Mini Normal 2271 - Game Over

[Gamma Emerald]

hello friends
gonna start catching up shortly

[Gamma Emerald]

I usually get scumread for this but eh who cares.

1. How long have you played the game of mafia, not just on this site, but ever?
2. Do you like playing the role of town or mafia better?
3. Are you an active poster or a lurker?
4. Do you find it hard to lie or it something you have no issues with?

oh fun!
1: been playing forum mafia for almost 6 years (excluding breaks), but played mafia in person back thru to 9 years ago (2013)
2: either is fine, as long as I can enjoy myself
3: tend to be on the more active side
4: I would call myself an okay liar, the biggest issue is that when a bit of the facade slips, it's near impossible to get it to go back

[Gamma Emerald]

I ain't dead yet!
I'll try to form a Roden read naturally while catching up, but don't expect it to be *good*

and @Mala it's good to see you too

[Gamma Emerald]

The reason why I am asking you to read Roden first - is because I believe the person who was in your slot previously was attempting to miseliminate Roden and I want you to establish a baseline on that slot right away before you branch out.

I did a check of his first couple posts, I do expect to have some sort of read on him fairly quickly, but I still wanna do my standard front-to-back catch up.

[Gamma Emerald]

UNVOTE:
standard protocol, a bit delayed

[Gamma Emerald]

was I the only person to respond to italiano's RQS besides koopa and scorp?

[Gamma Emerald]

. Very lurky.

Spoiler:

I usually get scumread for this but eh who cares.

1. How long have you played the game of mafia, not just on this site, but ever?
2. Do you like playing the role of town or mafia better?
3. Are you an active poster or a lurker?
4. Do you find it hard to lie or it something you have no issues with?

1. I’m too old for this shit.
2. I like playing the game
3. I guess you’ll find out
4. These are such great questions…

why the hostility?

okay, i'm slipping into old habits.

I would like to announce that I'll be imposing post limits for me. I wanna train a lurky/wall-ey posting style. Wish me luck.

This is townie but idk why you're imposing anything on yourself

why is it townie?

Mala villagery tho, why do you want to vote only villagers mr monkey?

I heard scum being called "wolves" but first tyime I see someone consyistently calling tyownies "villagers".

what's with the extra Y's?

I usually get scumread for this but eh who cares.

1. How long have you played the game of mafia, not just on this site, but ever?
2. Do you like playing the role of town or mafia better?
3. Are you an active poster or a lurker?
4. Do you find it hard to lie or it something you have no issues with?

Uhh no, I have a boyfriend... how gross you should feel disgusted with yourself.

I usually get scumread for this but eh who cares.

1. How long have you played the game of mafia, not just on this site, but ever?
2. Do you like playing the role of town or mafia better?
3. Are you an active poster or a lurker?
4. Do you find it hard to lie or it something you have no issues with?

I'll do it proper.

1. I've played Mafia 2017 with Town of Salem, then moved to Forum Mafia on the ToS forums, which moved me to Discord Mafia (of which I am now an admin) and MafiaScum.
2. I prefer playing mafia, I am better at it by a large margin.
3. Read my sig aha. I am a bit of both, I post actively if I believe to have a substantial case on somebody but otherwise I lurk to avoid being pocketed into wrong reads.
4. Lying is easy. Used to fake-claim as town as a way to manipulate the scum into screwing themselves over. Don't do that anymore, got out of hand.

bad vibes from this

Anyway for now my hot take fresh off the press…

Scum team: koopa, Roden, Scorpious.

Honestly if I wasn’t leaning toward Flavor Leaf being town I’d think he and koopa were partners.

I think Mala is the LHF for today.

Well off to bed y’all everyone have a great night!

this team guess feels 1/3 rn

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Malakittens
This one is pretty obvious.

VOTE: NK15
This one is pretty obvious.

Confident in this vote.

why?

Again not really seeing where I did a TMI on JV.

My thought process was as follows:

Get my role PM - see it’s green. Get excited because I’m not scum finally.
See the player list and realize that JV is in it.
Get excited because I’m finally playing as town instead of scum with JV there unlike the last two games we were in.

Gets scum read for said excitement.

#reck

[Unv][/unv]
I think NK15 has also been villagery on this page.
VOTE: Scorpious

Are we still random voting?

bad post

koopa prob town

I gotta agree

although there's posts I don't like, but overall it's got a tone feel

so gut says town

The most scummiest votes on my wagon is NK15 & koopa.

This has me confused, I'm curious as to your thought process between these. What changed your mind on koopa being prob town to one of the scummiest votes on your wagon in the subsequent 9 posts?

I already see the missing puzzle piece, I'll see who else caught on first though

I didn’t like the trajectory.

Letting me breathe & then asking me to post a list on page 4 which I’m not comfortable with and then oppurnity jumping onto my wagon using pressure vote

Which is cool, but obv makes the commenting letting me breathe go to trash

Again just hated the trajectory on premises

not what I expected
I was thinking the logic would be it was just koopa's vote was scummy but not enough to make a scumread

I think Facebones is a villager in all worlds I'm currently considering.
I'd like to poll peoples current thoughts on Scorpious if possible

Scorpious:Worker..

Fixed it..

this is kinda funny

Only explanation I can think of is Mala doesn't think Koopa's play in general is scummy but that the vote itself is.

But yeah major discrepancy, good spot.

Why are you answering for mala instead of waiting for the reply?

I'm putting out a possible explanation as to why they could say that, they are of course welcome to clarify whether that is correct.

That's generally anti-town because it could give scum an excuse they didn't think of...

This. I asked addressed that question to Mala for a reason. I wanted them to answer, I don't really care about what you think are possible reasons.

I saw koopa say he felt facebones was town, I'm feeling similarly based on this

Again, appreciate the responses to the questions. I like getting to know the people I play with with whom I’m not familiar. If I was giving out prizes, it’d be a tie for 1st place between Flavor Leaf and JV for best response.

this is town

VOTE: Malakittens
This one is pretty obvious.

I missed this one. What’s obvious?

Read my iso.

why was this your response?

I’m ready to 1v1 someone who was on a Mala wagon.

Been feeling some scum energy getting pushed into that direction.

Where shall i pounce

Why don't you just do it instead of posturing about it? I've been waiting for you to actually do something like this for a bit now.

do you know flavor from elsewhere?

[Gamma Emerald]

I have a couple suspects already so I could drop a vote if called for, though normally I like holding out until being at least close to caught up

[Gamma Emerald]

Spoiler: scorpius

I’m ready to 1v1 someone who was on a Mala wagon.

Been feeling some scum energy getting pushed into that direction.

Where shall i pounce

Why don't you just do it instead of posturing about it? I've been waiting for you to actually do something like this for a bit now.

I’d rather see how people react to me saying it than do it

I think it’s fair, I would be more inclined at this early stage to think the voters were more sus than the votee..

based on?

Experience.. of course I have no hard data, but how many times is the first wagon flipping scum? It’s a crapshoot. So I go off of what I know.

Now granted it’s 2 votes, but steam will pick up on it and you’ll find at least on scum to push on D2.

I am also still learning this blurry line that used to be RVS in these games… like is it still a thing, is it not? Is it now optional? Like I’m really confused..

this feels like bad logic
I know from

my

experience that scum that end up as the first wagon tend to be let off easy because of this mindset, and as such are more blasé about early wagons on themselves

Koopa/Italiano/Malakittens way too early town block for me atm.

These TRs align with some of the ones I’ve formed myself, though I have different suspects to FL rn at this point in the thread

[Gamma Emerald]

no further questions

HEM is town. That is all

VOTE: Malakittens
This one is pretty obvious.

VOTE: NK15
This one is pretty obvious.

But I also get how that frustration could be genuine, so a slot to keep an eye on for now.

Frustration can come from scum, too. In this case it is not town-indicative.

The most scummiest votes on my wagon is NK15 & koopa. Koopa because I didn't like the trajectory, NK15 because that post was scummy af.
Roden is prob town as stated before. HEM is up in the air.

Koopa looks decent, don't agree with you for them but NK15 I can agree with. HEM is very likely Town, but not something I am willing to delve into as if I get everyone to TR them they gonna die. Roden I am indifferent about

Confident in this vote.

I am confident in my villaread on NK15, and thus this string of posts - particularly in a wolf!HEM world - are wolfy.

Why does nk15!town equal JV!scum? Do you not see any world in which they’re scum together?

VOTE: Italiano

I guess it doesn't ever hurt to crank up the heat. Scorpious was more a "do something" vote anyways.

Explain.

blegh

[Gamma Emerald]

Like Italiano has a lot of shade thrown at Mala, *however*, he is pushing elsewhere instead, rather than pursuing a read that in words is their strongest wolfread, when you look at the things Italiano has said.

Also this world I feel that Salad slot also fits in as the 3rd wolf - in which case I need to wait for Salad to post here to see how they act.

Now that you mentyion it, yeah I agree and I'm willing to sheep this.
VOTE: ItalianoVD

Mala and Italiano are both scummy to me right meow.

neither of these are very good takes imo

[Gamma Emerald]

With Italians, it’s mostly been a lot of their stuff looks like it’s been said just to be said rather than them thinking it, almost like a “make the townie convince me they’re town” kinda strategy.

I guess I don’t see Italiano’s reasoning as complex. Looks pretty weak reasoning for the most part.

Almost looks like they wanted you to feel that ease off of them so you’ll town read them.

Flavor Leaf how do you play as town

Smart question

I’m ready to 1v1 someone who was on a Mala wagon.

Been feeling some scum energy getting pushed into that direction.

Where shall i pounce

Why don't you just do it instead of posturing about it? I've been waiting for you to actually do something like this for a bit now.

Another thing up against this, while I've been pushing the appearance of not doing anything/lurky, if you check my ISO, even though the tone is probably there, I feel like you can see multiple posts of vaguely where my head is at.

I tend to find it better for me not to immediately come in the beginning of the game because I'm someone who can essentially take over by talking a lot, so early games I try to stay in the background until it's time for me to pounce.

You can poke at the kitty, but I got hops and claws.

I also dont mind pulling attention onto me if I need to. I like interacting with people directly.

This does interest me a little - Flavor initially says they don't want to take over the game by talking too much, but since then I'd argue they pretty much have taken over the game. That's not a bad thing if they're in the right because they've helped move things forward and put interesting ideas out there, but it does feel like a very deliberate and quick switch-up in approach. Is it town just latching onto ideas they've developed or mafia perhaps sensing a chance to take control?

This is a salient point from a player that has not left much of a strong impression so far. An average player might find that a town thing, but I don’t. I have found that players who ring this bell for me turn out scum rather often. So Malcolm is on my radar for this.

[Gamma Emerald]

Facebonez has towntold more than Scorpious, who has spent the majority of his posts complaining.

This is just nonsense..

I fail to see how what koopa said is incorrect

[Gamma Emerald]

I believe that Human is attempting a White Knight pocket attempt on Italiano to lower my presence in the game as scum.

It isn't a chainsaw.

What's a chainsaw? I saw that mentioned twice now

I believe that Human is attempting a White Knight pocket attempt on Italiano to lower my presence in the game as scum.

It isn't a chainsaw.

What's a chainsaw? I saw that mentioned twice now

Player A (Town) pushes Player B (Scum).

Player C (Scum) pushes Player A. <--- that's the chainsaw. They defend their partner by attacking the one thats pushing their partner.

Thanks for explaining this .

You guys seriously don’t know what chainsaw is?

Why would us not knowing what a term means even worth bringing up?

Things are called different things on different sites.

RVS where I learned mafia is referred to as “joke phase”..

RED ALERT
VOTE: Scorpious
The “joke phase” thing feels inordinately hinky to me. I think I’ve only ever heard it referenced once ever on this site and it was by scum. That on top of all the rest of my grievances with Scorpious make me feel good voting here despite only being about 1/5 caught up

[Gamma Emerald]

Understandable.

[Gamma Emerald]

Idea:
Scorpious Traitor
Italiano and Mala wolves.

I need to so another reISO session later.
The push on me is very flimsy and utilitizes things I know are present in my playstyle that wolves very often think are "wolfy" looking. I know because, obviously, I see it first hand :p

In other news I think HEM is a villager based on recent posts, unfortunately its a sort of conviction/want to be heard kind of energy I see in them.

That being said, we have not seen this in a while, I'll take the advice that no one wants to pressure inactive slots(poor decision imo but I am not a 1 man army) and: VOTE: Mala

Ngl this constant reISO deal is starting to feel like a lot of useless noise

[Gamma Emerald]

Okay idr where I heard joke phase before but full disclosure I was gonna vote Scorpious eventually so that’s inconsequential

[Gamma Emerald]

There are no masons in the setup.

[Gamma Emerald]

It's possible, though, but I'm a mason so i have the different pov, obvi

Didn't you do this claim before as scum in a game with me?

With DkKoba to be precise if I am correct.

Hey DK is the person that made me aware of this site where are they?
I saw them host a game with this ruleset on MU, and it seemed cool to me.

[youtube]https://youtu.be/D32EHS748D4[/youtube]

[Gamma Emerald]

It's possible, though, but I'm a mason so i have the different pov, obvi

Didn't you do this claim before as scum in a game with me?

With DkKoba to be precise if I am correct.

Hey DK is the person that made me aware of this site where are they?
I saw them host a game with this ruleset on MU, and it seemed cool to me.

EBWOP

[Gamma Emerald]

Are you a DkKoba alt?

Holy fucking shit you’re Koba, aren’t you!?

[Gamma Emerald]

Man, this human's obsessed with me.

@Roden - wasn't that serious

So much FL talk when I was away, that's what I like to see. Even when I'm not here, the spotlight loves me

Nah you don't get to backpedal after you made several solves that make me a PoE choice without explaining anything.

VOTE: Flavor Leaf

This is probably coming from town who hasn't learned how to look past getting POE scum read as a personal thing.

I'm not invested enough in this game to care that you scum read me.

What does matter is that you kept trying to tie me in to multiple solves, never explained why, then backed off when nobody bit and you got confronted on it.

why weren’t you invested atp?

I'm just having fun with y'all at this point.

I've explained why you wrong, just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean it's not true.

I see why koopa has been spouting a ton of bravado about my slot being “caught scum” because this is extremely uncharismatic play by flavor leaf, which he does sometimes as town. And like, it’s a standard day when flavor leaf is making an ass of himself.

[Gamma Emerald]

Can we reset this gamestate
We're in too deep on this circular conversation..

Human and I actually havent gone back and forth too much directly, tbh.

To be fair, he only knows how to discredit which is an issue from both scum and town alignments on their part, but it's not ineffective.

lmao projection

You keep using that word; I don't think you know what it means.

For a theater nerd Flavor sure missed the damn mark with this one. Doesn’t help that I just saw Princess Bride for like the fifth time overall over the weekend

[Gamma Emerald]

Incredibly - I went through some meta on Scorpious.. and I am shocked to find that their WOLFPLAY has more depth than their villager play somehow.
When comparing:
This wolf game from a game called Internal Affairs:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... ct[]=26244
and this Villager game from a game called Polish Rap:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... ct[]=26244

Also interesting tidbit I found in the wolf chat:
Subject: Infernal Affairs Mafia PT

Oh, yeah. You should know that.

I’ll be scum read by page 4. I just come off as scum all the time. I usually get out of it but. There will be a push on me. I’m just not that good at this, but I like the game so much.

I feel like I’m pretty familiar with how Scorpious plays as town and this doesn’t feel like it

[Gamma Emerald]

Wait no scratch that

[Gamma Emerald]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84936
Read D1 of this game and tell me this can’t be FL’s town play (to be clear: FL = Pretentious)

[Gamma Emerald]

Not even going to lie, I think if koopa wasn't a PR claimant I'd think they would be paired with either Kitty or NK as they keep attempting to switch to another wagon immediately after saying they'd settle down on a vote. Like not like gradual, wait I do think this is better type of movement. They throw up a case, it gets debunks and they settle back down.

its possible that koopa could be a scum pr

but either way hes not the lim for today

sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo


i still want nk or kitty lim

gamma thoughts

you honestly gave me faith of my fl townread

I’d be fine voting out NK15 but he’s not my first pick
I only really feel like he’s scum if Scorpious is, since I feel NK15’s play around him is weird

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma actually posted. He lurks a lot as scum.

Et tu, MathBlade?
I feel like I’ve definitely broken out of that mold more recently.

[Gamma Emerald]

Imagine being wolfread for updating your reads in real time based on new posts.
I'm so sorry you have to deal with this NK15.

You know this is not the primary reason I wolfread NK15, can you actually take some time to read the replies I'm posting here?

NK15 is limbait in all his games. You need better if he's actually showing solvy mindset.

This is a weird take. Sure he’s not very charismatic but I think he’s good at avoiding rope as town.

[Gamma Emerald]

He has a weird playstyle. That doesn't make him wolf.

Case closed. When he was pushed he kept posting normally. He did not shrink back. Like come the fuck on guys - this is so lazy. NK15 plays different so he is easy to eliminate - his wolf games are very subdued and he is not subdued here.

How come this applies to NK15 but not FL?

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: HEM
I believe i was already here but I want this if I can't have FL.

FL replaced out..

Most likely because of you..

Yeah, let’s note koopa refuses to refer to me by name. Seems a bit fucked up, no?

[Gamma Emerald]

He has a weird playstyle. That doesn't make him wolf.

Case closed. When he was pushed he kept posting normally. He did not shrink back. Like come the fuck on guys - this is so lazy. NK15 plays different so he is easy to eliminate - his wolf games are very subdued and he is not subdued here.

How come this applies to NK15 but not FL?

I dont wolfread FL for playstyle.

It really seems like you do! You’re calling him a wolf for not explaining his Roden take, when it’s been established he doesn’t do that as town.

[Gamma Emerald]

hey i'm really swamped

let's not rush an elim.

Andres you can catch up, we have time.

game-advancing content: Mala avoided our engagement, and didn't answer my question about their FL townread satisfactory. This is scum, and I don't know what happened that I'm the only one in here.

bite me

a lot of it is tone + gut + knowing FL iRL

so I'm really sorry that it's not satisfactory to you, but it's good enough for me to go on with D1.

okay. now show us.

Btw I’ve seen Mala posting like this as town before, partly my fault in that past case but nevertheless this detachment from her at least is within her town range

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: HEM
I believe i was already here but I want this if I can't have FL.

FL replaced out..

Most likely because of you..

Yeah, let’s note koopa refuses to refer to me by name. Seems a bit fucked up, no?

I am referring to FL because they are reasons pertaining to FL - you can try to explain what you think progression wise he was thinking but I'm not going to label things he said as things you did. If you havent noticed I've referenced you when speaking of your slot in general
Why do you have concern for this though?

It feels vaguely like you’re trying to avoid actually being impartial by focusing on the player whose impression has been made rather than opening up your mind to the new person.

It also just seems, I dunno, a little fucked up on a human level? There’s a comparison I could make but in the interest of not making an ass of myself I’ll leave that door shut. But I have little tolerance for the type of behavior I feel like you’re potentially practicing.

[Gamma Emerald]

He has a weird playstyle. That doesn't make him wolf.

Case closed. When he was pushed he kept posting normally. He did not shrink back. Like come the fuck on guys - this is so lazy. NK15 plays different so he is easy to eliminate - his wolf games are very subdued and he is not subdued here.

How come this applies to NK15 but not FL?

I dont wolfread FL for playstyle.

It really seems like you do! You’re calling him a wolf for not explaining his Roden take, when it’s been established he doesn’t do that as town.

Wait, he doesn't do that as town? You mean he doesn't do that as scum, right?

I said what I fucking meant! MathBlade has been asserting that FL doesn’t provide reasons as town, and while I’m not as sure in that based on direct exp I feel like MathBlade at least knows what he’s talking about.

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma - your predecessor had several hundred posts. Of course I am going to mainly judge your alignment mainly based on that unless you override that with something significant. So far your play has been somewhat soft to me - safe in a way - that indicates you don't want to shake up anything set up right now

Is this the road you want to go down? I would not in any way call my play here “soft” or “safe”, so wat h your next step carefully. Others have already made note of ways in which my play runs contrary to the box you seem to have planned to put it into.

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma, Italian, Andres and NK.

All of which are in the PoE. I took Italiano out of the question temporarily. This is the pure PoE if all my reads up until this point are correct, which I do not believe is the case anymore. NK red leads to Koopa red which leads to Andres green. Not sure where I'd go from that point but in that case the remaining is currently in my brain as Gamma/Italian.

…

[Gamma Emerald]

Millers claim day 1. I suspect I am such role. I then claimed. Wasn't to do with wagon pressure.
We can solve me further later assuming I don't die.

I think both Scorp and Kitty are out of the wagon choices for today. Scorp if you had to pick someone outside of ur three suspicions (me, kit, poopa) who would it be.

Target me tonight.

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma, Italian, Andres and NK.

All of which are in the PoE. I took Italiano out of the question temporarily. This is the pure PoE if all my reads up until this point are correct, which I do not believe is the case anymore. NK red leads to Koopa red which leads to Andres green. Not sure where I'd go from that point but in that case the remaining is currently in my brain as Gamma/Italian.

…

Say something about it. Don't just use an ellipsis, I hate people that post useless messages that pretend to have content.

The only person in your PoE I feel like seems has a good chance to be scum is NK15, even correcting my name to Math

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma - your predecessor had several hundred posts. Of course I am going to mainly judge your alignment mainly based on that unless you override that with something significant. So far your play has been somewhat soft to me - safe in a way - that indicates you don't want to shake up anything set up right now

Is this the road you want to go down? I would not in any way call my play here “soft” or “safe”, so wat h your next step carefully. Others have already made note of ways in which my play runs contrary to the box you seem to have planned to put it into.

How do you feel about Mala and HEM?

Both town, HEM a strong read than Mala

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma, Italian, Andres and NK.

All of which are in the PoE. I took Italiano out of the question temporarily. This is the pure PoE if all my reads up until this point are correct, which I do not believe is the case anymore. NK red leads to Koopa red which leads to Andres green. Not sure where I'd go from that point but in that case the remaining is currently in my brain as Gamma/Italian.

…

Say something about it. Don't just use an ellipsis, I hate people that post useless messages that pretend to have content.

Gamma, which post made you aware of JVs PR status?

My death means my base role gets to make a move or gunsmith makes a move. I doubt both as

[REDACTED]

.
Either is fine, even if it is one free action.

[Gamma Emerald]

Millers claim day 1. I suspect I am such role. I then claimed. Wasn't to do with wagon pressure.
We can solve me further later assuming I don't die.

I think both Scorp and Kitty are out of the wagon choices for today. Scorp if you had to pick someone outside of ur three suspicions (me, kit, poopa) who would it be.

Target me tonight.

What?

Millers claim day 1. I suspect I am such role. I then claimed. Wasn't to do with wagon pressure.
We can solve me further later assuming I don't die.

I think both Scorp and Kitty are out of the wagon choices for today. Scorp if you had to pick someone outside of ur three suspicions (me, kit, poopa) who would it be.

Target me tonight.

is this pr bait

I’m not saying JV has to full claim today or even tomorrow, I just think him targeting me is a good way to resolve my slot potentially.

[Gamma Emerald]

Welp, my parents decided to go apeshit at a simple question despite that being the behavior they’ve been TRYING TO ENCOURAGE FROM ME, so I don’t think I’m in the mood to play here for a bit.

[Gamma Emerald]

Did I mention I am also 1-shot Bulletproof :p

I was actually considering claiming that so I dodge the nightkill - but I realized that people might mistake that as a traitor claim so I went against it

KNEW IT

[Gamma Emerald]

You're not as strong at 1v1ing as Dkkoba is.

Must suck for you trying to compare yourself up to Dkkoba.

> replaces out of the game

fucking ew

[Gamma Emerald]

Roden why did you drop Mala

I was having doubts when Mala started to actually play since her comeback felt genuinely townie. And Leaf claiming to be pocketed but literally being unable to explain why or how made me think Mala was the actual pocket instead. With that in mind, my gut was telling me that a Mala flip could lead to some chain mis-elims. Even if Leaf is scum, the elim wasn't happening today and I wanted to look for potential buddies instead.

However the Koba reveal is forcing me to hard reset entirely. Literally nothing is out of their scum range, and I need to reevaluate their main points to see if they were genuine or if I was just getting taken along for a ride. I feel like I've been getting heavily encouraged to tunnel Leaf, and despite my own attempts to try to step back I now just have all bad vibes gnawing away in the pit of my stomach.

This feels very, very townie for what it's worth.

I kinda agree
I would, however, like for Roden to respond to my question from before, as there was purpose behind it

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma does feel less aggressive upon entrance, but I attribute that to not being caught up

Wdym by “less aggressive on entrance”?

[Gamma Emerald]

Like, less aggressive to what?

[Gamma Emerald]

Also I reread an old game with NK15 I played in and I'm starting to think my reading method for NK15 was a fluke. I'm turning around on NK15 scum - It also explains why I am the only one really going to bat for the slot, because scum are likely already planning on bussing IMHO.

Which one is it?

[Gamma Emerald]

you're making it too obvious that we're partners. you left me out.

Please do not perpetuate this bogus.

[Gamma Emerald]

sorry Mala, but i do this AtE all the time and I really don't buy this climax. Although I'm gonna give you a benefit of the doubt and ask you to just engage me later.

[Gamma Emerald]

Town
I’m more confident now than I was when koopa asked earlier, btw

[Gamma Emerald]

For the AtE, actually
It feels remarkably akin to the situation she (and her hydra partner Kuribo) was dealing with in Pokémon Large Theme
I believe Math and koopa will see it too, they were also there

[Gamma Emerald]

do you mind sending me a link so i can read later

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87795

[Gamma Emerald]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=86642
Did a meta dive on italiano to see if I could eliminate them from my PoE - looks like this game, is similar to this one in terms of play.
There are low intensity wolf and town games too I saw - but this stood out. I read their ISO and thought similar things I did here. They pushed players in a similar way.

Scorpious, can you give us a readslist please?

I hate lists, although FL made me like them a bit..

I recommend the entire Foundation series by Asimov
All of Shakespeare is essential
The Expanse series is probably my favorite Space opera
Game of Thrones was a great read but I had to take notes. Sooo many characters…

Ohhh, the game… list. Not rankings

Big T’s
————
Mala
Italiano
HEM
You

Little t’s
————
koopa(only because claim)
Jv(same reason)
Nk15(this is ridiculous)
Note: one of these is lying

Scums
————
Kitty
Math
GE

I have not focused on Roden or Malcom at all admittedly..

NK15 is technically on here twice

[Gamma Emerald]

I see it was noticed

[Gamma Emerald]

I don't like Scorpious putting Gamma in their mafia reads when so far as I'm aware they've not particularly pushed that slot at all from what I can recall.

I’m sus of all replacements until I’m comfortable.

Seems bogus

[Gamma Emerald]

I claimed VT

Is anyone reading my posts or just riding this horrible wagon.

Okay and? Lmao

[Gamma Emerald]

I don't like Scorpious putting Gamma in their mafia reads when so far as I'm aware they've not particularly pushed that slot at all from what I can recall.

I’m sus of all replacements until I’m comfortable.

Seems bogus

Does it really though?

If you’re sus of me because I’m a replacement, why am I “big S”?

[Gamma Emerald]

fr?
I was gonna vote Kitty coming in probably, I feel like he kinda rode coattails a bit yday? He beat on Scorpious for pushing a claimed PR, which made me think Kitty claimed PR, but just generally I feel like kitty’s play has been scummy

[Gamma Emerald]

I guess the big question I have is why did scum send Andres to do the kill?

wdym

Andres was widely suspected.

Scum on MS generally have a choice to do the kill.

So why would they send Andres?

How was Andres widely suspected?

[Gamma Emerald]

I remember their Scorpious vote to feel townie. It was a weak read though.

But I felt like it was the right flashwagon to make

Why would u flash wagon a tr?

[Gamma Emerald]

Is Andre/Kitty/HEM a possible mafia team here?

I think team is Andre+Math+Malcolm/Kitty if NK15 is not faking.

ironic.

[Gamma Emerald]

I think I’m the Towniest Town that ever Towned. Not sure what there is to discuss here.

pffft

[Gamma Emerald]

Is Andre/Kitty/HEM a possible mafia team here?

I think team is Andre+Math+Malcolm/Kitty if NK15 is not faking.

ironic.

What are you thinking?

Andres, Kitty, and HEM were my bottom 3 during the night after I thought over what I’d seen with the Scorpious flip

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma, you think NK15 and Andres are laying a scum gambit or should I let it go and just vote Andres?

It would be a very bold scum gambit, I don’t think NK15 is the type

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma, you think NK15 and Andres are laying a scum gambit or should I let it go and just vote Andres?

It would be a very bold scum gambit, I don’t think NK15 is the type

To expend on this, NK15 had a rather weak scumgame and he knows it, and plays to whatever strengths he can rather than improve his play. As such I don’t expect him to run a gambit where he is meant to be the surviving one.

[Gamma Emerald]

I guess the big question I have is why did scum send Andres to do the kill?

Depends if multitasking exists and where the PRs lie

I mean yes but no.

Assume scum have two PRs they had to use and Andres is a vanilla goon.

Then what were they doing?

We have Koopa, JV, and NK15 who all claimed something. If they’re all town what would the invests be doing?
Then if they have manipulators like a roleblock why did NK15 get a check off?

If Andres is a strongman so had to do the kill then that means we have a protective along with a gunsmith and a tracker who could act on D1?

I can’t get the pieces to fit which means something smells.

What makes you think scum would have 2 PRs?

[Gamma Emerald]

It doesn’t make sense which is why they would do it.

Responding to 2947 & 2948

Pls respond to 2951/2970

[Gamma Emerald]

You’re drunk on WIFOM
Stop trying to guess at what PRs scum do or do not have.

[Gamma Emerald]

This is gonna sound rude but: when have you ever had ideas of normal balance that resembled what the game reviewers actually had in mind?

[Gamma Emerald]

I would like for kitty to post before the hammer is dropped

[Gamma Emerald]

NK15, JV
Malcolm, Mala, Math
Roden, Italiano
Kitty, HEM
Andres

These are my current reads

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey
I was gonna go after this anyway today

[Gamma Emerald]

still think HEM is scum
his mala push D1 doesn't feel like it was in good faith

[Gamma Emerald]

UNVOTE:
idk if I wanna vote IVD yet but the stuff Roden is bringing forward is suspicious

[Gamma Emerald]

Early on I thought HEM’s initial take on Mala was in good faith. I don’t agree with Gamma here regarding that it wasn’t.

to elaborate, the initial take isn't as problematic as the constant insistence on that mala read, that's what I considered bad faith

[Gamma Emerald]

@JV can you explain your Malcolm case again? I don’t get that.

I never made a case, in fact I was pretty heavily town-reading them up until recently when I realised that they seemed to bounce around and avoid direct arguments against them.

I don’t follow. Can you elaborate?

I have a feeling there’s a deep wolf stuff doesn’t add up here.

I just don't feel HEM is scum anymore, or at least I am less confident that I am willing for them to re-read and give thoughts, and Malcom is who I think is probably the best bet otherwise. I don't see how scum!italiano would be so obvious when their partner has been red-checked.

Actually, when you put it that way I think Italiano’s play around the guilty was rather textbook scumplay. The Roden “scum slip” push is an attempt to create an additional escape route.
VOTE: ItalianoVD

[Gamma Emerald]

@JV can you explain your Malcolm case again? I don’t get that.

I never made a case, in fact I was pretty heavily town-reading them up until recently when I realised that they seemed to bounce around and avoid direct arguments against them.

I don’t follow. Can you elaborate?

I have a feeling there’s a deep wolf stuff doesn’t add up here.

I just don't feel HEM is scum anymore, or at least I am less confident that I am willing for them to re-read and give thoughts, and Malcom is who I think is probably the best bet otherwise. I don't see how scum!italiano would be so obvious when their partner has been red-checked.

Actually, when you put it that way I think Italiano’s play around the guilty was rather textbook scumplay. The Roden “scum slip” push is an attempt to create an additional escape route.
VOTE: ItalianoVD

Oh? Could you explain further? I don't see why scum!italiano would make it painfully obvious and vote the tracker which guiltied their partner, given the partner was also just a Goon.

If not braced properly, a guilty can rattle a scum player to make moves that be plainly seen as covering for their buddy. I’ve actually blown my game up in the past by doing that.

[Gamma Emerald]

My bad. Meant to condense those quotes.

Personal experience makes me think you’re just generally sus

[Gamma Emerald]

Even your push on Mala feels similar. There were some holes in Mala's early play. Mafia can exploit this for a read that seems genuine even though they know it isn't.

This is the core for why I think HEM is suspicious

[Gamma Emerald]

I get that Scorpious/Jackson going for Koopa may have seemed weird but it'd have so illogical and baffling for two mafia to both go on the same role-claimed player bandwagon.

To clarify, I did that to make them look worse so they don't get shot rather than me particularly thinking they were scum but that also merged with my visceral repulsion of their play-style.

Why do people ever think this works???

[Gamma Emerald]

I'm kinda out of it, I had a bit of a personal epiphany this evening

[Gamma Emerald]

I'm kinda out of it, I had a bit of a personal epiphany this evening

Which is?

I acted seriously out of line in another game, and I know exactly where my mistakes lies

[Gamma Emerald]

Prodding humaneatingmonkey and ItalianoVD

Also, don't read into this. It's coincidental.

I thought nothing of it until you brought it up

[Gamma Emerald]

my mom had to deal with a lot of stuff in the past few weeks (she works in accounting so tax season is bust season for her) so I relate

[Gamma Emerald]

busy season*

[Gamma Emerald]

simple jailkeeper is a very sus claim given flips

[Gamma Emerald]

Hmmm

[Gamma Emerald]

Thinking about it I have an uneasy acceptance of Malcolm’s claim. It feels half-synergetic with NK15’s role to a degree.

[Gamma Emerald]

GE I think is also likely to be scum here — possibly with Malakittens, but also regardless of Malakittens.

I think I should just read the thread now and get a solid theory of what's happening in this game.

Really? Why?
You going back to pushing Mala also isn’t very impressive.

[Gamma Emerald]

I’m less TRing her atp and more scumreading your insistence on pursuing her

[Gamma Emerald]

Idk
I just think you’re pushing her out of need rather than an actual read, which why you decided to throw dirt on me when you saw the chance

[Gamma Emerald]

I don’t recall any belief I was scum at all from you until just now, when I popped in and started producing content again. That seems timed to potentially prevent me from working out your schemes as you could try to act like I was only reacting to your sus on me.

[Gamma Emerald]

I’d probably shoot humaneatingmonkey
Not exactly inventive but he’s become a bit of a mental block for me atp

[Gamma Emerald]

I'm very confident Roden is town here

[Gamma Emerald]

I don't think named roles are normal

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: hem

I want u dead

what changed from when u thought hem's thoughtspew was town?

[Gamma Emerald]

ugh the last page spew by HEM makes me think town

back to the drawing board

UNVOTE: hem

again:

locktown:
JV, GE, Math
town:
Roden, HEM

MT is losing his town status

Need to sort/scum:

IVD, KITTY & MT

VOTE: ivd

idk if this is E-2 or w/e

what was this then

[Gamma Emerald]

I acknowledge your point but your post is funny because you clearly have a different definition of “roleplayer” to the rest of the world

[Gamma Emerald]

I feel like the flipped PRs + malcolm could exist with 1 scum PR if it's notably powerful
I feel like scum is in kitty/malcolm + 1 other (thinking either HEM or mala atp), so I would be okay voting out either
I just hope we can get it right today

[Gamma Emerald]

The main issue I have is if Malcolm is town and scum don’t have two PRs then

Town would have on N1 a gunsmith that would be able to guilty 2/3rds if not 3/3rds of the game
A simple Jailkeeper that could stop the kill 2/3rds of the time with scum likely sending a goon to do the kill if all they have is one uber PR
Then a lazy tracker than can guilty in the same way a jailkeeper can and if it hits the uber PR then that Uber PR has to have a reason.

I’d have to calculate the odds but the odds of all three not getting a guilty on N1 is extremely low.

We know it’s unlikely scum have a blocker.

An ascetic would be a guilty.

Like help?

okay yeah this puts it in a different way that I think is more valid, basically a 1 PR team would be smashed by town's PRs if malcolm is town, and with 2 PRs malcolm is essentially useless. The issue there is useless at night doesn't make him a good vote-off. I'd rather hit scum. So like, do you have a particular reason why kitty is town by play?

[Gamma Emerald]

If we're thinking Mala is safe, then the game is essentially a lock, but I don't feel 100% about that, especially after what I pointed out very recently.

[Gamma Emerald]

I don't feel like Roden is scum, the way he went against IVD felt very towny

[Gamma Emerald]

If we're thinking Mala is safe, then the game is essentially a lock, but I don't feel 100% about that, especially after what I pointed out very recently.

I agree with this thought. I am not sold on Mala town but you Me and Roden is a pretty good town block.

Mainly I think with the fact Malcolm hasn’t been turbo yeeted means Malcolm is scum or scum don’t want to elim Malcolm for some reason.

Like it’s weird.

Is there a reason you townread Malcolm Gamma?

Why would Malcolm have been turbo yeeted as town?

[Gamma Emerald]

Yeah I feel like a mafia doctor probably exists because of Andres fishing for vig

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: mt

why are you opting to vote malcolm now?

[Gamma Emerald]

Pretty sure the vig is a red herring rn

[Gamma Emerald]

Not really atp

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: malcolm
See y’all tomorrow

[Gamma Emerald]

I feel like that kill is a sign kittytacky is scum

[Gamma Emerald]

Roden and Malcolm both were pushing you
They both flipped town

[Gamma Emerald]

I think Kitty fully expected to be voted out today and thus just made the kill he wanted

[Gamma Emerald]

Roden and Malcolm both were pushing you
They both flipped town

That would be too obvious.

It's a framing attempt.

Funny you only respond with this AFTER HEM came in to say this.

[Gamma Emerald]

You probably

[Gamma Emerald]

GE probs scum given her extremely sudden jump on me despite her showing basically no interest in me earlier, and the honestly half-hearted HEM accusation.

FOS: Gamma Emerald

Treat this as a vote, except I'm not voting for real so early in LimLo.

Did you miss me saying one of you/Malcolm was scum?

[Gamma Emerald]

I don’t think Math is scum so atp I think it’s Kitty and either you or Mala
I’m leaning it being you rn

[Gamma Emerald]

Let's say Kitty is scum, and you're right that Kitty just killed Roden because he FOS'd him. If he knew he would be dead, why wouldn't he just kill to benefit his partner at that point? Shouldn't it be a set-up to win?

It just doesn't make sense.

Roden was pushing Kitty quite a bit and probably would have had to have been killed the next night anyway because he’d be spewed as not a partner

[Gamma Emerald]

I always get this from you and Mala. Why is Math town?

Because from my POV, it's either both you are having a concerted effort to pocket the guy or both of you have been pocketed hard. The belief that Math is town is unshaken.

This is a bit of a weird perspective

[Gamma Emerald]

And why?

You seem to be saying it as me/Mala have pocketed math OR he’s pocketing us?
Do you think Math/Kitty could be the team?

[Gamma Emerald]

fake vote: humaneatingmonkey

Not buying it.

[Gamma Emerald]

Cast the pseudo vote coward

[Gamma Emerald]

???

[Gamma Emerald]

[Gamma Emerald]

Guess my reward for trying to get the ball rolling this day phase is getting told to go fuck myself

[Gamma Emerald]

@mala I’m wondering, why were you low effort so far this game?

[Gamma Emerald]

Sure as hell ain’t me
If math is scum I’m policy linking him any time he complains about town sided setups

[Gamma Emerald]

I’m betting it’s math + HEM
I should called math out on the fact I pseudo voted HEM

[Gamma Emerald]

I sim this setup as sub 50% odds of a town win. I can't really help beyond that.

Then imho your sim is flawed.

A n1 guilty is the expected result in this scenario and with that town’s more often than not win unless it’s prepared for.

only the tracker and the jk could get guilties n1
a jk guilty is inconclusive and a tracker guilty is highly unlikely

[Gamma Emerald]

Gunsmith was even night

[Gamma Emerald]

Wait nvm
I think it being even-night would have been fair

[Gamma Emerald]

people tend to think a setup is skewed against them as their own alignment when the setup is balanced in a closed - this is how i catch out scum mathblade everytime when he starts complaining about balance when I find the setup not that bad.

^^^^^^ This ^^^^^^

[Gamma Emerald]

Ooh, good comeback

gross af
youre not adding anything youre just being mean

[Gamma Emerald]

Ooh, good comeback

gross af
youre not adding anything youre just being mean

Tad hypocritical?
At least I was being supportive

when you're supporting someone attacking someone else, that's not okay
also I haven't really weighed in on the initial argument, but I feel like both koba and FL contributed some to the demotivation, but I think koba should at least know how to be better next time

[Gamma Emerald]

Scum was super strong yeah. It would have been a blowout if not for the lucky guilty D2.

Or slow down and dont tunnel (: scum was sloppy and HEM was blatant from the vig claim nonsense lol

Well that's just my playstyle, I latch onto people like a tick. I can't help it. I had my suspicions of HEM but ended up pushing the wrong people all game lmfao.

Same
We should have focused on HEM rather than fighting each other

[Gamma Emerald]

I think depending on how math played I would have eventually figured him out

[Gamma Emerald]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=89341

notes PT I used d/n1 and then promptly forgot about

[Gamma Emerald]