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[Rathe]

i agree with drippinggoofball 100% n i think her concern makes her town

[Rathe]

i think if she was scum she wouldnt care u dont need to fake that

[Rathe]

What about a neighborhood with two traitors, the town kills one, then the other traitor is treated as conftown because no mod would have a neighborhood of two traitors?

Assuming alignments in a neighborhood is always bad. It could have been maf + traitor too to give a chance to figure out who the traitor is. I've seen a mafia, traitor, town neighborhood before (iirc). Your issue isn't using roles, it's assuming neighborhood compositions are alignment indicative.

not an assumption it actually happened

[Rathe]

the issue is not being able to rely on roles to figure the game out

[Rathe]

its all about play crumbing makes sense but even still not sure how accurate it would be upon death

[Rathe]

setups can be wacky

[Rathe]

anyway

VOTE: dwlee99

[Rathe]

i think it happens a lot that people who talk more early r more likely town

[Rathe]

especially ones who get into big discussions

[Rathe]

i would say nero is town right now n i would say petapan is town

[Rathe]

i already think dgb is town

[Rathe]

after last game though i have to do better

[Rathe]

Rathe I feel like you're evil.

k

[Rathe]

Rathe I feel like you're evil.

do u think so cuz im voting u or cuz of another reason

[Rathe]

idk why but Rathe feels different to the two towngames I played with him but that could be a function of me being scum iiin both games.

y

[Rathe]

do u think so cuz im voting u or cuz of another reason

why exactly are you voting DW? you just sorted plopped down a vote on a growing bandwagon.

im sheeping this game n i think dgb is probably town

[Rathe]

you're the same person? this blows my mind

in another life we r all the same

[Rathe]

i agree that day 1 kills r more on town than mafia

[Rathe]

if it is on mafia its cuz the partners bussed

[Rathe]

after my last game i believe this more than ever

[Rathe]

n i sheep until i have a better idea of whats happening

[Rathe]

after my last game i believe this more than ever

Where does Dwlee come into this?

i already said

[Rathe]

i saw dgbs post on page 1 n agreed with it

[Rathe]

then i saw dwlee disagree n it seemed like mafia

[Rathe]

then i saw dgb vote there n i agreed

[Rathe]

it rly didnt have anything to do with peta

[Rathe]

@Rathe why do you think people are SR’ing you here? Do you think it’s play style driven? I haven’t seen any crazy takes from you so far, so I can’t say that I’m seeing it.

i get scumread until people understand how i play

[Rathe]

i dont get bothered by it they just need to trust me so its ok

[Rathe]

if u ask me questions then u understand me better

[Rathe]

otherwise u wont understand everything

[Rathe]

everyone is saying he is town but i dont think so

VOTE: osuka

[Rathe]

his iso is just talking to everybody to say he did

[Rathe]

but its nothing

[Rathe]

scum hardly ever has any good reason to hardbus d1, get your head out of your ass

what does this mean u said this like it had a point

[Rathe]

Spoiler:

we could just lynch you if you didn't feel like playing

That's the spirit!

i'm with it

VOTE: vfp

same here rvs is over

[Rathe]

Talking of which, I asked you some questions that I'm waiting on.

k

[Rathe]

after my last game i believe this more than ever

Where does Dwlee come into this?

he doesnt

[Rathe]

n i sheep until i have a better idea of whats happening

Why do you sheep DGB in particular over Peta or Nero?
Keeping in mind you're also voting with Peta.

dgb seemed like town more than anyone else on page 1

[Rathe]

And what's your understanding to DGB's scum read on Dwlee?

i dont need to understand it cuz its her scumread not mine i sheep the vote not the reason

[Rathe]

then i saw dwlee disagree n it seemed like mafia

What seemed scummy about it?
Is it what Peta said, gut, or different reasons?

it was how it was reacted to it felt like it was dismissed or like he wanted to change the subject

[Rathe]

then i saw dgb vote there n i agreed

What is DGB's scum read on Dwlee though?
If you're going.to sheep, you at least understand why DGB is scum reading there, right?

it doesnt matter i have my own reasons for voting there

[Rathe]

it rly didnt have anything to do with peta

What makes Peta town for you if its not the push on Dwlee?

after i voted I went back n read the other posts n peta seemed like town when i read his posts

[Rathe]

like this

for the record i have setup-related thoughts but they're not for sharing in the early game, will talk more about it later

[Rathe]

i dont see mafia needing to say this or fake this who cares

[Rathe]

n talking a lot can get u looked at by pr as mafia so even though mafia can do it they try not to

[Rathe]

Change the subject would mean that Dwlee started a new topic, and to dismiss it can be border line disagreeing.

no i don’t mean it literally the tone felt like that its hard to explain

[Rathe]

If DGB votes someone you're not scum reading, what action do you take?

well im not voting kyouko

[Rathe]

Because this is my issue. You were happy to vote Dwlee because of sheeping, and you implied its because DGB is town and can be trusted.
But now it's because of your scum read plus a town read also scum reading that slot?

u asked a deeper question n i gave u a deeper answer

[Rathe]

just cuz i believe dgb is town doesnt mean i am always going to agree

[Rathe]

y r u thinking this

[Rathe]

Well, I care. I'm not going to leave someone as town just for 1 post for the game. How about my comment on scum Dwlee gains nothing from his response post?

i meant who is gonna care if peta reveals his thoughts on the setup

[Rathe]

if he is mafia y would he care about doing that

[Rathe]

What's your take on Dwlee now that the wagon has fizzled?

y would anything change

[Rathe]

btw

@nom

what does DW voting rathe mean?

As I see it he's more than happy to push another wagon instead of pursuing the 1v1, either out of genuine interest for pushing rathe or because he's trying to go away from that 1v1, which scum!dw would be happy to do in that position

so it was for show

VOTE: nomnomnom

[Rathe]

Breadcrumbs should be incomprehensible until your role is revealed by the mod, everyone seems to confuse breadcrumbs with bullhorns.

so if im vanilla i can crumb anything right

[Rathe]

So Dwelee is still scum? More so than Osuka?

i didn’t say that u r thinking my read is based on his wagon changing im saying to that its not connected

[Rathe]

i can have a read on someone regardless of how their wagon changes or forms

[Rathe]

I just don't see what nom was hoping to acomplish here. like at all

i do hes mafia

[Rathe]

maybe osuka n nomnomnom r mafia i dont know about dwlee could be but not sure anymore

[Rathe]

I still don't know why you see scum!osuka here
Also i saw you don't want to vote Kyouko and I don't know why, care to elaborate on that

look at my iso i said y n its more like osuka stands out more than kyouko right now i havent rly read kyouko yet but i will

[Rathe]

nero do u think petapan is more mafia than nomnom

[Rathe]

Can someone explain the nom wagon because I don't get it at all?

read his iso n it feels like he lost something he originally had

[Rathe]

he came in kinda bold now it feels like he is deflated

[Rathe]

he wanted dwlee to prove himself n vote me n when he did he said he was mafia

[Rathe]

the tone is off

[Rathe]

maybe everyone else townreads it i do not

[Rathe]

anya n kyouko would be better to be sorted sooner rather than later

[Rathe]

Neighborhoods are a good source of mod fuckery and I will make no alignment assumptions from its existence.

i agree with this n dont care who is who there

[Rathe]

nero y r u saying so much about nomnom but u r not voting him

[Rathe]

thats y i asked u the difference between nomnom and petapan

[Rathe]

u go out of ur way to keep commenting about nomnom

[Rathe]

then u keep saying people are probably town but also could be scum

[Rathe]

normally i'd say dragon suggesting that could be possible is towny paranoia but given the circumstances where both were voting him i don't really want to give a pass on that

is it normal for everyone to play like this either or type of style

[Rathe]

if u think they r town or mafia then say it

[Rathe]

its strange to me for someone to say i think this person is town but they could be scum

[Rathe]

VOTE: Nero

[Rathe]

Rathe screamed town in sibyl elegy and isnt doing that here so it's worth my vote now

thats fair

[Rathe]

Dragon just vote one of us and move on.

i’ll do better

dayvig:

vfp

[Rathe]

What do you think you got out of this?

i got this n everyone else did too

Spoiler:

If this is real then that's fine with me.
Nom is to be tomorrow's lim all the time.

Then Titus should always be pushed the day after.

T3 is always town and Nero / Dwlee are town.

Peta plausible town.
DGB I'm not undecided.
Scum probably in the hood.

The rest are pretty irrelevant to me.

In fact if real Raithe is most likely town.
Dragon to be in the scum pool.

From the hood I like Anya as town.
Plausible both town, I don't think a lim there any time soon is needed as it's never S/S.

So I'd probably go with

Nom
Titus
Dragon
DGB

With 1 being wrong.
Dunn and Osuka probably not scum.

Leaving Andre / West / Derek / Hood?

[Rathe]

i wanted to see what vfp would do n i think he is town

[Rathe]

the reason i voted for nero is n voted with nomnom is cuz i think nero is mafia

[Rathe]

cuz of how he was pushing but not voting nomnom

[Rathe]

I almost think this slot is worth a lurky vote.

read my iso n u get my thoughts

[Rathe]

i dont have to keep coming back n saying the same thing

[Rathe]

when my thoughts change u will know

[Rathe]

yes, we know but it's not scummy FMPOV to vote one scumread over the other.

normally no but i asked u those questions cuz ur interaction was suspicious to me n u were grilling nomnom but not voting

[Rathe]

it seemed different than u n peta after reading it felt like u n peta were partners arguing

[Rathe]

i rly thought it once he voted u nomnom reacted townie peta reacted like mafia

[Rathe]

i rly thought it once he voted u nomnom reacted townie peta reacted like mafia

854 compared to 895 n 896

[Rathe]

n 855

[Rathe]

if u r town i will vote peta but i do not think so so i stay here

[Rathe]

n wanting to kill the lurker spots is easy n no resistance

[Rathe]

town wanna do it sometimes but for a lot of slots to be saying it means mafia is saying it too

[Rathe]

VOTE: petapan

[Rathe]

i was pretty sure nero was mafia that was different

[Rathe]

I think we just go Titus.
Scum killing Nero show either a threat there or setting up Titus more. However, I don't think they target Nero as a protective PR, meaning that this wasn't a consideration when killing and most likely means Titus is lying.

VOTE: Titus

u think titus is mafia babysitter

[Rathe]

y r people following chaos first dunnstral now t3

[Rathe]

chaos how do u feel about dgb n titus

[Rathe]

andres i hope we r town together again there are little people i kinda trust

[Rathe]

i still think its dgb n vfp who r town n probably t3

[Rathe]

what r u seeing from osuka i think they r mafia

[Rathe]

i still think its dgb n vfp who r town n probably t3

everyone else i dont know what do u think of petapan or titus

[Rathe]

VOTE: osuka

[Rathe]

i havent been very good n i dont think i can be much help but i will read n see

[Rathe]

I’m somewhat skeptical there still.

still u called them town

[Rathe]

I’m somewhat skeptical there still.

still u called them town

dumbest post over the course of the last 10 pages, he said "as town"

please fuck off with the misrep or, in the ever so unlikely event that this _isn't_ underhanded, learn to read

VOTE: osuka

[Rathe]

there is no reason to think u r town reading ur iso calling my posts dumb wont change it

[Rathe]

i admit i missed a lot but last I talked to andres he said u r probably town so when he said he is still skeptical of you i want him to clarify

[Rathe]

it doesnt even matter what andres thinks about u i am not basing my read on u cuz of andres

[Rathe]

as town_, osuka is accurate" into "osuka is accurate so he is town", which is actually not at all what he said

its not what i said either i already said what i meant in 2169

[Rathe]

i have 6 townreads n 8 null to null mafia reads

[Rathe]

i will vote within the 8 null to null mafia n anya is in that 8

[Rathe]

id like to vote osuka but maybe tomorrow

VOTE: anya

[Rathe]

thats l1 i think

[Rathe]

i wonder what dgb feels about all these mechanics

[Rathe]

personally i trust no one n should base it on play

[Rathe]

if anya is scummy get rid of her if she is not then dont but basing it on her role only can hurt us later

[Rathe]

How can you kill and protect the same person?

only if they get killed

[Rathe]

T3 what do u say to everyone who thinks u r mafia

[Rathe]

yes i get to both kill and protect but if i die the person i protect dies also.

[Rathe]

They shoot their target and also protect them from one kill. That cancels out unless there is a macho modifier.

i think u r looking at it wrong cyrus can protect a target but if he dies the target dies with him he can also use his vigilante kill to kill someone they r not the same

[Rathe]

town vengeful combind vig babysiter. sounds awesome . its like given me a shotgun.

the vig is separate kill but so is vengeful n babysitter all three roles produce a kill

[Rathe]

vengeful only happens if he is voted out the vig is a night action n babysitter is protective unless he is nightkilled

[Rathe]

My point is that if cyrus targets someone he shoots them and protects them from that same kill. If scum target that person for a night kill as well it does nothing.

k maybe im wrong i thought he picks one to vig or babysit

[Rathe]

if he can only pick a target and they get vig n babysit used on them then that is weird

[Rathe]

n then i can see y u r confused

[Rathe]

He claimed the combined modifier

town vengeful combind vig babysiter. sounds awesome . its like given me a shotgun.

i see makes sense now

[Rathe]

Now this is kind of crazy but if we want to we could mech-yeet Titus to make Cyrus into just a vengeful vigilante and leash his kills.

im not entirely sure how this would work but id rather not kill titus

[Rathe]

There's no mechanical anything. Anya is just obviously telling the truth about her role.

besides me n t3 who r voting for to end the day

[Rathe]

besides me n t3 who r u voting for to end the day

[Rathe]

Now this is kind of crazy but if we want to we could mech-yeet Titus to make Cyrus into just a vengeful vigilante and leash his kills.

Let's not.

You don't want a vigilante? I want a vigilante.

has the potential to be led by mafia dont want that

[Rathe]

Is a babysitter automatically town-aligned?

kinda wouldnt make sense for a mafia babysitter think about it

[Rathe]

A non-town Babysitter could theoretically exist, and is allowed in a Normal Game, but is only useful if kills exist in a rival faction (e.g. the Werewolves or a Vigilante).

[Rathe]

anyway i think we have talked mechanics enough who r u voting dwlee voting me or t3 is not good

[Rathe]

so basically is my role cool or to complicated lol.

who r u voting

[Rathe]

I just think you're both scum in general. Nothing to do with each other.

no save the dragons is ok but i still think osuka is mafia

[Rathe]

{titus, rathe}?

what do u actually see from me that u think im mafia

[Rathe]

manipulation lying an agenda

[Rathe]

u havent tried to actually sort me y

[Rathe]

Also want DGB + DotW to answer the question in 2534 btw.

i know this isnt for me but i think it comes down to anya kyouko or osuka

[Rathe]

So are we good with throwing him off the train?

r u good with it, i dont remember reading u having any kind of read on him or rly saying anything about him

[Rathe]

Can we discuss the mechanics of this decision as a group: I feel like I'm against you announcing who you're protecting in advance. I'd rather scum have to guess who you're going to protect and make the decision tougher to kill you. If you announce in advance and sit on town you're giving them an easy decision to kill you and a second town and then make their night kill. If you keep it a secret they have to guess whether or not it's worth killing you. Thoughts on why I'm probably wrong?

i agree with this ur not wrong

[Rathe]

@rathe this was my list of acceptable yeets for me

k got it

[Rathe]

it's more what you haven't done it's mostly a gut read based on active lurking

k well cant rly argue with that

[Rathe]

why do you think osuka is mafia?

early on he was getting townread by multiple players n i didnt agree cuz of his interactions

[Rathe]

but then he didnt want to sort any slots just argue about things that didnt rly matter

[Rathe]

hes not rly thinking n his takes on whats happening dont make sense for a town player

[Rathe]

also theres no reason for him to think im mafia when he doesnt actually interact

[Rathe]

example?

his takes on the neighbours n or masons he said hed vote anya or ssbm_kyouko but then didnt cuz dgb n dotw but then just voted me cuz its easy

[Rathe]

also theres no reason for him to think im mafia when he doesnt actually interact

he sheeped ur vote in 973

[Rathe]

read his iso many of his comments r pointless n mean nothing

[Rathe]

VOTE: osuka

[Rathe]

also rathe has never voted me before and he was town in all those other games

weve always been town together i am town again n this time u might be mafia

[Rathe]

n me voting u is not a good reason to vote me

[Rathe]

my townreads r voting u so i am okay voting there as u already know

[Rathe]

actually no nevermind

VOTE: anya

[Rathe]

i am starting to think maybe osuka is not mafia i still dont townread dwlee and jumping on osuka now after asking seems wrong

[Rathe]

Rathe if you're town stop pls

u r voting me so y say this

[Rathe]

Why is there so much resistance to a osuka wagon is osuka is town and Anya is scum, Titus?

i think its the other way around

[Rathe]

Why is there so much resistance to a osuka wagon is osuka is town and Anya is scum, Titus?

i think its the other way around

im saying the resistance is on anya osuka is a new wagon its doesnt have so much resistance

[Rathe]

im confused after reading anya again im going back to my original scumread n not moving anymore

VOTE: osuka

[Rathe]

Dwlee/Anya/???

y would dwlee be that obvious to be saving anya if they r partners

[Rathe]

if its not anya i think its dwlee unless they r neighbors which he denied i dont see them being partners

[Rathe]

i could see him knowing anya is town n protecting her so that if we see her flip town he can get on everybody

[Rathe]

He could have whiteknighted me, too, I'm town.

no one knows y mafia do the things they do

[Rathe]

cuz i sheeped u n i dont talk a lot

[Rathe]

but if u look at my iso u will see i am very town or at the very least not mafia

[Rathe]

Like what?

what do u want to know

[Rathe]

VOTE: osuka

[Rathe]

VOTE: titus

[Rathe]

i didn't receive any result and my action failed

i targeted rathe

probably being roleblocked so cruel

y would u target me if u thought i was mafia

[Rathe]

VOTE: Rathe

sheeping Dwlee

also rathe has never voted me before and he was town in all those other games

still dont like this

[Rathe]

I also think Andres is evil.

i thought that as well cuz of osuka n he also called nomnom or vaxkiller hard town

[Rathe]

VOTE: Rathe

sheeping Dwlee

also rathe has never voted me before and he was town in all those other games

still dont like this

but i dont see a bus being necessary here n both vaxkiller n osuka voted for u

[Rathe]

so u dont think the designers made the enabler be opposite alignments

[Rathe]

i was a mailman enabler in a game that had only scum mailman

[Rathe]

VOTE: andres

[Rathe]

In this case, the enabler actually makes the role stronger. Before, the babysitter was effectively a visitor with a kill if the babysitter died. When the enabler dies, the role becomes an ungated vigilante. If the enabler was scum, this would make the setup extremely swingy as now if the enabler dies, the mafia are not only down a player but also unleashed a vigilante onto the game.

k this makes a lot of sense

[Rathe]

Like what?

what do u want to know

What makes you very town?

i thought u would ask specific questions but my iso is the same as all the times i have been town what made me town then makes me town now

[Rathe]

Spoiler:

i can't believe someone says they have a clear on you

I am sure that you don't like cleared townies.

i can't believe someone says they have a clear on you

how do u feel about the person who did the clearing i dont get good vibes from them

[Rathe]

that is to anya n dwlee

[Rathe]

Can someone address my theory that scum are in the neighbor claims?

r u saying both of them or just anya

[Rathe]

i can vote anya the problem is no one else does

[Rathe]

she said she targeted me but it doesnt make sense when she thought i was mafia enough to vote me

[Rathe]

n then i dont believe the being blocked it is too convenient so i dont disagree

[Rathe]

the reason i voted u was simply cuz of osuka i thought u could be his partner but dwlee explained how its maybe not possible

[Rathe]

he defended u multiple times n never gave u a read but he had strong reads for me peta n dwlee n u kinda town read him so it made sense to me

[Rathe]

i said in 743 that anya n kyouko would be better to be sorted sooner than later n i still think that

[Rathe]

i dont know what other power roles if there r any but we can vote anya out n whatever power on kyouko

[Rathe]

i can vote anya the problem is no one else does

I voted Anya all day yesterday, along with several others.

sorry i wasnt rly talking about the ones who i know would vote there

[Rathe]

i dont know where t3 stands but dwlee vfp n andres dont wanna vote there so maybe chaos

[Rathe]

sorry i wasnt rly talking about the ones who i know would vote there

4 votes isnt gonna mean anything

[Rathe]

I just want their result from last night.

k same here if there is any

[Rathe]

hold on i was reading n saw this

Spoiler:

kyouko's posting game things that make a little more sense in the dungeon now

he's still talking to me like he knows i'm town but whatever

VOTE: nom

can you elaborate

y would scum waste a post to ask their partner in thread to elaborate on their partner

[Rathe]

ive found posts like this that make me think anya is town n now with nomnom n osuka flipped as scum is makes even less sense for anya to have been partners with them

[Rathe]

i think im gonna take a pause for now n read more but i need to rest

UNVOTE: andres

[Rathe]

ive found posts like this that make me think anya is town n now with nomnom n osuka flipped as scum is makes even less sense for anya to have been partners with them

this is what brought me back to osuka after voting for anya day 2

[Rathe]

but i do admit that i dont like the whole neighborhood voyeur stuff but i think osuka n nomnom partners r elsewhere

[Rathe]

i think im gonna try to clear people based on osuka n nomnom

[Rathe]

i think we can find the mafia this way