Mini Normal 2246 - Game Over

[T3]

VOTE: wiki
I have 7500 edits to Wikipedia.

[T3]

welp it's been a while

but here we are

FLASHWAGON

[T3]

You was a rather active player on previous Thursday. Previous weeks don't count?
VOTE: Datisi

last week does, it just so happened some of my classes got cancelled.

you already doing meta dives on people?

Another metagood soldier

[T3]

There are 4 scum so there is likely at least one traitor I think
Depends on pr’s

[T3]

VOTE: wiki
I have 7500 edits to Wikipedia.

7500 things nobody cares about.

:^]

[T3]

This is dumb
I don’t care about it I randomly mentioned it because of your username ._.

[T3]

Almost...if you wanna lynch me at least do it on gothic music...

Why would I want to lim you (or anyone else) on page one?? I opened the thread and saw you were the last one who posted so I voted you (doesn't matter that someone else posted in between while I was looking for the lyrics to quote)

Dance monkey

[T3]

hmm

ico, you unvoted me kinda quick

you scared?

Bad vines

[T3]

Do you mmean it's been a while since we played together or since you voted Town!me??

sure hope so, there's a few people i don't want to be scum in this game and you are one of em :p

Dragon and monke
Animal squad

[T3]

hmm

ico, you unvoted me kinda quick

you scared?

Bad vines

?

Vibes

[T3]

hmm

ico, you unvoted me kinda quick

you scared?

excuse me? there's a bunch of people i need to vote here, and i haven't got all day
also i'm distinctly *against* bussing so yeah

Are you sure about that

[T3]

hmm

ico, you unvoted me kinda quick

you scared?

Bad vines

?

Vibes

i get that you meant vibes, but what does that *mean*

bad vibes on me? on ico? why aren't you voting then?

You
I usually never vote someone just based on vibes.

[T3]

I can’t say why because of ongoing games but what wiki is doing is a play style thing.

[T3]

VOTE: t3
Okay I think t3 might be scum here
Worst case scenario I have a 1/3 chance of just guessing right

Yhy

[T3]

I'm happy to be here.

VOTE: IOnlyAskWhy

Sorry, I already got a cop guilty on you.

[T3]

basicly all of dwlee's posts make me go all

It’s a play style thing.

[T3]

Ico in my experience has just rolled over and died cause he was scum

Idk what town!him plays like

Agreed. I think the Gupta game was an outlier though.

[T3]

Dwlee is playing very strongly towards his town meta. Once he has more posts I’ll see if he exhibited the tell.

[T3]

No. Go look at my meta tell.

[T3]

Dwlee is playing very strongly towards his town meta. Once he has more posts I’ll see if he exhibited the tell.

I have a feeling that he tries to pocket Andre, if they are not together.

Andre votes Dwlee.
Dwlee votes Ico (for 2 first posts?).
Andre says Datisi and A50 are scums, Ico is town.
Dwlee says that his opinion is opposite, so Andre can be a scum.
Then Dwlee immediately changes his opinion: Ico is a townie, Datisi is a scum. Andre is town too for him, just logics. He has read 3 pages in short time to change all of it. He had no reason to tr Andre so fast with so opposite opinion, Andre should be very suspicious for him.

What does it look like? I think this can be Dwlee pocketing Andre. He had no good reasons at all to make such conclusions so fast. It doesnt matter Andre was right or not. Though Andre said Dwlee is town after all...

I recommend to reread this conversation, the timings are interesting. From page 3, post #69.

how does that even remotely relate to my comment

[T3]

Then maybe stop posting everything with much confidence, bc later when some ppl flip red/green, I will elim those, who have more and bigger mistakes.

this feels like an actual townie with principles, as opposed to scum twisting principles
this is kinda just a viberead but I'm fine having vibereads
While I don't think having bad reads is entirely a scumtell I appreciate Wiki's attempt to be firm about it

Not very useful principle though. Mafia has perfect reads after all.

It is very useful. It prevents townies from playing like idiots. Some caution is not unnecessary. Remember all your bad games and think what was done wrong and why. There is no need in fast decisions.

As far as I can tell this is your first game on this forum. You haven’t declared whether you’re an alt, so I’m going to assume you’re not. So how much experience do you have?

I don’t disagree with your assumption that Town tend to play like idiots btw. That’s more often than not the case. What I would challenge, or ask you to perhaps think about, is how you square that with the idea that the players that make the most or biggest mistakes are most likely to be Scum. I am finding that it’s a terrible way of going about finding Scum around here.

Basically everyone who isn't an active player is an alt :/

[T3]

anyway can some more people towntell pls

Who do you think towntold so far?

what is this weird pop in

[T3]

VOTE: t3
Okay I think t3 might be scum here
Worst case scenario I have a 1/3 chance of just guessing right

Hmm so like manufacturing a reason to display the TMI on ico so that they don't engage there too much? Hmmm

VOTE: Datisi
I believe in Datisi's ability to ping my towndar if town so let's see where this goes

This series of posts is enough for me to meta locktown Dwlee.
Basically scum them will never vote more than twice in his first 50 serious posts.

[T3]

VOTE: t3
Okay I think t3 might be scum here
Worst case scenario I have a 1/3 chance of just guessing right

Hmm so like manufacturing a reason to display the TMI on ico so that they don't engage there too much? Hmmm

VOTE: Datisi
I believe in Datisi's ability to ping my towndar if town so let's see where this goes

This series of posts is enough for me to meta locktown Dwlee.
Basically scum them will never vote more than twice in their first 50 serious posts.

mb

[T3]

my eyes are glazing over trying to read Datisi's posts so I'm going to ignore him for now

[T3]

andres and wiki

Hello ???

Yea why are you voting me btw

wanted to try to start a wagon, felt like you were more interesting with how my TRs had interacted with you

This read feels genuine.

[T3]

anyway can some more people towntell pls

Ok.

VOTE: Gamma

Serious vote?

Perhaps.

I don't see why town would beg for more people to town tell on page 8, but maybe that's just me.

okay, but why would scum beg for town to towntell?

[T3]

I will explain later.

++++++town for this post

"I will explain later"-type posts come from town >rand of the time

[T3]

I will explain later.

Either way people love to scream "omg scummy" every time I breathe so I'd live to know your actual reasoning.

altfight

[T3]

VOTE: Datisi
I believe in Datisi's ability to ping my towndar if town so let's see where this goes

hmm
why did you townread me for in the first place? i see the recent post saying you usually find town!me quickly, and i'm assuming 72 is a townread.

also on page 4, i don't get your iconeum scumread at all

And I don’t know when you’ve seen them roll over as Scum. I have seen something totally different. But I also had them pinned down as Scum so maybe that had something to do with it.

that's the game i was talking about earlier. i made him trip up on page ~3, he was hammered 12 hours later. so, uh. yeah.

kinda feeling selynee is scummy at start of page 6, her posting so far seems like mostly aimless questions with little-to-no follow up

kinda feel like Wiki is town already

i'mma need some elaboration on this one, chief, because he's surely not feeling like it for me

oh, 135 is a thing - disagreed on it feeling like genuine principles
like wiki's dwlee vote is feeling sorta like his earlier "suspicion" on me, which is shoving plainly nai things as basis for reads
depending on wiki's experience / skill level, this would be either +town or +scum (i feel like it's more likely to be +scum for a newbie and slightly +town for a veteran), but he's an alt and i'm not feeling too confident in his claims about experience so /shrug

and a50's shitposting is reminding me of that last game where he was scum bc i remember he was shitposting a fair bit there too
one townread, can i have one townread pls

hmm

ico, you unvoted me kinda quick

you scared?

Bad vines

?

Vibes

i get that you meant vibes, but what does that *mean*

bad vibes on me? on ico? why aren't you voting then?

You
I usually never vote someone just based on vibes.

are you allergic to actually using your words when explaining things?

bottom of page 6, be back soon-ish.

I don't have any set method which I read people other than meta, or if something random catches my eye .-.

[T3]

I prefer to ignore many things. This is my style. I didnt think you are waiting my answer on 167.

what -_-

[T3]

I will explain later.

++++++town for this post

"I will explain later"-type posts come from town >rand of the time

You do this as scum though?

I do because it's the kind of thing I would townread so I attempt to replicate that.

[T3]

Maybe smth like this now... not sure at all...

Town:
Daitsi, Ico, Gamma, Three, Andre/A50

Scums:
Dwlee? Selynee? Just feeling about her, no good arguments for now. If Datisi is town, she is in deep shadows.

T3 is strange, I thought a lot about his post "This is so dumb", where he said he lied about editions in Wiki. Maybe a scum would do that in other way, with some conclusion about me. Is it to become more townie? Meh. He had just a genuine reaction with no understanding, with no ideas. But maybe I just thought about that too much and it is doesnt matter

wait what

1. i didn't lie about my wiki edits but let's not have this debate now because it's not game related. proof here: https://xtools.wmflabs.org/ec/en.wikipedia.org/-noah-
2. i try to make my scumgame as genuine as possible

[T3]

Wiki you’re probably tunneling

I genuinely have no idea what the case on dwlee is

[T3]

Wiki are you an NPOM alt?

NPOM is banned iirc so I’d hope that’s not the case

The ban expired in April.
idk, doesn't really matter

[T3]

Wait, did you just hard claim Day Cop? What the hell is happening.

mafia

[T3]

So am I mafia?

Claiming daycop usually comes from VT, just from the extensive fakeclaiming of daycop I've seen on MU.

[T3]

@Three, OMGUS doesn’t say shit about someone’s alignment btw. Town sometimes just get frustrated and vote back thinking they’re being attacked by Scum. But I do SR Selynee’s timidity and somewhat narrow focus on your slot.

I don't disagree. The OMGUS doesn't mean as much to me as the rest of her post IMO. It reads like she's trying to scare me off her wagon by acting like she was on the verge of being flipped when she wasn't anywhere close to it. The fact that she's already worried about getting eliminated suggests self-conscious scum to me, like she's mad that she's already been caught over something small and trivial.

If she's genuinely frustrated town, she needs to deal with the people casing her, not attack people who are convinced by those casing her.

this post feels like it's made in bad faith

[T3]

@Three, OMGUS doesn’t say shit about someone’s alignment btw. Town sometimes just get frustrated and vote back thinking they’re being attacked by Scum. But I do SR Selynee’s timidity and somewhat narrow focus on your slot.

I don't disagree. The OMGUS doesn't mean as much to me as the rest of her post IMO. It reads like she's trying to scare me off her wagon by acting like she was on the verge of being flipped when she wasn't anywhere close to it. The fact that she's already worried about getting eliminated suggests self-conscious scum to me, like she's mad that she's already been caught over something small and trivial.

If she's genuinely frustrated town, she needs to deal with the people casing her, not attack people who are convinced by those casing her.

this post feels like it's made in bad faith

[T3]

I am a day cop, Dwlee is a checked mafia goon.

VOTE: wiki

you can go now

anti-mindmeld

[T3]

Andre said I'm washy about DW vs Wiki. Well, as I said, maybe because I don't have a clear view on Dwelee. And I'd also like to see Andre's thoughts on this slot.

VOTE: selynee

[T3]

imagine making an alt only to not pick up your role pm

[T3]

hi town

[T3]

t3 can I put you in my ultra-awesome list of townies

Why yes I would appreciate it

[T3]

Andre said I'm washy about DW vs Wiki. Well, as I said, maybe because I don't have a clear view on Dwelee. And I'd also like to see Andre's thoughts on this slot.

VOTE: selynee

Any more thoughts on this?

It’s still too early to have a real solid read on DW. I don’t think they’re Scum - I just think they’re a decently good player and they could be fooling people into thinking they’re Town with their aggression, confidence, and repeated attempts at forming a Town core (which all strike me as +Town).

OK, fair enough on town core. This usually comes from town- depending on what does with those reads later.

No

[T3]

I am a day cop, Dwlee is a checked mafia goon.

Hard claim

Hard claim 2

I am already VOTE: dwlee

if wiki retracts this claim at all, will vote for them untill they are gone from the game

I really hate this sequence but I also don’t see the scum motivation

[T3]

Salsa rolled scum too I think

i also thought her intro was tonally *off*, though at this point i feel like i have way too many scumleans, even for this game

Agreed, and I also like this observation.

[T3]

Datisi how do you have too many scumleans
Name them

sel and three for already explained reasons at some point in the last two pages
a50 because his laziness reminded me of that c9++ game
geraintm because are you reading his posts
salsa's intro is pingy
t3 is being weird and opportunistic-y and i'm still trying to figure out how to read him

6 feels like too much
and knowing my early reads generally aren't perfect
yeah

Opportunism is never ever ever a scum tell for me. I get accused of it a lot as both alignments.

[T3]

If traitor game then Gera > salsa > a50 has a decent chance of winning imo

I’m thinking this is a traitor game. Having to lim 4 scum to win means town can only afford 3 Muslims.

[T3]

Salsa rolled scum too I think

i also thought her intro was tonally *off*, though at this point i feel like i have way too many scumleans, even for this game

I think I've got a tell for Salsa atp, but it needs time to work properly

This kind of post generally comes from town.

[T3]

I have NO towntells. Only SCUM tells.

I think your low WIM is a scumtell. VOTE: a50

[T3]

Salsa rolled scum too I think

Sure looks like it, but I only have one vote

Salsa rolled scum too I think

i also thought her intro was tonally *off*, though at this point i feel like i have way too many scumleans, even for this game

You guys have more days to tunnel the shut out of me. I want a D1 pass as I joined late and not interest in catching up atm.

This doesn’t feel like lemin demin Salsa but I’ll need more time.

[T3]

No, I just don't know any other way to get into the game.

I very very very much like this sequence from Dorsey. He looks like newbtown out of water in a sense.

[T3]

@Three, OMGUS doesn’t say shit about someone’s alignment btw. Town sometimes just get frustrated and vote back thinking they’re being attacked by Scum. But I do SR Selynee’s timidity and somewhat narrow focus on your slot.

I don't disagree. The OMGUS doesn't mean as much to me as the rest of her post IMO. It reads like she's trying to scare me off her wagon by acting like she was on the verge of being flipped when she wasn't anywhere close to it. The fact that she's already worried about getting eliminated suggests self-conscious scum to me, like she's mad that she's already been caught over something small and trivial.

If she's genuinely frustrated town, she needs to deal with the people casing her, not attack people who are convinced by those casing her.

this post feels like it's made in bad faith

...Can you elaborate?

You said exactly what selynee was saying but added on a part that felt manipulative, in a sense. Like you’re saying it’s her fault she’s being scumread.

[T3]

Why not? I mean, feel free to share.

I… just don’t have any more thoughts. The part where you talk about Andrea seemed designed to make it seem like you’re making discussion while pocketing Andres.

[T3]

If traitor game then Gera > salsa > a50 has a decent chance of winning imo

I’m thinking this is a traitor game. Having to lim 4 scum to win means town can only afford 3 Muslims.

LMAO AUTOCORRECT

[T3]

@Three, OMGUS doesn’t say shit about someone’s alignment btw. Town sometimes just get frustrated and vote back thinking they’re being attacked by Scum. But I do SR Selynee’s timidity and somewhat narrow focus on your slot.

I don't disagree. The OMGUS doesn't mean as much to me as the rest of her post IMO. It reads like she's trying to scare me off her wagon by acting like she was on the verge of being flipped when she wasn't anywhere close to it. The fact that she's already worried about getting eliminated suggests self-conscious scum to me, like she's mad that she's already been caught over something small and trivial.

If she's genuinely frustrated town, she needs to deal with the people casing her, not attack people who are convinced by those casing her.

this post feels like it's made in bad faith

...Can you elaborate?

You said exactly what selynee was saying but added on a part that felt manipulative, in a sense. Like you’re saying it’s her fault she’s being scumread.

Who's fault is it that she's being scum read then?

Hers, BUT it seemed like an odd thing to say in the thread.

[T3]

Why not? I mean, feel free to share.

I… just don’t have any more thoughts. The part where you talk about Andrea seemed designed to make it seem like you’re making discussion while pocketing Andres.

Why? All I asked at that point was his read on Dwelee. Given that he said mine was wishy washy.

But I like you think I could pocket an experienced player.

idk i haven't played much with either of you

[T3]

I have NO towntells. Only SCUM tells.

I think your low WIM is a scumtell. VOTE: a50

Do you think A50's WIM should be higher this early into the game?

Definitely

[T3]

I feel your pain
Rn we're doing serious game related stuff.

[T3]

Salsa rolled scum too I think

i also thought her intro was tonally *off*, though at this point i feel like i have way too many scumleans, even for this game

Agreed, and I also like this observation.

Are you rolled scum?

never

[T3]

This doesn’t feel like lemin demin Salsa but I’ll need more time.

Oh no you're absolutely right that Lemon Demon Salsa never posted like that.
As an FYI there's some posting by Salsa I did like after I voted her

In every freaking game of mine, there was someone to tell this: SF didn't post like

this

in

that

game, SF didn't play like

this

in

that

game and surprisingly I was town in all of those games! SHOCKING

wait weren't you scum that game? or am i just completely tripping.

[T3]

Oh, finally! A wagon on a scummy slot

VOTE: A50

umhmhmhmhmhmhmh

[T3]

I'm getting pretty tired of this shade from wiki despite him apparently not SRing me anymore

yeah but in general that type of moonlogic comes from town

like i think wiki is severely misguided town atp
still catching up though, rl happened and i haven't gotten a chance to post when i normally would today

[T3]

re: 637
it seems like a genuine effort and doesn't seem like the kind of thing newbscum would think of

[T3]

I feel like punishing myself from time to time and logging in.

god, this is a mood.

Because many players can believe that if you never rolled scum before, you would have more chances to get it at last every new time. Just statistics.

the fuck.

Chances are still 50-50.

chances for rolling scum are not 50-50... the fuck, part two.

kinda liking the reaction to wiki's post from datisi

[T3]

because
VIBES

[T3]

Because Wiki is obvtown???

this doesn't feel like scum whiteknighting, the reasons are valid

[T3]

Salsa, dont play only using meta. It is not reliably at all. It works mostly only with noobs and until they decide to try hard to copy their meta or play in different styles every game not depending on their role. I know many players who love scum role so much and meta usually doesnt work, their game is so balanced. It is better to use logics in every moment of reading a person.

(generally) not true

each player has different tells which they are unaware of

[T3]

@salsa, white knighting is when a person (generally scum) defneds someone (generally town) under fire

why are you ing at that? like, explain to me why fakeclaiming daycop is scummy.

i don't like this post's tone

[T3]

why are you ing at that? like, explain to me why fakeclaiming daycop is scummy.

you are so scum datisi.

mindemelde
actually idk if he scumread that post for tone
we shall see

[T3]

And I'm not avoiding anything, those 4's scumread on me is biased af, so it’s not out of the context to state that if any of them is scum, they're using this to miseliminate me.

do you think that those 4 people are scummy for their read on you?

Maybe but not all 4 though. I mainly said if any of them are scum, then they can use this

biasness

towards me without creating any suspicious towards them.

This makes 0 sense.

[T3]

"Lie is a bad thing" - this is a newbie level of thinking.
More important what does it mean on the next levels.
What aims do scums have?
Everything they are doing is forced by their aims.
What aim to fakeclaim early?
I would think firstly that this a very scummy thing for one strong reason.
But nobody here thinks about it.
And Datisi's words that this is obv towns action - are the most suspicious reaction for now. Because it definitely not obv if to think about it really, about all options, looking on the situation from pov of possible scum!wiki. What aim can he have in this moment? What does scum!wiki need to achieve/know?
U dont think about it, u are pretending stupid , defending me like it is obv cannot be scum. This is not true


I have no time to talk now ugh

you could argue the claim is NAI. I'd say it's anywhere between more likely to come from town and NAI.
your fighting is all kinds of weird

I completely agree with this but I also think newbies fakeclaiming daycop (or agressive hyperposter alts claiming daycop) outweigh the scummy things wiki has done.

[T3]

16k posts
Probably you should understand, playing so much...
Ico is susp too from now

wiki
you do realize that you have the most posts per day of anyone onsite
and you signed up in the newbie queue so you're not an alt

[T3]

U dont understand, ico

i rarely understand

explain it to me like i'm 5?

Ok, i will say it loud.
If scum fakeclaims a cop, it helps scums to find a cop bc of the reactions of players after that.
Scums wish to find a cop or any important town role to kill it ASAP.
So fakeclaiming can be easily a scum thing.
But nobody thinks about it now and some experinced players like Datisi and Ico are even pretending that this is obv town's action, not thinking about how dangerous it is. Because they probably need any arguments to pocket me, knowing my color.

Comparing with Gamma: he does think that i can be a scum only for fakeclaiming, and this is ok. But at the same time Datisi says that fakeclaing cannot be scummy. This is is not ok. He cannot be so stupid about that in my opinion.

This is the point.

are you a chat mafia or mu player

you remind me of someone but i can't quite put my finger on it

[T3]

I don't scumread you cause of meta, Salsa...

Sure!

VOTE: salsa
bad tone in this reaction so i'm just going to vote you and then unvote you because another player will do something bad on my catchup

[T3]

Dwlee, Datisi, Ico? If so, gamma easily can be a scum for huge mistakes

Yeah you’re fucking off-base if you seriously think read accuracy is a good way to read people in general

bad tone, esp in the context

i do think i remember scumreading gamma one game for out of context bad tone and i was dead wrong
gonna try to find it later

[T3]

(generally) not true

(generally) players are noobs

i meta'd a 2005 player to death in one game and got that they were locktown

[T3]

VOTE: Icon

might not want to do that

[T3]

What scum would do all the shit Wiki has done, especially newbscum?

In isolation I'd say this is Town Gamma, unless Gamma wants to pocket Wiki for some odd reason.

i mean, unless gamma is scum and wiki is town

[T3]

Can we vote gera

I was, but apparently someone thinks I'm a better lim, so I'm just being a team player.

ohhhhhh i think i see what's going on

[T3]

Salsa I'm very confident you're gonna flip red but I know you have to pretend you won't and that is sad

Pathetic (2)

To the town (not the crazy ones), after my flip, not let this go away. I'm saying this, because people don't consider my posts/reads even if I flip green

you dug your own grave in 2234 tbh
also nm replaced into your slot

[T3]

Okay salsa

i vaguely like this reaction

[T3]

VOTE: Salsabil Faria

what actually is the scum motivation for whatever the heck salsa is trying to do rn

[T3]

Salsa I'm very confident you're gonna flip red but I know you have to pretend you won't and that is sad

Pathetic (2)

To the town (not the crazy ones), after my flip, not let this go away. I'm saying this, because people don't consider my posts/reads even if I flip green

you dug your own grave in 2234 tbh
also nm replaced into your slot

And?

so from an objective pov there was no reason to look back at your reads because your town flailing could have caused you to think irrationally about reads
ofc, you were right about me
but still

[T3]

VOTE: Salsabil Faria

Your reactions to DW don’t make logical sense to me. DW expressed a high degree of certainty that you were Scum. You called that pathetic, and have heavily hinted at DW being bad Town. But why Town? And why so confrontational? DW isn’t actually a bad player. I just feel you should express more curiosity and less frustration towards DW and the view they’ve expressed. I would also argue DW is very much starting to feel like Town to me. It’s hard for players in general to be this pushy of a SR as Scum. It’s rare, and DW hasn’t operated like that if my recollection serves right. So I am starting to feel like you’re being forced into discrediting DW without calling them Scum, which is why I’ve voted you.

You’re also pushing Wiki who honestly seems almost like obvious Town to me. Or rather, I feel like the normal reaction to how Wiki is playing is to not want to execute it (Datisi’s “village idiot” description isn’t particularly charitable, but perhaps not that off target). I’m more inclined to want to give Wiki more time to see if their contributions are of any actual value.

Separately, I think A50’s frustration seems more Town indicative actually. I didn’t SR A50 for the activity level - I felt a specific post I quoted was Scummy. But the reaction they had to the pressure seemed genuine.

THIS MAKES SENSE

[T3]

*Sigh*

I was getting excited, but my wagon died too soon.

VOTE: ger

it depends on wherever the votes are at rn but i think we should run up a50

[T3]

Im ready to elim any of them: ico, dwlee, datisi, salsa.
Should i vote salsa now?

yes

[T3]

@Dwlee

, SF's wagon is formatting finally, do you have any thought on this confscum?

there are 4 scum

we can only afford 3 mislims (assuming we don't lim both scum with traitor if there is one)

[T3]

done with my catchup

i am VERY happy where my vote is

[T3]

T3 you said this makes sense (andre treads a50), now you say we should run up a50. Does "run up" mean to elim?

It doesn't matter A50's alignment. We should put him to E-1

[T3]

A50 why not salsa

I dunno. She tried to pocket me, didn't she? I'm glad to accept that pocket for today.

Yeah, pocket the person who also in people’s suspect list..

>_>

that's like the entire point of whiteknighting

[T3]

@T3

, do you still think

Dorsey

is newbtown? If so, why?

i haven't seen much from him other than his og string of posts, so yes

[T3]

T3 you said this makes sense (andre treads a50), now you say we should run up a50. Does "run up" mean to elim?

It doesn't matter A50's alignment. We should put him to E-1

It's this the game where everyone says weird stuff?

@T3- you have reads that are not tone based?

@Three- Again...there is no reason town would fake a read here. Especially a scum read. So, you should be the first one to want be elim here...and make a case.

PS: Your vote was terrible. Which is...interesting cuz I felt like SF was soft defending you the first part of the game

I do.

ykw i don't think it matters anymore
i'm pretty sure a50 is slayer's gambiting

[T3]

T3 you said this makes sense (andre treads a50), now you say we should run up a50. Does "run up" mean to elim?

It doesn't matter A50's alignment. We should put him to E-1

It's this the game where everyone says weird stuff?

@T3- you have reads that are not tone based?

@Three- Again...there is no reason town would fake a read here. Especially a scum read. So, you should be the first one to want be elim here...and make a case.

PS: Your vote was terrible. Which is...interesting cuz I felt like SF was soft defending you the first part of the game

I do.

ykw i don't think it matters anymore
i'm pretty sure a50 is slayer's gambiting

[T3]

Townies dont vote players who are townies for them.
Ico did it twice, forgeting his own opinion.
Thats it.
I see no good reasons to consider Ico is town.

That's fair.... ish?
like town me often just straight-up forgets my own reads
i did that multiple times in happy face mafia and it led to noraa making a giant wall saying "oh no bad faith opportunistic t3"
so like
i'm not sure

[T3]

Dwlee, Salsa and Datisi defend Ico with no reasons at all.

This tunnel is meh but probably town.

[T3]

I read those games' iso in the beginning. Dont think im idiot.
Ico has no searching for scums here, this is the fact for god sake.

ffs this is actually mildly convincing

[T3]

when i feel like playing mafia but realizing i have to read multiple pages of wiki repeating the same nonsense case over and over

like dude
judging by the last votecount, you haven't convinced anyone except the person who isn't even reading the game

do you genuinely think your spam is protown?

posts of this type ( "blegh why is this game so dumb what is everyone even doing" ) very often come from town

[T3]

VOTE: Datisi

this is a double standard (sorta)
you're attacking ico for voting his townreads
then datisi asks a question of you and you deflect it and vote him?
STILL TOWN THO

[T3]

Townping from Selynee tho

VOTE: selynee

yeah

THERE IS NOTHING BETWEEN THESE 2 POSTS, WHY HE DECIDED TO CHANGE HIS MIND

I just have a crazy idea!

Wiki

is an alien or coming from a parallel universe where everything is a shit show!!

LITERALLY MU

[T3]

I don't really get the hostility. I thought this was supposed to be fun.

VOTE: Andresvmb

VOTE: dorsey

[T3]

-1000 social credit

[T3]

I’m honestly just over this day phase atp
A good number of people feel impossible to work with rn

i think town gamma would show more emotion over this but
IDK

[T3]

I really just want salsa flipped and next day phase

again, convince me that salsa is a better flip than wiki

Wiki is probably town. He reminds me of LQ when he scumreads every townie and does this

this observation usually comes from town ig

[T3]

-1000 social credit

andre is so locktown?
im worrying about his quite play

and wasn't you that person who cried loud how towny dorsey was?

he made 3 posts
each of which i liked
now he made one EXTREMELY scummy post
which outweighs the 3 posts i like

[T3]

No, I just don't know any other way to get into the game.

I very very very much like this sequence from Dorsey. He looks like newbtown out of water in a sense.

I don't really get the hostility. I thought this was supposed to be fun.

VOTE: Andresvmb

VOTE: dorsey

the reason is so incredibly bad and he isn't posting any of his other thoughts
like he can't find anything to latch on to

[T3]

u told he is newbtown
so why is it extremely scummy to vote andre?

because bad reasoning
also maybe just a tad bit of recency bias

[T3]

three town
wiki more town
salsa more scun
a50 more town

[T3]

T3:

Spoiler:

No, I just don't know any other way to get into the game.

I very very very much like this sequence from Dorsey. He looks like newbtown out of water in a sense.

I have NO towntells. Only SCUM tells.

I think your low WIM is a scumtell. VOTE: a50

Do you think A50's WIM should be higher this early into the game?

Definitely

I can tell you're idiot because your lOgIcS are

idiotic

. I never said

Dwlee

is an idiot because they're not, just their reason to scumread me is bad which mostly comes from meta but they kept saying meta is bad. So if town!them continue to tunnel me for bad reasons, it'll help scum more.
I never said I townred

ico

anywhere, all of your pushes/logics are worst. They're still scummy but I also scumread

GE

who also voted

ico

, so I'm not sure about what makes of that. And as a town, I can't have proof or surety that who can be scum because I don’t know other's role pm. You don’t read any of my posts in a non-bias view, that's why you don't get where is my head at.
I still prefer you over anyone, but no one gonna listen to me, so...

UNVOTE: Wiki

VOTE: GE

I don't scumread you cause of meta, Salsa...

Sure!

VOTE: salsa
bad tone in this reaction so i'm just going to vote you and then unvote you because another player will do something bad on my catchup

Dwlee, Datisi, Ico? If so, gamma easily can be a scum for huge mistakes

Yeah you’re fucking off-base if you seriously think read accuracy is a good way to read people in general

bad tone, esp in the context

i do think i remember scumreading gamma one game for out of context bad tone and i was dead wrong
gonna try to find it later

VOTE: Icon

might not want to do that

(i dont understand this)

What scum would do all the shit Wiki has done, especially newbscum?

In isolation I'd say this is Town Gamma, unless Gamma wants to pocket Wiki for some odd reason.

i mean, unless gamma is scum and wiki is town

Salsa I'm very confident you're gonna flip red but I know you have to pretend you won't and that is sad

Pathetic (2)

To the town (not the crazy ones), after my flip, not let this go away. I'm saying this, because people don't consider my posts/reads even if I flip green

you dug your own grave in 2234 tbh
also nm replaced into your slot

Okay salsa

i vaguely like this reaction

VOTE: Salsabil Faria

what actually is the scum motivation for whatever the heck salsa is trying to do rn

VOTE: Salsabil Faria

Your reactions to DW don’t make logical sense to me. DW expressed a high degree of certainty that you were Scum. You called that pathetic, and have heavily hinted at DW being bad Town. But why Town? And why so confrontational? DW isn’t actually a bad player. I just feel you should express more curiosity and less frustration towards DW and the view they’ve expressed. I would also argue DW is very much starting to feel like Town to me. It’s hard for players in general to be this pushy of a SR as Scum. It’s rare, and DW hasn’t operated like that if my recollection serves right. So I am starting to feel like you’re being forced into discrediting DW without calling them Scum, which is why I’ve voted you.

You’re also pushing Wiki who honestly seems almost like obvious Town to me. Or rather, I feel like the normal reaction to how Wiki is playing is to not want to execute it (Datisi’s “village idiot” description isn’t particularly charitable, but perhaps not that off target). I’m more inclined to want to give Wiki more time to see if their contributions are of any actual value.

Separately, I think A50’s frustration seems more Town indicative actually. I didn’t SR A50 for the activity level - I felt a specific post I quoted was Scummy. But the reaction they had to the pressure seemed genuine.

THIS MAKES SENSE

*Sigh*

I was getting excited, but my wagon died too soon.

VOTE: ger

it depends on wherever the votes are at rn but i think we should run up a50

Im ready to elim any of them: ico, dwlee, datisi, salsa.
Should i vote salsa now?

yes

done with my catchup

i am VERY happy where my vote is

T3 you said this makes sense (andre treads a50), now you say we should run up a50. Does "run up" mean to elim?

It doesn't matter A50's alignment. We should put him to E-1

T3 you said this makes sense (andre treads a50), now you say we should run up a50. Does "run up" mean to elim?

It doesn't matter A50's alignment. We should put him to E-1

It's this the game where everyone says weird stuff?

@T3- you have reads that are not tone based?

@Three- Again...there is no reason town would fake a read here. Especially a scum read. So, you should be the first one to want be elim here...and make a case.

PS: Your vote was terrible. Which is...interesting cuz I felt like SF was soft defending you the first part of the game

I do.

ykw i don't think it matters anymore
i'm pretty sure a50 is slayer's gambiting

VOTE: Dorsey

VOTE: Dorsey

Ok

UNVOTE: Wiki

VOTE: Dorsey

I don't really get the hostility. I thought this was supposed to be fun.

VOTE: Andresvmb

VOTE: dorsey

-1000 social credit

three town
wiki more town
salsa more scun
a50 more town

1. t3 townreads dorsey very much when everybody nullreads him and many votes to gera, but today t3 votes dorsey (not gera) with a bad reason
2. t3 scumread a50, t3 almost townread salsa (some defense), then t3 listened to andre and now he is happy townreading a50 and scumreading salsa... he wants to elim salsa after townreading her, and says he would like to put a50 on e-1, but thinks he is town now, wat?
3. interactions with Gamma are very low and more in defensive way

I was compltetely and entirely aware of the inconsistencies in my reads, this is for a reason

[T3]

hi
VOTE: salsa
wiki just take a 2 day break from posting and we'll all be happy

[T3]

To be clear: I'm still scumreading Three but he has done some towny stuff in the last few pages, mainly expressing annoyance with the gamestate.

[T3]

bad tone on 1349

[T3]

I feel like punishing myself from time to time and logging in.

god, this is a mood.

Because many players can believe that if you never rolled scum before, you would have more chances to get it at last every new time. Just statistics.

the fuck.

Chances are still 50-50.

chances for rolling scum are not 50-50... the fuck, part two.

kinda liking the reaction to wiki's post from datisi

maybe i'm wrong here but you seem to spend an awfull lot of time commenting on datisi vs anyone else this game?

idk
not really

[T3]

Ico votes his townies.
This fact is vital.
You cannot ignore this, otherwise you dont know how to play it.

but please

stop misrepping me

or i'm coming after you until you are dead. period

directly after wiki claims pr though

[T3]

actually you know what

if you had actually cared about sorting ico, you would've asked about why he decided to vote someone he had a townping on on page three-- i mean who he was so strongly townreading

but you don't actually give a shit, you're just looking for an easy target to attack based on facts and logic without having to actually do anything, right?

oh god

are we finally same allignment again xd

VOTE: Datisi

this is a double standard (sorta)
you're attacking ico for voting his townreads
then datisi asks a question of you and you deflect it and vote him?
STILL TOWN THO

i vote him because he has no reasons to protect ico, but he continues to do it with no explanation at all. zero examples and arguments.

you don't even pause to consider that datisi is whiteknighting? (ftr i don't think datisi is whiteknighting but yeah)

[T3]

Wiki

for the love of whatever deity you worship

you ain't Cyrus are you?

cyrus doesn't use capital letters

[T3]

Idc, I'll vote T3. Every time I open my mouth I get attacked anyway.

VOTE: T3

VOTE: T3

but why

[T3]

VOTE: T3

I think we need a wagon here.

but why

[T3]

what is gera doing

[T3]

Wiki

for the love of whatever deity you worship

you ain't Cyrus are you?

I didn't want to say it, but I think he's Cyrus too.

Yeah, im Cyrus, this topic is closed. Ico was first who guessed. Please dont say it to anybody else out of the game

LMAO
never would have guessed

[T3]

okay wiki is town

[T3]

Im not Cyrus btw lol

okay good ;-;
still town

[T3]

A50 can easily be either allignment here
same goes for GE i think

Oh wait, forgot I'm damn near town locking A50. He just has close to no WIM this game, at least so far.

.......what?
i thought that meant a50 was scum

[T3]

Talking about gera's meta on day1 is so nonsense

I remember gera being this low energy as town too so I'll give him a pass.

[T3]

Do you know how to read t3, Andres?

I yelled that they were Scum in a game absurdly loudly and I was correct. I’ve also correctly TR them before. But I have been wrong on them in the first game we played together (though I was right that they put out a bullshit role claim which frankly drove my suspicion).

I would say the main reason I’m voting there is because they have a complete opposite worldview to mine (though they TR me). I just think it’s a decent place to start.

In LN 232 I tried to bus my scumpartners so hard that I'd be limmed and they'd be cleared. So that game is just bad to meta me by

[T3]

Do you know how to read t3, Andres?

Extremely subjective IMO. Is there some standard, non-evolving method of reading a particular player that can be publicized and referenced?

mastina

[T3]

andres, why is salsa town?
dwlee, why is salsa scum?

PoE + she is tonally scummy and is doing some ridiculous ate stuff but when does she not amirite

salsa does ate as either alignment though
she is independently scummy

[T3]

@t3, is there a reason why most of your catchup today is shitting on ico, but you're still voting salsa?

because all the discussion involved ico
and i'm still slightly scumreading ico
and then i had to leave
so now i'm catching up again

[T3]

looker has waaaaaay higher wim than i remember scum him having
both in the game i modded and the game when we were buddies

[T3]

i mean, my read on gera is 2/2 so far and also not like i have much to work with on day 1

i am of the opinion that the games i roll scum i am awful and if people leave me alone i will screw it up for scum.
i think i am very easy to read, but htat is just me

ahhh i like this post
like does scum being wagoned actually just say this out loud in the thread

[T3]

K, I wasn't killed by a serial killer in the park (just my luck) so...

Faria- Actually don't find much mafia motivation with her entry. Faking believing the claim would have been something if she could get an easy miselim (like if any of them were at E-1 or something) but none were in danger of being elim. Plus stuff like calling for a policy elim doesn't seem like coming from someone who wants to be seen as town cuz from my limited experience, this usually isn't popular.

T3- Not a fan of their progression. Not helped by the fact that he doesn't really provides much info but like 375 says Three's read is made in bad faith but votes me in 377. 521- honestly, don't get why they are only suspecting me of pocketing when the same argument can be used that you were pocketing Datisi or Wiki by agreeing with them. Also, not a fan of the progression on salsa-516- meta stuff, 936- honestly don't see what's so bad in that reaction. 956- asks about scum motivations here but doesn't insist on this. 959- agrees with Andre's case. And that's basically all. No longer question Salsa read. Seems a superficial read there.

Ico- Did I say I don't like early reads? Cuz they lack consistency- like, if you say you townread someone on page 5 and scumread them on page 25, you can easily say "Well, the first one was just early vibes, now I no longer feel the same vibes" and this can easily come from both mafia or town.
Like, I actually like 352 and 368. Feels like a genuine attempt to make sense of Wiki's fake claim. And their early points on Almost. Plus from all the reasons they could give for voting me there, don't think mafia would come with 1374

*shrug*
i'm saying exactly what i'm thinking

[T3]

Do you know how to read t3, Andres?

I yelled that they were Scum in a game absurdly loudly and I was correct. I’ve also correctly TR them before. But I have been wrong on them in the first game we played together (though I was right that they put out a bullshit role claim which frankly drove my suspicion).

I would say the main reason I’m voting there is because they have a complete opposite worldview to mine (though they TR me). I just think it’s a decent place to start.

In LN 232 I tried to bus my scumpartners so hard that I'd be limmed and they'd be cleared. So that game is just bad to meta me by

My argument isn’t based on meta. That should be pretty clear from my post.

yeah ik
i'm just invalidating your point about the thing
i think this reason comes from town, seems like a stretch for scum to make that post

[T3]

It’s interesting that the minute that I started arguing for T3 to be pushed and they gather some votes, T3 starts posting a lot to increase their thread presence (probably to diffuse pressure). Not sure what it means yet.

my posting almost entirely depends on my schedule

[T3]

I've only played with scum!t3 once and I think he was mislimmed every other time (except the one he was conftown). Is that history correct, t3?

yes.
opossum just ended so actually twice

[T3]

What thing? You’re not invalidating anything. DW was questioning my ability to read you by asking me if I had read you accurately before. I answered that my accuracy wasn’t perfect, but that I had called you out as Scum before which means that I do have the ability at least to pinpoint whether the worldview you’re pushing makes any sense. Still, my read has little to do with that history. You haven’t invalidated shit.

i think there has been some miscommunication

[T3]

me being run up is usually town indicative

[T3]

like i think i've won most of my recent scumgames? (by recent i mean 3 months lol)

either way you're voting me for disagreeing with you but you aren't pausing to actually invalidate my reasoning

[T3]

The fact 1: Gera quoted and read normal roles in previous games, not once.
The fact 2: Gera plays in normal games for many years.

The fact 3: Gera said, that he believed in my claim and didnt read next posts after my claim, where it was said many times that it is not normal role.

what's the scum motivation though?

[T3]

you don't even pause to consider that datisi is whiteknighting? (ftr i don't think datisi is whiteknighting but yeah)

scum!tisi is very, very much capable of getting me misyeeted
scum only need a limited number of misyeets
scum!tisi could have EASILY kept up pressure on me early game and force some mistakes out of me (which i make a ton of, as either allignment), and just punish me.

it makes no sense for scum!tisi to try and keep me alive here, other then *wanting* to play this way which admittedly is actually possible but just unlikely imo

I'll buy that.

[T3]

looker has waaaaaay higher wim than i remember scum him having

mind elaborating? it feels to me like his contribution so far is just going with the flow and taking weak potshots, while the only game i've seen looker in (that granted, was almost two years ago) they were town and had like, takes.

i'd go check if i am right on them playing like that in that past game, but for now i don't feel like going back to the shitfest that that game was

He gave a bad one liner once in a while.

[T3]

Datisi protecting Almost50 and T3, Ico siding with Datisi, everyone thinking Datisi is town for zero reason.

"0 reason"

[T3]

Datisi protecting Almost50 and T3, Ico siding with Datisi, everyone thinking Datisi is town for zero reason.

"0 reason"

[T3]

Second time in a row, maybe this player base just isn't for me.

just like
post as much as you possibly can

[T3]

like i think i've won most of my recent scumgames? (by recent i mean 3 months lol)

either way you're voting me for disagreeing with you but you aren't pausing to actually invalidate my reasoning

You’re almost making an argument as to why we should execute you.

Look, us disagreeing on a bunch of reads doesn’t necessarily mean you’re Scum. That’s obvious. I have gotten a lot of reads wrong in the past, even when I’m paying attention and reading carefully. But I am having specific issues with your reads in that not only am I disagreeing, or think they’re premature perhaps, but they’re also hard to scrutinize. And maybe this is a play style thing. For instance, you’ve made the argument that depending on the level of effort, some players could be Town (Looker in 1581), or Scum (A50 in 514 and 1571, who I agree is not trying particularly hard and is openly admitting to not reading, but also had what I felt was a Towny post in 767). Like I’ll ask you - How can you possibly know that A50’s excuse in 1264 isn’t genuine? You’ve also changed your view of A50 without really explaining it much, just recognizing that you have inconsistencies in your views (see for example, 1299 for what you had previously said about A50). And it’s not like A50 posted all that much between 1299 and 1571. In fact I don’t think they have any posts at all. So that just makes it seem like your read there is entirely made up.

I also don’t understand 1184. Not when you later make 1580 saying you’re still SR’ing Iconeum (and where did you initially express that read? I can’t find it. Is it 376?). Or your attack on 956 regarding my read of Salsa which you immediately decided to back up after I explained it in 959. Particularly after your 936. It’s almost as if you’re just trying to cause chaos instead of actually reading anybody properly. You’ve also shaded Three (who I TR), didn’t follow up on that all that much (just 1346 as far as I can tell), and ended up agreeing without expressing much of a read there in 527.

Your read of DW early in the game also seemed a bit TMI’ish, but I didn’t disagree with it then (I’m just being cautious about DW, that’s all).

All in all, you’ve shaded A50, Three, Salsa, Datisi, Ico, Dorsey, and Selynee. Even to me, this seems overly aggressive and yes, opportunistic.

At this point I think I know what A50 is doing (if i'm wrong then i'll look really stupid postgame )
I wasn't entirely sure if what he was doing comes from scum a50 or town a50.

[T3]

1184 was me pointing out a flaw in Wiki's logic.
956 I didn't see Salsa scum, then I saw your actual reasoning.
In general I'll still point out scummy posts from townreads without having my reads change much - it depends on the weight I put into each post.

[T3]

@T3 - Post as much as possible? Isn't that why you hated Wiki?

@Three - What changed was pages went on and geraintm and I got treated differently than Almost50. And regarding my vote, one second me voting someone with no votes is a problem and now it's encouraged and I'm being shunned for not doing it - do you see how pointless this is? T3 actually had a wagon - Datisi did/still does not.

true lol
i meant that more as a mechanism to get your thoughts into the thread

[T3]

My playstyle is like this as either alignment.
I will say exactly what I am thinking. I will point out scummy posts made by townreads.

[T3]

most of my posting this game has come from in the moment stuff. i'm going to step back and read ISO's

[T3]

A50 if you're negative utility then just say so

[T3]

and now im asking him again, he has no answer, just voting himself, to save himself because it works
enough of this

Self-voting works?? I thought "Please don't lim me" works better. Couple that with "I'm an investigative role" and you probably endgame too.

^@T3^

VOTE: a50

[T3]

quoted the wrong post lol

[T3]

anyway can some more people towntell pls

Ok.

VOTE: Gamma

Serious vote?

Perhaps.

I don't see why town would beg for more people to town tell on page 8, but maybe that's just me.

Or...explain your scum read. You can't say "I'll explain later." as if you have to leave but then still keep posting. Also, where's your vote?

I don't see why town would beg for more people to town tell on page 8, but maybe that's just me.

why would scum do it either lol
as for why I said that, I'm trying to use my new just-about-norm strat of townblocking slots early, forming a PoE based on those TRs, and crushing the scumteam beneath my bootheels. The faster I can get at least 50% of players into my townblock, the faster I can start applying pressure to a PoE solve. I'll be honest that I

do not

expect my townblock to be solid initially, 4 scum means there's more chances for someone to take the Cabd Clause ticket, but I also think that also means there's more chances for scum to underperform

A possible scum motivation is to just simply look busy while saying townie things. I think if you want someone to town tell you'll need to drag it out of them, otherwise it's pretty easy to fake a town tell if you're just offering it up yourself as opposed to town telling through genuine reactions.

I do think your strat sounds effective though, which I think is a bit +town.

@Three, OMGUS doesn’t say shit about someone’s alignment btw. Town sometimes just get frustrated and vote back thinking they’re being attacked by Scum. But I do SR Selynee’s timidity and somewhat narrow focus on your slot.

I don't disagree. The OMGUS doesn't mean as much to me as the rest of her post IMO. It reads like she's trying to scare me off her wagon by acting like she was on the verge of being flipped when she wasn't anywhere close to it. The fact that she's already worried about getting eliminated suggests self-conscious scum to me, like she's mad that she's already been caught over something small and trivial.

If she's genuinely frustrated town, she needs to deal with the people casing her, not attack people who are convinced by those casing her.

Why not? I mean, feel free to share.

The lack of aggression here is telling.

I don't see the obvious A50 town thing ico.

okay, so sell me on scum!A50? i don't see it

In my pervious games with them, they were more active as town. I don’t have scum meta on them though but they're lurking for some reason and the self vote is weird.

Meh, I think they don't really enjoy this game. Seemed like they were looking for some reactions to their self-vote, though not pushing a lot there...

Hmm can be, who do you propose to vote instead?

This feels pretty scum indicative. I don't know how you could be so lost on who to vote for that you need someone to tell you who to vote.

VOTE: Salsa

i'm gonna shorten my response to 1012 because this game is already giving me a headache due to wiki and it's not worth it

i am disagreeing with you? or rather i'm calling you out for falsely saying i have a "contradiction" going. like, 740 asks how i can think a post she made made sense while still thinking it's scummy. i can think both, because scum sometimes tells the truth. she was telling the truth about never claiming there was scum between dwlee/wiki. that doesn't make her town.

i'm not quoting word for word (and am rather carrying over the meaning) because it's easier to make my point that way. like it seemed obvious to me that "cuz i'm mafia pushing you?" was said in a "is this not what you're thinking right now?" context.

and it's called hyperbole. yes, you obviously didn't have literally zero reads and takes this whole game. the intended meaning was always "i think you've given too little content for how you've been active", like i think it was kinda understood to mean that?

You're making it really obvious that you just don't want to admit you were wrong. Whatever.

i'm gonna shorten my response to 1012 because this game is already giving me a headache due to wiki and it's not worth it

i am disagreeing with you? or rather i'm calling you out for falsely saying i have a "contradiction" going. like, 740 asks how i can think a post she made made sense while still thinking it's scummy. i can think both, because scum sometimes tells the truth. she was telling the truth about never claiming there was scum between dwlee/wiki. that doesn't make her town.

i'm not quoting word for word (and am rather carrying over the meaning) because it's easier to make my point that way. like it seemed obvious to me that "cuz i'm mafia pushing you?" was said in a "is this not what you're thinking right now?" context.

and it's called hyperbole. yes, you obviously didn't have literally zero reads and takes this whole game. the intended meaning was always "i think you've given too little content for how you've been active", like i think it was kinda understood to mean that?

A50 why not salsa

I dunno. She tried to pocket me, didn't she? I'm glad to accept that pocket for today.

Yeah, pocket the person who also in people’s suspect list..

>_>

that's like the entire point of whiteknighting

THANK YOU. Holy shit, I feel like I'm losing my mind.

I'm not sure why people suddenly piled their votes onto Dorsey.

A50 can easily be either allignment here
same goes for GE i think

Oh wait, forgot I'm damn near town locking A50. He just has close to no WIM this game, at least so far.

three's read on me is utter bullshit because he's been called out by multiple people as misrepping, which means that maybe, *maybe* your posts are fucking confusing and it's not the rest of us that are wrong

rn i'm leaning on it being town bullshit

but it's bullshit nonetheless

Dude can you literally talk about anything other than a post from a fucking week ago? You're so focused on something that doesn't matter and you refuse to actually try to solve me. I'm trying to figure you out and you don't even acknowledge it.

Also "called out by multiple people" you mean you, who I scum read? Salsa, who I scum read and who also LIED about the misrep? Lmao. Sel is the only other one and it got clarified a week ago that what I said wasn't a misrep, it was a misunderstanding. Get the fuck over it and play the game or get limmed.

[T3]

didn't mean to press submit

[T3]

anyway can some more people towntell pls

Ok.

VOTE: Gamma

Serious vote?

Perhaps.

I don't see why town would beg for more people to town tell on page 8, but maybe that's just me.

This has already been kind of resolved but there is some obvious town motivation to do that, which is also fake-able as scum.

Or...explain your scum read. You can't say "I'll explain later." as if you have to leave but then still keep posting. Also, where's your vote?

Three doesn't even pause to consider that someone would have a legit reason

I don't see why town would beg for more people to town tell on page 8, but maybe that's just me.

why would scum do it either lol
as for why I said that, I'm trying to use my new just-about-norm strat of townblocking slots early, forming a PoE based on those TRs, and crushing the scumteam beneath my bootheels. The faster I can get at least 50% of players into my townblock, the faster I can start applying pressure to a PoE solve. I'll be honest that I

do not

expect my townblock to be solid initially, 4 scum means there's more chances for someone to take the Cabd Clause ticket, but I also think that also means there's more chances for scum to underperform

A possible scum motivation is to just simply look busy while saying townie things. I think if you want someone to town tell you'll need to drag it out of them, otherwise it's pretty easy to fake a town tell if you're just offering it up yourself as opposed to town telling through genuine reactions.

I do think your strat sounds effective though, which I think is a bit +town.

Again, Three doesn't even pause to consider that Gamma uses this strategy regardless of alignment.
It just sounds 'mechanically' (not really mecchanically, more like optimal) sound, so Three townreads it.

@Three, OMGUS doesn’t say shit about someone’s alignment btw. Town sometimes just get frustrated and vote back thinking they’re being attacked by Scum. But I do SR Selynee’s timidity and somewhat narrow focus on your slot.

I don't disagree. The OMGUS doesn't mean as much to me as the rest of her post IMO. It reads like she's trying to scare me off her wagon by acting like she was on the verge of being flipped when she wasn't anywhere close to it. The fact that she's already worried about getting eliminated suggests self-conscious scum to me, like she's mad that she's already been caught over something small and trivial.

If she's genuinely frustrated town, she needs to deal with the people casing her, not attack people who are convinced by those casing her.

Already went over this, the post sounds manipulative.

Why not? I mean, feel free to share.

The lack of aggression here is telling.

I don't see what possible reason Selynee would have to be angry?

I don't see the obvious A50 town thing ico.

okay, so sell me on scum!A50? i don't see it

In my pervious games with them, they were more active as town. I don’t have scum meta on them though but they're lurking for some reason and the self vote is weird.

Meh, I think they don't really enjoy this game. Seemed like they were looking for some reactions to their self-vote, though not pushing a lot there...

Hmm can be, who do you propose to vote instead?

This feels pretty scum indicative. I don't know how you could be so lost on who to vote for that you need someone to tell you who to vote.

VOTE: Salsa

Town and scum do this

all the time

.

i'm gonna shorten my response to 1012 because this game is already giving me a headache due to wiki and it's not worth it

i am disagreeing with you? or rather i'm calling you out for falsely saying i have a "contradiction" going. like, 740 asks how i can think a post she made made sense while still thinking it's scummy. i can think both, because scum sometimes tells the truth. she was telling the truth about never claiming there was scum between dwlee/wiki. that doesn't make her town.

i'm not quoting word for word (and am rather carrying over the meaning) because it's easier to make my point that way. like it seemed obvious to me that "cuz i'm mafia pushing you?" was said in a "is this not what you're thinking right now?" context.

and it's called hyperbole. yes, you obviously didn't have literally zero reads and takes this whole game. the intended meaning was always "i think you've given too little content for how you've been active", like i think it was kinda understood to mean that?

You're making it really obvious that you just don't want to admit you were wrong. Whatever.

This post reads similarly to 340.

i'm gonna shorten my response to 1012 because this game is already giving me a headache due to wiki and it's not worth it

i am disagreeing with you? or rather i'm calling you out for falsely saying i have a "contradiction" going. like, 740 asks how i can think a post she made made sense while still thinking it's scummy. i can think both, because scum sometimes tells the truth. she was telling the truth about never claiming there was scum between dwlee/wiki. that doesn't make her town.

i'm not quoting word for word (and am rather carrying over the meaning) because it's easier to make my point that way. like it seemed obvious to me that "cuz i'm mafia pushing you?" was said in a "is this not what you're thinking right now?" context.

and it's called hyperbole. yes, you obviously didn't have literally zero reads and takes this whole game. the intended meaning was always "i think you've given too little content for how you've been active", like i think it was kinda understood to mean that?

A50 why not salsa

I dunno. She tried to pocket me, didn't she? I'm glad to accept that pocket for today.

Yeah, pocket the person who also in people’s suspect list..

>_>

that's like the entire point of whiteknighting

THANK YOU. Holy shit, I feel like I'm losing my mind.

I

think

this post usually comes from town. I usually just don't see scum getting extremely exasperated with town.

I'm not sure why people suddenly piled their votes onto Dorsey.

Three doesn't even look at the reasoning as to why.

A50 can easily be either allignment here
same goes for GE i think

Oh wait, forgot I'm damn near town locking A50. He just has close to no WIM this game, at least so far.

Many people have said that A50 having low WIM is a scumtell.

three's read on me is utter bullshit because he's been called out by multiple people as misrepping, which means that maybe, *maybe* your posts are fucking confusing and it's not the rest of us that are wrong

rn i'm leaning on it being town bullshit

but it's bullshit nonetheless

Dude can you literally talk about anything other than a post from a fucking week ago? You're so focused on something that doesn't matter and you refuse to actually try to solve me. I'm trying to figure you out and you don't even acknowledge it.

Also "called out by multiple people" you mean you, who I scum read? Salsa, who I scum read and who also LIED about the misrep? Lmao. Sel is the only other one and it got clarified a week ago that what I said wasn't a misrep, it was a misunderstanding. Get the fuck over it and play the game or get limmed.

Tonal inconsistency.

-----

Not to preflip associative, but Three has been hard pushing Salsa nearly the entire game, and so have I, albeit for different reasons. I think a Three scumflip means Salsa is town. This doesn't particularly read to me like a bus, mainly because of how Three gets exasperated.

With that said, VOTE: Three

[T3]

when i hyperpost everyone yells at me

when i make a good and well thought out wall i get ignored

[T3]

How about this....give me your most convincing scumread and like 2 or 3 sentences and I'll tell you if you're town off of it

three

he made some posts that came off as manipulative
he is approaching the game from a pov that assumes stuff

[T3]

How about this....give me your most convincing scumread and like 2 or 3 sentences and I'll tell you if you're town off of it

three

he made some posts that came off as manipulative
he is approaching the game from a pov that assumes stuff

Outside of DW who you have Town locked from meta, who do you think is Town?

you
wiki
looker

then like
maybe datisi

[T3]

there are just so many lurkers and people not doing anything that my reads aren't very solid

[T3]

Wow, an explosion of posts and wagon shifts to protect Datisi. That was quick. VOTE: Datisi

I jump off A50 and now all of a sudden he's scum. Datisi is the manipulator. He's also the one calling people "fucking morons" and "purposefully ignorant".

this is going into conspiracy theory level territory

[T3]

And @Andres, because clearly Datisi is the boss.

You know we can vote wherever we want right? Every single possible wagon has been tried by certain players but nobody is really touching my T3 case, there hasn’t been much of a disagreement from anyone really, and T3 is just constantly sheeping whatever they think will get through instead of them.

how is what i did sheeping

[T3]

956 I didn't see Salsa scum, then I saw your actual reasoning.

You know how absurd this is in light of the fact that T3 posted 936?

What is happening here?

dlfjlfklakalsdkajdklakdad

i didn't see why dwlee or whoever i responded to thought salsa was scum

[T3]

T3, who is Andre for you?

????

[T3]

T3's been shading a good number of people, including myself

but he hasn't really stuck his neck out on any them that I can remember, including the ones that actually got pressured so I don't know what to make of it

at the very least he's here and talkative and responding and stuff
if i seriously scumread his actions i'd be all over his ass trust me

I’m SR’ing the shit out of the slot. Shading half the game (literally) and still not acknowledging that fact or really providing some more detail on where they stand now, or providing more TRs than what, DW, and going with whatever they think can get executed, why is this not being SR’ed?

i point out scummy posts about townreads but don't usually vote them for it

i've said this like 5 times

[T3]

then like
maybe datisi

why am i a maybe? i feel like you called some bits of my posting town quite a few times recently.

not as strong as the other townreads

[T3]

@andres

if you see... basically any of my scumgames then you'll see that as scum i tend to bus and townread a lot of people early
the exact opposite of what i'm doing here

[T3]

@andres

if you see... basically any of my scumgames then you'll see that as scum i tend to bus and townread a lot of people early
the exact opposite of what i'm doing here

How could I possibly know that you aren’t bussing here? Fine if you want to argue that you would have more TRs, but the other part of your argument is impossible for me to know unless I had perfect knowledge of who is Town and who is Scum.

yeah
fair

[T3]

And @Andres, because clearly Datisi is the boss.

You know we can vote wherever we want right? Every single possible wagon has been tried by certain players but nobody is really touching my T3 case, there hasn’t been much of a disagreement from anyone really, and T3 is just constantly sheeping whatever they think will get through instead of them.

how is what i did sheeping

Your extended case for Three is coming after they’ve been pushed loudly by other players. It’s not original. Sheeping is the wrong word. It’s more like you’re piling on there. Your detailed case against Three comes in 1883, though you were already drafting it around 1849. Up to that point, you had signaled you SR there (374, 1346, though only partly contradicted by 1299), but nothing really substantial. Well, before your extended case, Three seemed to be gathering more meaningful pressure by Datisi and to a lesser extent Iconeum (though Ico’s vote on Three in 1876 comes before your extended case but after you had hit submit on a bunch of quotes, which was clearly signaling your intent to build a case there).

i had all these reasons as to why i thought three was scum but then i complied it in 1883

1849 i knew what my case was but i hadn't finished actually writing it out

[T3]

956 I didn't see Salsa scum, then I saw your actual reasoning.

You know how absurd this is in light of the fact that T3 posted 936?

What is happening here?

dlfjlfklakalsdkajdklakdad

i didn't see why dwlee or whoever i responded to thought salsa was scum

Okay I get that now. You weren’t expressing a read in that earlier post.

I think you need a crash course in punctuation.

Wait no hold on. That post is you putting a vote down for Salsa saying you didn’t like their tone. How could that possibly be you questioning someone else about their read?

miscommunication AGH

so i had a bunch of posts from 936 to the post where i said that your case on salsa makes sense

936 was me voting salsa for bad tone
then there was a post where i said i didn't see the scum motivation. this was in response to dwlee, i didn't understand dwlee's case.
then i saw your case, and agreed with it.

[T3]

honestly that's kinda fair
i'm not really sure how to defend
like it was my genuine read in the moment

[T3]

i'm not really sure how to defend

Find a scum instead of you and prove it

three

[T3]

How about this....give me your most convincing scumread and like 2 or 3 sentences and I'll tell you if you're town off of it

three

he made some posts that came off as manipulative
he is approaching the game from a pov that assumes stuff

wiki's (trying) to be manipulative
i've made a few manipulative posts
hell, i've been sorting for example Datisi with assumptions - does that make me scum?

it seemed like three wanted to just continually bad shade selynee
and wiki is obvtown

[T3]

Wow, an explosion of posts and wagon shifts to protect Datisi. That was quick. VOTE: Datisi

I jump off A50 and now all of a sudden he's scum. Datisi is the manipulator. He's also the one calling people "fucking morons" and "purposefully ignorant".

this is going into conspiracy theory level territory

Can you expand on this?

• Are you saying that you would've drawn a different conclusion from that information? Because, when I presented it to you in conversation, all you said was "okay" and stopped talking.
  
  Spoiler: 1533

  It's just that I'm skimming through and all of the bigger wagons (Wiki, Selynee, geraintm,

  Almost50

  , Dorsey) have had you on them. You weren't on A50's, though.

here's the bad faith tone again... i'm saying that going "wow, you were on a lot of wagons, therefore you're scum" is an extremely Bad And Simplistic take that's more likely to come from scum than someone who's actually solving the game. i'm not claiming i would've townread myself because of it.

? Looking at the post, it doesn't look like I was saying that at all. It looks like I was asking you why you wagoned that way and why you were so dismissive of the speculation, especially if "patterns and inconsistencies are a way of finding scum".

I would like to see some more meaningful votes from {DW, Looker, geraintm, A50}, and to a lesser extent Salsa. Wiki and DW are definitely not getting executed today, and Looker and DW are just straight up not voting with 2 days to go.

VOTE: Datisi

VOTE: salsa
i feel pressured into this

You sent from one vanity wagon to the next - switch to a bigger wagon.

he's saying that datisi is scum who has everyone pocketed which is kinda impossible
ish

[T3]

There's also the fact that I've just seen the "I'm Investigative" con recently. Anyone who claims an Investigative while NOT being put @E-1 should be eliminated. PERIOD.

"Please don't lim me"

[T3]

T3 protected gera with asking about his scum motivation, but he said nothong like this about dorsey. This question is more easy to use to Dorsey, than to Gera.

If there are no mistakes in my townies, gamma has found almost all townies (perfect read?), while Three played hard against many townies.

Salsa - almost the same as Three.

A50 doesnt play at all, and he has convinient mixed position about his scumreads.

Sely... I always forget about Sely, but every time i open her iso,her position is good i guess... t3 is suspicious to her... and some people tr her a lot

If datisi is town, i can accept the mistaking view of new player dorsey. It seems genuine how he thinks that ico is like alt of datisi...

My thoughts here are based on the assumption that nobody of townies mistakes very much (maybe except dorsey). If there are any hige mistakes, well, most of them at keast are not mine i guess

dorsey said scummy stuff

[T3]

How about roleblocking looker? What do you think, a50?
He tries so hard. Im not sure he wants be roleblocked.

How do you know there's a Town RB?

hold up
WAIT A MINUTE

[T3]

this is extremely annoying

andres is tunneling me for... good ish reasons but he's wrong
wiki is sheeping along for really terrible reasons

[T3]

Somebody mentioned that Wiki has voted and accused the entire player list of being scum. Is it possible Wiki is just pushing everyone with the intention of trying to get town to claim PRs to save themselves?

does that actually happen though?

[T3]

T3 tries to elim you with all cost.
I scumread him.
And you are saying about my open wolfing.
How should I understand this? As protection of t3 obviously. And you are thinking about dam traitor sh from nowhere in your head with no any healthy logic.

chill alright
you're town but you're poking at nai stuff

[T3]

like does scum really play that fast and loose

[T3]

like does scum really play that fast and loose

They absolutely can. Just because it doesn't usually happen doesn't mean it can't happen. If you ever rule out a possibility for scum, then they'll always be able to do whatever they want and get away with it if you just hand wave it away as "scum doesn't ever do that".

Do you see a town motivation for signaling to the scum team what to prepare for wrt PR night actions? Do you see a town motivation for accusing the entire player list of being scum and then claiming PR unprovoked?

True....

[T3]

With three a claimed VT it isn't the worst thing in the world if he is town to flip him here. And if Andres is behind it I feel okay voting there. I agree with Andres on the feeling disarmed by t3's reaction but I'm trying to remember if something similar happened in opposum mafia

in opossum i just completely imploded and still dodged the lim

[T3]

why does scum!three claim VT but not PR?

to not be suspected for claiming pr

[T3]

i feel like three might be town but i have no evidence to back that up
objectively i think he's scum though

[T3]

I'm never going to understand this site meta. Punish townies who scum hunt and protect scum who act polite. Fucking bonkers mind set.

Yes.

[T3]

why does scum!three claim VT but not PR?

to not be suspected for claiming pr

YOU LITERALLY CLAIMED PR AND LIVED!

true facts

[T3]

wait a minute

[T3]

theoretically a balanced 13p game would mean that on average you would need about 3 lims to win.
4 groupscum = 4 lims to win
3 groupscum = ~4 lims to win
2 groupscum = ~3 lims to win
1 groupscum = ~2 lims to win

so that means there are probably 2 groupscum
idk i'll do something mathy when i get home
but if three is groupscum he's probably be trying to save himself more?

[T3]

ugh

[T3]

I could 100% see Wiki counterclaim that Jailkeeper claim as town

[T3]

i only posted once after the claim because i had a thing rl

[T3]

i've been townreading you the entire game

[T3]

A50, salsa, gera, Dorsey, swap one of those for a possible deepwf

[T3]

i can maybe see that universe existing

but also wiki panicking when he saw the main wagon claimed jk and counterclaiming to make sure it goes through sounds much more possible to me

do you think it's *likely*?

I didn’t notice this. I’m really not sure, but I’m leaning wiki town

[T3]

Wiki counter claimed jail keeper.

[T3]

Enchant’s progression on wiki is kinda weird

[T3]

Not like weird as in scum

[T3]

VOTE: salsa

[T3]

WIM dropping

[T3]

Idk how many votes wiki is at but consider my vote on him in spirit because he self voted