Newbie 2073: Parfait (Over)

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Here's hoping this game goes better than the last one lol Nice to see Catboi's in here, I didn't get the chance to play much with him last time

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I

may

have joined to snipe the game you were in, hope you're town again~

VOTE: Save The Dragons

Oh my, I feel so special (⁄ ⁄•⁄ω⁄•⁄ ⁄)

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Everyone's talking about their past games and I'm over here like "this is my second game ever" lol

Tbh the RVS stage seems practically designed to throw people off-track, so imma reserve judgement for when there's more to go on.

I will say that T3 gives me weird vibes that I can't quite explain, but I dunno if I'd outright call him scum.

The only other person I've really taken notice of is Val but since he's VLA I'll have to wait til he comes back to look more into.

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Now that there's been a bit more discussion and I'm not trying to hurry and post before my break ends, I think I wanna give a bit more of a detailed breakdown of what I'm thinking rn.

T3 still gives me weird vibes, but I think that might be because he reminds me of a player in my other game who turned out to be scum. Actually analyzing what he's said so far though seems to lean slightly townish. Things like asking what color a person's role was (there should only be two going by the sample PMs and scum would already know what everyone's is if that's the case) and pointing out problems with Wu's posts. None of that's definitive, but it has made me a bit less wary if nothing else.

Meg seems to be genuinely trying to analyze and keep things focused on the game. I feel like they might be town, but can't say for certain yet.

Roden feels similar to me. I would assume that he's played on other forums or in some other fashion because he definitely seems to have more confidence and presence than newbies in my other game.

Catboi I'm holding off on analyzing just because I am somewhat familiar with them and don't want to let bias influence my reads, so I need a bit more before I can make any calls.

Save the Dragons (imma just call you StG from here on for the sake of ease) has only posted twice, but I am curious why he ignored Catboi's question? It could just be that he missed it so I don't think that's AI atm but it is something I'm curious about.

Wu is probably the scummiest of the people that have posted so far, but I don't know if that's just me being easily influenced. One thing I will say is the assumption that scum won't bus day 1 is false, that's actually a somewhat effective strategy in certain games, especially on this forum (at least that's what I was told by one of the SE players in my last game). All it takes for a mafia victory is one tricky and charismatic scum player, so having a partner isn't technically necessary, especially since that'd make it easier for you to have more influence on who dies since you'd have complete control over NK

As for everyone else, gotta wait til they post more

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You have some valid points, but bare in mind that d1 is arguably the most important day of the game since it lasts longer and no one has any reason to suspect anyone by default on account of no eliminations or suspects from the get-go; it's the most ideal for info gathering. Ending d1 early is a good way to keep town at a disadvantage and depending on how useful your partner is, it could arguably be worth the sacrifice if someone's confident in themselves. It's a huge risk for sure, but if someone's confident in themselves, chances are that doesn't matter to them.
Really all I'm saying is that throwing out the idea just because you view it as unlikely is only going to harm future reads

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Also how is Roden towny for suggesting he be policy zgrynibysed?

Take it from someone that did something similar in my first game, asking to be eliminated reads as incredibly towny on this forum since most scum have too much self preservation to risk anyone actually following through. Basically if someone says they wouldn't have a problem being eliminated there's room for doubt, but if someone actively encourages their elimination if things play out a certain way, the chances of them being town are higher.
Obviously that doesn't work with games that have unusual roles or modifiers like vengeful and there's a chance that scum might just be willing to take the risk, but those are circumstances that aren't likely to happen in a newbie game so to most people it reads as a town action

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(Also sorry for writing paragraphs all the time, I like to go into detail woth my thoughts and can go overboard sometimes ^^')

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Tbh that was a typo on my part but T3 brings up a good point lmao

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If you're a townie, you know 100% that you're town, so if you get zgrynibysed you know that town will 100% lose one member.
I'd say that asking to be zgrynibysed is NAI because both town and scum have strong motivations for not wanting to be zgrynibysed.

Yes, but with town you know that there's at least six other people who can still win for you and it's better to be down one townie than have the vote split over suspicions that make it easier for scum to manipulate. It's not a great strategy, but it's one that has a higher chance of benefiting town than mafia on account of it being less of a hit which is why most people think it's a town move

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You say to take your word for it, but aren't really making a compelling argument. Are you just grasping at straws or are you just going off of gut-feeling and insisting everyone agree with them?

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Anti-town in a newbie doesn't mean scum. It's his first game.

Except it isn't

I've played 8 games on my 'home' forum and became curious about how it looks elsewhere.

It may be his first game on here, but 8 games is more than enough to know ways to play to help town.
Honestly the fact that they've gone dark again when people start questioning them is definitely setting off some alarm bells in my head. I understand that life can be busy, but if that's the case, why not just say that? Instead their only defense is that their old games had the days go shorter? I have to agree with Roden that it just doesn't make any sense.

VOTE: shwinnebego

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That'll be a big ole yikes from me, chief

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So I went through everyone in ISO and figured I'd share my thoughts.

Wu: Between the lack of relevance with most of his posts, lack of any real substance in his reads, and certain behaviors that come off as pocketing (namely how quick he was to defend shwin without much real reason to do so) gives me a null read at the best of times, and a pretty strong scum lean at the worst. The fact that he's suddenly stopped posting after doing so almost nonstop feels suspicious given the timing, but I won't deny the possibility that he just hasn't had time to post.

Meg: Seems pretty genuine with their scum hunting. Definitely seems to find certain behaviors odd that I don't and vice versa, but that might just be because of our differing mafia experiences. Not really much else to say; very town leaning.

Roden: Honestly despite the distrust he got earlier, I tended to agree with quite a few of his points. I think it might be because I'm also one of those "anti-town actions really aren't much better than scum so may as well vote them out so they can't hamper things more" types. Behavior from people that have played with him before or who looked into his meta hinted at the possibility that he might be putting up an act as scum so he's not my highest town read, but that's still where I'm leaning on him.

Val: Honestly while the intense start seemed kinda off to me, now that things have entered a more serious stage and he's gotten deep into the scum-hunt (and coming in with the receipts in T3's case), he's gone up there with Meg as one of my strongest town reads.

T3: Probably the most constantly changing read for me this game. He's been somewhat hard to pin down due to his posts seeming to switch from genuine to weird and random with no real rhyme or reason, but between Val's posts and the ISO, he's currently a scum-lean in my book. There's a somewhat decent chance that his post pattern (or lack thereof) might be an attempt to intentionally make him hard to read without coming off as a complete troll or active lurker.

Catboi: He's probably the strongest null-read for me. His scum-hunting seems genuine, but there's something about it that feels off for some reason. I might reread the other game where I know for a fact he was town and compare them just to see, but for now I'm gonna go with the view of null but if I had to choose, he's just barely town.

StD: Honestly hasn't posted enough for me to really have a solid read yet,

Shwin: Pretty sure at this point he's just a troll. None of his posts have had anything of value barring maybe his reads list (which is questionable at best), his votes are for the most asinine reasons, and he's all but stated that he doesn't really have an interest in the actual game itself. Tbh he's made the game super un-fun to play which is partly why I've been so quiet and I think from now on, unless he starts taking things seriously or subs out, I'm just going to ignore what he says just because the chances of it actually being worth the attention are astronomically low.

Sorry if the reads are a little on the weak side, it's pretty late and I've been busy all day with work and a new kitten but I felt bad not really participating much today

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Aftet some consideration, I think it's time to change my vote.
Val's links have been very helpful and I've seen quite a few convincing arguments. On top of that, hos overall playstyle has been inconsistent and he doesn't seem to be doing much to benefit town, so I'm afraid I'm going to have to turn my vote on you T3.

VOTE: T3

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He's a moron.

Who?

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Personally I'm with Val; I don't quite buy T3 being a mason on just his word alone. I'd like to hear from Shwin before making any judgements about lynching

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Quick question: do you think that T3 would sacrifice himself to let his partner finish the game or is it possible he was hoping to get away with it and just got bussed?

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The latter; I just don't think it clears Shwin completely

I can see a few reasons why you might suspect Catboi, but would you care to share them?

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Because the only way to disprove the claim is to have someone counterclaim. And since it's incredibly risky for a VT to make the claim; chances are good that whoever does legitimately does have a power role

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Well yes, but I was more talking about why scum would try it in general, obviously there are little differences depending on the claim

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Isn't T3 only e-1? I thought it was only me, Val, Shwin, and now T3 himself, did I miss something?

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Omg this game was so stressful to read from the afterlife XD

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My hat's off to Roden, I only started picking up on his scumtells after I already knew his alignment.

Honestly it's kinda funny how I initially thought Shwin was just a troll, but by day 2 he was the one I found myself rooting for lol

Wish Val would check things out now that it's over, I'm definitely interested in hearing what was going on with him at the end there

Overall, this game was kind of a nightmare but definitely an entertaining one and I definitely think mafia did wonderfully (I might have to take some notes if I ever get a scum role lol)

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GG, thanks everyone. I hope Val checks in too, because I think I know what he was going for but I had to push him anyway.

Btw Nav, what actually are my scum tells? I'm pretty aware of my playstyle, but I'm not sure which subtleties give me away.

Honestly they're very subtle, but knowing you were scum let me notice that you have a tendency to project and at times your posts gave off the vibe that you knew more than you let on (because obviously you did). But like I said, it's very subtle and I probably wouldn't notice it in a proper game with you