Newbie 2071: The Sandwich Debate - End!

[Lukewarm]

Hello. It is I, a watcher from the shadows

@LLD

Can you talk about what led you to making this play?

Spoiler:

Today is the day for a mass claim, btw. We're in a 5:2 situation, and we have 2 confirmed townies we can create, with a possible better outcome depending on roles.

So we need to organize a popcorn claiming list. We pick the scummiest person, and then make them claim, then, they tell someone else to claim, and we go down the list. This way, it makes counter claims a little harder to fake too.

I also think, for the immediate moment in the claim order, you shouldn't claim your ROLE, just whether you are a Vanilla Townie or a Power Role.

If we have any counter claiming, we can use that to try and catch people, but if we don't, we don't reveal what power is where to the scum.

Anyone disagree with this?

Never seen something like that suggested day 2 of a newbie game, and was the reason I started spectating this game lol

[Lukewarm]

Also, congrats on getting it right in Elo

[Lukewarm]

Spoiler:

We'd just flipped a townie, and the game was at risk of hitting apathy. Forcing a mass claim creates new info and makes people have to chew on it and make decisions. I felt that using the mass claim timing here would provide town +EV if done like this.

Now, mechanical stuff: Popcorn because it prevents scum from being able to do weird fake claim stuff, and only claiming "power role or no" because of the same.

The way this setup is built creates the possibility for duplication errors. In that a cop is fine, ubt there's no guarantee the jailkeeper that claims is real or not, because the cop can't know the setup. It could be a real jailkeeper, or it could be mafia making the guess from that position.

Having popcorn'd order makes it harder to plan the timing of a fake claim, and having hidden role names and only claiming to have power or not hides the setup they need to duplicate.

Had more than one person claimed a power role, we would have been making them power claim in reverse order of the order they claimed, and then evaluating what came from that.

In essence, doing it this way created the GUARANTEE of a few confirmed townies, or gave us a guilty and a good plan. In this scenario, my play wasn't super necessary since we had a cop with a guilty

but what happens if the cop just claims the guilty and then the jailkeeper claims later?

Cop claims it, we kill 1, and the fake jail keeper "clears" someone as not the person who killed the cop and then it's GG. It's game over. Then the JK no kills, claims a guilty and boom.

We lose to duplication error.

Doing it this way prevents ALL that gambit shit.

That makes sense, but like I said I have never seen it done before.

Is that something you think should be done in general in a game that had a day 1 VT elim and a night 1 VT kill?

Or was there something more specific about this game that made you lean that way?

[Lukewarm]

What about the worry that we only have 1 pr?

Like, in this game, if clasko had claimed PR, and then Looker had claimed PR. That could have been 2 pr claims, with no counter claim?

Obviously that is a risk for the scum team, but they also know that they are in column c, so there is a 67% chance that one can get cleared into the pr group

[Lukewarm]

Thanks for all of the info.

I was **This** close to copying your play in day 2 of my last newbie game, it was going on at the same time as this game, but then chickened out because I really wanted to have a better understanding of the Why before I used it myself

[Lukewarm]

Manatee wins by doing absolutely nothing

Congrat!

Make sure you add this to your wiki