Newbie 2070 - Airplanes | GAME OVER

[GrandpaMo]

Please tell me this isn't a game where half the players flake out....

WASGOOD

[GrandpaMo]

VOTE: Vote: Nancy Drew 39

The first 38 were bad news, I'm sure #39 is no different.

It's been a minute since I've played, I'm happy to join you all!

wait did u already confirm?

it says still u havent confirmed unless mod didnt update

[GrandpaMo]

First.

Psyche is playing?

since when do mods play mafia

VOTE: brookewyrm
No pun allowed.

Join date

If you are mafia then say "I'm mafia" It will help us win.

If you are town then say "I'm town"
Thanks!

VOTE: Vote: Nancy Drew 39

The first 38 were bad news, I'm sure #39 is no different.

It's been a minute since I've played, I'm happy to join you all!

I'll definitely be tracking where this game goes.

Please tell me this isn't a game where half the players flake out....

Theseus's Mafia Game

Move along nothing to see here.

t3 why are u acting more "optimistic" or whatever the word is ... it just seems like you are happy about a specific role

[GrandpaMo]

Can we try and work as many airplane and flight related puns as possible into this. I think there's nothing better than the smooth landing of a well delivered airline pun.

no ur scum

VOTE: BlurryX

finally i found a non awkward vote for RVS.

i rlly hated to vote T3 after psyche voted them

[GrandpaMo]

I will catch up later.

... theres nothing to catch up wit... u act like u just replaced in lol

[GrandpaMo]

VOTE GrandpaMo

Let's make a circle with everyone

pointing their guns

voting a unique member! Though that's probably not helpful for town. Also, what happens if we all vote a unique person and it stays that way at the end of the day phase? (I mean, one vote on everyone) Would the lynch be randomised?

and the paranoia of dumbtells have started.....

[GrandpaMo]

VOTE: GrandpaMo

i agree wagons are better

LOL thats actually funny -- i might just townread u off this

[GrandpaMo]

i kind of find post 41 a bit artificial
the post just wasn't that funny

huh i thouhgt u were meming ... u voting me was actually serious? LOL

[GrandpaMo]

i kind of find post 41 a bit artificial
the post just wasn't that funny

I got a similar vibe from that and a similar vibe from.the same post where Greenland talks about me being excited. VOTE: Grandpa Psyche is towny for this.

pog e-2

[GrandpaMo]

pog e-1 VOTE: GrandpaMo

[GrandpaMo]

UNVOTE: GrandpaMo

ok i should probably stop meming xD

[GrandpaMo]

also kind of odd to go from deriding "the paranoia of dumbtells" about one shitpost to "i might just townread u off this" about another in the span of like half an hour

we are literally on page 2....


i am just townreading you because i don't think you would just do that confidenly as scum -- now thats a serious townread!

[GrandpaMo]

i kind of find post 41 a bit artificial
the post just wasn't that funny

I got a similar vibe from that and a similar vibe from.the same post where Greenland talks about me being excited. VOTE: Grandpa Psyche is towny for this.

sheeps me but votes me ...


classic t3

[GrandpaMo]

Psyche is towny for this

i townread psych for the same reason u implied kek

and u did too right after i posted smh

[GrandpaMo]

um, are we actually limming me this early x.x

pog e-1

[GrandpaMo]

UNVOTE: GrandpaMo

ok i should probably stop meming xD

Mo, why aren’t you taking this more seriously?

because the sequence of events are funny

i meme to t3 and aggress lunar

then psyche makes a funny post which leads them to vote me

then im like shit "let me put myself to e-1 since everyone had already voted me, and instantly unvote"

then clark puts me at e-1 or sum shit then yea

i love playing wit t3 -- gosh, i know this is so random but i feel like t3 is the msot limmable person in MS and i am the only one who knows their allignment and they know mines.

ik that was so random, but i was just like rereading that game and enjoyed a few posts t3 has said and done lol

[GrandpaMo]

um, are we actually limming me this early x.x

pog e-1

Yes, yes I am.gif

LMFOAOFOAOF

T3 THIS IS EXACTLY WHY . READ WHAT I JUST SAID I DIDNT EVEN SEE THAT TILL NOW

[GrandpaMo]

i love playing wit t3 -- gosh, i know this is so random but i feel like t3 is the msot limmable person in MS and

i am the only one who knows their allignment and they know mines

.

What do you mean by this?

meaning i know how they how play as scum

and how they play as town

so i can tell when they are town and scum while others cannot making him a very liable scumpush for mafia

[GrandpaMo]

I don’t know what to make of Mo here. In the game we played together, he was actually upset by scumreads on him. Here, he acts like he doesn’t really care. He’s the lead wagon at E-1 and he seems to be totally fine with it. Why isn’t he even trying to put up more of a fight?

wha game have u played wit me? what

also -- its because i thought this whole push on me was a meme.

but ig its not?

can ANYONE give me a reason they scumread me?

This started as a RVS vote on me from LunarRest then Psych just voted me along with no reason ( I thought they were meming. look at post 40)

And I townread them for this because I felt like scum would find a hard time trying to figure out how to get in a vote on me, but psych made it look so casual.

They claim my townread on them was artificial because THEY thought it was unfunny to THEM. (ok ignore how i feel then :rollingeyes)

Then they bring up another reason of me shitposting -- But like I already explained everyone was and shit why can't I (also my post 40 wasn't a shitpost since it was a real read)

Then T3 sheeps Psych and say they agree and puts me at E-2.

Then in post 63, they talk about someone else but vote me -- it just felt like a meme vote as well.

These whole sequence of votes just been actual jokes. And that's why I thought it was funny and I thought this whole game was just a giant meme.

But ig not? I am being scumread now for it?

Can anyone give me a SCUMCASE on me OTHER than psyche?

[GrandpaMo]

@Mo, who is scum here? Can you possibly give us a readslist?

It's literally fucking page 5 LOL

What is going on this game...

Am I missing something that no one has told me about?


Like MAYBE I would have Psyche as implied town. And maybe T3 as well. (which I already explained)

But other than why ask for a readlist this damn early LOL.

[GrandpaMo]

i love playing wit t3 -- gosh, i know this is so random but i feel like t3 is the msot limmable person in MS and

i am the only one who knows their allignment and they know mines

.

What do you mean by this?

meaning i know how they how play as scum

and how they play as town

so i can tell when they are town and scum while others cannot making him a very liable scumpush for mafia

So, are they town or scum here?

to early to know that -- i get to know during closer to eod with there interactions with other ppl..

but im null leaning them town cuz them thinking i scumslipped

[GrandpaMo]

I don’t know what to make of Mo here. In the game we played together, he was actually upset by scumreads on him. Here, he acts like he doesn’t really care. He’s the lead wagon at E-1 and he seems to be totally fine with it. Why isn’t he even trying to put up more of a fight?

wha game have u played wit me? what

also -- its because i thought this whole push on me was a meme.

but ig its not?

can ANYONE give me a reason they scumread me?

This started as a RVS vote on me from LunarRest then Psych just voted me along with no reason ( I thought they were meming. look at post 40)

And I townread them for this because I felt like scum would find a hard time trying to figure out how to get in a vote on me, but psych made it look so casual.

They claim my townread on them was artificial because THEY thought it was unfunny to THEM. (ok ignore how i feel then :rollingeyes)

Then they bring up another reason of me shitposting -- But like I already explained everyone was and shit why can't I (also my post 40 wasn't a shitpost since it was a real read)

Then T3 sheeps Psych and say they agree and puts me at E-2.

Then in post 63, they talk about someone else but vote me -- it just felt like a meme vote as well.

These whole sequence of votes just been actual jokes. And that's why I thought it was funny and I thought this whole game was just a giant meme.

But ig not? I am being scumread now for it?

Can anyone give me a SCUMCASE on me OTHER than psyche?

Talking about post 63.. I meant to put Clark up there^^^

[GrandpaMo]

Grandpa perspective slipping and then posting walls.

Fun fun.

Grandpa has basically scumclaimed at this point.

how i just explained kek

[GrandpaMo]

@Mo, who is scum here? Can you possibly give us a readslist?

It's literally fucking page 5 LOL

What is going on this game...

Am I missing something that no one has told me about?


Like MAYBE I would have Psyche as implied town. And maybe T3 as well. (which I already explained)

But other than why ask for a readlist this damn early LOL.

I was trying to get you to do something to demonstrate that your actually taking the wagon on you seriously. Because if you were to continue to treat the wagon on you like a meme, how are we supposed to be able to seriously parse you?

hm. well its just that no one looks like it was it being serious, but im the one that is suppose to give a readlist etc -- it felt like i was being attacked (probably to get a reaction out of me to determine what you exactly said) -- but following the sequence of events... i will really not take this wagon on me serious UNTIL i get a full scumcase on me. Yes on page 5 pog.

Which I haven't done anything, (in my opinion, from my perspective) AI.

Me being virtually on E-1 should mean I am town -- unless mafia is bussing me or somehow all 4 town are voting me and you think I would be scu,. You would expect everyone on my wagon to be town, but I just highly doubt that, just by looking at the series of events, I think mafia could be on me right now. Why hammer this early? It gives town no info and scum only advantages. And scum will regardless because I am town.

[GrandpaMo]

Grandpa perspective slipping and then posting walls.

Fun fun.

what walls?

this is nothing to how i played in games wit u and u know that LOL holy shit r u scum this game . CAN I FINALLY NOT GET POCKETED :')

[GrandpaMo]

Here is this just for reference:

Spoiler:

I don’t know what to make of Mo here. In the game we played together, he was actually upset by scumreads on him. Here, he acts like he doesn’t really care. He’s the lead wagon at E-1 and he seems to be totally fine with it. Why isn’t he even trying to put up more of a fight?

wha game have u played wit me? what

also -- its because i thought this whole push on me was a meme.

but ig its not?

can ANYONE give me a reason they scumread me?

This started as a RVS vote on me from LunarRest then Psych just voted me along with no reason ( I thought they were meming. look at post 40)

And I townread them for this because I felt like scum would find a hard time trying to figure out how to get in a vote on me, but psych made it look so casual.

They claim my townread on them was artificial because THEY thought it was unfunny to THEM. (ok ignore how i feel then :rollingeyes)

Then they bring up another reason of me shitposting -- But like I already explained everyone was and shit why can't I (also my post 40 wasn't a shitpost since it was a real read)

Then T3 sheeps Psych and say they agree and puts me at E-2.

Then in post 63, they talk about someone else but vote me -- it just felt like a meme vote as well.

These whole sequence of votes just been actual jokes. And that's why I thought it was funny and I thought this whole game was just a giant meme.

But ig not? I am being scumread now for it?

Can anyone give me a SCUMCASE on me OTHER than psyche?

also -- its because i thought this whole push on me was a meme.

but ig its not?

I was asking for clarity on this earlier in the game and nobody provided it. It seemed like inside jokes/things not be taking seriously. I know this is a game, but especially in a Newbie it's nice when things are clearly communicated.

can ANYONE give me a reason they scumread me?

Psyche gave you additional reasons for his vote making it no longer an RVS vote. I decided to switch my vote to you mostly because I was unsettled by what I felt was a defense of your odd behavior by Nancy. Also, I like early E-1's. They give a lot of information and IMO are well worth the low risk of a quickhammer. I would say that reactions from you, Psyche, and more notably Nancy have been worth it.

Let me sum up how I see the progression of your wagon. You initially misread the suspicions of Psyche and T3 because you thought they were just fucking around despite them explaining that their votes were real. You do acknowledge this in 46 but your defense involves somewhat explaining your town-reads and then self-voting. When I put you at E-1 you kind of run through the sequence of events but don't offer a real defense. You do post that you

know

what T3's alignment is and that he

knows

yours as well. Either that is you saying that you and T3 are scum or that you are both...masons? Your explanation for this is that you can read T3 so that is how you know he is town. If this is true your first post was

very

poorly worded. If T3 knows your town why is he (eagerly) on your wagon?

I thought my sum up was good enough. This was literally me reading word by word on the iso. I tried to add everything to summarize everything. But I will explain in detail now.

I was asking for clarity on this earlier in the game and nobody provided it. It seemed like inside jokes/things not be taking seriously. I know this is a game, but especially in a Newbie it's nice when things are clearly communicated.

Why do you think I was confused? I thought this whole thing was a joke that everyone had went along with starting with LunarRest.

Psyche gave you additional reasons for his vote making it no longer an RVS vote.

I actually had thought it was a semi-real vote with just the other real part being it to gauge reactions and with the main part it being to joke along with Lunar, this was also emphasized stronger with T3's vote. I had already explained everything about what Psyche has said. Town usually questions -- I never expect a quick vote to E-1 ( I bring a point later on)

I decided to switch my vote to you mostly because I was unsettled by what I felt was a defense of your odd behavior by Nancy.

See, I never knew this. You haven't gave any explicit scumread, you just expected me to assume that's what you meant by that earlier post you made to Nancy. But now you have told me, that is YOUR scumread. Also I don't think it was a defense on my end -- It was just me reiterating stuff I had already said -- since there was literally no new info at that time.

Also, I like early E-1's. They give a lot of information and IMO are well worth the low risk of a quickhammer. I would say that reactions from you, Psyche, and more notably Nancy have been worth it.

Never have them seen before done... hence why I was confuzzled for the most part as if there was a leading progression etc. And now people are using that info to manipulate specific context. I disagree. Early E-1's are a bad way to bring into light for newbie games. Anyone could hammer and heck I could be PR, VT, or scum, but you still wouldn't know for 100 percent and you will have a newbie who may misread or VC, or scum that may pick up on a soft, and just hammer me. Would that make them scummier the next day? Maybe, but that blame could be initially all shifted to the people who BROUGHT me to E-1 in the first place. Shit, it is a newbie game and for all I know they could just play the newbie card and get away with it. This happened in the "Would you like to be my neighbor" game I was in. But not to me, to someone else.

Let me sum up how I see the progression of your wagon. You initially misread the suspicions of Psyche and T3 because you thought they were just fucking around despite them explaining that their votes were real.

I already did for you.. twice actually. And yes, but I also had some back head thoughts spiraling as well.

You do acknowledge this in 46 but your defense involves somewhat explaining your town-reads and then self-voting.

This specific quote feels manipulative. Out of all the posts you chose for my "defense" which wasn't even the defense part, you add that with me self voting and pretend like it was me as scum doing this. You should have linked post 50 where you can see my implied confusion, and my lazy defense there. Reason I say lazy, because I wasn't going to take those votes on me fully seriously yet.

hen I put you at E-1 you kind of run through the sequence of events but don't offer a real defense.

Yes, because there was no scumcase. There were no reasons for a defense. There was no reason to defend. Everything that T3 has said or psyche said, I already explained before. It just felt like a repeat. I gave an outline of events because I felt though, an E-1 early especially with the sequence of events that followed should make me town in your eyes. That's how I feel about it. The only real defense I had to do was explain to Nancy on why I wasn't taking the game seriously -- which I already had did later on.

You do post that you

know

what T3's alignment is and that he

knows

yours as well. Either that is you saying that you and T3 are scum or that you are both...masons? Your explanation for this is that you can read T3 so that is how you know he is town. If this is true your first post was

very

poorly worded. If T3 knows your town why is he (eagerly) on your wagon?

If you look at my original scum, you would see that I said "I am the only one" meaning one person -- this is a two scum person game. Why would I presumptively scumslip with me having the narrative that I was talking about me only. Like I said, that may have been poorly drafted -- and I do apologize. But if you read it literally -- you would understand what it means through what I previously said, context matters here! Why do you think I said that, it's because I said this previously gosh, i know this is so random but i feel like t3 is the msot limmable person in MS" then I proceeded to say >>> "I am the only one that knows his alignment and he knows mine." Why would town!t3 know that it's me scum!grandpa if I did "slip" especially considering T3 kept screaming at me saying I scumslipped.

If T3 knows your town why is he (eagerly) on your wagon?

See quote above regarding this (how does town!t3 know i would be scum as implied in my supposed "scumslip") but honestly, I said this earlier, but I kinda don't like T3 anymore. To answer your question -- they realize I am town after multiple interactions. Look at my recent game where I died and they- Oh wait, I believe that game is still ongoing~!

Well in a game previously, they would ultimately decide to know if I am town or scum eventually after their reads change. For example, in my Aliensitter game, I was scum, and took advantage of them being scummy!town, and proposed a lim on them. (sorry t3-- you probably heard this story like 8 times from me now >,<) butttttt after that T3 townread me, then eventually scumread me towards the end I believe. @t3 u can confirm if this is true. That is one theory, but this is only a theory implying that T3 is town.

Well I hope they are town this game. Or this will probably be another game where I have been pocketed or well swayed by their niceness. I may have bias into townreading them but it's okay. I want to be able to scumread them later on.

[GrandpaMo]

Official Vote Count 1.02

Boeing 787

---

Elimination

GrandpaMo

(3): LunarRest, Psyche, T3

Nancy Drew 39

(1): ClarkBar

Psyche

(1): BlurryX

Wayward Son

(1): Nancy Drew 39

Not Voting

(3): Wayward Son, brookewyrm, GrandpaMo

Deadline:

(expired on 2021-07-06 10:00:49).

Mod notes:

With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to eliminate.

We have 8 days guys, no need to rush anything. Wrt to Mo, I miselimed him in a past game. He could be scum here or limbait. Some people are naturally scummy players. It would be nice if we had some time to actually see he’s really the best elim or not.

He isn’t playing extremely differently here from the game I miselimed him in so I’m wary.

Oh I completely ignored this post -- I thought this was MOD Vc, I was trying to look at where Clark quoted.

And again this has been asked 3 times now, 2 by me and 1 by Clark, what game? pls me is confused

[GrandpaMo]

If you look at my original scum

I mean quote* here if no one caught the joke.

[GrandpaMo]

I was the one confused. I made a post asking for people to explain what was going on because I was getting lost. It seemed like everyone knew each other and had inside references that were impacting this game in a way I wasn't fully grasping.

If you are referencing post 55 you made this with my quote in it. So I will assume that you were talking about me.

I had played with T3 never with Psyche -- but from what it seems other people has.

I thought it was still the "RVS" timeslot, I mean heck, it should have been it's only been page two.

So I just started meming because I thought everyone was.

[GrandpaMo]

Understood. Thank you for this post, it was helpful.

Can you explain how?

[GrandpaMo]

I think that covers everyone so far. For now I think keeping Grandpa as the lead contender for the guillotine is the right move, as they do have an erratic posting style that may cause confusion later in the game, but hopefully there is something more substantive to base a day 1 lynch off of in the next few days, and we haven't yet heard from the two AFK players.

Okay -- I kinda. Man that just hurt me.

I joined this game to do that. To fix that playstyle of mine by changing my playstyle a bit.

Can you explain what posts I have made that made you think I was in erratic stage?

Can you tell me what's the difference between the series of my posts versus T3's series of posts in the opening game.

[GrandpaMo]

The E-1 early on is probably a good thing, because it's the catalyst that is getting people talking (provided no quick-hammer). Without it, I'm not sure people would be talking as much this early on in the game (although I'm not super familiar with how the early games really go usually).

See post above to my dislike on E-1's ^

I mean -- What has it told you @Blurry, can you tell me? Because when it came to my read that you posted about, you haven't said anything other than it being a something you would come back in the future/.

I felt like you could tell way more from the people voting me right now, rather than myself.

[GrandpaMo]

I also think pages 1 - 3 are completely NAI to read anything based from.

I think you can garner way more info starting on page four.

Everything just has been useless info to read early on, you would only use this info later on towards EoD or closer to the end of the full game.

[GrandpaMo]

Wrt to Mo, I miselimed him in a past game.

What game is this? When I look at your topics and Grandpa's topics there are no other common games besides this one.

It was under an alt account which I’d prefer not to out. I’m still leery of his wagon building up that fast. Why would my post - saying att, he hadn’t played too differently and was miselimed, make you want to put him at E -1?

I still don’t know what to make of the whole meme thing but if he’s actually scum here, then his buddy is either choosing to let him hang or straight up bussing.

Mo’s point about being so fast being run up to E - 1, is a good one, because where is the resistance?

hm i probably have an idea of what you are talking bout -- but i will refrain from saying anything just in case.

i mean yea -- its there, i explained, and now taking the votes on me very serious and everything else as well

[GrandpaMo]

UNVOTE:

I lean to likely at least one scum on Mo wagon. Don’t think it’s Lunar or probably not Clark anymore.

you also had said psyche was leaning town for you. idk if lunar was voting me.

but if they were, then t3 is just left. does that mean you imply t3 is the scum on my wagon?

i also agree as i said previously. i do think there is probable scum on my wagon. i just dont know who rn

[GrandpaMo]

also can u explain why not lunar or clark anymore?

[GrandpaMo]

Understood. Thank you for this post, it was helpful.

Can you explain how?

It was clearly written and addressed a multitude of issues. It gave me a really good insight into your thought process and decision making. The point of my vote on you has been met. I think you are kind of a null to very light town read, and certainly shouldn't be at E-1 any longer.

Hey, who do you think is the likeliest scum on your wagon? I know my pick. That said, it would be hilarious if both slots that haven't posted yet are scum.

this is like the nicest thing i have ever read in a long time -- after multiple people coming at me for having posts not being able to understand or just not comprehend. i am trying. and i hope u see im trying to adapt a good non toxic playstyle. i apperciate it a lot.

better not be scum>:(

[GrandpaMo]

UNVOTE:

I lean to likely at least one scum on Mo wagon. Don’t think it’s Lunar or probably not Clark anymore.

you also had said psyche was leaning town for you. idk if lunar was voting me.

but if they were, then t3 is just left. does that mean you imply t3 is the scum on my wagon?

i also agree as i said previously. i do think there is probable scum on my wagon. i just dont know who rn

also @clark this should answer the question -- ik its a weak response, i will give more detailed analysis tmr regarding my wagon - and possible scum. since those were like lazy written tired laid back posts

[GrandpaMo]

wait im so fucking confused.

[GrandpaMo]

i love how i go from being to e-1 to everyone literally just reiterating my posts etc and sorta sheeping


thats literally how i see it. if thats not town than shit idk what is

[GrandpaMo]

UNVOTE:
You knowwhen someone's post pings you, and then when you scroll down that post someone else also got the same ping?That's the kind of feeling I'm getting with Psyche so I think he's town.

So basically Grandpasaid "I know his alignment and he knows mine" The he was referring to me.. and I was voting him. I'm voting him, and he's nodding along saying, yes, you know my alignment.

like wtf is this????
pls explain t3 (((


this is like the third time u do this

u vote me
scumread me

then i push u
then someone townreads me (which i end up being town)

u then unvote me

then later on u get to townread me

[GrandpaMo]

i will respond to psyche's weird wallpost later when i come back around from work -- theres a few points i want to really hit at

`post reminder`

[GrandpaMo]

Hello all;

Nice to see you again so soon GrandpaMo and T3!

I'll have a read through and let you know my thoughts once I am done.

hi...

i hope we can be cooler this game

yes?
no?

[GrandpaMo]

Regarding the alt thing. I was annoyed that Nancy used a past experience with Grandpa to defend/justify the gameplay style they were using that got them to E-1 fairly quickly but then decided to not disclose the game in question. I wanted to skim that game for similarities to this one to get a better read on if what Nancy was saying was true and informed this game and Grandpa's play-style better. Why bring it up if we can only take her word for it? It felt to me that Nancy was advocating for Grandpa during his push and that pinged me so I wanted to explore their past relationship/interactions. Ultimately I was too lazy to sleuth the game out, and I wasn't motivated to bother Nancy about it. Seemed like a dead end. I will check out the link provided by Val later.

I can understand that but I was telling the truth, I did in fact miselim him and it was under a different account. If it had happened under this account, that would obviously be preferable but it wasn’t and that is my only experience playing with him.

i second this

[GrandpaMo]

she doesn't need to explain the alt thing.

it should be self explainable -- its not that hard to understand.

she townreads me because i am playing the same way i played in a game where she was scum and mislimmed me in.

that game she was on an alt.

and i probably know who she is talking bout -- nd can confirm this did happen.
val and nancy were just going bout either side triumph regarding all that i just epxlained above and it go no where.

yall r both town anwyays

[GrandpaMo]

Val and Clark are both town for the above.

i dont know who scum is anymore.

t3, i willl ask u

who is scum

[GrandpaMo]

she doesn't need to explain the alt thing.

it should be self explainable -- its not that hard to understand.

she townreads me because i am playing the same way i played in a game where she was scum and mislimmed me in.

that game she was on an alt.

and i probably know who she is talking bout -- nd can confirm this did happen.
val and nancy were just going bout either side triumph regarding all that i just epxlained above and it go no where.

yall r both town anwyays

Nancy should explain it enough to clarify the situation so everyone can be 100% on the same page. She doesn't need to go into full detail or out the alt.

didnt she do that already like 4 times

[GrandpaMo]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

no lol

[GrandpaMo]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

emily is already outted

[GrandpaMo]

.

[GrandpaMo]

vc

[GrandpaMo]

Val and Clark are both town for the above.

i dont know who scum is anymore.

t3, i willl ask u

who is scum

can u answer my question u scummity scum scum scum!

[GrandpaMo]

Val and Clark are both town for the above.

i dont know who scum is anymore.

t3, i willl ask u

who is scum

can u answer my question u scummity scum scum scum!

vc

I have no idea.

lol ok i think u are town

i had u as hard null and u were the only one as null

i literally have no idea who scum is either

like i have too many townreadsss this gameee plssss someone do something scummmyyyy

[GrandpaMo]

Hi. I'm new to the game and I'm not really smart either, so please bear with me.

hmm ig i might need to reread lunar rest -- they were also someone who i havent focused on too much because they were "new"

@lunar whats ur reads looking like pls

[GrandpaMo]

Town: lunar val clark psyche nancy
everyone else: everyone else.

Town: lunar val clark psyche nancy
everyone else: everyone else.

Grandpa/Blurry scum team then. Solved game gg

Real talk, Blurry's posts suck and they're coasting hard while everyone else fights each other over a whole lot of nothing.

ok pog we vote blurry then ez

also im ur town smh dont vote off town

[GrandpaMo]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

I initially thought the same. But of the 3 accounts that mislimmed Grandpa - Loki Dokie, Hopkirk, Emily (see here); only Hopkirk was also on the bugspray wagon, as per Nancys 146. GrandpaMo also has reason to think the Nancy Alt flipped scum (not sure where that comes from, but OK), and Hopkirk is the only other one to fit that description too.

Interestingly, the briefest of looks at that ISO throws up red flags as far as a theoretical scum!Nancy=Hopkirk goes - I can see the "I'm hurt and you are a meanie" attitude coming through from the very first post. That would be a very good reason right off the bat why a scum!Nancy in this game wants to be coy about her scum game in 1009, if we are right about the identity of the alt.

That is why I don't get it. If you aren't scum in this game, why do you need to protect your scum meta from scrutiny? If protecting the alt important to you, then just don't mention the information you gleaned from your alt play, just say "I found this game of Grandpa's, and this is what I see" and don’t mention you were actually in it; or else say "I played in this game under alt X", and just roll a new alt for your next game. Trying to hide the existence of a game you played as scum only makes sense me to me if you also rolled scum this game.

"i carried a mislim on grandpa" they refer to me when i was town.

town says that to town?

no. that implies they are scum lol val what logic is that -- u silly goose

[GrandpaMo]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

I initially thought the same. But of the 3 accounts that mislimmed Grandpa - Loki Dokie, Hopkirk, Emily (see here); only Hopkirk was also on the bugspray wagon, as per Nancys 146. GrandpaMo also has reason to think the Nancy Alt flipped scum (not sure where that comes from, but OK), and Hopkirk is the only other one to fit that description too.

Interestingly, the briefest of looks at that ISO throws up red flags as far as a theoretical scum!Nancy=Hopkirk goes - I can see the "I'm hurt and you are a meanie" attitude coming through from the very first post. That would be a very good reason right off the bat why a scum!Nancy in this game wants to be coy about her scum game in 1009, if we are right about the identity of the alt.

That is why I don't get it. If you aren't scum in this game, why do you need to protect your scum meta from scrutiny? If protecting the alt important to you, then just don't mention the information you gleaned from your alt play, just say "I found this game of Grandpa's, and this is what I see" and don’t mention you were actually in it; or else say "I played in this game under alt X", and just roll a new alt for your next game. Trying to hide the existence of a game you played as scum only makes sense me to me if you also rolled scum this game.

"i carried a mislim on grandpa" they refer to me when i was town.

town says that to town?

no. that implies they are scum lol val what logic is that -- u silly goose

Grandpa, I would accept your waterfowl epithet for me with good grace if "I carried a mislim on grandpa" was in fact what Nancy said, but it wasn't. It was:

Wrt to Mo, I miselimed him in a past game.

No mention of "carrying" involved.

Town says that to town? Yes, they bloody well do - I say I mislimmed you in our game (sorry about that, old chap), and we were both town.

In any case, if you are right that only scum says that, then that's only further confirmation that Hopkirk and Nancy are one and the same; given that Hopkirk was the only scum on your wagon in 1009.

eh same thing just going off by memory -- most of the time its scum. i dont think i would say mislim here especially in the context of finding out my allignment and how i played. the context was in my playstyle

[GrandpaMo]

also u werer like the fifth scum in that game shh

[GrandpaMo]

she doesn't need to explain the alt thing.

it should be self explainable -- its not that hard to understand.

she townreads me because i am playing the same way i played in a game where she was scum and mislimmed me in.

that game she was on an alt.

and i probably know who she is talking bout -- nd can confirm this did happen.
val and nancy were just going bout either side triumph regarding all that i just epxlained above and it go no where.

yall r both town anwyays

No, we were both town in that.

shh im tryna confuse them

[GrandpaMo]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

no lol

Btw, that PT with you and Emily was probably one of the funniest things ever.

yea that alt played me well lmaoo

[GrandpaMo]

wait so why is blurry scum

[GrandpaMo]

I sincerely apologize if I could be nicer about this but I’ve literally explained, re-explained and re-explained ad nauseum and even after I don’t think I can make things any clearer, Val continues to insist I’m ignoring the question. Then Roden piggybanks on it.

I’m fine with answering questions but getting repeatedly asked the same exact question - which I have answered, probably at least at least 3 times now, is exasperating. And I honestly can’t tell anymore if Val is pretending not to read my responses or he’s genuinely not understanding. Either way, I’m done with repeating myself over and over again, when I have abundantly clearly already explained it.

what tf more aren’t youcomprehending?

If you want to protect the alt, why not just say "I have a meta read on X, here is the game he played in and here is what I think it tells us"; trying to muscle in the fact you were playing in it under an alt seems like a way to try and bolster not very good reasoning with "I was there" cred whilst at the same time trying to hide your own meta tells. You know who worries about thier own meta tells in a mafia game? Scum! Who cares if you get meta read as town if you are town, right?

^ This.

I didn’t want to link the game BECAUSE I was playing under an alt. I’m almost regretting now even mentioning it but when I saw Mo so quickly being run up to E-1, I felt I had an obligation to say what I did because on what other basis could I have effectively communicated my concern with the speed of that wagon or why I was leery of it?

I really expected Mo to flip scum in that game and I was obviously wrong, so I had serious doubts about him flipping scum as a result.

I never ever link my ISO’s when I play under alts but if you like, I’d be more than fine linking that tm game, because I played that under my main.

Subject: TM2021 | Anime Destroys Untrod Tripod | Endgame

I asked him to read TGP, and Ceph thinks it's possible TGP is scum, but is confused at why he's a popular target. Also as scum it'd be weird to go after Nancy because she'll definitely OMGUS you. Not the wagon I'd go for today, and it's practically the same wagon as the one that was on me (Flavor, BBmolla, Nancy, NEE). The only difference is Mistyx being on it and shea avoiding it despite really going after TGP (and obviously TGP not being on it). Kind of just reinforces to me that assuming there were a couple of scum on my wagon that it's not TGP.

Let's talk about interactions between common people on these wagons.

NEE about Flavor: Opening post is a vote for FL, says that FL vote is town. Directly talks to FL once. Gets asked a question directly by FL and responds with a scum game. Once more recently but just about how the game isn't chaotic.
Flavor about NEE: Quite a few. Asks NEE about his reads. There's a short back and forth previously mentioned here.

These two don't seem to be likely to be both scum, though I admit Flavor seems like the type of person who is good at interacting with his scummates.

NEE about BBMolla: basically agrees with BBM saying he's content with the Ram vote. Claims he'd support a BBM wagon if not for the wagon on me... then joins the TGP vote (justified later by then saying that TGP is the scummy one and bbmolla is "slightly scummy")
BBM about NEE: Votes for NEE in a jokingly way then goes back to the Pine project he assigned himself. No further interactions.

If one of these two are scum I could definitely see the other being scum. NEE could be halfheartedly distancing from BBM. That said, BBM doesn't have many interactions with anyone so have to adjust on that basis.

NEE about Nancy: His iso is FULL of interaction with Nancy.
Nancy about NEE: Likewise here.

Are NEE and Nancy otherwise good friends? Because assuming not, it seems unlikely to me that these two are together.

---

BBM about Flavor: Gets asked a direct question by FL and answers it quickly. Says he's "unconcerned with sorting FL today."
Flavor about BBM: Spends some time calling BBM "obviously town." Other than the direct question to BBM has no interaction with him until BBM says that he's unconcerned with FL.

Definitely a possible pairing, though again part of this is BBM has fewer interactions overall so it seems less determinative.

BBM about Nancy: recently called Nancy town. Otherwise nothing.
Nancy about BBM: Agrees with the Pine vote by BBM. Calls into question BBM's Pine vote later. Answers a question about Ramcius.

Nancy's posts to BBM seem pretty organic at least.

---

Nancy about Flavor: Similar to NEE, Nancy has oodles of interactions.
Flavor about Nancy: Similar.

Again, I think Nancy and Flavor are probably two people who would interact a lot with their scum partners, but I have no reason to believe that they're both scum aligned.

Eliminating Flavor and him turning scum would point me toward BBM but probably not NorwegianboyEE. My town read of Nancy aside, I feel like the two of them are probably well suited to playing off each other as scum.

Eliminating BBM doesn't really do much for this type of analysis, unfortunately as he could be a potential partner to basically anyone on that list.


NEE and Nancy aren't really two people I'm excited to see go today outside of this.

This is the town!Zor post that one of the two scums, convinced me to vote for.

ok let me actually clear this up.

there is an apparent misunderstanding. val is not talking about what you did, but more of say HOW you did it and the events leading towards it. from my perspective, it may have been coherent that i knew what you were talking about but from someone's else's perspective, it looks like you were maybe trying to hide info on purpose etc. val probably just needs to see it from me v nancy interaction and you need to see that val is only seeing it that way and not you communicating to the whole town. then you later addressed it to val which made them confused -- if that makes sense.

[GrandpaMo]

I've skimmed up to here but need to go back and do a more thorough read when it isn't the middle of my work day.

Immediate impressions:

val89 and Nancy's spat = classic TvT tunneling imo.

Clark and Roden townie mc townerson game solving attempts

T3 null until I do a careful read through...the only post of theirs that stood out on skim was noticing Grandpa talking about knowing alignment and I need to see if that's because the rest of their posts are scummy fluff or just unmemorable.

Psyche null. On one hand could be experienced player poking beehives to get the game rolling, on the other could be scum trying to stir chaos.

I want Blurry to come back and talk more, because that post seems disingenuous and I don't like it, but one post is...one post.

Don't like Grandpa.


Okies. Be back later.

eh you coming in and immediately finding scum on blurry then having the wildcards such as t3 and psyche as null because you dont know how they play then just saying you dont like me for no reason. im expecting a reason for all these reads, (i hope u werent caught up by that time)

[GrandpaMo]

I've skimmed up to here but need to go back and do a more thorough read when it isn't the middle of my work day.

Immediate impressions:

val89 and Nancy's spat = classic TvT tunneling imo.

Clark and Roden townie mc townerson game solving attempts

T3 null until I do a careful read through...the only post of theirs that stood out on skim was noticing Grandpa talking about knowing alignment and I need to see if that's because the rest of their posts are scummy fluff or just unmemorable.

Psyche null. On one hand could be experienced player poking beehives to get the game rolling, on the other could be scum trying to stir chaos.

I want Blurry to come back and talk more, because that post seems disingenuous and I don't like it, but one post is...one post.

Don't like Grandpa.


Okies. Be back later.

eh you coming in and immediately finding scum on blurry

especially when everyone literally had them as scum

then having the wildcards such as t3 and psyche as null because you dont know how they play then just saying you dont like me for no reason.

just feels like scum finding there way into the game

im expecting a reason for all these reads, (i hope u werent caught up by that time)

forgot to add the boldde

[GrandpaMo]

T3 is town for the above. You can eliminate them from the equation.

dont underesestimate this....


i townread t3 for the exact same reason in newbie 2069 or 68 (w.e the one that ended) lofi one and boom they were scum

[GrandpaMo]

Hi.

hi james am i playing better than our last game uwu

[GrandpaMo]

i townread t3 for the exact same reason in newbie 2069 or 68 (w.e the one that ended) lofi one and boom they were scum

You are making a rather large assumption that you know my reasons for townreading T3 for that post, and that they are the same as whatever reasons you had.

Out of interest, why do you think I'm townreading T3 for it?

yea cuz i felt like u had the same like vibe the same way i townread scum!t3 in that game.

so what happened was that t3 townread me after me just saying shit -- and i felt like i was comfortable, so basically it was my only scape goat.

basically got pocketed and i feel like since he townreads u and clark and just states it blanatly, u have the nerve to townread them as well because scum wouldnt say that from ur persecptive?

am i like at least half right?

[GrandpaMo]

Nod to my last game but before GrandpaMo scum reads me for being inactive. @Mo as of sending this I am going to sleep.

wdym, r u talking bout our last game? or rn

[GrandpaMo]

I was sick today, mild head cold and I'm rebounding. Being sick in the summer is the worst.

Quick question to newcomers (and welcome!) how do you feel about the dissolution of the Grandpa wagon and the quick reforming of the James/Blurry slot?

this makes me town like 87% most likely town from ur perspective especially when someone who never voted on me during the wagon

[GrandpaMo]

gotta say i'm often rather confused by the things you guys find confusing
like, didn't we cover this?

can u give me us ur reads?

i feel like u havent contributed nothing imo

[GrandpaMo]

gotta say i'm often rather confused by the things you guys find confusing
like, didn't we cover this?

can u give me us ur reads?

i feel like u havent contributed nothing imo

can u answeer mi question mi amigo

[GrandpaMo]

Part of me dislikes the fact I've come to town read/lean both T3 and GrandpaMo...

i dont scumread u .

i think ur spot is like half town. and that there is way more scummy ppl than u

im just waiting on a question be answered because psyche has like done nothing in this game and is getting away wit it

[GrandpaMo]

i also thought lunarrest was a little weary as well.

they havent contributed nothing as well. possible gamesolve?

[GrandpaMo]

I am lunarrest now, and I have contributed, you just kneejerk reacted to my read.

oh i forgot bout u honestly

uh let me reread ur iso real quick

also that means u probably had stuff that wasnt memorable lets see

[GrandpaMo]

I've skimmed up to here but need to go back and do a more thorough read when it isn't the middle of my work day.

Immediate impressions:

val89 and Nancy's spat = classic TvT tunneling imo.

Clark and Roden townie mc townerson game solving attempts

T3 null until I do a careful read through...the only post of theirs that stood out on skim was noticing Grandpa talking about knowing alignment and I need to see if that's because the rest of their posts are scummy fluff or just unmemorable.

Psyche null. On one hand could be experienced player poking beehives to get the game rolling, on the other could be scum trying to stir chaos.

I want Blurry to come back and talk more, because that post seems disingenuous and I don't like it, but one post is...one post.

Don't like Grandpa.


Okies. Be back later.

eh you coming in and immediately finding scum on blurry then having the wildcards such as t3 and psyche as null because you dont know how they play then just saying you dont like me for no reason. im expecting a reason for all these reads, (i hope u werent caught up by that time)

Sometimes not giving a reason gets better results than giving one.

The answer to your parenthetical is in my post.

LMAO THIS ???


OMG UR THAT PERSON.

pls

[GrandpaMo]

yup u havent contributed nothing. you also said u were gonna read the game more thoroughly have u done that ?

im giving u the benefit of the doubt here.

if u are town, can u tell me what u have learned since then?

[GrandpaMo]

yup u havent contributed nothing. you also said u were gonna read the game more thoroughly have u done that ?

im giving u the benefit of the doubt here.

if u are town, can u tell me what u have learned since then?

Wait are we in agreeance 314 is not town sided?

yes, i wanted to respond to it later on. but u see ignored it just in case chuck was going to post on a later date there more "thorough reads" or whatever the case that chuck has explicitly said in there earlier posts. ig that blantant reads other than explaining them usually come from replacements, thats what i have observed. 2nd part is true, that did answer my question. but that whole narrative felt unmotivated -- meaning like they post this and never make up a follow up later on. chuck did explain some of there reads, and instantly in 314 imply they didnt, which contradict there whole narrative originally.

seems weird to me tbh

[GrandpaMo]

I initially scum read you because you're reactive and there was plenty of reason to post intent to hammer on your wagon, but no one did, which I was strongly believing was your team mate either roosting on your slot for town cred, or pushing people to doubt so they'd stop voting for you.

I scumread blurry because their one real post felt like posturing -saying one thing, such as "this is town" then subtly undermining that assessment in the following sentences—up to and including null-reading my slot but still strongly casting doubt on motive. However, it was just one slot, I have no insight into how they play or if they've played before, and that could as easily be insecurity as it could be scum.

So...I didn't give a reason for my scum read on you in my list because I wanted to see how you and blurry would react. You snapped back at me, which I expected, but blurry-slot immediately jumped down my throat about that specific action being scummy, which I did not expect from a scum mate since it's obvious buddying. So either you're both idiots (which commentary from people who have played with you does not seem to support), or one or both of you are town.

Or, you know, I'm wrong, because Mafia is a bitch. But that's where I'm at.

i never snapped back at u. this post is manipulative, i just gave you my initail thought process on how that post made. u even later responded in 314 that giving no reasons was better than not explaining. then u decide to explain after being exposed and call it "reaction" posts. lol

[GrandpaMo]

So...I didn't give a reason for my scum read on you in my list because I wanted to see how you and blurry would react.

this reminds me of me playing scum. just give the old classic reactive post shit and hope town goes wit it.

i dont buy it.

[GrandpaMo]

also, something to take note, is that you only have explained those reads, your scumreads. who said not to explain ur townreads? your narrative starts to fall from here...

[GrandpaMo]

Dude, you did snap back at me. You may not think you did, but you did. How you intended a thing and how a thing actually came across can and usually are two different things.

Not giving a reason DID give me information- it told me that either you or James or both are town. You can try to twist that into a scum read if you want, but it's not going to help town.

i null read u rn atm. im just jsut tryna get accross in both worlds where u could be scum in another world where u are town.

[GrandpaMo]

Roden is actively game solving. Clark is actively game solving.

alright give me examples then

[GrandpaMo]

Dude, you did snap back at me. You may not think you did, but you did. How you intended a thing and how a thing actually came across can and usually are two different things.

Not giving a reason DID give me information- it told me that either you or James or both are town. You can try to twist that into a scum read if you want, but it's not going to help town.

i null read u rn atm. im just jsut tryna get accross in both worlds where u could be scum in another world where u are town.

also i believe i just tried to solve ur allignment from the beginning which correlated into u not giving explanations. heck u even admitted so rn

[GrandpaMo]

I can tell you with some degree of certainty that Psyche is town.

WHY T3

problem is u do this as both town and scum lol so its hard to see it

can u explain t3 pls

just for me k?

[GrandpaMo]

I've been leaning town on Nancy, but Val's convinced me that there really is stuff not to like about her in her ISO. By her own account, I should be taking her votes more seriously than I might someone else's in the game because she purportedly will never make them unless she's confident they'll land on scum. But when I look at her one vote this whole game (for Val!) I just see boring resentment, not any sorting, and definitely nothing afterward to either sharpen or otherwise help propel the town based on the read. She explicitly disavows any read-based motivation a single post later. For these reasons her ISO is super frustrating and hard to distinguish from active lurking. I mean we're now 17 pages, 419 posts, into the game and she has nothing but a bunch of specious null and town reads? It's tough to swallow.

At the same time though, there's little here to positively mark her as scum

if

her meta is consistent with this decision to never meaningfully weigh into the game - which I've only been assuming is the case but I'd bet it is. Val tries to make more of it by marking out apparent contradictions between posts like 183, 202, and 212, but tbh that's small fry shit. Any apparent tension between those posts is resolved by acknowledging that she didn't vote Val because she scumread the slot; she voted it because she was mad at him, and has been ambivalent about admitting as much. Unless there's some reason to interpret that anger as disingenous, that's NAI to me - though antitown in context.

also bold red! that sure helps single out stuff! gotta touch that sparingly though

i like this better than the response u did in the area tags -- i just felt like u had nothing to say in that.

also i dont see a scumcase on blurry from u , can u give me that at least?

[GrandpaMo]

ok wait

[GrandpaMo]

everyone pivoted to james?

who was first pivoted by nancy?

where half of the lobby was scumreading nancy?

[GrandpaMo]

also i dont see a scumcase on blurry from u , can u give me that at least?

After he's been hammered? You are going to get a shock once you catch up, Grandpa...

oh what

[GrandpaMo]

wait im confused, val can u give me like what happened in the past 2 pages

[GrandpaMo]

wait im confused, val can u give me like what happened in the past 2 pages

Yea so Psyche fake claimed Jailkeeper, and the apparent Tracker just hammered me despite Tracker/Doctor being a thing.

so if u flip town, psyche is high scum right?

i mean i townread u because of what i said earlier regarding nancy

[GrandpaMo]

you just made the Doctor get hammered

You ain't the doctor. I know 100% you are flipping Mafia Rolecop here. Just...give it a rest. You failed the second you chose Doc for your fake claim.

val wait.

u literally said psyche was scum and quickly pivoted to james being scum -- what happened there

[GrandpaMo]

well since ur getting limmed rn, and pr will be limmed tonight ...

that outs one of them as scum only if u flip town doc

if u flip scum, they still kill one of the power roles

[GrandpaMo]

i'm a fakeclaimer what can i say
my father was a fakeclaimer and his father before him

so ur scum fake claiming?

[GrandpaMo]

yall cannot behave while grandpa is gone smh do better

[GrandpaMo]

ok i hope this clears everything up -- im the real doctor.

and james is scum. i was tryna buddy up wit james so i can see who their partner is.

i crumbed in post 91, 49, in post 250, i wanted to use that "vc" pagetop to refer not to votecount but to the vena cava which is a popular vein found in the heart -- so yes im a doc

[GrandpaMo]

kek

[GrandpaMo]

ok everyone log off pls we going to sleep good bye

[GrandpaMo]

vena cava

[GrandpaMo]

ok i hope this clears everything up -- im the real doctor.

and james is scum. i was tryna buddy up wit james so i can see who their partner is.

i crumbed in post 91, 49, in post 250, i wanted to use that "vc" pagetop to refer not to votecount but to the vena cava which is a popular vein found in the heart -- so yes im a doc

Why would you cc after the hamer.

oh fuck -- i just realized i can claim tmr....

[GrandpaMo]

yeah could someone drop a hammer in here
it looks like val was already voting james in his last thing

its already hammer

[GrandpaMo]

if not hammer ,then psyche ur scum lol

[GrandpaMo]

Why would you cc after the hamer.

Grandpa is either very smart, or very dumb. We can deduce which and act accordingly tomorrow.

We have lots to talk about TOMORROW, T3. I for one am looking forward to it. Where's the mod when you need them?

same

but i think im the dumb part (

i always end up throwing for town...

damn, i think i rlly should have waited tmr , but that means james is confirmed scum then if that cleared up any confusions. thats why i was confused. i had townread james prior then when i saw them claiming doc im like yea they are 100 percent scum, then t3 claimed tracker? and then psyche fake claimed a pr.

so the two prs would be me and t3, then psyche could still be scum bussing james for more towncred. other scum is possible blurry.

[GrandpaMo]

VOTE: James

just in case.

[GrandpaMo]

Subject: Doubles Mafia Day 2/ Day 2

Can I vote now or what

Why the fuck did ya'll lynch before us

We can wagon but probably want to avoid hammer range. Who did you have in mind?
WANH and TH need to give final reads. I think they are likely to die by virtue of being large hydra. I think TH is more townie and dangerous now that I’ve got my head out of my butt to see it so I would appreciate it if they could give final reads in light of Titus flip.

Halloween:
Kill TH and Cakez.
Then contemplate if RC's slot was scum or not.

Christmas:
Ask NSG to solve.

-bitmap

Is there even one of your heads that is decent at Mafia? Serious question. If scum kills this slot, they 100% deserve to lose because they’re absolute fucking morons if they do.

Alright @Val, this didn’t involve a vote but I was pretty damn toxic in that game, so it’s really kind’ve embarrassing to reread those posts.

are u voting psyche rn?

[GrandpaMo]

I need to discuss things with T3 tomorrow. Real doctor needs to make sure there is an oppotunity that happens. Capisci?

um yea im dying tonight either way so ig that would happen. also still dont know what u talking bout

just log off

[GrandpaMo]

im pissed

[GrandpaMo]

hm... i wont say much until this one person posts.

[GrandpaMo]

ok nvm, scum should be aware. im not doc lol .

val i need ur input asap.

[GrandpaMo]

There's a 2/3 chance scum know my tracker claim is fake. I retract it.

ok i dont think t3 fakeclaims as scum here .. unless t3 is big braining and greatlly improved their scumplay from last time we played and they were scum.

[GrandpaMo]

val i need ur input asap.

Is there something specific that you want me to comment on?

I currently still think you are town, despite the fake claim. I suspect I know why you fake claimed, and if so, you know why I am asking you this question in the manner I am. I am doing a dive on something right now; unless there is something specific you want answering, I will get back to you once I have conclusions to share.

ok so at first i wanted to fake claim for the exact same reason t3 did but then you told me to shutup and stuff and i rlly thought u were tryna soft a doc claim here.

so i would die at night -- then you would claim doc the next day just in case

[GrandpaMo]

What input are you after from me, Grandpa?

Are you just fishing for PRs here, after what Roden just said in 636?

i explained i wanted ur input from previously of what happened.

\im solving the game.

the only possible setup is fn + jailkeeper + rolecop or just jailkeeper + 2 mafia goons

[GrandpaMo]

What input are you after from me, Grandpa?

Are you just fishing for PRs here, after what Roden just said in 636?

i hadnt even read what roden said until now

why would i be fishing for prs as scum?

when scum should pre handlely by mechanics know the setup, no?

[GrandpaMo]

For not voting D1, not weighing in on James at all (he only ever mentions Blurry), and not pursuing his SR of me.

how willing do u want an elim on chuck today and if they flip town, we condemn u

[GrandpaMo]

how willing do u want an elim on chuck today and if they flip town, we condemn u

F*ck me, Grandpa, you've come out of the blocks on D2 with a bunch of posts that make it very difficult to maintain my townread on you. What makes you so certain the last scum is 100% in ClarkBar and Chuck that you would suggest this?

What are you playing at, here, exactly?

ok good u knew my narrative was that scum was in chuck v clark..


look at the post right after -- just seems like an omgus. whats wrong with suggesting the last possible scum is in clark and chuck?

i townread every bit one else and lunar was someone who i scumread prior the replacement lol w

[GrandpaMo]

For not voting D1, not weighing in on James at all (he only ever mentions Blurry), and not pursuing his SR of me.

how willing do u want an elim on chuck today and if they flip town, we condemn u

Now I understand the page 2 wagon on you.

ok let me reiterate what i was tryna say here -- i was trying to push the narrative that there is scum in clark and chuck.

i was reaction posting to see what clark would say and how willing they would say yes or no. i believe town won't be that hesitant and wont find a way to fluff around the my question. if they were scum. clark would take this oppourtunity to pin point me as scum or someone else because they know the answer to that question is not that willing because they know they will flip town.

[GrandpaMo]

You know, "push the narrative" is such an unfortunate choice of phrase. Coming from you, Grandpa, it may well be NAI, but you don't half make this difficult for us.

You do realise that, if it's a theorectical scum!Grandpa, then getting a mislim today, outting and killing the possible remaining town PR tonight, then chaining that into a second mislim tomorrow is about the only chance that scum!Grandpa has to turn this game around, and that's exactly what you've come out straight away and appear to have done within a few posts of day start?

I know I initially TR'd you in our last game together D1, then mis-read you as scum when you started acting scummy after the D1 flip and into D2, so you have form for this sort of behavior and I'm being a little cautious drawing conclusions from it; but please don't think that because I've been burnt once that means I'll just consider it your meta and that grants you a license to act as scummy as you like today.

If you start acting in a way that is obviously anti-town, such as fishing for PR claims when that isn't going to help town now, or potentially setting up to chain lims onwhat appears to be flimsy justification, I'm going to call it out.

What did you your "reaction post" tell you about Clark? They don't appear to have taken the oppotunity to pinpoint you or someone else as scum, nor jumped at the chance to trade themselves for Chuck, so what is that telling you?

okay im sorta lost here.

you point out that i am acting in "anti town behavior" i felt as tho i haven't done anything that goes against town? can you please elaborate with examples here? also i explained the reaction post thing in post 650 if it's not clear enough.

again, how is having an opinion that there is scum between clark and chuck anti town? that is my narrative that i AM pushing, because i do think.

unless something happened that i missed out on.

that's why im confused, im just stating a geninue read that i have that appears with one omgussing each other.

also -- again, i justified the pr hunting thing, there is no reason for scum to PR hunt.

there is a difference between figuring out the setup and PR hunting. What I did was more of setup and mechsolving by figuring out the game details and fitting the pieces together. PR hunting / fishing is asking people or pushing narratives on people that would make them eventually out or soft or even accidently slip at times.

[GrandpaMo]

They don't appear to have taken the oppotunity to pinpoint you or someone else as scum, nor jumped at the chance to trade themselves for Chuck, so what is that telling you?

because they haven't answered this yet?

lol.

[GrandpaMo]

also it isn't a reaction post anymore since it has been spoiled-- and the point is lost, therefore making it an NAI statement from now and on. but clark had never responded to what i said.

[GrandpaMo]

You know, "push the narrative" is such an unfortunate choice of phrase. Coming from you, Grandpa, it may well be NAI, but you don't half make this difficult for us.

You do realise that, if it's a theorectical scum!Grandpa, then getting a mislim today, outting and killing the possible remaining town PR tonight, then chaining that into a second mislim tomorrow is about the only chance that scum!Grandpa has to turn this game around, and that's exactly what you've come out straight away and appear to have done within a few posts of day start?

I know I initially TR'd you in our last game together D1, then mis-read you as scum when you started acting scummy after the D1 flip and into D2, so you have form for this sort of behavior and I'm being a little cautious drawing conclusions from it; but please don't think that because I've been burnt once that means I'll just consider it your meta and that grants you a license to act as scummy as you like today.

If you start acting in a way that is obviously anti-town, such as fishing for PR claims when that isn't going to help town now, or potentially setting up to chain lims onwhat appears to be flimsy justification, I'm going to call it out.

What did you your "reaction post" tell you about Clark? They don't appear to have taken the oppotunity to pinpoint you or someone else as scum, nor jumped at the chance to trade themselves for Chuck, so what is that telling you?

I just did an ISO on Blurry, James, and Clark.

131 - Blurry does a wishy-washy read on Clark that gives them plenty of space to slide into whatever read of Clark is convenient later.

James town reads Clark, but only indirectly (333 and 363). He otherwise doesn't offer reads on Clark, and barely mentions him. He does (again) indirectly town-align Clark in his comment to me in 403.

Clark barely mentions Blurry- he "liked" Psyche's read on them (180) but offered no further commentary, and then quoted Blurry's comment on him (131). He doesn't follow up at all, except to ask this:

342

Quick question to newcomers (and welcome!) how do you feel about the dissolution of the Grandpa wagon and the quick reforming of the James/Blurry slot?

Which he also doesn't follow up on. In fact the next time he mentions James at all is D2 when he's casting doubt on me for reasons that are negated by the fact that I stated clearly that I had to "stop for now" and that I hadn't finished my reads, and the events he's referring to happened while I was gone.


In summary: Blurry's post is meh, but James was throwing suspicion around like candy while he was here, and Clark has been active enough that it's notable he didn't catch any from James. Clark was asking questions and poking around, but didn't respond to anything James said, when he absolutely should have if his questions were genuine.


Basically...vote Clark and get the job done.

my point as follows. do you really think tvt behavior continues to stem to day 2?

[GrandpaMo]

Official Vote Count 1.11

DeHavilland Twin Otter

---

Elimination

JamesTheNames

(5): Roden, T3, Nancy Drew 39, Psyche, Val89

<==HAMMER

Nancy Drew 39

(2): JamesTheNames

Psyche

(1): ClarkBar

Not Voting

(2): GrandpaMo, Chuck Shurley

Deadline:

(expired on 2021-07-06 10:00:49).

Mod notes:

An Elimination has been achieved.

I don’t think scum bussed, so I think James’ partner is likely offwagon and I think Blurry spewed Mo town, so it’s probably between Chuck and Clark.

I’m seriously overgamed af, so I will try do some more reteading later.

honestly thats how i feel rn lmao im like modding and there has been like 4 games i have been in -- im just ready to get this game done with.

[GrandpaMo]

Claiming my vote is OMGUS is utterly absurd, Clark.

actually i did

[GrandpaMo]

Looks to me like they answered it in 645 - 'No; I'm not 100% it's Chuck, and therefore as of this moment I'm not offering myself up in a 1v1, but I think they are most the most likley candidate.' Seems like a resonable position to take.

oh didnt even see that lol

hol up

[GrandpaMo]

Grandpa, Clark did too.

thanks for the credit xx

[GrandpaMo]

For not voting D1, not weighing in on James at all (he only ever mentions Blurry), and not pursuing his SR of me.

how willing do u want an elim on chuck today and if they flip town, we condemn u

If I were 100% on Chuck being scum I'd take you up on that. As it is I feel that slot is the best place for my vote for the reasons provided. We can debate that reasoning, and as that debate goes on how sure I am about whether or not Chuck is scum will go up or down.

For not voting D1, not weighing in on James at all (he only ever mentions Blurry), and not pursuing his SR of me.

how willing do u want an elim on chuck today and if they flip town, we condemn u

Now I understand the page 2 wagon on you.

ok let me reiterate what i was tryna say here -- i was trying to push the narrative that there is scum in clark and chuck.

i was reaction posting to see what clark would say and how willing they would say yes or no. i believe town won't be that hesitant and wont find a way to fluff around the my question. if they were scum. clark would take this oppourtunity to pin point me as scum or someone else because they know the answer to that question is not that willing because they know they will flip town.

look how my logic alligns wit clark's response.

you tell me thru the options i proposed , what this seems like

[GrandpaMo]

Can TvT tunneling cross day phases? Yes. As one specific example: Town lost in a game I played in quite a while back because two obstinate townies with a scummy play style tunneled on each other all the way to lilo.

If that's not what you're asking, then I'm not sure what you're talking about.

ok so now tell me. come from the perspective that clark is town, what would make you figure out that clark is town?

for example, is there a case u can come up wit for clark!town? so you don't misjudge this as another tvt tunneling.

[GrandpaMo]

Grandpa: It sounds like you're assuming Clark would go after you if he were actually scum, but I'm not grasping why you're making that assumption.

If you're asking if I believe there's scum between me and Clark...obviously?

In short: I am confused. Please clarify.

im not talking about anything regarding me.

it isnt a hard question i believe.

u said there has been cases of tvt tunneling before and it occured to you before.

now relaspe those time and events and compare it to this. whats different than what u expierenced before. are you able to come into a mindset where you are able to see clark!town doing this?

are you able to build a case for town!clark if you wanted to.

if not, why not.

[GrandpaMo]

val i need ur input asap.

Is there something specific that you want me to comment on?

I currently still think you are town, despite the fake claim. I suspect I know why you fake claimed, and if so, you know why I am asking you this question in the manner I am. I am doing a dive on something right now; unless there is something specific you want answering, I will get back to you once I have conclusions to share.

ok so at first i wanted to fake claim for the exact same reason t3 did but then you told me to shutup and stuff and i rlly thought u were tryna soft a doc claim here.

so i would die at night -- then you would claim doc the next day just in case

I'm not sure I follow the logic here. Why would Val claim Doctor on Day 2 in this scenario?

Could you answer this too Grandpa?

i already answered this in a earlier post-- i dropped it during the night, i realized i was stupid and forgot that mafia had known the setup, so it just served as a bait to reveal setup info.

[GrandpaMo]

val i need ur input asap.

Is there something specific that you want me to comment on?

I currently still think you are town, despite the fake claim. I suspect I know why you fake claimed, and if so, you know why I am asking you this question in the manner I am. I am doing a dive on something right now; unless there is something specific you want answering, I will get back to you once I have conclusions to share.

ok so at first i wanted to fake claim for the exact same reason t3 did but then you told me to shutup and stuff and i rlly thought u were tryna soft a doc claim here.

so i would die at night -- then you would claim doc the next day just in case

I'm not sure I follow the logic here. Why would Val claim Doctor on Day 2 in this scenario?

Could you answer this too Grandpa?

i already answered this in a earlier post-- i dropped it during the night, i realized i was stupid and forgot that mafia had known the setup, so it just served as a bait to reveal setup info.

unless somehow psyche wasnt jailkeep, and they decide to kill me for whatever reason, and i flip vt -- there would be a theory that val could still have claimed doc if we were in that setup

[GrandpaMo]

I'm just not sure why Val would claim Doc though? Psyche already counter claimed James at that point, so why would Val claim a protective role without any pressure or reason to do so? Even in an alternate universe where Val is the real Doc, why claim?

because wouldn't val just die during the night? if im claiming already and if im getting a intuitive thought that val is telling me to shutup because they were the doc, then im obviously going to keep my claim so i can sacrifice just for the sake of doc being alive. instead of pysche dying, val would have died if they claimed.

i also claimed to bait like i said then follow up wit val's actions but now it was to bait.

wait.

there is a possibility that the setup could still be tracker + jailkeep no?

it's just mafia hit jailkeep today nd mafia can hit tracker tonight

we know there isnt a doc, because mafia would have just killed me at night before killing psyche.

[GrandpaMo]

Well, if scum bussed, it can only be Val because a bus wouldn’t make sense early wagon but Val was hardpushing me, so I guess that’s possible.

val is just having end game paranoia again lol

[GrandpaMo]

To keep setup ambiguous from scum for at least one night longer, someone should go ahead and hammer.

Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.

Unless James is fake claiming, scum are the only one with the exception of the other PR who KNOW the setup, since doctor only appears once in each of column A and B. If they have a rolecop or roleblocker solves the setup completely for them.

No way Psyche didn't know that. Get this obvscum outta here, we can sort Nancy for sure tomorrow.

VOTE: Pysche

I'm rereading what happened at the end of Day 1 and this still sticks out as odd to me. Val, can you tell us your thought process here? You voted James shortly afterward when it looked like you picked up on Psyche's counter claim, but this vote and reasoning feels off.

Well, if scum bussed, it can only be Val because a bus wouldn’t make sense early wagon but Val was hardpushing me, so I guess that’s possible.

So, it has to be between those 3. I think you, T3 and Mo are all town.

gosh u radiate so much town energy rn

[GrandpaMo]

For not voting D1, not weighing in on James at all (he only ever mentions Blurry), and not pursuing his SR of me.

how willing do u want an elim on chuck today and if they flip town, we condemn u

Now I understand the page 2 wagon on you.

This made me laugh way more than it should have.
VOTE: Chuck

this has been a funny game

i did laugh too lmao

[GrandpaMo]

Yeah, we could have a Tracker (or a Friendly Neighbor), but I wouldn't pry anymore into that. Even if no one slips they're the 2nd PR, if enough people slip that they aren't, scum can use PoE to find the last one. It's best not to bring it up unless necessary.

I think I understand your thought process better now though. It's a little chaotic, but I get it.

i agree. lets nothave this pr discussion anymore.

i still do believe there is scum in chuck and clark

and i still dont know why val was so paranoiac bout me having those scumreads lol

then nancy comes in and agrees wit me

i just only disagree that val should be in the votepool. i think u roden is more iffy then val.

but i just think yall r both town if that were the case

[GrandpaMo]

he was hopping around wagons a bit but he stuck to the one that flipped red.

there is a better reason to townread t3 here lol

[GrandpaMo]

also where did this chuck v clark come from .. it seemed so random... another reason to just stay weary on those two (scum might have thought one was an achievable mislim)

[GrandpaMo]

At first glance (I read 13-ish pages in about 5 minutes) I did read him as town because it seemed like he was game solving. I read deeper, realized I didn't like the direction his posts were coming from, and changed my read. If he does something to change that, you'll all hear about it, but right now I'm not sure what the point of asking me to town read my scum vote is.

this is a bad reaction. because i wanted you to think of a world where clark is town. if clark is town and you were wrong and let say (hypothetical) we lim clark and they flip town, don;t you think we will lim you?

when you proposed earlier that there has been cases of you tvt in your own experience thru later day phases, why are you not able to see it this way this game? do you know for sure clark will flip scum? why is clark scummier than roden or val? or even me?

[GrandpaMo]

At first glance (I read 13-ish pages in about 5 minutes) I did read him as town because it seemed like he was game solving. I read deeper, realized I didn't like the direction his posts were coming from, and changed my read. If he does something to change that, you'll all hear about it, but right now I'm not sure what the point of asking me to town read my scum vote is.

this is a bad reaction. because i wanted you to think of a world where clark is town. if clark is town and you were wrong and let say (hypothetical) we lim clark and they flip town, don;t you think we will lim you?

when you proposed earlier that there has been cases of you tvt in your own experience thru later day phases, why are you not able to see it this way this game? do you know for sure clark will flip scum? why is clark scummier than roden or val? or even me?

im just trying to understand where this scumread came from and why out of all of a suden especially when clark voted you and it seemed you got offended and decided to scumread them. is it confbias?

[GrandpaMo]

Yeah, we could have a Tracker (or a Friendly Neighbor), but I wouldn't pry anymore into that. Even if no one slips they're the 2nd PR, if enough people slip that they aren't, scum can use PoE to find the last one. It's best not to bring it up unless necessary.

I think I understand your thought process better now though. It's a little chaotic, but I get it.

i agree. lets nothave this pr discussion anymore.

i still do believe there is scum in chuck and clark

and i still dont know why val was so paranoiac bout me having those scumreads lol

then nancy comes in and agrees wit me

i just only disagree that val should be in the votepool. i think u roden is more iffy then val.

but i just think yall r both town if that were the case

Val tried to kill me and Roden made it clear he wanted James limmed > me and James was fighting hard to survive. He was clearly not giving up.

Like it’s possible scum is just in Chuck/Clark anyway but Val did try to get me killed and Roden was commited to killing James > me. And Val was last on James wagon and I think Roden was first. I very much doubt that scum hardbussed when James was fighting so hard to survive and kill me. That makes Val far more sus than Roden imo.

ok i see what ur saying -- roden could have easily just jumped the wagon against u .

i mean yea there is a probability but you should also take account was it optimal for roden to pivot, was it to late?

[GrandpaMo]

To keep setup ambiguous from scum for at least one night longer, someone should go ahead and hammer.

Bullshit. Absolute bullshit.

Unless James is fake claiming, scum are the only one with the exception of the other PR who KNOW the setup, since doctor only appears once in each of column A and B. If they have a rolecop or roleblocker solves the setup completely for them.

No way Psyche didn't know that. Get this obvscum outta here, we can sort Nancy for sure tomorrow.

VOTE: Pysche

I'm rereading what happened at the end of Day 1 and this still sticks out as odd to me. Val, can you tell us your thought process here? You voted James shortly afterward when it looked like you picked up on Psyche's counter claim, but this vote and reasoning feels off.

Well, if scum bussed, it can only be Val because a bus wouldn’t make sense early wagon but Val was hardpushing me, so I guess that’s possible.

So, it has to be between those 3. I think you, T3 and Mo are all town.

gosh u radiate so much town energy rn

I have an extremely difficult time doing that when I getting run up, especially when certain people were completely ignoring my ISO and cherry picking and twisting things to make me look bad, so I just felt extremely defeated and almost no WIM. :/

lol i totally understand -- especially me someone who is known for not making sense at times (still working on it), i tend to really relapse judgment and hopefully i try to make ppl understand but its hard when the same person decides to make me look bad, and even worse its tvt

[GrandpaMo]

I'm sorry I haven't been able to be more active; I have a specific window when I can play Mafia, and unfortunately it's proven to be not enough. Anyway, since I am at E-1, I'm VT so my role isn't going to save me, and I can't check back in until either late tonight or tomorrow morning real time:

Reads-

Unless Nancy is *incredibly* good at scum theater, she's town.
My eyes tend to glaze over Grandpa's posts, but he seems town driven, if a little confused in how he goes about it.
Y'all seem to be reading T3 and Roden as basically lock town for reasons I am not grasping, but since I was town reading them for my own reasons, I'll keep it where it's at.
I still think Clark is scum, but Val is rapidly moving up the list.

Y'all are falling for an easy mislim and it's driving me batty, but I just plain don't have time to shove the tide back so...better me than a PR, and you can get un-stuck in D3.

were u scum lol u just got hammered

[GrandpaMo]

T3 fake hammered again lol.

NOOO

U WERENT SUPPOSE TO DO THAT

i wanted chuck to concede as scum if teh ywere lol

[GrandpaMo]

Anyway, since I am at E-1

He knows he ain't hammered Grandpa. I don't even thinl even T3 expects that sort of thing to work anymore, merely it's something they do so often it would be commented on in it's absence, you know?

In any case, If you are town Chuck, I don't think you need to worry about about being mislimmed here, "easy" or no. Everyone else who has posted today seems to think the pool is Me, you and ClarkBar, and frankly, I think the likleyhood is 90% that it is between you and Clark. My vote is on you, and I think you should flip first, because I think there is a slightly higher chance it is you over Clark, but it's a close call.

The only reason I'm not happy with calling it PoE solved at this point and encourage we all go cards-to-the-table style is that I don't want to piss away our potential PR advantage on the small but non-zero chance we are being led up the garden path by very clever scum play; and you know we have some very able scum players in this list. If you agree with Nancy though, that scum is in Me, Clark, Chuck, she is perfectly correct. There is enough time to lim all 3 of us, and even if the 2 NKs in the meantime fall out of that pool, thats still leaves 2 versus the remaining one from that list on D4 for the town victory.

In other words - if you think scum is in {Me, Clark, Chuck}, you should hammer, because town wins if you stick to that pool, and it appears there is at least 4 who have already decided that is pool; and if you think there is a chance that scum falls outside of that pool, you should hammer if you think a Chuck flip has reasonable equity of seeing the Mod post "gg's", before our continued discussions risk giving away what chance we get of information from our potential PR if we are dealing with a deepwolf.

i was thinking how nancy could be scum here.

[GrandpaMo]

He knows he ain't hammered Grandpa. I don't even thinl even T3 expects that sort of thing to work anymore, merely it's something they do so often it would be commented on in it's absence, you know?

also didnt see this lol woopsies

im dumb

[GrandpaMo]

He knows he ain't hammered Grandpa. I don't even thinl even T3 expects that sort of thing to work anymore, merely it's something they do so often it would be commented on in it's absence, you know?

also didnt see this lol woopsies

im dumb

also i had thought chuck said e-1 because they posted regardless it being hammer

[GrandpaMo]

this nk will also rlly be interesting

[GrandpaMo]

I don't see the point. What were you going to do if they go "nah, you just hammered a VT, idiots!"? Suggest we unvote them and move to someone else? James was playing we had hammered our Doc even after it was clear he WAS hammered, so a refusal to conceed even if you think you are hammered means diddly-squa

i seen it happen before lolol

thats why i was so keen on doing it

[GrandpaMo]

You, T3 or Roden would be the "deepwolfs"

is Val, Grandpa, Roden a fair assessment?

Can we leave T3 out there too?

I think we all agree we all three have more scum equity then T3. I am just waiting on who the NK is tonight to see something which [REDACTED]

I doubt scum!t3 fake claims there.

[GrandpaMo]

Are we ready to end the day? I can hammer if you all want.

[GrandpaMo]

VOTE: chuck

T3 I have a question, do you believe nancy is town?

[GrandpaMo]

Also, roden do you believe nancy is town?

[GrandpaMo]

Grandpa, you are getting very close to incidentialy PR hunting again.

Perhaps you would like to tell me what you think is wrong with my analysis as to why a Clark hammer leads to best chances for a town win here, if you do disagree? And if you do agree, explain why you are continuing to fish rather than drop the hammer?

You fake claimed Doc, so you must have some understanding at least as why we are are uncomfortable with scum having this information on the table.

Just on the off-chance you truely beleive asking "X, do you beleive Y is town?" is helping solve the game, let me be explicit so there is no mistake here - the answer to those questions are more likley to give clues as to who might have got a FN notification from whom, or who might have tracked someone and seen them not visiting at the time of the NK etc, and thus give clues to who might be the PR, or just as bad, who isn't. Please stop it.

I'm really having a hard time justifying to myself why I think you are town while you carry on with this sort of thing.

VOTE: chuck

[GrandpaMo]

NO I THOUGHT T3 WAS TRACKER. WHY DID T3 DIE AT NIGHT.


i think everyone should rr now!

[GrandpaMo]

What do we gain from outing a Tracker before they can catch scum?

how do u know the last pr is tracker?

are you pov slipping?

[GrandpaMo]

also how many fucking times i have to explain. its not power role fishing if im asking ppl on how they read people. there is 5 ppl alive, having tracker out (if we even have a tracker) with a visiting result or even a not visitng result for 2 nights on a person that is alive rn, gives town very reliable info

[GrandpaMo]

NO I THOUGHT T3 WAS TRACKER.

So did scum. Thank you for your sacrifice, T3.

rr?

That explains it.

ngl, i thought u were gonna die. but then i realized scum could take the risk of killing t3.

[GrandpaMo]

It seems clear now that we do have a Tracker, otherwise T3's death makes no sense.

just read the second part, sorry for taking ur post out of context.

but how does that tell that we have tracker?

[GrandpaMo]

It seems clear now that we do have a Tracker, otherwise T3's death makes no sense.

just read the second part, sorry for taking ur post out of context.

but how does that tell that we have tracker?

Why else does scum kill T3 after he just got accused of being a potential deep wolf and Nancy got town locked by basically everyone? Unless scum is just trying to lead us into believing they're PR hunting...that could be a possibility actually. But even then, Nancy would've been a better kill if we're in a 2 Goon or Friendly Neighbor set up.

isnt there like a 200 iq play where scum kills t3 because they want us to think there is tracker in the game? and so when push comes to shove... scum can easily claim tracker without a cc and have a better liability of staying alive?

this is probably unlikely tho.

as town, i like to explore all the avenues of a kill.

i mean they could just kill t3, because they had thought they were tracker from me, psyche's, and t3's weird pseudoclaim bs

i did say scum was in chuck and clark and i was willing to vote the other after one flip is done.

[GrandpaMo]

but wait if there were is a tracker, why didnt they kill t3 instead of psyche that night?

[GrandpaMo]

It seems clear now that we do have a Tracker, otherwise T3's death makes no sense.

just read the second part, sorry for taking ur post out of context.

but how does that tell that we have tracker?

Why else does scum kill T3 after he just got accused of being a potential deep wolf and Nancy got town locked by basically everyone? Unless scum is just trying to lead us into believing they're PR hunting...that could be a possibility actually. But even then, Nancy would've been a better kill if we're in a 2 Goon or Friendly Neighbor set up.

isnt there like a 200 iq play where scum kills t3 because they want us to think there is tracker in the game? and so when push comes to shove... scum can easily claim tracker without a cc and have a better liability of staying alive?

this is probably unlikely tho.

I literally just said this in the post you quoted...

you did where ?

but wait if there were is a tracker, why didnt they kill t3 instead of psyche that night?

We already discussed this back on Day 2. Scum has to kill protective roles before they can kill investigative roles. In addition, Psyche was a guaranteed PR and he counter claimed a protective role, so of course he was going to die. T3 randomly claimed Tracker, which meant he wasn't a guaranteed PR. And Psyche would most likely protect T3 anyway, so targeting T3 makes zero sense for scum to do. Why target a Tracker when a Doctor/Jailer just successfully counter claimed scum?

okay that makes sense, i never thought about scum killing because it was a better kill. i forgot that psyche eventually did claim doc so it was best for scum to kill.

[GrandpaMo]

NO I THOUGHT T3 WAS TRACKER. WHY DID T3 DIE AT NIGHT.


i think everyone should rr now!

Wait, Grandpa you literally just said here that you thought we had a Tracker lol. Why are you acting like it's weird for me to think there's a Tracker?

yea because of the claim, you were saying it in the setup wise i believe

[GrandpaMo]

Erm... I am tracker.

Well congrats, you just made the Doctor get hammered. He isn't a Jailkeeper. Even if it was possible that he was telling the truth, you as a tracker should have known instantly that it could have been either, yet you somehow didn't.

It’s possible scum believed this. I don’t think Mo thinking this is weird.

wait james claimed doc not the other way around?

i keep getting that confused.

t3 claimed tracker.
james claimed doc
psyche claims jk
i cc doc

correct?

[GrandpaMo]

holy fuck why does reading james iso makes u wanna say there is scum between roden nd chuck lol

[GrandpaMo]

I really need to hear fom Grandpa on what's in James' ISO that makes him think {Clark, Roden}.

yea i just came back with work...

expect like a complete analysis on james readlist on why i do expect its clark / roden in a couple of hours


tldr; this is manly based on james interactions with clark nd roden (the post that nancy pointed out of james) i noticed it from that and started quick skimming jame's iso and seeing their reads.

[GrandpaMo]

Nancy and Roden are town, Clark and Grandpa scum. Call me a copy cat if you like.

why do you think roden is town?

[GrandpaMo]

if nancy is scum, they already won. and also im down to vote clark

[GrandpaMo]

also sorry for not giving the analysis. just felt unmotivated to play anymore ; was like this sitewide.

[GrandpaMo]

we stil got 6 days left so

[GrandpaMo]

omg i read chuck as clark this whole time . this changes something ima explain in a few

[GrandpaMo]

i think everyone should rr now!

Do you still think this?

no. i realized there was 1 mafia left and realized that either tmr or today is a good day to rr.

we don't have to nor it's not optimal for town to rr.

we can and still probably have the same outcome, well that's how i think about it.

[GrandpaMo]

I was sick today, mild head cold and I'm rebounding. Being sick in the summer is the worst.

Quick question to newcomers (and welcome!) how do you feel about the dissolution of the Grandpa wagon and the quick reforming of the James/Blurry slot?

Hm.

[GrandpaMo]

Also I am sitting back and looking at a scumcase for everyone here.

[GrandpaMo]

For not voting D1, not weighing in on James at all (he only ever mentions Blurry), and not pursuing his SR of me.

how willing do u want an elim on chuck today and if they flip town, we condemn u

If I were 100% on Chuck being scum I'd take you up on that. As it is I feel that slot is the best place for my vote for the reasons provided. We can debate that reasoning, and as that debate goes on how sure I am about whether or not Chuck is scum will go up or down.

I want to know how Clark feels about this statement now that Chuck did flip town. They seemed not to be sure, and was thinking other options at that time perhaps. Actually who did you think Chuck was scum with clark?

Who do you think is scum now? Clark come back

[GrandpaMo]

I really need to hear fom Grandpa on what's in James' ISO that makes him think {Clark, Roden}.

yea i just came back with work...

expect like a complete analysis on james readlist on why i do expect its clark / roden in a couple of hours


tldr; this is manly based on james interactions with clark nd roden (the post that nancy pointed out of james) i noticed it from that and started quick skimming jame's iso and seeing their reads.

Oh, you actually are suspecting me. I guessed that was a typo because your earlier post said Chuck instead of Clark, and it looked like you were accusing Nancy of thinking that.

Either way, we've already been over this. For me to be scum I'd have to have hard bussed Blurry/James before the replacement even came in. Psyche had scum read Blurry first, but the wagon didn't start until I repeatedly kept bringing attention to Blurry and soft accused Val of trying to divert attention by arguing with Nancy. Even when James subbed in, I kept my vote on his slot and continued to pressure him.

It's not like I couldn't pivot out to another wagon either. Nancy had multiple people going after her and I'd already stated that I didn't trust Val's intentions at the time. If I was scum, all I'd have to do is completely ignore Blurry and help Val put pressure on Nancy. Literally all I'd have to do is shut up and James would likely still be in the game.

If you don't believe me, go look back at what happened. It starts around page 10 I believe. I specifically say that I think the early wagon on you was bad and that we should look more at Blurry.

That doesn't clear you as town. Just because you shoved attention to someone who you weren't even the driving force at that time, that doesn't make you town. Note that James scumleaned you. Also notate that Val, and I believe Clark had scumread Blurry as well and so that makes you scumreading them more NAI. Also for the second part is not true, you could have done the same Clark done and scumread Chuck out of no where and find yourself to explore a scumspot. If you would have shut up, there would still have been the CC and hammer still would have still proceeded with or without your input.

[GrandpaMo]

Can you give me why you are town not mentioning EoD of day one nor mentioning anything regarding your reads?

[GrandpaMo]

if nancy is scum, they already won. and also im down to vote clark

I wish. I’m town, how are you still this terrible at reading me?

if nancy is scum, they already won. and also im down to vote clark

I wish. I’m town, how are you still this terrible at reading me?

@Mo, since I’ve been hard defending you since D1, why are you the only player who’s still suspicious of me?

you arent confirmed nor anyone is. soloscum is alive and it can be anyone atp.

you aren't cleared just because of x and x no one is.

thats why im epxloring every possible choice right now.

and like i said if you are scum, then gg you win because roden, clark, and val won't vote you so it would be impossible for me to even try to build a scumcase on you because it would be no point.

just because you defended me is also no reason for me to townread you. you could obviously be pocketing me here.


just like how james did.

thats why im paranoid.

[GrandpaMo]

I wasn't 100% that he was scum,

Okay so no that isn't what I was saying.

Let me explain so you don't get confused.

I was saying at that time that you weren't 100 percent sure. So you must have had a back thought that he was town MAYBE for x and x, that means you had a backup scumread just in case they were town. correct?

because that's usually how it is for me when I am not 100 percent sure on my scumread, I explore the thought that person could be town and explore why this person is town and that makes x scum etc.

[GrandpaMo]

wait let me answer everyone else's question before asking another one

[GrandpaMo]

oh fuck didnt reload the page dammit dont mind the quote 808

[GrandpaMo]

T3 being the NK last night seems very, very odd to me.

So what does the choice tell you? Who has constantly been discussing PR's, been confused by claims, and came into today under the impression that T3 was a tracker? Whose choices have been erratic and unconventional? Val, your question here is may be you as scum gloating a bit. I have heard that surprise/puzzlement over a NK is a mild scumtell, but I don't think this is the case in this instance. I've been wrong all game, so who knows.

Screw this. Yes, 131 is compelling but I have to go with my gut here. My vote on Val is pure PoE. The mountain of scummy stuff from Grandpa overwhelms what Blurry said on page 6.

UNVOTE: Val89

VOTE: GrandpaMo

Okay now you are just guilttripping / manipulating context. You are putting Val's words into your thought process and being influenced.

I think Roden becomes likely town here.

And last scum lies between Val / Clark.

One of them is just misguided.

[GrandpaMo]

I was saying at that time that you weren't 100 percent sure. So you must have had a back thought that he was town MAYBE for x and x, that means you had a backup scumread just in case they were town. correct?

634 may be helpful for you. Yes, I had a back thought that he was town. No, I didn't have a backup scumread. It was the beginning of the day and Chuck had the most points against him (in my view) for me to explore.

because that's usually how it is for me when I am not 100 percent sure on my scumread, I explore the thought that person could be town and explore why this person is town and that makes x scum etc.

Of course. My chief issues with Chuck was the lack of a vote despite having scumreads as well as the nature of his scumreads. Why was that a problem that made me not be 100% sure Chuck was scum? There wasn't much time for him to finish his reads before D1 ended. However, with the absence of much else for me to work with that left me pursuing Chuck as a start to D2. I did not anticipate his elimination coming in just 4 pages or so.

It was pretty late into the day and you already had tunneled him. You also should have been awared that there were multiple people scumreading them at the same time. Heck, I even thought chuck was scum and don't know why they flipped town.

I thought you were more townier than chuck in the case. And chuck's vote makes it an omgus. We literally agreed on that part.

[GrandpaMo]

He voted for me today, so who do you think it was, Grandpa?

He isn't voting for you anymore sadly.

[GrandpaMo]

T3 being the NK last night seems very, very odd to me.

So what does the choice tell you? Who has constantly been discussing PR's, been confused by claims, and came into today under the impression that T3 was a tracker? Whose choices have been erratic and unconventional? Val, your question here is may be you as scum gloating a bit. I have heard that surprise/puzzlement over a NK is a mild scumtell, but I don't think this is the case in this instance. I've been wrong all game, so who knows.

Screw this. Yes, 131 is compelling but I have to go with my gut here. My vote on Val is pure PoE. The mountain of scummy stuff from Grandpa overwhelms what Blurry said on page 6.

UNVOTE: Val89

VOTE: GrandpaMo

"131 is compelling, but grandpa is scummy, and val is scummy because of poe" poe implies that i would have been town in your case. or "townier"

can u explain the scummy stuff i did? i felt like i justified everything. im playing the same as my town

[GrandpaMo]

t3 why did u have to die:( come back i need ur help

[GrandpaMo]

nancy ima just trust u for now, idk who it is anymore.

but if we are all agreeing its either clark / val. im down to sheep u and go to a f3 with a determiner of who scum kills at night.

heck, if yall want me to kill me today, go for it if it progresses town (no im not playing lamist, im being serious)

[GrandpaMo]

i dont wanna go to a f3 tho, this f3 is scary

me, val, clark in a f3, instant loss for town and scum easily wins of whomever is scum between val and clark

[GrandpaMo]

heck even nancy staying alive in a f3, would be very worrisome of its own.

roden, idek if ur town but i believe if ur scum, then you won as well so gg

[GrandpaMo]

This is a 9 player game, so I think you have 1 too many.

I thought "there is one scum between" Clark and Grandpa went without saying, but OK.

I'm 90% sure it's Clark, but Grandpa has given me some reasons to think he might be scum in this game. That appears to be his superpower, though, even as town.

The pool yesterday was {Val, Clark, Chuck}. If we don't flip right today, the NK is 100% either Nancy or Roden; they aren't going to kill me or Clark when we have such suspicion on us.

I would rather flip ClarkBar today over myself obviously, but if Nancy is adamant that Grandpa is town and is happy to bet the game on it, then I would rather you limmed me today so I'm not alive in the LyLo; as long as Clark is going tomorrow for the gg's.

VOTE: ClarkBar

does clark voting me, make u want to vote me too?

[GrandpaMo]

ok im just gonna vote now.


VOTE: ClarkBar

[GrandpaMo]

T3 being the NK last night seems very, very odd to me.

So what does the choice tell you? Who has constantly been discussing PR's, been confused by claims, and came into today under the impression that T3 was a tracker? Whose choices have been erratic and unconventional? Val, your question here is may be you as scum gloating a bit. I have heard that surprise/puzzlement over a NK is a mild scumtell, but I don't think this is the case in this instance. I've been wrong all game, so who knows.

Screw this. Yes, 131 is compelling but I have to go with my gut here. My vote on Val is pure PoE. The mountain of scummy stuff from Grandpa overwhelms what Blurry said on page 6.

UNVOTE: Val89

VOTE: GrandpaMo

Okay now you are just guilttripping / manipulating context. You are putting Val's words into your thought process and being influenced.

I think Roden becomes likely town here.

And last scum lies between Val / Clark.

One of them is just misguided.

I agree with this. If you recall, I had T3, you and Roden as likely town.

Roden was adamant about James and not me being the lim, where as Val first wanted to kill me, then Psyche and Clark was pretty much not doing much.

wait... val wanted to kill u?

[GrandpaMo]

oh wait ik what ur talking bout

[GrandpaMo]

I'm going to harp on the Chuck wagon again because scum is on it and it went too fast and I don't feel votes were justified.

Vote #1: Me for reasons I discuss all D2.

Vote #2: T3. No reason provided, but he was town so we can move on.

Vote #3: Val89. The end of 708 shows that there is a scum pool that Val is picking from, and he picked Chuck. Why? Because my argument was strong? Because Chuck's defense was weak? In 714 Val bolsters his reasoning for voting Chuck...

I think the likleyhood is 90% that it is between you and Clark. My vote is on you, and I think you should flip first, because I think there is a slightly higher chance it is you over Clark, but it's a close call.

but unless I missed it I am unclear why there was a higher chance (in Val's mind) that Chuck was scum over me.

Vote #4: The hammer is courtesy of Grandpa. He asks permission to hammer but never receives it before doing so. 732 is odd. Quotes Val about a topic unrelated to Chuck while hammering Chuck. Grandpa also never really mentions the arguments I made against Chuck. Grandpa does ask Chuck to make a town case for me, and when Chuck understandably (and reasonably) declines that appears to be the strike against for Grandpa, though Grandpa doesn't vote at that time. 701 is reasonable, but is essentially aping of part of my existing argument against Chuck.

I am aware I'm the likely elimination today, so I want to bring up as much stuff that is running through my mind as possible, and that includes which vote is the most opportunistic between Grandpa and Val.

im down to vote val if u want

[GrandpaMo]

i dont wanna go to a f3 tho, this f3 is scary

me, val, clark in a f3, instant loss for town and scum easily wins of whomever is scum between val and clark

heck even nancy staying alive in a f3, would be very worrisome of its own.

roden, idek if ur town but i believe if ur scum, then you won as well so gg

Nightmare scenario, because I honestly don’t know who I’d vote between Val and Clark. So if both Val and Clark vote you, it could possibly be that whichever one is scum wants the other in elo?

My working theory rn, is that scum only wants one of you, Roden, me in Elo. Me or Roden are probably the NK. I think if you get limmee today, we’re probably looking at either a Clark/Val/Roden F3 or a Clark/Val/me with Clark ahd Val most likely trying to push the other.

Rn, I’m leaning to it being Clark > Val but having both in Elo with either Roden or me, is I think the best case scenario for scum winning this.

thats why we lim between clark and val..?

[GrandpaMo]

Vote #4: The hammer is courtesy of Grandpa. He asks permission to hammer but never receives it before doing so. 732 is odd. Quotes Val about a topic unrelated to Chuck while hammering Chuck. Grandpa also never really mentions the arguments I made against Chuck. Grandpa does ask Chuck to make a town case for me, and when Chuck understandably (and reasonably) declines that appears to be the strike against for Grandpa, though Grandpa doesn't vote at that time. 701 is reasonable, but is essentially aping of part of my existing argument against Chuck.

lol i hammered because val was being annoying regarding me
supposedly pr fishing (which i still dont know how), so i just tried to prove to val that i was town by just hammering and just getting the flip over with

[GrandpaMo]

Nancy, the only ELO I don't really want is Grandpa/Me with you alive; because I worry the spat we had D1 would influence your decision.

With that in mind, even though I think ClarkBar is the likley candidate, me or Grandpa should go today.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Grandpa

BRO CAN YALL STOP FLIP FLOPPIONG

THIS LITERALLY CONFIRMS THERE IS SCUM BETWEEN YALL

AS SOON CLARK UNVOTES ME AND VOTES VAL

VAL UNVOTES AGAIN AND VOTES ME THEN VICE VERSA

ITS ACTUALLY ANNOYING . IDK WHO IS SCUM JUST FUCKING AROUND XD

[GrandpaMo]

You guys terrified me with all these votes, I was worried someone was about to get hammered before I could finish catching up on posts.

Val, please don't self hammer, I genuinely don't think it's you. Nancy is town locked for me and your spat with her was so TvT it hurts.

Scum is between Clark and Grandpa,100%. I'm not voting Val and if Clark continues to push him I'll vote Clark today. I've been leaning more towards Grandpa as the game goes on but I'm convinced that any push on Val has to be scum motivated. I don't believe even Nancy votes Val in a F3 scenario and scum likely believes the same.

how can i be scum if both clark and val literally voted me flip flopping their narratives.

when val had voted clark, clark had voted me

when clark unvoted me then voted me, val had voted me

like does that not confirm me as town unless either

roden / nancy is scum and we arent thinking that?

unless somehow BOTH CLARK AND VAL scumread me 100%

then there is literally no way

[GrandpaMo]

im confused wit this game atp.

idk what scum is doing anymore

[GrandpaMo]

VOTE: Clarkbar

He isn’t playing extremely differently here from the game I miselimed him in so I’m wary.

I hate this. Why move my vote? E-1 is fun!

VOTE: GrandpaMo

This post is ick.

I think Clark’s play makes the most sense as a buddy.

So spiritually my vote is on Clark.

so r u saying u wanna vote clark?

[GrandpaMo]

like shit im fucking willling to vote WITH val to vote clark

and im willing to vote WITH clark to vote val

like regardless if im alive in the f3, thats how im gonna play it, voting the other one (depending on who dies at night tho)

but the misguided town in that duo is scared and is not pushing one each other and is being influenced to easily use me as limbait it all fucking makes sense.

[GrandpaMo]

I'm gonna put it this way Grandpa. If you don't vote Clark, I'm going to take it as you need him in end game because you're scum. If you vote Val, I'll consider it a scum tell. It's up to you to interpret why I think this.

i dont get why u think this. this literally makes no sense.


so who ever i vote, you will scumread me regardless??? what anti town behavior shit is that

if you are town , you can't have that mindset because you will lock urself into never ending prophecy of bias.

you need to stop and then reread the game every time.

[GrandpaMo]

If you don't vote Clark, I'm going to take it as you need him in end game because you're scum. If you vote Val, I'll consider it a scum tell. It's up to you to interpret why I think this.

u literally did what u are talking bout.


if i dont vote clark, meaning i vote val, you will scumread me.

if i vote val, you will consider it scumtell.

thats literally what u said