Mini Normal 2271 - Game Over

[koopashell]

Kitty's entrance is villagery.

[koopashell]

Guess Scorpious' isn't as villagery though

[koopashell]

Kitty's entrance is villagery.

Is it particularly? Feels like a pretty standard entrance either side could play.

Oddly enough I managed to gleam a villa lean!

[koopashell]

'Soup, fools

You have a wolf guide? What can you teach me thay I don't already know

[koopashell]

'Soup, fools

You have a wolf guide? What can you teach me thay I don't already know

that you can always create better gambits

Hah, the riskier the strategy the less villagerd are interested in uncovering it. I like it.

[koopashell]

I usually get scumread for this but eh who cares.

1. How long have you played the game of mafia, not just on this site, but ever?
2. Do you like playing the role of town or mafia better?
3. Are you an active poster or a lurker?
4. Do you find it hard to lie or it something you have no issues with?

1. Since 2009? Probably.
2. Town! But that doesnt mean I don't like being a wolf
3. Very lurky.
4. I never lie.

[koopashell]

Mala villagery tho, why do you want to vote only villagers mr monkey?

[koopashell]

'Soup, fools

You have a wolf guide? What can you teach me thay I don't already know

that you can always create better gambits

Hah, the riskier the strategy the less villagerd are interested in uncovering it. I like it.

Are you guys friends?

Nope. Never heard of em.

[koopashell]

Mala villagery tho, why do you want to vote only villagers mr monkey?

villagey how?

That entrance is fairly pure tonally, what's bad about it?

[koopashell]

I believe it is your turn to explain what you saw in it that was worthy to shade though... An equivalent exchange of ideas after all.

[koopashell]

Ok that's fair. I felt the excited tone leaned more like a player who was genuinely excited to have randed town, but I see that reasoning too. You can have a townlean too

I am very generous with villa reads early in the game, and tend to raise my bar as the game goes on. It is generally easier to sort that way and catch wolves in PoE first and foremost. I understand most people try to be conservative with stronger reads, but I find that playstyle boring and I like to pressure wolves by strongly townreading people that may be potential miseliminations. It's a style that works well for the most part.

[koopashell]

I really like Italiano's energy so far, another townlean from me!

[koopashell]

I have a certain respect for people who have pride in their wolf play, as the better people are at playing wolf, the more interesting games are, and it isn't just as simple as solving the most polarized players, tis all.
Here's a list of my villa reads so far, ranked by strength:
Italiano
Humaneatingmonkey
KittyTacky
Malakittens

Not bad for page 2 as well as not even half the playerlist has posted if I say so myself

[koopashell]

ngl koopa you really seem like someone who got caught and is now amping it up to double down

not sure i trust you just yet

I think moreso we just had a difference in opinion I predict I will catch at least 1 wolf for you by page 10 so I can assuage your fears.

[koopashell]

I have a certain respect for people who have pride in their wolf play, as the better people are at playing wolf, the more interesting games are, and it isn't just as simple as solving the most polarized players, tis all.
Here's a list of my villa reads so far, ranked by strength:
Italiano
Humaneatingmonkey
KittyTacky
Malakittens

Not bad for page 2 as well as not even half the playerlist has posted if I say so myself

that's just a sneaky type of way to push me as being scum, i see how it is.

Moreso giving the proper respect towards a player who writes guides for wolves. I do not explicitly see you as below null, for clarity, else I would be voting you right now. I'm sure given a push or 2 I will be able to gleam your progression/thought processes and give a more confident read there.

[koopashell]

As sarcastic as that was, I actually think pushing that kinda mentality is somewhat townie.

as in, human is kinda townie for pushing that because thats kind of a weird thing to push as scum, yall feel me

I have a certain respect for people who have pride in their wolf play, as the better people are at playing wolf, the more interesting games are, and it isn't just as simple as solving the most polarized players, tis all.
Here's a list of my villa reads so far, ranked by strength:
Italiano
Humaneatingmonkey
KittyTacky
Malakittens

Not bad for page 2 as well as not even half the playerlist has posted if I say so myself

that's just a sneaky type of way to push me as being scum, i see how it is.

Actually - these 2 posts are villagery, but I will probably still keep an eye on you

[koopashell]

Easier for wolves to fake a reason for a townread than a wolf read, etc. I don't think anyone should reasonably find me too villager either while I still haven't actually tried to push anyone as wolf yet as with TMI it is fairly trivial to explain why a villager is a villager.
Right now mainly I have my eye very closely on Roden and await what they do as he popped into the thread and only posted a naked vote. As if my gut had a gut wolfread if you get what I mean haha

[koopashell]

I don't see the correlation between self consciousness and wolfiness, unless you are saying Mala is normally *not* self conscious as villager.
Is that something you have seen success with using to read people on this site, Roden?

[koopashell]

I do find issue that Mala immediately denied the self consciousness in response to it being called a wolftell - as it *is* present, although I did not inherently find it bad.
Can you explain the denial, Mala?

[koopashell]

I don't see the correlation between self consciousness and wolfiness, unless you are saying Mala is normally *not* self conscious as villager.
Is that something you have seen success with using to read people on this site, Roden?

Idk who's alt you are but this post is skeeving me out for some reason

Last time I played with Mala, she rolled scum, and her day play felt very self conscious there as well, with a pinch of "I don't do X as scum"

I am an alt, in the sense I am not using the name normally associated with my main identity, but I am a stranger to this website.

Re:Mala; Could you say the same is absent from their town meta as well, because you have only opened up the possibility of this being their wolfgame based on this minor tell, but it is only useful if it is a polarized tell.

[koopashell]

Tentative PoE of:
Saladman27
Facebones
Scorpious
MalcolmTucker
Not Known 15

I believe there is at least 1 wolf, if not 2-3 in this pool, based on my initial reads here.

[koopashell]

I think letting mala breathe for now and keeping an eye on the slot is the right play here, fwiw.

[koopashell]

I don't see the correlation between self consciousness and wolfiness, unless you are saying Mala is normally *not* self conscious as villager.
Is that something you have seen success with using to read people on this site, Roden?

Idk who's alt you are but this post is skeeving me out for some reason

Last time I played with Mala, she rolled scum, and her day play felt very self conscious there as well, with a pinch of "I don't do X as scum"

I am an alt, in the sense I am not using the name normally associated with my main identity, but I am a stranger to this website.

Re:Mala; Could you say the same is absent from their town meta as well, because you have only opened up the possibility of this being their wolfgame based on this minor tell, but it is only useful if it is a polarized tell.

Last town game she played was very aggressive and solvey. I wouldn't call it night and day, but her playstyle differences are noticeable in hindsight.

That's fair.

Unrelated:
VOTE: NK15

[koopashell]

where do you originally play koopashell

Now now, I can't have you trying to unmask me!
I will say I have played on MafiaUniverse for a while.

[koopashell]

are you a new person here or have i seen you around

I have seen you in the queue thread!

[koopashell]

I think there is a decent chance of mala being wolf after the follow up response, but I will attempt to play the good cop.

Mala, could you provide at least, as a token of good faith and open show of your thought processes, an ordered list of the players and how you would rank them from more villagery(towny) to most wolfy? If you include a break in the list to indicate a "null line" that would also help immensely, thank you.

[koopashell]

I think there is a decent chance of mala being wolf after the follow up response, but I will attempt to play the good cop.

Mala, could you provide at least, as a token of good faith and open show of your thought processes, an ordered list of the players and how you would rank them from more villagery(towny) to most wolfy? If you include a break in the list to indicate a "null line" that would also help immensely, thank you.

off page 4 -- i wont have solid reads and i seriously hate "forcing" reads this early on just b/c

early D1 i go by gut

majority of these players are new 2 me so i wont even have a decent read

the only ones i ahve played with ebfore are {FL, Roden, JV}

It's not forcing reads - it's ranking the players. It at least gives us a baseline into where you are thinking, with at least gut.

I'll grant you an incentive: VOTE: Mala

[koopashell]

Catching up a bit…

Koopa's gonna be hard to read

Don’t think so.

I have played with JV twice so far; both times I have been scum. So there's the potential that he might vote me right off the bat which is fair considering that I been scum twice so far now against him.

Why does that matter? So what if he votes you? Do you always do that for people you’ve played with?

You know HEM made a good point when he said it sounded like you were addressing JV almost like you knew he was already town and didn’t want the smoke.

I’ve never played with you (that I can remember) but I would assume town!you maybe wouldn’t care that much.

tbh if i was self conscious i prob wouldnt have posted my first post
just saying

And this is a contradiction.

73 and 74 ping me. Like the questions are kinda meh. Like almost like once they answer then what? They don’t seem like sorting questions. Feels like busywork.

I’m gonna place 77 82 and 83 in the townbin pile for now.

Geez 108 is screaming at me dude.

VOTE: koopa

What did you find wolfy about it?

[koopashell]

Again not really seeing where I did a TMI on JV.

My thought process was as follows:

Get my role PM - see it’s green. Get excited because I’m not scum finally.
See the player list and realize that JV is in it.
Get excited because I’m finally playing as town instead of scum with JV there unlike the last two games we were in.

Gets scum read for said excitement.

#reck

[Unv][/unv]
I think NK15 has also been villagery on this page.
VOTE: Scorpious

[koopashell]

Ah now I know why it wasn't obvious... I made a mistake.

Again not really seeing where I did a TMI on JV.

My thought process was as follows:

Get my role PM - see it’s green. Get excited because I’m not scum finally.
See the player list and realize that JV is in it.
Get excited because I’m finally playing as town instead of scum with JV there unlike the last two games we were in.

Gets scum read for said excitement.

#reck

[Unv][/unv]
I think NK15 has also been villagery on this page.
VOTE: Scorpious

Are we still random voting?

None of my votes have been random - I think you are trying to be UTR and want to draw you out - and you are in my current PoE.

[koopashell]

Oh shit, good catch.
Yes actually - I believe an explaination is in order.

[koopashell]

I didn’t like the trajectory.

Letting me breathe & then asking me to post a list on page 4 which I’m not comfortable with and then oppurnity jumping onto my wagon using pressure vote

Which is cool, but obv makes the commenting letting me breathe go to trash

Again just hated the trajectory on premises

My intent was to unvote as soon as you opened up your thought process a little. I probably should have said that but getting a ranked list is the easiest way for me to show my thoughts on the game quickly - your other response was also decently reasonable.

The breathe comment was before you said something "weird".
Regardless - we are starting to talk in circles about this - lets agree to drop it for now, I'm sure you'll be glad to.

[koopashell]

I think Facebones is a villager in all worlds I'm currently considering.
I'd like to poll peoples current thoughts on Scorpious if possible

[koopashell]

Italiano, you should know that doesn't make it wolf indicative.
Perhaps consider this motivation, which is the truth:
I want to advance the game to the fun part asap(solving)
The most effective way to get there is to take stances and note reactions to said stances.
I have not even once stated any of my reads were set in stone - in fact mala has been fairly volatile here in view.
Tl;dr forcing reads advances the gamestate and you should consider people have diffrent opinions on how to play Mafia.

I ask kindly that you leave that point alone and evaluate me based on the content of my posts rather than how you think villagers should play the game.

[koopashell]

What did you find wolfy about it?

The

tone

of the post mainly. I felt like the way you were asking her to post a readslist was kinda iffy. A readslist that early is 1) not gonna do anything as far as being able to read the slot and 2) a waste of time that early. And yes I do think it could possibly be alignment indicative.

I already explained it creates a baseline to trace from.
Again, you and I likely see the way to solve the game in a different light. I asked for something that helps me, perhaps it doesnt help *you* but it does help me.
Talk to me about Scorpious, please.

[koopashell]

Can people not quote 5 posts with parahraphs in them please? It's hard to parse on mobile.

[koopashell]

I’m ready to 1v1 someone who was on a Mala wagon.

Been feeling some scum energy getting pushed into that direction.

Where shall i pounce

Why don't you just do it instead of posturing about it? I've been waiting for you to actually do something like this for a bit now.

[koopashell]

Spoiler: scorpius

I’m ready to 1v1 someone who was on a Mala wagon.

Been feeling some scum energy getting pushed into that direction.

Where shall i pounce

Why don't you just do it instead of posturing about it? I've been waiting for you to actually do something like this for a bit now.

I’d rather see how people react to me saying it than do it

I think it’s fair, I would be more inclined at this early stage to think the voters were more sus than the votee..

based on?

[koopashell]

Now that everyone but saladman has posted significant content, I will do a new ranked list of player(mostly actually for myself to get an idea of what *I* am looking at as I haven't organized my thoughts yet haha) and we can see here:

Not Known 15
humaneatingmonkey
Facebones
MalcolmTucker
ItalianoVD
KittyTacky
Flavor Leaf
JacksonVirgo
Roden
Malakittens
Scorpious
Saladman27



Salad goes on bottom as a player with 0 content and thus 0 level of villagerness. Everyone in the game other has, in my view, achieved *something* that makes me feel there is a little thought behind it.


A few are extended gut reads and are very volatile in ranking possibility here - some of these I cannot even remember specific posts why but my brain tells them that they are there, but if prompted I can likely find the posts that led me to that conclusion.

[koopashell]

I'm interested in your Italiano read, Flavor, because I disagree and think their mindset is villagery, despite being one I disagree with.
Despite him wolfreading me, I think he is at least pushing me in good faith, in the sense that I feel that he is pushing me in a way that a villager pushes a read they believe in.

[koopashell]

Salad is "neutral" but I think there's a decent chance of the slot actually being wolf by PoE.

[koopashell]

I'm interested in your Italiano read, Flavor, because I disagree and think their mindset is villagery, despite being one I disagree with.
Despite him wolfreading me, I think he is at least pushing me in good faith, in the sense that I feel that he is pushing me in a way that a villager pushes a read they believe in.

do you think a scum cant push someone 'in good faith'?

I think wolves are more or less very hard pressed to push villagers in ways that are genuine and that is the key to catching most of them.
Perhaps your definition of "good faith" may be different, but mine is that they cannot come off as truly genuine in a push on a villager in a way that is uncatchable.

Italiano's reasoning to wolfread me are complex in a way that I find primarily comes from villagers.

That isn't to say I am not opposed to the fact my premise might be wrong and this is simply the first time for me having the tell not be useful - as it is a recent development in my wolfhunting strategy.

For me, as long as a world exists that has a line of thinking plausible for a villager, that thought process should not be utilized for a case.

I understand this is something that may feel foreign or uncomfortable to many players and all, and first reaction is to say that this is "fence sitting" or that this is some convoluted wolf strategy by using wordplay, etc.(I've heard a lot in my time regarding my townplay) - (this is primarily a response to you calling me "fluffy", I am very verbose and as a neurodivergant individual, I tend to overexplain in a way that can be interpreted as a wolftell to some.)

I think you are a valuable asset if you are a villager as you seem very active and active players are IMO the most important part to lead to a Town victory.
(My apologies if my thoughts seem really jumbled, I am inebriated and spewing a lot of things I think I should say here)

[koopashell]

So there’s nobody less than neutral for you right now, everyone’s better than neutral?

In a sense? Yes. Obviously, the bar is above the bottom 3 players minimum here, ergo, PoE. As we have more solid information, and flips, this bar becomes more strict and such.

I will tell you that one of my weaknesses as a wolf is that I struggle to mimic this, and am afraid to mark a part of someone's play as villagery in case I need to miseliminate them later and such. (in this case I mean using actual towntells that are difficult to walk back)

[koopashell]

Anyway for now my hot take fresh off the press…

Scum team: koopa, Roden, Scorpious.

Honestly if I wasn’t leaning toward Flavor Leaf being town I’d think he and koopa were partners.

I think Mala is the LHF for today.

Well off to bed y’all everyone have a great night!

I think that, Italiano can be a wolf, in a world where Mala flips as a wolf - which is somewhat likely to me at this point, so that's why I did entertain it,

Alright so I went to take a shit while writing this post. I decided that I think that a viable world(spitballing) *can* be Roden, Italiano, Mala. Don't ask me how. My brain just feels it is right at this moment, and I will be looking over the ISOs in a second. I think partially what prompted this was the odd inclusion of Roden in Italiano's wolf reads.

[koopashell]

I read 5 posts in Roden's ISO and realized how very stupid I was to even consider that thought.

[koopashell]

Actually, read over Mala, and look at how they interact with Italiano, and how they interact with other players.

Can you guess what I am seeing?

[koopashell]

I know it's extremely silly to try to teamsolve this early, but I find it has some merit to at least establish viable worlds at this point. Also shit, it's page 10, I need to hurry and deliver on my promise

[koopashell]

And now, reading Italiano's ISO - I see a sort of weird way that Italiano is treating Mala and how he is interacting with other players as well.

My gut says I struck gold, my brain tells me to slow down before I look like a clown

[koopashell]

Like Italiano has a lot of shade thrown at Mala, *however*, he is pushing elsewhere instead, rather than pursuing a read that in words is their strongest wolfread, when you look at the things Italiano has said.

Also this world I feel that Salad slot also fits in as the 3rd wolf - in which case I need to wait for Salad to post here to see how they act.

[koopashell]

That Flavor Leaf/koopa interaction on pg 3 is pinging my antennas.

That Flavor Leaf/koopa interaction on pg 3 is pinging my antennas.

What happens when two antennas get married?

I don't think this is a S/S interaction. There wasn't any follow up to the reasonings behind doing that as S/S.

It's more of the type of treatment is different that I was looking at -> Mala treats italiano with silly replies, everyone else gets serious ones.

Also Mala has not once reacted to Italiano's shade against her, but has replied to mostly everyone pushing her otherwise.


Do you see what I'm getting at?

[koopashell]

I already said Roden and Mala is a very silly thought after reading the ISO

[koopashell]

VOTE: Italiano

I guess it doesn't ever hurt to crank up the heat. Scorpious was more a "do something" vote anyways.

[koopashell]

That Flavor Leaf/koopa interaction on pg 3 is pinging my antennas.

That Flavor Leaf/koopa interaction on pg 3 is pinging my antennas.

What happens when two antennas get married?

I don't think this is a S/S interaction. There wasn't any follow up to the reasonings behind doing that as S/S.

It's more of the type of treatment is different that I was looking at -> Mala treats italiano with silly replies, everyone else gets serious ones.

Also Mala has not once reacted to Italiano's shade against her, but has replied to mostly everyone pushing her otherwise.


Do you see what I'm getting at?

Yeah, sure. I don't think that happens if they are actually S/S, it's just one of those dynamics that look S/S. I could be wrong, and they are S/S, at the moment, I just dont think that's how Mala would talk to their scum partner specifically. outside of meta, i dont generally like to use meta except self meta.

I guess I would disagree and say that a common average wolf mistake is that they will treat their partners differently from a town player and thus spew a difference check that way. Experienced and seasoned wolf players, such as myself, will be aware of this natural tendency and seek to avoid it, (and still potentially fail because lying in this way is an art that is obscenely difficult when the hunting is optimized).

[koopashell]

Hm. Fair enough. It is only page 10, but overall I think my theory is still plausible, though you raise a good point.
Regarding action - I think the lack of action in regards to words is moreso the egregious part here.

I think however it is best that the both of us step away from the thread and allow others to interact more as this dominating conversation will be to town's detriment if both italiano and mala happen to be town.

[koopashell]

Ugh, just when I start feeling better about you, you go and post 224.

What's bad about it? In your own words - No vagueness.

[koopashell]

let's sip on that KoopaTalianoMala Flavored drink, y'all

[koopashell]

I think Human is a villager who is likely wrong on your slot as well as Italiano's at this point.

I think Italiano is showing a thought process that is shallow in nature, and aimed to cherry pick what he thinks townies will see as "wolfy" when pushing me. As I have a green check on my own slot - I am able to evaluate this as a push on a villager, as I mentioned before with the "wolves cannot make genuine pushes onto villagers" spiel.

The catchup nested within spoilers is performative to me, the push on me is aimed to discredit me, the way they are reacting to the counterpressure is extremely weak and subdued.

That being said - I also might just be failing to understand a town!Italiano's thought process here and it just leads him to this conclusion, which is extremely faulty - but overall I think he wants me to be his pet wolfread right now and it is showing. As well as the team viability I have discovered, I think this is a good flip trajectory if anything.

[koopashell]

I am aware - btw - that I said that Italiano's reasons were complex to wolfread me, however this was more of a drawn assumption from my own reading rather than Italiano's own posts. They have not expressed any of what I had predicted would be the complex reasons that came out that I had linked to that -

Perhaps I guess I should say - I have changed my mind in a sense after looking back and rereading things.

[koopashell]

Catching up a bit…

Koopa's gonna be hard to read

Don’t think so.

I have played with JV twice so far; both times I have been scum. So there's the potential that he might vote me right off the bat which is fair considering that I been scum twice so far now against him.

Why does that matter? So what if he votes you? Do you always do that for people you’ve played with?

You know HEM made a good point when he said it sounded like you were addressing JV almost like you knew he was already town and didn’t want the smoke.

I’ve never played with you (that I can remember) but I would assume town!you maybe wouldn’t care that much.

tbh if i was self conscious i prob wouldnt have posted my first post
just saying

And this is a contradiction.

73 and 74 ping me. Like the questions are kinda meh. Like almost like once they answer then what? They don’t seem like sorting questions. Feels like busywork.

I’m gonna place 77 82 and 83 in the townbin pile for now.

Geez 108 is screaming at me dude.

VOTE: koopa

like I go back to this post - this is what I perceived as "complex" and I go and actually read the posts that are linked -

I think now and see that I feel that Italiano structured this post in a way that had a goal - a goal of making a push on me in an artificial way.

I went back and looked at my own posts they "didn't like"

and I feel that in a wolf Italiano world this is strongl

ok so

I kinda had a brainwave but like

y'know what - FL is right, there is a chance Mala/Italiano are town, and I am just trying to hero solve it at this point(and ego push back on what is a terrible push)

However - Mala wolf implies Italiano wolf. Remember that. If there is a cop here, one of those 2 is a valuable target.

I do not believe there is a world where those 2 are W/V, only W/W and V/V

And now, I go back to the drawing board.

UNVOTE:

[koopashell]

Ugh, just when I start feeling better about you, you go and post 224.

What's bad about it? In your own words - No vagueness.

@italiano I would still like you to address this, however.

[koopashell]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

I did an ISO skim, and as a holistic work, I didn't like it. - if FL is right on HEM, the pairing here is also possible.

[koopashell]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

I did an ISO skim, and as a holistic work, I didn't like it. - if FL is right on HEM, the pairing here is also possible.

Yeah, it's possible, just not really an important wagon.

I hate voting outliers because they're essentially just compromise wagons.

If you think that that pairing is possible, why not vote Human and see how JV reacts? As of right now, there's no case besides "little content" you can make on JV, so it's just gonna be fluffy noise.

I like to divide and conquer, and later consolidate. I'm the type that even if an elimination is very likely, I will vote off wagon to hunt for info

[koopashell]

You know, reading ISOs is so powerful. I go to reISO HEM, and I see the very things you are saying, FL. It doesn't ever hurt to reread something when someone makes an accusation somewhere. The holistic work is always the most important.

[koopashell]

no further questions

HEM is town. That is all

VOTE: Malakittens
This one is pretty obvious.

VOTE: NK15
This one is pretty obvious.

But I also get how that frustration could be genuine, so a slot to keep an eye on for now.

Frustration can come from scum, too. In this case it is not town-indicative.

The most scummiest votes on my wagon is NK15 & koopa. Koopa because I didn't like the trajectory, NK15 because that post was scummy af.
Roden is prob town as stated before. HEM is up in the air.

Koopa looks decent, don't agree with you for them but NK15 I can agree with. HEM is very likely Town, but not something I am willing to delve into as if I get everyone to TR them they gonna die. Roden I am indifferent about

Confident in this vote.

I am confident in my villaread on NK15, and thus this string of posts - particularly in a wolf!HEM world - are wolfy.

[koopashell]

Italiano, would you say you have an ego at all?

[koopashell]

Overall it does look like that there is a strong possibility that the Salad slot has to be a wolf based on the teams I am seeing so far.

So RIP to whoever has to replace in to that haha

[koopashell]

You know I haven't pulled my ultimate trump card of going through any of these players' prior games for myself for the ultimate cheat code(meta is cheating!! and also based) - And I feel I might have to potentially But I'm still having fun blustering through this without any meta, part of why I started here so I could practice without it

[koopashell]

The thing that really gets me the most about HEM is the excuse they pulled at the start of lowposting - and I know myself, I tend to also want to lowpost more when I am a wolf to relieve pressure, because out of sight is out of mind. (I know 1000% I get more pushes on me when I am the person most people see)

It's a small detail but I do remember it did lightly skeeve me at the time.

[koopashell]

What's bad about it? In your own words - No vagueness.

It's kinda interesting that you'd think I'd be vague about it or that I would not use my own words.

Anyway, while I was catching up and even before I had to leave, you were saying that you kinda townread me for how I was scumreading you. You also said you vote to provide pressure. Well I didn't think I needed to be pressured as I was pretty open and responsive all game, so the vote was very suspicious to me. Flavor Leaf comes in and says he kinda scumreads me and after no real fight from you, given your previous read on me, you just kinda jumped in headfirst. I gotta say, you feel very malleable as a player, like wherever the wind takes you, you'll just blow with it. It was like that with Mala, you didn't really start pushing her until the rest of us did. You also voted for Scorpious

after

I mentioned it as a hot take solve. I know you said you had him in your solve, but you didn't really expand on it until after the fact iirc. I don't know, like I wanna townread you, but you keep making it hard with these posts and actions man.

consider: when people post about people, it brings that person to the forefront of their mind, and they go into more depth on them -> what you call "wind blowing", I call natural human psychology. I am willing to listen to others.

Should I explicitly find you a wolf for suddenly pushing HEM after it's become clear that no one else finds me wolfy and FL stated a strong read on HEM as well as myself?

Apply your own logic to your own POV and see that it is not effective here.

[koopashell]

VOTE: Italiano

I guess it doesn't ever hurt to crank up the heat. Scorpious was more a "do something" vote anyways.

Explain.

I counter with: Keep reading.

[koopashell]

I have a pretty wild theory but I feel there is a lost wolf/traitor based on the fact I cannot feasibly find pairing higher than 2. I am going to read the game with the assumption there is one later on and see if I can't find someone trying to signal - but I think it's a decent possibility here.

I also think I feel comfortable parking here now: VOTE: Salad

The most recent conversation does not particularly help me much and instead just made me roll my eyes at Malcom attributing playstyle to alignment. Perhaps its ego but that statement did make them fall in my reads for me. A few others have shifted as well but I am withdrawing from the overall conversation to let things play out for now as I have contributed plenty at this point.

[koopashell]

If Italiano ever flips wolf that can be fulfilled but that was a joke combined with my confidence in my own play. I think wolves are playing very well and/or there is an uninformed aspect in the mix - which is why the traitor thing was noted - I feel trouble finding a viable trio.

[koopashell]

Yes I am ok sorting by postcount here for now.

[koopashell]

I think they have been villagery, although a certain paranoia exists in the back of my head.
If they start to primarily incite pushes onto villagers it should be examined later, however I don't see them being caught as wolf on day 1 ever and this is all certainly in their town meta.

[koopashell]

And where I'm from, when I start to feel too many active players are villagers, I start to go through the low posters and incentivize them to play by pressuring them.
Please do not lecture me on how to wolfhunt, I know what I am doing.

[koopashell]

I think in recent postings you have been villagery however I still currently see decently likely worlds where you are a wolf, so I am content with letting you live for now and see if those worlds get deconfimed in the future.

[koopashell]

I'm good for now - like I said I want to withdraw for now and not continue to dominate the conversation. We can go back to this later, I will explain what I thought at this time later.

And I think your case on FL mirrors thoughts I have however it is simply explanations for what he is doing *if* he is wolf and does not discount the viability of the fact that these are all actions easily plausible as a villager who is simply confident on a read/wants to drive the game that way. FL is clearly a player who enjoys thread control so your accusation does not really hold too much weight, especially since Italiano is in a possible wolf world right now. I think these kinds of cases only serve to frustrate the player on the receiving end, which I find not useful.
I guess I'd like to state that if I do end up getting nightkilled night 1, do not let FL use the argument "koopa townread me why would I kill them" - as I am very clearly a player who updates their reads with new evidence and a kill on my slot can come from players who recognize that kind of possible future threat.

I'd rather not get caught up in only pushing people who are active as that is an easy way to get into V/V tunnels while wolves sit back and low-mid post.

[koopashell]

"don't lurk"

Seeya.

[koopashell]

Facebonez has towntold more than Scorpious, who has spent the majority of his posts complaining.

[koopashell]

Facebonez has towntold more than Scorpious, who has spent the majority of his posts complaining.

This is just nonsense..

Oh?

This you? :

"don't lurk"

Seeya.

Stop doing this…

Activity is not AI….

[koopashell]

They are actually parsing the game and solving - their absence is likely IRL related rather than fear based on how hard they entered - supported by their entrance post.
The mindset is on display and easy to see for me.
As the point was a comparison with you - you have shown 0 intent to solve people's alignment, however tonally you seem cagey in a slightly villagery way.

[koopashell]

As I say I like Facebones' post about spotting a contradiction in Mala's play, but if Mala is town then that could just be good mafia play to try and put some extra heat onto Mala. If Koopa was voting for Mala right now I'd potentially buy their belief that Facebones is a strong TR but since they're not I struggle to see how they can be incredibly confident in Facebones being town so early on, especially when they are voting on the basis of low activity at the moment.

Mala's alignments doesnt matter here because villagers are uninformed, and especially so in early game.

[koopashell]

What makes it wolfy?

[koopashell]

Are you accusing me of TMI?

[koopashell]

koopa do you think malcolm is town

If I had to choose right now, yes. Although the fact I disgree with their style of reading is clashing with my ego. nk15 elicits the same although their villagerness is actually apparent to me.

[koopashell]

I feel scorpious expected my reasoning for the Facebones read to be strictly gut and an easy segway to a push and my actual verbose explaination caught him off guard.

[koopashell]

I learned chainsaw as a different term, where you defend a villager who is about to be surely killed for towncred.

[koopashell]

Are you accusing me of TMI?

Nope. Just get scum trying drive the game feels from you

So out of 80 posts and my explained thougut processes and stated reads, you can only draw out that your read is based on gut?
Feels bogus

[koopashell]

I don't think salad slot deserves to skate by with no pressure for not being here. Wolves are the ones who when they are busy happily dodge the game while villagers feel at least obligated to do something.

[koopashell]

Oh no I guess I should go afk for 4 days so I stop getting voted )))))):

[koopashell]

Early solve attempt is Koopa, HEM, and most likely one of the quiet ones..

Could be as simple Facebones.. but that’s reachy this early.

Italiano, why is scorpious villagery to you? Remove the fact that they are voting me - that is wrong + you should consider thought processes over ego.

[koopashell]

Early solve attempt is Koopa, HEM, and most likely one of the quiet ones..

Could be as simple Facebones.. but that’s reachy this early.

Italiano, why is scorpious villagery to you? Remove the fact that they are voting me - that is wrong + you should consider thought processes over ego.

When did I say Scorpious was villagery?

It's implicit in how youre acting. Can you tell me how you're reading them then?
I have a feeling theres 1 wolf (only 1 wolf) between you 2. I don't think you're ever W/W

[koopashell]

maybe you're just scum Italiano

Can you not.

[koopashell]

It's implicit in how youre acting.

How and when was it implied? I’d like you to give me examples.

State your read on Scorpious.
Stop deflecting please.
It's fairly easy to see why I thought it was implicit - you are giving them no pressure + are happy to sheep them to get a wagon going on me.

[koopashell]

Hm actually
I had a weird theory pop up of Scorpious traitor, italiano wolf, but that's only if scorp is to flip exactly traitor.

[koopashell]

Friendly mod reminder about the activity rules in this game:

Prods

- 36 hour before prod, respond to prod within 24 hours before replacement.
- Please make a game-advancing post in order to reset the prod timer.
- On your third prod, I will also begin searching for a replacement.
- Players who have declared V/LA will still be expected to post every 72 hours.

I'm not counting 382 as a game-advancing post, so Salad will have to post in (expired on 2022-04-17 03:00:00) or be replaced

Based

[koopashell]

Idea:
Scorpious Traitor
Italiano and Mala wolves.

I need to so another reISO session later.
The push on me is very flimsy and utilitizes things I know are present in my playstyle that wolves very often think are "wolfy" looking. I know because, obviously, I see it first hand :p

In other news I think HEM is a villager based on recent posts, unfortunately its a sort of conviction/want to be heard kind of energy I see in them.

That being said, we have not seen this in a while, I'll take the advice that no one wants to pressure inactive slots(poor decision imo but I am not a 1 man army) and: VOTE: Mala

[koopashell]

I think if FL is found to be intentionally instigating fights and retreating once its started - thats a likely hit by the way - be on the lookout. Although I do feel their pushes have been genuine and not with this intent however.

[koopashell]

I forgot to state this but I feel Roden is also very villagery

I would make this my core right now:
Roden - HEM - NK15
Malcom, FL, JV, FB, Kitty are all in a tier below that.
Everyone else is PoE atm.

[koopashell]

Openness involves explaining reads and progression, not some weird tangent about not knowing vocabulary my guy

[koopashell]

Openness involves explaining reads and progression, not some weird tangent about not knowing vocabulary my guy

And this shade is doing what?

Its proving you are selectively replying to things.

[koopashell]

FL, do you townread my slot?

[koopashell]

FL, do you townread my slot?

most of the time, i do a lot of the time, but some of the time, i do only a little bit of the time.

I'm going to guess you know why i am asking - as you seem to have avoided interacting with scorpious/italiano on their pushes.

[koopashell]

VOTE: Flavor Leaf
Speak plainly.

[koopashell]

I am very hard to pocket. I do not believe that.

[koopashell]

The only times I have been pocketed were when wolves broke their meta in a big way or when they do a very good bus - neither of those things apply here.

[koopashell]

The issue is I think you are trying to instigate right now rather than solve, and subtly pushing me in a way that can be backpedaled later.

[koopashell]

Can you link me to a game where you do something similar as town?

[koopashell]

Cheers.do you think we could each have a piece of the solve btw?
I have scorpious and you have HEM?
I am going to consider we are clashing because we are on the right track in different directions.

[koopashell]

There are no masons in the setup.

[koopashell]

There are no masons in the setup.

To add to this - This is fueled by not being a vanilla role myself. Or is it?

[koopashell]

It's possible, though, but I'm a mason so i have the different pov, obvi

Didn't you do this claim before as scum in a game with me?

With DkKoba to be precise if I am correct.

Hey DK is the person that made me aware of this site where are they?
I saw them host a game with this ruleset on MU, and it seemed cool to me.

[koopashell]

Fwiw I think FL's mason thing is an FPS and should he ignored

[koopashell]

NK15 is my strongest villaread and it is backed up by meta...gonna need some citation.

[koopashell]

I never said they were particularly accurate, just villagery.

[koopashell]

Accurate in the sense of having an effective reading style.

[koopashell]

You may be able to abuse meta on a dime but NK15 is not you.

[koopashell]

The only times I have been pocketed were when wolves broke their meta in a big way or when they do a very good bus - neither of those things apply here.

^

[koopashell]

You mistake me for a player who doesn't have good reads in most of his games.

[koopashell]

I think we'll just go this way:
I am a PR who has crumbed their role throughout this game. I will likely resolve.

I want this to be resolved: VOTE: Flavor Leaf
I have gotten to the point where there is way too much of a disparity between our perspectives and the nail on the coffin was trying to push a PoE that includes 2 people who are actually towny.
If FL did not push for my elimination here - I would believe they werent playing a wolf game where they wanted to anti spew in a way that involves simply eliminating the people in their fake PoE.

If you think that wordplay will save you here - I wish to see you try. My perspective is town and grossly opposes yours.

If you wish to live, explain your progession on my slot *in detail* because it is my view that you have tried to manipulate me and use me as a tool for you.

Good luck.

[koopashell]

Needless to say - I hard veto your 3 picks.

[koopashell]

I crumbed way earlier than you believe it to be. Again, good luck.

[koopashell]

I am strongarming now, I feel confident now.

[koopashell]

I mean there is a lot of OMGUS style reads in the realm of NK15 and HEM as well as myself partially vs you - and myself with scorpious and italiano - but the difference is I am seeing the reasons behind these players' pushes as shallow against me while the ones against you are more thought out.

[koopashell]

I don't think you are lockscum, but trying to discredit my point of view won't do you any favors.

[koopashell]

I mean there is a lot of OMGUS style reads in the realm of NK15 and HEM as well as myself partially vs you - and myself with scorpious and italiano - but the difference is I am seeing the reasons behind these players' pushes as shallow against me while the ones against you are more thought out.

so what reasons do you have to think I'm scum rather than a cocky town player spitting a lot of shit out there for harsh reaction?

I'll ask you this - are you particularly accurate as town? I am working with the assumption that being verbose and good as wolf, you are also able to transfer that knowledge to your towngame and give you good reads that way

.

[koopashell]

VOTE: scorpious
Although? I'm being honest, the subtle emotion I can sense behind your words feels genuine and not wolfy.

[koopashell]

Are you a DkKoba alt?

[koopashell]

'twas just a buzz word you used.

No.
You said you don't lie about reads as town. So you are scum, then, because you lied about your roden read. If you are town: Where am I wrong?

This isn't a good reason to find FL wolfy, NK15.

[koopashell]

Roden, I would venture.

[koopashell]

Which of NK15 or Human is a stronger town read for you?

Definitely NK15 but human I want to leave alone for day 1 regardless unless they do something that is wolfy(to me).

[koopashell]

I do have a suggestion that we should stop focusing on FL, myself, and monkey. I'm going to probably tone down my posting massively. I want other slots discussed because this is choking the gamestate.

[koopashell]

@koopa: What was your case on Scorpious? I don’t wanna tell you mine and possibly give scum!you ammo.

Mainly, I think they are detached from the game in a way that is wolfy and their mindset is very shallow etc.
As well as the majority of his posts being complaints about others with little to no solving.

[koopashell]

Even if you give me "ammo" you should know that if the push is on what would be my partner in that scenario - you make it harder to retract my push.

[koopashell]

I dont think semantic disagreements is going to be useful in sorting FL. Instead of being upset in how they are playing, ask yourselves: is this player an informed party? Is what they are doing reasonable from the point of view of being aware of the wolf team?

I see a lot of playstyle/personaliry clashing going on right now and that isn't useful.

[koopashell]

I genuinely don't think someone with a reputation like FL simply easily gets pressure from half the playerlist as an informed party - especially since there is no need to as there was no other person really under pressure beforehand.
While it would be nice for FL to explain in more detail their progession, it seems they are a person who struggles to do that naturally and they dont know how to say that.
That's personally my take on the matter right now. I am in no means married to this position but at the moment it makes no sense for FL to play this way from an informed point of view.

[koopashell]

Human, can you tell me who you townread right now?

[koopashell]

Link me to a game where FL is caught day 1 as a wolf and we can talk

[koopashell]

depression

[koopashell]

why is scorpious town?

[koopashell]

And since I'm pocketed - why am I not on that list?

[koopashell]

Can we reset this gamestate
We're in too deep on this circular conversation..

[koopashell]

i also think you could be town, this is not something i have solidified

I preferred an answer to the other question more considering thats my strongest wolfread.

[koopashell]

Like I really don't get how people are finding scorpious town and its annoying no one will actually explain it because I really think their thoughts are bullshit.

[koopashell]

I think there is a decent chance of mala being wolf after the follow up response, but I will attempt to play the good cop.

Mala, could you provide at least, as a token of good faith and open show of your thought processes, an ordered list of the players and how you would rank them from more villagery(towny) to most wolfy? If you include a break in the list to indicate a "null line" that would also help immensely, thank you.

off page 4 -- i wont have solid reads and i seriously hate "forcing" reads this early on just b/c

early D1 i go by gut

majority of these players are new 2 me so i wont even have a decent read

the only ones i ahve played with ebfore are {FL, Roden, JV}

I thought this word for word when I read that post.

I hate lists in general, and probing for one so early is ambitious in my eyes.

Again not really seeing where I did a TMI on JV.

My thought process was as follows:

Get my role PM - see it’s green. Get excited because I’m not scum finally.
See the player list and realize that JV is in it.
Get excited because I’m finally playing as town instead of scum with JV there unlike the last two games we were in.

Gets scum read for said excitement.

#reck

[Unv][/unv]
I think NK15 has also been villagery on this page.
VOTE: Scorpious

Are we still random voting?

Facebonez has towntold more than Scorpious, who has spent the majority of his posts complaining.

This is just nonsense..

Facebonez has towntold more than Scorpious, who has spent the majority of his posts complaining.

I love when people get called out and then accuse the person that did so of complaining..

Simple scum deflection

VOTE: Koopa

For flooding the game with crappy contradicting logic.

Like come on.

[koopashell]

Scorpious' only contribution to the game was a shallow push on me - can people read their ISO please?

[koopashell]

A lot of scorpious' posts are non content - someone please see what I'm seeing because I feel like people are intentionally avoiding reading.

[koopashell]

Can we reset this gamestate
We're in too deep on this circular conversation..

okay why is FL town?

the last time i tried to engage FL he called me obsessed and continued calling me human even though i told him to call me HEM or Monkey — which is hilarious — but he is trying to get a ruse out of me here so I can have an emotional reaction and call those reactions scum.

You are so tunneled you are bringing up extremely NAI things now. Step away from the FL wagon
FL, please for the good of the gamestate step away from FL too.

[koopashell]

Can we reset this gamestate
We're in too deep on this circular conversation..

Human and I actually havent gone back and forth too much directly, tbh.

To be fair, he only knows how to discredit which is an issue from both scum and town alignments on their part, but it's not ineffective.

lmao projection

You keep using that word; I don't think you know what it means.

another discredit, which proves the projection

WHO CARES

[koopashell]

I'm just going to push over the more annoying one if you 2 keep going.

[koopashell]

I have and continually asking me that instead of disengaging is +5 annoying points.

[koopashell]

I have approached FL being town from multiple different angles and pondered the wolf angles as well.
He's in a box that he won't escape before endgame by this point if he is a wolf and that's fine! We need to solve for all the wolves not just 1, you don't need to have 1 pet wagon here.

[koopashell]

kay maybe i should put the phone away

Yes. Please return with a fresh mind.

[koopashell]

I am seeing an HEM wolf world with Scorpious based on their reluctance to talk about the slot.
I don't believe in wagonomics thought - I've seen my share of all villager wagons on a villager before. Especially on people who have played their dayplay abrasively similar to how you have here.
I want to focus on Scorpious though - can you explain your townread a bit more there?

[koopashell]

Roden - have you caught wolf FL before?

[koopashell]

And I also want you to tell me how you feel about Scorpious

[koopashell]

You did have some aggression FL.. I saw it in your tone when I voted you.

[koopashell]

Anyways I don't care about that right now, I want to talk about Scorpious

[koopashell]

Roden - have you caught wolf FL before?

No and as far as I know I haven't played with him before period. I don't see how that's relevant though.

Whats your read on Scorpious?

[koopashell]

Roden
I'm going to be brutally honest for a second: I don't care nor does that make them wolf. If they are wolf, they *want* the attention on them - so you're giving them what they want. I want to look at other slots thank you.

[koopashell]

Now. Scorpious read please.

[koopashell]

Wolves are literally laughing at us going in circles right now. Snap out of it and see the bigger picture and notice players who have gone under the radar.

[koopashell]

Of course it's fucking "weak". They aren't playing the game, Roden. Wolves literally default to low/mid posting and you're obsessed with the most active slot in the game.

[koopashell]

So take in that thought of me playing this way with a playerlist who isn't that familiar with me.

So did you join this game so that no one would be able to catch you as scum. Clever boy!

Any updated thoughts?

[koopashell]

Incredibly - I went through some meta on Scorpious.. and I am shocked to find that their WOLFPLAY has more depth than their villager play somehow.
When comparing:
This wolf game from a game called Internal Affairs:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... ct[]=26244
and this Villager game from a game called Polish Rap:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... ct[]=26244

Also interesting tidbit I found in the wolf chat:
Subject: Infernal Affairs Mafia PT

Oh, yeah. You should know that.

I’ll be scum read by page 4. I just come off as scum all the time. I usually get out of it but. There will be a push on me. I’m just not that good at this, but I like the game so much.

[koopashell]

Yeah. I am reading through and Scorpious is 10x more lost as a villager than as a wolf

That really is an unfortunate meta to have. Let me switch it up to what I have noticed lately from the others: VOTE: Mala

[koopashell]

That also implies Flavor Leaf was genuinely accurate on Scorpious' meta so there's that, although this kind of explaination would have been useful for me to reach the conclusion myself.

[koopashell]

So take in that thought of me playing this way with a playerlist who isn't that familiar with me.

So did you join this game so that no one would be able to catch you as scum. Clever boy!

Any updated thoughts?

If by updated you mean different then no, if you mean more then yes. I’m sorry but I think it’s amusing to see players trying to sort Leaf. I say just stop, lol. Nobody’s gonna do it. I assume Leaf plays the game similarly regardless of alignment and he is laughing either way at players trying to do so. If Leaf is scum then I assume his partner(s) have already voted him or currently are and he has voted them or currently are. If he is town then scum has voted him or currently are and he has more than likely voted scum or currently is. Again I’m assuming he is town because I’ve had enough content and interactions and reactions from him with me and other slots to come to that conclusion. If I’m wrong, at this point I wouldn’t even be mad losing to scum!Leaf. Leaf you better not be scum though!

Actually - VOTE: Italiano

[koopashell]

Not Known 15
MalcolmTucker
KittyTacky
Flavor Leaf
humaneatingmonkey
Scorpious
Facebones
Malakittens
JacksonVirgo
Saladman27 *
Roden
ItalianoVD

New tiered list just dropped with a huge shift in Scorpious position

[koopashell]

ope I forgot to move Mala down, she goes right above Saladman.

[koopashell]

VOTE: Koopa

Ellaborate.

[koopashell]

I don't care what you like and don't like
I'm not you and I'm not playing to appease you.
Sorting people by playstyle is obnoxious.

[koopashell]

If you have any concerns about my reads or content - and not style of play, I will listen. If you wish to criticize how I play and tell me that doing X means I must be wolf - I have no interest in interacting with you, as that is the type of lazy play I detest

[koopashell]

I think Jackson's reaction to me finding Scorpious as town is incredibly wolfy.

[koopashell]

I think Jackson's reaction to me finding Scorpious as town is incredibly wolfy.

I voted you for no reason outside of just to see how you would react. Which you did so poorly with a retaliatory scum read, I gave zero context in which you fabricated one instead, even after asking me to elaborate.

Oh I fabricated it?
A naked vote after I move to villa read someone was wolfy in context. If I'm so wolfy - case me based on my.play so far.

[koopashell]

Jackson - pray tell, what reads have you had this game thus far at all?

[koopashell]

Alright, all caught up.

I fundamentally really think Flavor is town here although I'm aware I could of course be getting manipulated. Need to ask - would the current state of the game be beneficial to FL if they were mafia, given how they've approached it? And I think the answer is no. The D1 conflicts/arguments here should give us plenty of info going forward and it's beneficial to mafia to fundamentally keep as much info as they can hidden from town.

I also think we'd have seen more people directly batting for FL when they were under suspicion and starting to become the main wagon. The way it's died down now indicates to me someone in mafia (whether HEM or Roden) didn't have their heart in it and didn't think it was going to go anywhere in the end.

I didn't particularly like Roden's reaction to FL and I thought their argument Flavor wasn't really being clear with their reads felt very off given the state of the game so far. But I'm not sure mafia Roden has any way to react the way they did - the push was long past and it felt like essentially picking a fight which suddenly put them in contention again as possible mafia. If you're mafia, best just to ignore and move on from that I think.

Koopa is very much towning it up now, not necessarily agreed with everything they've said at times but their logic/approach seems a lot more solid now as the game goes on.

I mean there's more info as the game goes on so naturally thats the trajectory

[koopashell]

@Koopa - I think the sheer fact that Jackson voted you here is townie in itself.

Like you are going back and forth a lot, something I also do, and besides the PR claim empowerment to 1v1 which felt more ego emotion based anyway, you've had a generally townie mindset, and scum probably wouldnt try to push you the way that JV did. They might try to push you, but not by just voting like that, if that makes sense.

They're in my PoE and it is concerning that the timing of the vote coincided with the flip on my read.
If they don't want to explain their reasoning - I can only default to the context clues to draw from for the reasoning.
"Reaction test" this far into the game when I am the 2nd largest poster with many substantial posts is just bogus as hell or they are simply not playing the game if town - both unacceptable.

[koopashell]

But they directly denied it had to do with my read flip by claiming a different reason which feels like they want to hide the fact that its linked to that.

[koopashell]

Jackson - pray tell, what reads have you had this game thus far at all?

Ive stated my reads, and you know that all too well why choose to shade me here?

What read do you have other than NK15 being wolf?

[koopashell]

Andresvmb replaces Saladman27

Mathblade replaces Facebones

Please welcome them!

Catching up now gonna see what the major events are.

Anyone wanna point me at some place they want a comment on?

Hi, I think your slot was town based on their entrance posts.
Primarily has been FL and myself doing a lot of discussion, to be honest. Hard to really summarize since there's been a lot of movement.

[koopashell]

VC 1.13

With 13 players, it takes 7 to make a decision. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-04-25 00:30:00).

VC

Flavor Leaf [3]:

humaneatingmonkey [265], Roden [598], Not Known 15 [620]

koopashell [2]:

Scorpious [457], ItalianoVD [484]

Not Known 15 [1]:

JacksonVirgo [138]

ItalianoVD [1]:

KittyTacky [364]

Scorpious [1]:

koopashell [625]

humaneatingmonkey [1]:

Flavor Leaf [683]

Not voting [4]:

MalcolmTucker, Facebones, Saladman27, Malakittens [561]

mod notes

Replacing Saladman27. There's someone who asked to be on the replace list so they'll have priority for a few hours

Boon wagon looks stale.

To those of you on it why is Boon scum? Or is it left over RVS?

FL claims there are wolves on the wagon, notably between Roden and Humaneatingmonkey.
NK15 is being NK15.

[koopashell]

Jackson - pray tell, what reads have you had this game thus far at all?

Ive stated my reads, and you know that all too well why choose to shade me here?

What read do you have other than NK15 being wolf?

HEM town. FL I am paranoid of but that’s nothing to base a read off. Scorp feels vastly different than a recently closed game so baskng a TR there.

At work can’t give detail nor do I want to currently

And I have reads on every slot - and I'm wolfy.

[koopashell]

Can't give detail seems to be a common trend from Jackson.

[koopashell]

I will trust the judgement of the other people telling me off though - although I don't like the way Jackson is approaching the game, which is to say, very unholistically, pushing conclusions based on limited info(lacking info that is readily available) and incomplete context.
VOTE: italiano

[koopashell]

Actually
VOTE: roden

[koopashell]

So what paints my slot red?

[koopashell]

So what paints my slot red?

Your play so far..

Very specific! You are surely on your way to being the top wolfhunter.

[koopashell]

I think this is the real reason you find me wolfy:
I am loud.
I have opinions.
I talk a lot.
I am not afraid to change.
Did I mention loud?

You see me post a lot, and with an aggressive tone and you are scared.

That's the reason.

I doubt you will admit that, or rather, have the level of insight able to figure that out - but your level of reading is extremely ineffective towards my playstyle as it fails to take into account context.
What is shocking is you are not at the same time pushing FL here too.

[koopashell]

So what paints my slot red?

Your play so far..

Very specific! You are surely on your way to being the top wolfhunter.

I was going to say your reactions..

But I had a feeling you’d make my point for me… Thank you

How effective have you found this method of hunting for you in the past?

[koopashell]

Link me your towngames where you solved the game.

[koopashell]

I think this is the real reason you find me wolfy:
I am loud.
I have opinions.
I talk a lot.
I am not afraid to change.
Did I mention loud?

You see me post a lot, and with an aggressive tone and you are scared.

That's the reason.

I doubt you will admit that, or rather, have the level of insight able to figure that out - but your level of reading is extremely ineffective towards my playstyle as it fails to take into account context.
What is shocking is you are not at the same time pushing FL here too.

I hate lists.. They’re a scum tell to me..

How are they a wolftell?
Do you believe you're the greatest mafia player of all time and somehow figured out an ultimate tell? Somehow every other town player

FL also has done lists - that make them wolf too?

Trying to push these kinds of tells is extemely unfun to play with - because they are NONSENISCAL.
If it really is a "tell" - wolves wouldn't do it after some time.
You are making this game not as fun from my point of view by trying to tie what can be *proven* to be not a wolftell via simple statistics.. I can ask any great town player I know(SPF, macdougal, askthepizzaguy, etc.) And they'd all tell you that trying to tell people that "making a list" is wolfy is a ridiculous concept.

I have 0 hope in adjusting your play here but I fear you are going to be taken easily to a limlo situation and you will end up using these tells to lose us the game.


Tl;dr - learn what real wolftells are please and stop pushing the list angle because I will keep doing them as expressing my thoughts on the game openly is conducive to making other villagers see my thoughts.

[koopashell]

Link me your towngames where you solved the game.

Stop flailing..

You’ve demonstrated the ability to be proficient at that.. You can handle finding those..

“Link towngames where “you” solved… I wish I was smarter… What you said there is called something but I can think of it..

I already stated I don't wish to unmask my account on other sites like MU :Lol:

I don't like players like you because you aggressively push incorrect mafia theory that is proven wrong in practice.
Your deflection is proof of that - have some self awareness please.

[koopashell]

I think it is funny that FL and I have played in a largely somewhat similar way - but Scorpious has said nothing of them.
Are FL's lists not wolfy?

[koopashell]

[Roden, HEM, Kitty, Andres, Italiano] contains at least 2 wolves.
Added Kitty based on my reISO after Malcom's prompting.
I still think JV should be critically analyzed before endgame if they stay alive.

[koopashell]

My apologies to everyone else for the heated posts on this page - I am intensely frustrated when a player pushes bad mafia theory to push me as wolf when it is simply stuff part of my playstyle, and thus i largely have 0 argument against it.
I think Scorpious is worth an investigative check here if anything just to make sure they are not a wolf trying to hide within this ridiculous theory.

[koopashell]

My apologies to everyone else for the heated posts on this page - I am intensely frustrated when a player pushes bad mafia theory to push me as wolf when it is simply stuff part of my playstyle, and thus i largely have 0 argument against it.
I think Scorpious is worth an investigative check here if anything just to make sure they are not a wolf trying to hide within this ridiculous theory.

The reason I got more upset now is *because* I found they are probably a villager, if they are wolf I'd just laugh and bury them.

I think Scorpious' push here is pretty lazy but I'm not particularly reading them as mafia for it currently to be honest. Don't see why mafia would push you.

[koopashell]

My apologies to everyone else for the heated posts on this page - I am intensely frustrated when a player pushes bad mafia theory to push me as wolf when it is simply stuff part of my playstyle, and thus i largely have 0 argument against it.
I think Scorpious is worth an investigative check here if anything just to make sure they are not a wolf trying to hide within this ridiculous theory.

I think Scorpious' push here is pretty lazy but I'm not particularly reading them as mafia for it currently to be honest. Don't see why mafia would push you.

Oops i messed that up:
The reason I got more upset now is *because* I found they are probably a villager, if they are wolf I'd just laugh and bury them.

[koopashell]

I am intensely frustrated when a player pushes bad mafia theory to push me as wolf when it is simply stuff part of my playstyle, and thus i largely have 0 argument against it.

then do what you told Roden to do and move past it. No point pushing back with an emotion side. JV's just playing the game, and he's not as deep as some other players, so I think it makes sense a townie who's only been seeing bits and pieces and playing when theyre near and present could see you as scum.

We've gone fast, I don't blame JV for not posting as much, however I am used to JV's playstyle a bit more, but I generally just feel that they're in an acceptable spot at the current moment based on it being Day 1 still. JV alone isnt going to be able to fade you or anything, so you arent in trouble. it's 1 vote.

Was talking about Scorpious, JV seems reasonable just very much lacks much context.

[koopashell]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=86642
Did a meta dive on italiano to see if I could eliminate them from my PoE - looks like this game, is similar to this one in terms of play.
There are low intensity wolf and town games too I saw - but this stood out. I read their ISO and thought similar things I did here. They pushed players in a similar way.