Micro 1029: 8-Ball (but with Wolves) Game Over

[Taly]

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Bingle

, ask me question!!!

VOTE: Momrangal

[Taly]

Wisdom

, I demand a townread or I will meme Light Yagami all day phase long, don't test me-

[Taly]

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Bingle

, ask me question!!!

VOTE: Momrangal

Toucans prey upon ducks, right?

[Taly]

Bingle, ask me question!!!

Um....

Purple!

No, wait, Green!

PURPLE. I CHOOSE PURPLE.

Wisdom

, I demand a townread or I will meme Light Yagami all day phase long, don't test me-

VOTE: Wisdom To pressure you into giving a town read so I don't need to find out who or what or how heavy Light Yagami is

Don't worry, you'll find out when it's too late!

tipsyHiraki here - gonna avoid RVS all around baby

no smiley with glasses huh? bullshit man, bullshit

Who said we were in RVS?

v/la till Sunday

FUCK, what do I do with this?
Still demanding that townread or Light Yagami will never die.

VOTE: the worst

i have a sudden, strong feeling that scum are going to win this game

What makes you feel so?

[Taly]

Any warmer, fuzzier feelings? Yo, I need to feel some.

Or any reads and ideas about the 8ball?

[Taly]

I had a very weak thought of

Mom

-8ball but everybody in the thread posted between my vote on her and my post a few moments ago. Nobody seemed to want the wagon.

If you think

Wisdom

is scum, why not join

Imaginality

?

[Taly]

This is going to be fun.

[Taly]

Taly/Wisdom scumteam, game solved on pg 2.

I'd love to hear you justify a townread somewhere then, must be pretty easy to find reasons when you've got a solve.

[Taly]

Any warmer, fuzzier feelings? Yo, I need to feel some.

I actually think that they're antipartnery vibes, fite me.

It's certainly not going to be hard to fall into your pocket this game..

[Taly]

Noooo duckyyyy

Even

Mastina

has read me correctly once, why can't you-

[Taly]

tipsyHiraki here - gonna avoid RVS all around baby

no smiley with glasses huh? bullshit man, bullshit

If everyone avoids RVS we'd never get past RVS therefore avoiding RVS is anti-town, by the principles of Kantian universality.

Also keeping up the fiction that RVS is useful is what makes society work, like believing money and Pokemon cards have value.

VOTE: Hiraki for disrespecting Immanuel Kant and Pikachu

Trust me, the RVS comment is the least interesting aspect of

Hiraki's

slot right now.

it would disrupt our friendship dynamic

True lmao

But let's work together on this. Do you feel threatened by my vote on you? Instead of entertaining a solid question, I feel like you gave a cheeky response and have thus let someone else take a jab at me. If you really believed I were mafia, why shroud it with doubt and "maybe's"? It does not read as sincere. Is this an unfair assessment?

Location: Bad Player Jail

Don't you believe in

Hiraki's

cause

Ali

? You do seem to be familiar with them!

more people should sheep me ty

I'll help! Vote me guys!

[Taly]

Don't you believe in Hiraki's cause Ali? You do seem to be familiar with them!

this isn't even a funny joke

I wasn't joking. I like playing with

Alisae

and prodded for their input.

[Taly]

@Taly I'm not really sure there's a way I can deepen our convo in a way that would help me sort u rn.

Fine, I'll take this at face value.

UNVOTE:

Hate to disappoint ya,

Bingle

, but I want to see where this goes.

VOTE: Hiraki



Were you waiting for me to do this,

Hiraki

?

[Taly]

Do you feel threatened by my vote on you?

what part of this persists of 'working together' furthermore if he's town,

why should he care about your vote? isn't his objective to eliminate scum? not to make sure that he doesn't get voted out?

this pings me the most because it shows that taly potentially has an incorrect way of thinking OR is thinking correctly but in the wrong role

You answered your own question about my motives... My post was to understand better of

the worst's

mentality behind sheeping you.

But it doesn't seem like he has to worry much about placating me. He's got you coming to bat for him~

Instead of entertaining a solid question, I feel like you gave a cheeky response and have thus let someone else take a jab at me. If you really believed I were mafia, why shroud it with doubt and "maybe's"? It does not read as sincere. Is this an unfair assessment?

it's page 3

post edit - theworst let's fucking NAIL this game baby

And this post that outlines a grievance you have about me is 20 posts later than your vote on me.

VOTE: Taly

Since your 62 illustrates that you do actually scumread me - I'm assuming that your reason for believing I'm scum occurred before the post that you're nitpicking here. 54

So this reply to me is just fluff. A filler.

[Taly]

I think I'm never the 8ball here, everyone but Imaginality knows me and doubt they think I'm limmable

Taly has decent chances of being it

Am I likelier the 8ball than I am wagoned-scum?

Are the two worlds mutually exlusive? (Could I be scum and 8ball)?

VOTE: Hiraki for disrespecting Immanuel Kant and Pikachu

Trust me, the RVS comment is the least interesting aspect of

Hiraki's

slot right now.

What did you find more interesting about Hiraki's posts at the time you wrote that?

He called for people to sheep him 52. I interpreted multiple potential motives there:

1) Hiraki

genuinely believes I'm scum and is town.

2) Hiraki

is scum trying to gain influence by projecting confidence.

3) Hiraki

is hunting for both scum, town, and the 8ball - and that his vote is not just to solve me, but also to read other players.

I was disappointed by his latest posts, since motive

3

seems least likely right now.

[Taly]

actually 64 is just to convince other people, 29 is the start when you said "who said we're in RVS" as if it was

1) supposed to propel the game in anyway
2) supposed to give any substance to the game
3) be anything less than an annoying little hehe

but i knew that it wouldn't convince people nor be the last time you did something of that nature - if it was, i would've unvoted you

I genuinely don't understand the vex toward the

"who said we're in RVS"

comment. It was true to me when I made that post since I wanted to engage into this game seriously. And even though that comment had humor to it,

who are you to judge that the comment was useless?

Plus,

even if my comment were genuinely void of substance on the butt-ass beginning of page 2 and did not serve any purpose for the game

- why does that make me scum?

Your language towards me in

@point 3

is rather aggressive. It feels forced.

just to put this in perspective to everyone else

i even started the post with this - which you decided to ignore because you got rid of it from your post?

Sure, I'd love to do a quote-by-quote wall with you. Make it as inaccessible for all 6 other players to read as possible.

No but really, the significance of that sentence is lost on me. It's a tonal positioner.

like if your entire point is that i never explained why i was voting you in the first place - that's correct, i did not do that

I guess you're waiting for a time when I have more suspicion on me and it's plausible to eliminate me - is when you will state your scumread.

That's what I gathered from your mentality and approach from the bolded and underlined above. You're either confbiased that I am scum off of a comment you didn't subjectively like, or you want to eliminate the player at L-2.

[Taly]

wait,

TW

unvoted?

[Taly]

oh I'm at L-3, my mistake.

I need to eat and shower and probably burn some incense hehehe.

[Taly]

OK, if you're confident in your scumread, then go find my partner.

I'll trade funny GIFs with you, man. But a 1v1 would be a waste of time.

[Taly]

If

mastina

can see the light, so can you

Alisae <3

[Taly]

We'd know if Taly were the 8-ball, as the rules clearly say the 8-ball will flip as 8-ball if eliminated. And besides, whether or not the mod announces it, it'll be obvious by whether scum get a kill that night.

All of which is to say the "if you flipped scum I could consider it" seems more likely to me to come from scum talking to town than from town. Scum talking to town know the first part of the statement ("if you flip scum" can't occur so are more likely to give a careless consequence "I could consider it", compared with town who believe it's a genuine possibility to consider.

You're right, I don't consider Taly flipping scum a real possibility which is why I didn't run the simulation in my head and

didn't realize he'd flip 8ball

Was there a typo here? I need you to clarify

Wisdom

.

~~~

As for whether I think

Alisae

is town? I have a pretty half-baked read on them that I'm rectifying.

This doesn't feel historically like what I've encountered as scum from them. However, their recent post begs to differ.

I also doubt they're a partner to

Hiraki

, who I do currently scumread. I doubt that scum will find themselves on the same wagon much in this setup. My wagon doesn't have the traction for them to eliminate me. Plus

Alisae

needs to try much harder to take me down

The slot has been inoffensive. I'm watching them.

For context, I have hydra'd with

Ali

as both alignments and have played with them solo when they've been both alignments. So they're right up there with

the worst

in terms of my familiarity in mafia.

[Taly]

This doesn't feel historically like what I've encountered as scum from them. However, their recent post begs to differ.

Oh this may be unclear

I mean that

Alisae

would probably disagree that I lean town on them via meta. Not that I suddenly suspect them anymore than usual.

[Taly]

We'd know if Taly were the 8-ball, as the rules clearly say the 8-ball will flip as 8-ball if eliminated. And besides, whether or not the mod announces it, it'll be obvious by whether scum get a kill that night.

All of which is to say the "if you flipped scum I could consider it" seems more likely to me to come from scum talking to town than from town. Scum talking to town know the first part of the statement ("if you flip scum" can't occur so are more likely to give a careless consequence "I could consider it", compared with town who believe it's a genuine possibility to consider.

You're right, I don't consider Taly flipping scum a real possibility which is why I didn't run the simulation in my head and

didn't realize he'd flip 8ball

Was there a typo here? I need you to clarify

Wisdom

.

Was there a typo here? I need you to clarify Wisdom.

No

The reason I point this out is because I read the bolded as though you knew I was 8ball. A potential slip. That's what I want clarified.

[Taly]

Uif Taly thought I could be 8ball, why vote the 8ball

'cause it's fun.

Even so, his motivation is right there in that post
He thought scum might join the wagon

This too, but my thought was more broad than

Mom's

slot. I figured almost anyone could be the 8ball, so I hopped on somebody already being voted in RVS to see how much fire the wagon got.

But there was some nuance, though. Since this plist is full of veteran players,

Mom

is the most recent joindate with the least experience I've had with. So I wanted to vote someone I thought

could

reasonably be 8ball.

IE, I probably wasn't going to bite an RVS wagon on

the worst

,

Wisdom

, or

Alisae

because I see them as pretty strong players and unlikely to be eliminated D1.

Right out of RVS?

Honestly, this post right here:

I had a very weak thought of

Mom

-8ball but everybody in the thread posted between my vote on her and my post a few moments ago. Nobody seemed to want the wagon.

If you think

Wisdom

is scum, why not join

Imaginality

?

Had

FAR MORE

to do with me trying to sort

the worst

than it did your slot,

Mom

. Even me talking about your slot was a gauge to see if

the worst

would comment on it.

:3 Hope that clears some stuff up!

[Taly]

I think Wisdom is scum and Momrangal is the 8 ball. wbu?

I mean, this is a lovely post to return to later in the game.

[Taly]

I'm soulreading good vibes from

the worst

now. Shit.

He's fooled me with his cute yellow feathers before.

[Taly]

Suddenly, I feel better about punishing you with a vote when you succumb to paranoia 28. Your fear tastes sweet.

[Taly]

the worst

, are you open to explaining that

alisae

vote, or would that spoil something my bird brain isn't seeing?

(not replying is also a reply)

[Taly]

Blegh. My vote on

Hiraki

feels like a vanity wagon now.

[Taly]

Why state that you shouldn't be townread?

[Taly]

I don't think it's a stupid question. Your reply makes me think you're town.

[Taly]

Youplastic.
You could be baiting yourself for multiple reasons.

Scum-Ali could benefit from surviving an early game wagon because suspicion could be weaker later. Since they would have already taken heat.

Town Ali may genuinely be uncertain of their stance in this game and what to do about it, so being overt with that notion through Fluffy m&m posts is a signal. Or an attempt to gain a foothold.

You could be scum trying to find someone to bite, but if I was your target, you aren't successful. I don't see you preying on other slots or vying for influence.

So I believe you actually have trouble orienting yourself to this game.

This isn't a stretch because this is an old plist.

[Taly]

LMFAO YOUPLASTIC?
WTF phone

Ali, youplastic. That's your alignment

[Taly]

Good talk. I have work now so

[Taly]

Some thoughts

Mom's

push on

TW

reads slightly town.

Why aren't there more votes on

Hiraki

?

Bingle

, why are my good vibes with

the worst

worth more to comment on than

Wisdom's

?

Imaginality

, who is most likely a partner to

Wisdom

?

MOD-
Is there a deadline?

[Taly]

The reason I point this out is because I read the bolded as though you knew I was 8ball. A potential slip. That's what I want clarified.

No, you misread. Imaginality was talking about the possibility of you being scum and 8ball, and that's what I was responding to

Just gonna cut this off at the knees: That was 100% not a scum slip. When discussing the hypothetical that you are the eightball, the presumption that you would flip 8 ball is natural.

Hopefully we don't have a week long argument about whether the obviously NAI post is a scumslip every game I'm scum in.

now

this

is a scumslip

But like, it reads like a potential slip to me too. Djdoxjsklsjshs

[Taly]

Daytalk is enabled.
By default, the wolfteam does not get a nightkill.
Before each day phase (including Day 1), the Wolves pick one player to be the "8-Ball". If this player is eliminated, they flip as the 8-Ball, and wolves get a nightkill.
After each elimination, wolves can change their 8-ball.

I'm unsure. I read the rules as wolves not being able to change 8ball until the initial 8ball is eliminated.

@MOD - Can scum change the 8ball each night, even if the 8ball was not eliminated?

P-edit

It occurs to me that I forgot to ask STD which method he's using to make deadlines a thing in this game, and I should probably do so.

Pm'd the dargons here.

Also worth noting that No Elimination is specifically not allowed to be 8 ball.

[Taly]

4. Please do not ask me questions in the thread. Use PMs. However, it's OK to point out any vote tabulation mistakes I make in-thread.

Oh right oopsies

[Taly]

The reason I point this out is because I read the bolded as though you knew I was 8ball. A potential slip. That's what I want clarified.

No, you misread. Imaginality was talking about the possibility of you being scum and 8ball, and that's what I was responding to

Just gonna cut this off at the knees: That was 100% not a scum slip. When discussing the hypothetical that you are the eightball, the presumption that you would flip 8 ball is natural.

Hopefully we don't have a week long argument about whether the obviously NAI post is a scumslip every game I'm scum in.

now

this

is a scumslip

But like, it reads like a potential slip to me too. Djdoxjsklsjshs

i'd be interested in you expanding, i've had growing concerns about bingle.

Just the

"every game I'm scum in"

sounds like an admission since it seemed

Bingle

presumed that the

Wisdom

post was a red herring. Why would the first part of that sentence be true but the next be false?

Like, I can't be misreading again can I?

And why hold off on those concerns ducky, you waiting for me to be your shield?

[Taly]

My pool right now is

{Bingle/Wisdom/Hiraki/Imaginality}

.

I'm unlikely to be swayed on

Mom

. I don't want ducky eliminated unless he just fucks up.

Ali

feels limbaity and my defense button has been pushed for that slot.

[Taly]

Admittedly, I had early townpings on

Bingle/Wisdom

but I wantto read them more critically. Also POE would suggest

Hiraki/Imaginality

and I have no basis to entertain that reality.

To be fair,

TW/Ali/Mom

townvibes have all been pretty recent. Within the last 30 hr.

[Taly]

Hopefully we don't have a week long argument about whether the obviously NAI post is a scumslip every game I play.

Omfg you're right. Apologies. Fucking duck.

IT'S LATE. I'M GOING TO BED.

[Taly]

No elims are bad
Scum now have the info to change the 8ball into someone likely getting limd whereas it was a blind guess in pregame
Let's just flip Ali

No. I stand by the read I made yesterday.

Ali you wanna live?
Read my points about Imaginality and vote there

THIS IS WEIRD,

WISDOM

.

You're trying to get someone that you've voteparked

(Alisae)

on to agree with a scumcase you have on another player,

Imaginality

, and if the first player who is about to get limmed doesn't follow with an

Imaginality

vote, you are perfectly content to eliminate.

Walk me where you think

Ali/Imaginality

S/S is possible.

And unless I've missed something, that's the sum total of your points against me. Whereas this push on me is a point against you, it fits the 'scum wanting to get players who are suspicious of them eliminated' motif.

Then why is

Wisdom's

vote on

Alisae

and not you? It's less likely that you will be eliminated at this point in time, so what does scum-

Wisdom

have to gain from voting a more-voted player while countering you?

Imaginality's tone still feels manipulative to me

Read your ISO the past 2 pages, doll.

Yeah but that's me
Does anyone have experience with imaginality and can assure me he's like me?

He fooled me when I was my alt -

Cupcake Butterfly

, I thought he was town but was scum who kind of pocketed me. I don't have a solid meta on him. He's a logic based player.

Hopefully we don't have a week long argument about whether the obviously NAI post is a scumslip every game I play.

Omfg you're right. Apologies. Fucking duck.

IT'S LATE. I'M GOING TO BED.

GOTTEM

reaction to being epically pranked was kinda towny though smh

Wis atm I think it's either you or him

if i had one bullet and wisdom and imaginality rn i think i'd shoot wisdom

except i'd cry if it was a miselim

Ducky, why vote

Alisae

? We could be a powerful town trio that gets 8ball'ed and eliminated one after the other. It would be iconic if you joined.

Imaginality also said I could be scum with Wis
that's kinda weirdchamp
I don't think Wis would just bus me at the start of the game if we were partners. Hell randing scum w/ wis would probably actually be exciting?

Do you ever see

Imaginality/Wisdom

as a duo here?

Imaginality also said I could be scum with Wis
that's kinda weirdchamp
I don't think Wis would just bus me at the start of the game if we were partners. Hell randing scum w/ wis would probably actually be exciting?

I don't see early day 1 votes as bussing, too easy to hop off onto other wagons by end of day. If anything it's convenient minor bit of distancing.

I don't have a scum read on you. My read on you is pretty neutral so far, you are playing different than you did in the other game I was in with you (OMB) where you replaced our as scum but I don't place much weight on meta (aka I'm too busy to meta properly (aka too lazy) so I'm keeping a watching brief.

My post where I listed you (and Mom and the worst) was in response to the "if Wisdom is scum who's the partner?" question just looking at how different slots have interacted with Wisdom.

Taking other play into account I'd say if Wisdom flips scum Mom is my main suspect. But she's not scummy enough in isolation that I'd vote her over Wisdom today.

Wis atm I think it's either you or him

Honestly you make me think you're just scum looking at a tvt and eating popcorn with such posts

This is a valid consideration. Especially with how Ali ramps up the aggro right afterwards. Seems like Ali could be scum feeling under pressure from your post:

Like ya you could be town right on scum
or you can be scum trying to bully me into helping you complete your objective

how is going about this in this manor going to get me to help you?

You want to READ me?
Leave me the fuck alone and do what I do best, which is trying to read the actions of the other players in the table.

If you think Imaginality is scum, go fucking vote it and push it. It would be way more productive than voting me while also trying to 1v1 the guy and if people want to vote me you can just swap back anyways if u insist on maintaining this stance that I'm scum

Wisdom, you were calling my earlier post manipulative. Ali's #262, now that's manipulative.
I buy the popcorning scum theory.

VOTE: Alisae

Ali warning you not to push her to decide between us too soon makes me think I'm the 8-ball and she's wanting to see if there's enough interest to get me eliminated over you while perfectly happy to see you go also.[/quote]

What the fuck did I just read?

What have

Bingle

,

Mom

,

the worst

,

Hiraki

and

I

have done than not lean into the 1v1 between

Imaginality/Wisdom

?

Like, y'all pull

Alisae's

teeth for a vote when she's at L-1 or L-2, and then are content to eliminate them - because they won't join you guys on your quest to eliminate each other?

No.

One or both of

Imaginality/Wisdom

is scum. I'm reading some hot bullshit here.

This is a nightmare

I agree

i don't see wisdom flipping scum here, still don't really have a good read on imaginality, still think ali & taly will flip red

zzz

WRONG. at least 50% of your scum team solve is wrong and I believe 100% is, so change your ways or we all die, if you want to call yourself a towny.

[Taly]

No elims are bad
Scum now have the info to change the 8ball into someone likely getting limd whereas it was a blind guess in pregame
Let's just flip Ali

No. I stand by the read I made yesterday.

Ali you wanna live?
Read my points about Imaginality and vote there

THIS IS WEIRD,

WISDOM

.

You're trying to get someone that you've voteparked

(Alisae)

on to agree with a scumcase you have on another player,

Imaginality

, and if the first player who is about to get limmed doesn't follow with an

Imaginality

vote, you are perfectly content to eliminate.

Walk me where you think

Ali/Imaginality

S/S is possible.

And unless I've missed something, that's the sum total of your points against me. Whereas this push on me is a point against you, it fits the 'scum wanting to get players who are suspicious of them eliminated' motif.

Then why is

Wisdom's

vote on

Alisae

and not you? It's less likely that you will be eliminated at this point in time, so what does scum-

Wisdom

have to gain from voting a more-voted player while countering you?

Imaginality's tone still feels manipulative to me

Read your ISO the past 2 pages, doll.

Yeah but that's me
Does anyone have experience with imaginality and can assure me he's like me?

He fooled me when I was my alt -

Cupcake Butterfly

, I thought he was town but was scum who kind of pocketed me. I don't have a solid meta on him. He's a logic based player.

Hopefully we don't have a week long argument about whether the obviously NAI post is a scumslip every game I play.

Omfg you're right. Apologies. Fucking duck.

IT'S LATE. I'M GOING TO BED.

GOTTEM

reaction to being epically pranked was kinda towny though smh

Wis atm I think it's either you or him

if i had one bullet and wisdom and imaginality rn i think i'd shoot wisdom

except i'd cry if it was a miselim

Ducky, why vote

Alisae

? We could be a powerful town trio that gets 8ball'ed and eliminated one after the other. It would be iconic if you joined.

Imaginality also said I could be scum with Wis
that's kinda weirdchamp
I don't think Wis would just bus me at the start of the game if we were partners. Hell randing scum w/ wis would probably actually be exciting?

Do you ever see

Imaginality/Wisdom

as a duo here?

Imaginality also said I could be scum with Wis
that's kinda weirdchamp
I don't think Wis would just bus me at the start of the game if we were partners. Hell randing scum w/ wis would probably actually be exciting?

I don't see early day 1 votes as bussing, too easy to hop off onto other wagons by end of day. If anything it's convenient minor bit of distancing.

I don't have a scum read on you. My read on you is pretty neutral so far, you are playing different than you did in the other game I was in with you (OMB) where you replaced our as scum but I don't place much weight on meta (aka I'm too busy to meta properly (aka too lazy) so I'm keeping a watching brief.

My post where I listed you (and Mom and the worst) was in response to the "if Wisdom is scum who's the partner?" question just looking at how different slots have interacted with Wisdom.

Taking other play into account I'd say if Wisdom flips scum Mom is my main suspect. But she's not scummy enough in isolation that I'd vote her over Wisdom today.

Wis atm I think it's either you or him

Honestly you make me think you're just scum looking at a tvt and eating popcorn with such posts

This is a valid consideration. Especially with how Ali ramps up the aggro right afterwards. Seems like Ali could be scum feeling under pressure from your post:

Like ya you could be town right on scum
or you can be scum trying to bully me into helping you complete your objective

how is going about this in this manor going to get me to help you?

You want to READ me?
Leave me the fuck alone and do what I do best, which is trying to read the actions of the other players in the table.

If you think Imaginality is scum, go fucking vote it and push it. It would be way more productive than voting me while also trying to 1v1 the guy and if people want to vote me you can just swap back anyways if u insist on maintaining this stance that I'm scum

Wisdom, you were calling my earlier post manipulative. Ali's #262, now that's manipulative.
I buy the popcorning scum theory.

VOTE: Alisae

Ali warning you not to push her to decide between us too soon makes me think I'm the 8-ball and she's wanting to see if there's enough interest to get me eliminated over you while perfectly happy to see you go also.[/quote]

What the fuck did I just read?

What have

Bingle

,

Mom

,

the worst

,

Hiraki

and

I

have done than not lean into the 1v1 between

Imaginality/Wisdom

?

Like, y'all pull

Alisae's

teeth for a vote when she's at L-1 or L-2, and then are content to eliminate them - because they won't join you guys on your quest to eliminate each other?

No.

One or both of

Imaginality/Wisdom

is scum. I'm reading some hot bullshit here.

This is a nightmare

I agree

i don't see wisdom flipping scum here, still don't really have a good read on imaginality, still think ali & taly will flip red

zzz

WRONG. at least 50% of your scum team solve is wrong and I believe 100% is, so change your ways or we all die, if you want to call yourself a towny.

[Taly]

In post 262, Alisae wrote:
Like ya you could be town right on scum
or you can be scum trying to bully me into helping you complete your objective

how is going about this in this manor going to get me to help you?

You want to READ me?
Leave me the fuck alone and do what I do best, which is trying to read the actions of the other players in the table.

If you think Imaginality is scum, go fucking vote it and push it. It would be way more productive than voting me while also trying to 1v1 the guy and if people want to vote me you can just swap back anyways if u insist on maintaining this stance that I'm scum


Wisdom, you were calling my earlier post manipulative. Ali's #262, now that's manipulative.
I buy the popcorning scum theory.

VOTE: Alisae

Ali warning you not to push her to decide between us too soon makes me think I'm the 8-ball and she's wanting to see if there's enough interest to get me eliminated over you while perfectly happy to see you go also.

[/quote]

Fucking quotes. This was

Imaginality

voting NOT ME.

[Taly]

I double posted too?

I've embarrassed myself one post after the other in the last 24 hrs.

[Taly]

Clarifying that I did not vote Alisae. That was a preview error I only caught after my post. Apologies for any confusion

I'll get to the thread later.

[Taly]

I need someone to sit me down and explain their scumread on Ali because I'm not feeling this.

[Taly]

I think im currently making the 2nd or 3rd best vote, will be around a bunch before end of day. Someone talk me off this ledge.

Ali low 8ball equity unless y'all think e is jestering (I don't; Ali is just innately funny)

Why not go for the vote you think this best?

[Taly]

I just don't understand why scum-

Alisae

would vote

Wisdom

here.

The only town-motivated reason I can think for

Wisdom

to try and get

Imaginality V Alisae

going was to see if they were partners or if

Alisae

would take a bite out of

Imaginality

for survivalism.

Walk me where you think Ali/Imaginality S/S is possible.

Theyre two of my three scumreads
But even disregarding that I dont see where you take issue
If Ali is town

I'm asking him to go for my other scumread and convince me to vote there

If Ali is scum

Im making him vote one of my other scumreads

There's only 2 scum in this game. One of your scumreads must be incorrect.

Your assessments strike as odd to me because your trying to point

Alisae

towards going after and eliminating someone you ALREADY THINK is scum.

Not to figure out if there's a fallacy in your reads.

The threat that you want to eliminate

Alisae

:

Ali you wanna live?
Read my points about Imaginality and vote there

Followed by expecting them to vote there for their survival is largely a behavior I would associate to be scum. So your interaction with

Alisae

felt like a

"gotcha"

moment when they didn't vote

Imaginality

for you.

[Taly]

Taly, Bingle, Mom
Do you think there are two scum among {me, Alisae, Wisdom}? If yes who? If no which pair are the most likely to be TvTing?

I think there is 1 scum in that group,

Wisdom/Imaginality

S-S is far-fetched, really doubt it's

Alisae

.

I feel weird about how

Wisdom V Imaginality

heated up only accelerated

Alisae's

wagon, who was already voted by one of them. That trajectory doesn't read as sincere or logical because

Alisae

didn't actively fuel one side of the argument over the other. I get that that is what

Wisdom/Imaginality

scumread

Alisae

for, but I don't think it's unlikely that town would refrain from giving a solid stance, or not have one.

Wisdom, you were calling my earlier post manipulative. Ali's #262, now that's manipulative.
I buy the popcorning scum theory.

VOTE: Alisae

Ali warning you not to push her to decide between us too soon makes me think I'm the 8-ball and she's wanting to see if there's enough interest to get me eliminated over you while perfectly happy to see you go also.

How does this thought change with

Alisae

voting

Wisdom

?

Oh also, explain where I "pull Alisae's teeth for a vote when she's at L-1 or L-2" because that's a blatant misrep.

Oh sorry... you didn't pull

Alisae's

, you agreed with

Wisdom's

theory that

Alisae

was scum for not wanting to be pushed into voting you...

What were your expectations of both slots, assuming you considered town motivation for both of them?

[Taly]

because i want someone else to do it first so i can sheep them and pretend it was my idea all along

Is this a clue? It can't be someone currently voted or recently voted?

That only leaves

Bingle

and

Momrangal

?

Other slots have my attention at the moment.

[Taly]

I feel like I should change my vote at the moment but I really need more time than 15~ hr to sort

Wisdom/Imaginality

indefinitely.

I still scumread

Hiraki

but it has wavered since he's actually giving some thoughts. My scumread still remains because it feels like their posts consists of asking for a simplified answer to something instead of having some depth of thought, and their reservation for seemingly very confident reads.

Granted, I'm biased in a way against him because I disagree with his solve.

[Taly]

Why

Bingle

as the most likely partner,

Ali

?

[Taly]

Mmm, I can see what you're thinking but by himself,

Bingle

doesn't read as scum to me.

Where are you at with

Hiraki

?

I need to get off tonight soon but I really need

the worst/Imaginality/Wisdom

to be posting so I can have a final vote decision... which will probably be 3-5 hr before deadline when I wake up.

But that's probably too late to vote.

Also reading back and seeing

Imaginality/Wisdom

townreading me, haha, I'm going to feel like shit if I mislim here.

Gun to head at this moment, I'd be voting

Wisdom

. The

"If x is town, I'll ask them to convince me to vote a scumread I have"

is an almost unrealistic level of confbias, seems more likely to be scum. The

Ali

scumread also feels understated but it has been apparent since 71, so it's more difficult to gauge how naturally it generated.

Though, I don't follow

Imaginality's

trajectory, and I am waiting on answers from them. I also disagree with their POV on thinking they're the 8ball in most any scenario or what he intended with his believing

Wisdom

slipped by TMIing a townread on me.

I mean, if

Imaginality

wanted to push the notion that

Wisdom

TMI'ed me as town, then comments like:

It's obvious I think Taly isn't obvtown (I do lean town in Taly but I don't see anyone as obvtown yet).

are lukewarm in sorting me, and not congruent with the strength of suspicion towards

Wisdom

. Is this true,

Imaginality

?

[Taly]

I'm going to bed, but I think I've thought as far as my bird brain will take me and I think I've given

Wisdom/Imaginality

enough to address to help me sort.

[Taly]

Fuck. Why does scum-

Imaginality

even throw out

Imaginality/Wisdom/Ali

as a T/T/T possibility this close to deadline. He's opened himself for scrutiny and is at threat of elimination the most outside of

Alisae

.

My guess is, he doesn't. So that's a towny reply.


Don't think Wiadoms "you just find my playtime scummy" but he does justify himself still so that's a point in his favor

[Taly]

VOTE: alisae

ALI NO

[Taly]

VOTE: Momrangal

[Taly]

HOLY SHIT THATS L1NOT HAMMER

THANK FYCK

ALMOST HAD A HEART ATTACK

[Taly]

I've eliminated people with no votes on them quicker.

[Taly]

I've done some stunning elo plays with worse thread dynamics.

[Taly]

Hmmm, yeah I can agree. But aside from on

Hiraki

, I have the least confidence in a townread on. Ughh

So has any of

Wisdom's

posts given you doubt that he's scum?

[Taly]

If you are town voting yourself makes zero sense
Especially if you happen to be the 8ball
You just take away the info of the 5th person on your wagon from us

But you're probably just scum so

Wait, so why would

Alisae

have his 8ball equity and be likely scum at once? Or is the 8ball just a very low possibility you're deliberating here?

[Taly]

High 8ball equity*

Damn phone

honestly I hope y'all miselim Taly.
Actually do it. I really want to see y'all miselim Taly. I think it would be really funny.

LOL NO GO TO SLEEP

[Taly]

VOTE: Wisdom

Ok I think this is the best vote still.

[Taly]

the worst

unvoted you so you're at L1

[Taly]

Lmao

I only inspire confidence as an ally, when it is recognized that I am an ally.

Not based on any other qualities I have.

[Taly]

I'm not deliberating any possibility, I was referring to Ali arguing he might be the 8ball
And I'm saying that it makes zero sense to selfvote as town and especially as 8ball so he's full of shit
Do you need a road map to every sentence I write?

Town self-voting at x-1 is dumb in any game but in this game where there's the added chance it gives scum an NK it's twice as bad so twice as unlikely town do that.

I buy that town!Alisae would be unhappy about being about being the likely elimination, but I don't buy that town!Alisae would self-vote in this setup.

Also I don't like Ali town reading Mom just because Mom is against eliminating Ali.

It's 12:25am here, 4 hours to deadline. I think I can be around another rhour or so but probably not right up to deadline.

I'll vote Wisdom (or Mom, no one else though) if the choice is that or No-lim, but I still believe Ali is our best chance of getting a scumflip.

I disagree with the point that both of you make here in regard to

Alisae

being more likely scum for the self-vote.

Since an elimination was not reached in time, we can never have a solid idea of who was the D1 8ball, nor have clarity of

Alisae's

slot. It was highly likely that

Alisae

would be eliminated, so for

Alisae

to only go after another wagon at the opportunity to eliminate a scumread, I don't think self-voting is a negative.

VOTE: ali

I don’t really trust this sudden shift to Wis, makes me worried he’s an 8 ball, tbh.

glad it wasn't just me

I also disagree with the point that

Wisdom

was much or anything like a hypothetical 8ball push in nature. Unless you believe the team is literally

Alisae/I

, which does not align with what I think scum would even look like in this setup.

Why would scum push for the 8ball at the butt-ass last minute of the dayphase?

~

I'm almost certain the 8ball currently resides in

{Imaginality/Wisdom/Alisae/Taly}

. The good thing is that town can actually make more informed assumptions about this and have reason to sort rather than scramble for a wagon.

the worst

, why vote

Imaginality

?

Alisae

, I want you to be candid, did you really believe that you were going to be eliminated D1 - and why do you think that you aren't now?

Mom

, if

I/Imaginality

was your solve, why keep your vote on

the worst

?

[Taly]

VOTE: Alisae

nani

DUCK, I GAVE YOU HOMEWORK:

the worst, why vote Imaginality?

[
I disagree with the point that both of you make here in regard to

Alisae

being more likely scum for the self-vote.

Since an elimination was not reached in time, we can never have a solid idea of who was the D1 8ball, nor have clarity of

Alisae's

slot. It was highly likely that

Alisae

would be eliminated, so for

Alisae

to only go after another wagon at the opportunity to eliminate a scumread, I don't think self-voting is a negative.

I'm bit sure what your final sentence here means. Can you clarify?

Let's presume that a town motivation for

Alisae

to self-vote is to give town better information about the 8ball. Why would scum self-implode when someone is trying to derail their wagon, and that a no elimination can be secured when there is no consensus?

It is arguable that self-voting as scum is playing against wincon because a no-elim D1 would grant scum a stronger idea of a more successful 8ball elimination target. On the other hand, town has the intention on giving clarity to the playerlist, and an

Alisae

elimination would.

Alisae

didn't bullshit a read on any other player that could've been eliminated outside like

Wisdom

, like

Imaginality

or

Mom

. They even discouraged my vote on

Mom

, ignored

the worst's

call on

imaginality

and stuck to

Wisdom

with 400 when it was possible that wagon had allure.

So I believe that they voted for themselves as resignation rather than spite, and decided to pursue

Wisdom

at the end because there was a chance to secure an elimination on a scumread rather than themselves.

I also disagree with the point that

Wisdom

was much or anything like a hypothetical 8ball push in nature. Unless you believe the team is literally

Alisae/I

, which does not align with what I think scum would even look like in this setup.

Why would scum push for the 8ball at the butt-ass last minute of the dayphase?

First of all, I think an 8 ball push would have come from exactly one scum player. Both scum hard pushing to get an eightball elim would be dumb. Second, I think a wagon on a player who was largely unsuspected prior to the end of day that came out of nowhere when scum are looking to get a specific elimination in is largely suspicious, yes. Third, you two weren't the only ones pushing Wis at EoD, imaginality and ducky had expressed willingness too. Finally:

Deadline:

(expired on 2021-09-23 12:19:23)

SCRAMBLE TIME

So... Yeah. I think it's entirely reasonable that there was scum somewhere in {Taly/Alisae/duck/imaginality} and that was why the sudden interest in Wisdom at "the butt-ass last minute".

Where is your read on

Wisdom

in all of this?

I also disagree with the point that Wisdom was much or anything like a hypothetical 8ball push in nature. Unless you believe the team is literally Alisae/I, which does not align with what I think scum would even look like in this setup.

well

Vote: Alisae

Why not vote me? The count has been reset.

[Taly]

I left school for a reason Taly!!

Let's see if this motivates you to re-enroll.

VOTE: the worst

Evading me D1 is plausible, not D2.

Also guys vote for quick night
Lets not wait for 48 hours every time just for an 8ball choice

I voted for quick night. I actually want people to claim whether or not they did so.

Hiraki actually scumreads Taly
Maybe guy is just washed

I don't know if I believe

Hiraki's

read on me anymore. I hardly did but I figured it could be real by EoD1. Now I just don't follow it.

But

Alisae

, no worries! Let's be constructive.

I think

Bingle's

EoD1 stance on your slot was very half-assed, but what's a scum motivation to target

the worst

?

[Taly]

Wisdom

, I am not pleased with our recent interactions.

If you so believe that my resistance on

Alisae's

wagon and the read there is misled, I want you to counter my recent points or try to convince me.

P-edit

i voted for quick night

NANI

HIRAKI

WORKING WITH ME?

[Taly]

Why assume that you are? I have no reason that would suggest such.

[Taly]

I'm around

But not

Puppies had worms, bby turns 1 lots od crazies rhis past week

Sorry to hear that! Hope the puppies are OK

[Taly]

Fucking thank you

House

, my excitement for this game has magnified.

I'll reward you with a GIF that accurately depicts my alignment.

Seeking replacement for Hiraki.

another head in this game too?

please be

titus

please be

titu-

* +20 other users exist*

OMG I DON'T KNOW.

(I wish

Alisae/Hiraki

good luck from rainbows!)

[Taly]

Oh great. So at Ali was heavily suspected on d1 this slot was probably chosen to be the 8-ball for d2, do that my lim would cost town 2 players.

This sucks.

Somebody, interact with me. Find me.

I derailed your slots elimination EOD1 and I'll derail it again, I don't give any fucks I'LL 1v6 THIS PLAYERLIST IF I HAVE TO.

VOTE: Wisdom

VOTE: ali

I don’t really trust this sudden shift to Wis, makes me worried he’s an 8 ball, tbh.

This.

Is.

Not.

A.

Real.

Thought.

No scum team picks Wisdom as 8-ball on d1, unless they know he rolled jester or someshit.

This is so candidly similar to

Alisae's

POV that I really don't think

House

fakes this information after an hour of scrolling through the game. The fact that

House's

reads don't mirror the rest of

Alisae's

list is what sells this as likelier to be genuine.

[Taly]

You know what, I don't think my vote on

the worst

will pressure him to talk anymore than me bugging the shit out of him with quotes and questions.

VOTE: Wisdom

p-edit

House

, my reads are looking like this:

House/Alisae~imaginality

the worst~Mom~Bingle~Hiraki Slot

Wisdom

Yes, there is order - from most confident to least confident in the respective tier.

[Taly]

@House

I'm inclined to agree after

the worst's

recent vote and

Hiraki

having a more mellow disposition towards me.

I wouldn't worry too much about

Hiraki's

replace out That can be resolved post-game if resolution is necessary.

Mom's talymaginality solve is towny

I want to hear your rationale for this.

[Taly]

omg i love bats, second fave animal to toucans

[Taly]

You know what, I don't think my vote on the worst will pressure him to talk anymore than me bugging the shit out of him with quotes and questions.

Yeah… except him dodging all the quotes and questions is the scum activity that makes the vote good. Cmon Taly. Really.

Hm. Perhaps I’m the only person in the thread not irrationally terrified by Wisdom.

Oh, my eyes are glued to duck. But I've not been a fan of

Wisdom's

replies toward me ever since EoD1 and their thread presence has fallen significantly upon the lack of

Alisae

elimination.

Also, you didn't answer my direct question about your read of

Wisdom

. I want to hear.

[Taly]

Mom, Alisae, and Taly are all easier to d1 than Wisdom.

I like to think I've become more difficult to eliminate as the years go by.

[Taly]

Mom, Alisae, and Taly are all easier to d1 than Wisdom.

I like to think I've become more difficult to eliminate as the years go by.

Not suggesting you're LHF, by any means~

[quote="In post 516, "Morning Tweet"]
pockieted[/quote]

[Taly]

No, Taly. Get back in my pocket. Remember the kittens.

Fuck this is hard, man.

why doesn't anyone want me in their pocket?

'Cause you're in my pocket.

[Taly]

Lmao this

the worst V Bingle

is so comical, it was not a 1v1 I would have foreseen to start off D2. I'll leave my commentary at that for tonight.

(Hint: I'm implying a read here.)

[Taly]

Actually, I'll be more upfront since my tonal range this game is expanding.

the worst

is a player I have a hard time distinguishing their alignment because in almost every game we have played, we were T/S and was fooled by the other AND promptly NKed the other. The only T/T game was when we deathtunneled and then I flaked that game.

I can't presume to know

the worst's

brain, but I am weary of how vague they are playing this game. It's almost too fuzzy of thinking for them, and I feel like minus the

imaginality/Wisdom

interactions, they have suspected other players around moments that they have been pressured by them. I wonder if it's a deflection.

But I also wonder why

Bingle

feels compelled to defend

Wisdom

. It parallels my defense and dynamic of

Alisae

, but I doubt

Bingle/Wisdom

are as familiar with each other as I am with

Alisae/I

. It smells of a T/S dynamic from them, but since a S/S

House-Aliaae/the worst

is an ungodly duo to imagine (and unlikely), I don't think their mindmeld is suspect

I understand how fence sitty this is and I kind of don't care because I want to press

Wisdom

, we got 6 days.

With that, I'm heading off for the night.

[Taly]

What u think about me Taly

The willingness to cooperate and align with other players while also still trying to take time to read through the game to develop reads is a good start imo.

Usually I'm not this loose lipped with townreads of any degree but the likelihood of an NK is much reduced in this setup.

[Taly]

There are pretty few games that have had a trajectory that I expected less than this one. This is making for a passive toucan dayphase.

the worst

-

But I also wonder why Bingle feels compelled to defend Wisdom.

i feel like bingle is
- missing a vibe read
- working on a consistent trajectory

he feels forced

Specific posts, please?

I can't tell if

Wisdom's

avoiding me or thinks he has better things to do than dissuade me from his wagon and

House

townread.

I'll do some rereading of the Bingle case today as I've just skimmed last couple of pages. One question I have for others who know him is, is he someone who'd hold back from hammering Alisae yesterday or Wisdom today? In both cases I think they were X-1 for a while and they can't both be his buddies.

I'm familiar with

Bingle

but I don't think I've seen his scumgame yet.

Also

Imaginality

, I really want to pick your brain on how you went from

Wisdom

is the best elimination EoD1 to

Alisae

over one post. Like, do you remember your internal monologue when you wrote 265?

[Taly]

I expected Ali to have been hammered by Taly

and was vaguely hoping the null read would flip scum, then responded when the mod made a contrary call.

Let me understand this - you thought that the quote preview error I made was an actual hammer 288

But when it didn't happen 310, you L1'd

Alisae

in 405

Over 3 pages of content happened during that time. Why the wait?

And if this is an incorrect interpretation of your post

, what gave you the impression that I'd 180 on my

Alisae

townread?

[Taly]

If you are town voting yourself makes zero sense
Especially if you happen to be the 8ball
You just take away the info of the 5th person on your wagon from us

But you're probably just scum so

Scum self-hammers

Demoralized town self-votes.

You're better than this.

Except it was not a hammer

EXACTLY MY POINT

Your point apparently is to cut my post in half and dodge what I'm actually saying entirely

I'm not getting anything from this dialogue.

How do you read

House's

entrance?

[Taly]

House

, you seem more familiar with

Wisdom

scum than I do, what's your meta take?

Also, do you think the thread currently aligns with the narrative that you're the 8ball, or is a current wagon or someone else that has already been voted - a likelier 8ball?

[Taly]

Yeah, I'm good with townbinning

Imaginality

. I don't think scum makes that change of vote POV seem so fluid.

Only partner I can see

Imaginality

with is

Wisdom

and I don't think we're that far into Hell this game.

[Taly]

Maybe I'm not thinking critically about this, but I don't particularly feel the current points against

Bingle

? Other than the lazy D1 take on

Alisae

and otherwise left-field jump into

the worst

, that's as far as I'm thinking on his slot being potential scum.

I think

Wisdom

is a better push because I feel like his jump to

Alisae

D1 was opportunistic. His EoD1 replies felt as though they came from scum trying to sow doubt in arguments that were valid against them 356 and 357 and 398. I don't follow the

Bingle

vote [

MT

being the convincing vote on that wagon] and I don't think the 1v1 with

House

has accomplished anything for either slot IMO.

And it's unusual for replacements to have similar takes on certain aspects of the game as

Alisae

did (namely townreading me, thinking

House

is a likely 8ball,

Wisdom

being scum), so I don't feel like this wagon is without solid reason.

[Taly]

I mean, I either have a solid bloc with half of the plist and this game is smooth sailing or it really isn't. But I don't know where I'd be misted with

House/MT/Imaginality

nor am I inclined to investigate heavily without any tangible flips.

I also think I'm being boxed into a UTR position which was the opposite of how I'd think the thread would react to me on EoD1.

I can't predict the 8ball ss of this moment. But

Alisae

couldn't have predicted a

Wisdom

or

Bingle

wagon judging by their posts. So that leads me to believe that scum have lost thread control and that

House

is sincere.

[Taly]

I need people to pick my brain. I think I'm being viewed as a number rather than a voice haha.

With that, I'm going to sleep, night!

[Taly]

Lol I stopped an 8ball mislim just to achieve an 8ball mislim on another player

[Taly]

I havent been mislim'd in ages I believe, this game serves as shock that either the site meta is less forgiving towards my playstyle now or I am rusty and don't actually play like I used to

You play nothing like how I remember.

Sorry!

And me? ;3

[Taly]

Bingle

I had to try hard not to jump into your pocket~

[Taly]

I believe the mod did fine. I think another good response for the mod would just be to confirm with me in PM if my vote was intentional... which it wasn't. I had a quote error that I mentioned the post after.

I didn't think vote trickery was a thing people did or thought to do. Definitely agree with

S_S

on having a rule like that.

[Taly]

Also intentionally hammering

Ali

would've been so out of character that I'd definitely not think to do it as scum unless we were the team, which would still otherwise be gamethrowing on my end.