Mini 2266: GnG's Upick Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Roden]

I will participate.

Appreciate that people think I'm fun and active. Uhhh...if we're doing this then I guess I'd pick Pooky.

VOTE: Pooky

Also don't mind my role or skill set. I got my first pick, so that's nice.

1

[Roden]

I will participate

im gonna post a lot less cuz lol challenge

Nothing in the challenge says your 5th post has to have game advancing content or be a certain length.

What if everybody dipped into the warrior tree and became 1-shot bulletproof?

Going to be hard for mafia to kill anybody. Any strongman type abilities would likely be limited.

3

A single dip into Warrior seems optimal for every alignment tbh.

2

[Roden]

Wait, so if the VC is accurate then

A. This day phase at minimum is plurality, probably due to a role of some kind
B. Roden is already out of the challenge somehow, or was never in it

Interesting

1

It got updated, I'm still in it.

3

[Roden]

In that case I will not be picking up the Miller unless I want the doctor ability from the Mage tree.

1

Is there even any benefit to taking Doctor over Bulletproof Bodyguard? They both require the same amount of experience.

4

[Roden]

We CoUlD aDdReSs ThE eLePhAnT iN tHe RoOm

[Roden]

What is the elephant in the room?

1

The hoods and anyone who's lurking in them.

I mean, my understanding was that everyone was just assigned one of the three things and thrown into one of three neighbourhoods, independent of whether you actually take anything from that tree

There are already 4 of us who have posted in my hood

3

Only two others have posted in my hood besides myself. Assuming the player list was split evenly between the hoods, they should be 4-4-5 or 4-4-4 with the 13th player being hoodless. My current suspicion is on whoever is staying silent in my hood, but it's possible they just haven't been online yet.

Also, I've been way too overconfident with my reads lately, but I still read Dunn as town due to their tone. Their town and scum tones are like night and day to me.

1

[Roden]

How busy is everyone else's hoods? Is most of the gameplay just happening there? The set up is interesting enough that I feel like more people should be talking.

[Roden]

Oof, forgot my 2.

3

[Roden]

Dunn, I don't want to talk mechanics. Talk people. Who do you want to work with this game. Same to you jjh.

Who do you think would help me improve as a player? Who do you think I struggle to read?

3

I honestly have no idea Titus. I don't know who some of the people in this game even are.

VOTE: Gypyx

4

[Roden]

WhErE's GyPy? No ReSpOnSe To ThE wAgOn?

[Roden]

LLD is in this game??

[Roden]

VOTE: Shiro

Sure, why not. Kinda hate that this post challenge is making people not want to post, it isn't even a real restriction do idk why anyone is treating it like one. It's a little scum sided in that sense, since if no one is posting than scum can't get sussed out for lurking.

2

[Roden]

Fair points.

VOTE: Gypy

3

[Roden]

I still feel good about Dunn. And my hood hasn't had any objections to the Gypy wagon. I'm not seeing much momentum to try to shift the wagon in the main thread either. So what does everyone think this indicates about Gypy's alignment?

[Roden]

ChAlLeNgE

[Roden]

Shiroooooooooo my best hydra partner <3 can you share some early reads and your feelings about your neighbors?

I am treating it as a masonry at the moment, it might bite me later but eh. Honestly I townread my whole hood which I am most likely wrong about. I think mech it makes sense for 1 scum in each hood but


3/5

What is the general consensus on Gypy in your hood?

[Roden]

Pooky claiming Miller and then telling people not to target him is uh, not great

2

[Roden]

just fucking trust me

1

also why the fuck would i fake claim miller and then ask people not to target me AS SCUM?

am i secretly a godfather or some shit?

lol

2

I mean you haven't really given me a reason to trust you. I was going to target you tonight with "something", but I'm willing to offer a show of good will here and choose someone else tonight.

My role is extremely low power, so I'm assuming just being targeted at all ruins your fun tonight?

2

[Roden]

Because it's a Upick and everyone should have an

interesting

role + this game's gimmick is making the fun choice over the "right" one

3

[Roden]

Shiroooooooooo my best hydra partner <3 can you share some early reads and your feelings about your neighbors?

I am treating it as a masonry at the moment, it might bite me later but eh. Honestly I townread my whole hood which I am most likely wrong about. I think mech it makes sense for 1 scum in each hood but


3/5

What is the general consensus on Gypy in your hood?

Upgrade his role for *reasons*

So there's dissent to the Gypy wagon then? And is it based solely on the role claim?

4

[Roden]

LlD vS pOoKy Is SpIcY aNd UnExPeCtEd

WhY dId YoU cLaIm MaSoNs?

[Roden]

Oh, well that answers that

1

[Roden]

The reason I was asking what the general consensus from hoods were is because I also town read my hood. I figure people are more willing to be open with their reads in the hoods since you're less likely to get flash elim'd for it. But if at least two townie hoods consensus agree with the Gypy wagon, then it's more likely that these hoods all contain scum and are fine with letting the wagon go through due to Gypy being unaligned with scum.

There's basically no sense of urgency in my hood, we're all just kinda vibing and agreeing with each other, so it makes me wonder if it's similar in the other hoods. And if so, that might indicate Gypy is just a mis-elim.

2

[Roden]

Is LLD in a hood? She's not in mine, and you're not claiming she's in yours Pooky. It only leaves whatever one Titus/Enchant/Shiro/Gypy is in.

PE: So Pooky is in the Warrior hood. Why were you forced to invest in the Mage skill tree?

3

[Roden]

Also afaik I don't think the hoods have much to do with the skill trees besides name. I was told I had the Sneak skillset in my role PM, but no mention of abilities from the tree, and the mod confirmed we're not locked to only upgrading to the tree we're associated with.

4

[Roden]

LLD not in out Hood.

1

InTeReStInG...

[Roden]

So LLD is either hoodless or staying silent in one of the hoods. But she's apparently a Mason.

1

[Roden]

I guess it makes it obvious now, but my hood is Dunn/Mastina/Frozen Angel/me. Dunn's been pretty townie, I was hesitant on Angel at first but they've been relatively townie since they started posting, and Mastina has kinda mindmelded with the hood while chanting that she's town. She told us a little more about her post gimmick/requirement in there, and I think we can trust her for now.

2

[Roden]

So LLD is either hoodless or staying silent in one of the hoods. But she's apparently a Mason.

1

i HAVE AT LEAST ONE HOOD, WITH THE PERSON WHO MASONIZED ME. i WON'T SAY MORE THAN THAT ON THE SUBJECT, FOR NOW AT LEAST.

1

Hiding whether or not you're in a skill hood makes it hard to believe your Mason claim. I don't see a town reason for leaving that vague.

3

[Roden]

Being left out is whatever, hinting that you might be in one but not speaking is a bit more an issue.

[Roden]

*MoRe Of An IsSuE

[Roden]

So LLD is either hoodless or staying silent in one of the hoods. But she's apparently a Mason.

1

i HAVE AT LEAST ONE HOOD, WITH THE PERSON WHO MASONIZED ME. i WON'T SAY MORE THAN THAT ON THE SUBJECT, FOR NOW AT LEAST.

1

Hiding whether or not you're in a skill hood makes it hard to believe your Mason claim. I don't see a town reason for leaving that vague.

3

Why wouldn't she? The person who masonized her can always come and claim it. So she can do whatever she wants. This type of situation at least creates paranoia in every hood that a mason could be there watching. It limits just agency capturing every hood.

I'm not saying she needs to claim who she's Masons with. I'm saying if she is in a skill hood but not saying anything so that she can essentially eavesdrop, it makes it harder to believe the Mason claim because it's anti town.

[Roden]

Oh no...Titus are you scum? You're doing that thing where you defend a suspicious player and try to give them room to breathe for town cred.

2

[Roden]

Oh no...Titus are you scum? You're doing that thing where you defend a suspicious player and try to give them room to breathe for town cred.

2

WhO iS tHe SuPiCiOuS pLaYeR?

You.

3

[Roden]

Oh no...Titus are you scum? You're doing that thing where you defend a suspicious player and try to give them room to breathe for town cred.

2

WhO iS tHe SuPiCiOuS pLaYeR?

You.

3

wHAT IS SUSPICIOUS ABOUT ME, PRECISELY?

i WANT your WORDS HERE. yOU APPEAR TO SUSPECT ME, SINCE YOU MADE THIS ARGUMENT WRT tITUS.

wHAT ABOUT MY POSTS AND BEHAVIOUR MAKES ME SUSPICIOUS... AND WHAT ABOUT MY LITERAL CONFIRMED TOWN STATUS ARE YOU MISSING?

I just went over this in my hood but, basically your Mason claim wasn't necessary, you had exactly one active scum read on you and you weren't dying today. I don't see the point in claiming unless you or your buddy are getting run up, but you barely had any pressure and it doesn't sound like Gypy is the Masonizer.

I also don't have a reason to believe your claim at face value, same reason I don't really believe Pooky's at face value. Honestly I think both of you are suspicious and I've expressed that in my hood. I feel like your interactions with each other felt off.

However if Titus is doing what I think she's doing then it's likely you and Pooky are both town.

4

[Roden]

ChAlLeNgE

[Roden]

Supposing LLD town, who is scum Pooky? Same to you Roden?

Probably Gypy, probably you. Idk about the 3rd but I'm assuming it's a low poster.

[Roden]

Honestly I anticipate I will commit two crimes of a similar level to enchant's over the course of this game

2

We win if we work together. Too many cooks spoil the broth and give scum a place to hide.

you have not explained any of your plan to us

I'm not going to just nod my head and say yes i trust you when i literally have no clue what you are planning to do

4

Pooky that's literally the exact thing you're doing with your own plan. Your only argument was "just fucking trust me" lmao

2

[Roden]

Honestly I anticipate I will commit two crimes of a similar level to enchant's over the course of this game

2

We win if we work together. Too many cooks spoil the broth and give scum a place to hide.

you have not explained any of your plan to us

I'm not going to just nod my head and say yes i trust you when i literally have no clue what you are planning to do

4

Unless the people in Gypy's hood start telling us what exactly Gypy did that earned them a town read and a free max level skill tree, I see no reason not to elim them.

[Roden]

I have no idea why that got quoted again

[Roden]

@Mod

You need to retry challenge instantly you noticed it failed, or you could wait for a bit?

1

Honestly I anticipate I will commit two crimes of a similar level to enchant's over the course of this game

2

We win if we work together. Too many cooks spoil the broth and give scum a place to hide.

you have not explained any of your plan to us

I'm not going to just nod my head and say yes i trust you when i literally have no clue what you are planning to do

4

Unless the people in Gypy's hood start telling us what exactly Gypy did that earned them a town read and a free max level skill tree, I see no reason not to elim them.

Gave us a gameplan to get anywhere from three to five conftown.

HoW dO wE kNoW tHaT tHe PlAn Is GuArAnTeEd To WoRk?

[Roden]

I don't think Pooky's scum meta is to stomp his feet and complain about how bad the town is

I don't necessarily trust him, but I don't really feel like he's scum for the reasons you've given Gypy

1

[Roden]

pedit : i've not really noticed the complaining? Like, if anything he's being more agressive than anything really

Really? How have you

not

noticed it?

also the idea that scum!me decides to bus a partner d1 in order to 1v1 you on d2 is really fucking dumb

if im scum i just shoot you at night i dont bother trying to duke it out with you in the thread cuz lol im not an idiot

3

i mean you're pushing pooky!town and helping gypyx!scum get xp to do some bad shit to the town so you pretty much are not just useless but actively working against town wincon so w/e i dont really give a fuck

2

i also dont actually give a fuck if this town wants to drive off the edge of a cliff cuz sekrit hood shenanigans i have no patience for idiocy

4

if gypyx promised you 3 conftown people by tommorrow then i have a bridge to sell you

3

Titus doesn't even have a reason to vote me she's just being bad

3

by bad i mean probly bad town not scum

4

also I don't actually care if you guys elim me cuz i think its comical how bad this town is

2

2

[Roden]

Also I don't see how it makes any sense to spare you for today Gypy because your hood has a """"""""plan"""""""" but then be ok with voting out Pooky who also has a """"""""plan""""""""

3

[Roden]

Also afaik I don't think the hoods have much to do with the skill trees besides name. I was told I had the Sneak skillset in my role PM, but no mention of abilities from the tree, and the mod confirmed we're not locked to only upgrading to the tree we're associated with.

4

oh i didnt know that

maybe ill go mage tree then


4

In case I'm wrong and Pooky flips scum, this post clears me of all associations lol. But tbh I really don't think this is scum!Pooky.

[Roden]

FiVe

[Roden]

Also I don't see how it makes any sense to spare you for today Gypy because your hood has a """"""""plan"""""""" but then be ok with voting out Pooky who also has a """"""""plan""""""""

3

honestly i have fuckall idea what the plan even is mate, so i'm not the one who could answer you there

What the fuck

Does anyone know what the hell is going on??

1

[Roden]

Titus what makes you think Gypy upgrades into a Masonizer?

[Roden]

I also think it's possible there may be a fundamental misunderstanding about what it means to upgrade a role PM, but time will tell on that front.

Given that in my case my role PM is an inconceivable mashup of two of my picks, these being the entire seasonal anime 'Life with an ordinary guy who reincarnated into a total fantasy knockout' and the character Rit from 'Banished from the hero's party I decided to live a quiet life in the countryside' from which information I feel there is no way you could guess my role, I am concerned that an upgrade to my role PM might introduce my third pick of Bojji from 'Ranking of Kings' to this mixture somehow rather than being a direct upgrade to the role.

I mean, it could be played straight and improve the abilities in a more predictable way, but please stop assuming it will

1

I meant to respond to this earlier because it piqued my interest. My role PM is also a combination of two of my picks, though none of my three picks had much to do with each other so it's a weird fusion. It's likely that an Engineer upgrade just incorporates our third pick somehow.

3

[Roden]

Uhhh idk why this Pooky wagon just happened but it really shouldn't have

Also Dunn I don't think any of us are going to have enough experience, and I don't want to upgrade Gypy in the first place

4

[Roden]

TbH i DiDn'T rEaLiZe PoOkY wAs EvEn In HaMmEr RaNgE

[Roden]

Last vote count only had him at three votes wtf

[Roden]

I will participate.

1

[Roden]

So if Gypy doesn't give us at least 3 conftown right now, we're flash wagoning them. Correct?

2

[Roden]

Where are the conftown Titus?

[Roden]

Where are the conftown Where are the conftown Where are the conftown Where are the conftown

Wow this challenge makes me look deranged

[Roden]

I will not be participating. I don't understand the rules and it would screw with my posting.

I can confirm that someone other than Shiro upgraded Dunn which threw me for a loop but what else is new. Gypyx now has LLD's role and vice versa. That was my failsafe in case Gypyx was lying. LLD wanted a new role and getting three town in a link was too much to pass up.

First of all, I wasn't upgraded. I'm assuming this is a typo.

Second, explain to me what Gypyx and LLD did. LLD claimed the role she flipped as.

Can you explain how Gypyx is clear?

2

Gypyx did nothing.
LLD did nothing but give me some of her exp.
I swapped Gypyx role with LLD.
Thus, if Gypyx had be lying,LLD would have flipped with his lie or she would have claimed it.

How did you swap their roles? Can you explain this?

I'm .5 short of upgrading now if we had a mechanical reason to upgrade prior to nightfall.

Upgrading to what? Did you spend the experience to buy the Engineer 1-shot?

[Roden]

Where are the conftown Titus?

2

[Roden]

Your Ability is to: As the reigning champion of last years league, you get first round picks and have the ability to create your own neighborhood and recruit one player per Night phase to join your roster.

Along with being equipped with a primary ability, you also start off with a passive.

As a Changling, your posts will be deformed in the sense that you must reverse the use of uppercase and lowercase letters. (hERE IS HOW i WOULD GIVE AN EXAMPLE).

You're lying Titus

LLD was the one following this post restriction yesterday, not Gypyx. This was LLD's role.

1

Oh, well that was just easily disproven lol

3

[Roden]

Could be two neiborizers Could be two neiborizers Could be two neiborizers Could be two neiborizers

Yes they could be the same alignment, but it isn't guaranteed one way or the other.

[Roden]

This challenge is ridiculous lmao

[Roden]

I will not be participating. I don't understand the rules and it would screw with my posting.

I can confirm that someone other than Shiro upgraded Dunn which threw me for a loop but what else is new. Gypyx now has LLD's role and vice versa. That was my failsafe in case Gypyx was lying. LLD wanted a new role and getting three town in a link was too much to pass up.

First of all, I wasn't upgraded. I'm assuming this is a typo.

Second, explain to me what Gypyx and LLD did. LLD claimed the role she flipped as.

Can you explain how Gypyx is clear?

2

Gypyx did nothing.
LLD did nothing but give me some of her exp.
I swapped Gypyx role with LLD.
Thus, if Gypyx had be lying,LLD would have flipped with his lie or she would have claimed it.

How did you swap their roles? Can you explain this?

I'm .5 short of upgrading now if we had a mechanical reason to upgrade prior to nightfall.

Upgrading to what? Did you spend the experience to buy the Engineer 1-shot?

Where are the conftown Titus?

2

2

[Roden]

Titus is there any reason for why you're avoiding my questions?

[Roden]

Titus is there any Titus is there any Titus is there any Titus is there any

[Roden]

I will not be participating. I don't understand the rules and it would screw with my posting.

I can confirm that someone other than Shiro upgraded Dunn which threw me for a loop but what else is new. Gypyx now has LLD's role and vice versa. That was my failsafe in case Gypyx was lying. LLD wanted a new role and getting three town in a link was too much to pass up.

First of all, I wasn't upgraded. I'm assuming this is a typo.

Second, explain to me what Gypyx and LLD did. LLD claimed the role she flipped as.

Can you explain how Gypyx is clear?

2

Gypyx did nothing.
LLD did nothing but give me some of her exp.
I swapped Gypyx role with LLD.
Thus, if Gypyx had be lying,LLD would have flipped with his lie or she would have claimed it.

How did you swap their roles? Can you explain this?

I'm .5 short of upgrading now if we had a mechanical reason to upgrade prior to nightfall.

Upgrading to what? Did you spend the experience to buy the Engineer 1-shot?

Where are the conftown Titus?

2

2

1

[Roden]

VOTE: Roden

Let's start mafia.

Literally what are you even doing this game

2

[Roden]

...How is Gypy at E-3 if they have four votes? Is that a typo, or is an ability in play?

3

[Roden]

I will always copy I will always copy I will always copy I will always copy

Is that from Gypy's role upgrade? I saw somebody mention that they were Loved earlier but I didn't understand the context.

[Roden]

Ohhh. Ok, so did Gypy's upgrade go to LLD then? From what I know, Dunn used the Engineer as soon as he got it.

[Roden]

Oh btw, meant to do this earlier but I'm gonna be a spokesperson for my hood for a bit. We have some info but don't want everyone to know who did what or did what, so I'll keep how we learned this info vague.

-The Rolestop is actually a Roleblocker that also prevents Strongman abilities. Kinda weird, but at least we have counterplay.

-Gypy was Tracked, they didn't do anything last night.

-If someone is currently in a new hood from Gypy, then Gypy bought the Ninja skill and wasn't Roleblocked.

2

[Roden]

I will always copy this, and then copy this, and then copy this, and then copy this, at the beginning of literally every post after realising it might help other people too

Ohhh. Ok, so did Gypy's upgrade go to LLD then? From what I know, Dunn used the Engineer as soon as he got it.

LLD didn't flip with an upgraded ability

2

The action resolution priority seems pretty wonky then, but I guess it worked out.

3

[Roden]

I will always copy I will always copy I will always copy I will always copy

[Roden]

Also, Gypy is at E-1. I guess we don't really need a claim, and I want the experience + have been scum reading Gypy. Gonna hammer in a couple hours unless something comes up.

1

[Roden]

I haven't been doing the helpful thing because it's interesting to know who really wants that extra experience, yet also wants to make their voice heard. Plus it's actually kind of easy to break this challenge anyway, if you don't mind posting nonsense.

Is there any objection to my intent to hammer? Not much is happening and Gypy is waiting out the timer. Is there anything anyone needs to talk about?

2

[Roden]

Ok, those are good points, I can wait. Do you mind unvoting to avoid any random hammers/self hammers then?

[Roden]

Ok, those are good Ok, those are good Ok, those are good Ok, those are good

Just remembered I wanted to ask a question before we moved on to the night phase actually. Would anyone be against a flavor mass claim?

[Roden]

I considered it and thought it would be funny if I did take your spot, but I do think there's a chance Gypy self hammers here to cut off discussion and experience trading.

I'm actually also pretty confident Gypy is getting bussed, because scum profit even more from being on the wagon than normal since they don't want to lose out on a buddy

and

on experience. So I genuinely do think anyone rushing to get on the wagon now is +scum.

1

[Roden]

I have a simple solution.

VOTE: Yume

Let's kill the player that a lot of people scum read but has been coasting by this game.

2

[Roden]

Idk what Titus is doing but I don't think she's scum at this point either.

[Roden]

I will always copy I will always copy I will always copy I will always copy

I'm fine with ending the day. I wanted to do flavor claims but I'm fine with waiting until tomorrow for those.

[Roden]

I won't be doing the challenge today, I'll have just enough experience after the day ends to get everything I need.

I also have a guilty on Dwlee.

[Roden]

I literally did nothing

I have like 2 xp

I don't believe you. You should have 3.5 experience, where did the rest go?

[Roden]

My whole hood knew I was engineer from the get go, try agian Dun. I told them I dont want to upgrade gypyx cause I dont trust the plan.

You can thank me now for bringing LLD back and kindly remove your vote. ^_^

Who did you upgrade?

[Roden]

My slot gave Titus 1 XP before I was in it

When?

@Titus:

Can you confirm this as well as when it happened?

[Roden]

Well yours of .25 and Reinhardt gave me one. That got me to 2.25. So no Yume didn't.

Names aren't on the gifts.

Huh, ok. But wtf happened to all of that experience then?l

[Roden]

Sneak hood just cracked wide open...I may have a hard guilty.

[Roden]

This game is wild

[Roden]

Wait you can upgrade self?

Let me check this out.

1

Yep, I did so last night. We were curious if Angel could upgrade twice since their role only involved one flavor, but she couldn't upgrade herself after the initial upgrade unfortunately.

[Roden]

...Scum can revive dead scum as well then, can't they?

[Roden]

Sigh. I was writing up my post, I hit preview, and saw Angel more or less got the gist of it. There's a bit more stuff I claimed in the hood, but I don't want to full claim here since it would be anti-town and purely benefit scum. Though Dunn's trying to get me to out it anyway because he made a bad slip and is deciding to scum side lol.

One thing I'll note is that Dunn is straight up lying about a vampire faction existing. I never claimed one did, and both Angel and Mastina can back that up. I said vampires aren't town-aligned, that's it. I don't know if they're group scum or 3P, which was why I asked if he could town side in the first place. He's only claiming town, which I know is impossible but whatever, if he's scum he can't exactly claim scum lol. Idk why he refused to claim 3P, but I'm assuming he's hostile 3P and is afraid a Strongman shot can permanently kill him (current working theory is that vampires don't die to plain Vig shots which is why he's asking to get shot, he knows he won't die).

If I were scum I'd Strongman kill him, and if I were 3P Executioner I'd fake a better case. Dunn doesn't mention that I genuinely tried to come up with an alternate solution, that I gave him a chance to town side, that I full claimed in a show of good will and honesty, or that I even explained that if I wanted to just elim him that I could've just waited and faked a guilty tomorrow. The game does not end with a vampire elimination, and seeing as my role informs me that multiple vampires exist I think it's pretty silly to think 2-3 players have a chance to end the game immediately upon elimination. And if you look at the wagons, I haven't been on any that went through, so I'm clearly not trying to just wagon people haphazardly and hope I elim a vampire. I'm simply not a 3P and my play proves it.

[Roden]

You can elim me then rez me if you want to peek at my alignment and wincon yourselves. Death kinda doesn't mean much with the Mage tree lol.

[Roden]

Mastina is a possibility, but we've discussed in the hood that it could be...risky.

[Roden]

@Roden

Can someone, preferably Roden, just confirm whether Roden would leave the game in victory in the scenario that he achieved this side wincon?

1

1

Originally no, but I recently got an update from the mod and I don't see a reason not to share. I can choose to leave the game and immediately announce my win, or continue to play as town and announce my win in post game. I intended to do the latter since my upgrade is fun and I want to see if I can catch scum tonight.

However, the update makes it clear that I don't have to fulfill both wincons, just one of them. I'm assuming this is because I have to be on a vampire's wagon when they get elim'd for it to count. For instance, if I died beforehand and one of the vampires rolled scum instead of 3P, I wouldn't be able to win even if a scum vampire died if I had to fulfill both wincons. So it's a nice little QoL cushion.

[Roden]

Btw, if you want proof that I'm not lying about vampires not being town-aligned: notice the absence of other vampires counter claiming my info and claiming to be town. Notice how Dunn ignored my suggestion to elim me and then rez me in order to peek at my alignment and wincon.

Additionally, I already explained in the hood why telling people to Rolestop me was a bad idea and purely anti-town. I also explained that I know trying to Vig a vampire is a

really

bad idea, but he's begging to get Vig'd now, which is odd if he's claiming to be town. Purposely killing a townie is bad play, but wanting to be Vig'd just gives me bad vibes. I theorized in the hood that shooting a vampire without using a Strongman shot would fail and instead spread vampirism, which made Dunn freeze up and come rushing in here to try to set me up in a bad light before I could even say anything. He's also been caught lying about multiple things now so...yeah, not looking good.

I recommend Masonizing Dunn, or just flipping one of us and then rezzing whoever flips town. But I'm very much against ever using a Vig shot there, please don't do it. If he's hostile 3P, let scum resolve him tonight and Strongman NK him.

Oh, idk if it got claimed here, but he's immune to investigative actions. I'm not sure if Masonizer is affected by that, but if it is it may as well be a guilty.

[Roden]

I haven't lied about anything

You tried to tell everyone that I claimed that a vampire faction existed. This can be proven to be false by either Angel or Mastina though, since they can confirm I never said that and that I even clarified this to you in the hood. So yeah, you not only lied, but you did so in bad faith.

notice the absence of other vampires counter claiming my info and claiming to be town.

There's no other vampires...

I know this to be untrue.

[Roden]

Are you serious

You realize group scum can consist of generally evil fantasy creatures and characters, right? Or are you suggesting that the entire scum team are all Changelings/affiliated with Changelings, since that was Gypy's flip?

[Roden]

Like, I said this shit three times in the hood now and you're still trying to claim I said a vampire faction exists when I not only never said that, I denied that every single time and Angel had to even tell you that your accusation was incorrect

[Roden]

Why are you ignoring the question

[Roden]

Why are you ignoring the question

Additionally, why are you continuing to put words in my mouth?

[Roden]

Group scum can contain one vampire without being all vampires. Vampires can also be solo 3P (Survivor/SK/Cult/Arsonist).

[Roden]

and targeting roden would also give a useless result based on what he claimed in sneak chat

Dang that's unfortunate that he also claimed to be immune to investigations right after making up a bunch of other stuff

Are you really gonna make me claim this

[Roden]

Dunn's trying to make me sound like an unclaimed Ascetic when I'm not. My upgrade makes me reflect actions, which includes the NK. However, Dunn is trying to encourage people to use their actions on me knowing that it'll just get reflected back on them. Rolestops would self-target, Cop checks would just tell the user their own alignment, and Vig shots would just make people kill themselves. I don't have to hide my alignment, I even offered to flip myself and get rez'd after to prove that I'm town and that my wincon is protown. But you're going to ignore that in order to keep shading me and give scum info.

[Roden]

I'm sorry you got caught over a dumb slip but you're kind of more trouble than you're worth for my wincon at this point. I'd rather just Vig you like you wanted and just stick to the main wincon so you stop giving scum info out of spite.

[Roden]

I'm sorry you got caught over a dumb slip but you're kind of more trouble than you're worth for my wincon at this point. I'd rather just Vig you like you wanted and just stick to the main wincon so you stop giving scum info out of spite.

Uh, this is for Dunn, not you JJH.

[Roden]

Mastina full claimed in the hood, she's town.

[Roden]

He said that vampires couldn't be vigged, they could only be voted out.

I'm sorry you got caught over a dumb slip but you're kind of more trouble than you're worth for my wincon at this point.

I'd rather just Vig you like you wanted and just stick to the main wincon so you stop giving scum info out of spite.

So which is it Roden?

Take a look at the hood before you fuck up any more of tonight's plans

[Roden]

He said that vampires couldn't be vigged, they could only be voted out.

I'm sorry you got caught over a dumb slip but you're kind of more trouble than you're worth for my wincon at this point.

I'd rather just Vig you like you wanted and just stick to the main wincon so you stop giving scum info out of spite.

So which is it Roden?

Take a look at the hood before you fuck up any more of tonight's plans

I really don't get how you are simultaneously calling me either mafia or hostile 3p and expecting me to be working with you in the hood, and revealing info in there like it's nothing

Because if you're town-sided, everything works out fine and we still win. Otherwise, you just guilty yourself if something specific goes wrong that only someone in our hood could know about.

[Roden]

Is it possible Titus could actually just be a Cult Leader?

[Roden]

True. I don't want to assume godfather cult members are a thing, so Titus probably is just a Masonizer.

[Roden]

It's apparently the 4th skill in the Mage tree. Shiro reviving LLD just means they're likely town.

[Roden]

Enchant, I think your only valid target tonight is Pooky. Do you already have the ability?

[Roden]

Hey I don't really want to wait two more days just so one person can do the challenge. Dwlee is caught and there isn't anything else to talk about, let's not kill the game please.

[Roden]

I think he's 3P, I don't think any scum are in my hood. If we kill three scum and the game is still going, then yeah I'm pushing for his elim. But if we can win by just killing scum, that's fine with me since it means he's town-sided anyway.

[Roden]

I will participate.

I have a guilty on JJH.

[Roden]

Bad kill.

[Roden]

I will participate

mastina is still mafia
i havent read shit btw

Clearly not since if you had you'd know that I'm basically conftown here.

I'm town.

And while FA is out of the game and the scum for whatetver reason killed Dunnstral (that said, Roden, uhh...what happened to vampires being nontown??? Dunn was town...), there can only be one scum and Roden can still vouch for how I am town in a dozen different ways, including:

So everyone is completely aware. I've been asked if you're allowed to reinvest in a skill tree after completing it. The answer is yes, it works exactly the same in that you have to buy the skills from top to bottom again.

Guess who was the one who asked that?

It was me. I shared it with my neighborhood and I reinvested in the Warrior tree.

N1 I bodyguarded LLD; last night, I bodyguarded Titus.

UNVOTE: jjh

This is true, she did claim this in the hood. I also BG'd Titus to protect the Mason role for stealing and to try to reflect the kill. I'm not sure why scum killed Dunn but I'm assuming they also thought he was a hostile 3P.

Also Mastina I think you should at least have a decent guess as to why Dunn flipped town here. Remember what he did in the hood right before Angel disappeared?

[Roden]

Remember blood pact

[Roden]

I will participate.

I have a guilty on JJH.

Yea and last time Dun was not aligned with town

Vote:Roden

Are you just not paying attention

I hard pushed both scum elims and tried to save Pooky.

[Roden]

Shiro is barely playing

[Roden]

Yeah I got a no result even though I can't be affected by Roleblock/Rolestop. So you're an unclaimed Ascetic. You're claiming Commuter now after you got targeted, but you didn't even hint that town shouldn't target you.

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well.

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well.

I just realized how much I screwed myself by accidentally making this my second post lmao

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well one

[Roden]

The Vig shots were on N2 and N3.

Why are you certain that Yume didn't have a Bulletproof?

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well one two

[Roden]

I will say vigging Yume in N-3 is kinda scummy given I was coordinating actions and Yume was one of the people I could get to do things

There was a world where Yume was gonna steal Titus' role and use it during the day for a result. The only reason we didn't get that was because she immediately burnt her 1 exp to get the reviver and Shiro failed to funnel any exp in from the mage hood to make up that deficit


I'm certain Yume didn't have a bulletproof because she complained about not having one yet and wanted even more exp

NGL, everyone in our hood was heavily suspicious of you and I had a theory about you or Yume being a cult leader. Dunn kind of eased off by the end but we almost coordinated a massive amount of actions your way N2 before we swapped to Dwlee at the last hour or so. So that's why we've been firing at Yume.

I'll just claim my investigative action now. I can check the purchase history of one player each night, that's why I've been questioning people about experience and claiming that I knew if someone was lying. N1 I checked Titus, she was telling the truth about not spending any of it. N2 I checked Dwlee, they told the truth about the Bulletproof purchase. N3 I checked you and got no result.

Ability comes from my pick Shining Force, the theme of my ability being inventory management.

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well one two three

[Roden]

@roden you explicitly claimed that vampires arent aligned with town and cant get vigged

refused to accept that you're a survivor.

why that doesn't mean you're scum now that we know what dunnestral was

I hard pushed both scum elims and tried to save Pooky.

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well one two three four

[Roden]

@roden you explicitly claimed that vampires arent aligned with town and cant get vigged

refused to accept that you're a survivor.

why that doesn't mean you're scum now that we know what dunnestral was

I hard pushed both scum elims and tried to save Pooky.

how that means you're not an evil 3p

I literally explained this one in depth yesterday. You even admitted my play makes no sense to come from evil 3P.

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well one two three four five

[Roden]

Angel, if yoiu

really

wanna do this, I don't really care. I already said my flip will prove my alignment and we can scrounge up the experience to rez me once I'm proven town.

[Roden]

Ok if you claimed in the hood early on that changes things

Still unfortunate I got basically nothing done last night then, because my Bodyguard and Vig shot did nothing as well one two three four five six

[Roden]

I really think there is something on evil side of this setup that we didn't understand yet and its scaring me

There should be a massive scum side utility that is doing their job freely right now. in a setup with so many protective and investigations, this just doesn't make sense

To be fair, both flipped scum kinda just rolled over and died. The set up could have possibly been more scum sided and we just didn't know it because it didn't get utilized.

[Roden]

One two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine

[Roden]

Angel, if yoiu

really

wanna do this, I don't really care. I already said my flip will prove my alignment and we can scrounge up the experience to rez me once I'm proven town.

I really wanna know why you claimed that vampires are not town and insisted on it even after you claimed you want him dead for your wincondition if you were working on sorting him for real the way you claimed you were

your plays had paradox

To be fair Roden, FA is pushing a pretty valid point in that you explicitly said that vampires are not town aligned and Dunnstral has flipped as entirely town aligned

Because something fucky is going on. I know how it looks and I don't have a satisfying answer.

[Roden]

One two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten

[Roden]

Roden could well be the correct lim here tbh

I kinda thought he might be town that was playing in an anti-town way because of a 3p side wincon, but that ship has sailed or he'd have claimed that was why he was being anti-town

I...literally claimed that?

I'm sorry but did everyone forget everything I said yesterday and that I hard pushed both scum while trying to stop town mis-elims

[Roden]

one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four Pooky you're right this town sucks lol

[Roden]

Uh

Idk what happens if you gladiate a reflect

[Roden]

one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two three four five six seven eight nine ten one two

[Roden]

@Roden

Can someone, preferably Roden, just confirm whether Roden would leave the game in victory in the scenario that he achieved this side wincon?

1

1

Originally no, but I recently got an update from the mod and I don't see a reason not to share. I can choose to leave the game and immediately announce my win, or continue to play as town and announce my win in post game. I intended to do the latter since my upgrade is fun and I want to see if I can catch scum tonight.

However, the update makes it clear that I don't have to fulfill both wincons, just one of them. I'm assuming this is because I have to be on a vampire's wagon when they get elim'd for it to count. For instance, if I died beforehand and one of the vampires rolled scum instead of 3P, I wouldn't be able to win even if a scum vampire died if I had to fulfill both wincons. So it's a nice little QoL cushion.

[Roden]

Absolutely wild that I can solve the game and get told I'm anti town for it lmao

You'll find out on my flip Angel

[Roden]

Uh

Idk what happens if you gladiate a reflect

She's probably going to gladiate me based on context, from which I think you can see just how horrendous this play is

Wait what

Why gladiate you??

[Roden]

I miscounted somewhere, challenge is dead

[Roden]

There is no "guilty".

I told Dunn my secondary wincon in the hood but told him I believed he was town aligned and didn't want to vote him out. Dunn responded by hard throwing and trying to 1v1 me in the main thread while also lying about multiple things in the hood to make me look bad. I said multiple times I'd rather hunt scum and he refused to just do that.

And honestly it's fucked up that I keep having to clean up everyone's mistakes and catch scum, just to be told I'm scum because somebody else decided to play poorly and no one wants to actually play mafia.

[Roden]

I never guilty'd Dunn.

I don't know why he flipped town because it contradicts the info I was given. Best I can assume is it has to do with the "blood pact" he made in the hood chat after he spammed a bunch of MTG cards.

If you can't understand how hard pushing two scum against town's wishes while also trying to stop town from mis-elimming other townies, then this town is just hilariously bad. Again, y'all don't want to play mafia for some reason.

[Roden]

Lmao if you actually think you're getting anything else from me after you pull this bullshit

Just figure out who's reviving me after I flip town

[Roden]

Yes I'm tilted

[Roden]

Yes I'm tilted

that doesnt make sense either

I'm giving you a chance to explain your lies.

so I think Its fake this getting tilted

We aren't necessarily just reviving people

Roden, I'm trying to take you in good faith here so maybe reiterate your info so that if there is a miscommunication here I can identify it

This is exactly what I mean when I say none of you are paying attention

I explained multiple times yesterday everything I knew and how my second wincon works. I also explained how I couldn't be an executioner/evil 3P, because it would be the easiest thing in the world to just wait and fake a guilty on Dunn the following day. I also wouldn't tell him anything about my wincon in the first place, or hesitate or getting him elim'd, or push for scum to be elim'd first. I'm town by play, but you refuse to analyze play and keep trying to unga bunga your way through elims.

As for why you're claiming your Vig worked fine Angel, I'm certain it has to do with the Blood Pact ability, and that you're purposely withholding information about how Dunn is affecting you. The fact that you tried to Vig him after I told you it could affect your alignment is scummy as fuck tbh.

[Roden]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... er_sort=Go

[Roden]

I didn't contradict myself, I was literally being given new information as the Day went on and even said that.

[Roden]

@Roden

Can someone, preferably Roden, just confirm whether Roden would leave the game in victory in the scenario that he achieved this side wincon?

1

1

Originally no, but I recently got an update from the mod and I don't see a reason not to share. I can choose to leave the game and immediately announce my win, or continue to play as town and announce my win in post game. I intended to do the latter since my upgrade is fun and I want to see if I can catch scum tonight.

However, the update makes it clear that I don't have to fulfill both wincons, just one of them. I'm assuming this is because I have to be on a vampire's wagon when they get elim'd for it to count. For instance, if I died beforehand and one of the vampires rolled scum instead of 3P, I wouldn't be able to win even if a scum vampire died if I had to fulfill both wincons. So it's a nice little QoL cushion.

[Roden]

Angel I can tell you really want to play the hero, but you're just clowning yourself by Vigging a townie and assuming because things don't immediately make sense to you in a bastard game, that intentionally mis-elimming a townie is somehow the correct follow up play

[Roden]

I have never seen someone be so confident yet so embarrassingly wrong

[Roden]

JJH and Pooky, if you're confident Mastina is the final scum then I'll vote there. Otherwise I'm down to self flip due to my love of making overconfident heroes eat crow.

[Roden]

Mastina: literally claims evil 3P

Angel: "yeah this is probably town"

[Roden]

Roden openly trying to divert attention on Mastina.

If I don't roll over and die then I'm scum I guess

[Roden]

Roden openly trying to divert attention on Mastina.

If I don't roll over and die then I'm scum I guess

Why you lied then

I didn't. I believed the information I was given. This is a bastard game, we all know this and it's tiring that everyone is pretending it isn't. Either the flip is wrong or the information I was given was wrong. If you think I'm scum or evil 3P then you need to explain why I played the way I did.

[Roden]

Roden, you're kinda halfway between rolling over and not

Please could you just reiterate for me all the info you got about vampires or I'll give up on eliminating Mastina in this phase

If you want to run the risk of getting gladiate'd then go ahead.

[Roden]

I just simply don't want to waste my time requoting/rewriting a bunch of posts I already explained several times that I know no one will actually read. If anyone paid attention or believed me this situation wouldn't be happening in the first place.

Like you understand how dumb it is that people want to let a claimed killing 3P live over someone who is, at worst, a suspected execitioner that? Do you really think reiterating anything that was ignored in the past will change anyone's minds this time around?

[Roden]

I just simply don't want to waste my time requoting/rewriting a bunch of posts I already explained several times that I know no one will actually read. If anyone paid attention or believed me this situation wouldn't be happening in the first place.

Like, do you understand how dumb it is that people want to let a claimed killing 3P live over someone who is, at worst, a suspected executioner? Do you really think reiterating anything that was ignored in the past will change anyone's minds this time around?

[Roden]

Currently at work but I'll explain on my break

[Roden]

Like, right now you're supposed to be annoyed about how people have misinterpeted what you said

Why not be explicitly clear about what info you got and let me get to the bottom of this

Ok so, the main problem isn't that I'm being misinterpreted, nobody just particularly cares what I'm saying. Town is on auto-pilot to the point that the people who want to vote me currently have the mindset of "contradiction = lie = evil" and are just taking the game at face value.

For me to be scum, I'd have to have hard bussed both of my buddies. Yeah scum can do that...but why do I then try to 1v1 Dunn after Dwlee's fate is already sealed? What exactly is that supposed to do for me besides get me killed for trying to fake a guilty on a townie several days before ELO? If someone wants to claim I'm scum, they'd need to explain what I was doing there that's supposed to lock in a scum wincon. In reality, it's pretty obvious I'm not scum.

Ok but what about evil 3P? I've already explained why this doesn't make sense either: I'd just fake a guilty on day start. That's the easiest way to do it, and I'd already pushed two scum beforehand so it wouldn't be hard to convince people to do it. I know this because it literally just happened to me in the last Grand Idea Mafia. I had first hand experience with how to successfully win as executioner by being the target of one, so it would make sense to just follow the same game plan. So it's reasonable to believe I'm not 3P either if you just look at my play.

However, none of that is happening. Nobody wants to think about how my play doesn't make sense to come from scum or 3P. A bastard thing happened in a bastard game, and for some reason, some people can't accept that. I could write a ten page essay thoroughly explaining vampire info, but it wouldn't matter because Dunn appeared to flip town. There's nothing I can type up about vampire info that will make people change their minds.

[Roden]

well played so you're trying to use that to come back at me

As for why you're claiming your Vig worked fine Angel, I'm certain it has to do with the Blood Pact ability, and that you're purposely withholding information about how Dunn is affecting you. The fact that you tried to Vig him after I told you it could affect your alignment is scummy as fuck tbh.

His blood pact effect is not known to me. If I knew what it was I wouldn't scream in our chat the way I did when he used the skill. mod later came and said that I was hit by it but I don't know what it did. So I don't know what it did. I really belive that he thought I'm really dieing so used a skill that will effect me when I die. But I never died.

This in particular should be a massive red flag to Angel, and the fact it isn't should be a red flag to the rest of us.

Angel knows that she's been targeted by an unknown affect and that it was done with evil intent, yet doesn't question it or the town flip. She also at some point spewed that she knows it comes from an upgraded ability even though it didn't show up in the flip.

And mechanically, there's no reason for her to be notified by the mod that she was targeted by an ability. That's not how abilities typically work, unless you know what the affect is or you've been doused by an arsonist.

[Roden]

Like, right now you're supposed to be annoyed about how people have misinterpeted what you said

Why not be explicitly clear about what info you got and let me get to the bottom of this

Ok so, the main problem isn't that I'm being misinterpreted, nobody just particularly cares what I'm saying. Town is on auto-pilot to the point that the people who want to vote me currently have the mindset of "contradiction = lie = evil" and are just taking the game at face value.

For me to be scum, I'd have to have hard bussed both of my buddies. Yeah scum can do that...but why do I then try to 1v1 Dunn after Dwlee's fate is already sealed? What exactly is that supposed to do for me besides get me killed for trying to fake a guilty on a townie several days before ELO? If someone wants to claim I'm scum, they'd need to explain what I was doing there that's supposed to lock in a scum wincon. In reality, it's pretty obvious I'm not scum.

Ok but what about evil 3P? I've already explained why this doesn't make sense either: I'd just fake a guilty on day start. That's the easiest way to do it, and I'd already pushed two scum beforehand so it wouldn't be hard to convince people to do it. I know this because it literally just happened to me in the last Grand Idea Mafia. I had first hand experience with how to successfully win as executioner by being the target of one, so it would make sense to just follow the same game plan. So it's reasonable to believe I'm not 3P either if you just look at my play.

However, none of that is happening. Nobody wants to think about how my play doesn't make sense to come from scum or 3P. A bastard thing happened in a bastard game, and for some reason, some people can't accept that. I could write a ten page essay thoroughly explaining vampire info, but it wouldn't matter because Dunn appeared to flip town. There's nothing I can type up about vampire info that will make people change their minds.

Contadiction doesn't mean evil and lie doesn't neccissirly mean evil. If they were I would start the day with voting you and would not bother question you.

You refuse to accept how we got here right now and are changing the events. What happened was I asked you a simple question: why you lied. You insisted that you didn't lie

Now you're contradicting yourself in this same very post. At start of it you say that this town is assuming a lie is evil - so accepting you did lie and played anti town and on second part you go back on your claim that you were lied to in your role pm.

Guess what I asked the mod if they lie in role pms or not. They said they can but they would feel so bad about explaining a role badly to player or lie about it inherently that would make the role something else entirely than what was written. The game is bastard, that doesn't mean the mod will lie about to a player about how vampires are not town and are not viggable. It just makes no sense in any design to do so. The only conclusion reachable is that you're lying

so You insisting that you didn't lie is whats scummy about this and contradicting yourself.

About rest of your post, the case against gypyx was not pushed by you. You just hoped on it and dwlee was hard guiltied and scumread by everyone else so if you were not hard busying them as scum I would doubt your sanity.

And for you not being 3p, you can be. I honestly think you made a mistake there claiming that you need him dead, you just wanted to guilty the ass out of him and get him killed and look town while doing so, and then got forced to develop the rest of that story as you saw fit. that's why all these contradictions appeared in the first place.

TLDR is I don't know what other wincon you have beside being an executioner, but whatever it is in addition to that, my conclusion is that its not aligned with town cause if it was you would come clean about it now that its obvious you lied and was playing anti town regarding dunn slot instead of all this desperate attempts to shade other stuff.

The fact that you're just reaffirming my point and somehow not realizing it speaks volumes tbh.

[Roden]

The fact that you're just reaffirming my point and somehow not realizing it speaks volumes tbh.

the fact that you try to discredit the case against you like this is hilarious tbh.

I was not reaffirming your points your points cant reach the conclusions you made. Everything is logically flawed about your reasoning

so no

What exactly are you accusing me of being then...?

Scum? 3P? I already proved I'm neither and you haven't refuted that. You just keep repeating that I'm a liar.

[Roden]

Or his directly blaming me for dunn green flip when he literally is still claiming he has a guilty on the vampires to push further his anti town agenda?

And its known for a fact that he is indeed an executioner and wanted dunn eliminated in day

Quote where I said I had a guilty on vampires.

Quote where I said I wanted to eliminate Dunn instead of Dwlee.

[Roden]

Sneak hood just cracked wide open...I may have a hard guilty.

Wasn't even hard to find.

I said "may" because at the time Dunn was freaking out in the hood when I asked if he was town-aligned, which Angel admitted happened. I made it clear it wasn't a guilty when we explained the situation after that post. Why are you ignoring that?

. I said vampires aren't town-aligned, that's it

I mean roden are you even trying?

You said specifically that vampires aren't town.

Not town-aligned =/= guilty. I asked Dunn multiple times if he could town side. Why are you ignoring that as well?

[Roden]

Organize who's doing the rez and I'll self hammer

[Roden]

How about no? He is displaying the same defeatist attitude as both flipped scum did. He is scum.

No this town is just unbelievably lazy. Nobody's trying to play besides like three people. I've already said this, but at this point we won't be getting anywhere until y'all see my flip. Like it's really fucking stupid that I legit I have to kill myself and reveal my flip just to prove a point but whatever, death is meaningless in this game anyway.

Plus now that I think about it, I'll get to question Dunn in the dead chat, so I might learn about what the Blood Pact does.

[Roden]

Epic play Roden

Told you the 1v1 was a bad idea.

[Roden]

Ngl, the amount of vitriol sent my way for trying to play to my wincon was really uncalled for.

[Roden]

Epic play Roden

Told you the 1v1 was a bad idea.

I never tried to eliminate you man

You literally told everyone to vote me out lmao

[Roden]

To clarify why I said not to Vig Dunn: I town read him and only wanted him as a backup wincon in case I couldn't win as town later on. I didn't expect Angel to do...literally, anything that she did.

[Roden]

Roden is 3rd party

Epic play Roden

Told you the 1v1 was a bad idea.

I never tried to eliminate you man

You literally told everyone to vote me out lmao

No, no I didn't.

Not sure why you're arguing this, the game's over. You pushed me in the main thread and made your intentions clear in the hood that you wanted me gone and that you were going to 1v1 me.

[Roden]

Ngl, the amount of vitriol sent my way for trying to play to my wincon was really uncalled for.

You should have claimed your real role after I had died because you were town and could win normally

But instead you continued to lie and act dodgy and avoid explaining what happened with your role

You wouldn't have died if you claimed your real role and said you lied

I was already getting voted out for lying, admitting that I lied doesn't change that outcome.

[Roden]

Ngl, the amount of vitriol sent my way for trying to play to my wincon was really uncalled for.

Roden could well be the correct lim here tbh

I kinda thought he might be town that was playing in an anti-town way because of a 3p side wincon, but that ship has sailed or he'd have claimed that was why he was being anti-town

I...literally claimed that?

I'm sorry but did everyone forget everything I said yesterday and that I hard pushed both scum while trying to stop town mis-elims

Did you? I thought you said you didn't have an explanation for why Dunnstral turned out to be unambiguously town-aligned

Like, I'm saying if instead of saying "I don't have an explanation" you had said "I lied" I would be fine with that

If you'd just admitted you were lying to achieve your wincon rather than insisting you were telling the truth but not telling me what you were telling the truth about, you would have remained as town as you were when I locktowned you

I pretty much already answered this. I legit tried to ease into this but I had people wanting my head the moment I even hinted that I was admitting to it. I was just overwhelmed and frustrated at that point because I was trying to side with town but feel like I got punished for it. It would've been easy to just miselim Dunn but I felt too guilty to do that, though in hindsight I probably just should've. If I knew I could leave the game sooner I probably would've planned around that instead of compromising halfway to each wincon.

[Roden]

What the fuck was dunnstral's blood pact

The mod thought it was funny that I bolded a message saying 'Perform Blood Pact' and put the mtg cards for no reason, so they asked me if the ability should do anything. I said it should inform FA that the blood pact has been performed and do nothing else

Tbh it had me paranoid that I was accidentally right about you being able to spread vampirism.

[Roden]

Anyhow, we won, and we had fun, and that's what's important. And with that, I bid you good night.

Yeah, I overall had fun. GG and thanks for modding Ginngie.

[Roden]

Angel I said not to Vig Dunn and you did it anyway

And when I tried to reason with you afterward you claimed over and over that I'll never flip town

You can say in hindsight you'd change your mind, but I was never going to believe that when you kept making plays that I told you would be bad to do, and anything I said to you afterwards got disregarded because you said it was impossible for me to be town over and over. And you were not the only one saying this on loop the entire day either. I actually thought you were scum at that point, because you shot Dunn after I told you not to and then blamed me for it.

I'm not even mad that I got voted out, I literally volunteered to for two game days straight and even said to vote me before voting Dunn. It was the "yeah fuck that guy" attitude afterwards that bothered me. I genuinely tried to make the least selfish play out of all my options but got forced into the worst one once you took those options away.

[Roden]

I don't think a conversation here is helpful then if that's your takeaway from this.