have voted at all. You'd have just let it be.

I'm voting without stating Dunn is lockscum. I'd be doing the same if I voted you right now.

If I want to sit alone and tunnel (which is what I meant by fire), then I'll be damn sure I am right.

For now, my vote is best used working with others.

[Titus]

What is Math doing that helps him survive? I am moderately TRing him and even I am considering a policy elimination.

LLD, this was a question for you.

[Titus]

The problem I have with that Bork is no negative side to an artifact that is world destroying is kinda not believable.

Both Prism and Bork would have this knowledge though...

[Titus]

I do but if Dunn is town Titus stock goes down.
Bell is one of my few lock towns.

Bell is based on what? He's my highest SR currently.

[Titus]

I do but if Dunn is town Titus stock goes down.
Bell is one of my few lock towns.

Bell is based on what? He's my highest SR currently.

VOTE: SirCakez

Come sheep me Bell.

Based on me being a day cop Titus /s

I have reasons but they’re anti town to say

I just spit out my water. You have no problem posting other stuff that's been anti-town but when it comes to helping out your sister you can't because it's suddenly anti-town?

And you're backing off the place we agree has a possibility of being scum and going back to your own tunnel read.

[Titus]

VOTE: SirCakez

Come sheep me Bell.

Bell's been trying to eliminate you? Why would he sheep you?

[Titus]

VOTE: Mathblade

If you aren't willing to rationally discuss your reads but expect people to sheep you, I have no hope of reading you. When you don't work with people who are wagoning your scumreads because it's not your favorite, then I cannot work with you.

If I cannot read you and I cannot work with you, why keep you?

[Titus]

I'm going to be busy the next couple days but I'll hope in soon thereafter

[Titus]

Haven't caught up but Math getting flack for FoSing LLD is bullshit. LLD has lied about being a mason before.

[Titus]

I kinda feel like sangres could be scum this game, but that could just be OMGUS. I don't have any particularly strong case or reason there. Same with Dunn.

I feel LLD and GreyICE are probably town, but their play is shit. LLD in particular cares more about control than honesty and valor. I bet that will make her angry but I don't really care about LLD's tantrums.

I am glad Math is actually quiet for a few hours to let the thread discussion go elsewhere for now.

I'm a bit paranoid Spiffeh is whiteknighting me but I like his content so I'm going to crawl into his pocket. I've been a bit lackluster this game and I know it, so I wonder how I'm so high in Spiffeh's reads.

Bork I lean town on but I want to see more to solidify that feeling.

Cakez is in the same emotional place as me, so I'm ok slotting him as town for now.

[Titus]

Also I am probably soon going to reach my threshold on the number of players allowed to scum read me without punishment. Objectively this is the most obviously town I have been in a game in a year or two at least and I will no longer be tolerating scum reads on me at this time.

Thank you all for your concern in this matter.

I am only giving you a TR because my SRs are full and I will get back to you if any of my SRs flips green and I have a spot open.

Logic says I should scumread this but it tonally feels town...

[Titus]

This section seems really manipulative around getting townread rather than a genuine commentary on their alignments, the fact that you're going out of your way to say you don't care about her tantrums bothers me.

I don't really care if it bothers you. LLD is about control and that's a fact. LLD claiming mason is manipulative. That's a fact. LLD has fakeclaimed mason before. That's a fact. LLD has a temper that's a fact. I don't care if I provoke it. That's a fact.

If saying facts is manipulative, then I am guilty.

I feel LLD is doing this controlling behavior because otherwise she'll feel drowned out in a playerlist with Tammy and Nacho. You were getting the artifact before LLD claimed and insisted she get it.

LLD is all about control.

[Titus]

*with the likes of Tammy, Nacho and Spiffeh etc

[Titus]

Manipulative is a dirty word for persuasion btw. They're the same thing. I should sig this.

[Titus]

I do but if Dunn is town Titus stock goes down.
Bell is one of my few lock towns.

Bell is based on what? He's my highest SR currently.

VOTE: SirCakez

Come sheep me Bell.

Based on me being a day cop Titus /s

I have reasons but they’re anti town to say

VOTE: Mathblade

If you aren't willing to rationally discuss your reads but expect people to sheep you, I have no hope of reading you. When you don't work with people who are wagoning your scumreads because it's not your favorite, then I cannot work with you.

If I cannot read you and I cannot work with you, why keep you?

This isn't "persuasive", it's manipulative

Same difference.

I am persuading Math to be protown or I vote him.

I'm not about to enjoy a game with Math and LLD like this. So I'm getting the most protown result.

I'm persuading or manipulating Math to assist.

Again, I don't give two shits about the word choice. Just don't argue persuasion is manipulative and therefore scummy. They're the same thing.

The manipulative argument is just noise.

[Titus]

There's a lot of mildly suspicious slots that REALLY don't want to go mathblade, or won't discuss mathblade, but are a-okay going titus, so that means we go mathblade today

Can you give me some players who fit this criteria?

+1 I should have asked this but I got egocentric.

[Titus]

Math may very well flip town and I don't trust LLD. I see the page limit and know that I can't do my scumhunting with him commenting on everything. The post count will be gone. He has double the posts (approximately) as anyone else. Nothing Math is saying is of value or working with anyone else. So I am plugging my nose and hoping for a day 2. If I see a decent wagon, I may move but I am not pushing to sort. Mathblade's taking that space. I detest artificial post limits.

[Titus]

@Math, your wagon is almost entirely town. You're committing every sin that I warned you about and frankly it may be too late.

@GreyIce, I'll see what I can do this afternoon to catch up and not use any posts. If I knew this game had a hard post limit, I never would have inned.

[Titus]

Working on my catchup now. It's going to be interrupted at points. Bear with me. I'm using a couple hours before my doctor's appointment.

[Titus]

Sircakez, Battle Mage, GreyIce, and yourself

This is resistance to mathblade, not all are ok with going titus as well; most are instead tunneled on me to a frankly unrealistic degree

Sangres is honorarily ont he list because they keep directing questions at me while supposedly suspecting Mathblade but it doesn't have the same feel

I could buy Sangres as scum, particularly in the T v T v T scenario. I expect Nacho and ffery to have more of a presence with the posts they do make.

Because where I'm coming from, in the event that MathBlade is scum (which I highly highly doubt atm), it's a little hard to believe that any scum would fight for him at this point when he's dug himself a huge hole?

I would expect scum to bus him into the ground here instead of risk themselves trying to save him. And I think you're smart enough to be able to see that too.

I expect scum to be on the back of the Math wagon if he's town. I doubly expect the crowd to start a push to end the day if we get a non-Math push on scum. If Math is scum, I expect equal dispersement between early and late. There is still the caveat that scum will blitz bus if we get a wagon on his partner.

As long as LLD is claiming mason and is going to take control of the game, I'm not going to be the wagon for today unless there is strong disagreements from multiple members of the town

This type of attitude is just yucky regardless of alignment. It's a reminder that some votes matter more because of who is talking rather than what is being said. It's toxic and demotivating. Why should I bother posting if my posts won't be respected? I have other games where my effort matters.

[Titus]

Sircakez, Battle Mage, GreyIce, and yourself

This is resistance to mathblade, not all are ok with going titus as well; most are instead tunneled on me to a frankly unrealistic degree

Sangres is honorarily ont he list because they keep directing questions at me

while supposedly suspecting Mathblade

but it doesn't have the same feel

What?

We've been settled on a Mathblade townread since before the afternoon phase started, and I don't think Nacho ever had a scumread on Math.

We voted you last night.

Nacho told LLD that we'd to Titus if she'll vote there.

And then I moved our vote from you to Titus when Greyice voted there. That was a very comfortable move to make, not only because Nacho had already indicated he'd vote there, but also because my scumread of you has weakened over your content over the last 24 hours. I pushed you on your comments about people giving us too easy townreads because it was one of my points of concern, and I didn't absolutely hate your responses to that.

I have some vague feels that Math's page 30 posts sounded a little too "look how I'm not caring if I get miselimed", but the preponderance of his posts, particularly interactions with Titus and Bell, feel town to Nacho, and I'm very comfortable going along with that.


----------------------

@Math, I'm EXTREMELY uncomfortable with your post count burn rate in a page-restricted game.

This type of posting is why I feel sangres can be scum.

They're objecting to me, yet sheeping my opinion about Mathblade's post rate. He gives no real reason for his objection to me and tries to pass the buck off onto LLD for their read.

They're seeking a popular miselimination to be safe on. If Math is group scum, turbo lim this. If Math is traitor, major FoS. If Math is town, minor FoS as he could be leaving/creating an out to vote Math when convienent.

[Titus]

@LLD - 871, What? I expected anger there but I guess you're rather self-assured. You and I both know you lied about being a mason as scum before. Yet, you seem to be shocked by my suspicion towards your slot. I detest being lied to and having my words be worthless because I know you lie without hesitation. I want you to actually show respect towards slots like Spiffeh who I have as locktown even if you hate me.

Catchup soon count:

Mastina! (with bonus offer of lynching her... so tempting)
Tammy!
Kitty Trauma Team! (With bonus for there's two of them)

guyz I have a free money bet
not three green

My townread here is gone.

Mastina has consistently been behind in all her games.
Mala has just returned and is getting used to the game flow.
Tammy frequently falls behind. It's NAI for her.

There's no reason to think one of these slots must be scum for falling behind.

End of 36. Brb

[Titus]

Yaknow I really wanted people to ask me about Prism so I could do this sooner but I actually don't feel like waiting as a reactive thing so I'mma be proactive and put this out.

I actually have a fairly compelling case for why I think Prism is scum here.

First I want to preface this by saying I'm intentionally playing more abrasively. As mentioned before, diversity is nice and I'm tired of playing friends after Iceland.

1: Nine times out of ten, a player saying this is going to be scum. Deliberately altering your playstyle in a game with multiple players intimately familiar with your playstyle and justifying it in advance is a common scum ploy. (Heck I can even back this up with a rather notorious example if you'd like, but suffice to say, this is a real tell.)

2: Nothing Prism has done this game has felt town. Quite the opposite in fact.

3: I believe Prism's flavor claim of being HG Wells--I do not believe HG Wells would be a VT.

4: I believe HG Wells started with the trident. I do not believe HG Wells started with it as town; I believe it was a scum artifact that Prism is trying to get towncred for.

5: I believe the flavor claim of being HG Wells--I do not believe that makes the claim town. Everyone who watched the show probably remembers how HG Wells ended up, as a retired warehouse agent more or less...but did they forget that HG Wells spent

an entire season

as THE series Big Bad? Whose opening episode on the show was

killing the series' long-established Big Bad

? Not out of heroism, but to show how she was eviler and more insane than the first Big Bad? (Whole, sorting algorithm of evil, thing; she killed the previous big bad to show that she was a worse threat than the previous big bad.)

In fact, HG Wells is one of only three Big Bads I can actually remember. (I know there were more than three, pretty sure, but she sticks out to me as one of the three real, non-imaginary-in-your-head Big Bads. The other two being the one she killed and the final Big Bad.)

In other words I think that Prism is a scum HG Wells, who is not a VT, and who started with the flavor-appropriate trident, and passed it on for cheap towncred.

Baah!

VOTE: Prism

I reserve the right to change this to a more useful place after my catchup but I like this case based on flavor.

I'll be watching for Mathblade's reaction to this post since he says he's a flavor expert.

At this point the thread is going to be pissed off when I flip town and bicker at each other. This is the first time I have /inned to a game in a year+ and the biggest thing I have learned is just to never /in and replace in always. And that’s sad.

You’re still scum Pooky.

Math is too busy looking at politics rather than engaging with the substance of what anyone is thinking. He's posting multiple stream of consciousness posts which actually don't make him more readable.

You know what would have made him more readable? Engaging with the substance of mastina's case using the flavor knowledge he bragged about. Instead, his posts are more about what he WANTS to be true. There's no thought process anyone can track because it's too scattershot.

That scattershot posting dominates the thread, making it hard to fathom questions that can help establish relationships between players without using a lot of posts to catch people's attention. I think there's a decent chance Math flips town here but with the artificial cap and lying LLD in charge, I don't care to fight it because we need to actually get to an environment where scumhunting is possible.

VOTE: pooky
here my Dunn vote is stale and Pooky's posting lately has been truly terrible

I can see a Prism Cakez scumteam here with Cakez 846 and 847. There's an appeal to Pooky's posts being terrible, which is untrue.

It could be an appeal to Mathblade to disrupt his good reads to push him to target Pooky.

[Titus]

Like she's not town.
I know she's not town.
It's just not a wagon that's going to succeed today, and I'd like to play a game with my wife where something stupid doesn't happen day 1.
If I'm dead tonight come back to this plox

Not sure if LLD is scum. I would policy them for lying but there's an off chance they aren't and outing the other mason would be a disaster. I doubt LLD is though and I hate how manipulative that claim was.

I want to see what SorCakez does with the meta request he made of Prism.

[Titus]

Like she's not town.
I know she's not town.
It's just not a wagon that's going to succeed today, and I'd like to play a game with my wife where something stupid doesn't happen day 1.
If I'm dead tonight come back to this plox

I'm town Charlie.

Towwwwwwwwwwwwn

come to candy mountain charlieeeee

it's full of town candy charlieeeeee

Also I swear to god anyone else claims mason and it's YEP THAT'S A MASON ALRIGHT

I claim mason and it's REMEMBER THAT ONE TIME LLD CLAIMED MASON AS SCUM AND THEN SHOT THE TOWNIE WHO WAS FAKING IT WITH HER WITH A JANITOR KILL TO DISGUISE IT AND WON A GAME.

I swear I'll never live down those moments.

Then why do you treat me like shit for calling you out on it?

Afternoon Vote Count 1.04

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes bronze.

Dunnstral (4): , SirCakez, quiet, Battle Mage, Spiffeh
MathBlade (5): Bell, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, Titus, Dunnstral
PookyTheMagicalBear(1): MathBlade
Titus (2): GreyICE, sangres

Not voting (5): Tammy, borkjerfkin, Kitty Trauma Team, mastina, Prism


Mod notes: 35/85 pages used

Afternoon Vote Count 1.05

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes bronze.

Dunnstral (3): quiet, Battle Mage, Spiffeh
MathBlade (5): Bell, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, Titus, Dunnstral
Titus (2): GreyICE, sangres
SirCakez (2): mastina, Kitty Trauma Team
Prism (1): MathBlade
PookyTheMagicalBear (1): SirCakez

Not voting (3): Tammy, borkjerfkin, Prism


Mod notes: 37/85 pages used

Bell,LLD, Pooky, Titus, and Dunn’s votes have just sat on me, and BM’s move onto me is sus as FUCK.
Mastina’s sircakez vote and shit is terrible.

My guess is BM/Titus/(Prism/Mastina/Bork)/??? Maybe quiet

Tammy Cakez and Bell and Spiffeh are obvious town.
Sangres if that bit earlier was a slip then replace then the ??? is them and replace with Prism
Kitty miiiight be scum but I horribly doubt it.

Game is damn near solved. Fucking do something with votes if you’re town.
VOTE: Titus

I don't think Math has a single read right other than maybe Prism.

Mathblade's arrogance in being wrong is common for town him. That makes his inability to work with people even more problematic as he'll be an extra scum vote either way.

This is ordered t->s within the buckets, ie. bottom of scumleans is the worst of the bunch

Safely town
==========
Spiffeh
Tammy
Bell

Pretty town
===========
Battle Mage
bork
sangres (Last three could really go in any order)
SirCakez

My Only Townlean That's a Mason Claim anyway
===========
LLD

MathBlade
============
MathBlade

Null and/or hasn't played the game up to Page 30
===========
GreyICE
Pooky
quiet
mastina

Scumleans
============
Dunnstral
Titus
Kitty Trauma Team

That pretty town is pretty scum infested. I can't see why Prism has Cakez so high when Cakez did zero with that meta request from before.

on a non-mathblade point, it's interesting how many people seem to be throwing Titus' name in near the bottom of their reads. ordinarily i'd say maybe it indicates some distancing, but last time it happened Titus was just town.

I actually don't have a problem with most of them (although scum are capitalizing). This game is more of a chore because of how demotivated I am. Day 1 sucks. Day 1 where you're discredited out the gate and there's an artifical limit to scumhunting sucks worse. The best thing to do in a situation where you suck day 1 is to sit back too. This leaves a picture of scummy Titus.

math is trying to solve a puzzle and the pieces are coming together (albeit in a way that i'm not super following the verbiage of) and is probably town

Okay, I get math thinks there's a flavor puzzle. I'm just not following why someone should have a grappling hook and stuff.

If flavor determines what artifacts you start with wouldn't flavor claiming be bad? I looked up my guy in the wiki and I think I'd say my start with artifacts matches my flavor.

I mean I'm happy to let people work, at worst it gives us some insight into Mathblade and hopefully some extra scum. I'd just like to be able to decypher this train at some point.

If Math thinks there's a flavor puzzle, why doesn't he analyze mastina's Prism case deeper?

My scum reads are Cakez, Prism, Titus

Town reads are Math, LLD, probably GreyICE

Now leave me the fuck alone, last warning

Kuribo is in my locktown. Aside from his SR on me, his scumreads are mine.

[Titus]

I want to see what SorCakez does with the meta request he made of Prism.

I was going to dig through them to see if his scum game is like this one but I haven't gotten to it

Well, why not do it now? You asked for it, so you should do it. Give me a strong conclusion.

[Titus]

VOTE: SirCakez

Cakez + Prism

[Titus]

Probably sangres too

[Titus]

Maybe my vaccuum sucks and Cakez is scum that is pretty bad.

Math, what are your thoughts on mastina's Prism case? You seem to ignore that I want your actual flavor thoughts on that.

[Titus]

@Mala, You're pretty right. I don't care.

@Math, Your post asking me to do things isn't in good faith. I just spent hours catching up and your reply is that I'm not "doing things". I asked for your thoughts on Mastina's prism case and I got three posts of nonsense. If you were reading my posts with any eye to listen, you'd know why I am suspecting Cakez at least partially. There was zero follow up to his request for Prism's meta.

I didn't directly say this in my catchup but I feel your townread on Cakez, like your other reads, is largely political. There's no nuance in your reads. I don't really feel like engaging you when doing so will generate 3 posts to my every one and flood out the thread.

[Titus]

Afternoon Vote Count 1.08

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
MathBlade (5): Bell, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, Battle Mage, GreyICE
Titus (4): sangres, Prism, SirCakez, MathBlade
SirCakez (4): mastina, Kitty Trauma Team, Dunnstral, Titus

Not voting (2): Tammy, borkjerfkin


Mod notes: 51/85 pages used

Oh wow. Just saw this. I doubt Prism and Cakez are scum together based off this VC. Probably Sangres, Cakez, (Tammy/bork), (Grey/quiet).

[Titus]

Claiming VT.

Don't care if I get yeeted. This game is a town loss. There's no cohesion or ability to get it thanks to the stupid post restriction.

You have my solve. See you in 1-2 months.

[Titus]

The post restriction is a limit of 80 something pages and you’re not even posting.

There’s 40 pages left.

There’s actually a pretty good town block imho, even if I am not in it which is my job as a Townie.
LLD, Kitty, sangres, Tammy, Pooky, Prism, bork and that’s off the top of my head.

Is Titus just defeated scum here?

Tammy isn't posting because of grading and spam. No one tries to work with her.
Kitty is town and fair to be in a block.
LLD is lying and not a team player so she is not in any block. She's a dictator.
Sangres isn't town which is a requirement. That's part of why town loses.
Pooky is fair in a block.
Prism isn't working with anyone and his interactions with Cakez are bad. If it wasn't for VCA, they'd be partners.
Bork is close to fair but not active enough to actually form a block.

Townblocks are active and discuss reads with each other. Aside from Cakez, it's which policy elimination to pursue.

I don't want to play in a post limited game with you and LLD but subbing out would be tactical and against the rules.

[Titus]

I am defeated here, but you have my alignment wrong. This is a great group but these mechanics are no fun.

[Titus]

@sangres, Everything flowing isn't how I read you. In fact, one could argue consistency is scummy.

Your position on me has been tunnely nonsense. I get some of the votes on me. Yours, I struggle to see a town perspective on. It feels like a chainsaw from my earlier posting. You never took me head on and said your problem imo but you were perfectly ok to sheep other opinions.

I play conversationally too but if everyone plays conversationally we get a deadline elimination on town. I suck day one (usually) so it's best to let others take charge with such bullshit in place.

The problem is that letting others take charge shouldn't lead to opinions being treated as bullshit or ignored. I felt compelled to reply to this post because this reachout from whichever head is talking feels rather genuine and caused me to reconsider that read.

I agree with the game pace being fine. The problem is it's because slots are silenced. Tammy and mastina have nothing memorable. I can't push on the Prism/Cakez issue because it would take too many posts to pressure the thread and demand that read from Cakez while fending off "confirmed" town. Fighting confirmed town when you suck at day 1, defending yourself takes valuable resources, and you can't get a solid person to sheep is hard. It's hopeless when I can't see who to get to work together.

I'll read through this one more time by Saturday at noon. Then eliminate me or not.

The popularity contest for artifacts encourages the lying for power. Then the post limit creates a tradegy of the commons situation with posting.

Every post I make takes a post from someone else. Players like Math don't get that. He sucks day 1 too and he spams. He doesn't work with others. I think his level of crazy is town this game but I have been burned before.

I guess what I need is hope. I don't see where it is.

[Titus]

We all had to read the rules on replace in.

Why is this only an issue now?

You're not an ass.

The post limit and popularity contest were not in the signup thread. I always had an issue with them once I found out.

[Titus]

I might be depressed.

Don't be surprised if I don't post tomorrow. I'm trying to sort that out.

X post all games.

[Titus]

@GreyIce, My depression is clinical and not triggered by anything in particular. My brain convinces me that things will just consistently be bad, no matter what I or anyone else says. It doesn't have to be caused by anything. While it occurred at the same time Math refused all my logical reachouts, Math is not or will never be the cause. It's a chemical imbalance in the brain.

I don't feel it's fair to sub out since it would be purely strategic though.

I feel better about you being town until you try to say LLD is scummy for disagreeing with you. If you felt she was using her mason status to manipulate town, I would buy that. Yet you seem to be against calling me town for feeling that way sooo.

@Spiffeh, I thought I did engage on Dunn with you at the time. I don't really recall anything that Dunn has done and I'm ok sheeping you there. The problem is, I am also ok sheeping a Math vote, even if policying my brother is seen as scummy.

If you want to get away from Math, you can join me on Cakez. Cakez is content to ask filler questions and never follow through on them.

[Titus]

We are heartless monsters who only feel pleasure at human suffering and the thought of a willing sacrifice arouses us.

excellent

VOTE: Titus

Pooky townread rescinded for this hammer knowing my reread was coming.

[Titus]

I also want to kill cakez regardless of what Titus flips

Yet you never voted him because?

[Titus]

@GreyIce, My depression is clinical and not triggered by anything in particular. My brain convinces me that things will just consistently be bad, no matter what I or anyone else says. It doesn't have to be caused by anything. While it occurred at the same time Math refused all my logical reachouts, Math is not or will never be the cause. It's a chemical imbalance in the brain.

I don't feel it's fair to sub out since it would be purely strategic though.

I feel better about you being town until you try to say LLD is scummy for disagreeing with you. If you felt she was using her mason status to manipulate town, I would buy that. Yet you seem to be against calling me town for feeling that way sooo.

@Spiffeh, I thought I did engage on Dunn with you at the time. I don't really recall anything that Dunn has done and I'm ok sheeping you there. The problem is, I am also ok sheeping a Math vote, even if policying my brother is seen as scummy.

If you want to get away from Math, you can join me on Cakez. Cakez is content to ask filler questions and never follow through on them.

*sigh* If by refusing all reach outs means doing almost every single one I don’t know what to tell you.

You still spammed, you still refused to work on our reads together, you still posted incomprehensible posts. You didn't work with anyone at all and your D1s are still trash.

I'll buy you a cake when you lead a d1 scumflip.

Offer expires never.

[Titus]

@kuribo - Thanks

I really don't see us winning and I don't see how extra effort helps. I don't see that in any town with Math and LLD.

[Titus]

I don't believe Titus is cold-hearted, ruthless, or sociopathic enough to emotionally manipulate members of a community that she is close to.

the entire point of the game is emotional manipulation tho >_>

Lying about IRL is a line I never cross.

I will manipulate but not about IRL.

Think I am scum. Fine. I am still clinically depressed.

[Titus]

sangres (hydra of fferyllt and Nachomamma8) - Null (their reachout sole reason
2. Tammy - gtmh scum, nothing done since midmorning
3. borkjerfkin - gtmh town
4. SirCakez - scum
5. Kitty Trauma Team (hydra of Malakittens and kuribo) - town
6. Lady Lambdadelta - can go eat rocks, anti-town
7. mastina - gtmh null
8. Bell - town
9. Spiffeh - lean town, could be whitenighting
10. GreyICE* - gtmh town
11. PookyTheMagicalBear - town
12. Titus
13. MathBlade - needs death
14. quiet - lurker scum
15. Prism - meh
16. Dunnstral - sheeping this from Spiffeh so scum
17. Battle Mage - town

[Titus]

sangres (hydra of fferyllt and Nachomamma8) - Null (their reachout sole reason
2. Tammy - gtmh scum, nothing done since midmorning
3. borkjerfkin - gtmh town
4. SirCakez - scum
5. Kitty Trauma Team (hydra of Malakittens and kuribo) - town
6. Lady Lambdadelta - can go eat rocks, anti-town
7. mastina - gtmh null
8. Bell - town
9. Spiffeh - lean town, could be whitenighting
10. GreyICE* - gtmh town
11. PookyTheMagicalBear - town
12. Titus
13. MathBlade - needs death
14. quiet - lurker scum
15. Prism - meh
16. Dunnstral - sheeping this from Spiffeh so scum
17. Battle Mage - town

Kay I've shut up about this all day, but this is another example of bullshit I don't deal with.

I have provided oodles of space for players this game. I have no shut down anyone, and I've been really relatively light fisted from a position of power.

As for my mason claim, believe me or don't, but you don't get to treat me the way you have and call me anti-town when your grand contribution to this game has been literally so small that an electron microscope couldn't find it.

Also, I'll be expecting an apology post game from you when I flip mason, JSYK.

Why? I have been abundantly clear that your claim was for control regardless of if you're a mason or not. That's the problem I have. It's the elitism and anti-town play that's my problem. If you're a mason, that makes it worse not better as you were under no pressure.

[Titus]

Why? I have been abundantly clear that your claim was for control regardless of if you're a mason or not. That's the problem I have. It's the elitism and anti-town play that's my problem. If you're a mason, that makes it worse not better as you were under no pressure.

she has literally not done thread control except for leashing my vote to hers

Yeah.

She could have stopped Dunnstral from hiding behind her.

LLD knows that she has that level of influence.

[Titus]

Why? I have been abundantly clear that your claim was for control regardless of if you're a mason or not. That's the problem I have. It's the elitism and anti-town play that's my problem. If you're a mason, that makes it worse not better as you were under no pressure.

she has literally not done thread control except for leashing my vote to hers

Yeah.

She could have stopped Dunnstral from hiding behind her.

LLD knows that she has that level of influence.

Why would I stop that?

By not stopping it, you effectively vetoed his elimination.

[Titus]

If I can find the motivation, I'll case SirCakez and quiet.

I'm not as sure on quiet scum but SirCakez is definitely deflecting attention away from a slot under no pressure. It also likely won't be made to catch up either. So why does Cakez need to defend quiet?

[Titus]

The only reason I'd vote Math at this point is to help clear up the gamestate
I think he continues to make bad post after bad post and I just don't think it's scum play at all

“Bad” post after “Bad” post << Bad is not defined.

It’s shit like this that pisses me off.

You calling something bad doesn’t make it true.

I find them excellent posts and I am probably dead tomorrow anyway.

*cough* Cakez isn't being direct because he's likely scum. *cough*

[Titus]

@Cakez, Why the switch on the quiet read?

[Titus]

Titus, you promised some catch up. Would you please or a reads list with some detail?

You're literally quoting parts of my catchup.

Can you at least look at Cakez?

[Titus]

I'm largely caught up. I'm mobile posting, so I can't do in depth walls but I want to try and work with you now that we're both on.

[Titus]

I'm largely caught up. I'm mobile posting, so I can't do in depth walls but I want to try and work with you now that we're both on.

Okay...How difficult would it be for you to get to a computer and post an actual detailed reads wall?

One hour minimum. I'm at the laundromat.

P.S.

Cakez is at two strikes. Never materializing meta on Prism.
Sudden, reasonless shift to defend quiet.

[Titus]

I already explained this. I saw quiet going into some yeetpools and reevaluated.

Except you never said anything about quiet at all. You had quiet in your yeet pool for many of the same reasons that you're now objecting to. You don't mention which slots caused you to reevaluate.

It reeks more of trying to buy a scumpartner space on subbing in.

[Titus]

Hey, vc comment here.

SirCakez is one wagon.
The other two scumread him.

[Titus]

If you're talking about the recent votes on mastina, who specifically are you spooked by on that wagon?

Honestly? Everyone except Bell and Battle Mage because they weren't interested in Titus to begin with:

any of
Sangres 1716
Prism 1725
your 1831

Feel to me like they could possibly be stay-off-my-buddy votes just because none of them have any real "I've changed my mind about Titus" to them, and if mastina flips green there basically has to be scum in there

This feels like scum trying to attack a townblock and knows mastina is town.

[Titus]

I'm against Cakez RN.

Why?

[Titus]

mastina's play is a bit weird as either alignment. Why would she take a dive for me when we largely have the same skillset and I am worse mentally atm? No scum is worth sacrificing themselves to save me. It's a negative EV as either alignment, so I lean town on that.

[Titus]

Too many hards pushes by people I suspect near deadline. Earns a hard no. Scum want him dead and they're not fake bussing him and secretly hoping we murder someone else.

Also, I like sme of his posts. I'm not ruling him out for scum, but he has a shiny town spark.
Also, I hate ethics tells and find them unreliable but I'm not sure Sircakez would have the balls to hit you while you were down as scum him. But my ethics tells suck.

I agree there's no bussing here. If I was queen, I would flashwagon Dunn but that's a long shot. Cakez is the next best thing. I also disagree with the scummy people want Cakez dead (minus Dunn) but ine busser is to be expected.

[Titus]

This feels like scum trying to attack a townblock and knows mastina is town.

meanwhile:

1. sangres (hydra of fferyllt and Nachomamma8) - Null (their reachout sole reason

2. Tammy - gtmh scum, nothing done since midmorning
3. borkjerfkin - gtmh town
4. SirCakez - scum
5. Kitty Trauma Team (hydra of Malakittens and kuribo) - town
6. Lady Lambdadelta - can go eat rocks, anti-town
7. mastina - gtmh null
8. Bell - town
9.

Spiffeh - lean town, could be whitenighting

10. GreyICE* - gtmh town
11. PookyTheMagicalBear - town
12. Titus
13. MathBlade - needs death
14. quiet - lurker scum

15. Prism - meh

16. Dunnstral - sheeping this from Spiffeh so scum
17. Battle Mage - town

your reads on people in the "townblock i am attacking"

There is a townblock. Doesn't mean I am sure of it. Second, my sangres read is outdated. I town lean them now. The people you're suggesting as scum are all widely townread.

[Titus]

mastina is my #1 choice and I won't be swapping except to avoid a no-elim.

This reeks of omgus.

[Titus]

The people you're suggesting as scum are all widely townread.

Do I really have to point out the cog-dis of "I don't townread all these people and that's fine but since

you've

presented a situation where there might be scum in that group it's scummy"?

Does your read being outdated somehow make that ok?

Except I was saying I largely do.
Second, even if I didn't townread them, your statement can still feel like you're shading people based on knowledge.
Third, townblocks that exist don't have to agree with my reads. They just have to be a group that townreads each other.

Your post looked like it was attacking a townblock.

[Titus]

there is no wagon on Math really Bell

Why would you flashwagon Dunn but it's a problem there's no wagon on Math?

[Titus]

mastina is my #1 choice and I won't be swapping except to avoid a no-elim.

This reeks of omgus.

look how bad this is
titus criticizes bork for attacking people in the "townblock" then IMMEDIATELY does the same thing herself

Prism isn't in a townblock. Second, making an observation about OMGUS technically says nothing about an alignment.

You're very reachy here.

[Titus]

You know I'm aware of the meme in addition because I joked about it in the Cell PT which you were part of and undoubtedly read.

Just because I read doesn't mean I remember.

Also, for the record: I'm worthless enough right now that I don't mind dieing--why?

Because on this page, in the 1711 through 1724 I am doubting my Prism read.

I am pretty sure Titus is town, but if Prism is town I don't really have much in the way of useful scumreads. I'm still voting SirCakez, and I'd go onto MathBlade, but I should have four scumreads but I don't, unless you think that SirCakez-MathBlade-quiet-BM works as a scumteam.

Can you take another look at Bork and Dunn?

[Titus]

Will move my vote to probably mastina at some point.

In the middle of something but I am aroundish and will be back later

Ffery what do you like about battles posts?

For cakes his I WILL END YOU feels a bit farcical coming from him which pings but not sure how really alignment indicative it is.

*pings and no vote* If I had a dollar for everytime this happened, I'd be rich.

[Titus]

@mastina, why do scum!Math and scum!Cakez vote Dunn over your wagon mastina?

[Titus]

If I was queen, I would flashwagon Dunn but that's a long shot. Cakez is the next best thing. I also disagree with the scummy people want Cakez dead (minus Dunn) but ine busser is to be expected.

Titus, Dunnstral has just become a viable wagon.

It's time for you to get your revenge on those that have persecuted you all this time.

It's time.

VOTE: Dunn

[Titus]

VOTE: Cakez

I intend to be back before the deadline, but paperwork calls.

[Titus]

With the CC from Tammy, my vote stays on Sir Cakez. I'm not posting anymore unless it's a last second swap.

P.S. I said pages would be a problem.

[Titus]

Dunnstral (3): quiet, Spiffeh
Titus (1): borkjerfkin
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (7): GreyICE, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy, sircakez, bfin, bell
Mathblade (1): sangres

Feel better soon LLD. I broke my rule but human connection is worth it.

[Titus]

This needs an explanation.

[Titus]

Down with eliminating quiet and Pooky.

Will hammer the artifact to move on. I don't approve of the funnel strat but it's not the worst thing in the world as it prevents dueling roleblocks for now.

I'm also annoyed that LLD didn't wait for Cakez to claim roleblocked or not before revealing the information. There is a chance I missed something though.

[Titus]

SirCakez (7): mastina (confscum), Dunnstral (only likely scum if Cakez is), Kitty Trauma Team (conftown), Lady Lambdadelta (high prob town), PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus (conftown), MathBlade (Derp Town)

You are highly likely the scum on Cakez's wagon by PoE. If Cakez is also scum, scum would have preferred the mastina wagon go through which would change some analysis. Right now, I am proceeding under Cakez town.

[Titus]

The way the dayphase played suggests he was.

What's your read on Cakez?

[Titus]

What's your stance on quiet?

[Titus]

VOTE: LLD

@Math, That wagon analysis (it's not a full vca) was relatively spot on. mastina is confscum.
Dunn being scum requires mastina and Dunn double up on the Cakez wagon. I don't see why scum would do that given the options. Maybe if Cakez is town but it's just unlikely behavior from scum.
KTT is conftown because they are dead.
LLD is conftown to most. I don't fully trust them but they are highly likely town.
I know I am town.
You I lean towards being an anti town townie.

That leaves Pooky.


Can you vote LLD so we can get to the afternoon?

[Titus]

Can we just be quiet until the afternoon? I pmed the mods that we hammerred morning.

[Titus]

VOTE: Pooky

[Titus]

He said he said takes a lot of posts. Let people come on. You're not going to convince each other to claim scum.

[Titus]

You have made 50 (out of an ideal of 125) posts in ~12 hours, which hopefully you spent 8 of them sleeping. This is the last time I'm going to burn one of mine, but yes, you need to slow down.

And you need to not push obvTown.

If people continue to be silly I will continue to fight it.

Til then the people I didn’t have in any PoE should not be up for elim or I will post to try to save them.

Fighting via posting excessively posting causes people to ignore you. You then post more to resist it. You need to tailor more. Post less.

[Titus]

Pooky was leashed to LLD and did almost nothing.

Pooky voluntarily followed LLD, did next to nothing, and is the most viable scum.

Right now, your spam is pissing people off and detracting from Pooky's elimination. All Pooky has to do is remain silent and you'll rope yourself. On top of that, people will ignore you for failing to follow basic requests.

[Titus]

Stop making up exceptions to say Dunn can be scum and Pooky isn't.

There is no "organic" counter thing. Either Dunn was a counter or he wasn't. Dunn and SirCakez were counters which make them horrible choices today.

Quiet slot or Pooky. Pick one.

[Titus]

You already claimed vanilla. You were wrong yesterday. You're being really vocal and not listening to others. You're disrupting communication that lets us hunt and possibly reach a resolution. This is problematic.

Rather than elaborating why Pooky is wrong, you whined that my wagon analysis sucked. You didn't detail what. You agree Pooky hasn't done much, yet you're willing to die for him.

To try and force Dunn, you try to argue that Dunn was not an organic wagon.

In the alternative, you try to push Cakez. Cakez was definitely a counterwagon to mastina and thus should not be a lim candidate today.

Tammy and Cakez are also claimed PRs.

If you want to defend Pooky, say why he's town.

[Titus]

I like MathBlade for town.

I am strongly leaning that way as well, but he's townbeard at best.

[Titus]

DGB is scum. DGB was the old quiet slot.

[Titus]

I like MathBlade for town.

MathBlade, you want to yeet Pooky?

MathBlade, you want to yeet Pooky?

No. I am saying if Titus continues to push Pooky I will yeet her and likely be successful.

I will NEVER want to yeek Pooky.

Who do you want to yeet. I will vote there too.

VOTE: Titus

*shrug*

That's DGB's entire ISO.

I find Math town. I sheep Math.

There's no scumhunting there. There's only a sheep.

[Titus]

@GreyIce, Can you vote Pooky with us? It's still on the Cakez wagon.

I'm pretty sure Pooky and DGB are scum. I'd policy Math if I had to, but I would rather eliminate scum.

[Titus]

There's literally zero foundation in your posts for your conclusion. You are still tunneling the same results that you were yesterday despite being off a wagon that flipped scum.

You equate progress with agreeing with you, which is a toxic mindset. Progress is anything that moves us forward in solving the game. DGB locked in my scumread of her based on her entry.

Your content here is agree with me or else I will spam up the thread, which is extremely antitown. Your mindset of only dumb people will vote Pooky is also very insulting. It also reflects you are not open to new evidence. It makes talking to you a chore and pointless.

You are on mute to conserve thread posts.

[Titus]

The way I figure is you have two choices.
1) I out the mason (s) and townfirm myself and we elim Cakez or Titus and where I demonstrated I knew who the fucking mason(s) were
Or
2) We skip to Cakez / Titus part or whoever it is as if you consider me confirmed town.

Give you the miseliminations you want or you out your theory on who the masons are? That's anti-town as fuck.

You claim the Cakez wagon wasn't all town. Yet you townread Pooky for mystical reasons. You also claim no one bussed mastina. In a Cakez scum scenario, all the scum would not be on the Cakez wagon. That makes no sense.

You are spamming and threatening anti-town behavior to get your way. You are also ignoring why I told you that you get wagoned. You claim it's because you're "on defense" and that people don't like you.

You're also acting like you're God's gift to us lower people. That's a very toxic mindset and makes people want to ignore you. This game has quite a few legends of mafia. Talking down to them the way you have and the fact they aren't voting you (mostly) for being scum is a testament to their patience.

If you think that the answer is me, Cakez, Dunn, stfu and let people see it. As a bonus, listening might show you that you're wrong.

VOTE: Mathblade

The threatening to out the masons unless we voted the miseliminations he wanted is the last straw for me. Either he starts showing humility and playing protown or he's out.

My vote only moves if a wagon on a scumread gets going in spite of him.

[Titus]

But seriously (Though I am totally serious about hammering that shit) yesterday you kinda got after me, and then claim d I was counter claiming cakez, when I wasn’t sure if even that’s what I was doing, But I know that sometimes when we’re town together and everything’s cool but sometimes it’s not and you like to take potshots at my playstyle and then I can’t tell if it’s scum you or town you doing it, But I would like to see all about cakez,

I’m having have had big motherfucking problems with Pooky and cakez interaction’s since yesterday, and I do not think both of them are town and while I think it’s some serious scum theater I could be wrong, but my one big question I ask myself is why did cakez spend all of yesterday saying I WILL END YOU POOKY!!! and then not know who to use his role on, take suggestions cuz he doesn’t know how to use his role, then use it on fucking quiet while still yelling “I WILL END YOU POOKY”?

Like does that make sense?

Does it make more sense than book trying to deflect fake paranoia on ffery yesterday at end of day over dumb bullshit? OH and then trying to false equivalency fake paranoia on me for ffery and do nothing else today? Yeah that makes sense y’all,

I don’t believe it’s impossible that w had due,in scum wagons yesterday, I think it’s entirely possible one of Pooky or cakes is scum,

The CC feeling was likely impulsive thinking given the deadline and that a CC fit into my established views and gave me a reason for you to claim at all. When I am depressed, sometimes that higher order thinking goes in a time crunch. Now I see that I was likely wrong.

I get that odd interaction in a way. Cakez role depends on finding deep scum though. Pooky is not likely deep scum, particularly given mastina flipping with no artifact.

You also claim to have understood the fundamentals of the mafia alignment,

What are these?

[Titus]

Yup so Math throwing a temper tantrum based on his read. What else is new? Pooky was under no real threat yet Mathblade outs a theory that suggests he's a mason.

It's totally wrong too. There's zero reason to crumb masons that early.

It's also troubling because Math is outright looking for masons rather than letting LLD just claim it since LLD is fucking alive.

[Titus]

I caught Titus scum and you can either keep your Math sucks bs attitude and yes I might be insufferable but forcing scum to kill me is the proper move as VT every time instead of letting Titus tunnel the fucking mason.

So let me get this straight...

You think that I as scum would just tunnel a mason knowingly rather than someone actually miseliminable. You think the proper response to that is to out your theory and start arguing on behalf of mason!pooky that might force a confirmation or not rather than letting me expose my alignment and having the wagon fall apart naturally?

Scum are never ever killing you as long as you play this arrogant Math.

I still think Math is wrong on Pooky mason for the record. We're looking at Pooky, quiet plus one imo.

[Titus]

@Prism, Can you talk to me about Bell or Bork scum?

[Titus]

@Prism, Can you talk to me about Bell or Bork scum?

What's the case for it?

Bell is hardtown and the fact you're pushing there is a giant redflag.

Bork is less town but hasn't done anything terrible, slight defense of mastina was fine imo.

It's my eyeball guess by looking at the EoD wagons. I tend to trust that more than my reads. I agree on Bell being a stronger townread based on play.

My goal for today is to understand why mastina flipped over SirCakez and to find the scum voting for mastina to finish my theory.

[Titus]

Good morning.

@Sircakez, what was your result on Quiet?

@Titus, I'd ask what about my voting patterns EOD seemed like scum. But let's be real, I'm going to be dissatisfied no matter what your answer is.

I was spitballing based on looking at wagon spots on the mastina wagon. It's not a detailed VCA. I'm not satisfied with it either, hence why I reached out.

[Titus]

This slot is blatantly town to me and I would strongly recommend sitting through the end of day and really tracking through the actual votes if they're giving you a vaguely bad feeling. You will have to do a lot of work to successfully get this slot flipped.

This is something I need to do when I have the mental clarity and focus. I just eyeballed it.

If we suppose that Pooky and DGB are scum, like my theory suggests, one scum should be on mastina. I would suspect that's later on the wagon. I could be wrong there, particularly given this setup.

If Pooky is town and Cakez is scum, then the mastina wagon should have more scum on it. I really doubt Cakez is scum though.

[Titus]

You're devoting most of your posts to telling MathBlade why he's wrong, but you actively think he's Town. I'm concerned that you're doing this instead of pushing scum or visibly trying to get reads on others.

Correcting Math is my way of pushing Pooky. With Math screaming Pooky is a mason, it's very hard to get an elimination there. Pooky is scum by PoE unless Cakez is scum. I struggle to see an all town counterwagon on town (well after mastina) when scum could have switched to Sir Cakez.

The only way SirCakez and Pooky are both town is scum being ineffectual and unable to jump. That leaves us with a lurker scumteam, including DGB.

DGB I felt was scum separately. Her entrance just saying Math is town and then leaving shows zero scumhunting. Did she read the thread? Does she have thoughts? It's hard to push her when she doesn't post and there's someone posting they are better than everyone else.

That leaves the last slot, which is likely on mastina. Where is the catch though? If Cakez is town, like I suspect, then it would likely be somewhat towards the front, preventing a Cakez swing. If Cakez is scum, then the vote is towards the back end. Of course either way could be in the middle, which is why I focused there.

[Titus]

That leaves the last slot, which is likely on mastina. Where is the catch though? If Cakez is town, like I suspect, then it would likely be somewhat towards the front, preventing a Cakez swing. If Cakez is scum, then the vote is towards the back end. Of course either way could be in the middle, which is why I focused there.

What are your thoughts on bork? Are you willing to vote there today?

Yes, I would vote there today. Bork and I had some conflict yesterday where I thought he could be scum independent of the VCA.

Meanwhile, Pooky is making a good point against Cakez there. While I want to believe I was wrong yesterday, it could be that Cakez is a scum PR.

My preference is still DGB given how yesterday played out.

I would vote Bork though.

This is short of the reread I should do (but might not do) of the end of day 1.

[Titus]

Math is behaving, so I'll move my vote to my best suspect.

VOTE: DGB

@Bell, Why flip Cakez before Pooky?

@Math, Why does DGB keep avoiding your scumpool? How do you feel about the consensus being towards DGB scum?

[Titus]

3) This really feels like you’re aiming for anyone but you that will find purchase. Who do you think could be scum with DGB? And don’t say Pooky. Pretend that’s a mod clear.

My reads have been pretty clear
DGB
Pooky or Cakez
One on the mastina wagon, leaning Bork but needs review.

[Titus]

3) This really feels like you’re aiming for anyone but you that will find purchase. Who do you think could be scum with DGB? And don’t say Pooky. Pretend that’s a mod clear.

My reads have been pretty clear
DGB
Pooky or Cakez
One on the mastina wagon, leaning Bork but needs review.

Then why not do Cakez? That has just as much agreement IMHO than DGB. DGB is such a blah elimination.

Sometimes a blah elimination is just the right one. Quiet abandoned the game and DGB is doing nothing but agree with you and not because she thinks you're right.

Cakez I still strongly feel is town. I only have him as scum if Pooky is town, and I don't buy Pooky town although that is weakening. I'm just not interested there.

If you want to scumhunt with me, let's find the scum that bussed mastina. If you feel Cakez is scum, mastina's wagon should have scum trying to save him.

[Titus]

3) This really feels like you’re aiming for anyone but you that will find purchase. Who do you think could be scum with DGB? And don’t say Pooky. Pretend that’s a mod clear.

My reads have been pretty clear
DGB
Pooky

or Cakez

One on the mastina wagon, leaning Bork but needs review.

Then why not do Cakez? That has just as much agreement IMHO than DGB. DGB is such a blah elimination.

Sometimes a blah elimination is just the right one. Quiet abandoned the game and DGB is doing nothing but agree with you and not because she thinks you're right.

Cakez I still strongly feel is town.

I only have him as scum if Pooky is town, and I don't buy Pooky town although that is weakening. I'm just not interested there.

If you want to scumhunt with me, let's find the scum that bussed mastina. If you feel Cakez is scum, mastina's wagon should have scum trying to save him.

Really Titus? You start the day making the correct argument that we should be looking for scum on the Cakez wagon, and now today you’re saying “let’s look on the Mastina wagon”. You have Cakez as a scumread yet strongly feel he is town.

Why the change in wagon Titus? And why is a strong townread in your scum PoE?

And lol I townread Bork so probably not Bork. If I have to guess the scum on Mastina it would be in {Spiffeh, GreyICE, Prism, or Bell (moonlogic here but still possible) } but those reads drastically change depending upon Cakez’s alignment and how each slot plays today.

Cakez is not a scumread. It's a PoE if Pooky is town. The votes don't make sense unless one of them is scum. I strongly think it's Pooky.

The rest of the wagon solves itself. Dunn and mastina aren't scum together because early neighboring votes would overload. LLD is an outright mason claim. We're us.

There's nothing further to be mined there right now.

DGB is the second scum.

That leaves the last scum on the mastina wagon. That one partially depends on Pooky/Cakez.

Why do you TR Bork?
Talk to me about GreyICE read.

[Titus]

@Math, I have been discussing hypotheticals if Pooky is town and Cakez is scum. In that case, the scum on the mastina wagon is Bork or backwards. If Pooky is scum, it's Bork or forwards. I find you're fixated on the Pooky is a mason and refusing to consider the possibility of Pooky being scum.

I'm not clear on why you TR Bork still.

GreyICE is someone I should review. The willing to murder me and chainsaw defense was odd. mastina's play around me was odd. Scum's play around me as a whole was odd.

[Titus]

A chainsaw is when someone attacks the attacker of someone else.

For example, Adam attacks Brian. Charlie then attacks Adam usually for his attack on Brian. That's a chainsaw.

Sometimes a chainsaw is from scum defending a partner but not always. It can and commonly is town defending town.

Catching up now.

[Titus]

VLA Tuesday Wednesday

I'm spending 10-15 hours on the road tomorrow and I'm already very behind. This was almost a sub out request but I really want to try to finish.

[Titus]

Cakez is not a scumread. It's a PoE if Pooky is town. The votes don't make sense unless one of them is scum. I strongly think it's Pooky.

Titus, what exactly do you mean by this line.

Which votes do not make sense unless one of me and Cake is scum?

The end of day wagon does not make sense unless one of you or Cakez is scum.

If you and Cakez are both town, then we get a scenario that should not exist. Namely, an all town counterwagon to scum.

[Titus]

I'm not catching up, as I don't have time to play that way. I'm going to look at the VCs instead. Tomorrow may be better for a catchup but I may just play from wherever I can. Don't be surprised if I miss some content.

[Titus]

Afternoon Vote Count 1.14

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
MathBlade (2): Battle Mage, Bell
Titus (6): sangres, SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, MathBlade
SirCakez (3): mastina, Dunnstral, Titus
mastina (1): GreyICE

Not voting (3): Tammy, Prism, Kitty Trauma Team


Mod notes: 67/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

I like GreyICE as town based on him being the first on mastina. It's a weaker read but very good for today. I like Dunn as well for town based on being a counter to mastina yet voting next to her. Both individually suggest town. Together would make me shocked if Dunn flipped scum.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.15

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
MathBlade (1): Battle Mage
Titus (5): SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, MathBlade
SirCakez (4): mastina, Dunnstral, Titus, Kitty Trauma Team
mastina (4): GreyICE, sangres, Bell, Prism

Not voting (1): Tammy


Mod notes: 69/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Prodding GreyICE

Here suggests an ineffective scumteam unless the votes change dramatically in the next VC. I see zero movement onto my slot and only movement to mastina. Bell and Prism are in the most frequent bus spots but are pretty town by play. My theory should bear fruit in later VCs.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.16

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (3): quiet, MathBlade, SirCakez
Titus (3): borkjerfkin, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear
SirCakez (4): mastina, Dunnstral, Titus, Kitty Trauma Team
mastina (6): GreyICE, sangres, Bell, Prism, Battle Mage, Spiffeh

Not voting (1): Tammy


Mod notes: 74/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Battle Mage had been sitting on a Math vote for quite some time (his VLA might be a small part). He's largely lifeless though but casts a vote on mastina. This suggests a bus vote to me.

Mathblade and SirCakez both move to Dunn rather than staying on the larger counterwagon (me), effectively killing it. While they moved to vote likely town instead of scum, killing a counterwagon on town gives townpoints.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.16b

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (6): quiet, MathBlade, SirCakez, Battle Mage, Spiffeh, Titus
Titus (3): borkjerfkin, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear
SirCakez (3): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team
mastina (4): GreyICE, sangres, Bell, Prism

Not voting (1): Tammy


Mod notes: 76/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Battle Mage backs off his mastina vote when a counterwagon on Cakez appears. Major scumpoints.

He gives momentum for the Dunn wagon and I specifically recall him asking me to join.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.17

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (4): quiet, MathBlade, SirCakez, Spiffeh
Titus (1): borkjerfkin
SirCakez (6): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus
mastina (5): GreyICE, sangres, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy
Mathblade (1): Bell

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 77/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Battle Mage jumps back to mastina here. LLD and Pooky jump to SirCakez. Pooky's vote is the only one that makes sense as a chance to save SirCakez that could be scum here.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.18

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (3): quiet, SirCakez, Spiffeh
Titus (1): borkjerfkin
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (5): GreyICE, sangres, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy
Mathblade (1): Bell

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 79/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

I don't think Math is scum, despite his proscum vote here. He's flagging as the townbeard all the way.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.19

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (7): GreyICE, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy, SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Bell
Mathblade (1): Sangres

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 81/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening
LLD is V/LA.

Positive looks for Bork and Bell in context here, assuming Cakez is town. They could have easily sat back and let SirCakez happen.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.20

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (7): GreyICE, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy, SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Bell
Mathblade (1): Sangres

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 83/85 pages used (switching to post count here: 2078/2125 posts)

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening
LLD is V/LA.

Final Afternoon Vote Count

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (1): quiet
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (9--BRONZED): GreyICE, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy, SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Bell, Sangres, Spiffeh

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 83/85 pages used (switching to post count here: 2080/2125 posts)

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening
LLD is V/LA.

Flip incoming

Townpoints for Spiffeh as well here but weaker. He could have been forced scum hammer but that's unlikely.

‐--------

Conclusion: DGB and Battle Mage are confident scumreads. Pooky is a scumlean.

[Titus]

Titus, there is only so long I can defend you.

I understand that you're struggling to find time to play, and that even when you do have time motivation is an issue.

But you need to supplement your VCA with thoughtful reads. If you can't do it today, okay, but if you're going to do it never eliminating you is not a question of if but when. That doesn't mean you have to come back and townread the right people, if you come back and say "The team is Prism Bell LLD" then as long as you can defend it that's fine with me. This is a team game and we make up for each other's weaknesses as we go, but I have gone very, very far out of my way to protect you in a way that is becoming increasingly indefensible without more thoughtful reads on your part.

I appreciate this and I will make a reads based priority list this weekend. Maybe tomorrow but I may be drained and stuck contributing my way. Just know even if I fail, your request was heard.

It's very hard to separate my reads by play from my VCA as my VCA colors my reads.

[Titus]

A horrendous VCA she strongly believes in is probably a town tell for her.

What's horrible about it? You seem intent to come in and criticize me (discredit if in a negative mood). Do you disagree with my conclusion on Battle Mage? It's even fueled with some in thread events.

[Titus]

UNVOTE:

I think Titus is town. A horrendous VCA she strongly believes in is probably a town tell for her.

I'm just not sure dgb makes this post as scum knowing that's where her vote is or instead maybe unvoting or i don't fucking know but this isn't it

help

I think that post shows DGB's agenda. She doesn't care about sorting me, she cares about discrediting me.

P.S. We had our issues but you're town for the day based on my VCA.

[Titus]

I was looking at BM's ISO to where he tried to persuade me to vote Dunn but that was Spiffeh. My memory was wrong.

However, BM did ask Cakez for an exit hatch on voting mastina in his ISO.

[Titus]

I just want to note my hero solve here is GreyICE, DGB, B_M and I strongly doubt it's right but I want it on paper.

We can work together on DGB and BM.

[Titus]

It would be absurd for me to agree that Battle Mage is scum based on the VCA.

Correct but I was asking what you thought of him independently of that. Sorry it may have been unclear.

[Titus]

Like the kills >> One on each wagon points to Cakez scum
Wagon stall eod while counter wagon majority town >> points to Cakez scum
Mastina dead voting Cakez while speaking about Prism >> points to Cakez scum
Mastina defends/WK Titus >> NAI but Mastina thought it important enough to do , why and not me? Titus’s reads bad D1? Maybe she thinks I see through it?

The only thing giving me pause is why Mastina walls right there. SirCakez is scum by almost every metric I can think of except my Mastina makes a certain post unless it’s Cakez Titus BM
I just don’t think I am hero solving based on gut.

Going to bed now but I hope I explained why Cakez and Titus are good flips

This gives me pause.

1) Why do you feel both kills came from scum? If both kills did come from scum LLD likely has a read on scum (or she could dispel that notion). A scum vig is unlikely. Two kills by scum is just unlikely thus "one kill on each wagon points to Cakez" is likely wrong. The fact you start there is alarming and troublesome.

2) Wagon stall at EoD doesn't say anything about Cakez alignment. Most wagons are majority town.

3) mastina talking about Prism was likely trying to attack the townblock. It says zero about Cakez alignment. Also, VCA tries to look at just the votes (although if we purely did that LLD would look really bad).

4) I was under more threat than you and mastina wanted a miselim for later. Plus, I bought her Prism case. I was already pocketed.

That being said, I'll try to redo my VCA with Cakez scum. I don't buy it but I'll take a look. I won't do Dunn scum as it would be blatantly intellectually dishonest as I see little to no way I am wrong there.

[Titus]

@LLD, If an artifact has a vig, please state who you gave it to.

[Titus]

Outside of the mason claim, is anyone townreading LLD?

[Titus]

Outside of the mason claim, is anyone townreading LLD?

It’s all related to the mason claim and her behavior and timing surrounding it. I think her claim has legitimacy in part because she claimed early, it was unlikely to be a fake claim provided by cabd or penguin and it was proactively done. Eye brows are going to be raised if she lives much longer.

I don’t think this is a productive avenue for exploration.
In your previous experience with lld fake claiming mason, did they do it so early?

Yes. She was in a hood with Katsuki and convinced them(?) to go along. I'll try to find the game.

[Titus]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=80832 Here is the game.

[Titus]

So if we assume LLD is not a mason, Pooky is almost certainly still town for crumbing mason with LLD.

Pooky disavowed those "crumbs". You are tunneled on Pooky town.

[Titus]

I think (GI, DGB, Cakez, Titus, Dunn, Math, BM) holds all 3 scum.

Interesting about Math. Talk to me more about that. Some things he said within the past couple days are worrisome. If he is scum, he could be trying to chain miseliminate me and Cakez. That doesn't explain his Dunn flash vote.

Also, talk to me about Dunn. He makes no sense with the vote patterns.

[Titus]

@Math, why flash Dunn? Independently of Cakez v Pooky, Dunn should be obvtown by votes.

[Titus]

@Math, why flash Dunn? Independently of Cakez v Pooky, Dunn should be obvtown by votes.

Because I want to see DGB/Cakez/Prism’s reaction.

All three scumread Dunn. I am trying to explore the situation if you and I and Cakez are all town then Dunn is scum by PoE so seeing reactions.

Again. It's Pooky or LLD or you.

[Titus]

Titus - How well does mathbladeread you typically?

He only reads me as town as scum. As town, he scumreads disagreement. He doubles down on bad logic, even when proven false. As scum, he must fake it. He'll scumread me if I am right.

[Titus]

@Cakez, We agree on practically everything, yet you feel my posts are bad. Cog dis?

[Titus]

Bork is a bad elimination.

It's DGB BM and one of Cakez/Pooky/Math/LLD.

[Titus]

Again, Math posts are totally divorced from reality.

1) He whines about people not looking at the Cakez wagon. I have the most votes.

2) He argues Cakez is scum and that his partners all decided to bus him. (That's a Cakez Dunn Titus team).

3) He argues that Pooky crumbed being a mason still despite Pooky saying not a crumb in 2559.

4) He argues for two scumkills, yet doesn't push LLD for an explanation as to what happens with the artifacts as that would be the most logical source for a second scumkill.

Mathblade's response here is to discredit and divert attention from DGB and BM. Either it's because of partners or it doesn't fit into his absurd theory.

[Titus]

I am trying to help get an explanation for DGB scum other than quiet lurked on D1.

DGB being scum is likely why scum couldn't flip the wagon to Cakez.

[Titus]

@Math and DGB - What are your thoughts on BM?

@Tammy, You're largely right. I do have some doubts based on his recent posting but still probably town. I see him trying to force a Cakez scum PoV and a hunt on the Cakez wagon which makes no sense if Cakez was the more valuable slot over mastina. If Mathblade's theory holds, then the Cakez wagon could be all town. He's not acting according to that theory. That could be an agenda. He uses things like 2 scum kills to justify his position, which isn't certain given what info we have. He's trying to dictate the game solve according to his parameters rather than where the evidence takes us.

[Titus]

Can we not wait until the last minute to eliminate someone this time?

Why is DGB voting Titus atm when they have made like 6 posts about Titus being town lmao

Did you check the votecount? There's a reason why I'm keeping it there despite the read, at least for now. I'm waiting for something.

This is why we wait until the last minute.

[Titus]

I am expecting next week to be lighter so I can do a readwall on each player by play if I can't get to it Sunday. I'm not going to be able to do in depth posting tomorrow because that's DnD day.

[Titus]

VLA this weekend. Birthday weekend.

[Titus]

Thanks Bell.

VOTE: Prism

[Titus]

The other mason outting today would be a bad idea

I agree.

Third unless they are wagoned.

[Titus]

@Prism, I hard scumread DGB too. It's not scummy to be wrong. I'm literally baffled now outside of BM and I should reevaluate that.

[Titus]

@Prism, I hard scumread DGB too. It's not scummy to be wrong. I'm literally baffled now outside of BM and I should reevaluate that.

I mean yeah, being wrong happens all the time, but am I your choice for the artifact?

Yes. As far as I am concerned, everyone was wrong yesterday. So accuracy is a non factor, so that leaves strength of a townread.

[Titus]

@Prism, I hard scumread DGB too. It's not scummy to be wrong. I'm literally baffled now outside of BM and I should reevaluate that.

I mean yeah, being wrong happens all the time, but am I your choice for the artifact?

Yes. As far as I am concerned, everyone was wrong yesterday. So accuracy is a non factor, so that leaves strength of a townread.

“Everyone” was not wrong and if “everyone” was then you should be doing VCA to find the scum in Cakez/Dunn or why Mastina was bussed and how DGB ended up elimmed.

Accuracy a non factor my ass.

FMPOV, there were two choices yesterday. Me and DGB. Both were town. So everyone was wrong yesterday.

As for Day 1, I still need to reassess knowing that DGB wasn't the reason that the mastina wagon was flipped over SirCakez.

I have talked about the bussing of mastina and how I felt that was BM.

My question for you...why haven't you looked for the mastina bussers if you felt SirCakez was saved scum?

[Titus]

What reassessing did you attempt overnight?

None. I was VLA during night phase for our birthday.

[Titus]

Why do we have to hand off the artifact in the first few hours of the day?

Save posts imo. Why rock the boat if no one SRs Prism?

[Titus]

It is very unclear why you townread me Titus, originally Day 1 my being town was based off of it not being me/Cakez. You've already had one scum white knight you this game. I have yet to see you substantially tackle either my or mastina's end of our interactions.

The way you reached out to me and your frustration felt very town in the way you said that I can't defend you if you don't put out more. Second, I feel scum, like mastina, were better off whiteknighting me given my position of defeatism in the thread. They didn't want to all of defend me though due to losing the miselimination.

I usually don't read through EoD interactions. VCA is how I reflect and reread generally.

[Titus]

VLA and work is why I haven't gotten to it.

[Titus]

I can reset in thread. I do what I can, when I can.

How does my post contradict where I push Pooky? I specifically haven't pushed Pooky heavily today at all either.

[Titus]

From my PoV, scum can be Pooky as well. Just because LLD is a mason doesn't mean Pooky is. You continue to noisily tunnel that perspective and refuse to consider any chance you are wrong. That's doubly concerning given Pooky's position as a possible attempt to swing the wagon to SirCakez.

Dunn is most likely not scum, but I intend to verify that mastina and Dunn were the first two votes on the Cakez wagon. The first two votes being on Cakez both being scum is an overload and unlikely. If Dunn is scum and I am wrong, Cakez almost certainly is not. Cakez and Dunn are not SvS.

Cakez and Dunn are both very likely town. If Cakez is scum, his wagon is likely pure with the exception of Pooky and we're looking at scum on the back end of the mastina wagon.

Who is scum on the mastina wagon in both Cakez scum and Cakez town worlds?

[Titus]

Cakez scum would suggest scum in bork or bell. Sangres, the decider, wasn't scum. Spiffeh's hammer is null because he'd have to hammer anything but I lean town on Spiffeh because mastina was scum and he could have lurked out. That means looking towards the people who made mastina an option. Bell and bork.

However, if Cakez is town, then bork and bell are likely town as well. The Cakez wagon would have scum, which leads me towards you/Pooky by PoE.

[Titus]

You asked for my opinions prior to my reset and you're simultaneously complaining that I am giving them.

You also dodged the question about who is scum on the mastina wagon. That's very much an agenda. Your reads being in sync on Cakez is not a reason, by itself, to townread anyone.

You're trying to deter me from townreading both Cakez and Dunn or threatening to eliminate me because you don't like my opinion. That's an agenda.

You're pushing agendas rather than scumhunting.

You're not asking why mastina went through over SirCakez. You're supposing the answer and insisting on a result from that assumption. You're assuming Pooky is town and trying to force that assumption on the rest of us, despite assuming Pooky scum making more sense in your narrative.

You're one of the swing votes attempting to push the wagon from mastina to SirCakez. Yet, you've done zero reanalysis since mastina flipped scum.

You have an agenda here. You're refusing anything outside of it. That's forcing a reset on your slot.

[Titus]

FWIW Math, I'd be interested in a Titus or SirCakez flip today, but probably Titus more. I think Titus-scum is smart enough to know that playing off Mathblade is a good way to post lots without really furthering anything or getting a lot of scrutiny. And I trust Titus to read me better than SirCakez would, so Titus looking for a cheap mis-elim on me yesterday looked worse. But I'd be fine with either. Yesterday didn't split the pack much, as the DGB elim was almost unanimous somehow...

This post gets several things wrong

1) DGB elimination was not near unanimous. There was a counter on me.

2) I have, and continue to get, scrutiny for pushing back on Math. My goal is not to avoid scrutiny but to stop an agenda that almost certainly leads to eliminations on townreads.

3) Characterizing my push on DGB as a cheap miselimination search is wrong. I had a theory that I wanted to test.

On another note, how can you have zero townreads?

[Titus]

But if Titus is adamantly refusing to actually let me hunt in my PoE and figure out what the fuck is up with Cakez today I can and will tunnel her into oblivion if she’s going to continue to be an antitown player who doesn’t reset. I do not have the spoons to figure out if it is malicious.

You can hunt in your PoE. No one is stopping you. I just won't say that I think your PoE has any merit whatsoever. Your PoE for today consists entirely of a counterwagon to flipped scum while insisting that the target of the counterwagon is scum. It's nonsense that I want no part of. You're perfectly free to work around me though. Continuing to ask me the same questions and using that as an excuse to a) not hunt at all on the mastina wagon and b) claim that you are unable to hunt in your PoE is utter antitown garbage.

If I am that much of a nuisance, stop talking to me and hunt.

[Titus]

If SirCakez is town, then scum failed to save their buddy. So scum are in (you,Dunn).
If SirCakez is scum, then definitionally there is scum on the Cakez wagon.

If SirCakez is town, Dunn's vote did nothing to save his wagon. Dunn's vote predated the mastina wagon mostly and thus could not be a vote to save SirCakez.

Me, based solely on VCA, is fair. So is Pooky by that standard. So are you as the last vote.

If SirCakez is scum, then the wagon on SirCakez likely does not contain bussers given his PR claim and the counter onto mastina. If SirCakez is scum, he's clearly the more valuable and it makes sense to search off wagon.

Searching off wagon makes little sense though given the play of most of the mastina wagon.


Hero Solve: Math, Pooky, Battle Mage

[Titus]

He just usually isn’t so lurky/hyperfocused as town.

Bell has the fourth most posts and posted 14 hours ago. He's not lurky.

[Titus]

He just usually isn’t so lurky/hyperfocused as town.

Bell has the fourth most posts and posted 14 hours ago. He's not lurky.

He is though. He’s not memorable.

All he does is push me then leave.

He does not comment on anything going on.

Lurking isn’t defined by post count.

Active lurking is still lurking.

If Bell was active lurking, like you say he is, he would not be a consensus townread. He's pushing against you, yet you have no memory of what he says. You have zero attempts to engage him to figure out why he this you're scummy or his reads.

If Bell was spamming, people would call him out for it by now. Bell isn't playing in your paradigm, so you've chosen to dismiss his content instead.

[Titus]

I'll make a mental note to relook at GreyIce in my VCA. Both Tammy and Bell had an issue with him and I think (although memory could be wrong) Prism did too.

[Titus]

I'll be reassessing Grey but thinking through this again with Math, there's no way Cakez or Dunn is scum.

So that means Pooky and/or Math are.
Battle Mage is still scum.

If one of my hero solve is wrong, I'll look for that in my VCA. In fact, I usually scumread a townbeard based on my VCA, so that's a thing.

[Titus]

I'll be reassessing Grey but thinking through this again with Math, there's no way Cakez or Dunn is scum.

So that means Pooky and/or Math are.
Battle Mage is still scum.

If one of my hero solve is wrong, I'll look for that in my VCA. In fact, I usually scumread a townbeard based on my VCA, so that's a thing.

Yes by thinking through it you did absolutely no VCA and kept the same opinions.

I am shocked /sarcasm.

I haven't done my VCA because I have been waiting in court all day. However, I do have significant memory of the Cakez wagon composition. Nothing changes the fact Dunn and mastina were neighbor votes or that Cakez was a hotly contested wagon to flipped scum.

I still intend to check my work, but I see no compelling reason to change my mind on Cakez or Dunn.

I'll be looking at you, GreyICE, BattleMage and Pooky as major sources on my ReVCA. I'll still be checking to see if Dunn and mastina actually were neighbors on the SirCakez wagon though as that's a big reason I am clearing him.

[Titus]

Right now, given my lack of time today, the bad facts against me, it seems proper to accept my miselimination. I needed to be right on my DGB theory. I wasn't.

Of course that locks in Pooky scum, which Math will drown out with accusations that Pooky is a mason. No one else (besides Math) makes sense as a defining swing vote to send SirCakez over mastina. Math reads more like a townbeard but the refusal to even engage me in good faith on the mastina wagon or Pooky (admitting he might be wrong) is just demoralizing. Either a) I'm dealing with a wrong town with an infinite amount of time on his hands to spew bullshit and not listen to anyone which makes it ten times harder to get scum like Battle Mage eliminated who we both agree might be scum or b) is scum spamming preventing any sort of investigation to try and force three town miseliminations. It's like that guy pushing a rock up a hill. I get a glimmer of hope that I'll get a rational conversation when I try, but then the rock slips into Pooky is a mason, my reads are the one true reads and you must agree to be town and only my discussions are valid. We have a strongish townblock that mostly consists of my townreads so I can accept not pushing this rock anymore once I get out my final reads which I pray will be tomorrow. I am seeing nothing after my 3pm errand barring an explosion at work.

I might get to it tonight but that depends on if I find the energy.

[Titus]

Reads by play

2. Tammy* - Relatively solid town (this would be where I'd look for a paranoia read but unlikely). Tammy tends to be a solid town when town and I see that here. Someone could argue her treatment of me is scum looking to pocket but it feels more like compassion.
3. borkjerfkin - Moderate town - I did have some conflict with him earlier, but I like his responses in hindsight. He doesn't seem overly defenses or OMGUSy.
4. SirCakez - Weaker town - I've been fooled by Cakez before recently but nothing he's done feels particularly scummy. His attempt to try and push Pooky I feel particularly endearing.
8. Bell - Moderate town - The frustration with Math feels pretty genuine here. He's been a pretty vocal presence and the opposite generally of when I last caught him as scum. He got so demoralized after being caught for the wrong reasons. Scum!Bell tends to telegraph his pushes. The fact that Bell hasn't jumped on me despite having tried to push me in the past and I'm in a weaker position here. This makes me feel relatively good about calling Bell town.
9. Spiffeh - GTMH town - Spiffeh hasn't been supermemorable but I'm not holding that against him. His pushes haven't come across as fake. So this read is more of a lack of scummy than a presence of town. Given most slots are town, that's GMTH town.
10. GreyICE** - Weak scum - He feels overly hostile and his interactions leave a sour taste in my mouth. Particularly the defining a chainsaw discussion. It felt more like a gotcha than a reasonable attempt at discussion. I can't really get a feel for what he's trying to accomplish.
11. PookyTheMagicalBear - Moderate scum - This would be a strong scumread but his Cakez wall felt like there might be a chance at town there. I don't see Pooky actually hunting but resting on his charm. His passing the buck to LLD for his Cakez vote was particularly bad. Doubly so if Cakez is town.
12. Titus - Demotivated town
13. MathBlade - Frustrating null. I want to call him town, but his play is so anti-town in trying to control everything.
15. Prism - Solid town. I like his overall pushes, mastina tried to shade him. I don't feel him trying to sort me is coming from a negative place even though he doesn't understand my thought pattern can be erratic as town. Scum would just write me off as scum rather than trying to solve my thought processes.
16. Dunnstral - Weak town - I see Dunn as a little more passive than I'd like but we all can't be cooks in the kitchen.
17. Battle Mage -Strong scum - He claims no solid townreads by day 3. He's been a joke impression. His trajectory on mastina is horrible. He has no pushes besides me today and that's his first. He was almost certainly bussing mastina.

[Titus]

@Pooky, I feel it is but I need to take a more detailed approach and refind it. Right now I'm doing my VCA though.

@Prism, There's more than just the sheer numbers involved. I'll go more into this but BM's vote comes between and 1950 and 1991. There's two factors I'll look to check on in my VCA regarding this vote. Namely, did my jump kill the Dunn wagon and did Bell jump off prior to BM's move? If my vote moved first, then the Dunn miselimination is dead and the mastina wagon is gaining momentum. I'll look at his ISO to answer your question but my memory of him jumping on just to catch the bus. The votes according to my memory of the day play support a Battle Mage bus.

[Titus]

Well I went to check it and it turns out Battle Mage did back off of the Dunn wagon before I did. That means I'll have to take a fresh look at that move in my redone VCA.

[Titus]

It is very unclear to me what made his progression horrible if the only thing you had in mind to point to was a vague idea of vote timing.

The progression was the fact that I thought BM panicked as he saw the mastina wagon growing. That apparently seems to be incorrect.

[Titus]

Afternoon Vote Count 1.08

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
MathBlade (5): Bell, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, Battle Mage, GreyICE
Titus (4): sangres, Prism, SirCakez, MathBlade
SirCakez (4): mastina, Kitty Trauma Team, Dunnstral, Titus

Not voting (2): Tammy, borkjerfkin


Mod notes: 51/85 pages used

Afternoon Vote Count 1.15

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
MathBlade (1): Battle Mage
Titus (5): SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, MathBlade
SirCakez (4): mastina, Dunnstral, Titus, Kitty Trauma Team
mastina (4): GreyICE, sangres, Bell, Prism

Not voting (1): Tammy


Mod notes: 69/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Prodding GreyICE

The static nature of Math v Cakez v me indicates at max 1 scum. mastina and Dunn were not neighbors on the Cakez wagon. There is conftown in the middle. Still if Dunn is scum, then the Cakez wagon is overloaded here. It seems most likely that we're looking at T v T v T and scum didn't care.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.16

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (3): quiet, MathBlade, SirCakez
Titus (3): borkjerfkin, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear
SirCakez (4): mastina, Dunnstral, Titus, Kitty Trauma Team
mastina (6): GreyICE, sangres, Bell, Prism, Battle Mage, Spiffeh

Not voting (1): Tammy


Mod notes: 74/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Here's the first mastina wagon. Counters are me, Cakez and Dunn. My wagon has been dying for awhile. Sircakez and Mathblade both jumped to Dunn, effectively killing my wagon. It's a net null because they killed one town wagon to start another on likely town. Both act like townbeards.

Also worth noting that GreyIce wasn't the first on this wagon. Math (point in his favor) and Bell voted first but left the wagon for various reasons. Bell coming back is a better look for him. Math not coming back is a minor point against him. I'm more persuaded by Math voting scum alone.

Spiffeh voting here could be a bus. We have GreyIce (early stayer), sangres (conftown), Bell (comes and goes off... weak town on that), Prism (solid town by play), Battle Mage (who gets townier for later [I originally thought BM was consistently bussing when the mastina wagon took off but he's a momentum shifter)], and then Spiffeh who largely has been silent on the T v T v T wagons.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.16b

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (6): quiet, MathBlade, SirCakez, Battle Mage, Spiffeh, Titus
Titus (3): borkjerfkin, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear
SirCakez (3): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team
mastina (4): GreyICE, sangres, Bell, Prism

Not voting (1): Tammy


Mod notes: 76/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Both Battle Mage and Spiffeh jump here. I think Spiffeh tried to convince me to vote Dunn here (need to check). If he did and didn't on mastina, that's an indication of a bus.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.17

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (4): quiet, MathBlade, SirCakez, Spiffeh
Titus (1): borkjerfkin
SirCakez (6): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus
mastina (5): GreyICE, sangres, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy
Mathblade (1): Bell

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 77/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

We have Battle Mage abandoning and starting to kill the Dunn wagon. I moved from one town to another town that countered scum, so I get I look bad here. Tammy jumps onto scum mastina here, which is a good look for her given her large silence.

On Cakez we have scum, town, town, town, ?, town. I just can't buy Pooky town in that VC there. I just can't.

Afternoon Vote Count 1.18

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (3): quiet, SirCakez, Spiffeh
Titus (1): borkjerfkin
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (5): GreyICE, sangres, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy
Mathblade (1): Bell

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 79/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening

Afternoon Vote Count 1.19

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (2): quiet, Spiffeh
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (7): GreyICE, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy, SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Bell
Mathblade (1): Sangres

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 81/85 pages used

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening
LLD is V/LA.

Bell and Bork jump onto mastina, tying the wagons. Either could go to SirCakez and get a likely town miselimination.

The only way those two should be considered as scum is with a SirCakez flip.

Final Afternoon Vote Count

Afternoon 1 will end in (expired on 2021-03-01 23:59:59)

With 17 players alive, it takes 9 votes to Bronze.

Dunnstral (1): quiet
SirCakez (7): mastina, Dunnstral, Kitty Trauma Team, Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalbear, Titus, MathBlade
mastina (9--BRONZED): GreyICE, Prism, Battle Mage, Tammy, SirCakez, borkjerfkin, Bell, Sangres, Spiffeh

Not voting (0):


Mod notes: 83/85 pages used (switching to post count here: 2080/2125 posts)

Battle Mage is V/LA until Monday evening
LLD is V/LA.

Flip incoming

We know quiet slot was town. We know KTT was town. We know LLD was town. Dunn is likely town because scum scum likely don't park together that long. That leaves Pooky and Math to try and save the wagon. Math has consistently voted as a townbeard though aside from his early mastina vote. So I'm really liking Poooky as the vote to try and save mastina.

Spiffeh's VCA looks worse in this second go around.

A lot of the usual town suspects still came back as town this go around, Cakez, Dunn, Tammy, Bork, Bell, Math (as beard), and Prism.

My revised solve would be Spiffeh, GreyIce, Pooky. Although GreyIce isn't that confident of a read. He's more a PoE VCA.

[Titus]

And what if Cakez is scum?

Where is your VCA for that?

You keep saying Cakez is likely town.

What this reads to me is elim Cakez and if he flips red elim you, or elim you first in the PoE of three because of vote orders when LLD+Pooky were a leashed unit and your VCA is not accounting for that. Even if you disagree with the mason read VCA should treat LLD+Pooky as one position.

The VCA suggests Cakez is likely town. I have suggested multiple times throughout this thread what the situation would be if Cakez is scum. I don't buy it based on my VCA or what would have to be scum if wrong as I townread those slots. We've been over that ad finetum and I don't care to rehash it until you give a Pooky scum discussion. You aren't discussing with me in good faith until you consider the possibility you may be wrong. I have no problem reconsidering when my assumptions are bad. I do have a problem having the same discussion 5000 times.

Either do an analysis supposing Pooky scum, or shut up about me redoing my analysis again supposing SirCakez scum.

[Titus]

someone talk to me about the game, something interesting and fresh.

Also, Pooky got my back so he better not vote anywhere I don't vote.

I'm watching you bear. That foam finger should have my face on it.

Literally anywhere LLD voted Pooky would vote.

This feels like the billionth time I have quoted this post:

How many times do they say “got your back” with each other?

So many times they need to open a firey bear spa.

Foam finger in LLD’s avatar is a #1. Top town reads are your #1 reads aka mason partner

I can do this all day Titus.

Your VCA is flawed or you’re scum here.

You should have put me in it if you’re scum.

Enough with this mason spam ffs.

Pooky and LLD were buddying. Masons don't openly act like that. You're so dead set on Pooky mason that you're not willing to have a rational discussion.

Until you're willing to consider you may be wrong, we have nothing to talk about.