Newbie 2074 | Game Over

[JamesTheNames]

VOTE: ClarkBar

[JamesTheNames]

Anyways, what’s everyone’s favorite flavor of ice cream?

Banana.
Random question: Is banana ice cream a thing in the states? I went to Arkansas a few years ago and never found any.
PS. Not banana + toffee or banana + _____. Just banana flavoured.

[JamesTheNames]

Do not tell my Italian partner but I do not like pizza.

[JamesTheNames]

Just going to get the backlash to the comment out the way:
UNVOTE: ClarkBar
VOTE: JamesTheNames

[JamesTheNames]

VOTE: cowsloveSushirolls

I don't think cows loving sushi is super plausible.

But bars made out of men called Clark?

[JamesTheNames]

As a kid I was all about Rocky Road. These days anything vanilla with a little caramel is my go to. Ben & Jerry's "Americone Dream" is perfection.

Just going to get the backlash to the comment out the way

I have strangely never heard of Banana ice cream. Seems like an obvious flavor too. So is the backlash about this or you not liking pizza? I'm confused by the self-vote.

The pizza comment unfortunately.

[JamesTheNames]

The pizza comment unfortunately.

Sure, not liking pizza is an insane take, but there was no backlash. What is the value of the self-vote?

Just getting the fluff posts out of the way.

[JamesTheNames]

UNVOTE: JamesTheNames
VOTE: Salsabil Faria

[JamesTheNames]

VOTE: cowsloveSushirolls

I don't think cows loving sushi is super plausible.

if you were a cow, you WOULDN'T use all 4 of your stomach chambers to enjoy good sushi? every other cow would, the fact is on wikipedia

Are cows not herbivores?
How are cows used by the mafia?
As drug myoooooles.

[JamesTheNames]

VOTE: SalsabilFaria

This is sus. My vote has been copied.

[JamesTheNames]

VOTE: SalsabilFaria

VOTE: SalsabilFaria

This is sus. My vote has been copied.

I replaced into a game in your slot, 2064 like 2 months ago. It was fun. We won.

[JamesTheNames]

Hi.

[JamesTheNames]

@Val89 I just haven't decided who I want to death-tunnel yet.

[JamesTheNames]

Why?

a player with that level of verbosity and apparent dedication to analysis can spare a few words to at least attempt to get some sort of conversation going on a useful game level

In this case, the amount of words read to me as a nervous cover for rolling scum

Compared to 3 votes with no initial justifications?

[JamesTheNames]

I'm a VT.

[JamesTheNames]

I'm a VT.

don't do this

also why did you do this

but don't do this

Gets the game going doesn't it.

[JamesTheNames]

you didn't do that to get the game going

why did you actually do it

You'll be very surprised by the answer.

[JamesTheNames]

you didn't do that to get the game going

why did you actually do it

You'll be very surprised by the answer.

I'm eager to be surprised!

To get the game going.

[JamesTheNames]

Roughly 13 of the last 30 posts relate to 96.

[JamesTheNames]

Maybe you did. You shouldn't do that in the future. Everyone telling you that knows what they're talking about and newbie games are for learning things like this.

VOTE: Val89

Newbie games are also for experimenting.

[JamesTheNames]

assuming you are town, you have made it easier for mafia to hunt down PRs, and if you are lying broke down any trust you will have with the rest of the town

furthermore, the game was already going, there was stuff to talk about. Why didn't you engage with the rest of the game first?

Are you implying the game develops better when there is only 1 thing going on, 1 thing to consider, or just because it was your push on Val89?

[JamesTheNames]

@Ythan why did you retract the vote on me by the way? Between your vote and your unvote my only posts was reiterating why I claimed, and me saying how many posts had to do with my claim.

[JamesTheNames]

you didn't do that to get the game going

why did you actually do it

You'll be very surprised by the answer.

Would it be possible to walk through some hypothetical answers for why you did it that would be surprising?

Sure. This bit isn't hypothetical. I did the same thing in my last game then got hammered from 0 votes to 5 votes within the span of about 4 hours before D1 ended due to time. I wanted to try it again. I won't comment further regarding that game as said game is ongoing.

Hypothetical answers:
From a mechanics point of view even town vs even scum, ie 6 town vs 2 scum, benefits town, I get conftowned by claiming and we get to a beneficial mechanical stage?

The first non-newbie game I read over Dannflor did this, and I wanted to try it.

If I make everythone think I look stupid with random claims and hard-tunnelling. I won't get killed during the Nights and can save the game D3 or D4.

[JamesTheNames]

Welcome newbie enjoy your time on MS.

I don't want to put words in your mouth, but this read to me as back-handed insult. So please clarify - what's your intent here??

No you got it.

UNVOTE: Salsabil Faria
VOTE: Ythan

[JamesTheNames]

Also, James is a seems off to me, a self vote and a really random and awful VT claim. That's obviously very scummy, but it feels less like it might just be too scummy and random to be to actually be something scum does.

The self vote was just RVS fluff.

[JamesTheNames]

Also, James is a seems off to me, a self vote and a really random and awful VT claim. That's obviously very scummy, but it feels less like it might just be too scummy and random to be to actually be something scum does.

The self vote was just RVS fluff.

Still not a good play, even if you say that.

It wasn't intended to be a good play it was fluff. It was the 16th post.

[JamesTheNames]

UNVOTE: Ythan Not comfortable with this at 3. Will be back this evening.

Not at E-1 but at E-2 feels a bit weird to unvote at.

[JamesTheNames]

UNVOTE: Ythan Not comfortable with this at 3. Will be back this evening.

Not at E-1 but at E-2 feels a bit weird to unvote at.

shouldnt you be an advocate for minimizing quickhammering given your history with them?

I've yet to be in a game with an early random hammer.

[JamesTheNames]

Though I do advocate early E-1s. Applying some lovely pressure early in a Day phase is much more efficient than in the middle of a Day phase.

[JamesTheNames]

Is there a scum advantage of doing that sort of VT claim?

There's no benefit for either.

[JamesTheNames]

Boring!

Come again? What don't you like?

[JamesTheNames]

please scumread james for diff reasons

Is this pocketing?

[JamesTheNames]

UNVOTE: Ythan Not comfortable with this at 3. Will be back this evening.

Not at E-1 but at E-2 feels a bit weird to unvote at.

Nope? We have 2 scums remember?

First of all the person putting it onto 4 would have to justify it. Then you hammer the hammerer D2 as a matter or policy.

[JamesTheNames]

Sure. This bit isn't hypothetical. I did the same thing in my last game then got hammered from 0 votes to 5 votes within the span of about 4 hours before D1 ended due to time. I wanted to try it again. I won't comment further regarding that game as said game is ongoing.

Hypothetical answers:
From a mechanics point of view even town vs even scum, ie 6 town vs 2 scum, benefits town, I get conftowned by claiming and we get to a beneficial mechanical stage?

The first non-newbie game I read over Dannflor did this, and I wanted to try it.

If I make everythone think I look stupid with random claims and hard-tunnelling. I won't get killed during the Nights and can save the game D3 or D4.

Maybe I lack imagination, but this explanation reads worse.

J says he claimed VT recently and it had a decisively bad result for himself and team. So he immediately does it again. What makes him think the same won't happen again? The upside to building a meta by claiming VT as VT would be for when he eventually wants to claim VT as a non-VT I presume?

So either:
- He's dumping this game again as VT for an even future scum game (worse than last time because of how last time went)
- This is that future game where he's scum (cashing in on the last game to take this town down)
- Given the value of a PR and how badly it went last time, the least generous conclusion would be assigning him as PR here, although that would likely be the least surprising next revelation.

I'll go with the most generous conclusion which is that this is the cash-in game.

VOTE: JamesTheNames

I will not be retracting my claim, nor claiming a PR further down the game.

[JamesTheNames]

I will not be retracting my claim, nor claiming a PR further down the game.

It sounds like you fail to understand that if you are town this narrows down scum's search for potential power roles.

You need to understand that this is wrong before you play real games, for real.

It'll be better if you talk to a wall instead

Isn't there a Britney Spears song about you?

[JamesTheNames]

You think it was a necessary comment?

[JamesTheNames]

Hey, I should have mentioned that weekends are extremely busy for me. I will try to make a substantive post today, but honestly weekends are a bear.

alright! thanks for checking in
UNVOTE: JamesTheNames
i gotta look at what's going on around james and convince myself that this isnt an unwarranted tunnel

Are you scum cowsloveSushirolls?

[JamesTheNames]

Are you scum cowsloveSushirolls?

what answer would please you the most?

I mean I'd love if you actually were and said yes but it was just me prodding.

[JamesTheNames]

Hello. I'll be catching up when I wake up. cowsloveSushirolls is scum. I'll explain why when I wake up.

[JamesTheNames]

So if Salsa, Leaven, and James all flip town this game. What are the takeaways.

- With Salsa, scum can freely do anti-town things and even be town-bucketed for it. Furthermore, if people vote that scummy behavior, they will actually be scum-bucketed for it.
- With myself, scum will know they can't easily get away with anti-town things.

What advantage does town get (now or in the future) from laying a red carpet down for scum to freely behave against the interest of town? I'm happy to create an environment that discourages anti-town behavior.

If James was randomly 25% Scum, 25% PR, 50% VT, now I have him at 30% Scum, 5% PR, 65% VT. Still overwhelmingly likely to be VT, but as I've said previously, outside of a better option (which we likely will have in 5 days), my vote lands there.

Boooooooooooooooooooooooooooriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnngggggggg

If you have time, check my meta, will see how townie I am all the time

This is scummy.

[JamesTheNames]

So if Salsa, Leaven, and James all flip town this game. What are the takeaways.

- With Salsa, scum can freely do anti-town things and even be town-bucketed for it. Furthermore, if people vote that scummy behavior, they will actually be scum-bucketed for it.
- With myself, scum will know they can't easily get away with anti-town things.

What advantage does town get (now or in the future) from laying a red carpet down for scum to freely behave against the interest of town? I'm happy to create an environment that discourages anti-town behavior.

If James was randomly 25% Scum, 25% PR, 50% VT, now I have him at 30% Scum, 5% PR, 65% VT. Still overwhelmingly likely to be VT, but as I've said previously, outside of a better option (which we likely will have in 5 days), my vote lands there.

Boooooooooooooooooooooooooooriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnngggggggg

If you have time, check my meta, will see how townie I am all the time

Until I replaced into 2064, you were basically a consensus scum in that game. So this is incorrect.
Not to mention, if you were town you'd be able to give reasoning outside of meta. You are trying to play into the "too scum to be scum" category.
Posts: 80, 83, 111, 208, 223, 286, 306. All ping me that way.
I also don't buy the whole unvoting at E-2 nonsense.

[JamesTheNames]

@cowsloveSushirolls would you like to explain your opinions on me claiming VT? I don't want you to directly quote anything I want it in your words please. I'm already aware of other opinions.

[JamesTheNames]

@cowsloveSushirolls would you like to explain your opinions on me claiming VT? I don't want you to directly quote anything I want it in your words please. I'm already aware of other opinions.

for what it's worth i think it's genuine, but you've done a bad job explaining what it was supposed to do and you continue to make these self-centric actions but almost refusing to solve slots with the information you've gained, despite having 42 posts

if you mean in a more general sense:
listen to what people say lol, i think this is a good lesson for you to absorb unless you're going to exclusively play mountainous games when you get out of this queue

the case i'm assuming you have on me will probably help with sorting your alignment and thought process so i want to see it

if you arent satisfied with this explanation i'm sure you know why

--

Sure. This bit isn't hypothetical. I did the same thing in my last game then got hammered from 0 votes to 5 votes within the span of about 4 hours before D1 ended due to time. I wanted to try it again. I won't comment further regarding that game as said game is ongoing.

Hypothetical answers:
From a mechanics point of view even town vs even scum, ie 6 town vs 2 scum, benefits town, I get conftowned by claiming and we get to a beneficial mechanical stage?

The first non-newbie game I read over Dannflor did this, and I wanted to try it.

If I make everythone think I look stupid with random claims and hard-tunnelling. I won't get killed during the Nights and can save the game D3 or D4.

i think the largest bit of confusion people have w/ you stems from this post, james

can you go through each of your hypothetical answers in a bit more depth?

I thought it was obvious in which case it was my bad. The hypothetical stuff was sarcastic, not serious.

[JamesTheNames]

If you have time, check my meta, will see how townie I am all the time

i have time
name a few games?

2064.

[JamesTheNames]

Boooooooooooooooooooooooooooriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnngggggggg

If you have time, check my meta, will see how townie I am all the time

Until I replaced into 2064, you were basically a consensus scum in that game. So this is incorrect.

You might be overselling this one a bit James. Given the "will see how townie I am all the time" comment came in response to Leaven suggesting that a refusal to vote you for your VT claim is laying a red carpet for scummy behavoir - I

think

she might actually have been saying in a sarcastic manner "I've been known to do scummy things as town myself", not "I'm always read as town".

In any case, her ISO in that game before you replaced her is literally 6 posts, and I think "consensus scum" is a wildly overstating the matter. I wasn't in that game, but reading it back quickly it looks like there were 3 slots expressing mild reservations about Salsabil, which had translated into one vote, at the point you replaced in.

This isn't to say that Salsabil hasn't done things that do warrant attention in this game. I'm still trying to get my head around what her CCing your VT claim means for her alignment; I literally don't know where to start with that one, which is why I haven't approached it until now; but I don't think that comment and the 2064 game are going to be helpful in sorting her.

Meta = Ree. We know this.

[JamesTheNames]

This isn't to say that Salsabil hasn't done things that do warrant attention in this game. I'm still trying to get my head around what her CCing your VT claim means for her alignment; I literally don't know where to start with that one, which is why I haven't approached it until now; but I don't think that comment and the 2064 game are going to be helpful in sorting her.

they've been saying that they are bored a lot this game, i think the action is in line with that along with maybe their relatively high posting
i just think salsa leans town for their earlygame
#78, #111 i felt were pretty town. before these posts i just townbinned them for laughing at me (#37, response in #77)
looking back the rest of the fluffposting is comparatively 'empty' to the towny posts i pointed out
i guess i'll know if it's gonna be helpful in sorting them when i start reading

I'm bored af

Let's hope the next game is fun and you aren't complaining every other post.
UNVOTE: Ythan
VOTE: Salsabil Faria
She's purposefully going for the too scummy to be scummy vibes.

[JamesTheNames]

I change my play style if I want to change it, not because what other people think I should do as any alignment.
It’s nothing wrong what you're saying, I am just stating that if you want to eliminate an anti-town player, you need to find/understand the agenda behind it, not only because they are playing anti-townie way.

If you can't get rid of scum for whatever reason you should aim for Hammer or lose without anti-townie people. Purposeful anti-town behaviour, such as yourself, isn't indicative sure, but it benefits town to hammer them still.
So tell me, why are you playing off the "What I'm doing is anti-town but doesn't make me scum?"
Do you intend to play in a way to benefit town? Do you have any arguments as to why you're town instead of "meta" and "anti town =/= scum"?

[JamesTheNames]

Hello. I'll be catching up when I wake up. cowsloveSushirolls is scum. I'll explain why when I wake up.

James, do you have any plans to come back to this?

Yep I'm just being very careful with interactions with him, as to not break any rules.

[JamesTheNames]

149 was about another game entirely
why are you trying to point out rulebreaks within other games outside of discussing ongoing games?

He said he did it in another game and got speedwagonned so he's going to try it again.

If you want to read the game you can.

[JamesTheNames]

149 was about another game entirely
why are you trying to point out rulebreaks within other games outside of discussing ongoing games?

He said he did it in another game and got speedwagonned so he's going to try it again.

If you want to read the game you can.

Meta is for nerds.

Not telling you to analyse anything, I also hate meta and think it isn't in the spirit of the game but you can see what happened or just read it?

[JamesTheNames]

So if Salsa, Leaven, and James all flip town this game. What are the takeaways.

- With Salsa, scum can freely do anti-town things and even be town-bucketed for it. Furthermore, if people vote that scummy behavior, they will actually be scum-bucketed for it.
- With myself, scum will know they can't easily get away with anti-town things.

What advantage does town get (now or in the future) from laying a red carpet down for scum to freely behave against the interest of town? I'm happy to create an environment that discourages anti-town behavior.

If James was randomly 25% Scum, 25% PR, 50% VT, now I have him at 30% Scum, 5% PR, 65% VT. Still overwhelmingly likely to be VT, but as I've said previously, outside of a better option (which we likely will have in 5 days), my vote lands there.

Boooooooooooooooooooooooooooriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnngggggggg

If you have time, check my meta, will see how townie I am all the time

This is scummy.

Why?
I kinda think it is too, but I don’t think it’s gonna be the same logic as yours.

As far as I'm concerned, if your sole argument is "Look. Meta." as to why you're town, you aren't town.

[JamesTheNames]

149 was about another game entirely
why are you trying to point out rulebreaks within other games outside of discussing ongoing games?

He said he did it in another game and got speedwagonned so he's going to try it again.

If you want to read the game you can.

Meta is for nerds.

Not telling you to analyse anything, I also hate meta and think it isn't in the spirit of the game but you can see what happened or just read it?

Note that I'm not voting you and haven't been for quite some time. My diatribes toward you about your play have nothing to do with the bearing of your antics on your alignment.

I'm not doing this for alignment but I can't say what I want because I don't want to be in a grey area with the rules again.

[JamesTheNames]

Last night (while being in bed), I realized,

Ythan

has only done theory stuff so far. Yes, they are a SE but also a player but instead of playing they're actually teaching everyone so far. If they really take the SE stuff seriously, they should concentrate more about practical stuff (meaning play the game by implementing the theory they have been teaching about), not only focus on correcting the theory talk of others.
That's been said, I think they are scum who are using their SE position as a shield.

UNVOTE: Leaven

VOTE: Ythan

imagine the slightest pressure from a replacement and someone completely folds.

[JamesTheNames]

I haven’t said that, you're misinterpreting my thoughts completely.

Do me a favour and read your own 306.

[JamesTheNames]

Policy to me should not take priority over your actual reads though.

Leaven has indicated he isn’t really doing that though?

True, but I also noted he said that he'd vote someone else if. The only problem is the last couple posts to me don't come off as someone trying to scum hunt so far, which I still find a little odd, although this might just be their playstyle.

This is hilarious!

What is with this string of filler.

I think from the start she was trying to be "too scummy to be scum", but got called out on it and she is now flailing.

[JamesTheNames]

So if Salsa, Leaven, and James all flip town this game. What are the takeaways.

- With Salsa, scum can freely do anti-town things and even be town-bucketed for it. Furthermore, if people vote that scummy behavior, they will actually be scum-bucketed for it.
- With myself, scum will know they can't easily get away with anti-town things.

What advantage does town get (now or in the future) from laying a red carpet down for scum to freely behave against the interest of town? I'm happy to create an environment that discourages anti-town behavior.

If James was randomly 25% Scum, 25% PR, 50% VT, now I have him at 30% Scum, 5% PR, 65% VT. Still overwhelmingly likely to be VT, but as I've said previously, outside of a better option (which we likely will have in 5 days), my vote lands there.

Boooooooooooooooooooooooooooriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnngggggggg

If you have time, check my meta, will see how townie I am all the time

This is scummy.

i assumed that salsa was joking because of the laughing emote and constant talking about how anti-town actions do not equal pro-scum, which stems from personal experience more than anything (?)

Re-read my all the posts, you'll understand.

How about you do something proactive? What posts have you made in your eyes which would help us understand?

[JamesTheNames]

I haven’t said that, you're misinterpreting my thoughts completely.

Do me a favour and read your own 306.

You RE-READ my posts first.

I have. Twice.

[JamesTheNames]

Hi. I don't like this self vote. All it makes me certain of is that we have not hit a PR. Self-hammering only benefits scum, it makes it harder to detect bussing or not-bussing, it gives your partner less room to mess up, also depending on the roles, can have varying success. If I had to guess right now, I think we've hit a Mafia Goon, and that we're in Column C. Assuming they don't know who any PRs are, it would be wiser to give the PR less time to work out scum. (especially in Column C where there's either 1 or 0 night actions).

[JamesTheNames]

Last but not the least,

Re-read

my post with an

open mind

, thank you

@Ythan

, why don't you find some to time to smell your a** and get high on that

This was completely unnecessary.