micro 1017 is over party

[skitter30]

Heya everyone

@schadd vla fridays + Saturdays

VOTE: dats

[skitter30]

I think dats' reaction was kinda townie, dislike the bugspray vote

UNVOTE:

[skitter30]

Not sure i like retti either but that's more of a ping than anything else

Pedit i liked the tone of 13 (albeit unrelated to your reaction) + 18 also struck me as town

Not sure if i can articulate it beyond 'good gut vibes' ans 'good tone' rn tho

[skitter30]

VOTE: datisi I scum read you

I definitely dont scumread you for posta through here and would like to hear more abt why bugspray does

[skitter30]

i'm nowhere near ready to let skitter be town.

skitter's explanation of her townpings on me gives me some paranoia that i am being white knighted / pocketed here

but i will not act upon it yet as it is way too early and my skitter reads are usually ass-backwards

why do you find her town? @retti obviously

Nah, i would never do such a thing

I've got townpings on both retti and pob btw

Pedit bugspray's vote wasnt rvs? They said they scumread dats and dats already had content so it looked like a pretty clear-cut not-rvs vote to me

[skitter30]

Because you're a shining beacon of towniness, obviously.

Heyyyy this is my line!

[skitter30]

^

[skitter30]

skitt is town

Uh why

[skitter30]

skitt is town

Uh why

ur saying ur not?

I am, and i'm more than happy for people to read me that way, but i want to know why *you* think this with what i've posted thus far

I'm also not really sure why you answered my question this way?

(This is mena right???)

[skitter30]

it looks to me like those times when you were scum and did the same thing (panic room, defcon) ...
Otherwise idk what you're talking abt

[skitter30]

Oh fair
That actually slipped my mind ... i was thinking abt the recent scum-examples
Nm

[skitter30]

Pob because i dont think scum enters the way they did
Retti is Good Posting:liked their read on me, liked the pob read, kinda like their approach overall

Neither of these are like locktown or anything but enuf to decoare a townlean on p4 or whatever we're on

[skitter30]

VOTE: datisi I scum read you

I definitely dont scumread you for posta through here and would like to hear more abt why bugspray does

[skitter30]

VOTE: bugspray

[skitter30]

I'm also feeling a bit sus of mena fwiw

[skitter30]

This isnt like a real read on me right?

[skitter30]

This isnt like a real read on me right?

there's been something that's pinged me as towny and I like your take on poblong and retti that I kinda vibe with but it's mostly the default townread thing

where would you wanna look so far in terms of scum? and what's pinged you about bugs?

~Rhyme

Hmmmmmm

R.e. scumreads: bugs, who i'm voting, and who you're also voting .... why are you voting them?
Wrt bugs: dislike the initial dats vote, dislike they ignored the concerns abt the initial dats vote, dislike the tris read, and dislike the fact that that's ehat they chose to engage with

[skitter30]

Dats is like really obviously town

[skitter30]

now I'm feeling kinda sad but for non-game-related-reasons

Also i missed this earlier but i hope things get better soon

[skitter30]

Dats is like really obviously town

I don't see it yet

~Rhyme

He has like a lot of real time complex thoughts

[skitter30]

I'm kinda confused why you're asking me where i want to look for scum and asking me why i'm voting someone when you're sheeping me on that vote, it feels like a bit of a weird question

[skitter30]

I dont know yet

[skitter30]

Maybe tris and t3 but they're still pings and i wouldnt really call them scumreads, bugs is the main one

[skitter30]

I thought u meant like outside of urself

[skitter30]

I'm also not sure i'd call you a scjmread, you more just feel kinda off

[skitter30]

I feel like you're asking weird questions, your responses to a couple of things have been a little off, and i didnt like the scumclaiming bits

[skitter30]

I mean its weird but i'm not sure its enuf to call u scum over

[skitter30]

No, he just feels weird. But like idk if its enuf to call him scum over. If i thought he was scum i would just say it

Like it isnt exactly a scumread, its more of a 'mena feels kinda off and on a scale between town and scum its probably closer to scum than town but like im not sure if being weird inherently makes him scum'
If that makes sense
Otherwise i can try to say it a different way

Pedit i mean yes a lack of confidence to some extent in that i'm not sure i scumread him, but i'm not sure why you think i'm feigning that or whyt its a scum-motivated waffle rather than me just being unsure

[skitter30]

Why is retti so low

[skitter30]

Ok and why are you townreading rr?

[skitter30]

I think your retti read is somewhat OMGUS-y, but also colored with enuf of a 'oooooh i caught him for not scumreading me too!' vibe that it probably comes from town

Like i think voting someone because you think they should still be voting you because their reasons for switching to someone else can also be applied to you probably comes from town

That ... is a somewhat convoluted sentence but i hope it conveys what i'm trying to say

Pedit meh i'm skeptical

[skitter30]

VOTE: datisi I scum read you

I definitely dont scumread you for posta through here and would like to hear more abt why bugspray does

[skitter30]

I noted that, i was talking more abt the reasoning you just gave for him being so low / keeping it there, but fair enough

Bugspray are u gonna respond ...

[skitter30]

Spoiler:

VOTE: datisi I scum read you

I definitely dont scumread you for posta through here and would like to hear more abt why bugspray does

VOTE: datisi I scum read you

I definitely dont scumread you for posta through here and would like to hear more abt why bugspray does

This isnt like a real read on me right?

there's been something that's pinged me as towny and I like your take on poblong and retti that I kinda vibe with but it's mostly the default townread thing

where would you wanna look so far in terms of scum? and what's pinged you about bugs?

~Rhyme

Hmmmmmm

R.e. scumreads: bugs, who i'm voting, and who you're also voting .... why are you voting them?
Wrt bugs: dislike the initial dats vote, dislike they ignored the concerns abt the initial dats vote, dislike the tris read, and dislike the fact that that's ehat they chose to engage with

And i think dats had some stuff too

[skitter30]

I feep p good abt a bugspray vote at this point

[skitter30]

VOTE: bugspray

[skitter30]

I didnt realize potions dont flip >.>

[skitter30]

I mean its weird but i'm not sure its enuf to call u scum over

Out of curiosity, what, if anything, do you think he's doing differently from what you'd expect from scum-him?

-Reason

He tends to be like ~smoother~ as scum sort of

Also i really think bugspray is scum, can we get a wagon on them plz?

[skitter30]

Heya dats. Was thinking of mbos 9 too

I feel like they're ignoring questions asked of them and opting to not provide content, and dont really have reasons for the things they're doing, and iirc mbos9 correctly this is characteristic of their scumgame

[skitter30]

Fwiw i'm getting partner-y vibes from rr ans bugs

[skitter30]

This isnt like a real read on me right?

there's been something that's pinged me as towny and I like your take on poblong and retti that I kinda vibe with but it's mostly the default townread thing

where would you wanna look so far in terms of scum? and what's pinged you about bugs?

~Rhyme

This is still a bizarre question to me given:
- i was voting bugs slready
- was sheeped by them on bugs
- they had a readslist like two posts prior where bugs was their biggest scumread

[skitter30]

however, all this said, when I questioned S_S about it he thinks her take makes sense as town too, because he's doubtful (and I admit probably right) that I've done a great job of replicating my approach to skitter as scum this game, namely in that I've not really tried to be subtle about it whereas when I am scum I'm *actually* trying to fool her into thinking I'm town, whereas here I was hoping she'd think I was scum and call it out, at which point I'd drop this whole explanation and be all "boom, skitter is town everyone"

It was weird and that's what i was thinking initially honestly, but it didnt line up exactly with how you do it as scum, usually the sucking up bits are more intebse

But as soon as you called me town on p2 or whatever that's the scenario i was worried abt, that you wete scum and were going to do the thing you always do

But i was also wondering why you'd do that given that you and i both know this is how i'd read you so i was kinda thinking that scum-you would try to be less obvious this time

So like you felt off because it wasnt the exact same approach that you'd take as scum, but like i can see scum-you switching it up and trying to avoid getting caught that way. Or you could just be town playing weirdly. Like i didnt really have a good way of diffrentiating

You said you 'were trying very hard to make it look like your reads were dependant on mine' which i did pick up oj but like it was less intense than how you do it as scum almost if that makes sense

But yeah given this whole gambit/explanation i think you're probably town now

[skitter30]

Like ig i was just kinda thinking that all involved parties (you, me, ss) would know that this probably wouldnt be such a successful approach, so i wasnt sure why you would do it in the firsf place as scum

And if u were trying to mimic ur scumgame it felt different than how it usually did beyond when i first called you out on it, it was more subtle, you're usually a lot more blatant abt it

I wasnf having a great night last night and was kinda exhausted, i probably would have pushed harder abt it on a different night and figured it could wait a fay or two until i could string words together again

I dont really have strong thoughts on t3. He feels a bit shallow but i think he often does. I think the fact that he's active + trying is loosely + town tho but its not a strong read and not one i want to commit to rn
Pedit maybe this isnt a good reason to townread him then ...
Idk

[skitter30]

Like ig i was just kinda thinking that all involved parties (you, me, ss) would know that this probably wouldnt be such a successful approach, so i wasnt sure why you would do it in the firsf place as scum

???????? if RR is scum they are pobably lying about that you know

I kinda dont think he cooks up this whole gambit as scum given that he knows that this is one of the vectors i use to read him ... he wouldnt be *trying* to trip off my suspicions here i think

[skitter30]

Now everyone has similar reads >.>

[skitter30]

tris what are your reads at this point
and why do you think i would be having doubts on bugspray?

[skitter30]

hey, skitter? unrelated to the game, feel free to ignore; why did you go back to capitalizing things?

Some words (esp at the beginning of sentences) auto-capitalize on my phone

It is most certainly not intentional >.>

[skitter30]

I dont really have any thoughts on tris's recent posting

[skitter30]

You feel kinda shallow and consensus-y

[skitter30]

Do u think i'm scum or just that i'm not being town?

[skitter30]

Maybe its just bugspray/tris

Do u think u should be townreading me at this point?

[skitter30]

So you're saying i'm scummy for not being townie but you're unsure if you should even be townreading me rn?
Is that right

[skitter30]

i'm nowhere near ready to let skitter be town.

Y tho

[skitter30]

Nullish, maybe nulltown if i feel generous

I know its at the start of the game, but it exhibits a certain level of oaranoia of me in that you're expecting to be hesitant to townread me
What changed in that you think you *should* be townreading me at thia this point

[skitter30]

i remember having come to the conclusion that skitter is best treated as scum until proven otherwise.

I think this us isually more in the sense of 'man maybe she's scum, we cant really trust her reads or pushes' and less in the sense of 'she's a good vote because i'm not sure we can townread her' two irl days into day1

I also dont really think it makes sense to argue 'we should all be paranoid of skitter' and 'she's scummy because i dont townread her yet' at the same time. If i'm good enuf to be that paranoid over i dont think it should be a red flag that you dont yet townread me on p13

I also basically feel like you're looking for reasons to vote me

And what retti said abt 'commenting on random posts' resonates quite a bit too

[skitter30]

@skitter; how do you think this fits with how i tend to be as scum or town?

More likely to come from scum with the caveat that i dont rememner your playstyle too well offhand

Its more a thing that i've noticed scum in general do and less a thing that i've noticed scum*you* do if thay makes sense

[skitter30]

wouldn't scum!skitter also notice menalque acting weird? this wasn't random paranoia. there was a strong reason here that could easily be picked up on by scum i would think.

I mean yes but i dunno if i call him out on it

[skitter30]

i wanted to comment on this - i'm not sure this is true? (i'm gonna take the liberty of assuming this is meant in a sense of "everyone is fine with consensus, therefore the consensus is wrong.) like, sure, up to now a decent amount of people expressed a scumread on bugs, but what i find interesting is that that wagon has completely stagnated despite multiple people expressing that they're fine with it? which uh, kinda reminds me of some recent games, where there was a wagon building / consensus read on scum, and most people seemed ~fine~ with it, while the wagon was dead and scum was hoping that the town finds a new shiny distraction.

I meant this more in tje sense of 'now the game is boring because nothing os gonna happen and there's nothing to talk abt'
The reads are consensus-y but i actually dont mind it *too* much, i'm p sure bugs is scum and i think my townreads are p solid, so we just have to go through everyone else

[skitter30]

hOweVeR i'm also getting townie pings because in my head idk if scum!tris attacks town!skitter here?

I'm kinda thinking this too, esp since she was on my scumteam in the TM game i basically won ...

But idk something feels off to me abt this interaction, it almost feels like she wants to find me scum and is therefore looking for ways she can
It doesnt feel like a sincere argument on her end, its not something she actually believes but rather something she wants to argue i think

[skitter30]

I'm not really clearing her, kinda more wondering why scum-her would choose this avenue

Dats: yeah like i said i think its consensus- y but i'm ok with that cuz i feel like i reached this point organically and i think the consensus is right
Idk why tris is doing what she's doing but it doesnt feel town to me

[skitter30]

Nullish, maybe nulltown if i feel generous

Toog ^

[skitter30]

oh, didn't mean to quote that

why do you maybe null town toogs?

I don't really get any Good Vibes there yet, but it's just that T3 feels like he could be limbait but just as easily could be scum and I think that unless he starts being actually towny I wouldn't want him to endgame anyway. if bugs greens then I would probably be more careful around flipping T3 or want to be more confident he's actually scum, but if bugs reds and we're ahead then I think I'd rather just lim him and not worry about it

~Rhyme

I'm not really getting any bad vibes from toog and i liked his reason to scumread retti a few pages back
Def not strong enuf for a townread but the pings u've been getting have been positive

[skitter30]

though having said that, i'm realizing i'm thinking of that micro game that i modded where skitter bussed, when maybe i should be thinking of that micro game i played in where skitter was an actual partner to bugspray, but also uhh this feels like an exercise for a later day so whatever

I mean i can elaborate the difference and tell you what it would probably mean here lol, but i'm always intrigued how other people read this too

Fwiw i probably bus bugs here, but idk if i *go out of the gate* bussing him

[skitter30]

* them my apologies

And indeed

[skitter30]

Eh and i meant difference between mbos9 and the game you modded, and not between mbos9 and here per se

[skitter30]

I only try to make people paranoid of me *sometimes*

[skitter30]

I'm not really getting any bad vibes from toog and i liked his reason to scumread retti a few pages back
Def not strong enuf for a townread but the pings u've been getting have been positive

eh, just feels very boring to me, like generically safe reads but with a little bit of spice/contrarianism by putting retti initially low. I feel like pob long's "why are R+R town, I think they're scummy" strikes me as more authentically against the current?

but meh

~Rhyme

Yeah like i said it wasnt strong at all but uf i had to pick one side or the other i'd say town

[skitter30]

VOTE: bugspray

I dislike this hammer irregardless of bugspray's alignment

[skitter30]

skitter probably is town actually

Why??????

[skitter30]

...

[skitter30]

Tris uh u look a little sketchy rn

[skitter30]

also also i *think* skitt was just messing with me earlier

I would never do such a thing

[skitter30]

VOTE: tris

Posts eod + hammer were Not Good
Also i still dont get your read on me

Also i'm assuming this means scum failed to apply 2 points of damage to anyone last night

I dont really see a reason to not claim this, @rr i gave u the potion u received

[skitter30]

Oh sorry
Seemed a bit pointless to me and i figured being able to backtrace at least some actions/potions would be a good thing

[skitter30]

Triiiiiiiissssssss why did you hammer bugspray

[skitter30]

+ the fact that you randomly started townreading me for reasons you cant really explain
Do you not see why your eod posts were bad or

The sad things is that i lowkey think you're town
Sigh
Dont lolhammer people, especially not before a claim or before people are ready to end the day

VOTE: toog

Pedit ...

[skitter30]

skitter probably is town actually

What is this even

[skitter30]

Ok ya you're probably town but plz dont do that again

I dont townread retti as strongly as i did yesterday either

[skitter30]

Iirc in this series there's sometimes incidental random mechanic things that dont per se intersct with anything

I dont have any examples offhand but i feel like this was a thing in past iterations

[skitter30]

Subject: Micro 921: mystery b. of silver sevin two sides of the sa...

the core of the earth turns to ice. a monsoon ceases. most wildlife grows calm.

Aloratom has been lynched! he was a

mafia worm agent.

night 1 begins now and ends in (expired on 2020-02-25 23:30:00). please send me actions by PM or in a PT when applicable. i will end the night early if everyone requests that i do so.

Here's one
Still dunno what a worm agent is and iirc it had nothing to do wigh the rest of the setup

[skitter30]

Actually
VOTE: retti

[skitter30]

@retti the vote had nothing to do with the potion thing
It was more an offshoot of me thinking i dont have as strong a reason to townread you and since you had been around was hoping it would spark an interesting convo that would help me read you better
But then i fell asleep

And waking up honestly i'm more interested in toog so gonna switch back VOTE: toog

It was an impulsive 'oh maybe this will lead to an interesting convo' thing more than anything else

[skitter30]

Skitter, why the vote on me from the previous page? I assume you don't think I am null-town anymore. Then you voted for someone I had as one of my scum reads.

Give me your thought progression, por favor

Cuz i townread a lot of people and i dont townread you
In fact i think you might be the only person i dont have a reason to townread at all

[skitter30]

Uh, skitt

What changed between here:

The softing clicked:
- realized she was softing some sort of pr-potion (probably should have realized that before but i didnt)
- which explains why she was impatient to get to night

And then her explanation for why she was townreading me (trying to make me into a scum-target) made sense too

The whole eod makes a lot of sense coming from town-pr impatient to get to night and use their ability, and I'm oncr i realized thay she became a townread

[skitter30]

Rhe whole admitting 'i'm playing my scumgame to look townier' thing

[skitter30]

Ph and o forgot pob long again, they're probably just above toog

[skitter30]

like, we all have potions, I'm assuming that most people have at least one that actually does something, so the explanation here doesn't really make sense that she was impatient because town PR? like if the majority of thread have powers of some nature then why would trjis particularly be so keen to do this? also doesn't really fit with my model of trjis as a player

like this feels like such a stretch of an explanation to me, and I also individually really don't like 450 which just feels very performative especially considering how quickly it's followed by the reversal on the slot?

and then besides that the progression on retti is at odds with what she was saying yesterday? I don't get why retti was suddenly voteable for "not having a strong reason to TR" him when yesterday all she mentioned was town reading him (89), and while she didn't say explicitly that that carried on throughout the day, it was implied: 180 suggests she thinks retti should be higher, and I think that 342 where she says that what retti was saying "resonated" with her also implies that she was TRing him there/identifying with what he had to say. I don't think retti did anything that makes sense that her TR there would drop off or she'd feel the need to pressure him by voting there, and the switch back to toogs immediately afterwards instead of... actually doing what she said she wanted to do also feels off? like if you're gonna vote retti to try to get a more solid read, it feels like it sort of defeats the purpose to immediately tell him that's what you're doing because then he kinda knows the potential pressure of the vote isn't real

~Rhyme

I mean a few things:
1. Tris's softing suddenly clicked between those two posts. In the context of 'oh bugs is obvscum and i'm excited to use my pr' the hammer makes sense. The bit explaining that the eod townread on me was meant to help her 'direct' scum actions to known targets makes sense too. Was the hammer a *good* thing to do? No. Do i endorse it? No. Does it make sense coming from a town pr? Yes

2. Yes i'm slow on the uptake for softs sometimes, i figured it out while writing 453

3. I dont really have a feeling on whether tris as a player would do this or not

4. The retti vote wasnt a 'ooooh now you're ny biggest scumread and i want to flip you vote', it was more of a 'hmmm i want to read them better and voting them will probably spark a convo that will enable me to do so'. And i wanted to do it in realtime but i fell asleep so the oppurtunity was lost a bit and i'm more interested in toog anyways. Also like three people overnight asked why i made that vote, so are you expecting me to just not answer or

5. Also the read just dropped off because i'm hesitatnt to say that all scum is in t3/toog/pob - since bugs flipped town that necessitates a shuffling of my reads given that i was wrong yesterday. Its not coming from anything he did or didnt do per se

6. I thinj you guys are over-estimated the strength of my t3 read - i dont per se townread him so much as i can find *something* that's a bit townie there (albeit small) whereas when i think of toog i cant find any good reasons to townread him at all, so he's my preferred vote rn

[skitter30]

skitter is all over the place today, without a doubt. Votes me but doesn't explain the drop from Null-town. Then votes Retti. Then revotes me and says the only person other "non-town" read is T3.

Toog can u explain why exactly this makes me scum plz

I object to your characterization that my reads are 'everywhere and nowhere', but supposing it s an accurate description, why is it scum-indicative - like, what am i doing as scum here?

[skitter30]

Can you show where you think that's happening?

I'm p sure most of the pressure i received today happened after/because of me revising my reads, no?

Also ... uh you think i'd flip-flop on my reads to appease people after getting some pressure ?

[skitter30]

I believe it works in tandem with Rhyme and Reason. I'm hard locking R&R because I have the exact same potion, though I haven't used mine yet to deal 1 damage to a player. I think in tandem with your potion, we can execute players we don't want around.

I'm skeptical that all of these sources of damage come from town, and am puzzled why you think this is a reason to locktown rr

I also lowkey think we might as well massclaim
I'm also kinda wondering if scum in this scenario would claim their damage to 'get ahead' of massclaim given that other people are claiming damage-causing potions as well - there is going to be damage from unexplained sources probably and scum are going to have to claim something - if townies are claiming damage it suddenly becomes 'safe', if not advantageous, to do so

I will note that you being blase about taking damage yourself is probably on the townier side but i dont think its enuf to townread u

[skitter30]

Can you show where you think that's happening?

I'm p sure most of the pressure i received today happened after/because of me revising my reads, no?

Also ... uh you think i'd flip-flop on my reads to appease people after getting some pressure ?

I believe it works in tandem with Rhyme and Reason. I'm hard locking R&R because I have the exact same potion, though I haven't used mine yet to deal 1 damage to a player. I think in tandem with your potion, we can execute players we don't want around.

I'm skeptical that all of these sources of damage come from town, and am puzzled why you think this is a reason to locktown rr

I also lowkey think we might as well massclaim
I'm also kinda wondering if scum in this scenario would claim their damage to 'get ahead' of massclaim given that other people are claiming damage-causing potions as well - there is going to be damage from unexplained sources probably and scum are going to have to claim something - if townies are claiming damage it suddenly becomes 'safe', if not advantageous, to do so

I will note that you being blase about taking damage yourself is probably on the townier side but i dont think its enuf to townread u

@toog

[skitter30]

Probably just as well because I felt like going to sleep around then, too. Regardless, I'm here now, although I'm still catching up, if you want to have a conversation, just ask me something?

I dont know if i have anything in particular i want to ask you >.>

That's why i went with the voting method, to create something to talk abt

[skitter30]

I'm a little bit leery of the damage claims, but they seem to be clearly meant to interact with Datisi's charisma potion in some way? Like, I don't see a world where town only has a single means of dealing damage or whatever

I think all the damage claims do not come from town,, i think there's scum in there

Pedit no i'm asking you to explain yours
i am thoroughly underwhelmed by your reasons to scumread me and also feel like you're trying to find reasons to do so

[skitter30]

Fair enuf

Pedit i mean the succinct i dont take isue with, so much as i think you're making stuff up

[skitter30]

I mean as town ...

[skitter30]

If dats weren't in this game i would guess you were dats

[skitter30]

That must be it

I'm a little suspicous of toog's use of pedantry to avoid adequately responding to questions asked of them

[skitter30]

Yeah it seems like this potion may make it a bit hard for you yo engage in normal discourse

Maybe like ask questions and then after someone says their opinion say yours? Idk

I've kinda been assuming we're all gonna screw up and take 1 damage this phase :shrug:

I dont think you're tunneled on t3, i can understand why people would find him suspicous. I dont think the bit i found townie offsets the sketchy parts abt him so much as i'm much, much, much more interested in toog rn

schadd

if dats says an opinion, and someone later says something thay disagrees with said opinion without really addressing dats/continuing that convo, does that count?
Like dats says: i think x is town
Later someone else incidentally says: i think x is scum

[skitter30]

I dont hate the idea

I would want massclaim to happen first so that there isnt room for things to go awry + would probably want to flip them afterwards anyways

[skitter30]

Ok i think everyone except pob has either at least partially claimed or has stated they are officially on board

I started with 1 potion, a 'traveling potion', which i can basically just pass along to someone else
I gave it to rr last night, and that's all i had

T3 u might as well go too

[skitter30]

That's all it does, it basically exists to get passed along to someone else

[skitter30]

I'm incredibly skeptical that all of the people with potions that deal damage are town

[skitter30]

I feel like my role is the baseline vanilla of this game
I wouldn't really classify 'ability to deal damage' as normal baseline vt

[skitter30]

Toog why is rr locktown for having the same potion as u

[skitter30]

i don't get why you think it's +town in any way from your pov, that's the bit i'm trying to understand

[skitter30]

skitter, I get why you're skeptical of Toogeloo's claim of a damaging potion here and I find the way he's been responding to me to be frustrating, but I kind of feel like we just leave him be here and leash him to shoot who we want? I guess there's the fear if he's scum that he just goes and shoots someone else instead but if that happens we just yeet him on day 3 regardless? So that's not a huge concern for me.

I'm not completely opposed to leashing them to like one of t3/pob witu the understanding that if neither of those flip scum he's next

I an slightly dubious of overnight shenabigans leading to unclear sources of damage (like i can totally see him juat *not* using the potion overnight and then saying the target must be lying ir something, ior an unusual number of people dying due to dats' thing or something) but like theoretically i'm ok with it, especially since we gained a flip last night ans are on evens

Two flipa overnight + flip today worst case scenario we're in 5way tom

More people dying than expected and not hitting scum will lead to scum winning tho

As i write this out i realize that toog's potion may not be enuf to causw death overnight, it may need to be coupled with dats' thing

I'm just wary of causing more deaths than expexted since we dont know exactly hiw many people are to die tonight (with dats' thing) so it might just be a loss if we dont hit scum

Slightly convoluted but those are my thoughts

Mena feel better

[skitter30]

Absolutely no idea at this point
Made sense to me early game cuz i was off but i dont really think you should be having an issue this phase

[skitter30]

I'm just wary of causing more deaths than expexted since we dont know exactly hiw many people are to die tonight (with dats' thing) so it might just be a loss if we dont hit scum

fwiw, i'm pretty sure schadd is supposed to let me know when someone is taking damage from the charisma potion. i'm just unsure if he's gonna do it in public or just tell me privately - i'm in the middle of asking, will update when i get a response (i have been alerted of zero damage taking so far if that wans't obvious)

Ok this makes me feel bettwr abt just leashing him tbh

Would prob prefer pob over t3 but i dont have very strong opinions so long as we get toog if neither flip scum

[skitter30]

also, I just don't know if I have the energy to fight skitter if she is scum, and I guess the feeling that she is and that that's the inevitable consequence of me being around and pushing her is like, disincentivizing me to play rn + as mentioned, not having had a great day yesterday just due to general IRL mental health

~Rhyme

Luckily i'm not scum here, but i'm sorry that this is causing some level of disincentive-ness :(

Idk what i can do abt it to help but lmk if u want to chat abt anything

Also i hope things get better

[skitter30]

this is crap!

No, i'm trying to avoid losing overnight

[skitter30]

Except i learned some more information since that makes my concerns a moot point :shrug:

[skitter30]

how Scum is Toogooloo too you, skitter?

Oh i missed this - he's my best bet for scum rn

[skitter30]

Dats i think this potion has a bit of an unintended side effect in that it makes it hard for you to engage with people :(

[skitter30]

This is me explicitly agreeing with u

[skitter30]

Oh there we go
I appreciate that its public at least

[skitter30]

why do you rather kill 2 people you dont think are as scummy. its a crap plan

I mean i dont really want to but its not looming looking like i can get toog today

[skitter30]

I reallu think toog is the best flip today ...

[skitter30]

i mean i would prefer not but if people are suspicious of me and want me to i would

[skitter30]

Yeah i'm a little skeptical of pob's claim too

I dont mind shating my potion list

Otherwise i dont have much to say

[skitter30]

he's saying he has two potions called 'gulp', and that they do nothing, which sound dubious to me

[skitter30]

doesn't necessarily make him scum but i don't think he's telling the truth

[skitter30]

i mean yes i'm dubious that they do nothing and that they're called 'gulp' tho

[skitter30]

just for kicks here is my ingredient list:

dinosaur urine; witch spit; hibiscus; daisy stem; chickpeas; essence of foreceps; one french fry; cheeto dust; concentrated carrot oil

~
it, uh, honestly sounds kinda nasty
also i feel like i got scammed out of my 'plant-based' potion as the first two ingredients are definitely not plant-based

[skitter30]

i feel like this ame is sorta 'stuck' rn

[skitter30]

oh ok then
they're probably town then
don't really want to flip them honestly

[skitter30]

I do feel better abt the damage plan if toog holsters if we flip greeni would vastly prefer him and am dubious that t3's willingness to flip here comes from scum
If we flip t3/pob today i want toog tomorrow

Also my retti read sort of evaporates when he stops posting :(

[skitter30]

tris seems to be a strong-ish pr

[skitter30]

also ahhhhhhhhhh i feel like you're more likely to fake the 'flip me i'm cool with that' thing than t3 but it is kinda unlikely to come from scum

[skitter30]

well retti seems to have given a reasonable explanation + if scum have to dish out damage via potions it's possible nobody would have gotten enough cumulative damage at that point

[skitter30]

why are people so hesitant on toog again

[skitter30]

there is not a factional nightkill.

Hmm...

oh this too
i didn't realize this was a thing
than i'm *incredibly* doubtful that all fo the damage claims are town ...

[skitter30]

I'm also kinda wondering if scum in this scenario would claim their damage to 'get ahead' of massclaim given that other people are claiming damage-causing potions as well - there is going to be damage from unexplained sources probably and scum are going to have to claim something - if townies are claiming damage it suddenly becomes 'safe', if not advantageous, to do so

[skitter30]

if all of t3, pob, and tris are town it makes sense for scum to want us to damage them if they don't have an nk >.>

[skitter30]

like .
if there isn't scum within the damage claims are we positing that scum don't have an nk and also dont' have the ability to deal damage or

[skitter30]

And honestly, it makes roles like the charisma potion seem to benefit scum more than town.

yes but i think (?) dats is town on play + it's super easy for him to 'accidentally' write posts in a way for people to disagree with + it looks like the pressure of writing his posts in a ~neutral~ way is getting to him, when if he were scum that wouldnt' be happening

[skitter30]

than i'm *incredibly* doubtful that all fo the damage claims are town ...

I mean, if we assume that scum are using their damage potions to kill threats, they probably aren't claiming those shots.

So if anything, a damage claim on a suspicious player is a verifiable pro-town action that proves they didn't take any other action that night.

-Reason

true but what are scum goign to claim otherwise?

[skitter30]

i think that if townies are claiming damage potions scum would too

[skitter30]

because i'm not 100% confident you're town, maybe like 90%
like the (?) is the difference between a locktown read and a strong town read

[skitter30]

i also just feel like the fact that you're so intune with the scum mechanics is +scum :/

idk maybe i'm tunneled but i'm having a hard time here seeing toog as town

[skitter30]

nothing drastically beyond 'this game feels hard and i don't know where scum is so i have an element of paranoia on everyone'

[skitter30]

also uh why are you questioning the (?)

[skitter30]

i can't really think of anything, like it's not a you-specific paranoia so much as i'm at least a little bit dubious of everyone right now i think
like in my mind you haven't dropped so far, it's just more i don't want to call anyone locktown right now so you're sort of right below that level

i guess i'm just finding it weird that you're kinda concerned about the difference?

[skitter30]

why is that weird? do i like, need to again revive the discussion from c9++ abt my concerns of other people's reads on me or

also like i'm not 100% on you being town and that ~hesitation~ in your read on me (when you've given no prior signs that i've done something to make you do that) struck me as a bit out of the blue

i guess in my mind it doesn't really feel like a really big or significant difference rn and idk your concern feels a bit overblown to me

[skitter30]

I have self voted, to sum up my position, the best way to combat a scum team with no factional kill is for any town players with a damaging potion to holster it and never use it. Any deaths at night will be due to scum.

ig my concern is that to the outside obesrver there's functionally no difference between 'scum using their potion and claiming they didn't' and 'town not using their potion and claiming they didn't' as the hp damage isn't announced

so like yeah someone died but it's literally impossible to tell if you could have been responsible or not
just because you said you didn't do it doesn't mean you didn't

the self-vote is making me hesitate tho
UNVOTE:

[skitter30]

like ss i don't see why scum *wouldn't* claim the fact that they have the potion because we literally can't tell if they used it or not ...
toog may have used it last night. he may have not. we just don't know.

[skitter30]

right but they'd claim one i imagine, especially if town has one too

[skitter30]

do these potions just induce 1point of damage and you can use it each night?

[skitter30]

ugh maybe i'm tunneled >.>

[skitter30]

i think you're reading too much into the (?)

[skitter30]

maybe i need to revisit rr

[skitter30]

Scum presumably have ways to damage people if they dont have an nk, right?

Pedit good

[skitter30]

What do u think of the fact that he's currently self-voting tho

[skitter30]

Yeah i guess the one thing holding me bsck is that they seem fairly satisfied with the day ending with their flip, and scum usually dont
But i suppose if i really dont want them to end game might as well flip them today

[skitter30]

VOTE: toog

[skitter30]

Its not i'm p sure its just at 3 votes

[skitter30]

Toogeloo (2): skitter30, T3

Me and t3 both revoted and pob, who else is on them?

[skitter30]

Oh 4 with toog but its 5 to hammer

[skitter30]

UNVOTE:
Like if we're not ready to end fay yet but this is my preferred flip

[skitter30]

I feel like this is probably a faulty assumption? The OP says scum have some kind of factional information, and given the fact that scum probably cannot true claim their potions, I'd imagine they might be given safe claims to make, because otherwise town can just confirm each other if there's similar potions between their inventories. Like, that is the thing that actively makes more sense to me as the reason for an early claim from him.

A) i feel like the fact that toog is hyper aware of what scum's abilities are is +scum
B) so you think wcum were told there was a 'gulp' potion and decided to claim it pre-emptively? I kinda think it makes more sense that scum had a damage potion and upon seeing town claim it they claim it too >.>

[skitter30]

Oh good at least someone in this game acknowledges my existence in some form

Yea but you lack of motivation and just kinda disappearing act nakes it hard to keep up a scumread on u

[skitter30]

And even though I healed her I feel officially kind of sketchy about how skitter is treating the momentum on toog to be something of an inevitability because it feels like she wants it to happen but can't really justify it

But then I don't know what scum were doing with their damage last night if she wasn't attacked

A) people arent told if rhey get damaged so we have no way of knowing what scum did last night
B) i believe i have in fact justified my toog push, what part feels unjustified to you
C) they almost got flipped, how ought i be viewing it? And do you thinj they should endgame or

[skitter30]

also uh. i find it kind of curious that this post was only made after both t3 and skitter presented the idea that i could be scum scum or said they found something about me weird

Indeed, but its ok i'm not planning on voting u

[skitter30]

I kinda think toog's dats push is preposterous

[skitter30]

i mean yes the self-voting is much more on the townier side but:
a) i don't think ti's out of toog's range, especially after seeing people give t3 towncred for doing the same thing
b) i think there's scum in the damage claims
c) i feel like they've been rather scummy outside of the self-vote. like you seem to think i'm just pushing him because of the damage potion, but that's incorrect. i dont 'think they're townie, and i dont' really follow their reads (why is rr locktown for having a similar potion to them? why is dats scum now?) - lke the thing they're posting don't make too much sense to me either (and i also don't like that i haven't really gotten clear answers out of them when i'm trying to understand their thought process)

i also just feel like i don't think toog should endgame so like if not now then when

[skitter30]

but keep in mind that scum allotted their potions to each other after Day 1

there is not a factional nightkill.

Hmm...

did you remember either of these thigns offhand? i certainly didn't, and i've read the op a few times now, and i bet that most townies didn't either (in fact from reactions to toog saying this, i know a lot of people didn't). scum, however, would be incredibly aware of both of these facts as this is the reality of the game for them thus far: they had to make a conscioius choice as to how they'd have distributed the potions, and they know perfectly well they didn't kill anyone last night
townies honestly don't have any reason to remember this, because why would they? so far the game hasn't really gone *taht much differently* than a normal game, despite things being sort of different on the scum end. literally nobody even remembered about the lack of a factional nk until toog brought it up

I'm hard locking R&R because I have the exact same potion

does this make sense to you as a real thought???

also i think their push on me is p bad

[skitter30]

I just had a rough few days IRL

i hope things get better soon!

[skitter30]

ok fair
but idk i feel like ~knowing~ these things offhand is just a lot more likely to come from scum as that's the ~reality~ of their game, whereas it wouldn't be for town in nearly the same way
like it's not impossible to come from town so much as i think it's much more likely to come from scum

and i hope the work stuff wasn't too bad and i hope u feel better from the cold, those are Not Fun

[skitter30]

R.e. potion distribution: Uh that is actually a cogent point that i forgot abt

R.e. factional nk; i'm not sure where you messed that bit up

I uh have to rethink a bit

[skitter30]

oh where did the rhymers and reasoners go?

[skitter30]

skitt's reaction to toog's push on me, coupled with the fact that like right after it, they were willing to yeet toog, is making me think it might have supposed to been a "ok, i see people aren't interested in [controversial read], i can vote [compromise]"

idk what you're trying to say with this

[skitter30]

oh i thought you were talking abt me but wasn't sure
yeah that's a fair point

idk holistically overall toog just doesn't feel super townie to me
and just like don't feel like they're approaching this game from a town mindset

[skitter30]

like maybe i'm tunneled here idk but yeah

[skitter30]

not nearly as strong, no
it's kinda evaporating in the same way the one on retti has


(i will note that retti has disappeared again too ...)

[skitter30]

i wish
gun-to-head i think they're townier than not but i would in no way like bet the game on that, ya know

[skitter30]

also waht happened to ss, i feel like he hasnt' posted in like a week

[skitter30]

You guys so realize there are only two scum in this game, right?

Yes and apparently 5 other town yet i cant find, like, any of them

[skitter30]

Increasingly starting to think Datisi has maybe snowed me and it’s exactly skitt/datisi

~Rhyme

>.>

[skitter30]

Why are u even scumreading me again?

[skitter30]

Increasingly starting to think Datisi has maybe snowed me and it’s exactly skitt/datisi

~Rhyme

>.>

This does absolutely nothing to reassure me

~Rhyne

I mean what ought my response be
How do u even square this game with dats being scum
?

[skitter30]

But the reason when I outed that read was based around me really not believing your progression on tris/some of your posts there reading as super fake to me

Now it’s more like... game feels really hard, if I had to pick a set of players who if they were scum would result in game feeling really hard it would probably be you and dats

Iirc i responded to that read on me and yoh kinda dipped after that, so not much more i have to say there unless u have something new to add or want to respond

For the second point that's like fair
But the game is hard for me too and i dont have all the answers either

[skitter30]

so not much more i have to say there unless u have something new to add or want to respond

I’ll settle for a “Cassandra” scummies nom if that becomes an award this year

~Rhyme

Ok but i'm town tho and if ur town this is just not gonna be a ~helpful~ way to to go through the rest of the game
Like i'm not really sure what else u want from me here, and i'm kinda trying to get more out of you and i just get the above in responsw, so i'm getting kinda close to just writing this off as 'one of these illogical paranoia reads' and moving on

[skitter30]

Sigh

~
Like i said idk what you really want or are expecting
I dont think i'm being agenda-y, and i dont even really know how to respond to what you're saying becauss most of it is boiling down to being 'off' basically
Ig you might call this reductive but from my pov this is basically what i feel like you're saying, esp since i have been trying to respond to your points and i kinda feel like you're brushing me off for broader paranoia reasons

Idk
I dont really know what else to say wrt this

Pedit i'm p sure that was at me and not u dats

[skitter30]

Oh i thought 920
Idk i'm not finding it so hard to avoid disagreeing with u
Maybe this is why i'm not as apathetic as everyone else

Pedit fwiw toog i dont think this is *super* normal for a micro, i think the charisma thing is exacerbating it
Larger games tend to be more active, maybe try a normal or mini theme and swe if those are more your vibe?

[skitter30]

Oh lol

[skitter30]

Ok. I will vote once were all ready to end the day

Fwiw i am more sus of rr now then i was two hours ago

[skitter30]

I feel like i keep trying to unstick the game but kinda dont know what to do anymore >.>

Retti i wasnt trying to ignore u r.e. pob, i guess where i disagree woth u is that a lot of his thoughta wrt toog are sort of mirroring my own

I'm also not sure why you're reducing his push to OMGUS (is my toog push omgus?)

I also kinda fear that flipping toog wont unfuck the game so yeah i'm not really sure where to go from here

Pedit mostly annoyed at the thread being kinda dead again and remembering you sayinf you would post this weekend
My apologies for annoying you, wasnt trying too, you have a point that nothing really happened yesterday (irl)

But ig i was kinda hoping someone would try to do something abt that ...

[skitter30]

I almost want to wagon someone else out of the toog/t3/pob pool (heck even me) just to unstick things but i imagine this proposal at this juncture wont go super far cuz i think people just want to end the day

~

Retti r.e. pob ig from my pov this is sort of how i'm viewinf toog so other people having similar thoughts makes me feel like they're thinking abt the game similarly to me

I think it is possible i'm tunneled but if i am i dont fully know where to go from here >.>

Also i have to check when pob started suspecting him but i dont remember it happening just after toog suspected him
Pedit me i'm p sure

[skitter30]

HUH????? how did I go from there to here only from reasons that are making random guesses about the setup????

Ok ur right it is omgus

[skitter30]

I drank down one big Gulp but I still dont know what they do. my other one is different. and now I am very busy today, sweating and doing personle things, dont ask!!

~
Ok upon iso-ing:
- i think his exasperation at all the mechanic-talk is +town
- the way he's consistently talking abt his potions seems truthful to me (yes i know i said the opposite earlier)
- his toog thought process just kinda makes sense to me. How ~annoyed~ he is at what toog is saying and at the fact that we havent flipped him yet also feels town to me

And possibly a weird thing to say but he feels kinda unpartnered/unaligned almost

[skitter30]

i also just feel like the fact that you're so intune with the scum mechanics is +scum :/

idk maybe i'm tunneled but i'm having a hard time here seeing toog as town

i said that too

@retti does this come from scum in that universe?
Idk he's just so annoyed at how we're approachung this it just doesnf really feel like scum to me

[skitter30]

He's basically calling me out for using the same arguments as him .... when in your universe, he's using *my* arguments - he's calling me out for repeating things he's already said when in reality he's mimicking things *i've* said

Idk that feels kinda gutsy in a way that most scum wouldnt think to be
~
Aside ehat do u think of rr

[skitter30]

Oh pedit >.>

[skitter30]

IDK, the fact he's being shielded by, like, all of you/RaR/Datisi makes me feel like something is up, like no you can't all be scum but if scum was in that group I would expect a lot less...resistance? to the vote, t3 is content to keep voting toogs, toog won't even join me on him, I don't get how he's unaligned exactly

I don't know fully how to explain this thought better, beyond: i somehow dont think so much fo what he's talking abt would be his 'gulp' potions if partnered
I didnt fully manage to articulate this vibe which sort of only makes senss in my head and i dont fully know how to either >.>

[skitter30]

Tris why did u give the friendly neighbor potion to pob

[skitter30]

He's a random person to send it to and i didnt remember u saying why

[skitter30]

He's a random person to send it to and i didnt remember u saying why

was it just curiosity or did you have other reasons you wanted to know the answer?

Curiosity

[skitter30]

Yep this has been quite a week for me. New job starting tomorrow, been looking for apartments, and out of town for the holiday weekend.

Oh! I hope apl of these things are going well!

And whatever
VOTE: toog

[skitter30]

He's a random person to send it to and i didnt remember u saying why

was it just curiosity or did you have other reasons you wanted to know the answer?

Curiosity

Eh
Even knowing that you friendly neighbored i'm somewhat sus of you

[skitter30]

Ugh i wasnt gonna solve this one
Gg scum!

[skitter30]

I think if i came into today i maybe would have gotten retti
The one thing that did tip me off r.e. dats was whe you had a *very* odd reaction to the (?)
Bur like i said wasnt gonna fully solve this one i think