open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[midwaybear]

VOTE: skitter

Hi everyone. I pretty much agree with Datisi’s thoughts on flow trap not being w/w with SS. It is more likely than not that scum has someone who was aware of SS pattern, but not guaranteed. Having meta numbers seems a little broken lol

[midwaybear]

the struggle when you have general setup questions, but asking here will just make people go "dumb questions!!!" "Trying to dumbtell!!"

update on the plan: I'm just gonna wing it and fake it till I make it

Good idea, I will too

What setup questions do you have (Andante/flow)?

[midwaybear]

i mean, my point was that flow trap is unlikely to be scum period, not that they're unlikely to be s/s with s_s. so i am curious where is that interpretation coming from.

I misinterpreted you then and probably replaced your thoughts with my own (I was thinking similar things because I also noticed SS always picked 9).
I don’t think the any of the pairings decide to pick same as scum except for maybe for the two 1s.

[midwaybear]

You think only scum picked 1?

I think if scum were to double up, it would be on a low number (like 1). Also doubling up hurts your chance at getting a good role, but also makes people think you aren’t wolves together. If Datisi and Pooky are wolf, I think they might give that a shot. I don’t think the other pairings do that. I don’t scumread either of them though. It’s more of an observation. But also scum chose multitasking which seems better when scum actually have roles to work with, so…

[midwaybear]

Like Datisi u actually think I’m scum here or?

by now? not really. i've been skimming this game but everything is kinda getting blurred together and i have no thoughts, so. will try again later.

hm maybe ur town lol idk

Funny interaction
Datisi: IV, why are you scummy
IV: no u
Datisi: maybe ur town
IV: yeah maybe you are too
Possibly 1 wolf in IV/Datisi.

[midwaybear]

Agree with the Andante townreads. I saw one post that I don't think she makes as maf.
I also agree with skitter that catboi's townread on me is a bit TMI. I am not sure how confident catboi normally is though.
UNVOTE:

[midwaybear]

@catboi I forgot you were Marigold lol. I think I read you as town that game as well, but you were probably within your scum range. Ya, ur read on me is fine.
Also, I can't tell if IV is joking in some of his posts which makes it hard to get a read on him (579).

[midwaybear]

aha someone felt the same thing!! a good sign!

I'm not sure mindmeld works when the explanation for the read is just "feeling"...

[midwaybear]

If I didn't agree with observations that skitter's comments about Datisi being chill were a bit off, I would scumread the recent back and forth between nsg and Datisi.

[midwaybear]

Scum theater. But, I feel like I'm getting too conf biased (around your slot) because I really think you are scum. I'm starting to build a narrative that makes you scum regardless of other alignments(nsg/skitter), and I don't think that is very good. Maybe you are scum, but I don't want to tunnel at this point.

[midwaybear]

I didn't like skitter's read on Datisi, and I was also thinking that skitter wouldn't make a read like that on her buddy. So that potentially indicated Datisi as townie. But I had no reason to suspect skitter, then I would scumread that interaction between nsg and Datisi.

[midwaybear]

what about that interaction seems like scum theater?

You enter the thread with some light scumreads on me and Datisi. Datisi said your scumread on him made sense and then you guys bounced back and forth and it looks like you don't scumread him that much anymore. Seemed like a plausible w/w interaction. Now that I'm typing this out it seems a bit silly, but that was my thought at the time. I'm probably too conf biased around Datisi.

because I really think you are scum.

what's making you so confident this early?

I didn't like your interaction with IV earlier and how you both sort of didn't want to go any further. I also found 642 a bit off. But yeah, that doesn't warrant this level of confidence so I don't think I will ISO you rn or anything like that.

[midwaybear]

if the reason is logic then scum can come up with it pretty easily but if it's a gut feeling that springs from a town mindset it might be harder.

I think I agree with you more now. I was thinking it's harder for scum to fake longer chains of "townie thought", but I don't disagree that it's not hard to fake townie logic. I think there is a difference between the two though and I still don't think it was hard for scum to scumread my entrance (nsg called it classically scummy?)
About IV though, I have been trying to get a read on him based on how he has tried to read me this game. Cuz I do think it is townie that he has this focus on me (and Datisi). I think it is more natural to town to try to read people they find readable while scum might go with the game more and make reads on whoever convenient (yes, I still think scum will "read" people they would usually find readable, but IV focus on me and Datisi is a lot more than i would expect). I was initially suspicious on why he would vote me so quickly though, but a good explanation might be that he just had no other leads which makes sense. I also read (ok more like skimmed) what Andante wrote up and I don't think a lot of what she's pointed out is actually scummy. I think I'm lean-town on IV rn.
Also, VOTE: Mare
The interaction with Datisi felt a bit off.

[midwaybear]

Midwaybear do you thjnk I should have you as town by now? or anyone familiar with you?

Probably? I don't think I call Datisi/nsg out as scum because I don't see that as scum. Everything else I could probably do as scum though Also, I think catboi's early tr on me was more luck (?), but he did correctly read me on early on in the last game we played.
Also, I don't think we've played in over a year so I don't think I am obv town anymore (I died during day last 2 town games).

[midwaybear]

how I picked my number was I placed 9 fingers down, clicked the keyboard, and picked the first digit
I admit that I wanted to pick high fwiw. Didn't want to pick a two digit

[midwaybear]

Oh, would it resolve you at the bottom?

3 picking the same number means basically last place

[midwaybear]

wasn't midway the one who SRed Datisi, then backed off when Datisi started asking about it? and that "confident scum read" became non existent?

The read(logic) was never strong but the gut feeling was. So when Datisi started asking about it, I realized that there wasn't really reason for my gut to feel that way.

[midwaybear]

then why did you say you were confident in the read?

Cuz of the strong gut feeling

[midwaybear]

why do you think I don’t get that vibe now, if I’m town here?

I was really hyped for that team mafia game so had a lot of energy for it (at the beginning at least; by the end, not so much...)
This is more of a normal game. I was definitely tryharding in TM. idk what esle

[midwaybear]

UNVOTE:
Fine with unvoting b/c we have time. I have disagreed with a lot of Mare this game, but I can see a town perspective during interaction with skitter. I feel like I always scumread Cakez because of his short posts calling people scum. Some of Andante's posts make me think I am giving too much good faith in my read of Andante (ahh). I'll read more in depth in a bit.

[midwaybear]

I did notice that flow went from 100+ posts two days ago to 1 post yesterday, but I thought it was probably because flow was busy. Also, I think scum would be more self-conscious about that activity drop? I don't really think scum allows themselves to make that big of a drop without explanation.
I still don't really townread Cakez. I saw the point that he doesn't go after Pooky immediately after getting burned which does make sense, but nothing else he has done has really pushed me one way or another. Looking at the games I played with Cakez, it seems like I can't read him well from the normal things I do to read people so maybe that point about Pooky is something I should consider more.
Also, I thought Andante saying "yet" wrt Datisi read was fine. I don't think that scum actually say "yet" to set up a push on a townread later on.
pedit: Warehouse 13 was a long time ago...

[midwaybear]

Lol, maybe I should use that.
I think it might make catboi town for bringing it up though.

[midwaybear]

IV, I won't argue that I have been more reactive this game compared to Chromatic Ascension.

makes me feel like he's more interested in surviving this game and faking a trajectory rather than actually playing the game here

But I wonder why this play makes you think I am interested in surviving? I don't think lurking is a viable option to survive as scum here, but maybe you meant something else. I agree more with skitter's 1449 that my play is easier and more indicative of what scum would do.

I think I'm back to being a bit off put about catboi's early read on me (like skitter). 314 seems to me like he was exaggerating the townieness of my posts. "Serious mechanical minded discussion", meta numbers as a "flourish"? I appreciate it, but do you really believe that.
That's not the answer I expected from Datisi. I don't think he would ever describe that single post as a "case", so the answer I expected something like: "voted midway and then ivs case afterward seemed good enough". So to double down on 1429 being the real cause just doesn't seem legit.

[midwaybear]

if you agree you've been very reactive this game can you tell us why?

Not super sure because I don't think my playstyle has changed too much from Chromatic or since that TM game tbh. I think it is just game to game variation and that this stuff is within my townrange as well even though you might not have seen it before (although it probably exists if you do a deep dive). But I also don't want to sac this game so you have this in your file of "town-midway" later on, so I'll hopefully step it up and improve your read of me.

so i kind of want other people to weigh in and see if im just being way too nitpicky or if this is actually a little sketch

Yeah, I think I saw what you were seeing. We even both used "double-down" lol

[midwaybear]

Cakez bruh

I was very curious about the narrative described here and why it was held so close to chest.

I felt like my Datisi read was biased and it began to bias other reads because of that (for example: datisi scum -> skitter town).

you were definitely not self-focused as scum and you were diplomatic

Can you elaborate on these characteristics a bit? From the standard definition, Faker seems relatively diplomatic this game (he even mentioned that it was basically the goal of the alt).

[midwaybear]

I mean why did you like his townread earlier ?

I thought it was fine because he did have an early townread on me in another game. But comparing the language used for the tr, that game it seemed to be mostly feeling (which is ok) and this game he actually gave reasons. But the reasons here look a little manufactured.

[midwaybear]

umm ok

[midwaybear]

there is a world of difference between being personally affable and being actively diplomatic

Hm, I can sort of see what you mean. Probably why flow took you out of his poe.

Which begs the question, why is their discussion not TvT?

I found it odd that they were willing to de-escalate their suspicions of each so quickly so I thought that one of them was scum looking to avoid a fight. I did not think that one of them was more suspicious at the time, but if you asked me at the time I would probably say Datisi for backing off first. Now, it seems more nai since it looks like they do similar stuff every gamestart.

Unclear where this factors in

Agreeing with his opening statement didn't factor into my read of him at all really.

Why did you begin to believe Datisi specifically was scum in these, and why did it strengthen?

I thought Datisi was scummy because his play didn't really fit in with my expectation of how a town him would play. I don't think I have played much with Datisi, but I have followed a few games he was in and I got the impression that he was pretty free flowing (speaking his thoughts) as town. ig his opening just didn't match up with that because now that I look back he looks ok.
The scumread strengthened because I'm sort of an ego player, but there really wasn't enough for me to actually push him.

[midwaybear]

Thanks flow
I might tr Cakez for 1544. I'm not super familiar with Cakez scum meta, but I don't think he hops in to take a shot at me and dips out. It's sorta annoying, but maybe town. Cakez, can you elaborate on some of your reads (preferably who you read as town right now). Ik you said you mostly agree with Faker, but it would be helpful to hear your own thoughts.

[midwaybear]

This is where I'm at rn
{IV, Andante}
{Faker, flow, Cakez}
{catboi, Mare}
{SA, SS, Pooky, nsg, skitter, Datisi}
Last tier is unorder and I like first two tiers for town. I'll try to flesh out reasoning later.
Mare, what's your read on skitter rn? Faker, what did you think of catboi's early read on me.

[midwaybear]

skitter do you have a read on mwb?

This feels like bait
VOTE: Pooky
Be back later

[midwaybear]

About my reads, I have seen people scumread Cakez because his play is easy for scum to do/not doing much. I agree that all he has done this game is basically call out posts he sees as scummy without much detail, but I feel like he would make an attempt to ask people questions and cement himself in thread more as scum.
I'm back to not scumreading catboi for his early read on me because he mentioned that he was making an effort to justify his initial feeling. So the weird wording isn't as much as a problem for me.
For Mare, I expected her to mention something about skitter when she came back yesterday so not doing so was a bit of a ? 1561 did address getting voted but that was from Faker and the rest of that post makes me confused lol. Also, Mare why do you tr me?
Thinking about sleepless, I think he is townie for intentionally "beetlejuicing". I'm not even sure why that is considering scummy traditionally. I feel like scum would not immediately attack a vote on them.

[midwaybear]

UNVOTE:
After reading Pooky's next few posts, I can see his reasoning and that quote that I voted him for doesn't feel that malicious anymore.
VOTE: skitter back to my rvs vote but for non-random reasons (well even that first vote technically wasn't random).
Faker, I think you are reading too much into 1507 as a pocket onto you.

[midwaybear]

because Pooky's vote made total sense.

Why? TBH, I didn't really get why Pooky voted you

[midwaybear]

So if skitter were to flip town, would that change your read on North and Datisi? Do you normally make Day 1 reads bases on associatives? It seems like your entire read on Datisi is based on your skitter read being stronger than your North read.

If she flipped town, I wouldn't necessarily think that Datisi and North were scum but if she flipped red I might be more inclined to tr them (this is more how I thought earlier in the game than right now).
I don't really make D1 reads off associative which is why that whole interaction doesn't rlly factor into my reads rn

I need to stop lying to myself and pretending that I'm going to reread the past pages and make meaningful commentary.

[midwaybear]

and those are

oops reasons probably imples that I actually have reasons. but my reasons for voting you are mostly that nobody really seems to scumread you (which I find odd because I don't think many people are townreading you) and I have disagreed with a lot of your takes this game

[midwaybear]

Faker, I looked at the quotes from Cakez surrounding Mare and I do agree that him pivoting off of Mare into Pooky so quickly is a little questionable. But his explanation later on that it felt manufactured makes sense, and it also makes sense that he would jump at something smaller given that he just played in a game where Pooky was scum. In general, I don't think Cakez has had much of a scum agenda this game. He doesn't seem to be trying to build connections with others which is what I would expect him to do as scum. Your insistence that Cakez is scummy shifts him down to null-town to me while I do think his posting aligns with town Cakez, the content is generally lacking. It's unfortunate game start coincided with the holidays.

[midwaybear]

- why does nobody scumreading me mean that you should vote me (kinda just trying to understand this thought process here ...)
- which takes do you disagree with?
- in general, do you have any spicy reads you'd like to share?

It feels weird because most people in this game have received pressure. I think all townies go through suspicion at one point or another, so you sort of remaining on the fringes of that is weird. That part was sort of a gut thing so idk if I explain it too well.
Some takes were: Datisi early game was "cool", SA beetlejuicing was scummy. I know it is only two though...
I gave my reads yesterday. I think my most spicy read atm is that you are scum. Also, I read 1705
I don't read your quoted portion of SA's bigpost as backwards justification. Although I do agree that the reasons given weren't that scum-indicative (for IV), I think it is a reasonable belief to have as town. Ok, the stuff on IV later isn't too great either. I don't really understand why you called him out for his nsg section either.
It just seems to me that you can't really read SA based on his takes because he is perpetually behind. So I would read him based off his real-time interactions and, again, I don't think scum is that open about "beetlejuicing" which makes him a town lean for me.

[midwaybear]

you can't really read SA

BTW, I didn't mean that you(skitter) can't read SA. I mean that this town as a whole should put less factor into SA takes when reading him.

[midwaybear]

Ok Faker, I messed up the order and can sort of see that Cakez is sticking to Pooky but also seems to sr equally if not more. I think that's something for Cakez to answer.

[midwaybear]

My eyes were open to the crimes.

~

There've been things that Midway's said that I looked and thought, yeah, I've said/thought something like this before as town. What's the bad parts about him?

I hope people get their motivation back

[midwaybear]

he was significantly easier to read, had real time interactions, popped in occasionally with thoughts, had follow-through between his posts, had significant scumreads, etc, while also being behind and having the same work schedule, so i don't think he should be given a pass here for that at all

Ok, this is fair. I looked at the post counts for that game and he had 187 which is surface level of me but still a lot more. Ya, his IV read is not good which I think could be explained by confbias + not reading the thread. But not reading the thread could be scum indicative? I'll wait for the others to give their thoughts about SA ig.
pedit: true too lol

[midwaybear]

tiger wanna vote midwaybear together with me?

fool me twice...

VOTE: midwaybear

i still really don't want to kill the best town player on d1 (yes that is a real thought i have as town too) but ya idk what my tiger read is anymore

bruh

[midwaybear]

Can you ask for specific ones because I can't elaborate on them all some are just gut feels and/or no reason to SR them and such

Eh don't have any specifics and it's fine because you actually started posting again. Reading your posts, still think you're townie.

[midwaybear]

really at the end of the day im just left weakly scumreading him for all the stuff he did before i pushed him

I agree with skitter about the gamestate is rn. She made the observation that only two people are voting sleepless and I think only three are voting me right now. I think the current lack of consensus means we end up just deflecting onto Sleepless or me at the end. Tbh, it seems like few people have super strong scumreads so im somewhat tempted just to sheep mare lol

[midwaybear]

VOTE: SS
I'm unvoting skitter because I think she would push me as scum here since I'm a high number. I will look at flow too, but I townread him earlier.

[midwaybear]

i definitely feel that is a scumtell for me

ok? from what

I voted SS because I didn't really want to vote flow and just thought SS was a bit under the radar. But I did say that I was rereading flow's posts. I mostly agree with your assessment that while flow doesn't have much content and is a bit troll, it could just be that this is a tough game and little motivation etc...

[midwaybear]

midway's lack of urgency

Also about the looming deadline, I'm pretty sure I talked about that earlier today. I guess I wasn't really urgent but I did acknowledge that that was a problem.

[midwaybear]

ur EOD approach isn't making any sense to me from a town perspective

Hmm. Well to explain my perspective. I don't have much firm scumreads this game. I do have townreads, light townreads (which are sort of contested), and this big pool of players. So I have been going around voting and trying to figure out that pool. I think my vote on SS was more of a process of that than the incoming deadline. You're right that I should work withtown on the options currently at the table. But I still have doubts on flow (being scum) and my read on sleepless is p similar to yours
What did you think I would do as town though? Put up a fight? I mean I probably would. But even though I agreed with skitter that the gamestate would probably push the elim onto someone like me sleepless (and flow ig), it doesn't seem to rlly be deflecting on me so there's not much of a reason.

[midwaybear]

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I meant that you expect a town!me to put up a fight because I am about to get elimed, but I'm saying that there isn't rlly a reason to because there's not pressure.

[midwaybear]

i can't recall a time where he was seriously pushed. the only time ive actually seen him get flipped was as scum in 2167 when he finally got flashed he put up very little resistance and just memed and rolled over after playing pretty well for most of the early game.

I got pushed in Chromatic Ascension and Mini Normal 2195 (where I was actually pushed by scum Datisi lol). So you can look at my final posts there if you want to see how town!me reacts to elim pressure (and I was elimed in both games).

[midwaybear]

people got distracted on other slots that were more polarizing

True, but are we getting distracted by polarizing slots here? I don't really think so.

[midwaybear]

lol glad that you are getting the right read on me?

im not really sure why you had either of these reactions

Also, to answer your question here. I thought that when you were asking skitter to vote me with you, that you were doing the same thing you called Pooky out for doing (tiger trap). I thought you were townreading me there, but it seems like that was a coincidence and you genuinely just wanted to vote me with skitter lol

[midwaybear]

I don't get a good feeling from you saying that
Yes, you are reading it correctly now more or less.

[midwaybear]

UNVOTE:
I am willing to vote flow right now cuz I think I was too lenient on my read earlier.

[midwaybear]

can you talk about this?

There's not much too it. I just think I am(was) townreading flow more because I townread him earlier in the game for gut reasons which doesn't really seem logical at this point in the day. I don't really see that much of an issue with the content (but I also haven't read it closely enough), but it's the activity that seems a bit off. flow's posting basically just dropped off after the first irl day. That could be just demotivation which is nai, but idk anymore

[midwaybear]

? i don't really know what this means

I townread flow earlier in the game from just gut feelings and I think my current read on him is just sheeping those gut feelings but not anything based in the present.

[midwaybear]

this is one of the few posts in flow's iso that townpinged me a bit

Same, but there's no follow up on it which is a little bizarre.

[midwaybear]

Also, I do townread Andante, skitter, Mare all to some extent but draft theory does suggest that scum at least try to pick high numbers. So I def think there's scum in Andante/skitter/Mare/Mena/Datisi
I don't really think it is Andante and Datisi is growing on me. But this is stuff to think about for tmrw.

[midwaybear]

Ugh, did not like SA questioning IV about the dream. What are the votes at rn?

[midwaybear]

what do we all think of cakez here?

I could vote him.

[midwaybear]

what do we all think of cakez here?

I could vote him.

nvm i wouldnt

[midwaybear]

VOTE: Sleepless
Think this is E-2

[midwaybear]

why sleepless over flow
like just *gestures* at this vote, why

idk im fine to vote either but i didn't like sleepless questioning iv on dream
and agree with others that his posting just doesn't seem townie but this does remind me of how i would be posting so idk
idk what to do about flow though (there might be something)

[midwaybear]

yes ik i have not been doing much this eod but i jsut don't have a confident read on either of these two players
@Datisi sorry for unclear but i was thinking atm that flow should get vigged, but a replacement would probably be better

[midwaybear]

I don't like the idea of starting a brand new wagon in 24 hours.

Maybe dumb question but why?

[midwaybear]

Ugh why are we even voting midway

you deserve an oscar

[midwaybear]

That's not even my thought process. I don't townread flow anymore.

[midwaybear]

@Sleepless sorry if I sound frustrated at you. Your insistence on wanting to die just makes me think you are scum faking it lol

[midwaybear]

Oh well, I'm not voting flow mostly because I scumread your posts today and I think he gets replaced. I think I mentioned that my early gut read had no factor on my current reads.

@Datisi sure, but especially here because I'm #3 in draft...

[midwaybear]

what if we did a last minute pivot and flashwagoned obvscum Mena????

Mena does seem a bit off this game. I expected him to be posting more and my tinfoil is that he replaced into a situation where his scumbuddy has been being wagoned and is a bit defeated by that. But, idk what to think of Pooky
I want to end this day with Sleepless unless he flips my read on him.

[midwaybear]

I should be around 1 hour before deadline btw

[midwaybear]

huh, everyone on my wagon comes from flow's wagon

[midwaybear]

If you are voting flow because you think he will be harder to read than SA, then maybe reconsider because flow is probably getting replaced. Also, I think flow’s demotivation this game does seem genuine. I might be getting my timeline wrong, but people (except for maybe Faker) only started suspecting him after he started dropping off in posts. Also think he would try harder as scum in last few posts.

[midwaybear]

Ugh
Why do y’all think none of the higher ordered numbers died?
VOTE: Datisi
Didn’t like your end of day. Felt generally lazy. Even though you said you didn’t want to do much, I still scum read it.
Also, I lightly townread the flow Alyssa slot from the early interaction with andante.

[midwaybear]

@skitter look at my last post of the day. I expressed a light tr on flow there. Also, I expected you to be voting catboi because Faker died.

[midwaybear]

Whichever slots were most content with the stagnation are probably scum

So this is why you're voting Cakez?

[midwaybear]

I think IV and Faker were killed because they were pretty consensus townreads. I think scum avoided the top slots partially because there is a doctor in this game and also because at least one of those slots is scum.

[midwaybear]

I did not kill IV, believe it or not

SS, is this waht you saw

[midwaybear]

i don't rlly think andante is scum tbh

why is a lazy eod scummy?

You stood out to me for just seemed willing to go with the flow (lol)
moving your vote, making some comments here and there
but I got the impression that you didn't really care what the final outcome of the day was which is scummy considering that I would expect town to be at least somewhat invested and wagons were probably all town

[midwaybear]

Can we just make Andante claim

lmao cause that's a towny idea

i actually thought this too fwiw

[midwaybear]

Yes because I literally cared less about the vote and did so openly lmao.

Ya, your end of day didn't read that well either. I'm voting Datisi because whim/gut

[midwaybear]

Ye, I townread Andante and sort of townread skitter. Based off of Sleepless (rip) claim, we know that there is either doctor or roleblocker in this game. I'm pretty sure skitter and Andante were also pretty townread yesterday, so it would make sense for scum to try to kill them. But, if my reads on them are right (hopefully), scum didn't kill them because they fear that doc might be on them. This explains why skitter and Andante are alive I think and I will probably townread whoever claims doctor (maybe not locktown but pretty sure there is doc).
Note: This sort of hinges on everything above being true which idk how likely that is. But I want to take that risk.

Also, I do think scum would aim higher, so there's at least one scum in Datisi/Mena imo (probably just one; but double is tinfoil).

[midwaybear]

Okay but then why vote Datisi over Menalque

idk

[midwaybear]

Yeah, logically there is not much reason to be voting Datisi over Mena. Maybe because I have experience playing with Datisi. But I really don't have a good answer. What's your take on Datisi/Mena?

[midwaybear]

menalque did essentially ~nothing at EOD which struck me as odd that you'd be more critical of Datisi there

I just talked myself into treating Pooky's rep out as NAI which was probably a big reason I was hesitant on that slot earlier. But I think another reason might just be that mena is somewhat not-present this game. So I think it's more productive to vote Datisi and get him to talk than it is to vote Mena. I don't think I have gotten much out of Datisi's responses to me, but that is probably because I haven't really given him much to respond to lol
Anyways, I don't necessarily want Datisi dead over Mena, but I just think a vote on him does more at this point.

@skitter why do you townread SS?

[midwaybear]

No, because taking the posts out of order is ignoring how my thoughts actually progressed

tbf. Even with the posts in order, you still seem to leave yourself open to voting both which was part of Cakez's argument. But I don't really find that in itself to be scum indicative because yesterday's wagons just generally were bad and confusing.

[midwaybear]

so what about a Datisi/Pooky/flow team... Like, if any maf in the world would pick the same number, it'd be pooky and dats... I don't think this is unreasonable

It's not unreasonable. But I don't think guessing scumteams is very productive at this point in the game. Maybe later in the game but definitely not now. Can you explain your scumreads? Any or all.

[midwaybear]

rip i dont see any of those as townie on first glance
also

Gun to my head, Mare is town

mare is low key openwolving this game imo

[midwaybear]

And you weren't acting like someone with a healthy fear of death, yesterday or today.

I don't agree with the first part of this (that Andante didn't fear death yesterday). It seems to me that she genuinely believed that she was going to die N1 which is why her activity dropped a few irl days into Day 1 and why her play seemed so lackluster.
But Andante, I don't think you should sideline yourself today.

pedit: Because he can get towncred from sleepless flipping green? Sleepless was probably flipping anyways. I'm not saying that it is scummy from him, but I don't think its unlikely for SS to do that as scum

[midwaybear]

VOTE: Mare
Back to this vote because I think she is just blatantly scummy. My read on Datisi hasn't rlly changed though.

[midwaybear]

Voting mare also means I have to revisit Cakez. So that will be soon.

[midwaybear]

It seems like she just doesn't care much about solving this game. And she's posted enough where it seems to me just like scum keeping appearance than a townie that is checked out.

[midwaybear]

Why's that how that would come out? Wouldn't she try harder if she thought she only had one day to play?

Nah, I don't think Andante's the type of player to tryhard as town if only having a day to play.
But, now that I think of it. I'm pretty sure Ydrasse coasted as scum after pairing with IC in Holiday Dance. So I probably would have townread her under similar logic (she's not trying to set herself up so town). You were scum with her though. So I'm surprised you didn't mention it.

[midwaybear]

I still don't really scumread Andante here though.

midway, have you gained anything from voting me? if you think it would help you sort me, why haven't you given anything for mw to respond to before unvoting?

I got your replies but it didn't do much to change my read. I have been having trouble reading you this game tbh. It's flip flopped back and forth. I just felt like voting Mare because I scumread her more now. I'm not the type of player to wait for a vote to do something before moving it.

[midwaybear]

This game feels like a lot less than 139 pages.

[midwaybear]

I think Cakez EoD is actually townie and I townread flow's early interaction with Andante. It seemed like a natural progression on reading someone familiar (not much else for flow to read off).

[midwaybear]

not much else for flow to read off

Er, not much for me to read off of for flow

[midwaybear]

how much should I care that Menalque basically hopped onto the same wagon on me despite my slot being his apparently third strongest scumread?

I would say not that much. I don't think he scumreads your slot that much and you mostly ended there by poe.

[midwaybear]

Just hammer who cares anymore we don't need 12 more hours

u could've done it if you wanted to

well I was hoping for a flow hammer not Sleepless

This seems like a town progression. Yes, I can see scum being like "hammer idc who just end day" but then to actually have an opinion on who they want out and not hammer because of that. And then he also doesn't try to make a big deal of prefering flow over sleepless after sleepless is hammered.
Also 2736 is a funny post (the first part), miss you IV

[midwaybear]

uhhh
Actually that doesnt make sense
ignore that ty

[midwaybear]

It would have been townie if sleepless wasn't hammred, but since sleepless was hammered, it's just null unfortunately

[midwaybear]

VOTE: catboi
This guy is scum and I bet that's why Faker was killed

Cakez why not?

VOTE: midway
This guy is scum and I bet that's why IV was killed

[midwaybear]

it also doesn't match his progression before that

I thought Cakez was pretty consistent in prefering flow over sleepless?

[midwaybear]

Only a few days before deadline so it's not a super well tracked progression I guess. But it does sort of make sense. None of his other scumreads are really gaining traction except for flow and maybe me so he just shifts to flow EoD.
anyways gtg

[midwaybear]

Rethinking my read on you

When did this start?

[midwaybear]

The funny part is I think it's very likely I was between maf and IV last night. Good thing I picked IV XD

Who was your other option?

[midwaybear]

yeah agree with above as reasonable explanation. And I dont see how sleepless wagon not initially picking up points towrds scum flow.
Alyssa did you ever talk more about how Cakez EoD was scummy?

[midwaybear]

lol i think im the only one who townreads him based off of tone
although i haven't played in so long (well not that long but long enough) that it's basically like all of you are secret alts. I have no good clue of anyone's meta here tbh so maybe im just really off on cakez (my read on him has nothing concrete).

[midwaybear]

My yolo-whatever solve is something stupid like skitter/Andante/Cakez

UNVOTE:
Well, I did have this thought too so you can get an unvote ig. Game's hard. Except I don't really think Andante is scum. If skitter is scum, she is just wking Andante.
I get the bad feeling that nsg won't really react to the wagon and she'll either lurk out completely or give some content that isn't super readable. I don't really have an opinion on her slot, but this just seems to be continuing things that don't work.
I don't really townread SS pushing Andante because she is such an easy push for scum to make in general. I think most slots have pushed her to some extent this game anyways. So unless you think SS is just incapable of conviction as scum, I don't really buy it.
Anyways, my other tinfoil team is ss/nsg/mena.

[midwaybear]

I don't really have an opinion on her slot, but this just seems to be continuing things that don't work.

Actually, nsg does have a decentish chance of ebing scum so i think this is ok.
Also i tr alyssa for trying to get wagons going.

[midwaybear]

idk why this whole game feels like molasses and like we can't do anything

imagine if we're all just town arguing with each other

[midwaybear]

I will probably vote nsg soon, but want to first thnk about what town nsg means about this game

[midwaybear]

beginning of today certain posts

I’m a bit confused how the three posts at the beginning of the day were enough for you to basically reverse. Can you explain what felt good about them compared to my posting from yesterday?

[midwaybear]

Sorry busy days.
I townread catboi for switching to menalque. Think town get cold feet here more than scum. It's possible nsg is scum.
I don't really agree with alyssa on how self voting is beneficial for the game. Ur not getting wagoned today...
Thoughts on SS? I think he could be scum here.

[midwaybear]

Sorry, after tmrw I should be less busy. Hopefully the night and flip will be good for the game
I think SS is scum now because nobody's really mentioned him at all compared to slots like Cakez and Mena. While I can't exactly tr Cakez/Mena anymore, i still think its not a good look for SS
but idk anymore. my read calibration is out or sorts.

[midwaybear]

im doc and doc skitter n1. lets vote out a different lurker today
VOTE: SS

[midwaybear]

oh yeah i remember andante said she claimed because she wanted doc to protect her? not sure how she knew that
VOTE: andante

[midwaybear]

eh i can see town andante assuming that
VOTE: SS

[midwaybear]

btw, even if andante is scum, it's still not like she could've known there was a doc if you're town, so.

sleepless?

[midwaybear]

Sleepless outed his pick on day 1

if andante is town, shouldnt there be possibility of scum roleblocker
unless ur trying to say that since she did not get roleblocked she assumed there is doc

[midwaybear]

So sad
gg